The Day Hololive Almost Died

It truly was a tough time.
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[@MarioMasterProductions]

It's funny how Capcom took down all those videos and then later be like, "We're going to sponsor you.".

[@demonsofrazg]

What if this was their plan all along!!

[@hazamax2139]

That's just how money works. PR wise they were OK with it but letting an organization profit from their product like that conveys the message of "everyone can do it." And if everyone can do it, you cannot complain in court. This applies to indies too but suing an individual and suing internationally is a whole can of worms that companies just do not want to open, it's just not worth it.

[@orange._.persik4006]

They didn't take out all videos they took out 2, and it was technically reasonable from their perspective. (I know there's 0 reason to stop people from seeing your game but Japanese companies are auper dumb and think in 20th century logic.) Later cover actually asked them officially the permit to play the games and they were happy to oblige to a super popular company compared to a little one it was in 2019-2020

[@shade0180]

@@orange._.persik4006 then mio fan won a capcom cup.

[@TheInnocentRabbitofCaerbannog]

Too bad japan has cancer fair use/copyright laws

[@AFO666]

tinfoil hat moment: when capcom and hololive struck a deal, mio was specified as being someone who capcom HAD to collab with as part of the agreement to kickstart mio again and as a show of good faith.

[@Fate862]

I did enjoy that. Its like "their is no ill will, just ask us for permission next time" kinda thing. It did help out cover alot. More than half if not mostly all the videos that the hololive girls had on their channels didn't have perms so this helped them understand that having perms in a country where perms are important as there is no fair use law to protect them its better to just ask and get them the right way. Now its an always used system so there is no legal issues or strikes unless an error is made somehow. But you are correct, collabing with Mio was a show of good faith and also getting Mio's name more out there for capcom fans and gamers, while also getting abit of capcom publicity to Hololive fans. Like what Korone does with Sega and her collabs with them and sonic or even her and capcom too lol.

[@Corrodias]

That would just be cruel, forcing her to play nice with the company that just tried to axe her channel.

[@YoRHaDemon]

You know this is ancient because /vt/ wasn't even created and /jp/ was used for the VTuber discussion in 4chan.

[@kris8569]

Oh man I checked out /vt/ recently and really saw the dark spot in the Vtuber fanbase. So glad I stopped going on 4chan, what fucking freaks man

[@kris8569]

Imagine still going on 4chan 😂. I checked out the /vt/ board after not going on that site for yeaaars, and the shit I saw there disgusted me lol. It’s definitely a stain on the Vtuber community lol. I hope no Vtubers go on that board and see the gross shit people post and say about them lol. The Biboo thread I saw was just…. ew. Nothing but schizo posting and borderline CP

[@kris8569]

Imagine still going on 4chan. I recently checked out the /vt/ board and saw a Biboo thread. That entire thread was just… ew. Pretty much everyone was just talking about her “kiddie holes” 🤮. I hope vtubers never go on that board and see the gross shit y’all post about them lol

[@carso1500]

@bobokaba123 i mean /jp/ is older than vtubing itself by a good margin so in a discusion about vtubers its imposible to go before /jp/ even existed also man i remember the funding of /vt/ i was there when the touhous were getting exterminated in mass by the hololive wave, when the entire board became the fastest board on the entire site for a couple of weeks, and finally when /vt/ was born (still the fastest board on the site every time hololive does anything)

[@suhnih4076]

It really sucks how we live in a timeline where people need permission to stream music

[@UnownDepth]

Music companies are assholes like that

[@lizlizbianrosethornsword]

​@@UnownDepthThe worst part? They abused tf out of KZbin's ©️ system. Which is horse crap.

[@TheShiningEnergy]

some are better than others.@@UnownDepth

[@cucumbermainline]

It's an uphill battle to force any changes in the world's old and broken copyright laws. A lot of businesses are benefitting from them.

[@lionelk.y7233]

​@@cucumbermainline Not only that But the biggest fear of changing the rules It makes it worse and the end result would become more predatory

[@yincka]

Not to be that guy, but i appreciate the new vtuber archivists out there that probably have all their oshi's video's saved to their own personal computers and the like.

[@sakiamira]

You'll never know when your OSHI will graduate so now we need to archive their sh-+ before it's too late

[@illiiilli24601]

Same

[@OnePlayer480]

A few people were being called crazy by archiving Mel years or months before February 2024. Suddenly they were actually seen as prophets.

[@rooislangwtf]

Mel was too p̶o̶n̶ pure for this world 😭

[@justlooking070]

​@@OnePlayer480 tbf cover also gave them a month to archive shit

[@kirbyx2573]

Permissions are one hell of a thing. Mad what could have been if stuff went just a little different.

[@lizlizbianrosethornsword]

The following events and factors Hololive was saved. Having a awesome CEO like Yagoo. Cover Corp interacting with their fans and embracing the cringe. Taking most feedback seriously. Their quality in everything is mwah. And unlike Nijisanji they know when to to be stubborn and when to fold. After all when they got tf out of China and Fubuki also sacrificed her CN fanbase for her Holo Mems? You know things got real. Many events really saved Hololive. Covid really helped them to more than harm really when everybody was stuck at home.

