The End of the Obama Coalition

The Democratic Party has been hemorrhaging nonwhite and working-class voters. There are a lot of theories about why that has been happening, blaming it on the party’s ideas or messaging or campaign tactics. But I think the problem might be deeper than that - rooted in the structure of the Democratic Party itself.
Michael Lind is a columnist at Tablet magazine, a co-founder of New America and the author of “The New Class War: Saving Democracy From the Managerial Elite (www.penguinran...) .” He argues that the Democratic Party in recent years has become more beholden to special-interest nonprofits, which claim to represent large constituencies but actually reflect the interests of the donor class. In this conversation, we discuss why he thinks the nonprofit complex became so powerful, how that might have led to a disconnect between the Democratic Party and its core voter base and what he thinks Democrats could do to course correct.
Book Recommendations:
Where Have All the Democrats Gone? (us.macmillan.c...) by John B. Judis and Ruy Teixeira
Tyranny, Inc. (www.penguinran...) by Sohrab Ahmari
Mother Jones (us.macmillan.c...) by Elliot J. Gorn
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [e-mail].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast (www.nytimes.co...) . Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at www.nytimes.co... (www.nytimes.co...) .
This episode of “The Ezra Klein Show” was produced by Rollin Hu. Fact-checking by Kate Sinclair and Mary Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota and Isaac Jones. Our supervising editor is Claire Gordon. The show’s production team also includes Elias Isquith and Kristin Lin. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The executive producer of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts (nytimes.com/pod...) or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

[@ronarubin]

The Dems need to take a hard look at what happened here. I still think they don’t get it.

[@alanbudde8560]

How can they get it when they are the problem?

[@southbug27]

They’re still calling everyone sexist & racist instead of realizing their ideas are bankrupt. They’re literally abusing girls’ & women who don’t want men in our locker room showers & in our sports. They’ve gutted Title IX. They’ve become evil.

[@Megatherium]

These guys have an impressively vast understanding of this election imo

[@philipc8280]

@@alanbudde8560 the establishment is the problem, not regular people

[@user-ss1xg9oj1h]

2024 Democratic Party: Bernie speaks at the DNC about how billionaires control the political system. The very next speaker is Illinois governor J.B. Pritzer, who brags about being a billionaire.

[@tombergins8215]

The Democrats have imported millions of Trump/Republican voters.

[@xclampazzo]

Perfectly boils it down 😭

[@gypsylee333]

The Pritzker brothers are the worst type of billionaires I choose Vivek over the child mutilati0n duo

[@sullainvictus]

I thought you guys didn't like generalizing groups of people, especially minority groups (like billionaires).

[@xclampazzo]

@@sullainvictus Hurrrrr. You made a funny

[@glum_hippo]

The critical question for me is this: isn't it possible the Democratic party establishment simply DOESN'T MIND losing, as long as they don't lose to the progressive wing of their own party? It seems their vigorous efforts to sideline Bernie were much more focused and credible than their attempts to defeat Trump.

[@anthonyjimenez96]

Correct take

[@RyanRuark]

Oh the establishment Democrats are very much prepared to cash checks for themselves while putting on the face of ‘the party of opposition.’

[@SamSung-nf6tr]

Ridiculous

[@anthonyjimenez96]

@@SamSung-nf6trhave people like you even been paying attention long enough to remember the Super Tuesday coup the Dems pulled in 2020? Use your SamSung to Google how we got here

[@theYoungPilots]

Wrong. The Democrats don't mind losing as long as they are loyal to the donor class.

[@tusker2418]

I'm 10 minutes into this and the only thing I am taking away from this is that Democrats lost, frankly, cause they are a bunch of stuck up snobs.

[@divinedemonj]

Worse, snobs that constantly break each others toes to get to an answer.

[@andywomack3414]

Was policy ever mentioned?

[@richardsimms251]

Very true and I am a Democrat

[@rjs8044]

Yes they are!

[@alexcannon9364]

Yes and here are two of them who have learned nothing.

[@Jeremiah-h8i]

Obama’s legacy not looking so hot lately

[@SamSung-nf6tr]

Unfortunately when Obama tried to talk to the crazies in his own party, they preferred to blame Obama not the craziest.

[@pr-tj5by]

@@SamSung-nf6tr Who are the crazies ?

[@smittywerberjaegarmenjense3566]

how so?

[@kevinwoolley7960]

​@@SamSung-nf6tr You mean him scolding and talking down to black men? People really don't like condescension.

[@birdstrikes]

@@kevinwoolley7960 just wait. trump loves his uneducated.

[@dgib1694]

Discussing how identity politics have been and should be 'navigated' just show why the democrats are drowning

[@marlonbrimmer]

Harris avoided identity politics like the plaque in her campaign so this is bs.

