The failed utopia of the creative class.

[@sarahkendall5714]

I was talking to my dad the other day about being a first time buyer, I am 27 and living with my family, I have a job in the city and its good pay. I can only afford a 1 bed flat in a village 40 minutes away from work. My dad bought his first house when he was 21, it was a three bedroom house with a big garden, and he was earning way less than what I am earning now. The class system has changed over the last 30 years, but our systems and ways of thinking are still stuck in 1980s.

[@La_xula_dorada]

I feel you...this is brutal. I am 33, a teacher, with a salary somewhat approaching 80K and I have no prospects of ever buying a home where I work (urban city in the Bay Area, CA)...I also don't even know that I can afford to stay in this city for much longer. It's funny because my experience is a teacher and why I have been teaching for 12 years is BECAUSE IT IS VERY creative, but the way that neo-liberalism has taken a stronghold, it is robbing the profession of any autonomy and the conditions for being able to remain creative have completely fallen by the way side :(

[@pequodexpress]

@@La_xula_dorada Do you have half-decent administrators?

[@seabreeze4559]

staglfation, wages stagnate and prices of assets go up because the central banks keep printing money to devalue the currency workers spend

[@pequodexpress]

This is all by design to limit the economic prospects of changing demographics, at least in the U.S., but this seems to be creeping into other societies as well, as if it is a roadmap to show how other societies might be able to get away with it. If economic prospects are squeezed so is electoral participation. It is an extension of the U.S. Southern Strategy, of which both Republicans and corporate Democrats are guilty. Good luck to us all.

[@jhmmp]

Same in asia

[@rongallipoli7701]

The loss of the commons, of public spaces, is a factor here. Actual artists and students - as opposed to corporate 'creatives' - will go where the rent is cheap, because they have little money. Bona-fide bohemians will drink cheap wine in the park with their friends, not go to cocktail bars. But the modern city is very unfriendly to the poor, creative or not.

[@sofiabravo1994]

The city has always been indifferent with the entry level workers.

[@chilldude30]

Yeah. That has got much worse where I live (uk) too in the past few decades. It was much easier to 'slum it' in a big city in say 1982. I imagine the same is true in the US (the dude from the big lebowski, set in LA in 1990 springs to mind)

[@danielhutchinson6604]

@@blakejohnson3864 Your generalization of the Wealthy seems to ignore some of the rich who do show appreciation for well done artistry..... They may seem cheap and vulgar at times but the rare example of appreciation does appear.....

[@pahwraith]

@@Tania-rg7jp haha, im doing this in chicago. I found a weird space that im gonna turn into an illegal apartment. But my rent will be under bucks a week. When a legit one would cost 900-1100 at the very least. Ill be able to focus on my documentary films and take more risks. Rather than constantly shoot weddings and corporate videos.

[@ColinTherac117]

@@blakejohnson3864 Period blood paintings and the infamous "piss christ" are not exactly something desired by normal well-adjusted people, nor by the middle class who spend their 12 hour work days managing multi million dollar business infrastructures only to take home 60k a year after all the employee salaries and other bills are paid. Only the ultra wealthy spend money on such crap and only as a form of legal tax evasion in exchange for favors that cannot be bought directly with money.

[@katatsumuri-san9588]

I think the worst thing social media has ever done to us is promoting horrible idea that you have to monetize your creativity, your passion - and, ultimately, your soul - either for money or clout. It creates a goal to put out steady stream of product - "content" - with the same level of quality, of course ! - or else, who would want a defective product? However, the sole purpose of creativity is exploration. Art exists only in challenging the unknown. The monetization of creativity is inherently opposing creativity and killing it.

[@r.thomasmurphy1533]

YES! This is what I have been saying to myself for about a year now. I really enjoy being creative, but I hate that people think it is a waste of time to create stuff when you aren't making money off of it or gaining fame for your creation. This is why I long for the old patronage system of creatives. Wealthy sponsors could fund the work of creatives and the creatives could share their content for free with the world. Even those who don't want to it professionally should still be encouraged to create and give to the world rather than seeing their creation as a cash cow.

[@preyaxpatel]

Nailed it 🎯

[@samurottman6832]

Yup 100%, this is why I don't like the idea of pursuing my love for content creation as a career it's much more fun and liberating when it's just a hobby or side thing you can do to earn money.

[@SafianiMahat]

Well said

[@GeorgiaPeck]

I agree. As soon as I started taking commissions for painting I quickly started to hate art. It’s hard to know what to do because I’m most happy when creative so a sit down corporate office job really bothers me

[@Ermude10]

Can we just take a moment to be amazed at the fact that The Guardian chose to sponsor Alice with an exclusive of all people!? This is such a high profile and highly respected newspaper who is very keen on keeping that reputation. It really says something about what they think about Alice's content. Well done! Félicitations!

[@benw7961]

It might be highly respected in some quarters, but a lot of its core readership have very mixed feelings about it, and many have abandoned it in recent years. Despite claims to be 'free of political interference' in most pivotal moment it sides with the status quo. Even its own history, celebrating 200 years of the paper, had to admit that fact .(For example, "during the US civil war, the Manchester Guardian was so concerned about the cotton trade that underpinned it that it sided with the slave-owning south.") And more recently its contempt for those who are seeking to address many of the social ills it agonises about over was abundantly clear in its constant savaging of the Corbyn project.

[@samarjitchowdhury7160]

The part where you mention the urge of young people to socialize in city centers really resonated with my current situation. I live in a suburb and my college and most of my classmates are based in the city. On instagram i see my classmates put up pics and videos of themselves lounging in niche cafes and indie stores, just having a good time. Upon seeing their posts I feel a little, well no other way to say this, sad. It takes me more than an hour to reach the city and with covid, there are a lot of restrictions on inter-district public commute. All in all, I feel pretty miserable that I do not have the means(economic as well as physical) to experience life like my peers but that part, for some reason, made me feel that it is okay to experience these feelings. Also, great video!! love your work

[@sif_2799]

I feel you. I live 30km away from the city. I arrive right on time for my uni classes to start and leave right when they end to catch the train home. Not to mention the last bus home comes half past nine so cant even go to their evening get togethers. No Time to socialise at all. I'm almost finished with my studies and havent made a Single friend. It's depressing.

[@samarjitchowdhury7160]

@@sif_2799 it's a struggle really. Also, I live 33km away from my city as well 👀

[@sif_2799]

@@samarjitchowdhury7160 Ok to be exact it's 37km but what a coincidence :D but damn 30 km and you're still in the suburbs, that must be a huge City. I live out in the countryside with my 30km xD

[@Gamer45977]

I lived in a big city with my family,great university,great places to go out and have fun,but I decided to leave it all behind me. I moved to my old family house where my grandparents still live. It's based in a small town with just over 6000 people living in it. For me,that was the best decision that I could have made. It gave me peace and clarity that I needed. My point is,you don't have to live in a big city and go out in fancy cafes to find happiness. You just need right people around you and trust in yourself. :)

[@itsdonuttime7729]

I relate to your feelings. It's ok to feel that way because it is true covid change our social lives a lot. You are doing the right thing by continuing to be safe a socially distanced.

[@brittany7288]

Your example of the graphic designer really hit home. I’m a copywriter and I’ve always worked with graphic designers. Two seemingly creative jobs yet they’re far more about productivity, capitalism, marketing tactics, templates, and people pleasing than truly creative work. In the past, I’ve had to track my time and justify every minute which makes my skin crawl. For me, writing often happens in bursts rather than sustained productivity over an 8-hour day, 40-hour week.

[@celeste9455]

I had a fashion design degree and worked as fashion merchandiser but quitted as it was so boring. I have been thinking about transitioning to copywriting. Are you thinking about switching career now if all they cares is efficiency?

[@applecrave1097]

@@celeste9455 The issue is the work environment we have set in place as a standard over that's worked its way up to what it is now, over the decades. Our Capitalist centered society has made it so that we not only just care but prioritize productivity over a set amount of hours. This priority has turned out to the extreme, were we crunch the numbers to squueeez as much as we can out of the workforce or singular person, to get out as much as they can in a short amount of time, at their expense. Toxic

[@brittsvids]

Well, hello, fellow Copywriter Brittany here! I find that only 5-10 hours of my work week is actually writing. The rest is all administrative stuff, revising and revising again to please a client, participating in meetings, etc. I don't think there are truly any 9 to 5 creative jobs that are pure creativity..outside of the dream careers of KZbinr, novelist etc. there will always be a sacrifice of creativity for stability.

[@jazzfan7491]

I worked mostly in China (for an animation company there) from 2014-2016. When I came back to Los Angeles at the end of 2016 I noticed that suddenly everyone below the level of producer was now called a "creative". My honest reaction was that it was a bit condescending... the idea seemed to be "the people who don't have real power are called 'creatives'"... at the same time it seemed to be an example of the phenomenon of "grade inflation" in the movie biz... people who really should have been paid more for their substantive contribution to a project were, rather, rewarded by being called "creative" rather than "animator" or "designer" or "writer". In that sense it was paying those people in prestige (an old phenomenon) while giving the real money in increasing amounts to the producers and the production companies.

