The Chess Cheating Scandal, Explained | WSJ

[@zihuatenejo]

Carlsen has such a deep understanding of the game, he can intuitively feel when he is against a bot.

[@MrSupernova111]

Maybe he just felt the beads while seating across from Neimann.

[@jari2018]

gamers do this also -get shot by a bot is diffent than a human player - maybe the ability is the same - botlike (computer)moves

[@penguinista]

Carlson said that he is very familiar with playing over the board against top players and that it was very odd that Niemann was not tense at all during stressful parts of the game.

[@listrahtes]

I dont know if he explained that but it is at least talked about that he deliberate played as he did vs Niemann to get to a conclusion himself that Niemann is cheating. Thats why he used such an unconventional opening. Niemann proved the point then for Carlsen. Listen to Niemann in the interview. He was at a complete loss to explain his movements because of that. He lied about a game of Carlsen he had studied that never happened. Carlsen played anti cheat chess inside a chess game. Truly genius.

[@lordjim3109]

0:51 this could be a generic stock image: "A cheater in action".

[@default2591]

I'm a Hikaru fan but Magnus isn't some crybaby, he has lost a ton of games and pretty much never complained so it was pretty believable when he somehow accused Hans of cheating.

[@rahulvig5298]

True. I mean if the best chess player in history finds something to be fishy then there definitely is something fishy. Also, if Hans is actually that smart, why isn't he able to explain his lines in the analysis of the game later on?

[@busdriverguy]

I dunno, all chess players have a crybaby quality to them

[@ilyassebenana3824]

​@@busdriverguy hans Himself is probably the biggest proof of that

[@DanielBoonelight]

lol @ your qualifying statement. weird false dichotomy.

[@eleazaraguilar]

​@@busdriverguyyeah just like how hans smash his keyboard every time he loses or drae

[@Gravy_Master]

Why the heck is a professional player allowed to walk around and go to the bathroom with their cell phone DURING a match they are playing in? That is just asking for trouble.

[@starlightbright]

They hide the cell phone in the bathroom before hand

[@myweirdsecondchannelwithap9070]

@@starlightbrightJust ban going to the bathroom during games. Really it should be simple

[@colours8846]

​@@myweirdsecondchannelwithap9070 classical chess can be very long like 8 9 hr long. Holding ur pee for that long is bad idea.

[@Joaquin-l2q]

It is not allowed.

[@myweirdsecondchannelwithap9070]

@@colours8846 didn't know that at all, wow. I guess the chess games I've watched are some other type of chess. Anyways, in that case I guess there is no simple solution. Best idea would be to ban phones in the bathroom maybe

[@superpantman]

- unable to explain his thought process or decisions - A victory that would make him the biggest chess prodigy to date with no previous indication of that trajectory. - trolling and disrespectful comments afterwards - A lack of attention and stress at key moments in the game - coached by a known cheater - claimed ‘by a miracle’ he studied the exact game the day before - previous proven instances of cheating, which he previously denied happened. Sure, there is no solid evidence that he cheated against Magnus but sure seems fishy. I totally understand the refusal to play him again.

[@byzantinephilosopher]

Or it could just be the simple fact that Magnus was playing poorly that tournament and Hans was adequately prepared. So many perverse conspiracy theories and paranoid imaginings.

[@zachhaywood1564]

Who was his coach? I'm new to this whole scandal.

[@edvinkarlsson9368]

@@byzantinephilosopher nah no way, dig deeper on this issue an youll see

[@Priestitude]

Cry more hahaha

[@edvinkarlsson9368]

@@Priestitude huh?

[@TheGeeoff]

The interview after the game is actually quite incriminating. A super GM analyzed his interview real-time and made a strong case that Hans does not understand the game that he played and won. Even the interviewer understood the game better than Hans.

[@doji-san]

Still no proof of actual cheating OTB...

[@Fivetimesthree]

Can you link the analysis?

[@TheGeeoff]

@@Fivetimesthree Hikaru Nakumura is commenting in the box and he is one of the top five (maybe top three) players in the world. So he knows what he is talking about.

[@pianoverse1366]

@@doji-san its hard to prove after the game has finished,but no one can proof he is not cheating either,one day this nieman will hit his limit

[@listrahtes]

@@doji-san So Hans, as we now know has cheated more than 100x in online games (read the analyis that IS 100%) . His coach is a lifelong cheater who got caught right after his last ban, he cant explain his win, his whole persona is that of a dishonest persona to the max, he has more engine correlation than any other player, but you want to give him the benefit of the doubt 🙂 Funny. They next to never catch someone red handed in OTB. Its extremely difficult. The ones they catch are mostly afterwards after weeks and months of video analysis.

[@LtLXIX]

“Must be embarrassing to lose to me” He knows himself that he has no skill or else no one would say that. I don’t watch chess ever but you can tell it’s a class act game and respect is a major part of the game. He clearly had no respect for the game

[@superpantman]

Dunking on a victory is classic cheater behaviour. Anyone that appreciates the effort and skill that goes into beating the number 1 wouldn’t talk like that.

[@Zamibia]

He's a proven cheater so yeah, clearly he has no respect for the game.

[@RoIIingStoned]

He clearly has no integrity. He cheated.

[@sudhirchandra9790]

He speaks like Trump I have never ever cheated

[@Nisowyd]

Although it’s true he has no respect for the game, he is actually a pretty talented chess player.

[@Harunee23]

Magnus has lost to others before. He doesnt complain when you’ve actually bested him. But when a guy that beats you cant explain the reasoning of their moves, its very fishy. Even elos under 1500 can explain the game they played. A gm that is unable to do so makes it very suspicious.

