THE FACTS ABOUT ADVERTISED BOW SPEEDS

[@davedobson9801]

Thank you John!!! I always wondered how bow companies could advertise a number that was impossible to achieve in the real world. This explains it very well. I hope the industry continues to put more guidelines in place around the process so that we see more accurate numbers in the future.

[@PoeOutdoors]

My son's EVO NTN 33 actually exceeded the listed IBO speed by 12 fps. Our crew doesn't chase speed as a priority but that was a nice change!

[@nockonarchery]

This has been my experience with PSE bows.

[@ricardodelvalle9702]

Very informative, Thank you. I will admit though after watching this I am impressed with Darton. My older 2016 Darton 3900 Ibo is 350-355. I'm getting 363 fps through my caldwell chrono with a 359gr arrow, 29.5dl 70# ABB strings.

[@thecadman99]

Great video that every new Archer should watch. Also consider that an aggressive speed bow at 60 lbs is as hard to draw as a mild comfort bow at 70 lbs and will create similar speeds without being hard on your body.

[@archerpaintball6822]

Years ago we used to say subtract 10fps from Mathews ratings and add 10fps to Hoyt ratings.

[@bmook019]

The only thing I disagree with is that bows aren't really getting faster. I have bows over ten years old that shoot as fast as today's bows. The newer bows are far more pleasant to shoot, but they aren't really faster. It's all marketing.

[@jordanpowell228]

I would say bows are faster at the lower draw lengths and with heavier arrow weights

[@jeffcopenhaver2217]

I’d say bows nowadays are way more efficient. No longer do you have to pull 70+ pounds to get great performance. 60lb is plenty for the deer woods and my shoulder joints agree! LOL

[@stickboy6772]

Glad to see more videos from you! And Great to hear some truth behind the advertising...with some sanity mixed in on how important this may and may not be. thanks sir.

[@cjr4497]

ATA Speed Guideline: Draw weight: 70# +/-0.2, Arrow weight: 5 grains per pound, Draw Length: 30" +1/4" and not under 30". So max for this would be a 70.2# bow with 350 grain arrow and a draw length of 30 1/4". This is what pretty much everyone thinks is the IBO standard.

[@jimjones1442]

Still not an excuse why companies are 20fps slow

[@HuntsT]

It’s about time for the industry to enforce a standard. Enough of this shadow games BS.

[@waynestevenson9613]

I guess there is really no way around it. Bow companies as you stated will use every means available to twist the actual truth when testing. Most people can’t afford the chronos that you described. The chrono on your right is the most common and prolly the one needed to test as it is the most affordable. But until there is one standard chrono, scale and advertisement standard (bow must be tested as it will come off the shelf and handed to a customer) it will all be false information. The best way is to try it before you buy it. The experience of shooting the bow should be the determining factor and for me the tune-ability is a big key. Not really a fan boy of any company so every time I purchase a different bow I look for what suits me and not so much speed.

[@johnsimonelli9988]

Very informative. I have a 21 year old Hoyt single cam that shoots a 448 grain total weight arrow at 62lb draw through a whisker basket and I am getting 234 fps. ( good enough for me ) I was surprised when my buddy brought his brand new Bowtech double cam 62lb bow with drop away arrow rest and arrows that weigh 400 grain total weight was getting 264 fps. My thought went to what did 21 years of technology get? 30fps? doesn't seem like I should upgrade at $2000 for 30fps.

[@colbykinney5633]

bow companies are basically lying to the consumer. the bows almost always shoot way slower than advertised like 20 fps. even if they were accurate they are listing speeds with arrows that are so light no hunter in their right mind would shoot. we need an company that lists honest speeds with a happy medium arrow like 450 to 500 grains.

[@YoureSoVane]

It's a comparison tool. Everyone has different draw lengths and different arrow setups, so a new arbitrary arrow weight will be just as helpful as the current 5 grains per pound standard. What's important is that everyone does the same thing or compares to the same standard. Exactly 70 pound, exactly 30 inches, exactly 350 grains, etc.

[@brpnw4r94]

I chase hitting what I'm aiming at nearly every day. Whether it's lobbed in there or Lazer guided, it hasn't been the reason I buy a bow, and I'm okay with that. With that being said....Nock On!🤘

[@billstiger2359]

Agree with most of the content. But it sounds like you’re talking about a deviation of a a few FPS. But when tested to IBO Specs some of these values are 20 to 30 FPS less then advertised.

In a previous video I remember you told that official speeds are measured with unfletched arrows. (As I remember the video was your first NTN PSE true speed test)

[@JSANDERS247]

I'm more interested in how efficient the cams are with heavier arrows. Now I'm not a heavy arrow guy but I like to shoot something in the 450 gr weight because I can build a really durable arrow in that range..

[@flip66five]

Glad we can comment now... id love a faster bow... i have an ibo 340 now and get 290ish with 435gn... but with speed comes momentum and i shoot more squirrels than deer...🤷‍♂️

[@careyhamil]

Was John prepping the battle space after PSE released their new Omen speed bow?