[@Magnulus76]

"Paying in prestige" is exactly what it's about.

[@whatsleft100]

@@Magnulus76 I'm a nurse and in the Uk the government liked to pay us in Claps , only through striking have we started the shift.

[@sandrinelaberge8136]

I once work in a bookstore (a chain) and they didnt see the books, they saw products to sell. They called some stands "impulsive buy stands" and it disgusted me. I still stayed to work there, but I was quickly fired, because 1 : I was trying to read books back cover so I could suggest books to clients, but apparently, this wasnt what i was supposed to do. 2 : they didnt want us to talk between employees. When I walked by a another employee, I would only say hi and the assistant boss walked across the fucking bookstore to tell me that we would be splited. I thought this was a place for culture, but it was capitalist as any other shop.

[@Man-ej6uv]

god, that’s horrible :(

[@rodeogirl8459]

what was their reasoning behind not wanting you to talk to other employees?

[@raz1572]

@@rodeogirl8459 control

[@TheNewTravel]

This is a great video essay. You put your finger on something I've always faintly felt but never had the words for. See I'm a full-time KZbinr (barely) and still struggling to get by. There is a path to more wealth, but it involves doubling down on product placements and selling things to my viewers. Essentially, becoming less of a creative and more of a businessman. But if I wanted to be a businessman I would have done that in the first place. The allure of KZbin was creative self-expression. And yet, when I meet strangers sometimes and say I'm employed as a KZbinr I'll see a look on their eyes like they think that's a dream. As if they think I've escaped. But I haven't escaped the system anymore than they have. The utopia, as you put it, is paper thin.

[@seabreeze4559]

unpaid carers in the uk make less than minimum wage and that's somehow legal, it's like less than £2 a day and nobody does anything. Jessica Kellgren Fozard has a video on it. Min wage is now going up to £9.50 an hour, carers get no increase. Slave wages are still happening, with First World living costs like rent.

[@ColinTherac117]

@@seabreeze4559 If your job pays very little, then go do something else. You are free to go do anything. If something pays little, it is because it is not needed all that much by people. Meanwhile welders, a skill that anyone with enough IQ to graduate high school can do, make 150k a year. Stop being money illiterate. Go do what makes money. That is what people want you to do and will be what best serves humanity organically without violent coercion.

[@DreadPitt]

@@ColinTherac117 so can you explain the wages of a nurse or a firefighter, compared to a banker or middle manager? Can you say that one is more important than the other, based on their salary?

[@ColinTherac117]

@@DreadPitt What is important is an organic function based on what other people want. I would say an abortionist has negative value. But to a person seeking an abortion, their services would be of high value. I would say that a person who would fix my house would be of a certain high value. The government said me fixing my house was of such low value, that they deemed construction as not in the category of "essential worker". Anyone's wages are based on consent of the people making the deal. If a middle manager at a bank is being paid more than a nurse, then the bank values the middle manager more than the hospital values the nurse. Which bear in mind, might also have something to do with how money itself is valued by the respective parties considering how a person who spent their lives learning to be a nurse versus a person who learned to manage money might value money. It has been tried time and again with planned economies to say that some form of objective value could say that the nurse would somehow be of more intrinsic value than a middle bank manager. And every time that has failed in the real world. Objective value theory has been debunked in every form. For further information and sources, please consult the economics lectures that are available on this site.

[@EasyPeasyVegan]

@@ColinTherac117 yeah also buddy, most "un-skilled" labor jobs are all paid like shit. So funny how people (consumers) of McDonald's a global company, one of the richest on 🌎 has tons of employees but yeah tell me about how all their employees are useless and have not made them much of their money through the decades? Also, I can attest as an "un-skilled" and "skilled" worker. They both don't mean shit to mega corps. I used to be a pharmacy technician. Went to trade school for it in 2014 and graduated from it and all. I got one of my first tech jobs at are 21 and you know what my beginning wage was? $8.60 starting out when minimum wage in my state at time was flipping $8.55. A whole five sense more to work in the pharmacy; granted I was naive at time because I was preety much just entering the workforce at this age and only had a couple jobs prior as experience. Then that same job for me was rhe 1st job I ever quit with no notice because I saw how bullshit it really was. Wasted 3 years of my time on this Earth 🌎 for breadcrumb pay. Quit at a whole $9.63 after THREE YEARS. A dollar and three cents increase over that time. They'd give horrible wage 'increases.' I've not gone back to that work since 2018. Quite a stressful job it can be with many varying tasks and responsibilities for "un-skilled" pay basically. Then I've had many factory work jobs the past couple years. They pay trash too. Made you wear a facial mask because of covid in a hot ass factory. Like what? Then we still had to wear them because everybody with the jab to supposedly protect them and make them covid proof still are somehow not protected enough?? So basically intolerable workplaces pre pandemic let aline when it happened, intolerable pay to live on, working with insufferable people like my job now where there is hella nepotism. There's just not enough control for an individual to possess in this system. I don't want to work. Surprise, surprise like most otherdon't. We've been forced and face homelessness and hunger/starvation otherwise. Not a fair trade when wages are stagnated in perpetuity it seems and costs of any and all are in perpetuity rising. So no, fuck being a slave to a corrupted beyond belief system.

[@jasminetaylor7223]

as a member of the creative class studying architecture in toronto lmao, i would 100% say that there is a capitalization of creativity. like at my core, i’m a creative person, i’m always looking to solve problems and do things in a new way but deadass, the way i have to pump out “new” ideas every week is exhausting. like this is no longer creative. a lot of people i know experience this. we’ve dubbed it “creative burnout.” youre running through the methods of creation without actually producing anything of value. it’s just interesting to look at how we’ve package creatively for maximum attraction but doesn’t necessarily produce the innovation that is inherit to what creativity is

[@joewhite1969]

yoooooo same. I have to just make more of the same thing. really suck the soul out.

[@KrisMF]

10:13 - this is such a great point. I'm a digital designer at an agency. most people assume that design is a very creative field, when in reality, if you're working with a brand that has established brand guidelines, creativity is more stifled than you'd think and bringing in new ideas isn't always encouraged. in that sense, design can become just about production and efficiency rather than "creativity." in fact, in a lot of places I've worked, I've been told to pursue "creative side projects" to improve my craft, probably because even management recognizes that we don't (always) have a true creative outlet in our day to day work. this isn't true for all designers, of course, but just my experience working in tech.

[@ShadeLeeds]

Yeah same though. My work essentially sees me as just the person who has the Adobe Suite programs. "Can you do this real quick?" "Can you open CAD files?" "Can you design 20 product labels by Friday? I know it's tight but you're so great!" I work at a fairly big company even. I'm just a pair of hands. Mind-reading would be more useful than creativity here.

[@popculturephase2]

I'M SO HYPE that The Guardian is sponsoring you omg. Congratulations, Alice. You deserve it.

[@itsraysis7907]

Because she's a White Female.

[@linamessaoui7414]

@@wildoranges que j’ai

[@seabreeze4559]

they never talk about the under-class or they say it's all wefare bums (not true) and criminals (nope)

[@seabreeze4559]

@@Tania-rg7jp end the fed, or audit the fed at least (and BOE)

[@sr.cosmos4543]

Lmao

[@louisenoisywords]

YES YES YES. I work as a motion designer at a media company, and most of the profitable projects I work on are not creative at all. We are encouraged to take initiative to start our own creative side projects, but those projects are frowned upon when our bosses look at the time sheets. Aka - the non-creative pixel pushing client work will always be prioritised.

[@normandy2501]

I'm assuming they meant start them on your own time, but didn't directly say that. I personally wouldn't expect anything different when working for/representating a company that isn't your own (depending on their goals at least).

[@louisenoisywords]

@@normandy2501 no, they have actually said to do it on company time, in order to RnD and expand our competence and offer.

[@CrisOnTheInternet]

I relate 100% with this, they encourage us to do it in our time, I allegedly being paid for 48 hours but working only 40, so they say those "extra" 8 hours could be for those side projects.

[@normandy2501]

@@louisenoisywords Maybe it's just my experience with companies, but they typically mean the opposite of what they say in some manner when it comes to creativity. There's always an asterisk after every proposal. I look at their brand and work around that specifically, not nessisarily my own interpretation of it. Less time is spent wasted when they're looking to reject something. It sounds cynical, but that's just how it is when it's not your personal brand entirely, but instead it's just your personal assignment for their brand.

[@louisenoisywords]

@@normandy2501 That’s very true

[@ilyas859]

“By looking only at income or lifestyle, we see the results of class, but not the origins of class. We see how we are different in our possessions, but not how we are related and connected, and made different, in the process of making what we possess.”' - Michael Zweig (The working class majority) got the quote from jacobin magazine but I first heard it in a video of yugopnik. I think that if people really "owned the capital inside their own heads", they wouldn't have to sell it's products to survive.

