The Best OBD2 Dongle Under $150

[@Tools-Tested]

NOTE the TopScan requires a subscription after one year of $50, I just found this in the fine print. Information about this on TopDons website "Tools that require a subscription are renewed annually. Once the subscription is renewed all updates for the tool are covered for the full year. TOPDON’s limited warranty will continue with the subscription. The tools will continue to function without a subscription; however, the tools will not be available for updates and the tool will no longer be covered by the warranty, and programming functions may be inaccessible." www.topdon.us/pages/faq

[@madcow3417]

"Programming functions may be inaccessible." Depending on exactly what 'programming functions' means to them, and if their FAQ changes tomorrow, this may become totally unusable. I can't trust it. Then again, the next best dongle is 50% more, so maybe it's worth the risk.

[@tonyhanneman3976]

@@madcow3417 Next best looks to be the Zurich from HF which is actually cheaper.

[@rolandm9750]

Yeah noticed that too. The subscription is pretty crazily priced, and not in a good way! It's $50/yr for the base subscription, $100/yr for the Pro subscription. I *think* the devices/hardware are the same. That is, you can either buy the TopScan Lite or Pro but I think the only difference is just the subscription it comes with. Apparently as long as you keep your subscription going, the device will be warrantied but I mean that's kind of a small benefit with such a high annual cost. What's also funny about the subscription is you can basically just buy a new unit every year instead, for about the same price with sales. So in 5yrs you can pay the $250-500 and have one device or just buy new ones and have 5 of them by the 5th year lol. Really dumb business model. Well smart for them I guess.

[@nowayjose596]

According to the Q&A it will stop working completely without an active subscription: "Unfortunately, TOPDON TopScan will not work if there's no active subscription." So you don't just lose certain features, but the ability to pull/erase codes entirely.

[@jackle842000]

​@@nowayjose596what a scam if so. That's what keeps getting on my nerves when I look at these 600.00 readers and stuff I want one when I need it but I'm not willing to pay a monthly bill to use one once every 3 years for my same old cars. Ridiculous that we pay a premium for the software that's on the scanner then they want you to continue paying again and again to use it. The readers themselves don't cost very much to make and sell so if they want a subscription then they should just about be giving the reader away. Tell us a $50 computer for 600 bucks then make you pay every month or year for it seems nuts. There's no reason that any code reader should not have full functionality with whatever year model you've had an update and back. I can understand paying to update newer models to the computer but to pay to use what I already paid for is ridiculous.

[@GAMP-b2s]

I am NOT an expert in this area, but I think this comparison did not clarify something very important about choosing an OBD2 dongle. My summary is that there are only 2 things that matter. First, what chip is inside the unit. Second, what software will you use. You should start by purchasing a dongle that has the correct chip inside for your needs, and then purchase software - separately - that fits your needs. You will likely have a sub-optimal experience if you just buy a dongle and use the included "free" software. The chip inside the dongle will be some version of a microcontroller programmed by ELM Electronics. The version of the firmware on the chip is what makes the difference between dongles, with the oldest firmware being more buggy and having less features than the latest. Versions vary between 1.0 and 2.3. Note that ELM Electronics is now out of business (2022). Bad dongle manufacturers use a "cracked" version of ELM's oldest firmware but report it as being a much later version version. Good dongle manufacturers use authentic chips, but they are more costly. The Veepeak BLE unit you reviewed uses an old, cracked version, reported as v1.5. Note that ELM did not even release a v1.5! Veepeak also sells a BLE+ unit for only a few dollars more that I believe uses an authentic microcontroller and is reported as v2.2. After you buy a good dongle (with v2.2 or v2.3 firmware), you then buy software that allows you to use the feature set of that firmware. Good software/apps will cost money. I think you have an opportunity to do this review again but in two parts: first, what dongles have which chips/firmware inside. Second, which software will allow you to properly use the feature set of the chip/firmware.

[@TheSacman11]

Sounds like you know what you are talking about. Can you recommend a good chip/firmware/software combo which obd2 manufacturer would you recommend.

[@robb1165]

Yes, it all depends on the software. I start with a specific car then choose the software that does what I want. Then the dongle or in many cases a corded dongle if expecting to program a module. Usually what is recommended by the software company. I do have a Veepeak BLE+, using it with Forscan (great Ford software) and Bimmercode (limited but useful for BMW coding).