[@alexanderjules1869]

Never thought I would see the day where I'm excited to hear about the latest news in the Chess world but here we are

[@eustab.anas-mann9510]

Cheating has become so easy in chess that with a little tech and an accomplice it will get you very far in the rankings.

[@GibsonArtola]

This is the best comment ever made on KZbin!

[@seeharvester]

If you think this is exciting, you should try the device he used to cheat.

[@bluesherbet2741]

I know right same lol.

[@miscdylaneous5269]

If you cheat once, your reputation gets tainted and your word becomes untrustworthy.

[@yahya2925]

Nah. People mess up and some sincerely intend to never do something like that again. You've got to give people another chance.

[@theoreticalexercise]

I can't believe WSJ is covering this. Loving watching chess blow like this lol

[@timefororbit]

Laughed out loud at "small liberator" and the silhouetted guy jumps

[@afif4738]

wsj is nothing

[@Djamonja]

@@afif4738 I'm pretty sure they are something.

[@eustab.anas-mann9510]

@@afif4738 and who are you, exactly?

[@jgalvan09]

@@afif4738 lol suuure a gif sure

[@MrLankoss]

When someone says "I cheated that one time, but never since", I automatically believe they have cheated many times, and will continue to cheat until forced not too. Once a cheater, always a cheater, especially when it can have a significant monetary gain.

[@kencur9690]

Well, that’s a bs way of thinking. I’m not defending the guy, but it simply is. Almost everybody has cheated in some way or another in their life. So they always cheat? Here’s my own admittance which doesn’t even have any consequence on anything, since it’s just casual living room gaming. When I was a kid, I was curious and typed in or inputted those cheats I always heard of, and I played some games like that. Invincibility cheat and what not. My curiosity satisfied, I never did that thing again, since it was quite boring. There, a prime example of someone who “cheated” and never did it again. I get that you’d be more suspicious of someone who cheated in the past, but to say that once a cheater always a cheater is the typical reductionist simplification that humans are unfortunately so good at. It’s a lazy way of reasoning.

[@kencur9690]

@Jmt1000 I know that, obviously, but that wasn’t my point, which you clearly missed. Regardless of whether it is innocuous and without consequence (as I plainly wrote in my comment!) or against others, it still remains the fact that having cheated once doesn’t mean one will cheat forever. That doesn’t change regardless of *how* the cheating is done: it is still cheating, and it was still not repeated. So I fail to see how my situation, despite being admittedly different, is not relevant. Why wouldn’t it be relevant? I mean, what are you talking about? What kind of “analogy” is that? I mean, it’s not even a bad one, it isn’t even an analogy. If you’re single, then obviously you can’t cheat (!) - not to mention that that kind of cheating is *also* significantly different from cheating at a game (in fact, it has nothing to do with competitive cheating). Whereas cheating at a single player game is STILL cheating. And by the way, many have cheated at single player games in order to get high scores... and to boast about it with other people. So single player cheats can have consequences after all: there are a lot of KZbin videos about such incidents, and about such cheaters exposed.

[@kencur9690]

@Just some Austrian guy with a mustache wth are you talking about? How is that in any way relevant to what I wrote?

[@kencur9690]

@Just some Austrian guy with a mustache ah I think I get what you meant to say: you’re arguing that since it’s effortless to cheat in online chess then one is more prone to cheat, and that the only reason one doesn’t cheat again is because it’s too hard to. So essentially, two arguments. Ok, let me address each one, assuming that I am correct in my interpretation of what you meant to say. Regarding the first one, the ease with which one can cheat in online chess, well that may be so, but then as you said cheating on the board is not as easy, so how does that fit with the “once a cheater always a cheater” mentality? Still, I think there is some validity in the suggestion that it’s more probable for a cheater to keep cheating if cheating is easier, so there I agree. As for the second point, that some don’t cheat again because it is too hard, there I don’t really agree: perhaps it’s also true in some cases, but especially in the case I referred to, my own that is, it was very easy to cheat, so it’s no different at all. I stopped for other reasons. So it’s not always the case that a cheater doesn’t cheat anymore because it’s too difficult: it can definitely be a conscious choice. I hope I understood your point and I hope I explained mine well enough.

[@kencur9690]

@Just some Austrian guy with a mustache yes, I understand that, and I already addressed it: while I agree that there is some validity in what you say, I disagree that it is the only reason, and it was not at all the reason in my own example: it was extremely easy for me to cheat again, and I didn’t. In fact, seeing how there were no consequences and I would never be caught, it was even easier: there was nothing on the line, and yet I still chose to not cheat. Clearly, it’s not entirely true that the ease of cheating defines whether we do it again or not.

[@skjoldgames]

This has been a much bigger problem even (and especially) in the much smaller leagues for a while. The even bigger problem is that somebody can have a secondary device for a chess engine and share screen won't even be able to detect it. They can even put it on another network or cellular data to further distance monitoring. I would say that as a genuine chess player, nothing is more enraging than knowing you've been cheated against. It is one of the main reasons I've decided to move more into speed chess, where cheaters don't have time to use a chess engine.

[@mysticjedi6730]

Why does the NFL allow coaches on the sidelines during the game? People should be able to determine next move however they wish. What's going to happen when glasses with heads up display, and other technology integrating humans with electronics is the norm? If everyone can make a move in consultation with a chess coach, computer, whatever.. that is the only way to level the playing field. The advice may lead to a win or loss... the good players will be the ones who take in all advice and decide for themselves. I don't consider it cheating at all.. no more than the NFL or any sports teams having AI determine statistical probability of plays... next we should ban coaches at football games and computers giving advice to players during games?

