The DUMBEST battle ever! - Rings of Power Siege of Eregion BATTLE SCENE AUTOPSY

[@foldionepapyrus3441]

Not just trying to claim 4 Km of range on that trebuchet but by the looks of it shooting upwards a very very long way too - that city looked to be full of mulitistory buildings and now looks so tiny and low this mountain must be a few hundred meters tall at least. So that trebuchet actually has a range of probably more like 15 Km - the rocks are still arcing upwards or at least not clearly decending yet and at insane distance already, so if the mountain wasn't there to hit minimum 8Km range... Making it somewhere in the range of a battleship gun or modern artillery in performance, well in excess of any black powder cannon I'm aware of... Even more stupid if your trebuchet can shoot that far why would you bring them that close! Its so much easier for your opponents to target the siege weapons if they are visible - they are in range of a sally, visible to the defenders so as they might just have a siege weapon or two of their own...

[@Scruffynerfherder10]

What’s even dumber, is this mega artillery are able to hit a mountain range accurately, but can’t mass attack the gates, or the walls, if they all shot at the gates at once, they’d blow it apart faster than that stupid reverse crossbow bolt thing they are using to take apart the wall.

[@foldionepapyrus3441]

@@Scruffynerfherder10 I'd give that accuracy level a pass - they only need to hit a mountain - rather a big target that is hard to miss where hitting the gate or wall could take a few attempts. I agree its super dumb they didn't use their magically high explosive only when its good for the plot, and otherwise as effective as a basket or rocks +1 dead orc ammo till they hit the walls...

[@Scruffynerfherder10]

@@foldionepapyrus3441I hurts me to say one movie did a better job showing a use of trebuchets in a siege, kingdom of heaven; where the Saracens used their trebuchets in a mass attack on a weak part of the wall to enter the city…ffs Ridley Scott; who hates history, does a better job than a billion dollar show

[@kaltaron1284]

@@foldionepapyrus3441 They had to hit some very specific point of fault in the mountain to cause that kind of reaction with their little pebbles.

[@detorrV2]

Well, i think such siege engines are cannon of the LOTR universe at this point. Who can forget the Minas Tirith trebuchets launching payloads several times heavier than the whole machine+counterweight. Or mere catapults lauching tons of rock at hundreds of meters away.

[@jamesanderson6769]

Critical Drinker said you would have a few um... "notes" about this battle. I see he wasn't wrong.

[@Mikalent]

I was expecting a 20, *MAYBE* 30 minute video before ending with Shad pulling his hair out and leaving. Was not expecting a full hour.....

[@benfijo]

Ah yes the critical wanker lord and prince of the rage bait isle

[@krissuyx]

That was aknowledged in the intro of this video.

[@kotarojujo2737]

i hate rop but he is also suck ass. He is ultra grifter

[@kreese-yi2nb]

The most entertaining instance of Shad losing it since he saw the Safiyah assassin's weapon in Batwoman S02E08.

[@lordcorgi6481]

Orc Trebuchet: I can't break through those walls! Also Orc Trebuchet: I can break through an entire mountain!

[@SeenInMirrors]

Trebuchet is bipolar.

[@ryanc6767]

Hey look this bucket can explode!

[@LinardsZ]

@@SeenInMirrors lmao

[@nemlas85]

bECauSe mAGic.

[@Njordin2010]

Magic elven wall chad vs mountain virgin

[@SocialRegressive]

Talking with my wife, I think the best explanation for modern literature, movies, and television is that they are created by people who have never actually done anything. It's not that they're unintelligent (well, OK, maybe); they have no experience in anything. Force-feed those guys false narratives about the nature of the world and humanity, convince them they write real good-like, and you get The Rings of Power.

[@fomobull4187]

They also seem to be full of themselves and have high self esteem. Some people would have asked for other peoples opinions, discussed scenes, studied history, made a mock scene and tested it on an audience, played devil's advocate, played what-if, etc. Not JD Payne and Patrick McKay. The show runners know everything. As seen by how they fire back at the audience.

[@JaMeshuggah]

Created by Jews and Marxist women*

[@youteacher78]

It's wild that such a high value production can't at least hire a battle specialist. On the other hand, in many cases the specialist just give up because they are being dismissed all the time for "ruining the spectacle". Studios have since long decided to please the lowest common denominator.

[@JaMeshuggah]

@@SocialRegressive they're created by people with tiny hats

[@Joshua-k1y]

They don't even read the source material

[@brandonjarvis1987]

Imagine trying to 1-up the terrible shite that was the defense of winterfell from GoT

[@0ctopusComp1etely]

I was thinking about that the whole intro. I'm legitimately not sure which one is worse, but I dare not compare them further. I don't want an aneurism.

[@morrogin5986]

RoP team saw how shit winterfell was: "Hold my beer"

[@mattimeo7612]

That scene where the elf chick gets hit by arrows from all directions, the one striking her lower left side literally comes up from the ground lol

[@neotronextrem]

The animators were laughing in the studio, at that point they had given up on quality

[@mazz9487]

Reminded me of that one Viking from American Gods.

[@77mpickett]

The orcs were all on one side so did she get friendly fired?!?!?

[@GideonRavenor712]

@@77mpickett That's the same thing I thought when I saw that. There was no way some of those shots could have been fired by Orcs just from the angles, she got clipped by her own guys. Because as we all know, Elves with centuries of experience, heightened senses, and effectively perpetual youth are known for missing, right?

[@tomwalker8944]

@@GideonRavenor712 Probably from the elves standing next to the magical orcish TNT storage unit who didn't want to get exploded. They were like "You dumb bitch, stop trying to blow us up."

[@hartattack2739]

It blows my mind that not a single orc has a shield.... they're just standing there, waiting to get shot.

[@citizenofcorona8783]

they only had a budget of $1 billion

[@firenze6478]

They are the darknuts from legend of neil. Ganon had to make budget cuts

[@Adelina-293]

Such a shame a basic buckler now costs 1,000,000,001 gold pieces.

[@Br4dSp34d]

they're protected by the power of family

[@linming5610]

Not even a ditch to protect themselves because they dont have shields?

[@seefoghall]

As soon as Drinker name-dropped Shad I couldn't wait for this video ! The best part, Shad doesn't mention Twilight.

[@brycehowell2560]

Twilight? I don’t understand… I know you are referring to the IP, but I don’t understand the exact reference…

[@seefoghall]

@@brycehowell2560 on Friday Night Tights Shad loves bringing up Twilight 😉.

[@GeraltofRivia22]

​@@brycehowell2560 Shad defends Twilight because the author is a Mormon.

[@councilofkarens729]

Of course Shad didn't mention Twilight. He's not going to tank viewership of his own channel! Doesn't matter when he's on Gary's channel though. 🤣

[@councilofkarens729]

@@GeraltofRivia22 unlike the RoP authors, who are Morons.....

[@Duke_of_Lorraine]

I wonder when Hollywood will understand that people interested in historical and fantasy movies often overlap with people who have some understanding of basic strategy thanks to strategy games and wargames. Thus, some tactics that make sense are expected by a significant portion of the target audience.

[@Certifiedgooner]

Or tactics that are consistent with the setting the story takes place in. World War 2 dogfights does not work in space, but it is consistent in the Starwars universe. Hyper driving a ship another ship, can’t tell which way is up on a planet surface, or replacing the antiquated Y-wing with a slow ship filled with bombs, raises questions from the fan base.

[@Duke_of_Lorraine]

@@Certifiedgooner all I could think about when watching this scene were calculations : at lightspeed, kinetic energy is half of e=mc2, further multiplied by the Lorentz factor which exponentially increases that the closer you get to the speed of light. 1 gram of matter turns into a nuke. Needless to say, it changes the SW meta a tiny little bit...

[@Scarlet_moon.]

Well if they hired some expert he would tell them that their idea of cavalry stopping from full charge would never happen,in real battle those cavalrymen would charge full force,not even noticing that cage,friendly fire was always part of the deal.

[@Scarlet_moon.]

@@Certifiedgooner but tactics here are consistent,consistently dumb.

