The Downside of Empathy

[@joesamson26]

Always be cautious of the self proclaimed “empaths” who feel the need to boast about being empaths.

[@AarmOZ84]

My Mother boasts about that. She is also a covert narcissist so...... 🤷‍♂

[@mral4381]

Projecting their shadow?

[@StratsRUs]

​@@AarmOZ84it's always the mother 😅

[@lenaccarlsson]

@@AarmOZ84 I was going to say just that. Narcissists use the empath spiel to get close to people.

[@cirodimarzio6238]

Exactly, I know some types that said they have high empathy, but they never help you, instead of that you have peoples who just help you without need to say them to, in corporation i meet both of them and type 2. Never said anything about their empathy EVER..

[@mathieul4303]

FINALLY SOMEONE ADDRESSING THIS. Too much empathy is not good. You can't protect or do anything like that.

[@DelaronZarath]

Empathy alone cannot dictate what is right, but it can serve as a valuable tool to recognize when our actions may harm others. Therefore, while empathy cannot solely form the basis of morality, it can certainly lay the groundwork for ethics by guiding our interactions with others and minimizing potential resentment. By integrating ethics with morality and regulating them both through rationality, these principles create a strong foundation to move forward into the future.

[@Falkon303]

I think empathy can be useful if combined with actual action and other aspects of care. I feel like we separate things too much and maybe they are designed to work together, kind of like you are saying it's an ingredient in a recipe.

[@SomeStupidBastard]

Empathy with actual action and care is just compassion but with extra steps. Empathy is only useful for those who want to make others feel better not make others better. Compassion is wanting people to be better.

[@Melonrevenge77]

Empathy is worthless without humility. Humility brings you level with others so you can empathise with them, but it also keeps you grounded in knowing that it's not your responsibility to cater to everyone else's needs. We always need more empathy, on this I know, but like a man can't live on bread alone - empathy is only part of the picture.

[@kicksyyarosh5708]

“Kindly let me help you or you will drown said the monkey putting the fish safely up a tree.” ― Alan W. Watts

[@zappy7393]

Basically my work emails...

[@Ash-zr7yr]

Mate thank you for the effort you are putting into such important conversations!

[@zappy7393]

My workplace is starting to "apply empathy" to our daily work...this of course means telling people to be empathetic whilst doing nothing about the problems.

[@stammesbruder]

If the downside of empathy is that some people feel the need to engage in toxic behavior, then that isn't a problem of empathy, but rather an issue of how to deal with empathy. As you differentiated it later anyway, the action is different from empathy. Here, you are clearly talking about compassion. In particular, self-sacrifice in a toxic way might just be an issue of self-worth and is only expressed through compassion, possibly as a direct consequence of them not getting enough in their own life. I don't share your view on the problem of directed care. Your direct environment is not the only place you can get help from as there are numerous services that assist you in critical and even not-so-critical matters. Through the internet, pretty much everyone has easy access to the information to get that help, regardless of whether you are good with words or not. I also don't view it as an issue at all, that people with "lesser problems" receive the help they need. People deserve help regardless of how severe the issue is, and the same is true for social change and financial aid to support groups. It may not be an optimal distribution, but that doesn't make it a downside. I come to this conclusion, since there is absolutely no way to put a metric on those issues. You could argue that capitalism is the cause of most modern mental health problems and therefore put all the funds into establishing a different economical environment through politics, but you could also argue that saving human lifes is more important, because you fail everyone who doesn't make it through - so you put your money in soup kitchens, homeless shelters, suicide prevention, etc to remedy the symptoms before attacking the root cause. Both make sense, and neither is inferior - as long as people are being positively affected, it's fine. Since you also showed a tweet about people who are just assholes, let's not forget your point about manipulation in the first section of the video. Someone who claims to be an empath may not actually be one. Narcissists have a tendency to disguise their cruelty as altruism. Of course, becoming a narcissist is partly instilled through learning mechanisms due to a lack of empathy towards them, so more empathy means less people who manipulate you in a toxic way. Any kind of social action is a sort of manipulation - we act in a certain way because we want to illicit an expected response. That is true, regardless of whether it's about empathy or not. The difference is, that some manipulate to harm, while others are harmless. This brings me full circle towards compassion and self-worth. If the parents of a child are not able to show their boundaries while being empathetic, then the kid might not learn this either, resulting in someone who is fine with manipulating, or imitating to the point where their actions hurt themselves. In the end, empathy is perfectly fine as a bar for subjective morality. Perhaps herein lies your grievance: Morality is not objective. The closest we can get to that is by establishing traits or ideas as guiding principles for moral behavior, one of which is empathy. It needs to be used differently in different contexts.

[@Ben-rz9cf]

To me empathy is the pragmatists greatest tool. You can have empathy for someone but not sympathy for them. Understanding how and what they are feeling is not just an altruistic thing, its the very basis by which all social problems can be solved or overcome, arguments can actually be won, and people can be persuaded. It requires truly coming to terms with who they are and what they think and feel rather than your own projection of what they should or do feel. We will never stop the issues of murderers, rapists and school shooters unless we can understand why they do what they do, what feelings might have led them down that path and what excuses they might give themselves for what they have done, whether or not we condone those excuses or think those feelings are even justified. I think the fact that people don't understand the value of empathy even from a purely selfish perspective is a lot of what is wrong with the world. They prefer ignorance and pretty delusions to actually being effectual.