[@JayceSyn]

@@mysticjedi6730 You cannot be serious. The game of chess would be destroyed if the use of engines and other tools were allowed; it would literally defeat the purpose of the game which is using your head to find the best moves to beat your opponent

[@mysticjedi6730]

@@JayceSyn when I play computers I get better not by playing on easy mode, but by losing..

[@TrevJ91]

@@mysticjedi6730 the difference is coaches on the sideline don’t perform for the player. The coaches can talk, but the player actually has to execute on the field. In chess, since the game is not physical but mental, the computer is the one executing and performing while the player is just does what it says like a dummy. A better comparison would be if the coaches actually went out on the field and threw the ball then you’d have a point.

[@mysticjedi6730]

@@TrevJ91 when play people can have 100 people advising them and any computer they like...

[@coconutologist]

The device was in his hair

[@SpontaneityJD]

2:26 Please, do not ever pronounce "FIDE" like this again.

[@elijahrose7913]

Ouch

[@jonathana.5270]

How should it be pronounced?

[@w1zxrd]

@@jonathana.5270 fide is prounounced fee-day. Fee like feet, and day like today.

[@LimitedWard]

@@jonathana.5270 It's meant to be pronounced "fiddy", as in "the Loch Ness monster needed to borrow three fiddy."

[@TikTokHotTub]

I don’t know chess but i will no go outta my way to say it like this

[@HouseofJello]

Don't castle like the model in this video if you're playing over the board. Always move the king two spaces then the rook.

[@lordcommander4694]

I see you are a man of culture as well

[@hypothalapotamus5293]

Internet denizen tries castling rook first online. Fails as well.

[@desiertos-j7h]

True that. And never use two hands to grab a piece after capture. Hehe. ;)

[@danielch6662]

2:15 in case anyone wasn't staring at the screen the whole time and missed it.

[@opusdei1151]

He is referring to this section 2:16 (First you move the king then the rook)

[@fatihsonmez]

2:17 dude, you can't castle like that. you have to move the king first.

[@nicbentulan]

Niiiiiice

[@DShadow_Vins]

Exactly what I noticed! Lol

[@nicbentulan]

Hans Niemann did castle like that vs Vladimir Fedoseev last year though lol

[@nicbentulan]

@@DShadow_Vins Hans Niemann did castle like that vs Vladimir Fedoseev last year though lol

[@fatihsonmez]

@@nicbentulan yeah and hans was wearing a cool red sunglasses :d opponent mocked the move but ignored it :d normally, it's not okay tho :d

[@ShantanuPatnaik]

2:48 - "Hidden somewhere on the player's body". Why not be more descriptive here on where it could be hidden?

[@ammonquitalig9077]

Exactly, LoL

[@xrandomdonalds695]

Its in his hair. If you noticed his new hairstyle its rather long...

[@pinky6758]

E.g. a remote-controlled buzzer hidden on his leg, sending the recommended move to him via Morse-code, from someone in the audience who runs a copy of the game in a chess-simulator on their Smartphone.

[@tuoljg]

@@pinky6758 Except sinquenfield cup and us championship allow no audience to watch only players and referees allowed in the playing hall. They also scan for signals. And they put delay on the game. And they scan players for good measure. Good luck cheating with that security lol.

[@martinblake2278]

Things that gave Hans away: 1. His moves for that match when analyzed and compared to his past moves strongly suggests that it's a move only a chess bot, super psychic, advance alien, or that of a super genius (miles ahead of Kasparov or Magnus) can do. It's very hard for non competitive chess players to realize but it's obvious if you are playing competitive for a while. 2. His explanations when interviewed on how he did those moves were so thin and lackluster, anyone who plays competitive chess significantly knows that there might be something going on there. I have no proof, but I've been playing since 10 years old and was competitive in high school, and I am 101 percent sure that cheating did occur.

[@tonya1425]

It’s obvious that he cheated. Chess is a straightforward game; the fact that there was this many suspicious actions should make it obvious that he’s a cheater.

[@MUISHAGGY572]

They have proof, Hans was tested positive for steroids!

[@Smileater]

He cheated, no doubt for me. Just take a look at his current performance and snd blunders.

[@ClaudioAguileraMunoz]

whe he is strictly observed his blunders are miles behind that performance. He obviously cheated, so pathetic.

[@venerable_nelson]

The second thing was one of the biggest ones for me. His explanations were so lackluster, and the interviewers had the chess engine recommended moves turned off while he was giving them (the first time this had ever been done). It's almost like he wasn't playing the game at all when he talks about it. His answers to all interview questions about the moves he took can be summed up with "trust me bro".

[@penguinista]

It is ridiculous that they don't take security seriously with that kind of prize money at stake. There are millions of people who care deeply about the outcome as well, so the risk of cheating is very high. Also, numerous grand masters have been caught in the past. They should hold chess tournaments at airports and use their millimeter resolution scanners on all the contestants. Don't allow spectators and delay the video feed by something like 30 min. Then we could find out how well Hans Niemann actually plays. Notice in that interview that he says he never cheated in a ranked game, but did cheat when he was sixteen to get his rank up online. He is evidently not a logistician.

[@macabree5856]

They did take security seriously. Watch the video again. But now, they underestimated how deep and advance deception and cheating is. There is another video on youtube that explains this and trust me, it will make give up on life the way they talk about superior advance cheating techniques.

[@tongpoo8985]

Unironically they may need to conduct cavity searches

[@animefan7424]

@@macabree5856 Danya literally gave a very simple way of cheating OTB

[@macabree5856]

@@animefan7424 Why you write that to me? What does your comment have to do with me? I don't get it. Plus, this comment thread nearly a half year old

[@scienceevolves4417]

​@@macabree5856u mad bro?