[@jeffsmith5436]

Made by lobotomized monkeys, for lobotomized monkeys😂

[@TwoKnowingRavens]

I love horses. I have the modern equivalent of a medieval type warhorse. Destrier 1) A Cavalry charge needs 100-200ft to truly get up to speed, fine. 2) A warhorse, in armor, with an armored rider, lance down, full speed 30+mph 3) Stops within 10ft??? You couldn't stop a charge of humans on foot that quickly. Half of those elves would have been run-over by their allies behind them, they all would have died then and there. Alternately had they completed the charge they would have washed those totally unprepared orcs off the battlefield in seconds saving thousands of lives.

[@incandescent9525]

Even if we put aside Helm's Deep and Minas Tirith battles, remember that few minutes flashback from the Fellowship, when united armies fought Sauron. Elrond giving orders, arrows fly past him, but he doesn't even flinch because he has complete trust in each of his soliders. The orcs army charges closer to the elven ranks like an avalanche, yet they draw their blades like a single organism, taking the blow without a singe step back. That was PURE CINEMA. Imagine if we could get more of THAT kind of battles in RoP? Meanwhile the scenario for this one looks like it was stolen from a Looney Tunes episode.

[@kevinfanning8027]

Ummmm, Elrond does NOTICEABLY flinch as the arrows fly past his head. Please watch the scene again, you can't miss it

[@lennny2218]

A certain level of unrealistic physics and tactical grey areas are fairly normal in most films, but this is so profoundly dumb and poorly planned it offends the intelligence of the audience. And they're trying SO hard to be Battle of Helms Deep 2.0. Its just sad at this point.

[@kaltaron1284]

This is more like Battle of Helm's Deep 0.0.1 pre-Alpha tech demo. That crashes every few seconds.

[@Kanaxe]

I believe that they honestly though the Battle of Winterfell was much better than the Battle of Helms Deep, and took it as an example.

[@Adam-mo6gf]

Unfortunately the real audience of this type of show have no intelligence to offend. They just consume. I know plenty of people who lap this shit up “derp, it’s a Tv show derp, you shouldn’t overthink it”

[@Kanaxe]

@@Adam-mo6gf Some people just want to watch a show and not think about anything, and I respect that, but because I have high expectations (for a show that expensive, from the marketing they did, and from the adaptation point), I can't ^^

[@Adam-mo6gf]

@@Kanaxe that’s fine, I’m the same sometimes and would go watch a ‘Commando’ or ‘demolition man’ type film. Tolkien’s work should never ever be in the category of ‘no brainer entertainment’, the guy created a world with its own history and languages, it’s such a dishonour to treat it this way.

[@J0hnzie]

The orks waited until the cavalry got THAT CLOSE without killing or ditching their hostage? What was their plan if the cavalry did the objectively right thing and continued the charge? Get lanced? And why on Earth was the elven cavalry formed like that? They were about to slam into the back of eachother's horses as they made contact with the ork formation. Top to bottom incompetence from everyone involved!

[@Scarlet_moon.]

Even if some of the first cavalrymen noticed hostage,that charge wouldn't stop,in reality if they stopped they would just cause casualties among themselves from collisions, Thats what happens when there is not a single person in a room with any logic or history knowledge.

[@jeffsmith5436]

Mostly from the bottom…as in poop 🖕💩🤮

[@thiefofa1073]

It's funny because behind the scenes, you would think it's EXACTLY what they wanted. Some people in forums are saying that when they wrote this into the script, they committed to the actual battle (after the cavalry charge) but then realised they ran out of budget for that episode, or that they didn't know how to resolve the battle in less than 4 minutes (without affecting the remaining episode time). SO what did they do? Yup, stopped the charge and immediate switch to a talking scene - SMH.

[@lotharrenz4621]

Also, the orcs had one elderly orc (how did he get that old?) guard Galadriel who could have freed herself easily by that time. so there was no hostage... but the script said no.

[@NotTheStinkyCheese]

@@lotharrenz4621 never mind that in season 1 (episode 1?) galadriel takes on a troll on her own and kills it with zero effort ... and now she's supposed to be a damsel in distress ? Did she get the Worf treatment ?

[@nicolaspeigne1429]

Warhammer 40k Orks have better logic and consistency, and they can believe things into existence

[@gabrielescaringi9444]

They olso run into machine gun

[@ripstake]

WAAAGH!

[@teomanzeynepyucel5480]

and same sjw people are trying to infect it like they did to LotR

[@nickpaschentis5284]

Orks would think of the mountain falling,send a round rock kicked by Kristianahhh Ronaladaaa and take down the mountain.

[@norrecvizharan1177]

Sort of on that last part. It's really more like they have an ingrained genetic method of like, labeling things with paint so that they know what it's best at. To them, they're just bashing stuff together until it works, but to everyone else, they're turning literal garbage into the equivalent of high end military weapons, spaceships, mechs, etc. Really makes ya wonder as to how scary intelligent they were at the beginning of the setting during the war on heaven (huge fight between literal deities, taking place way before humanity came about in the 40K lore).

[@sarahgould5435]

Shad, don't you know they took Gil-galad's quilted armor right from the Lament for Gil-galad? "His sword was foam, his lance was keen, His harp-shaped helm afar was seen, And every quilt he wore on field Was mirrored in- wait, where's his shield?" Isn't that how it went? Sure, JRR went for more archaic word choice, but "keen" is easier to rhyme than "cool" anyway.

[@tankythemagnorite9855]

😂😂😂 Hilarious

[@Strand0410]

Dying 💀💀

[@ViolentMessiah666]

Been looking forward to this even before Drinker shouted you out, knew as soon as Gary said "battle episode" I still remember the season one battle reaction 😂

[@cuthalion4281]

Here's something Tolkien once said regarding a proposed film adaptation script that never saw the light of day, which also played fast and loose with time and distance: "days are days, miles are miles, and weather is weather."

[@sebastianjost]

it's amazing how in the books, the battles with all the timing makes sense...

[@cuthalion4281]

@@sebastianjost It's almost as if Tolkien spent a lot of effort revising the maps and narrative so that time and geography actually make sense. . .

[@dojelnotmyrealname4018]

​@@cuthalion4281 It's almost as if Tolkien had experienced an actual war and therefore had a decent sense of logistical scale.

[@GideonRavenor712]

Its such a simple thing yet it is EXACTLY what these Showrunners don't care for. -We're given BARELY any sense of time in this show, and no years, not one. As far as we know, both of these seasons occur over barely a few months AT MOST. But the actual events themselves are SUPPOSED to be over years, decades, or in some cases CENTURIES. Most egregious in this season was probably making all Nine Rings for Men in what looks to be roughly 24 hours by ONE smith (Master Smith, but nonetheless, what's the point of that whole team he had?). -For scale, we're given no sense of it. Worst still IMO is season 1 where Galadriel thought it was a viable option to swim BACK across the Great Sea the moment she was at the edge of Valinor's bounds (Meaning she's got thousands of leagues of open water eastward, and no ship would go that way besides ships to Valinor). Arondir makes it IIRC on foot clear across Middle-Earth to be at Eregion in barely any time and only because he happened to get that info off of some random orcs, Khazad-Dum is not a mountain- range spanning sized Dwarf-Kingdom which takes DAYS to cross within its own bounds alone (Meaning Elrond getting to Durin and Durin getting the troops assembled and off to Eregion would not be one day alone), and Adar brought a massive army clear across Middle-Earth and nobody spotted it before it arrived at Eregion's doorstep. Conversely, it takes Galadriel and Elrond forever to move a fraction of the distance when they're headed back to Eregion. -Weather, mostly this series likes to keep playing fast and loose with Light and the Orcs.

[@Retribution8]

Is there anything that locks the siege engine into the ground? Because aside of the stupidity of hammering nails into the stone, the thing my brain kept coming back to was the fact that even if the nails did stick, the engine would activate and launch itself right into the wall and self-destruct because the wall is far heavier than a big crossbow with a log. xD

[@markgrehan3726]

Lol, Yes I hadn't even thought of that.

[@jeffsmith5436]

Them not no how phizziks work 😂

[@jrf2010ification]

@@jeffsmith5436 Well they ARE orcs after all. Intellectual pursuits and studies aren't really their forte

[@John21WoW]

Well you see, that is where the "genious" of having it be pushed somehow through fresh mud comes in, you can claim the mud grounds it when the plot demands it!

[@gabrielcruz6752]

100% raw material for a hilarious parody, that fact about a siege engine not anchored to the ground 😂

[@ESANTAAR_T]

There's a common I've noticed in modern shows... do they even hire profetionals to do the fight choreographs?