[@evan7743]

And letting the far- left progressive faction dictate their policies, regardless of whether it was an overall sound policy or not once enacted in real life. Like a parent who never says no to any demands by their children, reasonable or not, the out of touch DNC elites seem to have lost common sense and a backbone.

[@SamSung-nf6tr]

If you don't realize Republican elites do the same thing, your living in fantasy land.

[@pastramiking6874]

They're saying different things to different people all the time instead of having a broader message that works for most Americans

[@ryanh8764]

@@pastramiking6874yes you nailed it

[@RC4RC]

I beg you to interview the staff of these progressive nonprofits who have attempted to unionize at their own organization. Not the Executive Director, not their board members, I'm talking about the staff at the bottom who carry out this work directly. You will be shocked at how quickly the nonprofit's leadership and board become staunchly anti-union, and crush not only the labor movement itself BUT ALSO manages to exploit, burn out and push away those who want to do this work. This happens even when economic justice or labor rights are explicitly in line with their organization's mission. This is a MAJOR problem for our progressive industry.

[@danielkrall6501]

This has been a consistent feature of the arts for decades. Art non-profits, theatres, etc. The directors who drive a Lexus tell the rank-and-file getting paid 30-40k per year that they need to keep it up "for the love of the arts" or "for the love of the theatre" blah blah blah. It's always been that way. Constant falaciation to the donor class, and constant gaslighting to the rank-and-file.

[@danielbliss1988]

Absolutely. It's why I decided Washington wasn't for me. I found the Republicans to be far more nurturing than Democrats who tended to want to criticize and litmus test everyone; I ended up working for Republicans at Amtrak who have since been kind of orphaned by their own party.

[@Dana-pq7ke]

How long does it take for people to realize that the problem are democrats - they are just elitists who hijacked a working class party in the worst way. Using black skin to pretend they are about "justice", then using women, on the plate next would be using a gay member of society. It's just how psychopaths lie to you.

[@h1jen1x]

Interesting, well informed point. Thanks for taking the time to share.

[@triplea657aaa]

Turns out people don't want a 4th Obama term...

[@Dan-dj7kl]

Funny thing is Obama would serve 4 terms if he was allowed. The Obama brand only works with Obama, a generational speaker and figure. Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden, and Kamala Harris are all sidekicks with absolutely none of his charisma

[@marshallscot]

The Dems have made the mistake that people actually liked Obama for his policies, when most people voted for him based off his personal charisma. The Obama coalition was lightning in a bottle.

[@magnus08f250]

@@marshallscotand it was all media made. His true colors eventually came out

[@danielbliss1988]

@@marshallscot true that. Most people buy a myth, not a policy checklist. Obama's myth, that we were a post-racial society, was only good for one election cycle; he needed a new one and he didn't come up with it. Instead we got the budget sequester and the IT crash that took down Obamacare's launch.

[@danielbliss1988]

Listen to the whole podcast if you have time. It sounds to me more like, they didn't think Harris was going to be a 4th Obama term, rather a bunch of self-satisfied alphabet soup interest groups. The whole point of Obama was keeping these interest groups in check -- of course as he's gotten older his own flaw of scolding people has become much more visible and that also was harmful. So perhaps he couldn't really be an extra term of himself at this point.

[@johnanderson8714]

Thank goodness, I'm a Dem but tired of this Obama crap.

[@swcordovaf]

The non profit industrial complex….. put it up as another machination to add to the other complexes of influencers who don’t have mass support.

[@melitatunnicliff8385]

Both of you completely misunderstand Bernie Sanders and his phenomenon. He always put economic issues first and foremost. "You cannot have social justice without economic justice" was his message and it was popular with progressives and people who went on to vote for Trump. Bernie supported inclusivity but started always with economic fairness issues, which are popular with the majority of Americans Democrat or Republican, but are a third rail to political insiders, party consultants, and billionaire donors.

[@OhioVworld]

Open borders- that’s a Koch Bros. proposition….. What happened?

[@danielbliss1988]

@@OhioVworld We cut off immigration, it will cause massive inflation. Not what we want. What people rebelled against was the utter disorder at the border that resulted from Biden mistakenly assuming we were far enough free of covid to revert to the previous rules rather than waiting and seeing how things unfolded. We got hit by waves of people escaping drought, disease, dictatorship and drug cartels all at the same time.....without the legal structure or the resources to cope.

[@Anon54387]

The problem is that while Bernie might have good intentions is that socialism simply doesn't work.

[@vyor8837]

​@@OhioVworldprinciples are for other people.

[@gypsylee333]

Bernie was for closed borders I remember that clearly

[@WilliamThompson-b1j]

Most Americans will not ever want "woke" to be the dominant culture

[@stephenlight647]

Interesting discussion. One thing I would note is that the AMOUNT of these social engineering jobs has increased every decade since the 1930s. Government and non-profits are now a huge part of the economy. Time to trim that way back.