[@danielcintz8880]

2:49 is what you are here for

[@vignesh6654]

"Somewhere "

[@kaliss7192]

@@vignesh6654 *ANOLE*

[@Kane-ib5sn]

he was never caught. but, if you cheat, the cost comes back at you at a later date - almost guaranteed.

[@Priestitude]

Hahahaha

[@snoozy04]

The biggest disrespect is when Hans actually tweeted "The lawsuit speaks for itself."

[@marksmit8112]

Just like his win against Magnus. "The Chess speaks for itself". It does certainly because he cannot

[@Alexander_Grant]

You gotta love it. I hope from the bottom of my heart that he proves his innocence.

[@TheGaming100]

@@Alexander_Grant don't worry, he 100% won't

[@orderflowarchives]

He doesn't realize a lawsuit means he has to open up to discovery. Thats why he never went through with it

[@jasondeanhallquist8382]

He's a weirdo that's for sure. He gets so emotional he looks so guilty. I'm very curious to see how this unfolds

[@longwalksguidemenerdwalk8866]

And what if he didn’t cheat?

[@jasondeanhallquist8382]

@@longwalksguidemenerdwalk8866 Good question

[@thedarkowl8918]

@@longwalksguidemenerdwalk8866 or what if he did cheat?

[@khawarwellness4886]

@@longwalksguidemenerdwalk8866 probably he didnt he just take chess so seriously and emotionally people take it as suspicion

[@SGNL05]

He did cheat, multiple times.

[@matkins6813]

Looks like a Lance Armstrong moment coming soon...stay tuned.

[@TWE_2000]

It definitely doesn't help that Hans looks like the guy that sold you weed in high school lol

[@Napstone]

haha he IooKs and sounds IiKe a mad scientist!

[@Bulletproofsoul3]

Hans went to my high school

[@shaynehix7711]

Play in-person tournaments only. That will solve the cheating. Online games should not be recognized as official games.

[@animefan7424]

When they do have official tournament games online, it is usually done on a set location or you need to show multiple cameras from different viewpoints. Chess sites have prize money tournaments such as titled arenas

[@Max-ve5tu]

Lance Armstrong, Barry Bonds, Houston Astros, and now Hans Niemann.

[@austinduke8876]

Don't forget my ex; Annabelle Cavatelli

[@AJ-iu6nw]

Lance never cheated. Don't tarnish his name

[@eagle-eye29]

You forgot football deflate gate…. I haven’t

[@jtgd]

“It was a mistake” Deliberately cheats

[@timefororbit]

Oopsy

[@reviewyup592]

He cheated like a hundred games. Definitely deliberate.

[@ccie7489]

Yes, ‘mistake’ like when someone cheats on their partner. He meant making poor choices when he was 16. ‘Mistake’ doesn’t always mean something that is not deliberate.

[@wolfson109]

You're confusing "mistake" with "accident"

[@Sneaky-Sneaky]

@@wolfson109 In this case he meant…..an error in judgement ……

[@DontEatFibre]

Something about him feels very unhonest when he is defending himself.

[@Dracoool]

Time to force players to play in a Faraday Cage and do DEEP CAVITY SEARCHES.........

[@penguinista]

Faraday Cage for cheating prevention and cavity search for kicks.

[@alexm566]

Faraday cage is actually a good idea. We can use X-Ray instead of the cavity search.

[@EMC273]

They should play before it is broadcast.

[@bramvissers4985]

@@alexm566 We can, but do we really want to?

[@scottrackley4457]

nah, just a back scatter xray would have shown the beads

[@dche64]

August 2020. Hans is caught, feels ashamed and dedicates himself to "chess". July 2021 Hans says, "Raymond Reddington is my absolute hero...the way he runs his criminal organization, I would say, has inspired the way I think about chess."

[@THAC0MANIC]

yes coz you already repeat mistakes omfg that guy didnt learn from his past mistakes at all ever! there for we are going to blame him for eveything called Profiling bro and its illegol wouldnt stand in court. it be more insulting if i added race to this like Hes black, he commited a crime earlyer in his life there for he must be guilty of all furthur crimes that are even remotely pointed at his way! Like wow.

[@leonardofonseca1844]

The best evidence is that current performances represent a impossible growth. As if he had suddenly become a prodigy with years of training at age 18/19, which makes of course no sense.

[@krustyyy9284]

its not impossible, you just need to play a lot of games. Firouzja went from 2560 to 2700 in one year, even giri from 2525 to 2675 in a year. But im not comparing his level to them though, you just really need to play more games than anyone against weaker competition. In 2021 Hans played 250 games, whereas other GMs played 100 gaining 200+ points in just under 2 years. We can speculate whether he cheated all those otb games or not but no one really knows but my point is that its not really impossible.

[@Williamottelucas]

I hadn't heard about the toggling/non-toggling evidence previously.

[@mattmannina1935]

my biggest hurdle in chess is my bad connection in online games.. ive lost so many games from running out of time while waiting for the opponent to make his move >_

[@TheGushroom]

😂

[@technospyform1578]

"We got Jack Harlow at home" the Jack Harlow at home:

[@angelothompson186]

The dude looks like Dream.

[@technospyform1578]

@@angelothompson186 that's even worse when you consider...

[@angelothompson186]

@@technospyform1578 ik

[@Arvind_R]

The fact that the guy doesn't know how to castle (moves the rook first) or pronounce "FIDE" (the way chess players do) says a lot about Wall Street Journal's motive behind covering this.