[@simonspacek3670]

They don't even read Plch anymore. His book was great, even the short one (about 30 pages) is enough to make a decent fight (up to 6 people, but what do you expect from theatre guy on 30 pages?). The long one (about 190 pages) is more theoretical and it was meant as fighting theory with historical weapons for THEATRE AND MOVIES, to make fights more believable. And it was published in Prague in 1981. For 40 years there is no excuse for any movie to show bad fencing. Not to mention that if you have proper budget, you can send an email to Shad, Skallagrim, Metatron and Lindybeige, fly them to the place and let them make cool battle scenario and also cool personal fights. I have to admit that I don't know how much they would want for this kind of consultation, but 10k each? In a 1.000.000k budget it is 0.05% cost (with flights and accommodation) and it would be amazing!

[@LegendaryDorkKnight]

That female elf who thought she was Boromir got hit from so many different directions that it's impossible for me to think some of the elves didn't also tag her too.

[@pavelslama5543]

Lord of the Rings (visual adaptation): 1) Also a fantasy, like Rings of Power 2) Also has sieges 3) During the siege of Helm´s Deep, the uruks are unable to destroy the mountainside, the Deeping wall, and even struggle against the gate. Its only once they lay explosives directly underneath the wall when they can finally bring it down (or more specifically - blow up). 4) Their long ladders cannot be erected by sheer manpower, they require a pulley and anchor system. 5) During the siege of Minas Tirith, the orcs are unable to destroy the city walls. They are limited to shooting off the crenellations, and wrecking city houses. Their catapults have a short range, and are limited to the lowest level of the city. Their firepower initially also significantly lags behind the firepower of the massive defensive trebuchets on the city walls. 6) The battering ram made out of an iron braced wooden log is unable to break the huge city gate. 7) They require a huge battering ram with massive steel head and incredible inertia. ... All in all, its very obvious that you can make a fantasy siege look believable and logical. These show makers however clearly decided to make it ridiculous. The most likely reason for it that first comes to my mind is just cultural vandalism - the desire to destroy the legacy of established works.

[@sjoerdderks4731]

In lord of the rings, orcs and uruk hais have simple yet effective realistic tatics. Orcs let troll push their towers, catapults and the wolfshead (GROUND! GROUND!) Uruk hai only had the gunpowder to blow up the wall wich halves helms deep defense and overpower the other half

[@sjoerdderks4731]

In lord of the rings, orcs and uruk hais have simple yet effective realistic tatics. Orcs let troll push their towers, catapults and the wolfshead (GROUND! GROUND!) Uruk hai only had the gunpowder to blow up the wall wich halves helms deep defense and overpower the other half

[@benjaminthibieroz4155]

Lord of the rings is realistic siege tactics made cooler with the inclusion of fantasy elements (trolls, flying nazguls, giant weapons,...) Rings of power is people who think fantasy is just an excuse to shove all form of logic down the toilets. I love the combination of historical warfare and fantasy done right, and it gave us many fantastic scenes. This, is the template of how NOT to do it.

[@marioharrer9999]

@@sjoerdderks4731 its not ground but Grond named after the hammer used by Morgoth.

[@Firefrab]

@@marioharrer9999 the way tolkein describes grond's arrival in the books is so sick, the way he builds up a battering ram into this legendary weapon

[@foldionepapyrus3441]

Even if accept all the BS of that wall breaker, so it doesn't pull out the nail and give them every benefit of the doubt of putting the nails in (perhaps a team a masons were drilling that hole in advance or whatever) that siege engine can't weigh so much more than the wall that it isn't going to be pulled violently back into the wall itself. At best its a single use weapon suicidal weapon as Newton still applies so that weapon is going to really move and splatter itself against the wall bits its pulled out.

[@timl.b.2095]

Good observation. I'm kinda surprised Shad (and I) didn't note that.

[@rememberstayangry2366]

I knew something else was bothering me with this scene. The machine is on wheels. The front is not braced against forward movement. The rear is not weighed down to prevent it from raising up.

[@kaltaron1284]

And if it somehow had enough mass it would make it even less likely that they could move it through the riverbed. It would sink within seconds.

[@foldionepapyrus3441]

@@kaltaron1284 Well they did somehow remember to put mat under its wheels to help move it... But yes its utterly stupid.

[@kaltaron1284]

@@foldionepapyrus3441 That mat would have to made out of at least steel and cover a large surface to do any good.

[@a_kazakis]

Don't forget, Alexander the Great during the siege of Tyre had his army build a land bridge over the OCEAN with the length of 1km (0.6 miles) over the period of seven months, through storms and enemy artillery. He did that in 332 b.c.!! And it was so well built that it never fell apart, but instead became part of the topography and today Tyre is not an island, but part of the mainland. But I guess that was not fancy enough for Amazon to recreate.

[@AmyThePuddytat]

There's no ocean at Tyre.

[@VespoLiveGaming]

@@AmyThePuddytat maps.app.goo.gl/Ew9w6uanBVYEpoAG8 looks like ocean to me

[@VespoLiveGaming]

The original city was the tip of the piece sticking out into the sea- it was an island until 332 BC. The parts connecting it to shre now we're built up on and around Alexander's siege construction.

[@TheEddagosp]

The orks are laying siege from a pretty sizable forest. They could've built a floating bridge while bombarding the area near the point of contact. This is so absurd.

[@tritonk1759]

Holy shit that's cool as hell.

[@thewrongguy1]

One thing i realized when Shad was mentioning the river blockage. With how the episode ends i wont be surprised if in the next episode theres a "salvation" from the river breaking through the rubble and washing away the orcs so we can get yet another call back with Elrond and the water in fellowship.

[@TankHunter678]

Also the Fall of Isengard, where the Ents broke the damn and flooded the place to kill the Orcs en-mass.

[@turbogeschwindigkeit6180]

I don't remember what movie it was anymore, but there was an interview about an old movie and how they came up with these kinds of sieges. The idea is to get 2 writers and they're supposed to try to make a scenario where they're trying to invade each other, so that there's a natural back and forth between raid and defense tactics. Here, its obvious that it was one guy who had an idea of what would look "cool" and nobody pointed out how stupid his ideas are.

[@Likexner]

Pulling stones from the wall? _Pulling_ ? There is no word in the tongues of men for such stupidity.

[@kaimelis]

"who would do such stupidity"

[@Will_Parker]

The worst part is the stone they rip out is like a quarter of what they need to get through the wall. It takes so little stone out that it never actually accomplished anything. Every single siege weapon the orcs used in LotR, the explosives, the ladders, the towers, GROND, is used and used effectively. This thing doesn't accomplish anything at all.

[@kamenriderkfp6684]

You can't expect people who deny the very facts of reality to be able to comprehend the basic functions of Science

[@reforgenarsil]

Love this statement 👍

[@Frithonor]

This describes the political right to a T. Allegory? 🤔

[@Prince_Phaedru]

@@Frithonor nah, you're just doing mental gymnastics

[@SteveWhite-x1g]

​@@Frithonor cope

[@silverhawkscape2677]

The fact Shad is a Mormon makes this even better.

[@polishFantasyEN]

Aw yeah, I've been waiting for this every since CD mentioned you.

[@gamingisfuniloveit8526]

Same 😂

[@alinedarosaalves]

Same :D

[@davidgreenwood6029]

I'm no martial arts expert, but I think that kick the forgettable elf did was capoeira basically. Just wanted to point out the only martial arts type stuff, they chose Brazilian dance fighting to show. I'm not sure how to put into words how funny of a choice that is, out of every martial art, they chose the one that is more about dancing than fighting. Its like someone doing tai chi in battle.

[@merakimelodies8931]

I love Shadiversity and The Critical Drinker, and I love seeing both of you take on this mess. 😂😊 “Charge them, and they scatter!”-Tolkien, charging a line of cars to get them to move in a traffic-jam. 😂 It would have been cool to maybe see the elves pull a Horatius At The Bridge and remove the other bridges and defend the remaining bridge valiantly, rather than the designers simply removing the bridges and breaking continuity. About the wall: nope, there’s not much fixing that. 😂😅

[@Ptaaruonn]

They are throwing the same stones that made the temple of the Acolyte.