[@miletilblight2181]

The 6 Chinese hologirls basically dropping off the face of the earth hurts still tbh Only 2 I really say anything of were the two that spoke fluent English Aria and cylvia I think we're there names? It's been so long but they had potentially One was super competitive and was in legit tournaments and the other was starting to build a KZbin channel to get a western audience...probably hoping to survive the incoming storm tbh

[@Chinito116]

I'd rather not have those wolf warriors within Hololive. Artia was one of the leading forces among the Antis.

[@reachlol1]

Only 2 of the CN girls were not involved with the drama. As they were actually from Taiwan. Yogiri and Spade Echo I believe? Which were also bullied by the rest of the CN talents and management due to being Taiwanese. Artia being the main instigator for a lot of it.

[@FrarmerFrank]

Well, they closed Hololive China cause turned out some of them and their fans were among the Harrasment campaign against Coco Of course Coco being closer to a A-Chan is one of the reasons Hololive circled the Wagons around Coco Hololive EN was pitched by CoCo with her ending up an Orbiter of the EN Branch as still CoCo thus Omega? Model going unused

[@shinodamasaru7945]

plus, Cover corp supports clippers and indie fangames. with policy.

[@Duplucky5]

I heard about this Holo purge. I knew more or less what happened, but seeing the ratio of saved videos/deleted videos is really scary. What a horror to imagine now that Hololive could have disappeared at that time and that we would never have discovered all these adorable comedians.

[@culade]

Unfortunately Hololive still can't get perms from Sony to play any 1st party games. I remember Biboo was really excited to Bloodborne for the first time, had a thumbnail up and everything; but Sony once again said no. She was so sad over that.

[@neverheard446]

sony have own vtuber and one of share holder of anycolor

[@mmyr8ado.360]

Sony deserves what's coming for them then.

[@Vondular]

​@@mmyr8ado.360by recent news of Helldivers 2?

[@DinnerForkTongue]

Because Sony is bone and tendon with Nijisanji.

[@Vondular]

​@@neverheard446oh yes Shareholder, the highest Caste in bussiness entertainment

[@SWIFTO_SCYTHE]

The GREEN was what stayed... THE GREY WAS LOST Holy crap

[@crumpets8266]

Yeah I was looking at the percentages thinking 10 percent ain't so bad but how come so many of AZki vods were taken down? She hardly streamed gaming content at that time.After DN said the green was what remained it made much more sense

[@ed_cmntonly]

AZKi, Moona, Iofi, and Risu being the only real survivors of the Holopurge looking at over the endless amounts of lifeless Holo member bodies as Capcom laughs in the distance like a supervillain who just achieved their goals:

[@randomised3818]

that 4% for ayame is crazy

[@Khantlerpartesar]

New fans nowadays have zero idea what kind of hell Hololive Production went through in 2020. It's an absolute nightmare of a year. They indeed got a super boosted popularity but at the same time the largest known controversy - that's why some folks referred to this era of Hololive as the "Silver/Grey Age". Nijisanji, for better or for worse, the negative stuff happening are only affecting the EN side of things - meanwhile their JP side is still thriving strong, despite what others says. Meanwhile, Hololive in 2020, they not only fought a branch (CN) who has one or two talents in open rebellion from their real accounts, they also went directly to court and you can see Coco and Haato's vtuber images plastered on a paper regarding about them saying "Taiwan". They managed to survived from a government who not only hates them (historically speaking) and still came out victorious and even more thriving in the international waters.

[@darkshaman98]

2020 was the golden age, It's when myth debuted and they skyrocketed to the most popular vtuber company, sure there was the whole CN thing but ultimately Coco would have left anyway

[@forcexjr1566]

As a Singaporean Chinese, it’s also the defining moment that made me dislike irrational mainland Chinese. I was quite chill with them, but when the drama kicked off I was like, nah, I’m going to oppose them for the rest of my life.

[@OnePlayer480]

@@forcexjr1566Honestly they got some cool stuff but they can be so stiff that it actually borders on parody. If anything, we understand, there's a lot of reasons why things came to be like that. It's not just something that just happens because, but there's a real historical precedent which explains why it happens, and why it will continue to happen.

[@LordKoKuyou]

@@OnePlayer480 No it has nothing to do with history. It's just the CCP being greedy like any other communist/socialist government wanting full control of things. They will never accept Taiwan independence and will fight back hard to prevent the rest of the world to acknowledge and spread this notion. This has nothing to do with China hating Japan.

[@wat_aiwan]

I remember some of Hololive ID fans on Twitter are also anti ID current government meanwhile current ID government are notorious for having close relation with Mainland China government so those HoloID who also ID government haters are now hate the Mainland China government more than ever. Based HoloID fans, fuck CCP and fuck the corrupt Indonesian goverment

[@buak326]

I remember this happened. Us Towa fans got many videos saved. I had to save my video of me playing with her. I still have it

[@chins4tw]

Hololive had grown too large to not ask for perms. It was a necessary step to grow further.