[@tms174]

@@Thesamurai1999 ? Its not clear at all. You probably think that there only are monetary incentives. Which any capitalist Endeavour has every tight to. But why couldn’t it be committed to one of its self proclaimed ideals, sharing news?

[@artful1967]

it shows they are a news network citing facts not chess players. seems about right to me mr conspiracy loony

[@Arvind_R]

@@artful1967 Do you even know what conspiracy means?

[@mattrange5439]

It's just standard MSN reporting, none of their people know anything about something as old-fashioned as chess.

[@Arvind_R]

@Gabriel Jean-Batiste Na, it was a bit blasé. I'll leave it to your interpretation.

[@juannumbaone9142]

Magnus just sweeped Hans today 9/6/2024

[@waryinzero]

Illegal castling at the 2:18 mark. When castling, the king moves first to the left or right.

[@Lucas-pw8fi]

What I find interesting is why aren’t there any cyber security experts on this checking networks to see if there were any devices on the network

[@two_tier_gary_rumain]

Yep, it's all bunkum. They can't prove squat.

[@thetooginator153]

Maybe they did, and the device didn’t use the local network. It could be old-fashioned radio.

[@danielch6662]

@@thetooginator153 They already had radio scanners in that room checking while matches were on.

[@animefan7424]

@@danielch6662 they changed their security measures only after the incident

[@anonymouschicken952]

The report explicitly says they Chesscom found no evidence to suggest that Hans cheated against Magnus in the Sinquefield cup (or in any other over the board game), so that line toward the end of the video about how chess fans see the report as the smoking gun is a little misleading. Maybe some people do see it as evidence, but WSJ should really have made it clear that those people are wrong to see it that way, because this report is in no way evidence toward that conclusion.

[@ChoppyMemes_]

This is what I don’t like about this video. They left out that part of the Analysis. If Hans didn’t cheat against magnus, he may just be a genius.

[@1994mrmysteryman]

Maybe you should use a bit of common sense. In a court of law, past misdeeds of the same nature are taken as evidence even for a completely fresh case as well. Take for example. A person is caught robbing a 100+ houses. Proven. Without a doubt. 1 year later he is found in suspicious circumstances outside another robbed house. He has no alibi. His explanation makes zero sense. You don't need to specifically prove with physical evidence that he had a hand in that particular robbery. There's plenty of circumstantial evidence and a damning history of similar crimes. You just need to use your brain. This is one of the reason every top GM definitely consider him a cheater and so do most actual chess fans. Not ones that came from watching the Queen's gambit obviously.

[@skidawg22]

2:16 When castling, you always move the king first, then the rook. Moving the rook first is a legal move for the rook.

[@goat6262]

Cry louder

[@TomNook.]

Chess has never been this exciting

[@mastersinr]

so the "best" known method 2:10 is getting a hall pass?

[@mmathems395]

From this content I learnt that the analysis leading to accusations shows a strong connection with the patterns in which a computer plays, indicating that a computer is informing the player. It makes more sense, and the key is how that's done, and the extra participants explanation covers this. Thank you for this content 😊

[@rorykeegan1895]

Nieman has blown his credibility. Its about time cheating was jumped on harshly.

[@danielch6662]

This is exactly like what happens, when lazy cops "investigates" crimes, by simply blaming it on any convenient ex-con they know. This is why the country is going down to the s*******.

[@rejectmodernity1037]

Niemann keeps winning 🥱🥱 and crushing tournament while you haters keep crying. Keep coping

[@derekwang7330]

@@rejectmodernity1037 You think cheating in cash tournaments is acceptable?

[@prateeksarin3555]

Also if u see the way he analysed the game it means he memorises it and uses that which is how he plays

[@case6189]

Pretty bad report by WSJ obviously didn’t do much research on this. Missed a lot of key details implicating Niemann even more.

[@sy6550]

Just came here to vent. Been playing and time after time I get matched with cheats. Ohhh he only cheated online. It is horrible and aggravating when you face these idiots. Once a cheat always a cheat. Kudos to Magnus. He should be banned for life. Thank you Magnus for standing up to these vile people.

[@blacklisted4885]

Magnus knows when he is playing a computer.

[@danielch6662]

Twenty years ago, Garry said he knew he was NOT playing a computer. He was so damned sure ...

[@LeventButSpeedrunning]

@@danielch6662 tell me you don't know anything about chess without telling me you don't know anything about chess

[@bramvissers4985]

@@danielch6662 The difference is that GMs nowaday use computers to analyse games. GMs can spot computermoves from miles away.

[@NewWorldRubio]

How are these players allowed to have their phones on them during tournaments involving prize money? And leave to use bathroom breaks with them on? Y'all need better security, straight up

[@animefan7424]

If you keep your phone on you at a tournament it is meant to be turned off or kept silent, if you keep it in the locker room or an area where a staff member can look/watch over the phone then the phone doesn’t need to be turned off or turned to be on silent mode, also chess prize money isn’t a lot

[@mikethespike7579]

They should invite the guys to these tournaments who are in charge of security in casinos. They have more than enough experience with cheaters, can spot them already through their behaviour and can immediately tell if someone is lying.

[@lukehawkinson9738]

Dumb take

[@aventura8491]

@@lukehawkinson9738 Great argument!

[@Skynertia]

Years later Hans is still competing at the top level.

[@NSAKEY]

Magnus did not accuse Hans of cheating. He suspected him of cheating. There is a difference. Do better, WSJ.

