The Desert Air Force

The Desert Air Force
Part of North Africa Week on WW2TV
Ken Delve served 20 years in the Royal Air Force as a Navigator and during that time developed his passion for aviation and military history. From researching and publishing the history of his first squadron - 39 Squadron, which had played a major role in defeating Rommel’s supply lines - he has subsequently written over 40 books and numerous articles. His most recent work is a 3-volume set covering the Desert War, Malta’s offensive role, and the campaign in Italy.
Today we talk about the structure, operation, aircraft and men of the 1st Tactical Air Force, or Desert Air Force as it became known. It was formed in North Africa to support the 8th Army and included squadrons from the RAF, SAAF, RAAF and eventually the USAAF. The book includes descriptions of many notable defensive and offensive campaigns, the many types of aircraft used, weapons and the airfields that played host to these events. It was formed in North Africa to support the 8th Army and included squadrons from the RAF, SAAF, RAAF and eventually the USAAF.
Desert Air Force in World War II by Ken Delve
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[@WW2TV]

Ken was a great guest - I loved all the quips and trivia. If you have enjoyed this show, please don't forget to click like, leave a comment for other viewers and if you have not done so already please SUSBSCRIBE so you don't miss our next streams. You can also become a member of this channel and support me financially here kzbin.info/door/UC1nmJGHmiKtlkpA6SJMeA. Links to any books discussed, WW2TV merchandise, our social media pages and other WW2TV shows to watch can all be found in the full KZbin description. Lastly, my own book Angels of Mercy is always available online - more info here www.ddayhistorian.com/angels-of-mercy.html

[@Emchisti]

What a very entertaining bloke. Clearly knows his stuff, but delivered in a friendly and inviting manner. Really, really enjoyed this episode.

[@mammuchan8923]

What a pleasure and privilege to watch such an expert share his knowledge with us. Thank you Ken and Paul, you made my day

[@scottgrimwood8868]

A great start to North Africa Week! Ken has a tremendous knowledge and passion for the RAF Desert Air Force. I learned a lot today and I am very grateful.

[@DionSimmonds]

Can't say enough about how much I've enjoyed WW2 TV since discovering it a few months back. My subscription would be a bargain at twice the price; few things I say that about. Excellent. Cheers Paul.

[@jimasher]

Again,my gratitude for your work and presentations. I have more satisfaction watching history recounted by truly compassionate people than anything television has to offer. I spend my late evenings watching amazing episodes of both theaters of World War 2. I’ve been fortunate enough to have been to many of the places you talk about. Seeing the gun emplacements on Corregidor,and seeing tank barricades in Europe. And being from generations of military veterans of every conflict you can name, makes my interest in hearing factual information much appreciated. I truly give you my most sincere regards for your programs. Please know that some of us value your efforts. Keep going. All the way. Jim.

[@WW2TV]

Thank you Jim for the support

[@jefsantamonica641]

Loved this presentation. So knowledgeable and I really appreciated the matter-of-factness. Military tend not to mince words.

[@bobsakamanos4469]

Nice to see attention given to the N.Africa & Malta campaigns. My father flew there for 3 yrs. Hurricanes, Kittyhawks, then mu test pilot on many types.

[@localbod]

Another fantastically knowledgeable guest speaker. A thoroughly enjoyable episode. I would recommend reading Ace of Aces by E.C.R. Baker. It tells the story of Pat Pattle.

[@chriscamfield7610]

It's a REALLY good book. Found it completely by random at a book sale.

[@TinusleRouxRSA]

Great interview Ken! Keep well there!

[@timsampson7336]

Great overview of the Desert Air Force and its role in the North African theater.

[@patm8622]

Brilliant presentation by one of the premier experts in the field. Well done to WW2TV for another great programme featuring a leading historian and author.

[@pippohispano]

Again, I love these interviews and the guys you choose. Great show!

[@marktuffield6519]

A very interesting talk, I first remember coming across an explanation of how "forward air control" for want of a better term was developed in the desert and adapted for use in Europe in "The Right of the Line" by John Terraine all those years ago. I would recommend watching this talk in conjunction with that on Collishaw that you also did. Collishaw and indeed many senior officers in the RAF were influenced by their experiences of the high losses incurred by WW1 RFC/RAF Squadrons directly supporting the Army, particularly during the battles of 1917 & 18. Collishaw as the C/O of a RNAS Sqn. operating alongside the RFC had first hand experience of this. His approach in the desert was to use his limited forces to interdict behind the enemy lines rather than to be directly involved in the air over a battle. The Army was always reluctant to move without direct air support and ultimately, for fear of losing tactical air power to the Army (with its vision of dive bombers mimicking the German Stuka) had to give ground and re-learn the art and cost of close air support, which Tedder and Coningham did. The mention of the work of the RSUs reminds me that RFC did the same thing in WW1, recovering wrecks often under shell fire in no-mans-land, particularly engines as production of these always lagged behind airframes in WW1. I agree with Ken that the Germans seemed to lack a similar capacity to the RSUs, relying on re-supply of airframes, though it is notable that in photos of abandoned German aircraft at desert airstrips, captured by the allies, the aircraft are normally heavily cannibalised.