[@IamBrixTM]

A long argument for rejecting progressivism as if Democrats cared about that to begin with

[@johndavenport8843]

America is tired of politicans and a system that doesnt work, that more than anything else is how Trymp got elected in the first place.

[@danielbliss1988]

The system actually works quite a bit better because of Biden and Obama than it would otherwise, and a Harris or second Biden term would have been a huge step forward. The politicians sure don't cover themselves in glory though; they look like mealy-mouthed sellouts, all the time. So we have this thing where a majority of voters say they're doing well, but say the country isn't, and that was fed by Trump going on about the country being a hellhole without anyone pushing back on it. Some people felt they were voting for the country by voting Trump, otherwise were too demoralized to vote at all. (And for those reasons anyone who blames the voters for this disaster is part of the problem)

[@keligarrett63]

Little liberal bubbles everywhere and not a single substantive issue to stand on. Not anti-war, anti-oligarchy, so obviously not pro workers.

[@marshallscot]

​@@arcana_mystery "anti-gun saves lives" lmao

[@baj5763]

wrong

[@justanother240]

​@@arcana_mystery please put that sign on your lawn 😂

[@eemoogee160]

​@justanother240 "In this house..."?

[@OhioVworld]

@@arcana_mystery Really, the Democratic Party is for white collar unions in, say, tech?

[@Quixcilver7.62]

Thank God. America has never been more divided than under Obama's three terms.

[@jezkerjamez7110]

We need a 21st century FDR and we could have had one if the Democratic establishment didn’t give Bernie Sanders the shaft. Time to create a 21st century economic bill of rights.

[@keenannorris3309]

Amen.

[@deplorable-x9q]

@@keenannorris3309 Bernie was a non-starter. He was against the perpetual warfare state, opposed open borders, and wasn't big on identity politics. The democratic establishment wanted none of that in 2016 and 2020.

[@amcynic]

You already have one. It was called the Communist Manifesto.

[@neogeo6431]

@@amcynic We already have one it's called the torah

[@brettcase4129]

It’s called capitalism.. or as I prefer to call it survival of the fittest…

[@twyckoff87]

Micheal Lind is one of the best voices for understanding our current dysfunctional situation.

[@philosopher2king]

This is an amazing interview. However, I take issue with the use of “realignment“ as opposed to “establishment“. The realignment isn’t to the right, and the anti-incumbency “trend“ that Democrats keep quoting, is very selective. They’re only choosing a handful of countries. The big difference between both parties teaches a lesson that Democrats are just not going to heed; say what you want about Republicans and Trump, their party allows for an actually democratic primary election. The DNC does not. Clinton was shoved down our throats in 2016 when the push was really going towards Bernie Sanders. In 2020 when Bernie was winning again, Obama had to orchestrate a super delegate coup with Clyburn to sideline Bernie again, and while Biden won that election, he also barely won against a VERY unpopular President. And just over 100 days ago, Biden and/or the DNC, it is not clear yet, anointed Harris singlehandedly, when we should have had was an open convention. Again: the party leadership is CHOOSING THE CANDIDATE, NOT THE GRASSROOTS. Republicans are better able to tap into the electorate by RESPECTING their base. Democrats have the shattered illusion that somehow their base is more diverse and energized but reserve the right to shoot down a candidate they think won’t win and gives us one that loses.

[@ereckboykin3073]

100 percent.

[@MrJayColes]

“New York times opinion” Implying there’s a factual department at NYT

[@web9529]

This summarized a lot of thoughts I had but couldn't quite make sense of, great talk.

[@greendesertgoddess]

Still can't say "Working Poor!"

[@OhioVworld]

Progressive elites think the working poor are hopeless, low IQ rubes who need saving and guiding.

[@eemoogee160]

I wonder which concept feels more problematic to Ezra, 'class' or 'populism'.

[@bigjared8946]

They don't like to say "working class" because it sounds "Marxist". There's a reason the media and Democratic politicians like to keep the conversation steered toward identity politics and away from class politics. The people who own the media also own both political parties. You don't even need to be anti-capitalist to see Karl was very right about some things, if you're being objective. These people were literally doing Red-baiting on Bernie, in 2020, nearly 30 years after that sort of rhetoric should have expired.

[@DelsinM]

If you can't stand up against the worst humanitarian violations in nearly a century, what kind of party are you?

[@rjs8044]

I am so grateful for your podcasts & have learned more than I did in most of my college political science classes.

[@DevDogra-w9p]

We need the new deal coalition back.

[@ryanjacobson2508]

But most Dems have been trashing the mid-20th century as hopelessly -ist and -phobic....