[@jamesreed422]

Yeah, Magnus didn’t accuse Hans of cheating the same way your little brother is not touching you

[@grumpytroll6918]

Magnus fanbois retreating lol

[@derekwang7330]

@@grumpytroll6918 True or False: Niemann cheated in multiple online cash tournaments

[@MY-hc5fb]

He couldn’t accuse him directly because that would get him sued.

[@Yiran]

This escalated quickly. Let them beads for itself.

[@aportilla007]

If Hans trains with a computer, he will play like a computer. However, the window switching is an absolute tell.

[@ViktorShahter]

You can't play like a computer because computer doing bug amount of calculations while analyzing position. No one in the world is capable to count like that. There's some moves that every chess player will call "strange" but engine will tell you that this was the best move because it calculated everything. It can somewhat see the future no matter what opponent will play. Niemann played a shitton of this engine moves btw. And no, doesn't matter how much you'll be playing against computer, you NEVER gonna learn how to play like it because you won't be able to understand moves that it doing.

[@lc9991x]

All grandmasters train with engines. The issue is that almost every chess game will eventually find a unique position. There are virtually infinite possible chess positions, memorizing a so-called “computer line” or two is not enough to play like an engine

[@br2485]

Not true

[@ps9501]

You cannot play like computer

[@TheGreenTaco999]

@@lc9991x who called it a computer line?

[@cheesycarrotsoup]

anything online should be questioned but in person games are something different

[@johnostensen]

How can you easily beat the world champion in chess in one game, and then suddenly lose the rest of your games. Playing like a chess God in many tournaments in a row, and then play just average. Either you have beginning dementia or you are getting help somehow. You dont suddenly forget how to play chess or how to calculate / evaluate a position once you reach a certain level.

[@mage1413]

thats not how chess works. There are statistics involved. If he plays more matches he would overall lose most of them.

[@ShomilSaxena]

Thats not how it works this isn't soke power levels anime

[@manuelmed98]

1. that's not how chess works, for the third time 2. after beating Magnus, the whole chess world went into a huge debate and he was in the center of it all, receiving criticism from most, much more stressed that his opponents and he still was able to play high level chess. Losing is understandable 3. he lost the rest of his MATCHES. He won several games.

[@Marco..1]

Magnus lost because he thought he may plays an engine. Not because Hans did that well in this game. It was an okay game, but getting into the two result position was something an amateur could do with the difficulty of the moves. Evaluation you do not forget, calculating you may not do in analysis, because there is no need to think.

[@reviewyup592]

His performance is way too inconsistent. He couldn't provide analysis of his brilliant moves. Sounds like a fake GM to me.

[@marie-anne2062]

I think hans will be more invited because people would want to see him play, out of curiosity or want to determine themselves if he's cheating or not. To be honest he has gathered quite a fan base.

[@sux2beme]

Unless the tournament also wants to invite Carlsen

[@danielch6662]

@@sux2beme I kind of drifted off away over the years, but this thing has really rekindled my interest. Personally, as a spectator, I'd rather much see Niemann right now. For a participant, Carlsen's presence might increase the ranking points. But then he'd beat you.

[@groot843]

Things may turn up in the US, the way you claim but for the rest part of the world ( definitely for the Asian tournaments) he is done for. He has disgraced the game.

[@1994mrmysteryman]

@@danielch6662 Depends on if you're a chess fan or a drama fan.

[@niranjanrajesh1058]

@@danielch6662 as someone else said, all chess fans want magnus,all drama fans want hans. The tournaments that hans is currently playing in or just played in barely received any media coverage,coz hype and controversy only excite people for a while.

[@Stellar77x]

Magnus knew it right away when Hans was casually making moves in places where it takes a lot of logical effort to think through. And the dude carries himself as a dishonest looking person as well.

[@tengu8560]

Yet no proof and Hans is being a winner in the last tournament against super gms,what a shame

[@MrSupernova111]

@@tengu8560 . I trust Magnus over clueless youtube comments.

[@abdulrahmanhaffar3502]

​@@tengu8560 no proof, but many things that makes you believe that he maybe cheated

[@eliashoussney995]

I like how this compiled a lot of it so we don’t hVe to hear it through some biased gm but I wish there was more as there is a lot more to cover

[@iii898iii]

Lol

[@penguinista]

There is a lot of information about his public games and their percentage correlation with stockfish that looks pretty damning. I wish they had covered that, his self-contradictions in the interview, his coach's history of cheating at TT, etc.

[@joebidet3606]

I feel like it’s actually problematic to not have this video directed by a grandmaster. I’m not defending GM Niemann, but it seems that because this video seems to be produced by someone outside of the chess world, plenty of important information was left out. Many other super GMs have condemned Magnus’s behavior, and this video did not discuss the evidence Magnus based his claim on (perhaps because there isn’t any). Overall, I’d say this video unfairly portrays the situation for Hans. I prefer my drama from people who are more in tune, like GM Fabiano Caruana and GM Ben Finegold.

[@complainer406]

​@@joebidet3606 Is this the first time you're witnessing journalism on a subject you're familiar with? It's always like this

[@joebidet3606]

@@complainer406 Nah, usually when I watch the news regarding domestic and international politics, its pretty rare to find "reporting" that is as biased and shallow than what this video was. Then again, I bet WSJ just appointed this random guy to cover the story, rather than investing time and energy to contact/reference any other top-level GM that would have something to say.

[@J3susChrist]

man's just called FIDE, fai-dee LOL

[@TheNoerdy]

I love stuff like this. Nerds vs nerds. All fun and games until the nerds get serious enough to develop entire algorithms to I'd it.

[@rahulvig5298]

I mean, if the best chess player in history finds something to be fishy then there definitely is something fishy. Also, if Hans is actually that smart, why isn't he able to explain his lines in the analysis of the game later on?