[@dephyr788]

I think they are the ones from the bridge that prevented Elrond and Galadriel from traveling. xD

[@mehowme]

Nice. I'm not the only one who thought of the lesbian space witches when Shad mentioned burning stone.

[@killerkev3]

Except this is much better than acolyte

[@mehowme]

@@killerkev3 I'm gonna press X on this. They are both abysmal in their own ways.

[@Grabehn42]

"So in this scene they defend the wall - What wall? - Shut up Tommy, there's now a wall." And THAT is how Eregion got a wall in one day.

[@VainerCactus0]

But did the Orcs pay for it?

[@GideonRavenor712]

Yep, they didn't think anyone would notice Eregion did not have any walls in season 1, and no reason to build ones before the Orc army arrives. Apparently they just called them up from the ground, bunch of Earth-Benders apparently, these Elves.

[@therandman85]

Watching this I was reminded of a quote from DragonBall Z Abridged Vegeta's nose starts to bleed Nappa: "You ok ?" Vegeta: "Yes just an aneurysm out of sheer stupidity."

[@silvertail7131]

To be honest, I'd probably not know the force and distance a trebuchet is capable of, and I wouldn't really notice the lack of sufficient ladder tactics performed, though might eventually wonder why we're not seeing the walls overwhelmed. But then, the makers of a show don't need to know these details. That's what subject matter experts are for, and I know a topic like medieval warfare would be on my list of experts to keep on the project if I was making a show like this.

[@TurboRoggy]

The cavalry with a handbrake. Neat. From what I remember from history lessons, once you start a cavalry charge, it's close to impossible to stop it. Horses go into some kind of frenzy, you're in a tight formation and it's incredibly loud. These are just a few factors to consider.

[@glorialiedtke8931]

Also pretty dangerous because the first may be able to stop in time but not the second, third etc. Suddenly stopping in a tightly-packed group of riders without warning just means that everyone is gonna crash into each other.

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

actually halting a cavalry charge happened fairly often. ofcaurse that is during the slower phase of the charge, unlike holliwood charges were slower untill the last minute partly to preserve stamina, partially to make it easier to maintain formation, and partially to allow more oportunity for the charge to be aborted.

[@glorialiedtke8931]

@@matthiuskoenig3378 thank you, I wasn't aware of the different phases of a cavalry charge.

[@simonspacek3670]

@@glorialiedtke8931 Like a plane take-off. You first prepare for it, then you get in the position, then you start, then you hit V1 (last moment to say "nope, we are not doing it, abort, go back, this is wrong") and then V2 (this is "now we move so fast that we have to get in the air and if we have any problem, we will have to deal with it there"). With cavalry you are looking for some weak point (or you just go all in and try to smash through), then you charge, but if suddenly a much more pikes appear or they pull out a cannon and get ready to change your horse in meatloaf, you may still have time to stop it (or at least change direction and not get completely smashed) and make a new plan.

[@dragons_advocate]

The damming of the river would be even more uneffective than you think. Water has weight, and a lot of moving water has a lot of force behind it. Those falling rocks would be swept, if not long way downstream, at least so far out of the way until the same amount of water the river carried before could continue to flow unimpeded.

[@niamsidri]

Furthermore, Eregion is surrounded by not one but TWO rivers... there is another river flowing from the eastern side of Eregion. even if you dam the western river, the riverbed will eventually get refilled by the other river. the stupidest part is, it was the showrunners who decided to let the audience know "Eregion was defended by two rivers and thick walls"....

[@kaltaron1284]

And even if the dam works, guess where the water gets diverted to. Oh yes, the bank the Orcs are on. Oopsie...

[@beowulfsrevenge4369]

Even without the second river (and completely ignoring realty,) if that did dam the river successfully. The river bed would still be a swamp of mud and silt for a long time. Foot soldiers would have a bad enough time trying to get across, and unless you're reinforcing the river bed and basically creating a road, you're not getting any siege engines across. They'd have been better off building boats and rafts to supplement the bridges that were already there.

[@jrconway3]

@@niamsidri Gilgalad literally pointed out early in the season how Eregion (actually Ost-in-Edhil, Eregion is the region, but they aren't using the city's actual name) was protected by two rivers. They seemingly completely forgot about that fact in this episode.

[@kaltaron1284]

@@beowulfsrevenge4369 Or knock down the walls and then build a pontoon bridge.

[@KingOhmni]

Shad was so very calm and composed that I did indeed think he was making an inhuman effort not to reeeeeeee for one hour straight. Bravo sir, bravo.

[@Señor-Donjusticia]

And you know what the defense will be? “We’ll the LOTR trilogy was dumb too.” First: No. while it is true there were silly things like the Legolas shield skateboard, overall the battle tactics were FAR more logical and realistic than this mess. Second: It’s interesting that the defense of Rings of Power always has to consist of tearing down what came before. It’s never defending the show on its own merits.

[@BetaRayBill32]

Your second point is consistent across most current iterations of beloved franchises. For example, anything in Star Wars is forgivable because a stormtrooper bumped his head in 1977.

[@duncanmcokiner4242]

The only dumb strategy in LOTR was charging Osgiliath, and that was called out as dumb by everyone because it was clearly Denethor losing his mind.

[@funkydiscogod]

I thought the Legolas Shield Skateboard was meant to be comic relief during the battle.

[@Tyarrk]

@@funkydiscogod funny thing is, it´s technically possible to do with enough training. Not sure why you would though.

[@Certifiedgooner]

They could have consulted a historian about how medieval sieges/battles worked, they could’ve had the orcs build siege towers or ballistas on ships. Some like Alexander the Great and the siege of Tyre.

[@Mike_Firestarter]

Can't stress how much I love that Critical Drinker has tagged you o that clip :))))))))))))))))))))

[@QazwerDave]

Mine the mountain into the dam. Fill in the riverbed to create firm land bridge Soften the gate or wall or towers or merlons with trebuchets, to soften archer's ability to repell oncomers Then, ladders ! Ram against just the side of a wall seems of limited use. Just scrap the weird device. A cav charge into a dry river bed seems impossible. Stakes between the forrest and landbridge would make sallying to interupt the siege impossible, and stop any back up cav charge

[@strongandco]

Todays writers seem to think they can bash out any old rubbish and leave it down to editors and CGI to make them look good, not realising how well educated some of the most beloved story tellers of the day were and the crazy amount of research many of them undertook before producing their books and films.

[@nahfuck7080]

that's why I don't even watch movies/shows anymore I just play games which have tons of research for something they don't need to do much like these shit shows.

[@tomwalker8944]

It's why all good story telling is grounded in reality.

[@DMAN699669]

I think what’s happening here is that this show is the history of Middle Earth as told by an orc scholar, at the very end it’ll be like Never Ending Story where it cuts to a book (made of human leather) shutting and an old orc saying “An dats da troof of it awl”

[@Likexner]

Im trying to imagine an orc scholar and its very funny.

[@jeffsmith5436]

Dem riters Dey not no how fizziks works😂

[@dodojesus4529]

Its the grugling

[@lippoe]

If this was actually how the series ended I might give them a pass. Bravo, sir. 👏

[@arkenarikson2481]

You want to expect that something dropped will fall? - You do remember why boats float...

[@Disgruntled_Grunt]

Because they are optimists! Damn rocks just have bad attitudes.

[@mehowme]

​@@Disgruntled_Grunt The rocks shoot off the trebuchets in this episode must've looked up. Perfect explanation of the range.

[@Doncroft1]

Boats only look up!!!

[@spiffs2septims730]

I was going to write a comment but watching this bilge has dammed the wellspring of my thought. I dont even have any anger left, just haze. Good night and may God forgive you Shad for sharing this with us.

[@TapChanek]

Everybody says they waited since Critical Drinker mentioned you but I actually was waiting since I saw first videos (I'm not bumping up the audience to RoP by myself, just 3 initial episodes of S1) reviewing this episode. I'm European so when I saw the "battle" I immediately thought of wrestling compared to MMA. If Helm's Deep seemed like watching Emalianenko or CroCop fights (tho it's not physics-accurate on it's own) then this just look like watching John Cena or Hulk Hogan. From Temu.

[@frankvandorp9732]

Imagine thinking you can stop an entire army from attacking you just by taking a single hostage. And worse, Elrond knew that Galadriel went to fight Adar, so he could have known there was a large chance she had been captured by him. This shouldn't even surprise him, let alone cause him to stop the charge.