[@Joe_Blo]

I have a older cheap Bluetooth dongle. It often doesn't connect to my phone's Bluetooth. The Torque software says it's an unsupported l elm327. So it's hacked & cracked. The data rate & refresh is slow. But it does read and reset codes. I use an FM-Bluetooth 12v tranceiver to connect my phone to my older car stereo, so i can't use the Torque app on a trip to monitor mileage while listening to my stereo with the Bluetooth dongle. So I bought a supposed VGate brand wifi dongle to replace it from AliExpress. But it also is a clone. It works, does everything. Except when connected to my phone wifi, my phone cell data doesn't work! It thinks it's connected to the Internet. I suggest buying a known good ELM327 dongle in the first place to avoid hassles and a lot of cussing. And one with Bluetooth 4.0 or Wifi so it will connect to Apple, Android and a laptop with sufficient data rate. If buying from eBay, Wish, AliExpress, Temu etc, buyer beware. Ask questions of the seller before buying

[@johnburrows8281]

As a guy thats done alot of homework on these adapters. There is no mention of the FAKE microchip pic18f chips used in most of the adapters. The firmware is very buggy, your right. The last OFFICIAL standard was version 1.4b(openly admitted on ELM Electronics) they never made a version 1.5.

[@AtimatikArmy]

These details are way over most car guys head. We just want to know which is the best value for our dollar so we can get whatever vehicle working for the least amount of money possible.

[@donniev8181]

The best cheap thorough Bluetooth scan dongle ive found is the Autel AP200. The fact that it allows you to program keys is worth the $50 price by itself. Plus, the first model registered has free lifetime coverage. Every model afterwards is $20 a year

[@Tools-Tested]

Thanks for the info, yeah seeing it does keys thats a big deal.

[@donniev8181]

@Tools-Tested yeah, the immo programming pays for itself after one use. I also bought the Toyota specific scan tool, the Launch X431 Elite, its right around $120. It allows me to do everything on my new Toyota, from ATF temp to customization.

[@FredCookLive]

Nice quick succinct overview. The only note I would make, is there is a significant difference between ODB readers and more advanced ODB scan tools. I would consider all of these dongles to be readers except for the TopDon TopScan, which is a scan tool. And a bi-directional scan too on top of that! BTW, TopDon has great (U.S. based) technical phone support. Honestly, a scan tool for $60 (the TopScan Pro is $100, prices as of 8/9/2024) is crazy cheap! For DIY'ers that want a basic scan tool but don't want or need to go all the way with something like TopDon's Phoenix Max bi-directional scan tool for $4,000+, the TopScan is perfect.

[@Tools-Tested]

Thanks! Yep the is the only real scan tool and I agree is a good value for the money.

[@_P0tat07_]

I have the bluedriver and it’s really cool because the app is free and has no in app purchases. My only complaint is scamming is really slow. And I don’t k ow if that’s just a problem with Bluetooth code readers or if all scam tools are slow. I’ve never used an actual scan tool. But I’ve had it take well over 15 minutes to do a full scan on vehicles.

[@Tools-Tested]

Yeah I agree its likely do to it being bluetooth vs WiFi. I haven't tested larger auto scanners yet, but the ones I use at work(MTU,MAN Engines) are WiFi. All of the dongles that scanned for all modules took at least 5 minutes to do the complete scan.

[@naturestrail2296]

It doesn't do live data to see the transmission temp if you need to change the tran fluid and need to know the temp due to expansion with heat to set the level. So, bluedriver just didn't cut it for me.

[@wesleyrobson1620]

If you're willing to spend just a little more, $150-200, the xtool A30M is on par with the topscan as far as capabilities but has free lifetime updates.

[@mrrobotto3321]

Yup. I just got the A30M from AliExpress for $95+ tax during their last huge sale. I almost bought it from Amazon for about $170+ tax. XTool has a store on AliExpress so I guess I got it from the manufacturer.

[@donniev8181]

The Autel AP200 does nearly everything as well, including key programming for only $50

[@TheManMiscellaneous]

There's another one that seems to be pretty good in comparsion to the A30M in price, functions and free lifetime its Vident ISmartDiag510Pro.

[@TheManMiscellaneous]

Has to be a tie between that and the Vident ISmartDiag510Pro.

[@evanepp]

Thanks for making this video, great review. I was on the fence, but now I know I'm buying the TOPDON.