[@Bochi42]

I absolutely love these episodes and the wonderful historians you have on! Much thanks to them as well as you. Absolutely one of the best WW2 channels on tube.

[@WW2TV]

Thank you very much, I hope you will consider becoming a channel member to help us bring more content please

[@mattmilne147]

Really appreciate the comments around the SAAF's contribution to the DAF. South Africa's contribution to the early years of the war is vastly overlooked from a combined arm's perspective. The reality is considering the political landscape of SA and the injustices of not allowing black South Africans to take combat roles, it was really up to English speaking and a moderate minority of Afrikaans white South Africans to volunteer to go 'Up North'. It could be argued that the country was split in half between joining the war and neutrality. Maybe even leaning a little to the Germans amongst many Boer-centric nationalists. With that perspective the Union of South Africa's contribution cannot be understated.

[@TheVigilant109]

Wonderful presentation by Ken. How air power was developed and the principles laid down by the Desert Air Force are as relevant today. Thank you

[@mjinoz1677]

Another great episode!

[@SiTheSly]

A particularly good episode. Both entertaining and enlightening. Thank you.

[@bloodredsky24]

Great shows gentlemen!

[@davidk8522]

Extremely well organized and engaging presentation. The chronological approach/descriptive maps and images, interspersed with illustrative detail and anecdotes, is a great way to structure these operational discussions.

[@AnthonyBrown12324]

Really enjoying this , a cogent account of the desert airwar ; interspersed with vignettes about the pets for instance . Ken Delve has a feeling for the airforce ; having served . Reminds me of Antony Beevor with this narrative flowing in sequence . Lots of interesting facts but still a story not at all dry ; must be good books .

[@AG9229]

That was utterly superb. Off to find this chap's books.

[@cheesenoodles8316]

Great information on P40s in the crate, and repair/reclimation of aeroplanes.

[@PMMagro]

Thanks!

[@markrunnalls7215]

Wow I really enjoyed that ,be nice to here Ken if he could do one on the RAF in Italy … Oh and Burma …

[@joeokabayashi8669]

Very informative! Excellent audio - always great when speaker uses face mic or dedicated mic for audio.

[@WW2TV]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@robinbeil2870]

proper cool bloke . I Grew up with his son . I never knew all about his history I would have picked his brains all the time if I knew.

[@Rusty_Gold85]

On the point at the end about war records when we looked at a Great Uncles WWI papers it was bloody hard to interpret the cursive writing at times . The following years of the War like 1925-30 the AIF had typed up those events and made them easier to understand. He got shelled in the thigh , shipped back behind lines , then back to England but died of his wounds and was given a Official Ceremony at his burial

[@andrewblake2254]

Excellent stuff guys.

[@WW2TV]

Much appreciated!

[@thegreatdominion949]

Implicit in my question about the Proserpina was the fact that it was sunk at a critical time during the early stages of the Second Battle of El Alamein when the Afrika Korps was desperately short of fuel for its tanks and motor transport and consequently less able to effectively respond to the oncoming Allied offensive. Perhaps Ken is confusing it with another tanker, but the Proserpina was sunk by a single Beaufort of 47 Squadron RAF.

[@AG9229]

I think he answered it rather well. It's another tanker denied to the Axis by the DAF.

[@thegreatdominion949]

@@AG9229 Yes another tanker denied, but if you learn the story you will realize that it almost didn't happen. All but one of the strike aircraft looking for it expended their ordnance on other nearby vessels. What impact the arrival of this tanker in port would have had on the outcome of the El Alamein offensive is difficult to determine but it's an interesting counterfactual nonetheless. Ken also said the Proserpina was sunk by 39 Squadron RAF which was mainly a Malta-based unit. This is incorrect as I indicated above.

[@AG9229]

I have a hypothesis. You have a pet scenario about which you are very passionate. Great. You asked an expert in the hope that they would either: a) be amazed at your knowledge and compliment you for such an amazing question or (more likely, IMO), b) not know as much about it as you do, so that you can then flex your muscles about how you can't believe they didn't know that. It, quite literally, is just another tanker denied to the Axis and is unlikely to have been the only one denied to them at a crucial moment. It's even more generic a sinking when you yourself don't know what difference it would have made. Which, of course, you can't. None of us can. His answer, IMO, was specific enough for such a relatively commonplace occurrence.

[@thegreatdominion949]

@@AG9229 No, I am just aware of the story and thought it was a noteworthy episode. Apparently you and the "expert" don't agree with that. That's fine. People are entitled to their opinions but not their own facts. Strange that you are being so defensive about it.

[@AG9229]

@@thegreatdominion949 I'm not. You're just being so specific it's just downright odd.

[@anselmdanker9519]

Thank you for your excellent presentation on the Desert Air Force.

[@johnford6967]

As l had noted before.216 Sqdn used their Bristol bombay's for night bombing(Bengazi) Dad Flt Sgt G.Ford told me of one particular night raid which was printed in the Air pictorial magazine in the 1970s..