[@ilyas859]

@@WindofChange2023 you sell something the was produced by many people for the benefit of a few. And some people don't want be subservient or force other people to do that

[@ilyas859]

@@WindofChange2023 I disagree with your interpretation of the current state of affairs.

[@ilyas859]

​@@WindofChange2023 "... people who have the least understanding of things are often the most outspoken against them" - please continue to explain your position in 2+ paragraph form :) and I wish you the best of luck fulfilling the basic human need for ... debt consolidation. You know I've always wanted to become a debt consolidator as kid. Because you know, that's soooo much more useful than becoming an astronaut, a teacher, doing science or becoming an engineer but hey, you gotta make money to survive right? so you have to make as much of it as possible and that science stuff is only useful to make money :P

[@Okayletsg0]

I’m a wildlife conservationist and fine artist, in australia things are a bit different but the artist is certainly treated like a different class than other workers, like our work isn’t legitimate labour and just playing, we aren’t serious and we don’t require appropriate compensation. I spend more hours on my paintings for local display than I do rehabilitating animals but only one is taken as a contribution to society.

[@pequodexpress]

I'm surprised conserving nature is taken as a contribution.

[@user-lp7fc4iq3u]

@@pequodexpress ??

[@m.josena4485]

@@pequodexpress why ?

[@pequodexpress]

@@m.josena4485 I'm not stating that I feel this way, but that American society, at least, is reluctant to recognize work that does not contribute to GDP in obvious ways.

[@marksittner602]

Well, because its intangible assets, so the value is arbitrarily placed. There is no direct comparison to other similar assets, so.

[@electricwildsheep]

I used to work in advertising and I completely agree with this. To separate workers like I am as a “creative class” is disingenuous and to say that I “own” the mans of production? I had worked up to 12 hours a day in front of my screen writing copy and graphics to add value only for teh corporations that were my company’s clients. That meant I worked up to 11pm on weeks leading up to a pitch deadline. That was NOT me owning the means of production. In my country workers in the industry are very rarely unionised. Now that I am a freelancer, I am more often than not considered a gig worker so that leaves me out of employment-based retirement benefits and insurance. Like you said, we’re left in a “precarious” situation. Knock on wood, but my biggest fear is having a health crisis that I cannot pay my way out of.

[@MorningLightHaze]

"Making creativity productive ultimately killing creativity in the process" - so accurate

[@ПОЧИНЮКУКУХУ]

Nope

[@JamesTheWise_]

You should make a video sometime about the importance & impact urban planning/urbanism has on ones mental health & economic class. Ever since I watched Not Just Bikes & Eco Gecko videos I finally realized why I find car-dependent/sprawling cities & towns depressing. Humans are social creatures, we need connection with others in order to be mentally (& physically) healthy. Sprawling/car dependent cities & towns are terrible for ones physical/mental health, your wallet/the economy & for the environment too. More leftists need to have discussions about urban planning & its importance.

[@AliceCappelle]

Yes !

[@danielhutchinson6604]

The move from the Farm to the City has ruined agriculture as well as city life. The development of suburbia has now destroyed a lot of acres of productive Farmland.....The Climate Migration is pushing the limitations of our water supply systems all over the World.... Could we use a more agricultural based lifestyle, where we could actually see the people who produce the food we consume? Is the effort to move the farm workers to the city to serve the wheels of industry now seeking alternative uses for the humans they herded into the big cities? The single common element of this spiritual imbalance seems to involve is the use of money......

[@ColinTherac117]

The mouse utopia experiment says otherwise. Too many mammals in limited space triggers internal psychological triggers that nature has to work against overpopulation resulting in total collapse within a few generations. Small towns and communities are how humans function. The natural size of human organization is the size of about 30 people, which is why the military unit of a platoon is that size. Even urban planners are showing that the best way to organize cities is to actually break them apart into smaller walkable ones with transit in between.

[@danielhutchinson6604]

@@ColinTherac117 The current devotion to selling Gas, seems to trump your point? I live in a Valley that was formerly grazing and some Hay crops, in a semi arid environment. The rush of a climate migration to flee the dried up wells of overdevelopment in the Southwest, is filling our Valley with Pilgrims leaving the dried up wells of California and Arizona is search of water. 2-5 acre lots are now selling for the same amount 20 acres cost 20 years ago. over 50 new neighbors are filling up the former agricultural area so fast the water supplies seem to be challenged more every day.... The splendor of mans accomplishments is now demonstrating the folly of falling for some developers promises of riches. Capitalism is consuming itself as it runs out of places to exploit..... Naomi Klein has a valid point....

[@NJGuy1973]

@@AliceCappelle You ever read The Geography of Nowhere by James Howard Kunstler?

[@qualifiedarmchaircritic]

Creatives definitely are workers, and they are expected more than anyone to be grateful for what morsels the capitalist class throws them because their work is "enjoyable" - the same goes for academia. As if that type of work didn't also have to support lives and families. Not to say that creative or academic workers are "more oppressed", this is not oppression olympics. But it means that creatives and academics are exploited and underpaid and actively discouraged from organising, unionising, or criticising the system.

[@snailart14]

@@WindofChange2023 lol you sound fun at parties

[@jonahhekmatyar]

@@WindofChange2023 lol

[@prkp7248]

They exist only because of class structure, but the problem is that this class structure is international, and true working class of this structure is in so called "developing countries". That's why those who are "woke" among "creative class" think that they are working class, cause they don't see that true working class is on the other side of the globe. "creative class" make their living out of leftovers of surpluse value that bourgeoisie extract from labour of working class in 3rd and 2nd world. All those marketing and PR people don't create any value in their work. 50 years ago there was only a small number of people that were creating ads for companies, and most people in western countries were fsctory workers. Those societies were a maybe less wealthy in general, but when it comes to individual - they were wealthier that their grandkids today, because they were those who make everything and they knew it and had strong labour unions behinds their backs. Nowadays, even if their grandkids who work in some corporation will be able to unionize, they in reality can't achieve anything, because nothing is dependent on their job, without them everything will be like before. We can see this cleary if we look at stats about financial crisis in 2008 - countries that still have their own industry had better situation when crisis started, than those who moved their production abroad. Let China, India, Bangladesh, Vietnam, Indonesia etc. stop their export to "western countries" for a month and you will see that so called "creative class" don't produce anything.

[@nazifdanesi9623]

This reminds me of the job I recently quit. It is a job as a content writer which in the description was supposed to be something creative. But when I started working, the editors tried to police everything I did down to my choice of words. If I structured a sentence to create a certain emotion, they would say it is too much words, or it is too positive, or it is too heavy. At the end of the day, writing for blogs and websites was not creative. It was very suffocating so I quit. P.S the pay was shite

[@soulfulgardener]

The reason I’ve looked at applying for some of these ‘creative writing’ jobs and never have

[@empowernstattauspowern3388]

As a social anthropologist, I enjoy your content very much. Well researched as always. I just wanted to add the information that the creative class is defined by a lower economic, but higher social and cultural capital - speaking in Bourdieus differenciation between the sorts of capitals.

[@lemuelsap3686]

If I'm not mistaken, Marx saw creative work as a crucial component in human fulfillment, and his utopia was one where individuals are free to harness their creativity--not to maximize someone else's profits, or earn enough money to only survive--but for the fulfillment that it brings the individual. Capitalism, though it does spur creativity in innovation for making money, ultimately stifles it in a more fundamental sense I'm not a Marx scholar though, so please feel free to correct me if I misread his work. Happy to learn more!

[@ajeethavithiy1564]

I think you've gotten it correct! Species being was Marx's concept that human beings have this intrinsic essence or potential to do a (creative) variety of activities. The idea is that humans are naturally driven to produce because those products serve as social connections to others (like baking a cake for family and friends) and as 'reflections' of ourselves (the product can become an extension of our identity). Thus, there's an intimate connection between the producer and the product. The reason that capitalism stifles it then is because capitalism alienates the worker from their product by reducing their role in the work process and having each worker work on (specialize in) one part of the product (rather than its whole) for efficiency. Thus, according to Marx, by alienating the worker from their product, capitalism alienates workers from others and themselves. (Btw, I'm also not a scholar! Just a sociology major currently taking theory :) Perhaps this is an unnecessary expansion on your comment, but I just had to take the moment to prove to myself my tuition's worth 😅)

[@lemuelsap3686]

@@ajeethavithiy1564 Well put! Thanks for expanding on that :)

[@maestro723]

"his utopia was one where individuals are free to harness their creativity--not to maximize someone else's profits, or earn enough money to only survive--but for the fulfillment that it brings the individual." I don't understand - what's stopping you from expressing yourself through creative mediums (given you don't live in a country where such activities are banned)?