[@Tools-Tested]

No problem! Glad it helped!

[@strykerentllc]

Have the Blue Driver and it's very limited as far as we're concerned. It'll read & clear codes but not much else that's useful when it comes to isolating a code. O2 sensors are an example--left bank lean but doesn't point to the upstream or downstream (before or after the CAT). What we've been eyeballing is the HP Tuners mpvi3 and yes, it's pricey and requires purchasing credits but it affords manipulation of parameters.

[@BengalNpawz-jb4wj]

Hmm, Scotty Kilmer seems to think it's a great one, kzbin.info/www/bejne/oZapkoOZpcR4bNE Does it help you figure out abs issue?

[@Dpfdoctor]

Another top quality video, big fan of the channel. its only a matter of time until your sub count blows up

[@dragngt]

Been weighing the BlueDriver vs others out there. Really, I’d only heard to most positive feedback about BlueDriver. The TopDon looks very tempting. I’ll do a little more research and pull the trigger. Thanks for doing this! 👍

[@Tools-Tested]

No problem! glade you found it useful!

[@toyotatundra0455]

Thanks fir the video. I ordered the Topdon on a Amazon deal.

[@explosivebody1260]

Great testing! Have been in the market for another one considering the last two I got are subpar - I'm drawn to the Zurich, primarily because the topdon requires a $50 subscription fee every year... Other than that, an incredible tool for the price

[@Tools-Tested]

Thanks! also thanks for the info on the subscription, I somehow overlooked that. Im curious now if it will allow me to use the tool after one year, just without the ability to download updates or if it won't run all together.

[@explosivebody1260]

@@Tools-Tested no problem - even looking through reviews it's hard to tell if you lose all functionality or just updates

[@Tools-Tested]

@@explosivebody1260 So now that I'm down this rabbit hole, here is what I found on TopDons website "Tools that require a subscription are renewed annually. Once the subscription is renewed all updates for the tool are covered for the full year. TOPDON’s limited warranty will continue with the subscription. The tools will continue to function without a subscription; however, the tools will not be available for updates and the tool will no longer be covered by the warranty, and programming functions may be inaccessible." www.topdon.us/pages/faq Guess it will be interesting to see what happens in a year.....

[@explosivebody1260]

@@Tools-Tested appreciate you taking a further look! I'll be waiting for that update lol - thanks for all that you do

[@tonyhanneman3976]

@@Tools-Tested It's interesting that it works without an internet connection but it requires a subscription. I'm wondering what they mean by no longer receive updates. Does that mean the dongle will no longer get firmware updates, or that you will no longer be able to add new vehicles, or that certain parts of the app will cease to function? Because I would be fine with no longer receiving firmware updates, but probably not so much the others.

[@chucklemberg4968]

I used the BlueDriver (purchased it for $49.95) coupled with my android phone. However, I quickly tired of the small screen. So I purchased an OBDLINK EX using FORScan and OBDwiz software and connect to my 15" laptop. It is a corded OBD2 adapter and provides much higher speeds in transferring information than the BlueDriver. I saw the Topdon TopScan featured on Scanner Danner and am seriously considering purchasing one because of its bilateral communication (ability to activate certain systems).

[@Tools-Tested]

Yeah that’s the killer with these is the speed, but I do like the bidirectional us with the ability to turn things on and off.

[@w1nnin]

Have the BlueDriver, obdmx (BMW) coding, just ordered the topdon dongle thank u for the review.

[@Tools-Tested]

No problem glad it was helpful!

[@0084arun]

What's best for bmw

[@jxm1497]

@@0084arunmhd

[@MrGeorgeferreira]

thanks for the video but for me, BlueDriver seems to be the best choice with no subs, even with one lees function than topscan which does active component test.

[@carlfields]

I've tried several of these tools. TopScan isn't in the same class as the others. It's an actual bi-directional scan tool that has functions you'd find in scanners over $500. I bought the lite version which has a yearly subscription of $50, but the first year is free. If you work on cars and need a tool that actually helps you diagnose a problem and not just throw parts at it, then the TopScan tool is a no brainer. If you don't need an actual scan tool and just want a good code reader then pick one that at least scans all modules.