[@HannahRady]

The missed opportunity to upend the chess board in the opening shot has me pausing

[@domiy13]

It's a bit ironic for Magnus to point to someone else and say "they're playing too good, they must be cheating!" He's the greatest chess player of all time operating on a level of understanding far beyond most other grandmasters. His own games somtimes are remarkably impressive. Somebody just as easily claim that maybe he's cheating too.

[@GH-oi2jf]

Carlson is so good that it was predicted that he would become world champion.

[@LyubomirIko]

Those empty allegations did nothing good for chess. Even if Hans were cheating online, there is no way he cheated overboard.

[@ashleigh3021]

There’s a reason they don’t claim it.

[@gravityshark580]

just from observations on competitive games, the common occurrences of cheating (where it us kinda readily available) are people who are newer who immediately resorted to it, and people who are already one of the best thinking they deserve the highest ranks and they cheat to achieve that

[@john_mckinney]

When you lose, make accusations of cheating

[@Einomar]

Accept Magnus haven't done that before.

[@john_mckinney]

@@Einomar So?

[@BrotherBernard-yy4yd]

@@Einomarthere is always a first time If you are accusing someone you better have proof

[@abdulrahmanhaffar3502]

magnus loses a lot, he is not very untouchable like Kasparov for example,he never complained before

[@mitdesai55555]

Be Sooo Good They Can't Ignore You.... 🙏 Dedicated To Hans Niemann 🙏

[@corriepitt7630]

Another reason to bring back the brilliant ABBA/Tim Rice musical, “Chess”.

[@thissignupisretarded]

Right now we're Italian we used to be German the borders keep shifting around.

[@corriepitt7630]

Swap out the Hungarian horror for the Ukrainian horror.

[@corriepitt7630]

@@thissignupisretarded who do these foreign chappies think they are?😏

[@middleofnowhereradio]

Niemann looks like one of those cartoon bad guys LOL. I'm waiting for this to turn into an Adam Sandler movie.

[@alanchi8853]

The guy is a gm and only needs help on one or two moves a game. Very difficult to catch cheating.

[@danielch6662]

15 minute delay on the stream, no phones or any devices in the room. Any spectator who wants to leave while the game is ongoing, has to stay 15 minutes in the lobby, still without their phones and devices. Toilet break? Two or three match officials accompany you inside. Use the urinals where they can watch you. If you want to use the sit down toilet, a camera on a shelf INSIDE, built so that it doesn't see anything below waist level. The video is shown right outside, where your minder can watch and make sure. You keep your hands up visible to the camera when you're in there. Modify the clocks to record WHEN the buttons were pushed. This is then reconciled with the record of moves made, and then included in an extended PGN file format that records not just the moves made, but when. This way, the whole world knows if somebody is thinking for 20 minutes to many one move. We then have more data, and can be more confident about whether people are or are not cheat OTB. With more info, if there is still suspicion, the 15 minutes can be increased to 30 minutes.

[@MrSupernova111]

@@danielch6662 Good stuff!

[@pianoverse1366]

@@danielch6662 good points,maybe they will know soon about how to improve the security and solve cheating problems

[@uditasingh6240]

Came after Hans defeated Magnus fair and square. It's so sad people are so ready to label him cheater WITHOUT any proof just to prove their favorite person right.

[@ToddAndelin]

Hans alleged cheating has awakened the world to chess.

[@jayfanelli3659]

Being a proven cheater, the burden of proof now lies on Niemann, for all those asking for explicit evidence. The need for explicit evidence exists only for Niemann to prove he is not cheating, and any refusal to engage with this known cheater is legitimate. Why would Magnus risk humiliation at the hands of an individual known to be lacking in integrity, and known to be willing to subvert the rules? Full body imaging immediately prior to the game with monitored bathroom breaks would be one way to do it. But then you ask yourself, why are we going through all this trouble to include a cheater?

[@chessdad182]

I saw a player on lichess who has a 1800 rating. Their OTB rating from a tournament only a month ago is 932. There is no such thing as online cheating!

[@AdmiralEclipse]

Lichess also heavily inflates ratings, so its possible that they weren't cheating but who knows

[@Zeref_ft_rylles]

I'm gonna reply based of what I understand from it comment It's not if the person had played in tournaments, otb or rated online games, but if the person used an engine during the tourney Since Hans had reports of games where he played near perfect when no one in the world possibly can do, adding the fact during interviews he couldn't answer the moves properly, and doesn't really know the idea, most likely he is cheating

[@abdulrahmanhaffar3502]

online cheating happens a lot

[@nickwylds7116]

Have Hans play inside a Faraday Cage

[@unknown-unknown69]

He said he's down to play in

[@0rg164]

so basically that one dude is so good at chess he can tell when someone is cheating within two moves

[@omicron7735]

Yes , he can

[@visaeryon]

Hans looks like that villain kid from megamind.

[@jaydenrock]

So this dude is claimed a cheater with no physical evidence and just speculation? Kinda ridiculous if you ask me. I get their assumptions but isn't this opening a can of worms with future losers? Seems like this is being handled by some gatekeeper types. Also, this is lawsuit territory with out hard evidence.

[@DougieFrank]

He has admitted cheating before, & been caught before, which shows his character, or lack of, & disregard & disrepsect for the rules. Cheats never cheat just once, or twice - they cheat whenever they feel they can get away with it. Once a cheat, always a cheat. Prize money is a great incentive for him to cheat, & there is substantial evidence against him.