[@Allmightyimortal]

Honestly, they are elves. could literally have just shot half the orc holding her hostage and everyone around them. They do remember Elves are amazing archers...right?

[@MrPablosek]

@@Allmightyimortal Ah, well, you see, in that moment every single elf had a collective amnesia and they forgot that they can use bows.

[@neotronextrem]

They manage to make Galadriel even less likeable, by being singlehandedly responsible for the fall of Eregion and the slaughter of the elven army LOL

[@Rawrshuga]

What could have been done was: - 1) Elven scouts discover the large orc army approaching. Elves are confident that between the river, the defensible bridges, and their approaching dwarven allies they can win out. They only need hold out until dawn. 2) Night bombardment commences. City is targeted, not walls. A charge is anticipated on the bridges. No charge occurs. 3) Bombardment continues devastating the city. Many citizens, not soldiers are killed. Elves cannot simply sit back. Cavalry is sent to engage the trebuchets. 4) Orcs retreat back into the forest. Cavalry chases them expecting to find the Orc encampment, but desperate to stop the bombardment. 5) Cavalry find the forest creepily empty, aside from evidence of a large camp and the abandoned siege engines. 6) Reveal. The ground beneath the city shakes, a large sinkhole appears and the huge orc army flows out of the hole. The bombardment was a cover. First to create noise of the target area to give the tunnelling orcs information on where to tunnel up to (as foreshadowed in Season 1). Second to drop fire sources for light and for a future purpose later. 7) Orcs swarm out toward the two bridges in order to gain control of the city. Interior defenders fight bravely but are easily overwhelmed. Elon's cavalry are trapped outside the walls, their defences now working against them. 8) Elon's cavalry desperately use the orc's trebuchets to breech the walls or gate and fight into the city, fully expecting the dwarf reinforcements to arrive soon. 9) Orcs set the city ablaze (with the fires launched in the night before). Thick ashen smoke fills the atmosphere as the last of the elven defenders are slaughtered. 10) Dawn comes, and through the thick haze of ash the sun takes on an ominous red hue (reminiscent of the Eye of Sauron) and in the red glow of burning dawn it reveals... the dwarven reinforcements are not coming. Elon, Gilgalad and the remaining cavalry flee the ruined city as it finally is totally overrun by the Orc army as overhead burns the red sun and the fires of destruction.

[@PromptCriticalJello]

I don't know, if Elon's cybertruck charge didn't work, surely the dwarves would have arrived in time via the Hyperloop. I'm genuinely sorry. I just had to point out the auto correct. 😁

[@Rawrshuga]

@@PromptCriticalJello 🤣 nice one!

[@michaelkeegan9260]

Infinitely better story. Characters with intelligent thoughts being forced into high risk tactics by the situation at hand, discovering they have been duped by a smarter opponent, forced into using the weapons of their enemies to destroy the work of their own hands in desparation, only to abandon hope at the discovery of the betrayal by the dwarves. Tunneling under a river would be highly dangerous. Could have scores of orcs dying in tunnel collapses and flooding but eventually succeeding through sheer numbers and reckless disregard for their own safety. Would really showcase their more animalistic mentality.

[@benjaminthibieroz4155]

@@michaelkeegan9260 Also it would take weeks to dig a tunnel that long.

[@benningtoncheemingwan9168]

Like the Locust from Gears of War and their E-holes. And it would make sense given how much Orcs hate the Sun.

[@daruphir]

Having spent a lot of time undamming rivers in the swamp I agree with you Shad, likely the daming of the river would fail. The soil composition judging from terrain would not be suitable to assisting in daming those minigaps and microfissures as you mentioned. In looser soils the dirty, mud and clay would actually make it to where they become a natural cement

[@maxwellseear3246]

Most anticipated video since the release of this season two battle 🎉

[@marychocolatefairy]

I love Shad's 90 minute autopsy/rant about the s1ep6 battles, so I was very much looking forward to this. Especially as this ep was made by most of the same people- 3 out of 4 of the credited writers (Justin Doble and the 2 showrunners) and director Charlotte Brandstrom. BTW the only reason I know this is because the ridiculousness of the dam being made from the mountain had me looking up if this ep had been done by the same people that did the infamous volcano episode. And yep.

[@Kusina_at_Patalim]

Rings Of Power is an insult and abomination to LOTR, The Hobbit & anything related to Middle Earth.

[@adpistols]

it's insult to logic men. It's way beyond being insult to Tolkien. :):):):) It's just burning money. They honestly should just give it to homeless people in LA - everybody would be happier and Amazon would have better marketing :):):):)

[@aro_ger_]

To me, Rings of Power is just.. a VERY Bad Fan Fiction of Middle-Earth.

[@jeffsmith5436]

It’s an insult to anybody with an IQ higher than their shoe size

[@jeffsmith5436]

@@aro_ger_It’s only fan fiction in the sense that the writers are throwing crap into a fan and labeling it “fiction” 💩💩💩🖕🤮

[@DisorderedArray]

​@@aro_ger_it's not really Squirrelking quality, that's for sure.

[@m.b.boyack2228]

From the show that brought you simultaneously both the weakest and most devastating pyroclastic flow ever, created by the largest steam induced volcanic explosion, from a non sealed/pressurized vessel, ever. Is this 'battle' any surprise.

[@YtheTie]

Just think about the attack on Gondor when it comes to Artillery: Trebuche with Heads, Trebuche with rubble, Towers, Battering Ram, Fell Beasts. You know what each of these attacks are trying to do, how good they are at doing it and how succsessfull the plan was.

[@beowulfsrevenge4369]

They concentrated their forces on the gate. The weakest part of the defenses. They had siege towers to try to go over the walls, and they were causing chaos in the city. They tried their best to disrupt the Gondorian soldiers while they breached the city. They also didn't have a river/river bed to contend with.

[@marcin8112]

I agree with everything apart from the earthened ramp idea. The Masada ramp you’ve shown in the picture was built to reach a fortress on a hilltop, there was no water anywhere around it. While it might have worked there, there’s no way you could build a ramp in a big flowing river by just dumping „buckets of dirt” in it. Even if you somehow managed to build one, river would just overflow. So your idea is just as bad and unbelievable as shows mountain dam idea. They should just siege Eregion by bridges and boats

[@uvicjames]

They should have just crossed one of the rivers upstream even if it took a few more days. The siege engines seemed to have enough range to hit the city from miles away so they could have stayed across the river.

[@jensschmieder6126]

i know its way to late to mention this but it is possible alexander the great did build a landbridge spanning around 1km into the mediterranean sea to reach the former island of Tyre and the fortress build on it.

[@tomwalker8944]

I mean you just cross the river on the back side of the city, then walk around to wall. Which is exactly why this place would be easy to take in reality. All of that wall is useless if you just come at it from the cliffside. There is a reason they built fortifications on the high ground. I mean the wall butts into a slope. Just walk over the slope... And worst we're talking a few meters of earthworks. Which you could literally push down the hill. If you didn't notice they had explosives.

[@balazsszucs7055]

I love when youtubers I follow do a collab. Like the crossover events DC does every few years

[@chillgoblin9103]

It isn't hubris, it's toxic positivity. They're so busy clapping each other backs in fear of offending one another that they can't write anything half decent anymore.

[@lucofparis4819]

Did you learn this somewhere, or are just guessing? I'm guessing nobody with half a brain in the extensive crew had any chance to say anything to the higher ups who decided everything while being completely disconnected from reality. That's not toxic positivity, that's artistic tyranny. I pity the poor costume designers, set designers, and CGI artists who had to produce all this shitty work. It must have been horrible, especially if they liked Tolkien's work and thought they could contribute to adapting it.

[@NahBoiiiii]

@@lucofparis4819if you can’t stand up to your boss and tell them they’re making a mistake then you’re not worth hiring. And if your response is, “well, their boss has a boss, so it’s moot.” Well if your boss can’t stand up to their boss, then they’re unworthy of a management position. I see your point, but OP’s point still stands. Everyone is too afraid to criticize and critique their colleagues work, especially in the corporate creative space. But hell, that’s an oxymoron in and of itself. It’s truly a miracle that decent movies come out from major studios from time to time.