[@Vergil.bin.Sparda]

they still ask for perms even now

[@anhkduc7930]

They still ask for perms. They just don't need their talents themself having to do that tedious work. Also they only need to asked for the permission once and it applied to the entire company

[@rawrmonster6782]

bruh these people don't know how to read XD

[@SnakeSagacity]

Too large to NOT ask permission guys. Meaning the company has gotten so big that they now HAVE TO ask permission to things that previously got a pass.​@@Vergil.bin.Sparda

[@leandroiuki4337]

But copystrike a video after 2 years being public is still pointless.

[@YarugumaSou]

7:42 That aged like milk.

[@Alberto_Lince_Gan]

In the sun

[@krisostomoyabarrera2255]

I dont get it. What happened?

[@OnePlayer480]

​@@krisostomoyabarrera2255Nijisanji revelations.

[@adamlopez2275]

Following Mio at the time was really rough. And then there was the Mio “Rolling Girl” fan animation that came out while she was on break… that nearly broke me at the time. It’s a really shame I can’t find any archive of that animation

[@leandroiuki4337]

That time not just Capcom was abusing the copyright strikes, but many companies around the world. People was blaming Cover for being incompetent, but Capcom only gave permission after 3 months. Nintendo was faster, they gave the permissions 1 month after asking.

[@SWIFTO_SCYTHE]

The loss of entire VODS like Subaru's early streams is sad.

[@vincenttorrijos9680]

Especially since Subaru when she was just staring out was kind of a mess (I think she's the only Holo girl who was an actual nobody prior to Holo.)

[@jeremiahtorrevillas4396]

All of it? Wtf

[@Mutualititve]

​@@vincenttorrijos9680If I remember correctly, wasn't Haachama also a nobody, she was still in highschool when she started? The same can be said for Sora, but she's an exception.

[@vincenttorrijos9680]

@@Mutualititve hachaama was in high school yes but I don't know if she was a nobody, she could have just been young. Sora on the other hand, by definition, was a nobody but her role as basically the progenitor does make her an exception

[@astuteanansi4935]

@@vincenttorrijos9680 Subaru is actually such an inspirational story. If I recall correctly, her family's *house burned down* some time before her audition. They were in dire financial straits and Subaru tried out for hololive out of desperation. She was not a content creator, a singer, an idol, she was not even a gamer or an otaku to any particular extent. *And* she somehow misread the CEO's name as YAGOO. There's never been a job interview where the odds were so heavily stacked against the interviewee. And yet the recruitment team saw something special in her, and now she's among the elite vtubers of the world. And Motoaki Tanigo is forever immortalized as YAGOO. There's something special about hololive that makes it more than just a corpo. It's a place where *miracles* can happen. Subaru? The hiring of Suisei *as* Suisei, letting her keep her indie identity? Miko going from failure and despair to international stardom by saying the word that usually *ruins* careers? The smashing success of holoEN against all odds despite everyone predicting it would flop horribly, and the meteoric rise of Gura to become *the* #1 vtuber in the world? The salvation of a rejected pair of twins? Hell, going from the original "13 Knights" to millions of fans worldwide is a miracle in and of its own. Dreams can come true in hololive. I know it's probably unrealistic, but I hope they never lose that spark of magic

[@darkshaman98]

It's crazy people bitch about hololive being strict with permissions as well

[@grafzeppelin4069]

This is one of the reasons WHY Hololive is so strict with perms.

[@星影-o4z]

I am Japanese. I experienced this too, and the worst part was that Nijisanji fans continued to attack Hololive, even though Nijisanji was also violating copyrights. The attacks and oppression on the message boards continued for over a year. I was watching both Nijisanji and Hololive at the time, but it was so bad that I stopped watching Nijisanji after this incident.

[@carrot708]

And then Niji fans did something even worse a month or two later, sending shit to Mano Aloe's home address and threatening her family

[@tinlight4032]

Yes, to this day I always block every video about Nijisanji because of their toxicity (especially their fans) and also Chinese vtubers too.

[@jamesche7496]

And now Niji is taking the hit when Holo is chill right now, man how life could turn

[@jehmarxx2]

I dream of an alternate universe where there is an online video platform with no care about copyright. Wait, that was KZbin years ago.

[@MICHAELTUMANGDAY]

I remember this where you need permission to stream games/music. Fast Forward today.. Capcom is repeating the same thing but through the "Mods" eradication BS. Also there are rumors Nijisanji Shareholders were bribing capcom at the time to takedown the Holomems' capcom related content as means of taking out the competition. Also there's another one where The niji shareholders were the ones preventing Hololive from getting perms from Konami to stream all games and that includes Yugioh. Come to think.. It might be true as the game doesn't need permission to be streamed. While Niji and Indies can stream Yugioh games freely without drawbacks, while Holo can't even touch the game.