[@jaydenrock]

@@DougieFrank the only cheating I saw was some online games when he was a teenager. As we all know with Call of Duty teenagers love to use mods and cheat. It’s nothing out of the ordinary for a immature teenager. Now, if you know of any professional tournaments he was proven to be cheating, besides his own admission, I’d like to know?

[@DougieFrank]

​@@jaydenrock -LOL. 🤣🤣🤣- -Did you even watch this clip or read my comment...?- The whole point of this video & my comment is based on the fact he has never BEEN caught cheating at a professional tournament, but he has the means, the motive & the lack of integrity to carry out such an act. There is also substantial evidence against him to back up the allegations. -I really dont know why would you think I might know of a professional game where he has been caught, or why you would even ask me, when it is perfectly clear he has never been caught-

[@jaydenrock]

@@DougieFrank my comment wasn’t ment to argue with you. I was just asking you a question. Literally all I was doing asking if he had. I am curious if he has ever been in trouble before. I know zero about the chess world besides playing the game. I was just going by a couple videos I’ve seen. So this is someone from the outside looking in. So I could be wrong. So correct me if I am wrong. He hasn’t been punished and/or caught previous to these recent games?

[@eric4758]

Something not mentioned here is that Niemann lost all of his matches in the chess tournament in which Carlsen withdrew from

[@mikeyoung9810]

It's a cheating world and to many winning is all that matters, no matter how they do it. Carlsen's words have weight and I'll take him at his word over someone who has cheated before and is rated to be doing so to win games.

[@strategystuff5080]

The fact that he couldn't explain his thinking, in a post game interview, is insanity. He cheated in the past. He has 0 benefit of the doubt, that is only for people with a clean record. He should prove, that he isn't cheating by being able to explain his game plan. Also other GM's should be able to black ball known cheaters, sucks to suck baby. playing chess for money is not a right. its a privilege. cheating destroys the branding of chess.

[@mikeunleashed1]

0:33 The motive behind this video summarised, carlsen doesnt explicitly state that hanz is cheating, in fact he is and has been very indirect to avoid law suits. I wouldn't be surprised if this is a hit piece considering the money behind hanz, he comes from a very rich family.

[@two_tier_gary_rumain]

Magnus is a sore loser.

[@aventura8491]

The Rothschilds?

[@burntsider8457]

Misleading headline. No explanation is offered in the video.

[@bobvilla4383]

WSJ speaks for itself.

[@TheGushroom]

😆

[@jasondeanhallquist8382]

I remember watching Kasparov vs deep blue. Kasparov accused IBM of cheating when he lost.

[@cubitsinformatica7544]

It could be. Kasparov said that deep blue was playing with GM's help. Wich at that time, engines were still not strong as super GM's lvl.

[@jasondeanhallquist8382]

@@cubitsinformatica7544 yeah I remember that. He probably still believes that they cheated and they might have. He asked for some kind of move analysis printouts and they said they lost them just to mess with his head.

[@adhi_r]

Thanks Magnus! Hans is the first one to fall there are tons of cheaters I hope they are get caught soon.

[@shadowfurydono]

No idea how Hans fell, he's still playing tournaments.

[@heeronheeron1348]

How about the "pipi in pampers" issue

[@LeventButSpeedrunning]

Tell me you don't know anything about chess without telling me you don't know anything about chess

[@adhi_r]

@@heeronheeron1348 lol

[@adhi_r]

@@LeventButSpeedrunning another American Magnus hater I guess?

[@LEGENDARYPISO]

A cheater is also a very good liar

[@3mKay]

the report speaks for itself /s

[@MrDots99]

0:45 is the year wrong ?

[@CastleArchon]

They never prove it though. Who else is cheating over the board then? Magnus just eliminated a threat by implication, but not by playing chess.

[@imtheonehero9305]

They can prove it thru play style? His in person playing style should be completely different from online.

[@RecaneYala]

Loved the video.

[@LetterSignedBy51SpiesWasA-Coup]

If this dude is not lying, he really needs to learn to be honest in a more believable fashion.

[@KhaalixD]

he plays chess 15h a day, social skills arent really his thing. Kid is 19 and is ranked nr 50 worldwide

[@highvoltage47]

Yeah he sounds like someone trying way too hard to seem like he's not lying

[@nihilistPenguinz]

"Beads vibrates for itself."

[@sharonjuniorchess]

It quite clearly states that "I don't want to play against people that have repeatedly cheated in the past". That is a statement of fact; not an accusation as the WSJ states. This is inaccurate journalism...yet again from the WSJ.

[@gonogazz]

Niemann says it himself.. Make Magnus feel embarrassed..

[@davidc5191]

The easy way to block transmissions from an accomplice to a player in over-the-board play is to enclose the playing area in a Faraday Cage, which is simply a wire mesh that blocks all electromagnetic transmissions, depending on the size of the gaps in the mesh and the wavelengths of the transmission.

[@two_tier_gary_rumain]

You can also scan for EM radiation in specific bands and just block them by drowning them out with stronger radiation in the same bands.

[@davidc5191]

@@two_tier_gary_rumain Which doesn't seem to be done in the tournament Niemann is currently playing in, the U.S. Championship. They're just doing metal detector scans upon entering the playing area, not EM scans during play as you suggest.

[@huntersmith8733]

@@davidc5191 but they are using a delay

[@andreicmello]

Castling is a King move, not a Rook move.

[@Felix9lives]

There is so much "buzz" in the chess world🤪

[@hoola_amigos]

I see what u did there

[@ocping]

This would "prompt" so many people to start playing chess

[@erikvinnes]

Didnt FIDE release a report concluding Niemann cheated in at least 29 games? This says all imo. I never had the impression Magnus Carlsen complains, he just seems to display intregity for the game..