[@MegaBloggs1]

Id like to ask Ken if the Folgore and 7th falschirmjager were hurled at Malta in late 1941 would it have been successful and what would have been the impact of the loss of Malta

[@AnthonyBrown12324]

Important point there ; you don't have to destroy the tanks if you destroy their support vehicles ( logistics ) This was even more the case with heavy tanks like the Tiger ; almost useless without fuel which they guzzled .

[@DalonCole]

Amateurs talk be about tactics. Professionals talk about logistics. Good show. Mazeltov from Texas

[@martinricardo4503]

Another myth perpetuated..

[@nickdanger3802]

At 14.18 the Kittyhawk was the aircraft that was the most successful ...they got the Kittyhawk immediately after they stopped flying the Hurricanes...the Kittyhawk and Tomahawk were virtually the sole air force of the cell three squadron type aircraft for three years right through the North African campaign and right through the Eastern Mediterranean and Yugoslavian areas the Kittyhawk carried that by itself, and it was a brilliant aircraft...2,000 pounds of bombs 3 Squadron RAAF You tube

[@jacktattis]

Not really the Hurricane out numbered the P40 by 13 Sqns to 11 sqns and the Hurricane IIC could carry a heavier Armament

[@jonrettich4579]

Could the German desert intervention, especially toward the end of ‘42 , helped to save the Soviet Union? Thanks as ever for all your good works

[@PhansiKhongoloza]

Collecting pets, strays and even wild animals, is most definitely a South African thing. Even in my time during the 1980's, it was still a thing. No base was without its collection of dogs, cats, baboons, monkeys and even warthogs, hyenas, lions, and elephant and such.

[@PhansiKhongoloza]

Thank you highlighting the South African contribution to both world wars. It's a subject that has really been ignored and neglected. Very few know about the East African Campaign where South Africa inflicted the first Allied victory over the Axis powers.

[@silentotto5099]

The guy who thought of the shark paint scheme for the P-40 should have been knighted by the king.

[@rayfairall4126]

Copied off the Germans I believe.

[@silentotto5099]

@@rayfairall4126 I thought it was an Australian pilot flying Kittyhawks in N. Africa.

[@rayfairall4126]

@@silentotto5099 Yes indeed but I read that the "germ" of an idea was copied off a shot down German aircraft in N Africa. The mention may have been in the book about the Spitfires at Darwin which also used the sharks teeth.

[@silentotto5099]

@@rayfairall4126 You know... Now that I think about it, I don't think I've ever seen a photograph of a wartime Me-109 or Fw-190 with elaborate nose art. Usually they just have their noses painted in some solid color with nothing else but the Jagdstaffel badge. Perhaps it was copied from an Me-110 or a Ju-87. I've seen a few of those with some elaborate nose art.

[@marktuffield6519]

II./ZG 76 colloquially know as the "Haifisch Gruppe or sometimes, if technically incorrect, Geschwader" adopted a sharksmouth with no eye on their Messerschmitt Bf 110 aircraft during the Battle of Britain. Erik Shilling saw a photo of one and adapted the markings for the P-40s flown by the AVG. However as far as I am aware 112 Sqn RAF had beaten the AVG to the game with their similarly inspired sharksmouth design.

[@Rusty_Gold85]

The lessons learnt in Deserts of Africa by the 9TH AIF of supply and Logistics on the long roads and harbours miles behind the lines , they take to New Guinea and immediately implement . What they did first was pull back , string the difficult supply tracks of the japanese to straining and breaking , attack those lines with Hunting groups constantly keeping them on edge with daily ambushes and then when they were broken and weak , Hit them hard . Beat them and be the first Army to beat the japanese in the Pacific . But Macarthur sacked these Generals as he was not trained to retreat at West point and no previous fighting experience he didnt understand it was a tactical movement

[@martinricardo4503]

Where in the heck did you get your facts? Utter rubbish.

[@MegaBloggs1]

the mans a card and very knowledgable

[@siffchopf22]

seems like it was a short weekend

[@MegaBloggs1]

Australia used the P-40 as an effective dive bomber right up to 1945 in the pacific

[@jacktattis]

Clive Caldwell used the P40

[@nickdanger3802]

Churchill "Our most vital need is therefore the delivery at the earliest possible date of the largest possible number of Curtiss P-40 fighters." page 86 The Burning Blue Addison and Crang

[@PaoloRiveraPinelli]

To myself i think that is a huge exaggeration to say that Britain had any impact on the Greek campaign .

[@jacktattis]

Pat Pattle got 15 in a Gladiator

[@MegaBloggs1]

WOODY-theres no doubt that Joachim Marseille was the best deflection shot of the airwar

[@MegaBloggs1]

The assessment of Crete and Greece is wrong-churchill was after the 1000 strong greek merchant marine to replace the losses in the british merchant marine fleet-Crete could have been used as a bomber base for Cyrenicia but it would have been a constant struggle against axis raids from greece

[@MegaBloggs1]

Or as the Australians called it the benghazi handicap