[@james10739]

I may have to try that I have an elm327 I have had for a long time and it reads codes and clears with torque app and recently picked up a mucar for Ike $60 and it offered special functions like brake bleeding for a year but I never used it on a vehicle that needed any of those things now it's $70 for another year and I guess that's kinda bi directional but it wasn't described as that and I haven't seen a bi directional unit for under like $300

[@GremLant]

I like Topdon and have two of their products, but the yearly fee to keep all of the Topscan functionality is a miss for me.

[@carlfields]

@@GremLant I also decided to test out the xtool A30M. It has lifetime free updates and has similar functions as the Topscan. It was able to detect an SRS light on a 2007 Honda accord that the Topscan couldn't. More maintenance functions also. But I do like easy access to Topscan's Technical Service Bulletins. Either one would be better than the others on the list.

[@tichwykes]

I've got the ELM 327 & found it to be fine for my needs, the car scan app is less than £5 & can open up a lot more options whether or not it would read other modules remains to be seen but I shall try it.

[@boedilllard5952]

Thanks for the video. My goal for getting one would be to enable things like window roll down on the key fob, modify lighting times etc. for a Toyota Camry. Do you know if all of these systems can do that?

[@Tools-Tested]

No problem, only the Topdon will.

[@boedilllard5952]

@@Tools-Tested Thanks!

[@tobiasklima]

Thanks for a great video mate

[@Tools-Tested]

No problem 👍

[@KillerHT]

thx, very help

[@Tools-Tested]

No problem!

[@eurosonly]

I was under the impression that the amount of features you can see in the app is up to the app itself and not the scanner dongle.

[@AliSaeedArain]

Can they be used all the time, all the driving time?

[@shawcobra]

Could i use these scan tools on a motorcycle?

[@saucemaster2]

The subscription on the topdon ruins that one for me. Ill go with the zurich

[@MrShortStuff]

What unit can do MUT-II Protocols?

[@Tools-Tested]

None of these that I’m aware of, Mut-II requires it’s own tool to my knowledge.

[@MrShortStuff]

@Tools-Tested you can use a tactrix with evo scan as I have but was hoping for a smaller unit.

[@Tools-Tested]

Yep I understand that.

[@kelvinelrick807]

I have the OBDLink MX+ and it works great. I've had it for 3 or 4 years and the only thing I don't like about it is sometimes I have to unplug and plug it back in to get it work. Though I always leave it plugged in since I only have one vehicle at the moment. Another note, It's been a minute but I do remember being able to record data with the MX+.

[@jma8352]

Good job! the topdon pro one cost more and dose tpms, the regular one dose not so i think the zurich at $40 with the itc discount is a better over all deal. i hate subscriptions as these are advancing all the time.

[@MrGeorgeferreira]

thanks for highlighting that it needs subscription...I was about to buy it but now I will not...He should have said that..important point.

[@SnakZ]

ELM 327, what is like 6$ tends to die and no longer work after a few mouths. I had to buy around 4 replacements so far. What is why i am here now lol

[@Tools-Tested]

Thanks for the info!

[@davidpatrick1813]

perfect, thanks

[@Tools-Tested]

Glad it helped!

[@ermant1311]

but I think for reset functions u need to pay EXTRA for Topdon right ?

[@Tools-Tested]

I think after one year, its not very clear what functions you loose. Topdon website says you only looses updates but I find that hard to believe. I will know in January because that will be one year.

[@ComprasAltoRendimientoAutomotr]

Ayuda, me podrías decir cuál es el mejor para ver en tiempo real la presión y la temperatura del aceite?Help, could you tell me which one is best to see the oil pressure and temperature in real time?

[@Sheevness]

Try looking at the ones that do live data. Check their websites for more specific info.

[@aersn4locs]

Hello guys. Im doing a coolant flush/refill and i just wanted to see the elm 327 can read my coolant temp since it doesnt show on the dash. Worth it ?

[@NoferTrunions]

Seems like it is more a comparison of the software.

[@Tools-Tested]

Yeah software is 90% of these.