[@lemuelsap3686]

@@maestro723 hello! Strictly speaking, I can still engage in fulfilling creative work, but in reality it’s a bit less straightforward than simply doing it. As I understand it based on my lived experience and my fellow artist friends’ experience, fulfilling creative work is not always economically viable. Sustainable creative work is usually the type that serves the profit of some business/corporation, which means the creative work has to meet their desires and interests, not the creator’s desires and interests. Like anyone else, I need food and shelter, and they are not cheap. Most of my time and energy goes into making money through more sustainable means (non art 9-5 job), which leaves little time, energy left for any fulfilling creative pursuit. If I just go and devote myself 100% to doing my own creative work, I most likely will not make enough money for food and shelter. So what ends up happening is my creative projects get sidelined or abandoned so I can make enough money to stay alive On a wider scope, all types of work has potential to be creative and fulfilling, but prizing efficiency and profit stifles that potential. A comment this thread above explains it quite well.

[@lemuelsap3686]

@@WindofChange2023 thank you for bringing this up! As someone who’s worked multiple, minimum wage, manual labor, custodial jobs, your concern is something I am aware of and thinking through. Marx’s insights about capitalism are valuable (at least to me), but his vision for a communist society, as well as the path to getting there, is not without issues. As you’re probably aware of, the creativity Marx valued is not exclusive to visual arts-rather in other fields as well (hunting, cooking, medicine, construction & engineering, to use your examples). Cooking can be laborious, but also creative and fulfilling. Construction is laborious, but can be creative and fulfilling. Alienation under capitalism stifles the potential for creativity and fulfillment. Your concern is very important important because things (farming, building, healthcare) still need to be done. In Marx’s vision, those things would not be done for someone’s monetary profit-which typically leads to alienation, which stifles creativity and human fulfillment. As for jobs that are essential and nobody wants to do, if I’m not mistaken, Marx saw automation as a potential solution. Thanks again for raising a counterpoint! It’s important to recognize the faults in any single worldview. I’m not an expert on this topic, so I have lots to learn still. I’ll check out those people you mentioned too

[@sevilnatas]

A long time ago, in a life far far away, I was a graphic designer in a factory where they produced patches, for the uniforms, companies rented for their workers. We a team, of 10 or so, "graphic designers", produced camera ready artwork of the client's company logos, that were faxed to the factory. The factory used that camera ready artwork to produce screens that were used to screenprint the patches. I absolutely was an, all be it beginning, graphic artist doing non-creative factory artwork, required to complete a certain number of designs per day. Interestingly, I was fired because I talked too much to my neighboring graphic artist, while working at my drawing table. I was the highest producing artist, but my propensity for not following the no talking rule, among other rules, was incompatible with the factory's way of doing business.

[@naomiwallace3658]

I'm sorry if you said this and I just didn't hear it, but "the precariat" is a term that I've found very useful. I encountered it when I was a grad student learning about other grad students experiencing food insecurity. Middle class, fancy titles on the way, but one wrong step means losing your next meal or your shelter, precarious.

[@coscorrodrift]

Didn't know about that word but in Spain "precarious employment" is a term that basically every young person knows lol. People with very little saving capacity, low salaries, long hours, temporal contracts...

[@andrejdamis7263]

you can always get a minimum wage factory job. But that would make you one of the smelly worker underclass.

[@manicpepsicola3431]

@Andrej Damiš it's still the same situation being a blue collar worker as well.

[@jasongold4312]

I have a degree in graphic design. The main take away from my degree was, being creative is not part of design. It's all about following the rules. That world wasn't for me, as I never found work in it. I've got an uncreative job in a warehouse now, and I keep myself alive through drawing on my own.

[@ColinTherac117]

How are you so wrapped up in yourself that you fail to realize that your warehouse job is pretty much one of the most important jobs in the world right now. With all of the Covid lockdowns breaking nearly every single supply chain in the global market, logistics workers including warehousing are the key to ensuring humanity doesn't starve to death.

[@jasongold4312]

@@ColinTherac117 no one is eating this stuff, but I get what you're saying. As important as the job may be, as a creative, it is soul crushing. My art is to keep me from losing my sanity.

[@kaylagraceeee]

THIS. As soon as I realized this, I changed my major. I just couldn’t allow capitalism to destroy my love for art.

[@colourmequaint9690]

Same here- studied graphic design and hated the job. Even the illustration of a childrens book was extremely regulated and left no freedom for creative decisions on my part. The tragedy is that the jobs I can apply to pay so badly, that I would barely have time for art. So doind it "on the side" isn't really feasable either. Still trying to find balance...

[@jasongold4312]

@@colourmequaint9690 hang in there. For a while all the art i could manage was doodling on napkins in the breakroom at work. You'll find that balance, and find your art again, I just know it.

[@guesswho5790]

It's amazing how you captured the soul-crushing reality of being a graphic designer. Unless you're the owner of the company or independent, there is very little creativity in the process other than making something visually attractive to the masses. As a "small" designer you are expected to be more of an Adobe artisan more than anything. Same goes for any other work that requires a certain level of craftmanship, digital or otherwise. (Needless to say, I changed fields of study once I realized that WORKING as a designer sucks unless you really, really, really, love it). Side note: Absolutely loved the video essay!! It's so pertinent to what is going on in the world. Merci!

[@mainchannel1566]

An hour before watching this video I saw on Twitter that galleries are selling Hunter Biden's art for $100k more than signed Picassos. Success as a creative is *heavily* dependent on who you are, and who you know.

[@mississipi1103]

I am lowkey sad and very happy at the same time because Picasso was an absolute douchebag But I totally agree with what you're saying

[@emeric6]

"Success as a creative is heavily dependent on who you are, and who you know." that works for almost any industry

[@kevinzack537]

Lol

[@vacantvideostore]

'galleries are selling Hunter Biden's art for $100k more than signed Picassos' Let me fix it for you: 'those who wish to influence the Biden administration are laundering political donation money through art purchases at way above true market value'

[@soulfulgardener]

Are we still talking no about Hunter Biden? Get off it already

[@PokhrajRoy.]

In the Arts, you need Social Capital to sustain you and create Economic Capital. The truth is that money makes money. We also have to understand how Art is both a result of appropriation and gatekeeping.

[@carolinannapichler]

As an artist who currently studies in music university I really see my peers being pressured to work soon and pay their rent - whilst they usually play in prestigious orchestras and have beautiful concerts, they spend more time in rehearsal as they are even paid and barely can afford everything they need. In Austria there is the saying „bread - less art“ which is badly translated but revers to being in touch with the higher classes who pay the expensive VIP Tickets, also being worshipped and romanticised by them through their performance, but still have to come home to a cheap flat and maybe dept - and even if they are doing good financially, the time they have to invest in their craft and career still prevents them to work towards goals like investing money or owning stuff (except their instrument). This is why many musicians choose to be teaching their instrument over just performing - and thus maybe reaching „middle class“ .

[@borkborkx10]

Part of this is how in creative writing publishing there's a real inequality of opportunity. I can submit stories or poems to magazines, agents, and publishers and hope to get accepted--in that way, it's supposedly a level field based solely on the quality of the art. (Nevermind that the forerunners of these publishers let Joyce die in poverty and didn't realize Moby Dick was good until 50 years after Melville was dead.) However, writers with leisure time and basic needs already met can devote the massive amounts of time it takes to submit work to agents and magazines. Writers with more money can go to the workshops, conferences, and retreats where they improve their work and network within the industry. People who can afford to live in New York and still do all this have the advantage of being close to the major publishing centers (in the US at least.) Plus, the writing establishment--big name literary writers, agents, publishers, publicists, all those folks--seem to be an insular group, and wealthy to begin with. It can't be good for our culture that our literature, at least the stuff that's recognized in the larger culture, comes mainly from this one class of very rich people.

[@Iksvomid]

The interesting thing about this channel is how easily it can be described even though it is a highly philosophical channel. It is basically Alice showing us how deep the rabbit hole goes.

[@franmcwhorter9654]

Guardian reached out to you - what a compliment! And you cited them for journalistic sources - what a compliment!

[@nicksince9487]

The story you told about the girl who asked that question to the creator at that conference resonates so much with me. I actually remember listening to one of my favourite podcasts where the interviewer was discussing the launch of an exciting new apparel label that the athlete he was talking to had just launched. For a solid 15 minutes, this athlete went on and on about how the brand was all about empowerment, creative collaboration and the "team". At first I thought, "oh wow, someone doing well and sharing the good fortune with the local creatives in his community! cool!" -- but not even five minutes later, the host asked how we was able to compensate his "team". The athlete paused, and you could see the most awkward look on his face as he quietly replied, "we working on that part.." This athlete had the privilege of being on a major podcast, he had the attention and recognition from all kinds of brand sponsors, and his social media presence included photos of him wearing said apparel while driving around in a brand new Audi. It makes me sick to think about how many young, inspired and ambitious creatives fall into the trap of thinking that they're on "the team" when in reality, their talent, capabilities and time are just drained away in another form of exploitation. Alice, new here - but love your channel and I'm happy to have stumbled across it. Keep doing what you do!