[@Besdayz]

you sold them out to the corporate elites. big pharma big tech.

[@dennisweidner288]

Very interesting discussion, especially minority support for deporting illegals opposition to race based affirmative action, ad support of voter IDs. There is opposition to boys in girls sports and boys in girls bathrooms. Bu the candidates they elect run counter on these and may other issues.

[@europa_bambaataa]

Krystal & Saagar have tried to talk about grift 50 times, but they're always too cynical. This conversation made me understand it way better

[@seraph5765]

Saagar is a grifter. His analysis is always pointless and bad.

[@fabsmaster5309]

Yeah, it’s interesting to hear people on the inside and how they justify it. Almost no one gets up in the morning and thinks “How do I lie to the public and destroy the country so I can get rich?”

[@cwidd1929]

Krystal Ball is a known grifter, so big surprise.

[@eemoogee160]

Is this level of honesty about the DNC a regular thing here?

[@eemoogee160]

By cynical, do you mean not trusting the establishment?

[@bensweiss]

The voters are transactional and will move to those who serve their interests.

[@oscarpistorius3710]

Then who defines their interests.

[@danieldougan269]

@@oscarpistorius3710 Well, Trump SAID explicitly that he did. He was going to bring the prices down. Of course, it's a load of crap because the President doesn't control prices, but enough people believed him anyway. The greatest trick Trump ever pulled was pretending to care about the working class.

[@bensweiss]

@oscarpistorius3710 I assume they would try to.

[@RaviNayyar]

EXACTLY - democracy is about voters making a call.

[@Phlegethon]

You’re saying voters should just keep voting for the same party that doesn’t serve their interests? No wonder dems lost

[@GrammarSplaining]

The dogs don't like the food.

[@drewastolfi6840]

Well that is harsh...but serriously this ALPO could be better

[@zaffo757]

The first 5 minutes explain how awful the D party is. Horrific.

[@RaviNayyar]

Love this conversation.

[@magdovus]

You referred to the Tory loss in the UK. As a Brit who leans centre-right, the Tories lost for some basic reasons- they completely lost the confidence of the electorate (Partygate, Truss), they started talking crap that is fundamentally unBritish (Rwanda, attacking small boat immigrants), they'd been in power too long (14 years and it was starting to show) and then Labour had an electable candidate- Starmer is boring (which isn't a bad thing in British politics right now) and he managed to clear out the "loony left" that has never worked for Labour. The Tories as a party didn't really have anything to offer any more.

[@sjolson68]

The irony here is that if you compare the US and UK governments and how they've effectively operated with respect to spending as far back as Tony Blair's govt, it's been quite similar. Perhaps not surprising on its face, given how closely tied the countries are, but then if you look at the party who controlled the government in each place, it didn't matter if it was Tory in the UK and Democrats in the States or vice versa - the financial policies played out similar for the public but the rhetoric/narratives were deceptively aligned with getting them elected, but no promises kept.

[@swampwiz]

I've always considered Boris Johnson to be the candidate from the "Slightly Silly Party" (i.e., from Monty Python).

[@Petal4822]

Republicans are ❤

[@EM-od6yr]

Lind is wrong that there was a consensus for large scale immigration until now. If that was the case there would've been another amnesty passed in the 2000s. He is right that there is a neoliberal consensus, but it's not really true that either party has abandoned globalization. Both parties have continued the tax policies and privatization efforts which started in the 70s. Both parties might talk about the working class more than 20 years ago but any concessions are really piecemeal.

[@HebaruSan]

We should be having these conversations far enough in advance to avert catastrophes

[@bwmanarific]

Remember these conversations were "banned" from these political circles just a year ago. All of them supported and loved Biden and wanted him to run again. If you showed major disloyalty you were eaten by the left

[@nedludd3641]

This is excellent. Good on you for posting this.

[@honahwikeepa2115]

Release the Epstein and Diddy lists.

[@LoriTianSailiata]

Biden spent his entire career as a Neoliberal champion of the Credit Industry (Delaware), Wall Street, For-Profit Prisons (1990s Pipeline to Prison), and blindly pro-Zionist. His actual policies in office were quite surprising. Note: he did NOT run on that progressive record. Which makes me think they were concessions to Sanders, and not coming from Biden. Harris sidelining progressives in the general to pivot towards Cheney and celebrities also makes me question where she would stand once in office. I haven’t talked to a single Trump voter who likes Trump. There’s just a lack of trust towards the DNC as an institution. And that had an effect on down-ballot races. 🤨

[@ryanjacobson2508]

And the media/establishment says "he's from Scranton" and "blue collar people like his personality" etc.... They scarcely can point to any actual policy he's championed to help the general populace.