[@lucofparis4819]

@@NahBoiiiii You said it yourself, if fear drives them to mediocrity, that's on them. But the smoke kinda gave the fire away: if it's a company-wide problem, it's no longer an employee issue anymore, because that means either HR is specifically targeting the cowardly employee profile, or the higher ups are indeed bulluing and terrorizing their minions, who now fear being fired and shunned out industry at every step. Either way, to me that's _not_ positivity, toxic or otherwise. However, if the crew is either cowardly or under threat of shunning, it does incapacitate them as I'm guessing. So what do you think? Is my guess as good as his after all? Or did I make a mistake somewhere?

[@NahBoiiiii]

@@lucofparis4819 you make a good point, and yes, your guess is as good as his. Having said that, I think what he means is “fake positivity”, which is developed out of fear. Think about people living in totalitarian states who are required to clap and salute for every little “great thing” the ruling regime does. You are afraid to criticize your coworkers so instead you fake being supportive at the office or whatnot, maybe in an attempt to fly under the radar or maybe you think you can steer them quietly. Either way it amounts to the same thing. I think it’s a mix of 3 kinds of people: those who are scared to draw negative attention to themselves and thus get blacklisted in the industry, so they feign positivity to be in the social circle of their corporate compatriots. They fear being ostracized so they fake and hide their thoughts for fear of not being in the “in-group.” And the other is those that are protected by that atmosphere due to their social status, company power or politics. And of course, the last kind are the morons that support them.

[@Rawrshuga]

20:00 Even if those nails held, the laws of physics dictate that the massive wall would have just pulled the device into it rather than it pulling the stones out of the wall.

[@xiii0722]

Exactly, those were my first thoughts as well

[@cjodendal3182]

I've seen Bollywood battle scenes that make more logical sense than this.

[@Zombiewithabowtie]

I'm genuinely prepared to give "Soldiers form into a shield barrel and launch themselves over castle walls via palm trees" a pass at this point.

[@cjodendal3182]

@@Zombiewithabowtie lol

[@linming5610]

​@@Zombiewithabowtieat least it looks good and can pull your emotions as you turn off your brain.

[@mala6238]

And they are more fun.

[@michellembaeze2010]

Baahubali😅

[@PBRatLord]

Great video Shad! Still waiting on you to give us a proper and historical Nunchuku video, as well as the rest of the improvised weaponry from the Boxer Rebellion! I know they aren't what the movies make them, but there is genuine historical usage of them, even if they weren't effective.

[@siko-society5635]

Nice of the elven army to blare the round 2 horn lol.

[@AscendantStoic]

I still can't get over the fact they put horse armor only on the horse backs (i suppose to protect from falling arrows) but not in the front or sides where they are more likely to get hit with spears/pikes/long swords and even arrows, wtf 😅

[@jittersgc]

It's like this was written by someone with a child's understanding of warfare, physics and geography, which is most likely true. I can only imagine the script reading like this: "And then... And then... And then... And then...".

[@Kanaxe]

That's the best summary of this show I have ever seen. No logic, no consequences, just things happening one after the other.

[@knappster1754]

Please don't insult the intelligence of children.

[@lotharrenz4621]

@@knappster1754 I actually had classmates who would tell a story like that. taking a hectic breath every sentence, too... at the age of 14.

[@scottski02]

10 year old me with Legos and dinosaur models could have created a better battle than this

[@OurAwesomeUniverse]

The oil exploding is the best. Shad's reaction is priceless. There's even a blip of the wounded archer with a "huh!??" look on her face while it's going on!

[@OurAwesomeUniverse]

I also want to say that the trebuchet projectiles maintaining their kinetic energy at such altitude gain augments the insanity. Conservation of energy means they should lose KE the higher they go. But no, they still have the force to destroy the side of the mountain!

[@khaldaeras7038]

Not to mention the 'wall yanker' machine seemed like it would destroy itself after one pull cause they show tons of rock and stone flying right at the siege machine (pains me to even call it a siege machine) lol

[@cbcastlecastillo144]

Never did realize but you have Mistborn and Tress in the background! Love the Sanderson works. Would love a video on the weapons and armors found throughout the Sanderverse sometime!

[@FilipeLeviSilva]

6:30 It's quite simple, really. If no "magic system", "sci-fi tech" or other special worldbuilding detail is in effect, then you should always defer to the natural laws of physics.

[@lostalone9320]

Even when there IS magic or super-science, things run on normal physics unless they tell us they do something else. Magic trebuchet that glows from within with arcane fire? No problems. Cosmic-alloy trebuchet with hyper-velocity springs? All good. But just a hunk of wood? No.

[@captain_context9991]

Its AMAZING that we live in a time where there is now a second season of Lord of the Rings, and I dont even care to notice that it exists... Just incredible.

[@durinV]

Lets not forget that Elves archers failing to put proper volley after volley of arrows into the enemies pushing the "remove nail machine", those werent scared humans from a random town, but 2nd AGE ELVISH ARCHERD FROM A CAPITAL CITY! ...

[@GideonRavenor712]

Yea, most of these Elves don't act like they have at least a few centuries of experience, if not more, unlike in LOTR where you get the impression: "Okay, these are very professional soldiers, but there's not many of them left and they're not invincible.". And the ones that do come off as more competent are too much in the other direction to where they look comical and are trying way too hard. There is no in-between.

[@Eienias]

EDIT: a spoke too soon, you did talk about the "solid riverbed" to me its got to be the most baffling part of this whole thing which is saying a lot. so many historical records of wet lands, muddy roads and whatnot being the deathknell or at least extremely inconvenient for armies to cross and its just like "eh run across it easy"

[@eschelar]

Saw this on crit's channel and knew this was coming. Saw it and clicked it faster than an elf in rings of power traveling across the entire span of Middle Earth.

[@Merisu_Sheep]

Ever since Critical mentioned Shad I was like the poor dude must be in a padded cell over this. This looks so bad

[@velvetine74]

It amazes me how much money ROP costs to make and they get such basic "Technical Consultant" things so dumb. Do they not have technical consultants or are the technical consultants tearing their hair out at not being listened to?

[@AteshSeruhn]

Any technical consultants have long been disposed of.

[@brianpembrook9164]

The "Technical Consultants" are nodding their heads; "there is enough diversity here." They say. That is all they can see...

[@konardkonrado7755]

seriously im thinking they are dumber than average fantasy fun.I woulnd never came up with such stupid ideas , just need some common sense not even a technical support,war expert ROFL...

[@markgrehan3726]

I can't remember the show or the guy but someone who worked as a Historical Advisor basically said "They mostly politely ignored me and since there wasn't anything I could do to change things why make waves afterwards and jeopardize any future work offers?"

[@jeffsmith5436]

Well, when you “hire” a mentally challenged chimp as a consultant and pocket the consultant fee, then let WokeGPT write the script…

[@matthewneuendorf5763]

A large counterweight trebuchet might push 400 yards, iirc. Saruman was noted for developing incendiaries and explosives, implying that such weapons didn't exist until then. The walls may have been enspelled to make them stronger, which would explain their resistance to artillery. The nail engine shouldn't work against real fortifications, let alone elf-crafted ones. These elves are supposed to have fought and won the wars against Morgoth. Yet instead of superhuman experts with maximal veterancy, they're behaving like unblooded amateurs who haven't even read about warfare, let alone fought for literal centuries against the greatest foe ever to appear on Middle Earth. Roman military manuals discuss cavalry and woods at length. Woods require dismounting and switching from bows to darts and javelins. Elves are immortal and are reborn if killed. Holding an elf hostage should be worthless. Galadriel grew up empowered by the light of Valinor and was as pure and virtuous as any elf (and thus maximally powerful). How mere orcs could take her prisoner and hold her hostage without supernatural backing on the scale of a dragon or a balrog is beyond me.

[@naamadossantossilva4736]

If only there was something of that level available to the orc armies.Maybe a fallen Maiar,possibly even the strongest among them,to lead them and be their champion. Making everything out of order and at the same time was a terrible mistake.

[@uvicjames]

@@naamadossantossilva4736 Well, in all fairness they did give him the old Julius Caesar treatment, forcing him to turn into a puddle of sludge. That was a much much better choice of how to portray Sauron's relationship to the orcs.