[@meisfriend]

The idea that creatives own the means of production because it’s in their head just isn’t true. As a creative you’re giving that away to the company you work for. Work contracts for creative jobs have a clause that transfers the copyright of (almost) anything you make under work time to the company. If copyright to the ideas you create is the means of production you certainly won’t own it when working for a boss..

[@kelly55]

During a class on a specific section of European copyright law I believe we discussed a case where even projects outside of working hours could be claimed by the company if it was adjacent to the work performed during working hours 😥

[@meisfriend]

@@kelly55 Yeah.. I unfortunatly had that in my contract when I was a game designer. Legally everything I made was property of the company. In reality they´d only claim something that fits their company :(

[@robcarr9968]

As creatives we really need to start pushing for slice of the pie, I want to see more graophic designers share a % of the marketing campaign they designed all the visuals for, UX designers getting % of the apps they design and more, it's tough but it must a unified front, to reach this sharing of wealth from creative endeavors we are part of.

[@antoniaizuebe7228]

You have to be freelance and not work for a company. Those 'companies' should be your 'agents' . Like Talent agents for for the big corporations that are look for the best designers, editors. They should work for you and get a cut of your pie , not the other way round. Don't conform. Let your unique gift shine through 💞

[@robcarr9968]

So many great things in this video, I'd start out by saying that I feel a lot of people have been duped by these representations of graphic designers to think it's an artistic career, you can make it one by choosing some fields, but truth be told at it's core design should be solving problems, graphic design solving visual communication problems through the tools you learn, which means a lot of the time understanding the elements that will work to solve the problem for said client, brand and audience, is there space for creativity, of course, I think almost any job has that whether society deems it creative or not, but it is not artistic. Second, one of the hardest things creatives have to encounter as they work and I truly feel a lot don't understand it for a lot of time if ever at all, is that for most clients it's about the bottom line, they are coming to you to solve a visual problem and generate more money, that's it, and if they don't see how you can do it or usually how it happens, you can't pitch or explain your value to them, they'll go for the cheap fiverr route, most company owner's won't care about the 20 hours you put into the custom lettering for their logo and the perfect kerning in their tagline, as such most creatives need to work for a person who has these capabilities under a usually low salary. In our ultra capitalistic society most creatives cannot show the monetary impact of their work and thus they are like another user said, almost relegated to "playful work" and shitty salaries, and you may hate it, but it is the world we live in and the state of affairs, either you prove a high ROI or I'll go with the option that does. And in the social media alternate reality, yes we can see a lot of creatives living out in NYC, SF, London, Paris, shopping all the time, having drinks, taking trips, but as with most career, either they are part of the .001% top performers who found a way to make it big, or statistically more probable, they are broke and live this social media reality through credit, but have no real assets. This is of course a vicious cycle, because it makes other creatives around the world see these lives and think they haven't made for some reason and as with mos social media, can lead to psychological distress.

[@darilietas]

Hi Alice - thank you for this and other videos on your channel! :) They help me think along with you and slowly start to unravel so many confusing inner feelings and negative thoughts that have grown within my mind over time. I've just started therapy working on my constant self-doubting and low self-esteem. I've also felt quite disconnected from society in the past few years because it seems like everyone's busy promoting something, hoping to become 'real influencers' instead of enjoying life, which is my personal focus. I have a blog, mostly for fun, and I'm slowly gathering a small audience of like-minded people. Yet, while I enjoy the creative process of making content, I absolutely lose myself and my confidence when it comes to marketing myself. Eventually, I end up feeling... fake. Things like the compulsive need for aesthetics everywhere, the constant promotion of seemingly every single moment of life, promoting the monetization of your hobbies - all of that makes me angry because I can't find my place in it all. It's difficult to grow without losing your genuine self - and having low self-esteem in the meantime. As I said, your videos and the thought process you uncover and promote makes me feel like I can finally connect with something, understand why I feel like this. I'll continue my therapy and also try to learn about these concepts. Hopefully, I'll learn to understand and accept it and find ways how to exist among all that, without sacrificing my own well-being and esteem. Have a lovely day :)

[@indrinita]

This is interesting because with the rise of working from home, I feel like more and more young people, including creative people are moving away from more expensive cities to cheaper places, including to small towns, suburbs and even villages.

[@buru44]

I really hope we can reimagine the ways our suburbs look, imagine the communities we could build.

[@iGhostr]

Maybe for USA, not here in Europe

[@Tashax405]

Maybe it's also my age (mid 30s) but over the last 3 years I've gone from having a lot of friends who lived in London to having not one. They've all moved out of London to buy houses. I think working from home definitely contributed to that as many of them kept their London based jobs while doing this.

[@PokhrajRoy.]

We all have Main Character Syndrome because our voices were never heard and now we’ve torn our vocal cords due to being overexposed.

[@xXxRaVeNcRoFt_LuVrr69]

I went a county fair this past summer and was more impressed by the creativity I witnessed in the local 4H Club showcase than with 95% of what is produced by the Creative Professional Caste.

[@TheChocolatiie]

Great video. I studied landscape architecture and graphic design - on my first course (south europe) I learned a lot about city layouts and philosophies and on my second one I went to art school in the UK. I quickly learned that class in the UK is just incomprehensible but apart from that I wish that some topics like access to art education in relation to wealth where touched upon. Rich kids going to art school to cosplay being a starving artist is something I never though I'd see but it happened loads, especially in London. This is why I kinda understand what that guy in the beginning said. Yes they were also paying rent and getting in "debt" by going to uni but some of us were working 2 jobs to get a degree and they were driving BMWs 💀

[@therantingboy]

If you have an arts degree and live in a city where your idea of a hard day's work is paying £1,500 a month for a room, drinking Oat Milk flat whites and having to work overtime on a brand project, you ain't working class. Being in a creative job is a middle class pipe dream with lots of people competing for a handful of top roles. It's generally a rigged game. Everyone I know who made it in film production had a friend or relative get them in. There is definitely a secret slave labour economy of desperate middle class kids making coffee and fetching sushi in Soho for agencies in post houses paying through the nose for sound design on their commercial, but the only kids who can afford to be runners at 12K a year, are rich and living with their parents. The difference between the struggle of the "creative class" vs the working class, is it's entirely voluntary for the creatives. You enter the game knowing it's incredibly tough and competitive. It's an option available to you and you can tap out when you want. Someone on minimum wage in small town england working a factory didn't choose that life. They're not chasing the dream of being a famous factory worker. Also you've conflated different types of "creative" roles. It's funny you use graphic design as your example, when that's an incredibly precise and workman-like form of art. Nothing like, say, an abstract oil painter trying to find a job. Fact is, creativity is synonymous with freedom, and the moment you're being paid and meeting a brief and deadlines, the freedom is removed and instantly the work feels less creative.

[@BrittPearceWatches]

I loved the start of this video! Now, I'm a Canadian who has lived in England for 6 years now. It took me about 2 years to figure out what "class" is here and navigate my way through the caste system that exists in the UK! So in Canada, a upper class person is someone with a lot of money. A middle class person is like, a normal, average income family. And lower class people are poorer people. (to be blunt). So to a Canadian standard, I grew up really middle class! But in the UK class is a MUCH BIGGER THING! And I still cannot fully wrap my head around it. Old money, new money, certain sensibilities, the way you speak, what your parents give you, YOUR EDUCATION (education is much more dividing here than in Canada. Oxbridge, all that BS) etc. I liked myself so much more before I understood the British class system. I hate the way I now categorise people and see the world. I wish I could see the world like an innocent Canadian again! We are a lot less divided by class, and it's one of the worst things about Britain.

[@masterculturedunkerque7918]

Lol Canada is less divided by classes, since when?

[@chloecaso2075]

I completely agree, Britt. I moved to England from Canada and didn’t like how I started categorizing people and viewing things from a class lens. I ended up moving back to Canada. I like the Canadian version of myself better!

[@passarinha2018]

The most creative at disguising the capitalist nature (therefore rot intentions) is rewarded and praised. This creative class are meant to be the show people are watching and desiring while companies continue to be companies domaining the leftovers of States.

[@sharoncurran6622]

Older than most commenters, I think, but I wonder about 'the creatives gentrifying' cities...don't disagree or anything, but my educated, employed adult children literally can't afford to leave home, and most of my friends' and their families are in the same situation. Gen X parents with Gen Y & Z kids; so, I have a different view, I think. I wonder about inter-generational homes and their affect on things. I read Florida but I don't remember him anticipating it. I suspect it's a big deal. Even a lot of influencers live with their parents.

[@applecrave1097]

Thank you I was thinking the same! I'm a gen y/z fringe individual, and am experiencing the same thing.

[@marzipan2555]

i feel like when news outlets report on generational activities, they just interview the most privileged people and just assume that is what everyone is doing. So the articles that talk about creatives being gentrifiers probably just talked to 5 trust fund kids and assumed that that's what all millenials are doing.