[@puhanlemontian6026]

in niji's early days, sony was a big shareholder, helped niji to build good connections with other companies, the reason why they can stream all these games is because they signed many comprehensive deals with all major Japanese game companies, they got the highest streaming clearance, like no time limit for pokemon game.

[@kuronoch.1441]

​@@puhanlemontian6026 Also, remember that people called the Anycolor CEO a trust fund baby? Turns out, his uber-rich family was involved in making corporations favor Nijisanji more and Hololive less. It was rumored that one of the shareholders, Itochu, was heavily involved in this endeavor.

[@DeltaAlternative-bk7nj]

The Yu-Gi-Oh! thing is because Hololive closely allied with Bushiroad. Bushiroad is huge TCG distributor which handles Shadowverse, Weiss Schwarz and Cardfight Vanguard. Hololive can’t play much YGO because it is seen as betraying ally and promoting rival’s products.

[@LilyKazami]

​@DeltaAlternative-bk7nj if that was true holo would also be restricted from other card games like Pokémon, and they have been opening those packs forever. The simplest explanation is that Konami is still butt hurt about the stuff with their board game. No conspiracy needed, on either side.

[@kuronoch.1441]

@@LilyKazami Well with the recent Calli collab, Konami perms are now granted at the regular. Before, they were closely knit with Nijisanji due to them sharing a building. I guess the Pomu situation (where she got unceremoniously hindered from doing a collab, reason why Calli got the job) really did make Konami turn against Nijisanji.

[@21Raph___A]

I can never imagine Hololive dying. Though, I was not in the VTubing community during the Hololive vs China drama But I can imagine Kurosanji dying. Sink the yatch

[@signumxmagnum]

The China drama is weird, because it seems to be targeting Coco which were a popular streamer in those days. I'm not surprised if there's some shady hand behind those drama to eliminate competition in China.

[@lizlizbianrosethornsword]

​@@signumxmagnumThe best part? Cover and Coco aka Kson is still on good terms. Evidence has shown via actions and it shows they have a bond together despite the drama.

[@danielhakim9485]

​@@signumxmagnumThe thing is, Chinese' deep hatred towards Hololive (and Japanese media) was already rooted for a long time ago and the Taiwan incident happened to be the trigger to spark a bigger flame. The tragedy actually started from Hachama reading google analytical statistics on her worldwide viewership and mentioned Taiwan as a major part of it. The mainland Chinese fans were offended when Taiwan was mentioned and bombarded her account. Coco, knew about the issue and decided to do the same but highlight the Taiwan part louder which deviated the antis' attention towards her instead (kinda like tanking). And the rest is history.

[@MICHAELTUMANGDAY]

@@signumxmagnum Coco was also hated by the Chinese even back when she was still Kson, before becoming Coco. Heck even she returned to the Kson Persona, her haters are still around.

[@The73MPL4R]

​@@danielhakim9485Not to mention the huge plot twist where one of the HoloCN members was revealed to be one of the ringleaders of the harassment campaign

[@vanguardRailgun924]

Now I’m just imagining a timeline where Hololive died early because of this and Kurosanji was the top Vtubing Agency………. The Darkest Timeline

[@kuronoch.1441]

Well Nijisisters were always trying to do that.

[@wat_aiwan]

Normalized woke culture and Chinese supremacy rule, that's what you got in that timeline. Glad that never existed

[@TekLura]

i never understood why some companies have so harsh rules when it come to games, but now i understand, i didn't knew about this whole situation! great video btw!

[@lucia_candela]

Also, this purge was making FBK meme shorts vanished, including the legendary Scatman.

[@maxis2k]

I sense all these companies woke up once they saw how some very minor games would blow up once they appeared on a Pekora or Korone stream. SquareEnix and Capcom weren't letting their big AAA titles be played on Holo streams. But then some unknown game like Getting Over It or a retro game like Ganbare Goemon would show up on the stream and suddenly explode in popularity. And suddenly these companies were all for their latest game being streamed... Even making collab deals with Sonic and Dragon Quest.

[@TheRealVordox]

The Pien era. Or Chilla

[@ps4pro668]

I’d personally call it the Holo-Purge. Less problematic when discussing about the purge of many streams and nearly the talents themselves. Fun fact: That Miko clip was one that I heard long before I actually found out about hololive, along side Fubuki’s Scatman thing and Korone playing Fall Guys.

[@theultramage]

From what I recall, back then it was called the Holopocalypse.

[@OnePlayer480]

​@@theultramageThere's actually a more fitting name used already but I don't think it's appropriate for a broader audience. There's a plethora of extremely well known reasons why you don't see people commenting on it. It's not something that can be debated about either. The reasons stand tall and understandably.