[@teddmented]

“Blindly pro-zionist” tells me you’re in the “progressive” mold which is so far left it leans marxist, DEI quotas, reverse racist and lost Harris the election. And fyi, he ran on Scranton because that’s what won him the election - not his “progressive” record.

[@lindat6910]

Well I like Trump a lot and many do!

[@bigjared8946]

People forget about bankruptcy "reform" being Senator Biden's pet project. Before that, student loan debt could be discharged in bankruptcy. Delaware is basically America's Lichtenstein and those interests are what he very faithfully served as a Senator.

[@vyor8837]

Harris was incredibly progressive. That's why she lost.

[@ethanddog31]

I worked on both Bernie campaigns and I hate Obama. Trump is his fault more than anybody.

[@starbuckstark4745]

Some of us moms keep saying STOP alienating progressives. They will never listen.

[@grumpyoldcat8302]

I swear to god these people are still living in 2016. Newsflash Geniuses: *The Obama Coaliation has been dead for nearly a decade.* How is this STILL something you’re discussing? Democrats had 8 years to wake up, and yet here we are.

[@noelheberling3143]

My thought exactly. The "this is Obama's fault" clickbait title is way off base. What they're missing is that Trump is a direct reaction to Obama and the democrats never adjusted. They thought Hillary and Harris could be another Obama. However, Obama was an anomaly that caught fire in the Primary. When's the last time we had a real primary? When's the last time we had a grass roots activist on the ballot? Instead we keep getting forced to choose between corporate pawn and criminal. Funny that America chose the criminal over corporate pawn as the lesser of the two evils.

[@davidm6149]

@@noelheberling3143some would say 2020 was a primary till everyone but Bernie dropped out and backed Biden

[@coyohma8947]

@@noelheberling3143Obama installed Harris and called black men sexist weeks before the election, among other politically dubious moves. His influence has remained.

[@lindat6910]

I will just say it plainly! The democrats are a clown show! Literally! You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.”― Abraham Lincoln

[@RM-dc6zd]

We are tired of identity politics. Period. Keep talking about it, and you will keep losing. Obama was great, the real deal. Kamala was not. And neither are the grievance studies people.

[@PHL1213]

Agreed 👍

[@JG.777]

Yes. This and that monolith. More tired, aged, and tone deaf analysis.

[@alexanderclaylavin]

Obama was an inspiring orator and little else.

[@RM-dc6zd]

@ He was brilliant as a student (magna cum laude at top universities, editor/president of the law review), was well regarded as a teacher at a top university, served well as a state and later US senator, wrote best selling books, etc. prior to being a highly successful President. You can disagree with his views but he outmaneuvered and frustrated Republicans the entire time he was in office, so he is not just an inspiring orator. Glad you were inspired though.

[@bigjared8946]

Obama was actually a pretty mediocre president who was good at speeches and curating media hype. He ran to the left promising Hope and Change only to immediately pivot unceremoniously to the center-right and staff up the WH with Clintonites the moment he won. Once out of office and able to take off the mask entirely, he's kind of turned into a condescending prick.

[@paullunsford8921]

Oh my god, it’s a National bureaucratic patronage network!!! He’s figured out what every intelligent conservative has known for at least 4 years. Many much longer.

[@bwmanarific]

National bureaucratic patronage network based on race and influence from identity politics mind you 😂

[@giraffediety2477]

It really is amazing watching these people discover what all right wing analysis has internalized. I betcha they will figure out that power can ever only be held by a person, not an organization, after they lose in 2028

[@smak387]

4 years? Trying 70 years.

[@paullunsford8921]

@@smak387 Yes yes, James Burnham knew many things before we did.

[@zubversivezigotto9731]

Dems had a candidate with the charisma of a tadpole. The rest is history.

[@kevinwoolley7960]

She was an abysmal candidate, inappropriate laughter and weird smiling, non-answers to all questions, completely lost without a teleprompter

[@traviscutler9912]

Biden supported minimum wage? How?!?!?!?

[@Davidbirdman101]

Here's a big reason why the Democrat party lost so badly. A father goes to his school board because his eleven year old son brought home a book that described graphic s*x acts. I'm not talking about some mild kind of language, graphic. This is an eleven year old boy. Naturally the father was concerned about it and went to speak out against this at a school board meeting. The members of the school board acted like the father was doing something wrong and were basically unconcerned and dismissive of his concerns. Then there is parents who had a visit from the FBI because they were outraged by this insanity. Then you have people like John Kerry and Hillary Clinton making noises about that pesky, irritating first amendment. We're "Hampered" by the first amendment they say. We can't get our "message" across because of the "disinformation" on the internet. When I heard these narcissistic people say things like that. It literally sent a chill up my spine. These are dangerous things to be saying. If they cannot compete in the market place of ideas, they just want to silence their opponents. They think half of the country is stupid and cannot evaluate the situation. Yes, they are the ones who sold out the working class with NAFTA. As far as Obama goes, he was President for 8 years and never once did he address the violence that plagues the inner cities. He had the bully pulpit and could have spoken out about crime. But, no. And guess what? Black people are tired of being used and given crumbs after the election. Maybe you can think about that.