[@alelectric2767]

Another GenX here. Don’t tell the young they’re part of the problem with making housing unaffordable. They tend not to like the truth.

[@flux202]

Alice got an exclusive campaign!!!😭😭😭👏👏👏

[@beatrizdesa7601]

This video saved me a couple of months of therapy. Thank you.

[@pequodexpress]

"There are enough giants; there are not enough you," says a Go Daddy ad during this video. Translation: Go get a website and play with the other children wanting to be creative, because the giants have rigged the game and want to distract you with a romanticized creative life, a life where you will own little and be expected to be happy with that new order of things. Due largely to tacit class attributes, some will prosper in this precarious "creative" ecosphere and placed on pedestals to act as sirens beckoning the hungry and the hopeful, thereby establishing unspoken rules that blame the "losers" for not "making it." "Quit your whining and complaining. We gave you a website," decry the giants.

[@llamathedrama1454]

When you said commodification of creativity i just remembered this. I love writing and storytelling. I write things since i learned how to write and i have a handful of novel drafts that i work on. I don't want them to get published or something, 'cause i write them for myself, but my mom occasinally says, i see you writing all the time but we never saw a resolution, a finished work, the people in your age got their work already published etc. (im 18 the people she meant are wattpad writers but she has no idea how low the quality of those novels as she never read them but i did and to publish something like that i prefer to die honestly.)

[@lauratau3601]

"The Guardian is free from political or commercial influence" As a leftist: No. Just no.

[@GodsCosmicBollock]

You beat me to it!

[@jesselukaso8575]

Well she has to pay the bills

[@GeahkBurchill]

I’m a part of the “creative class“ and I spend almost 65% of my income on rent. I live in a large urban center that is designed specifically to attract “creative class“ young people, yet nearly the entire supply of housing, or studio space, is owned by a small handful of people. That’s hardly “owning the means of production”.

[@daviddoner7316]

your videos cover so many topics that im currently thinking about. thanks for that👍

[@marianadrago6327]

Do the authors mention that the "creative class" manly exists in developed countries? Excellent video btw 😄

[@meiguimeiguiwoaini]

i live in indonesia and it definitely exists here as well

[@marianadrago6327]

@@meiguimeiguiwoaini Oh this is interesting! In the current government of my country, any kind of art is unmotivated and seen as something "communist". The disregard for culture is enormous, two museums have caught fire for lack of infrastructure and the National Archives are collapsing. My question was genuine, because in underdeveloped countries (I live in Brazil), the rise of neo-fascist far-right parties has increased a lot, and with it the aversion to art.

[@kinkaju]

@@marianadrago6327 well I'm Venezuelan and it's the same shit here, the censorship and persecution of people who make art that the goverment dosen't like. I'm agree with you that "the creative class" barely only exist in developed countries though. In our countries only few people have the priviliges of make a living of art

[@cheeze6850]

I live in Mexico and here if people want to work something other than construction or medicine they have to move to the us

[@TotalSwitchYoutube]

@@marianadrago6327 if you are from SP, maybe, hardly, u can work somehow in a “creative artsy job” besides this is just for rich people who don’t need to worry about food and rent (I am also Brazilian) bcs the salaries are shit and art is always seen as secondary thing for any project or company.

[@londonh1800]

I am almost certified to be a music therapist. It allows me to be extremely creative in music without the pressures of stage performance while still following the guidelines of healthcare. I get to help people become healthy through the power of music, and that balance works for me.

[@blueodum]

As an oversimplification, I would call these people "the barista class".

[@jacob9673]

You think scientists and engineers are the “barista class?”

[@ExistentialAero]

As someone who is watching on an alternate account because I started watching your videos today as a background noise to slowly drink myself into oblivion to because I love the way your brain works, but wanted to comment anonymously, thank you. I struggle with heavy depression, and a lot of days I don't know if I want to keep pushing myself to get out of bed, but people like you give me a reason. You make me realize that I'm not alone as someone who spends far too much time in my own head philosophizing. That sees the state of the world as a heavily saddening thing that desperately needs change, but also has no idea how to make it happen. There are far too many people willing to exploit others in the world to properly execute any meaningful change as of now.

[@PokhrajRoy.]

KZbinrs are the new MLMs. But we live in a world where feminism and creativity are marketing tools.

[@lowkeyboldknit]

Omg, that is so true

[@ellebasi5044]

Oh wow spot on! Especially since it mostly targets young women and sells a certain lifestyle 🤔

[@oeckstei]

Their is a shift towards marketing products and services to women now that they are in the workforce and have more expendable income.

[@natasharules770]

@@oeckstei don't forget how the words 'girlboss' has been bastardised

[@mfg2324]

Could you do a book recommodation video one day? I'd love to learn more about classes, capitalism, social structures,... but I don't know where to start 🙈

[@AliceCappelle]

Usually I share book references in the description box if you want to read more on the topic I'm dealing with :)

[@mfg2324]

@@AliceCappelle Oh thanks for the tipp, I didn't realise that... Anyways, I love your videos!

[@Ykoz2016]

Just in response to the opening of the video… I think when discussing what constitutes “working class” (especially if you argue that high salary, educated professionals in offices still work for a company and a salary without owning a company, land, or a home and are therefore working class) at least in modern day society, it would be wise to take a look at choice of profession. Or the concept of having a choice. On one hand you have those who have the option of looking at a wide variety of professions, industries, and concepts and exploring which they may want to pursue. Even at a young age. Who have the support and finances to gain an education in their profession of choice, and the connections (even if just through their educational institution) to pursue it as a paying job. I feel like most of the creative class in the modern sense fall under this category. Yes, they still work. Yes, the reality of their jobs may not be as free or fulfilling as they thought it would be. Yet still, they had many choices. But the working class may be defined by those who take whatever job they can get. Usually factory or customer service, jobs with low pay and high turnover and less of a threshold to obtain. Jobs a person chooses less out of desire and more out of necessity. Jobs the creative class or middle class might do for a summer as a student for extra spending money but the working class needs to keep a roof over their head or the heads of their family. They choose as well, from the limited amount of jobs with similar structures (manual labor or front line service) but their choices may be more limited. And they may not have an opportunity to pursue a creative job in the first place, rather than be disillusioned once they have it. I agree the middle class is disappearing and upward mobility is stagnating. Absolutely. But I also don’t think society (of the last 30 years at least) can be divided into just the haves and have nots. Even amongst the have nots there are degrees and I can see how the modern day incarnation of a creative class is not on the lowest end.

[@beebop7543]

thanks for wording this so well - I definitely agree with the idea that there is a difference between the true working class and the idea of the creative working class, which essentially comes down to the privilege of choice.

[@kerycktotebag8164]

working class ppl with the privilege of choice are referred to as "labor aristocracy" by Marxists. They're still working class bc the only bargaining chip they have is their work (labor under a capitalist), not ownership of enough capital to employ others.

[@Tessy29k]

So what do you call young person that works from home, just got a graduate job and just bought a property overseas while studying their masters?

[@avgeek707]

I love the Guardian. It's nice to see they're supporting the small guys. Je te félicite!

[@nynaevealmeera]

Do they deliver print issues to the Philippines?

[@avgeek707]

@@nynaevealmeera I believe so! Though probably the offer might not be as good due to the terms of shipping. I believe the $6/6 offer is for US and EU, there's some smaller discount afaik for international but I'm sure they do it.

[@advendale9119]

I hope you start a channel on French politics 😂 Things are seeming to get interesting. I wish I spoke French because I am fascinated by France’s current state of affairs! Anyways, time to watch the video!

[@AliceCappelle]

I'll certainly do a video on it as the Presidential Election is set for April 2022! :)

[@gracebevill]

I second this, would be wonderful!

[@boiii3268]

If you want you can watch the videos of the « canard refractaire » channel. They are an independant media clearly leftits, they have intresting takes. You can also watch the videos of the channel « le monde ». They are much more traditional but it’s also a part of politics..

[@didiyem]

@@AliceCappelle ça promet d'être épique...

[@marianar2948]

I can resume the political landscape in France for you: les choses sont une merde

[@KhadijaMbowe]

loved this 💕

[@GlasPthalocyanine]

We've been making a living from our creativity for 25+ years. The two things you have to get straight are the spaces to create your work, and the space to exhibit and sell. You need control of both, in order to develop your work, and you also need time. If you start out in artist's cooperatives, you learn a lot about how the middle class creatives use these spaces to socialize with each other, and build up their own mythos. Let's be clear, these people are NOT more creative than other people. Some of them may be talented, but these spaces are another kind of business that has nothing to do with creativity. They are highly conformist and controlling over the work of others. So, yes, rent is a huge factor because space is part of the means of production. If you're working class, too much of your time is already accounted for. You won't truly be welcome in those middle class creative spaces. Your personal creativity will suffer and you may even lose your mind.