[@dxfifa]

Understanding cognitively how people are feeling is not the same as the layman's "empathy". People who profess to have strong empathy or be "empaths" generally emotionally read others, then emotionally process their projection of how the other feels in the first person. Ie, they feel they can both read others emotions, and then feel the emotions as if they were their own. Cognitive empathy is logical and thoughtful, but detached from the emotional empathy. You can have both, but cognitive empathy is what drives real action and understanding

[@Chat2Conaz]

YES ! Another one ! Thanks Neel !

[@teliph3U]

People that claim to be emphatic are often just overly emotional. And even as you say, decisions made based on an emotional feeling may lead to bad decisions that may cause a lot of bad consequences. Thus, in my opinion, bad impulse control and emotionality is bad. Feeling without reason is worthless. Feelings are the motivator. Reason ensures that your actions lead to the desired outcome.

[@TwinkleStar987]

The strange thing about this debate, is that all of our decisions are driven by our emotional needs. Very rational people are also driven by emotion. Our gut shoots of signals to the brain. My understanding of empathy is to its trying to understand others from their perspective. We spend too much time drawing lines in the sand, rather than building on the strengths, of all. There’s clearly a need for HSP’s, as it’s mirrored in the animal kingdom often. Indeed a conundrum.

[@MiyamotoMick]

I feel like I'm generally an empathetic kind of person, but I've never once held that feeling above any other kind of thought or opinion I've had about broader society. It's something that helps us understand an individuals situation, and allows us to connect with that person on a level they can appreciate. But at the end of the day everyone is struggling with something, and some handle it better than others. Either way though, society cannot shape itself in such a way that literally everyone can be taken care of. It's just not possible. Building your entire perspective of the world with empathy as your base just leads you to feeling helpless and unhappy with everything and everyone around you, staring at problem after problem with no chance at genuine solutions.

[@tbk2010]

Empathy is hard to define, often it's used interchangeably with pity or sympathy. But I think these are more like aspects of a causality chain: sympathy leads to empathy leads to pity. In that scenario empathy is the involuntary act, but it can also used deliberately to understand someone's inner emmotional state without sharing it. That is a) extremely useful, b) extremely dangerous. It enables narcissist and psychopaths to manipulate the people around them, often with disastrous consequences.

[@lilijagaming]

I would add to that 2 points: - empathy tends to be linked with who people identify more - being an empath isn't actually that fun and productive on its own. Feeling overwhelmed by emotions of other with no idea what to do with that. Strong empaths have a tendency to hide from people just because those outside emotions can easily become too much So I agree that empathy can be a useful impuls. But it has little to do with morality itself as empathy alone cannot improve anything.

[@HecClaytos4956]

These philosophical videos are top notch Neel. Keep them comming.

[@harleyzheng5494]

For the algorithm 🎉

[@clinthowell2145]

In a way it reminds me of "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" or "treading on eggshells" though sometimes the wheel keeps squeaking regardless of the amount of grease applied, and at a certain point you can't tread lightly enough

[@benjamindavey4782]

A great video Mr Kolhatkar. I agree that empathy is important, and despite being autistic it's an emotional trait I'm generally quite attuned to as a person. But that has left me vulnerable in different situations in my life, and I wanted to say I 100% agree it should not be the highest moral value. Personally I find honor (defined as being a mix of standing by one's moral principles and upholding one's personal dignity and self respect) to be a better candidate for such a position. I've followed your channel for absolutely ages and this is one of the best videos you have done.

[@addidentity7801]

Our empathy shoud lead us to action, understanding why people are the way they are make us realise what we have to do

[@punishedpinecone4772]

People who say "I'm an empath" are narcissists who have become so because they were applauded for simply getting out of bed.

[@Low760]

The photos used im sure gsin the traction of views from the right, good work.

[@FrazerKirkman]

Love you Neel. Thanks for being a voice of reason, and for caring about everyone.

[@dxfifa]

Acting on empathy on an emotional level is NOT benevolent. It is self serving by default. If you feel the emotions and pain of others, when you act on it, it is to lessen your own discomfort. Truly caring people don't need emotional empathy or sympathy at all, you can be cold and detached but still take action despite the fact it gives you no emotional catharsis. Funny how most "empaths" fail to give a shit or act to help anyone when their own personal emotions do not align with the way the other person feels

[@ThePatriarchXCI91]

You make very good points, especially around the issue of good communicators winning the attention

[@punishedpinecone4772]

Open a self-help book for men and count how many times it says "you should" Open a self-help book for women and count how many times it says "you deserve"

[@AkiRa22084]

Never forget what the road to hell is paved with.