[@surpriseandterror9698]

None of that happened you dumb fucking freak.

[@gypsylee333]

Facts, I heard when they put freedom of speech as an option on the polls, that was the 2nd most important issue after economy.

[@BrazilDan1]

One problem with the kind of "post-neoliberalism" that seems to be dominant now is that it criticizes the idea of free-flow (of money, goods and people) and changes direction towards closure, but hasn't really addressed the other, arguably more important, central aspect of neoliberalism, which is the retreat of the state both as a (re)distributive actor, and a provider of universal public goods and services. That aspect seems to remain largely untouched, which makes sense considering the current correlation of power between the capital owner and working classes in both parties, and even in other developed countries.

[@11equalsfish]

Another interesting episode. Politics is very different in this short time. Very risky things are happening.

[@tomasdvorak7487]

This is excellent

[@Ryan-wf6ib]

How the party of the working class lost hispanics but gained college whites is a disgrace. This wasn't supposed to be our party.

[@cablenewsfanatic5634]

Preachy college whites to boot.

[@VotelessOrc497]

Thank God

[@monksnack]

So nice, I watched it twice!

[@jonesrjones6257]

In the Obama clip he begrudgingly admits that the opposition "may love their kids". Is this because he is strugglingly trying to come to this conclusion or because he senses his audience can't fathom that this can be true without Progressivism? Either way, it explains why Democrats deservedly performed so poorly.

[@kevinwoolley7960]

​@@arcana_mystery People can do both things at once. Guns aren't remotely the most important thing for child health, social media is about 1,000 times as important.

[@EdwardDollar-r2u]

@@kevinwoolley7960 By "health" are you including death? Because the number one killer of children in this country are gunmen.

[@vuzkoth]

Ezra with the smooth brain incumbent Tory analogy. What a joke.

[@joshntn37111]

OMG!! Ezra!! My favorite liberal! If all Democrats were like Ezra, we garbage maggots, may have some competition on our hands. Thanks Ezra for the great insight! 😊

[@lizzy-wx4rx]

Planned Parenthood is a perfect example of this, providing medical services paid for through government funding, and receiving around 40% of its funding through government reimbursements or grants. Bernie Sanders was pilloried in 2016 for referring to it as part of the Establishment in 2016. He wasn't slamming it at all, he was simply stating a fact and explaining why it was a foregone conclusion that of course they would endorse Clinton instead of him.

[@Dana-pq7ke]

And to force people to suffer moral collapse to support it - they just don't want their tax dollars going to it because of their cultural beliefs - but we can't respect that. We can't respect a culture like that.

[@LearnedSome]

This podcast should be renamed Dismantling Democracy.

[@JohnR22926]

Don't appoint ideologues. Best advice ever.

[@JDK516]

Trump chose ideologue JD Vance as his running mate, and he won.

[@lindat6910]

@@JDK516 Wrong answer! JD is far from that!

[@marlonbrimmer]

This is such a liberal discussion. Trying to hyper focus on identity politics and woke like that was the reason harris lost. When in reality she purposely avoided using identity politics as a political strategy. No, its the status quo meo liberalism that you too support amd defend that is the issue

[@Yzyenthusiast]

Identity politics and woke

[@AlTarif]

Do you think the electorate forgot about her record as a Senator and weren't aware that she was just role playing a centrist?

[@Forester-]

You can't just ignore identity politics as the democratic nominee. Everyone in the country associates it with the party Harris represented and remembers everything she has said or done up until 3 months ago. If she really wanted to distance herself from that issue she would have to actually speak out against parts of it and we all know that wasn't going to happen.

[@kevinwoolley7960]

​@@AlTarifThis was crucial to her failure. She stood for extreme far left policies in 2020 and when questioned about the flip flopping said "my values haven't changed". I think most people saw through that.

[@EdwardDollar-r2u]

@@AlTarif In a country where over 40% can't name the vice president in any given presidency? Yeah, I do.

[@shaytheo]

Is this happening in both parties? Seems that the Trump regime is doing the same thing. It is just about payola and not quota based.

[@adama9032]

Young men came to vote this was a manospher election men had enough with the soft feminist message

[@barboglesby2162]

What was "soft" about it?

[@georgefurman4371]

The end of reformism as a political position. That is what it means. The political myopia is amazing. Always trying to save capitalism and perpetuate its social contract. The absence of a transitional mentality of change is absolutely defeating for the possibility of progress.