[@exquisitecanineaficionado]

let's just say back then, Hololive was still relatively small, and Western fanbase strictly existing as a niche on 4chan. And frankly, Holocaust is really appropriate term considering just how *MUCH* got deleted. This is basically lost media; something which might be acceptable for black and white films - and we got it in modern times. Subaru's WHOLE Undertale playthrough? That's just example. Or that one old ass scary flash game Korone played. There's more content which simply doesn't exist; unless someone archived it and uploaded elsewhere.

[@KeebeThePlush]

Makes me glad that Nintendo has spared cover corp from strikes since they gave them some permission

[@ultimatevexation8782]

Damn Mio just went to the hospital and you have this title with her image in the thumbnail.

[@jamesche7496]

Fun fact, after that dark time, on BiliBili you can still find a lot of those videos saved up and translated with subtitle in the website, so there was an archive that people could download, but when the CN incident happenend, everything was deleted or hidden due to the raging CN fans, and so now everything is truly lost

[@averagewhiteguy2]

Never forget that it was Nijisisters who did this. The holocaust, which is what this is called, was started by angry sisters reporting holo's content.

[@Mikael_Ore]

Who

[@Geats-IX]

@@Mikael_Ore The cult of Kurosanji fans They''ve been trying to destroy Hololive from day one.

[@suhnih4076]

Real?

[@timetochronicle]

They had a site called Nyfco. And theyre still very active

[@AfterthymeGaming]

​@@Geats-IXDo they all only consists of women or are men also part of the Nijisisters?

[@Absolute__Zero]

Hololive has been through many adversities, but that’s what makes their story/rise to success all the more impactful. They rose above it all and got to the point where they’re currently at right now thanks to the talents weathering every storm and continuing to sail through those uncharted waters, Cover’s ever-improving support, the dedication of the fans, and luck.

[@akumuryuu]

What's up with shady Japanese companies using copyright striking as a means to blackmail/send a threat? Same happened with Niji striking False and Khyo. Copyright striking itself makes sense, but blackmail is kinda illegal. Admitting that they specifically targeted Hololive instead of just enforcing the rules is a massive self-report.

[@MildlyOCD]

That last pun, more than anything else, is enough to warrant your cancelation. Jesus that was bad.

[@AJarOfYams]

One could say it's... a liability

[@clippygoat]

Even though we have FUWAMOCO playing Touhou again, it really hurts alot that Okayu and other JP Holo's gameplay of 2hu was almost lost in existence. I also feel bad for Mio from this.

[@LilyKazami]

To those who weren't there, Okayu went from zero bullet hell experience, to decisively beating one of Touhou's Extra bosses in a week. It was truly the stuff of legends.

[@sunggyulee9020]

TBH, I think Capcom were just huge assholes regardless of how wrong cover was. In regular corporate scenarios, something like this would be handled privately with a cease-and-desist letter to Cover's lawyers. KZbin strikes were meant to be tools for smaller channels with no legal team to interact with the bigger corpos. Capcom sending 2 strikes onto Mio was just a power move. Anyone who has ever worked in corporates will know this was done in bad faith. Abusing a system that was not designed to be used in this manner. It is baffling to me that Hololive later decided to take on the Capcom sponsorship. I guess Cover was too young and didn't realize they got dick smacked by a bigger company.

[@garritsen3783]

3:51 turn on CC subtitle, even after censored, "Holo*****" is still there lol

[@HDeDeDe]

Outside of Kizuna AI, this event was my first exposure to the concept of vtubers.

[@ConsNSG]

Ah yes, the vodpocalypse

[@signumxmagnum]

Capcom could just send letter to Cover, letting them making a request for game permissions, but they just copyright strike them, sounds so fishy.

[@TheShiningEnergy]

Capcom appears to be to prideful, and greedy.

[@pngmk2]

JP gaming industry being themselves, Nintendo, Capcom, Konami, all of them are fucking retard whenever copyright is concerned.

[@vanguardRailgun924]

That’s just how Corporate Japan operates and because Fair use and Copyright doesn’t exist over there.

[@astuteanansi4935]

@@vanguardRailgun924 It's actually insane to see a corpo like hololive being so open to fan content and even letting fans monetize said content to some extent. Nintendo and Capcom could *never*

[@kuronoch.1441]

@@vanguardRailgun924 It was also rumored that Riku's family pulled some strings in that situation.

[@crushingon]

The trash taste crew being absolutely deadpan in some weird fucking outfits was quite the whiplash

[@rhodesailant9728]

I personally hate them as cc, but still respect them as normal human being

[@AzeharaCh]

I remember seeing the whole missing video counter on the sub page and never really understood how big it was despite seeing the numbers. It just seemed to big. In number form, its extremely hard to see.

[@Mikael_Ore]

Yup this is a rare day indeed, loving it being this early.

[@Snakedude4life]

Japan and the non-existent fair use. 🎩 🐍 no step on snek!🇺🇸🇭🇰

[@TheShiningEnergy]

someone should teach them about it.

[@DinnerForkTongue]

​@@TheShiningEnergy Sure. Just gotta remove any freedom of speech or elective power from the entire Japanese population aged 60 and up. Good luck.