[@lahms111]

Very happy to see your channel grow. Next milestone 200k! Lets go!

[@oblisk420]

Creative work is compelling bc it appears to be an alternative to the drudgery of 'typical work' under capitalism. But it still operates within capitalism and is subject to the same forces. All the fantasies of freedom and independence is sobered by the reality that creative work in our current society still judges us against the profit motive. It constrains our creativity and even offers worser working conditions. In the end it's just capitalism co-opting anti-cap rhetoric without providing any meaningful change.

[@eliastalks7411]

It's only good if you manage to somehow manage to strike it big with KZbin or catch a break, most people are not so lucky and it sucks

[@andrewharris3900]

Of course the profit motive still exist, since when do businesses not want to make a profit?!

[@ColinTherac117]

@@WindofChange2023 You are so correct. This is why the true working class overwhelmingly tend to reject leftism. Welders, factory workers, and miners ARE the demographic that fights the hardest against the self and society destroying crusades of the creatives. Especially when they see for themselves what actual unions in action are really like with the horrific levels of favoritism, nepotism, cronyism, waste, and violent coercion.

[@paulbaker3465]

The true creative has never followed someone else’s rules or felt the need to fit in. They live to create change and have died trying to realise their dreams. They are probably not on Instagram but they are still out there. And it will be one of them that unites a generation and turns this world around.

[@TheSorrel]

Thats very romanticised. Even "real" creatives need to eat.

[@meowlodiculous]

@@TheSorrel I don't think their comment mentions them not eating...

[@TheSorrel]

@@meowlodiculous No, but that comment went into the romantisation of the "true artists" that don't do art for commerce. The truth is, if you want to spend you time making art, you gotta be good at selling it. It sucks, but its how capitalism works. I am an actor and I spend most of my time not acting because I'm still learning how to sell my craft. So, yeah, every professional artist is on Instagram.

[@meowlodiculous]

@@TheSorrel I agree but- I still do think you can be an artist without it being your main source of income. And you can be an artist outside of Instagram as well- sure it can be harder to reach people, but you can still reach the right kind of audience for you, depending on what you do of course, don't you think?

[@TheSorrel]

@@meowlodiculous Hardly. You can't really be that creative if you're still occupied with your 9-5. Trust me, I know.

[@celescoles]

I have been thinking about this for a while now and you put it into words in a way that I can never manage. I am a software engineer and I kinda count as a "creative class" and I had to move to a big city because there are no opportunities in the smaller ones. Therefore, all the other young people go there too. So in order to have a social life or work, you have to move to a big city and have to pay those rents because you have no other option. It is not a fair playing field either. People who grow up in those cities always have more freedom to be "creatives" because they don't have to think about rent or living costs, while people like me, have to save up money to be able to move there in the first place. I couldn't get a job because I couldn't afford it so I had to go for a corporate job. People who have "cool" jobs are usually privileged people from the get-go. So even though with my Starbucks and expensive (and could crumble down on me any moment) apartment I look like I live a fancy life, I literally have no other choice if I want to be a part of the society. So yeah, this video explains my frustrations so well. It also introduced a lot of new points of view to me, so thank you!

[@digrood]

I am honestly shook at the guardian sponsorship!!! I LOVE the guardian and I'm happy that they're supporting creators like you

[@TheAnthraxBiology]

It's crazy how I found this channel 9 months ago when you had something like 10-20k subscribers and now you have 115k! It's like finding an unknown band you like and then watching them get big. Here's to another 115k. Edit: sorry i'm kind of stoned love from IRE (insert flag)

[@mariam191991]

Funny I was just reading this in Capital Vol 1 (p. 546) yesterday: "The essential division is that between workers who are actually employed on the machines (among whom are included few who look after the engine) and those who merely attend them (almost exclusively children). More or less all the 'feeders' who supply the machines with the material which is to be worked up are counted as attendants. In addition to these two principal classes, there is a numerically unimportant group whose occupation it is to look after the whole of the machinery and repair it from time to time, composed of engineers, mechanics, joiners etc. This is a superior class of workers, in part scientifically educated, in part trained in a handicraft; they stand outside the realm of the factory workers, And are added to them only to make up an aggregate (footnote 99)*" *It is characteristic of the English intention to deceive by use of statistics (..) that the English factory legislation expressly excludes from its area of competence, as being 'not factory workers', the class of workers last mentioned, while the 'Returns' published by Parliament just as expressly include in the category of factory workers not only engineers, mechanics, etc. But also managers, salesman, messengers, warehousemen, packers etc., In short everybody except the owner of the factory himself."

[@mikehunt7810]

I work behind a bar for a living. That could be a creative job. Looking for new cocktails, bar snacks etc, but all the creativity is taken out of the job to recreate the same drink over and over again so that it can be consumed.

[@booksarebrainfood1708]

I love this, and love that you used Sally Rooney quotes to illustrate it since I think Dublin is a really prominent example of how the goalposts for young people to be “successful” are always changing

[@ilhamdarni6924]

My professor told me to read Florida's Rise of Creative Class, so I went on to youtube and found this video. It's really interesting to read a book and then directly watch a criticism of that book.

[@jupiterjames4201]

Ive always considered the creative class as "working class" in the economic sense. Socially, "working class" actually spans a wide range of economic class.

[@metalfeng8778]

As someone who finds a lot of value in uncreative work, there are a lot of people who are okay with doing uncreative work. I think creativity is very important in our society and very valuable, but it is only so in context to the collective. For most individuals, the most valuable type of work will always be the ones that bring in resources like money and living essentials. I think we should never lose sight of the fact that being able to thrive in your creativity is really a privilege, and not an innate human right. I always think back to my ancestors and what they had to do to live. Creativity might've helped, but being productive was always much more useful. My ability to create new things is always going to be supported by the productivity of our society as a whole.

[@Obi3D]

You're so correct about young people moving to these cities purely for the experience. I think there's just no social life after college, and young adults have no other form of a community these days. So they move to the cities in pursuit of things 'happening'. I went to school in NYC for the past 2 years, this year I'm commuting. So I speak from experience; my social life is trash this year. The thing is, as an artist, now I have more time to dedicate to my work, and on top of that I have been working 30-35 hours a week to actually accumulate funds/upgrade my gear. Two things I couldn't do while living in the city. I guess the thesis of this comment is that the path for creatives in the 2020's is a lonely one.

[@majohm96]

As a designer in a third world country, this video resonates a lot. It has slowly started to take this route in here and its really interesting that most creative positions are very valuable and seeked from companies, while also being one of the worst remunerated ones and with intensive amounts of work load. Sometimes they don't even make the minimal income. However, most of us are living precariously but in the city center.

[@Lily-ni5po]

I think one of the reasons that "bobos" have attracted so much hate from workers is that at work like in their politics they have tended to be socially liberal but to side with the boss on economics. It seems to be slowly changing. We will see. I know I am on my way to moving to that class because my working class family did get to buy a house in the economic boom after the war and my father got a better job at a Union after being fired from his factory job back in the days. So I get to move up while others don't, but I am not at all interested in maintaining this bs economic system. I don't seem to be the only one.

[@jaebcommakayla]

i clicked on this video SO FAST because it's what I've been thinking about for the past year. As a designer (or any other creative) you get all the bullshit of being working class (long hours, mostly unpaid overtime, sucking up to your boss, low pay) PLUS the burden of needing to "love your work", make it your whole identity, and feel "lucky" that you have a "cool job". Like, we're supposed to be hype about our own exploitation. And many creatives are so brainwashed by hustle culture that there is no worker solidarity in creative work (depending on your team). It's every person for themselves.

[@OohLa118]

Do you really work for minimum wage or under minimum wage? Working long hours or unpaid overtime doesn’t make you working class. It’s something that is expected in nearly all work fields today (teaching, care work, construction work etc etc). Also I don’t see how it is a burden to „have to love your job“. Nobody cares if you do or not. But how can it be worse than working a job everyone knows you probably hate lol

[@jaebcommakayla]

@@OohLa118 Yes, working long hours doesn't make you working class, but working for a wage does. That's it :) It doesn't matter how or where or how much you get paid, if you trade your labor or time for money you're working class (the alternative is the owner class, who own the means of production). And yes, I should clarify - you don't get *all* the bullshit of being working class as a creative in the corporate world. You don't get unsafe working conditions or have your hours/pay cut unexpectedly. You don't have to deal face-to-face with awful customers (besides clients who can be insidious in quieter ways). its generally more stable, besides the fact that you might not be able to go to an important dr's appt because a client demands you be in a meeting. The pay is better but still not equitable. I totally get why you wouldn't understand how being expected to love your job is an additional burden, but let me explain -- people DO care if you love your job or not when you're a creative. It's this weird culture thing that I still don't understand. Something about how creative work is so personal, makes people (managers, CEOs, etc) think that because you "do what you love" you're more willing to be overworked and underpaid. I knew someone at a former job who was let go, they weren't "passionate" enough about the job because they didn't come in 30 mins early every day like their coworkers. You can't just show up, do your job, and leave...if you're not overperforming, you're underperforming. It's not *worse* than working a job you hate (which, by the way, I do hate my job lol), but it's a different experience. At least in construction or retail jobs you can have solidarity with your coworkers. In corporate, we're all pretending we love our jobs and our bosses and everything is perfect, which means there is no opportunity to organize and demand better pay, hours, or more control over the work we produce.