[@somerandomguyfromthebeyond1821]

There's also the whole thing about Galadriel being the most powerful elven spellcaster to have live.... even before she got the ring of water

[@GideonRavenor712]

@@naamadossantossilva4736 Exactly. Instead of this stupidly contrived plotline of having Sauron be there and arranging all of this to happen JUST as the Nine are being finished (and he hasn't even done the One yet), why not just do it as the lore intended? Sauron leads the Orcs after testing out the One and finding out Celebrimbor screwed him on the Three, and begins the War of the Elves and Sauron by sacking Eregion himself. It would even get around explaining why a perpetual cloud would follow the Orcs, because they have a powerful fallen Maia protecting them from the sun. Instead of here where none of them question why the sun isn't hitting them (And that perhaps maybe it's Sauron's plan to have them arrive?) This version of the plot also screws Celebrimbor badly, no chance to try to redeem himself.

[@olorin3815]

Well agree on everything except the elf hostage being useless... They revive its true but it could take hundreds or thousands of years before they gain a body again and leave the Halls of Mandos and they can never again come back to Middle Earth, also keep in mind they can also maim and torture etc and not just kill hostages.

[@jeffsmith5436]

Celebimbo: “Holy trollnuts Smellrond, the dork army is charging! What ever shall we do?” Smellrond: “We need a battle plan! Fetch the mentally challenged toddlers!” Cue suspenseful kazoo music…😂

[@tankythemagnorite9855]

Hilarious 😂 I was in hysterics reading this.

[@rafaeldugatto]

Oh man, I laughed so hard with Shad in this one. Great vid!

[@S1030dan]

I am very much doubtful of how much of the "High" part of the "Budget" went in to actual production and costume design and fight choreography, and most importantly the Lore. Compared to some guys pockets.

[@theconstitarian]

A lot of it went to the lore. Amazon has really done a shitty job, but on top of that they got fleeced by the Tolkein estate (not that I blame them). They paid $250 million to the 2nd age content of the appendix of the LotR. They did not even get the rights to the Silmarillion. I think a lot of the problem is they picked showrunners with no experience based solely on the recommendation of JJ Abrams. It is clear nobody at Amazon cared about making a good show, they just wanted the Lord of the Rings name and 3 minutes of flashy content to put in adds.

[@shadow_king12344]

​@@theconstitarianhonesty after the star wars sequels i dont think anybody should take people recommended by jar jar 😅

[@JulieMoran1832]

"some guys pockets" = Simon Tolkien

[@camdenmcandrews]

"Rings of Power" was the final straw that caused me to stop doing business with Amazon entirely. For quite some time I wondered how they had become so stupefyingly stupid. Conclusion: It's the drugs.

[@firenze6478]

Dei

[@mudworks33]

Shad could have done a full hour just on the calvary scene...I've seen children playing with action figures do more coherent battle scenes

[@teomanzeynepyucel5480]

I don't think the writer have enjoyed playing such games during their childhood

[@jeffsmith5436]

Toddlers also write much better dialogue

[@Blobby3822]

Being woke, I suppose the writers played with dolls when they were younger...

[@ion_X]

Oeyy another good old classic style Shad video :D

[@Gool349]

the only thing that this episode got me hyped for was Shads review, thank you!

[@BodHopkins]

That was a funny intro, thought i had the wrong vid until you had your moment shad :)

[@seefoghall]

25:50 that scene, would've had medieval knights on horseback cooming in their armour! Flat plain, far spread targets, no battle lines or pikes...

[@nuclearmedicineman6270]

Any kind of cavalry really; flat ground, that much room to maneuver, no defenses, no archers. Those orcs would stand no chance.

[@beowulfsrevenge4369]

@@seefoghall Not even a shield among the whole hoard.

[@honeybadgerisme]

Yesss! Where were the pikes?!?

[@linming5610]

They blow horns or other instruments to communicate an order. Not too announce something. The rohan cavalry at pellenor fields at the move blew the horn twice: First at the start but i interpret it as a signal to halt since they have 6000 riders and it would take a while to shout orders and second to charge. This show should not exist...

[@AATCathala]

Remember: Guyladriel dealt with a troll by herself, while three male elves need to team up to do it...

[@linming5610]

She could actually do it but with magic.

[@weirdchick257]

​@linming5610 "With magic" What magic? See the problem is what that is they don't actually show that at all!

[@jeffsmith5436]

Cuz she a GIRLBOSS!!!😂

[@jrf2010ification]

Whamen pwer !!

[@xiii0722]

​@@linming5610the lore accurate version, yeah

[@cinematicgamer1]

How the actual heck does a single dam in a river cause the entire river to dry up?

[@coyoteone6197]

I admire your restraint, Shad - I was expecting you to combust over the non-usage of machicolations 😂

[@ChaptermasterPedroKantor-kv5yw]

The makers of this non-show clearly looked really hard at the PJ movies and sought to copy it. But lacking the skill to do so (being diversity hires and Jar Jar Abrams rejects) they could not pull it off, and lets face it, the battle scenes in the PJ movies are deeply flawed as well, full of Hollywood tactics. But PJ made it work because we had an emotional connection to the characters and stories. Things that are completely missing with this non-show. Gilgadaddy can't hold a candle to Theoden. When you like the characters and story you can get away with plotholes big enough to drive a Death Star through. When you despise the characters and story EVERY plothole will grate on you and annoy you.

[@jonathanmitchell3733]

I Can not understand how that show made it to a second season. EVERYONE hates it. The only thing I ever saw of the show was the trailer. Everything about the show is STUPID.

[@Ancorarius_DeusExPodex]

I was deeply shocked when a WoWs streamer I like started to defend the show... his argument: He builds his own opinion and does not just echo some youtuber's opinion. He thinks the battles are alot more enjoyable and if the focus is not on Galadriel it's quite entertaining for a show. In his view, PJ LotR was as much of an insult for book fans as RoP... It made me so sad, because you can't argue with that streamer. He is too full of himself, thinking he sits on a high horse because he watched it himself and anyone critizising it clearly should critisize PJ's trilogy too...

[@naamadossantossilva4736]

It has a 5 season contract.They can't avoid it.

[@j3i2i2yl7]

​@@naamadossantossilva4736 I want Ryan George to recreate the pitch meeting for that contract. Does the contract have a "stop sucking" clause?

[@I_love_bread_and_Hungry_Jacks]

That intro got me, I thought drinker swapped his name & icon as a late april fools, I need schleep

[@veryangryduckpl2122]

Nah, ya dont need schleep

[@jrconway3]

It got me for a second until I remembered I watched the video where Drinker made that comment about Shad. I love how they call back to each other like this its pretty funny.

[@UltraGalaxyify]

You want an example of a better siege? I got one, not from the Lord of the Rings, or Tolkien's works, but from director Ron Howard and produced by George Lucas, Willow. Specifically, the Siege of Nockmaar Castle: The remnants of Castle Galadorn's forces gather before Nockmaar, and after being turned into pigs by Bavmorda's magic and then returning BACK to men by Raziel and protecting the army camp with her magic(rendering the scene moot), the leader of the forces, Airk, along with Madmartigan, and the sorcerers Willow and Raziel come up with a plan to assault Nockmaar. The following day, it seems as though the army had abandoned both Willow and Raziel to face Bavmorda's forces. And after the sorcerers called out for the castle's forces to surrender, a small group is sent out to kill both of them(roughly twenty riders). But this was the plan all along, for Willow gave the signal for the Galadorn forces to rise up under cover and basically bum-rushed the open gate, storming into the keep. This is a little contrived, as it seems to rely on Nockmaar forces being dumb enough to leave the literal front door open, but the plan to draw out a small force to open the gate to a castle is still thousands of times more sound than ANYTHING the writers of this failure of a series could imagine.