[@Tamachii12]

@@TheShiningEnergy It is a waste of time, all the politicians here tries to appeal to old people that have zero understanding about tech and they themselves are such people, the mentality here is that if you're exceptional, you'll be dragged down to a mediocre level, or the nail that sticks will get hammered down, that's one of many reasons Japan is losing edge in many fields.

[@jakeyu2404]

Should've mentioned that mio fan that won the street fighter 6 tournament. The irony is almost poetic.

[@Des_kun4033]

Damn those were the days, glad were here now

[@osiris7127]

Its always darkest before the dawn.

[@eriknurwahab2861]

allow me to complete it "don't close your eyes, so that you could see the new light rising"

[@osiris7127]

@@eriknurwahab2861 allow me to complete it? That is an old phrase not a song lyric.

[@eriknurwahab2861]

@@osiris7127 similar quote from Gintama in the end of Shogun Assassination arc,

[@nawee242]

Reminds me of the theme of Kuro no Kiseki/Trails through daybreak game.

[@ThePrastomo]

This is a reminder that every company could rise from their ashes and deserved second and third chance. . But some just fucked their sixth chance.

[@jinwood]

Except nijisanji

[@piotr004]

If you can choose Any Color, but you constantly choose only Black, no wonder you are Kurosanji.

[@Osakarmakun]

But what I don't understand is that even if COVER has the permission of the companies, a lot of streams, for example, Choco's Sensei News segment, Mio's Pokemon Black, or HoloSummer 2019 are still private.

[@KB_13247]

people blaming hololive for this is pretty stupid. like it was thought that streaming games was fine back then. capcom purposefully made a big deal out of this in an effort to get the laws and rules down in japan, especially with japan already being since a business friendly nation. with vtubing being new capcom knew they could shit on hololive and the courts would back them. it's not all that surprising to anyone who's ever been a part of any fan made anything related to capcom. they always shut shit down, hell before they officially started sponsoring EVO, capcom tried to shut evo down before it was evo. they just didn't have any legal means to do it since all of those tourneys were held in america.

[@danyDarkneo]

what a fucking coincidence. She is in hospital now.

[@strippinheat]

Capcom owes a lot to Hololive and other streamers. SF6 wouldn't be nearly as successful if not for the streamer tournaments. To think they now profit off of the people they tried to destroy. Fuck Capcom.

[@piotr004]

Exactly. Fuck Capcom.

[@theultramage]

I came into hololive just right after the 'caust, having only watched Hana and a few of her colleagues up until then. I went into the youtube vods of the most recommended talents, looking for gameplay of some of my favorite games to have a common starting point. I was left really confused, because I only saw a few streams, and then a few old music videos, and that was it. It made me wonder if they all lived the twitch lifestyle where everything older than 2 weeks is deleted. It took me a while longer to realize what had really happened (either through reddit, comments under clips, or that holo schedule page that started showing those graphs).

[@decscuro]

Crapcom being Crapcom, maybe you're not wrong about how the Holo management was kinda incompetent in that era, but the way Crapcom act was just malicious, like I understand that their IP and blah blah blah, but that doesn't justify that instead of having a discussion with Cover on how to solve the problem, like it should have been. but not, instead of that they chose violence and started to copyright strike Mio's channel. To me, both parties were incompetent in how they handled the situation.

[@qizeaqfile]

People need to understand Hololive/Cover still never able to get "monetizable permission" on any Fromsoftware Games(Elden Ring,Sekiro,Dark Souls) They can play their games but no superchats or ads allowed. Yes, they gets no money(except for membership) every time they played Fromsoftware Games.

[@TheFusionmark1]

oh shit this was a minute ago

[@ritchieplacemedia9512]

The past can hurt, but you can either RUN from it or LEARN from it.

[@nestorgraciano3316]

The world will be a better place without copyright 😒

[@OneNintendoPlayer]

I almost disliked because of that last joke. The reaction I had was visceral. Good job

[@choopins5370]

damn one minute ago, also its amazing how many things couldve gone wrong with holo

[@kressrevo]

this video like time capsule, keep up the work 🔥

[@c-puff]

Wait so WHY can Capcom just strike people for doing Let's Plays of their games???????? THAT'S NOT HOW THAT WORKS?????

[@chobitssofar]

Ah I remember this and when Capcom admit that they do actually copyright strike Mio , I like "yep that how Japanese game company do". My friend who is streamer he and his wife do playthrough of Phoenix Wright got one strike from Capcom as well back in the day so he have to delete the VOD archive.

[@DelphinSquared]

Makes Me wonder with the surge of MonHun streams that happened recently.

[@Cunny_Lord]

The permissions have finally been granted No one can suppress the chuubas urge to monster hunter anymore

[@DelphinSquared]

@@Cunny_Lord Until Capcom says no again.

[@risktorise2103]

Hololive learn to be better, and they thrive today. If only Niji learn to do so,then more opportunities for vtuber. Sio far I heard more vtuber agency make effort to treat talents better. Hope they succeed.