[@_DeFiNiTeLy_Not_BrAd_]

Something you didn't mention when talking about "ibo speed", these companies can test at the longest draw length the cam will go, which is why they get these big numbers. ATA spec is the only one that specified 30" draw +/-1/4".

[@danielbutcher5836]

As someone who's not prepared to spend extra money for a "fast" bow, can I assume that consist speeds from shot to shot is more important than peak speed? Is there anything in a bow that would cause changes in speed from shot to shot, or is that mostly going to be about the shooter?

[@lorencpollo2926]

Unless the bow is set up incorrectly (cams not properly timed) there should not be more than a few feet per second deviation between shots. The only other thing I can think of that would cause a high deviation is if the back wall is really spongy and it lets you pull back more on some shots compared to others and that would change the speed of the arrow by a decent amount.

[@tucker2074]

Weight of the arrow

[@cjr4497]

IBO Standard: Draw weight: 80# +/-2, Arrow weight: 5 grains per pound, Draw length: no limit. A company could speed test an 82# bow with a 400gr arrow with the draw length stretched out as far as they can get it and still not be falsely advertising.

[@gladegoodrich2297]

Told my friend that my new bow shoots 332 fps. Dont think so he said, probably more like 280! Shot it through the conagraph and he was spot on! How can the manufacture advertise 332 when the true speed is 280????

[@bigz5262]

Because IBO is tested at 80 pounds, not 70. And there is no limit on draw, so they’re using their longest draws

[@flip66five]

They also use no fletching and no stuff on the string...

[@TomOnTheRun]

Truth to power. I have a Ballistic pro. If I shoot higher vs lower in the window can have a 4fps variance. Fact! I use chrono only to determine starting point for sight tapes. IBO standards, I don't find relative to hunting.

[@ryanrekonnect1769]

Its critical. Extra lubrication is critical. Specially if your arrow is heavy and you have a small knocking point. And big oranges are better than apples. Critical to lube those also. Extremely critical.

[@Wabblewater22]

Other then flatter trajectory with faster bows. To many put importance on fps. Speed of sound is 1100' per second. So you bow noise gets there lots sooner then the arrow. I would much rather tune a bow at 270 fps vs 300 fps. Just my opinion.

[@MD-173]

you mentioned arrow scales. I've tried the two most popular scales while building arrows and neither are dead nuts accurate and it drives me crazy. Do you have a scale you recommend?

[@owsowmuskwanaistus9213]

i been shooting bows for 38 years im 42 today

[@ajbholsters2035]

Methods aside, the problem is the industry has been lying and inflating numbers for so long that any company that actually tries to be honest with their numbers will get left in the dust by the companies who continue to fudge their numbers. PSE tried it a few years ago when they put out more honest numbers and they got flamed for putting out "slow bows". So they're back to doing the same as everybody else. Since companies are significantly more egregious than others.

[@sheyanderson4371]

So IBO/ATA need to standardize the entire process for their ratings. It wouldn't be anymore difficult, nor expensive to the manufacturers than it already is. Pick a specific radar, build a specific arrow, and set a specific environment for the speed rate testing. X brand chrono, X brand arrow @ 300/350/400g with specific insert, vane config, nock, x brand drop away, no peep, and tested in natural light. I am sure I missed something, but the process for the branded rating should have as little variance as possible. As the consumers, we should be choosing a bow on all different aspects, not just speed. The manufacturers' on the other hand, should be as transparent and honest as possible. There is no excuse for them not to be and I wish at least one big company would step up and lead the way.

[@_DeFiNiTeLy_Not_BrAd_]

If they used the ATA spec and were honest, it wouldn't be an issue. The problem is with "ibo" spec, there is no draw length restrictions.

[@jons7e]

Don’t forget rotating mods… will def change efficiency of bow

[@Gibsonlife573]

Truth

[@Theiliteritesbian]

Lol 2x speed is the same as young instagram motivator ppl jacked up on pre workout

[@miket8018]

Give me a bow that throws a 500grain arrow around 270-280fps and I am ready

[@shawndecastro8457]

👍

[@shawndecastro8457]

That didn't work but thanks John

[@Gibsonlife573]

20 strands will always shot faster then 24

[@timbow50]

I can’t imagine anyone with any common sense hasn’t realized part or all of what’s in this video. IMO, never believe all or part of any companies promotional material. Doesn’t matter what the product is. Apples to apples comparison doesn’t really exist.

[@jimjones1442]

Bows 10 years ago were faster what are you talking about

[@Life-of-Bluegrass_Music]

Bullshit

[@weldermike7017]

Just like the auto industry, full of baloney lol

[@craighunt1628]

Just pissing off the industry lol. Ppl don't like the truth.

[@billstiger2359]

Agree with most of the content. But it sounds like you’re talking about a deviation of a a few FPS. But when tested to IBO Specs some of these values are 20 to 30 FPS less then advertised.