[@felmarg8840]

I just saw the type of catapults 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣. I'm literally rolling on the bed in shock hahaha. I haven't watched the series yet, I think I'll watch it all at once for a good laugh. But I couldn't resist watching a video of the fight. The first video I saw didn't show the catapults, but here you show them, in all their stupidity hahahaha. This type of catapults, if I'm not mistaken, have a spring mechanism and have a very short range. They are made to defend a fortress, not to destroy walls because they have a short range and need to be higher. The good version of a catapult, which has a similar structure, is taller and does not have a spoon, but it is like a slingshot with two ropes attached to a strong cloth. These catapults have a much longer range but even they can't throw that far 🤣🤣🤣🤣. Not to mention the mechanics. Unless they're showing them in slow motion there's no way those rocks would fly more than 10 meters 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣.Fun fact. Rivers only have mud along the banks of the river because the current carries the sand away. There's no way there's mud in the middle of a river. this must be an extremely shallow river which is not true because they show how deep the river really is. The so-called protective wall is not a fortress, but simply a river bed. Such walls are 2 times stronger than a castle wall because the pressure of the river will knock it down if it is not. For this city to exist, this wall must be several meters thick. The stones must be glued very very firmly. If a tank fires at such a wall, the projectile will literally bounce back. It is realistically possible to break the first row of stones on the wall of 50 rows. But if this is possible on the other side of the wall there will be dirt or rocks (more likely) the level of the city will be higher, in other words then they will have to dig a hole to climb up and hope the ground doesn't fell, someone wasn't going to meet them with a spear from the arched ends of the tunnel or that they weren't just going to drop a cartload of rocks on top of them. Again I say the land inside the city should be at least 2 meters above the level of the river bottom, minimum. As noted in the video since they have magic catapults, why don't they shoot at the wall itself?🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@theBenStrothmann]

BREAKING NEWS: Experts have confirmed that Rings of Power S2 does, in fact, contain the dumbest battle scene.

[@jeffsmith5436]

This just in: LOTR fans form a committee and decide to throw Payne and McKay off the top of a castle wall as punishment for this blasphemy

[@Disgruntled_Grunt]

I dunno, I think Morfydd Clark's character flopping off her horse in the first season is a strong contender.

[@Disgruntled_Grunt]

@@jeffsmith5436 Slightly-related fact: that is the exact same punishment the elves of Gondolin imposed on Eöl for murdering his wife/trying to murder his son in The Silmarillion.

[@Theseekerofinfinite]

At this point I would not be surprised if this was simply just Amazon experimenting with just how far it could reduce the cumulative IQ of the human race. When the show writers die, the total IQ will go UP.

[@towarzysztatar7961]

Remember Minas-Tirith? I'm missing sieges of such quality

[@H0kram]

This is Minus Derpith

[@vane909090]

Remember when Grond the big badass battering ram threw open the gate and the camera pans to 3 armored trolls coming in? Now that was cool. This troll was useless and died like a little b*tch.

[@Doncroft1]

​@@H0kram 😂 Nice!

[@tankythemagnorite9855]

​@@H0kramor Helms Derp

[@charlieghague]

I'm SO tired of seeing these unorganized battles that turn into a melee. No battles in history ever looked like that. And wedge formations are just dumb. Elrond is literally at the mercy of the entire orc army by being in front of the wedge. It's such a stupid formation that never would work. The armor looks like some weird samurai armor or something too. Everything is just so bad.

[@dodojesus4529]

@@charlieghague there were some. City battles can get really ugly and messy, this isnt that so youre dtill mostly right. The armor is cheap larp stuff

[@haewymetal]

Worth noting is that in Season 2, during the night shot of Eregion the city, after Adar shows his army to Galadriel. It doesnt have a wall either. It looks like the season 1 shot.

[@kh_1984]

One does not simply stop a company of calvary at full charge in wedge formation in less than 100 feet.

[@VespoLiveGaming]

@@charlieghague to be fair- wedge formations for cavalry worked great for Alexander the Great to punch through weak points in enemy battle lines. The difference was that Alexander was a tactical genius, and the writers of ROP are drooling morons.

[@dodojesus4529]

@@kh_1984 especially when continuing means victory. Not even kidding, they keep going adars dead and the orc army leaderless.

[@Bluefiree]

I think the Orcs have access to Tunnelworms or something, to destroy the mountain or even better, tunnel under the river and maybe even under the wall?

[@krzysztofratajski9218]

4 km? No .... more , much more. I living in mountains, and it may look as such. But experience tells me more.

[@beowulfsrevenge4369]

Who knew orcs in Mordor had modern petrochemicals, modern propelents, and explosives?

[@arjenlaan4103]

Dunno, I have not seen any episode of the series. But, didn't they have a Witch King, a evil Maia, and a Morgoth-essence--imbued Middle-Earth? I am fully prepared to believe that tRoP is as bad as critics portray it, but the whole trebuchet and collapsing rock faces thing... I think I can forgive them for at least that, if nothing else, it's fun imagery. Also: about the orc suicide run, I would have deemed that totally unrealistic a couple of years ago... and then there was Russia. Orcs, indeed ;-)

[@hartattack2739]

It's a point in the book that Saruman is the first to create breaching explosives... thousands of years after this.

[@Alex_Fahey]

​@@arjenlaan4103None of those apply, and two of them definitely do not provide TNT regardless and the third one is only theoretically capable of doing so after a lot of experimentation on the Maia's part. The Witch-King does not exist yet (neither in Tolkien's work nor Amazon's). Sauron is on the other side of the walls and has provided no help to the orcs beyond blinding Celebrimbor to what is happening to his city. In fact, Amazon's orcs are explicitly enemies of Sauron who Caesared him in an earlier scene and currently work for his greatest enemy Adar. They are in Eregion solely to kill Sauron. As for Morgoth, Morgoth's poisoning of the world does not seem to exist in Amazon's version of events, and the elves are fading for unrelated reasons that are fully counteracted by the elven rings' mithril. In Tolkien's world, this poisoning only means that the denizens of Middle-earth are functionally fading in might over time. It does not provide siege engines with extra power.

[@adktheory2031]

"Thus he [Melkor] desired only to possess things, to dominate them, denying to all minds any freedom outside his own will, and to other creatures any value save as they served his own plans. Thus it was seen in Arda that the things made or designed by Melcor were never “new” (though at first he strove to make them so) but were imitations or mockeries of works of others." - Tolkien

[@menachemsalomon]

Beautifully put, and well said.

[@alexbrennan6285]

Except those aren’t Tolkiens words. While there are some phrases similar in his various works this is an often used but not actually real saying by him. If you’re going to quote the man or any of his works to mock an adaptation perhaps make sure the quote exists first? Otherwise it looks like you’re being hypocritical and the one who doesn’t understand Tolkien.

[@adktheory2031]

@@alexbrennan6285 Thank you for informing me as the misquote had passed into pop culture enough that I just thought it was a real quote. Upon further research I have found a quote which I believe is a better fit and an actual real quote instead of a misquote.

[@alexbrennan6285]

@@adktheory2031you’re right i think it first appeared on a book review site and then took off. I did something similar and now have the habit of googling references every time so i don’t make the same mistake again. Glad to be of help even though i disagree with your opinion as I’ve really enjoyed the show personally but respect where you’re coming from.

[@adktheory2031]

@@alexbrennan6285 Yeah thanks for helping me and think that if people enjoyed it that’s great. There were some good parts and parts that were cool and think that if they changed a few things (making it more book accurate, dropping the Galadriel Sauron romance, and maybe dropping the hobbit plot line to give more time to the main plot, [also maybe making Gladrail a different character like maybe a new character as a daughter of Feanor to give an explanation of her fighting, personality, and focus on finding Sauron but they’d have to change a lot to make that work]) it could’ve worked.

[@arkenarikson2481]

on the siege device: even if the nails magically gripped the stones, the moment the "crossbow was released... wall vs. machine ... which would more likely be thrown towards which (SPLAT! XD )

[@kaltaron1284]

But the siege engine thinks it's unmoveable while the wall just wants to get out of Rings of Power.

[@arkenarikson2481]

@@kaltaron1284 LOL XD

[@dizzyheads]

That might actually do more damage to the wall than the pulling itself

[@arkenarikson2481]

@@dizzyheads True, if its hard and heavy enough. Maybe Orcs are stupid enough to decide as follows: "We've got a lot of wood, iron fittings, rocks and rope. We could build a multishot trebuchet or a one shot thingy, that relies on magic nails to hurl itself at a wall a single time. ... Hm ... Screw it, we've allready got all those other magically enhanced trebuchets! Let's build the other one!" .... Could the writers be - in thruth - orcs?... ;)

[@memorexdrc]

The wallbreaker thing is the most Rube Goldberg bs I've ever seen. "Wheel it up to hammer some nails into the wall then shoot which moves log which pulls chains which breaks wall" like bro what

[@charlesqbanks]

Best sort of content Shad does! 👌 Huzzah!