[@DasRaetsel]

What do you mean by that?

[@georgefurman4371]

@ everybody … well not everybody . But most everyone takes this social contract for granted . As a permanent normal way of life . Even in science fiction is proposed the same capitalist way of managing and distributing the product of work( wealth). As we were fossilized into this manner of living socioeconomic ally and politically. Either a monarchy or a direct wealthy anarchic way of life. Without an evolutionary process of change into a better stage of human social organization. There is an absence of a transitional change mentality that could improve our humanity in every context of our interaction. On the side of the wealthy there is only their addiction to hoard wealth unlimited. An obsessive compulsion to impose their mentality . On the side of the people only an ignorance imposed by injustice and a sacrificial option for the ones with a conscience .

[@baj5763]

There has been no end of a "transitional mentality of change". What do you think Trump represents?

[@georgefurman4371]

@@baj5763 trump represents what his personal life represents and has been. Mediocrity as a moral person, megalomaniac, and unhinged in his desperation for power. Just like the social class he belongs to. The wealthy class champion will fight for his particular faithful family of wealthy people. He doesnt think as a normal regular citizen. He thinks as a wealthy hoarder of power. And he sees the majority as disposable and despise the poor . That is what you can expect from Trump and the people with the power to abuse power. Those that surround Trump permanently. He represents the past guilded age of the aristocracy.

[@DasRaetsel]

@@georgefurman4371 I think people recognize that they WANT change...but don't know where to put that energy towards (which is why you have people going from voting for Obama to Bernie to Trump). People WANT change, it just manifests in different ways....the energy is there. The reason why Trump won is because Democrats abdicated the revolutionary fervor to the other side. The laws of physics apply the same way (laws of energy, motion, power vacuums, etc.)

[@shancaelum-c2i]

Obama told everyone to drop out and back Biden in the primary and Sen Bernie supporters vote for the republican party

[@prodigylaunch5161]

Basically the Obama machine farmed out their policy making and implementation to nonprofits affiliated with their party donors via grants. So the donors controlled what policy was prioritized or omitted by how they ran their organization, something the government had no direct control over. And many of those nonprofits are single-issue groups with competing interests which may not align with the government. Basically no control of your own government. Which makes sense when you see so many tone deaf policies since 2008 that it seemed Democrats could not alter - immigration disaster, incoherent foreign policy, self-destructive fiscal policy, illogical gun control, etc. Like Ezra said, "its like no one could say 'no' to anything. So you have all these silly policies".

[@TheStanCountry]

The 10 most populous cities are led by Democrat Mayors. This is why we need the electoral college. He also said that they had the most non-profits that provide services. Imagine that.

[@andywomack3414]

"...had I set these policies in the 1980's I'd be considered a moderate Republican." -Barack Obama 2014 Univision interview. kzbin.info/www/bejne/bGialp-XfK6mgbc I might have missed it, but at no time during this interview did I hear discussion about policy, when one of the reasons the Democrats have utterly failed under Obama leadership are these wrong-headed ideas about policy. Before I knew it as neoliberal, I knew it as Reaganomics, and it's the Democrats acceptance of Reaganomics that is leading to their downfall. Democrats won a majority of people making more than 100,000 per year. They lost all other income levels.

[@alanbudde8560]

thats not true exit polls also had them winning under $50k ie the working class. But the problem is most working class people just correctly saw no one really cared about them and didnt vote

[@emdragowsky2967]

why did Harris/Walz fail in turnout? Biden/Harris won 81M vs 74M votes, whereas Harris/Walz are looking at about 74M while Rep about 77. That's a 4M vote drop (yes, this year stats are incomplete, and i'm projecting CA stats). The focus on percentage split is incomplete, without considering the total turnout issue.

[@brreezy421]

They were terrible candidates and a lot more ppl voted in 2020 cuz of covid and mail in ballot was so prominent due to it

[@KJango804]

because the need to vote wasnt felt enough in cities. Repubs are mostly busniess owners , employees most likely demo. Money is percieved different on each side. Besides everyone was home on the internet in 2020 so information given was probably looked at better because most people had time to injest

[@ไอ้พวกอิสลาม]

The illegals voting for democrats did not come out and vote this 2024 elections thats why theres millions of voters less this 2024 elections compared to 2020 elections. If you are going to look at Trump voters they are consistent in numbers, 70million + in 2016, 2020, 2024 while democrat votes always fluctuates. Its because dems are cheating just like whats happening in Pennsylvania now.

[@lilianxu8888]

Mr. Lind brings an interesting perspective and sounds thoughtful, but the conversation sometimes loses focus due to Mr. Klein's involuntary "Trump/republican bad" which, frankly, defeats the purpose of self-reflection. Notably never comes up is the issue of freedom of speech, which is important to not only civil libertarians but also Democrat's ability to think as individuals.