[@mrpetit2]

In every one of my car I have that cheap elm327 dongle and I use it with torque (android app). So I always have one with me. As for the more in depth diagnostics, I usually use a brand specific china sourced multiplexer (like a Volvo Vida interface, a BMW INPA/ISTA interfac etc) and the (pirated) dealer software. So you can do everything the dealer does, except updating software modules in the car (that usually requires a dealer subscription, which typically costs 10k+/year). I specifically don't by a car/brand where such a pirated version of the dealer software isn't available on the web. I've been diagnosing all my cars myself (and for my family) for about 25 years now (I'm from back in the day that you could only buy a loose elm327 and had to build your own (serial!) interface😉, so the late 90's), so I'm pretty experienced with quite a few car brands (although I'm not a professional mechanic) But for on the go, you can't go wrong with an elm327 dongle for 10 bucks. As it pretty much can read all the codes that could leave you stranded/inhibit driving.2

[@apivovarov2]

is Huper tough HT500 similar to Zurich and 430?

[@Tools-Tested]

Yeah it looks identical from the specs. Nice to see it being offered at Walmart.

[@apivovarov2]

⁠just $49 . best deal. I tested 430 and ht500 - no difference

[@rishabhsharma3917]

Does Zurich read other codes then just the engine and does it require any subscription?

[@Tools-Tested]

Yes please see table at the end of the video. No subscription

[@rishabhsharma3917]

@@Tools-Testedhey thanks for replying I was also wondering if it would be compatible with my Honda civic 2008 in Canada as I can’t seem to find it on their website.

[@Tools-Tested]

No problem! Yeah anything after 1996 should* be good.

[@phazei]

The stupid recommended video card covers up half the chart at the end so I can't even read what I really wanted to see :(

[@Tools-Tested]

Sorry, Thanks for the info, it should be removed.

[@GuyOntheroad-wf7tf]

Can i use app of my choice with ELM327?

[@Tools-Tested]

Yes you can use other apps with the ELM327, it's hard to say which ones will work with it without testing each one.

[@ComprasAltoRendimientoAutomotr]

Help, could you tell me which one is best to see the oil pressure and temperature in real time?

[@Tools-Tested]

All the ones with live data should be able to display oil pressure and temp, its just a mater of the additional features you want from. the tool.

[@ToxicTwix]

Anyone here can help me out. What is best between BLCKTEC 430 and The Blue Driver?

[@allwellbud]

Do these scanners show lifetime mileage? If someone changed dashboard mileage meter then the chip would have registered total miles right?

[@Tools-Tested]

Hard to say, probably depends a lot on the year and make of the vehicle

[@naturestrail2296]

Was the the obdlink mx+ or just mx? Price says + but list shows mx? Thanks

[@Tools-Tested]

The MX+ was tested

[@jackle842000]

Does topscan read trans temp? Does it require subscription?

[@Tools-Tested]

Yeah it would read trans temp, tool comes with one year sub. The site say updates turn off once the subscription expires but the tool is supposed to still work. I haven't made it one year yet so its hard to 100% say.

[@joeydelmarsjr.646]

can Topdon TopScan pull pin code to program keys and fobs?

[@Tools-Tested]

No I don't believe so.

[@evaldas266]

Hey, so if I have Elm327 OBDII Bluetooth from AliExpress it works with this program by pressing Bluetooth LE but not Bluetooth? And how about Ford Galaxy 2004 2.0 Petrol if it still works?

[@Tools-Tested]

Yeah should be Bluetooth LE and it shouldnt have an issue with a ford Galaxy 2004.

[@misterb1915]

Bro, how often are you told you look like Chris Evans?

[@Tools-Tested]

Never lol

[@madcow3417]

Ive been using a $10 dongle for a decade. It may be time to upgrade.

[@jimakos75]

i would like to ask you if you know any OBD adapter that can read my ecu with protocol KWP1281 from my Golf MK4 GTI early 2000 except OBDEleven because i have it , please.

[@mrpetit2]

Won't any KKL interface do that? (10 bucks on alie)

[@jimakos75]

Of course and i have but i want Bluetooth adapter my friend to recognise kwp1281.

[@EzekielTruman]

Jackson Donald Harris Jessica Moore Eric

[@BURZT_YT]

Why did u skip veepeak vp11?

[@Tools-Tested]

It’s the same as ELM327

[@GremLant]

At least one of these (Topdon) requires an annual fee to maintain full functionality. That adds to the total cost of ownership.

[@ImMentosFresh]

It's an informative video, I especially like having the table spreadsheet that lays out all the data. It makes everything easy to see and decipher what is best for my needs. Well done!

[@Tools-Tested]

Glad it was helpful!

[@sambashivanaspuri1402]

Awesome! super helpful. I have 2014 Jeep Patriot. Does TopDon reads/scans for engine issues ?