[@ShiranuiLoki]

Permission is important and especially important to have them in Black and White and Signed by both Party. Because fine and jail time is the worst that could have happen.

[@ErmaPula]

Completely out of topic question: there are new paintings in minecraft, will you add some of them to the background?

[@aamigz]

i dont get it... why these jp companies so ansty on Vtubers playing their game...??? IT IS LITERALLY FREE ADVERTISMENT!!?!??!!

[@thelastwindwaker7948]

3:57 Not surprised to see HoloID go relatively unscathed. Risu especially almost never plays mainstream games.

[@hohens7118]

Well, that and it hadn't been that long since their debut so they didn't have that many videos to remove anyway.

[@thelastwindwaker7948]

@@hohens7118 That too. When I saw that this happened in 2020 that dawned on me. I didn't start watching them until after all of this happened.

[@ssilentmedia]

i still don't agree, and i will never agree, with companies having a say in who can stream their games. you sold me the game and i bought it. it's my game. if i want to make an entire video shitting on the game and showing videos from the game. i can. they should have no say in what i'm allowed to do with the game i bought. it's mine and i'm allowed to record it if i want. imagine if clothing brands would start suing people just because i used the clothes they made and i bought, in my live stream (and by use, i mean that i was wearing them). it's complete insanity

[@luckytanuki5449]

Since when does a content creator REQUIRE permission from the game publisher to play and or stream their game, even if they are a corporate entity? Doesnt that fall under fair use? I dont see any other Gaming content creators getting hit with strikes over playing/streaming video games. Obviously music is the gray area that is dangerous territory. Really seems like a power play by capcom, showing their little D energy. Kinda wish cover didnt bend the knee to them and instead just told the talents to never play a capcom game again, it would have only hurt the game publisher in the long run since marketing is so dependent and profitable when using popular content creators.

[@theultramage]

Always required because of super capitalist international law. Not fair use unless it satisfies the strict rules of fair use + is confirmed by a judge. All gaming creators negotiate a license beforehand (or they don't and gamble their channel and risk a lawsuit). Capcom mainly did it because niji-antis mass reported Cover after noticing that holo talents were blatantly playing games that were known to be banned from streaming. Not bending the knee not a viable strat, Cover had tiny market share and no influence while Capcom and Nintendo are multibillion megacorps. JP is 20+ years behind the rest of the world and very slow to respond; there's also a lot of corporate greed involved.

[@luckytanuki5449]

@@theultramage Idk, after looking into it a bit it's quite a grey area and as you said, if it came to it, would ultimately need to be settled by a judge in court who would determine if the content fell under fair use. Obviously your average content creator wouldn't have the money and pull to manage that, but a full company could fight it. I almost wish they would have taken Capcom to court just to get one over on them. Companies like that and Nintendo need to be taken down a peg because of how anti consumer they are 🙄

[@theultramage]

@@luckytanuki5449 But the holos had no standing. Even in the US it wouldn't have worked, except the fact that the companies are more lax regarding this type of content). And iirc, Capcom had a publicly known strict no-streaming policy, and Nintendo required being approved for their partner program. Trying to argue in court would guarantee a financial smackdown so large that it would send the whole company into the shadow realm.

[@TheOmniBlade]

This drama can only happen because it was JP based because of the lack of fair use. If this happened in EN, not a soul would be blaming management and to this day “perms” are absolutely moronic, but so is the Japanese legal system when it comes to these matters

[@theultramage]

TLDR: There's no way in hell that ordinary gameplay streams will ever qualify under US fair use law. 'Fair use' is a concept in USA copyright legislature, a den of scum and villainy and corporate lobbying. It is super strict and narrow, makes no guarantees, and requires to be tested in court on a case-by-case basis. Somehow, the people have been deceived to think that it gives you freedom to do anything - either through propaganda by the media, or through content pirates lying to themselves and their audience. To qualify for fair use of someone else's copyrighted content without a license, you need to meet several criteria developed by decades of case law, and then hire a copyright specialist attorney (very expensive) and go to court and convince a judge that you either fit within existing case law, or establish a new precedent for your case. If you lose the case, you will suffer incredible penalties and fees. And if you don't go to court, you will not be legally safe doing whatever it is you are doing. Some criteria include: - Does your thing act as a substitute for the original work? A full or partial playthrough of a story game would. A playthrough of a mechanics-heavy game might. - Does your thing's existence compete with / cause a loss of revenue for the copyright holder? There is an argument that what you're doing is 'free advertising' and it'll actually benefir them. Good luck arguing that in court though, unless you have real world data to back it up. - Is the content 'transformative'? If you're doing a philosophical / artistic analysis of a game/movie, then kinda, yeah. If you're just playing it and the only thing added is your on-the-fly commentary and reactions, then that's probably not enough. - What is the purpose of your use? For vtubers, it is most likely just to have something to enterntain the audience with and add variety. The choice of game doesn't really matter. This is an instant fail of the test.