[@Nate_R_]

Well said

[@mynameisviktorreznov]

LOL the thumbnail

[@puncherdavis9727]

As a male I prefer to lead with analytical logic mixed in with empathy but not expressing personal sympathy because that gets a little too personal. When I'm listening to my fiance's issues I can be logical and empathetic but I don't have to over personalize it. People have what I call empathetic dumptruck syndrome where they think they have to dump all of their life's experiences an emotional baggage on you and you get to try to absorb it and then go kablooey cuz your brain can't handle it. I think social media is a huge part of this issue because people constantly dump their whole lives online hoping to get sympathy not just empathy in order to feel loved or important or who knows what else

[@gonthyalavishalchandan1193]

Empathy is one of the highest moral good, but attachment isn't sometimes it looks the same but isn't. Empathy is the ability to understand others feeling, which can never be bad, but when your whole personality is empathizing and empathizing alone like a parasite then it would feel horrible to see a world where there is not much need for general empathy (although I don't think it's objectively possible to world that doesn't need empathy but subjectively in your circle or your perceived world it maybe possible

[@danstrikes]

Well put 👍

[@algardaus]

Today "empathy" overwhelms sanity.

[@punishedpinecone4772]

Do not reward people who depend on the attention they get from elaborate tantrums.

[@Low760]

Which I see more of from the right.

[@SomethinSik]

Great video man 👌

[@StickNik]

I see Thomas Sowell quotes, I like.

[@potapotapotapotapotapota]

interesting video Mr KoolHatCar

[@JinJinDoe]

I don't know man if it's good or bad, I know that I want to be the opposite of my boss who only knows fake compassion, relies on manipulation and has narcissistic traits. Everyone knows that she doesn't give a shit. But the big bosses love her, cos she crunches the numbers.

[@SomeStupidBastard]

What type of job do you work?

[@algardaus]

Thats what modern empathy is, a great way for unproductive scum to get power over the real ones.

[@Low760]

The way Neel talks, he would be in that position too.

[@algardaus]

@@Low760 I disagree, there are plenty of good bosses and plenty of bad ones. But sociopathic climbers are everywhere, from political groups to NGO's and companies. They are a cancer that this cult of empathy is spreading. I think Neel is using the language of the day, but I don't think he is a sociopath.

[@mral4381]

Genius

[@ThinWhiteAxe]

I've been saying this for years after watching parents who are too soft and a pushover spoil their children. Tough love is important.

[@dxfifa]

Also, a lot of "empaths" just have a very weak frame and are the complete opposite of stoic, everything affects them and they are therefore fickle and hard to feel like you know the real person. Mirror people so to speak

[@AnnbagsMcgee]

I find this video odd. Was anyone arguing that society should be directed purely by empathy? Not a take I've seen before. It's certainly true that there are people who claim to be "empaths" and that there are downsides to the performance of empathy, spesh with social media in the mix. I've heard more about those that reckon society should function solely off objective reasoning. (Not possible imo, the inherent bias of an individual human experience will always colour the responses given in some way). But overall idk, this has a lot of points where you use specific examples of relationships and then do a "therefore society" point. Also not a fan of how you've used certain images/graphs to support your voiceover when they don't appear related.. Strange video.

[@Eeshank2]

this guy has made his base by simping for white people/right wingers, that should tell you enough

[@Vovoxa7]

Neel you did this VO in one take didn't you aha

[@isaiahpaul56]

your a comedian right? edit: I meant this as a compliment. Funny how comedians can do better than main stream media.

[@mathieul4303]

You know someone can do more than comedy right

[@isaiahpaul56]

@@mathieul4303 i meant this as a compliment.

[@entonbray]

Comedy has always been a form of social critique. These essays are a just a different form.

[@gwyn.]

Peter Pan Syndrome

[@Sitbear]

Empathy is not only overrated, it’s downright counterproductive at the societal level. After all, one death is a tragedy but a million deaths is a statistic. As a leftist, I do find it amusing that you portray the left wing as the more “empathy-driven” side. On the ground, this may seem the case, but on the ideological level it’s reversed. Conservatives form more identitarian in-groups (e.g. Nationalism), while Marx would’ve eviscerated “empathetic morality” as Utopian idealism!

[@Yodalemos]

but the neoliberals don't espouse Marxism. They advocate cultural Marxism, which I'm sure Marx would have been disgusted by, since his argumentation was almost entirely centered around economic status.

[@Yodalemos]

You're absolutely correct about the rightoids though. I just felt the need to correct you about "the left" that isn't really left.

[@Allister_1]

I have finally done it. I have found a intelligent, history-literate,articulate leftist. I see nothing but copy pasta braindead takes from leftists online so reading your comment was a genuine treat as a conservative as I have always valued alternate opinions to hone my own I have not had much luck with that among leftists lately but I have to imagine with you it would not be the case were we to debate. A breath of fresh air!

[@Sitbear]

@@Yodalemos Well when I'm talking about the left, I don't mean the left that isn't really left. Also, Cultural Marxism is not a thing; the closest match to what that might mean is Critical Theory. But critical theorists are not neoliberal.

[@Sitbear]

@@Allister_1 Well, you know how online debates go... Godwin's Law!

[@craigocaster]

Yikes

[@TexanSupremacy]

You must be a fan of Ayn Rand

[@twistedspirit]

So much yapping to just say that empathy is harmful. Brother you are a leftist poster boy 😅