[@Tools-Tested]

Yeah shouldn't be an issue.

[@DavidWerner-h1j]

Hernandez Larry Young Donna Miller Daniel

[@paulkaufman4901]

Thanks So Much! Perfect comparison for me! I use ios phone and I wanted bi-directional ability. The Topdon looks like a great option. I have spent more than $50 on basic scan tools. I bought the Topdon on Amazon for $58 on sale and am looking forward to trying it out.🙂

[@Tools-Tested]

Glad it was helpful!

[@bogieman101]

Great review, you just saved me from throwing away money on a cheap unit. Had no idea you could get scanner with some bi-direct for less than $100. I'm still using a centec hand held that I've had for many years. Time for an upgrade.

[@ttt69420]

Sad that I'm forced to by an obd dongle to get access to data that should have a gauge, but doesn't.

[@jordan6556]

Which 1 is lifetime update without paying extra every year.

[@iLL3571]

Glad I found this video, amazing help

[@Tools-Tested]

Glad it helped!

[@brettdavis9575]

Does anyone know if the Zurich can read abs codes?

[@diy-ft7js]

How about OBD2 devices for Toyota Prius or other Hybrid cars?

[@Tools-Tested]

I would assume they will read the information for the combustion engine. Electric motor side idk what it would show.

[@joeydelmarsjr.646]

Vlinker MC is the best for the $$

[@حمديصقر-غ4ق]

Hello tools tested. Can you make a video about? What is the difference between the Elm327 mini and Elm327?

[@حمديصقر-غ4ق]

And compare it of the rest OBD2 tools.

[@Tools-Tested]

My understanding is the “mini” is just a rebranding. With all of the same features as the old Elm327.

[@حمديصقر-غ4ق]

@@Tools-Tested Thank you very much for this information. I was think there's a difference between this two version but now I know it basically the same thing.

[@mrcokez1]

but what about the Thinkdiag2 ?

[@swimwithcoachraven1532]

Mine doesn’t work with Apple

[@Tools-Tested]

I don't remember which ones but some wouldn't work on old OS, you might make sure you have the latest OS. All were tested on an apple phone.

[@swimwithcoachraven1532]

@@Tools-Tested Manage to connect it. It worked. I set it to wifi instead of Bluetooth. It’s only had certain features. Was not able to reset a check engine light

[@almostahero1804]

You fail to mention one thing ,the top don also sucks ,there selling it for 16 dollars right now it's garbage,after one year they want you to pay subscription for app ,and for a person whose going to scan there car a few times in it's lifetime I just need the device and code no subscriptions so the top don 16 dollars normally 70 needs a subscription after a year

[@TheEvilMechanic]

I call BS. Show me where you can buy Topdon for $16.

[@timothylockhart2009]

Love this review. I have had 3 scan tools, The cheap BAFX (ELM essentially) a Snap on solus edge thats locked at 2018 and I just got the topscan to play with. I was/am very weary of their subscription and what it will lock out. If it locks out Bi Directional controls for older year models that will suck. Although I would understand it as No other scan tool does Bi Directional until you get to the Autel MK808 for $400 and even that did not COME with bi directional it got it in a software update. it used to be 1k for bi directional. So even if you buy this for one repair and then continue to buy the updates once a year. You would have 8 years of updated software vs buying something like the MK808 today. The topdon topscan did have slow polling,graphing during my testing, RPM graphs were not smooth but jagged compared to my more expensive tools. This was with a samsung galaxy S23 ultra and a 2016 silverado. I am going to keep mine as it will hopefully compliment the snap on with euro coverage and bi directional controls past 2018, hopefully not at a 50/yr cost.

[@brendonrutherford5118]

This presentation is very mediocre & average & I would not be choosing any of these models merely based on the information given here as it is rather sketchy & merely flows quickly over the various specifications offered!! In other words one cannot make a good & considered choice based on the limited amount of information given in this video!! There has to be better videos out there than this mere offering!!

[@Tools-Tested]

Lol sorry missed your video Karen

[@flatplanecrank]

@@Tools-Tested Thanks for the video, guaranteed this person didn't watch the the complete video and see the comparison table at the end. Really don't understand how much more info you could add..... Any how, just wanted to say FYI hyper tough now has a few versions out which look similar to the Innova and Zurich.