[@_brutalista]

What a surprise. A Japanese Video Game publisher being extremely protective of their IP to the detriment of anything else. Ain't that fun. Totally fun.

[@KintokiSan]

So it's just fine that capcom "shot first and asked questions later"? They were in their rights to almost ruin a company instead of giving a warning first? I get that nousagi is mostly about the legality but it would've been nice to hear him condemn capcom for this at least. Don't get me wrong, I'm actually in favor of capital punishment. But only where it's warranted.

[@v.valclodi8311]

alr grandpa, time to go back to bed

[@Moon42069]

The trial and challenges that they had to go through and it what makes them one of the best agency today. Hololive has lived and strived.

[@doctjoe]

Didn't Nintendo do it first like half a year before, and it was the fact that Capcom *also* went for it that made Cover go like "oh frick everyone else might come for our ass, just private everything!"

[@Khashmonet]

I've been a fan since JP gen 3. How am I just now learning about this?

[@saeukanoch.8166]

Still waiting for that gura in depth analysis video. I've been dying to wait and see for when that releases

[@thelairofthedemongod]

I thought this was something from right now, so i checked Mio's twitter, she got sick, hospitalized, cancelled her thingy with Sakura Miko saying she doesn't want to do it again, but in may 8 she said that she was still alive and feeling better, or at least, recovering and thinking she will be back in a week or so... just to see it was something from 2020, when i had no idea of Hololive's existence, the only vtuber i know was Kizuna Ai and probably looking at some memes where Watame or Korone was

[@gutiwalravens]

saying that the copyrights laws in japan are tight is an understatement

[@Cowslippoetry]

Oh I remember this incident. Seems like ages ago, but the outrage was definitely memorable. From my own recollection, the lion's share of bile was spat not at Cover or even Capcom (the talents thankfully escaped any backlash, as this was certainly none of their fault) but at KZbin's busted ass copyright strike system that allows for no creator flexibility, especially now that it's being mostly managed by a schizo algorithm. Louis Rossman sums it up perfectly: "It's like dealing with an AI with a personality disorder, you have no idea what this thing is going to do". On a related note, as much as Cover has learned, they still get the occasional bop. I just found out Nerizzler's Lilium cover got axed. Seeing that hole in my Advent playlist will always bug me.

[@arizeta3540]

Anya ID gets copyright strike from Anya JP 🤣 KZbin is crazy

[@konoMeel]

im sorry I just can't take the video seriously with the constant Holo**** getting censored 😭😭

[@goleogthais]

COPYRIGHT HATE DMCA HATE BOOMER HATE

[@Votedjt2024]

❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊yo bro I really love your show

[@saltedonion]

The 9/11 of hololive

[@seneca983]

0:25 Who's that vtuber? Is it AZKi or someone else?

[@AllanMeling]

i always understood why corpo Vtubers are hard on pemrs as i have been around since lets plays where a new thing, i also know having perms is still not a guarantee as ppl have revoked them in the past. so if i was cover i would not trust them even now

[@LordAshura]

Japanese laws are also a reason why beside Luna, Hololive has not taken in a single Nijisanji Talent after they leave. Hololive must be vigilant when dealing with the law after the horrific experience with the demonization apocalpse.

[@puhanlemontian6026]

i think taking talents from other agencies have nothing to do with laws, holo also took people from other corpo, like laplus was from ReAct, bae was from myholotv. i think there is a mutual understanding between niji and holo as the two giants in the industry to not take former talents, so no pouching, talents can't just move to the other company, so these two don't fight over talents, from a company's pov, it's mutually beneficial, otherwise an exodus of talents would be detrimental.

[@gillettedave]

I highly doubt cover would need to worry about talents jumping to ninji

[@Superjohndoe8060]

Thanks for the video!!!

[@Denamic]

Fuck Capcom though

[@HowardAltEisen]

Wait, the "grey" in the chart is what was removed? DN, the colors there are green and pink - are you slightly colorblind?

[@shinodamasaru7945]

i was there. supposed to watch Miko's COD MW2 (og). then, this happened.

[@damasake]

Mw2 is american, unless localizer is also a japanese publisher.

[@shinodamasaru7945]

@@damasake might be the localizer issue. i cant find the vid (maybe im blind). because, when miko tries the airport mission, she cant sh*ot the civs.

[@Notorious224]

gura is the reason they surpassed Nijisanji

[@kushantaiidan]

I have not bought a single game from any of the corporations involved since this happened. Fuck what they did to these girls. Never forgive.

[@anotherfriendlyshikikan6960]

So what I picked up is fuck capcom.

[@NightFlocke]

So in short, it was about bad management because of the "permits" for the games.

[@JD101_]

Hololive's dmg control here FAR outclasses Nijisanji's, TENFOLD

[@darknebulas1167]

if we replace holo with niji. mio would have been thrown overboard and the boat would have continued

[@merafirewing6591]

The fact that Hololive nearly went under. Crapcom is incredibly very low.