[@flowry1978]

Lets see...in 2004 we were told to suck it when Dubya romped home. Now the Republicans pretend he doesnt exist. Lets see how things are in 2028

[@OhioVworld]

Completely different time. The whole proposition of the left for the last 16+ yrs has been shattered.

[@thomasmills3934]

Sheer delusion from both of these people.

[@MrEvfrajr]

No way people really talk like this. Bring back non college educated non partisian local journalists

[@Jay-z2x]

@@MrEvfrajr that’s the voter block that was lost so maybe that’s a good idea

[@jmorrison230582]

they all got laid off when people stopped buying local papers

[@SamSung-nf6tr]

They do. It's ashame your never been in the room.

[@MrBearcatjew]

When has Ezra Klein talked to someone who makes under 60k a year

[@beerman204]

Obama went to his election celebration party with "the people" and left the party in a Goldman Sachs limo......

[@richardsimms251]

Where is Joe DiMaggio ?

[@howardmenkes2926]

Thank Christ

[@Runnerdude360]

Love the intro music

[@troywilliams4753]

I am black and so happy that I voted for Trump

[@gypsylee333]

I am a white woman and so glad I did also, he looks like he going through with his promises and I'm happy he didn't ditch Tulsi or RFK I was a little worried he would.

[@DohertyT2319]

Finally some actual analysis

[@rauldiaz3795]

Finally a face to the nut job .

[@hockeyhalod]

Thank goodness

[@awuma]

Outstanding discussion. Similar developments are seen in other countries, e.g. Poland, where only a couple or so of the 100 biggest towns and cities have Law & Justice (PiS, overtly Trumpist) supporting mayors. The city-rural political divide is very clear in most developed electorally democratic nations. 39:13 The power of the "non-profit complex" versus that of mass organizations is a fascinating observation, the "non-profits" supporting "astro-turf" instead of real grassroots. The trans activists and DEI advocates are clearly "astro-turf". 44:57 These small groups used to be called "pressure groups". The fact that they are funded by grants makes them inordinately powerful, something that didn't exist 50 or 60 years ago.

[@Readabookfoofoo]

You failed NYT. You did.

[@alexanderclaylavin]

They have fulfilled their exact mandate , just as in 2016.

[@alquinn8576]

Trump will be great for their subscriptions; things are going to plan

[@a.champagne6238]

RALPH NADER WAS RIGHT

[@fatface2911]

The obama coalition was hope and change, which of the 3 last nominees was a change candidate?

[@aaronwilkinson8963]

I hope Trump is exactly what the left accuse him of

[@JohnSmith-vy7ck]

Obama and his ilk lost. It’s over and America can finally move on from his constituency. And I voted for him in 2008/12 and regretted it forever. Voted Trump in 2024. 🙌🇺🇸 @crookedmedia

[@fromcolorado3367]

I have yet to listen to this podcast, but I'm thrilled to see Michael Lind as your guest. His is a voice that needs to be heard more.

[@iankclark]

“Sit down and read. Educate yourselves for the coming conflicts”. As someone who left the left, I think the right is doing more extensive reading lately.

[@alexanderclaylavin]

Hahaha that’s some rich cogni-disso.

[@iankclark]

@@alexanderclaylavin cogni-disso, that’s so cool, also serenely unaware.

[@baj5763]

lol

[@iankclark]

Hohoho I mean outside your fenced in technocratic, autogynophilic, materialistic, smug analysis hohoho

[@giraffediety2477]

I noticed that during Trump's first term. All the interesting conversations are on the right

[@Petal4822]

Harris, Biden and Obama were jokes.

[@JRay2113]

Very good podcast

[@drewastolfi6840]

So interesting.

[@t.c.s.7724]

I thought this discussion was a spoof.

[@nuance8530]

"It's the economy stupid" Every establishment candidate lost in every developed nation and this idiot's takeaway is abandon some minorities, don't reform policing.

[@DasRaetsel]

I think we just need new ideas that everyone can get behind. Maybe talk about "positive reforms" or something. Tim Walz and JD Vance talking amicably about Finland during their debate was an interesting sight to see.

[@anustart1934]

Please bring back the old theme music

[@michaelandrew964]

Yes, their policy is more left but too far and they missed the target

[@hwizell7478]

Stayed for Mother Jones quote 👏🫡

[@lisab.6714]

первонах Thank you for the episode! Love your show.

[@lifeisgood12341]

My non profit staffer says I shouldn't listen to you

[@Ninjaforrver]

I’m annoyed how much these guys are trying to pin this on trans rights groups.

[@moguls914]

Sadly, we're easy to throw under the bus

[@qqqcalls]

Its the reason why I stopped supporting the Democrats.