[@OohLa118]

@@jaebcommakayla okay thanks for clarifying, I get what you mean about working class. for me I never counted people who get academical degrees as part of this class, but in this definition it makes sense. but for the other part: if you work in retail or any other customer service you also have to pretend to love your job, otherwise you lose it fast. And if you rely on a tip bc of super low wages, the struggle to appear passionate is even stronger in a job that is rarely possible to fulfill you. precarious working conditions with short term contracts, as well as a huge competition in jobs like construction workers etc really stand in the way of any solidarity between workers. health and care workers are literally keeping people alive, and get paid like shit. not bc they think they are passionate about their job but bc some people rely so much on their income they can not just go somewhere else, so the bosses is able to pay them to their own liking. A graphic designer can start working in a supermarket or cleaning apartments as Second job, but a construction worker, a supermarket worker, a cleaning person etc who doesn’t have any other education (which costs money) in the first place is stuck in this minimum wage job area forever. but if everyone is part of the same working class, I guess „the creative class“ can start organizing by supporting other working class areas. if the lowest income workers get better working conditions (higher minimum wages, working security, health care, pension insurance etc etc) it will automatically better the conditions of all other members of the working class.

[@jaebcommakayla]

@@OohLa118 Oh yeah 100%, I didn't mean to imply that creative work is worse than any other job. It's just that creative work/white collar jobs are sometimes regarded as "dream jobs", as if they're perfect, but they're still exploitative. Every job under capitalism is exploitative tbh, it's the only way to make a profit. It's just different levels and methods of exploitation. Many white-collar workers think they're not working class because they "do what they love" or they got a degree, but that separation only serves the people who are exploiting us. You're right that we need to work together to raise up all members of the working class no matter what kind of work they do!

[@gracebevill]

Fascinating brain food as always! The organisation and succinctness of your videos is always so inspiring (especially as someone searching desperately for motivation to write essays for uni lol) 💛

[@Carlasweetness]

Currently writing my thesis related to this fascinating how this utopian thinking still persists although there has been soooo much critique uncovering this

[@LucaSiempelkamp]

Is there any concept or idea of bringing creativity back into rural areas? This "moving to the city to get away from the dumb people" is kind of a self perpetuating cycle isnt it? If young, creative people just stayed in the countrysde there'd be nothing to get away from... any idea or concept how that could work? And I mean ofc thats just one puzzle piece of a bigger problem... But still, this is particularly interesting to me :) like how do we make the country more attractive as a place to live in general

[@mealmoth8369]

Artists communes in rural areas are not a new thing, here in Germany I know two older ones (Worpswede, Kleinsassen), and I have read about a German youtuber trying to set up something similar but can't remember details. Doesn't necessarily mean they live off the land without money...

[@sofiabravo1994]

Yea these types tend to look down on the simple folk.

[@misspugsley41216]

I laughed out lout when you read that quote from Florida where he says the creative class already owns their means of production bc the skills are in our heads! First of all, we do still need physical materials and tools to transform those intellectual skills into value (eg computer, certain softwares, a space to work in, etc). And yes, I can arguably more easily obtain a laptop and Adobe suite than a factory worker could obtain the big machinery they work with. But I still need capital to obtain those crucial physical means of production, which not everyone has. And even if I can own those tools, as you're saying, I still have no choice but to use those tools for wage-earning, especially if I want to afford to live in a city to be with my "like-minded" peers (which is really a basic quality-of-life expectation, more so than a "perk"). Which is why the ruling class wants to attract us to cities and then makes cities expensive to live in. The bind they've put us in really is genius. AND I think the fact that we DO have the ability to own our means of production, or at least the illusion that we can, is incredibly demobilizing. I think that's another crucial component of class-based oppression. It makes me think of gig workers as well. The creative class and gig workers all have easier ability to purchase their Mac desktops, or their fancy cars for Ubering etc, and that gives us the illusion that we're okay, we're autonomous, we're successfully fending for ourselves and thus don't need to form solidarity with workers doing similar jobs (and bc we own our supplies and spaces, we literally/physically do not intersect with other similar workers). And then meanwhile we receive low pay, are stripped of benefits and insurance (gig workers especially), so we have to work more and more to compensate for that. And thus don't have time to organize with other workers anyway. tldr yes, factory workers might have a much harder time seizing their means of production bc the tools are physically large and they are constantly surveilled/threatened. But creative class are also in a bind because although we may already "own" our means of production, we are too physically isolated from each other and bogged down with imperative wage work to be able to organize a class struggle using those means of production.

[@MiguelThinks]

You have quite the amazing content as always. I literally took a course called "Creative Industries" that bring up this issue. What i've personally theorized is that there seems to be an evolution to this weird middle ground class. In the colonial times they were the "Merchant Class" then evolved into the "Middle Class" or the "Intellectual Class". Now Richard Florida calls it the "Creative Class" or the "Creative Manegerial Class" as Gary called it. But I believe Marx did actually refer to the weird middle class separate from the working class, but pretty "lazy," yet remarkably self-sufficient in managing their way through life (at the expense of others). EDIT: this class of people find ways to make a living while leaving everyone else in the dust. The opposite to Karl Marx/Robin Hood you could say. Steal from the rich, but keep it to yourselves.

[@xcf1614]

These days when discussing whether someone is "rich" or "poor" I think it actually makes more sense to look at their access to capital rather than the sum total in their bank account/assets. By this I mean, a starving artist may have only $1,000 in their bank account at a given time but if they grew up middle class in a middle class community and still have ties to their middle class family and friends they would be alright if they had some kind of terrible car accident or medical emergency that meant they NEEDED $20k fast (I'm American so of course this is the type of example that comes to mind most immediately). At the end of the day they would be able to scrape together that money (despite being "poor") a lot faster than say, a freshly arrived refugee with no network or access to funds. Basically there's a big difference between being broke and being poor and I think that also gets into a discussion about generational cycles of poverty.

[@cheninblanc]

Woooww The Guardian as a sponsor is in my eyes something to be proud of :D

[@tonghuizhao9203]

That's a very interesting topic!! Somehow the trend in China is really different where young people (including influencers) define themselves as "the working class" by calling themselves "打工人" or "people who work for others". Although it is used as sarcasm, it deff shows the mentality of anxiety, lack of leisure and less self-orientation at work in the working culture in China right now. Some young Chinese are trying to escape the status of "working for others" by moving back to their hometowns, starting their own business or simply "lying flat".

[@sarac2019]

Can we talk about how that lit candle was initially sitting precariously on top of a stack of books on your fridge?

[@AliceCappelle]

It's not a fridge ahaha

[@ioe5734]

@@AliceCappelle this WHOLE time I thought you were in your kitchen 😯😮

[@Valkyri3Z]

I have always felt Artists are basically factory workers. Its just we dont fit into that classic 'factory worker' image mould. Creative pursuit is a rigorous , labor intensive work. It takes both physical and mental strength. Some of the genius artists were all extreme workaholic. It takes a huge toll on your mental and physical health often.

[@ForeignManinaForeignLand]

Glad to see we aren't gatekeeping working class

[@pisceanbeauty2503]

I think it’s really just the concept of the “99%”, which has fallen out of favor of recent, not sure why.

[@Obirtae]

Completely agree. The worst part of it all is that the gap is widening, either you can make it and live like a king or you are condemned to live an undignified life and have to choose what parts of you life you have to sacrifice if you want to keep living in cultural hubs.

[@sterlingmarshel6299]

Graham S. advice for coffee is fine (of course he will sell you his brand of coffee for a price - a true capitalist that one) but to sit home and sit on a pile of money for retirement that you may or may not see; sounds like a trade-off many would be foolish to take. Traveling ( and spending money) in your 20's or traveling when you are 60+ are completely different experiences. Gen Z and Gen Y have mostly figured this out and are forgoing the traditional Married, Kids, House, Work, Save, Retire template. Everyone should strike their own balance but memories of vacations with friends and family are ultimately what you have left at the end of your life.

[@experience_kingsley]

Factories can be wildly creative places. I've often encountered way more energy in them than in typical "creative" spaces, especially post 2010 or so.

[@stanleysharkey3753]

I was putting away my laundry and kept hearing you say "Flo-rida's book" and was like, "When did the rapper Flo-Rida put out a book about the working class?" Then I saw the subtitles said Florida. I'm not sure how is name is actually pronounced, he's from NJ but I doubt it is pronounced as Americans pronounce the state Florida. Perhaps, it is pronounced Flo-Rida as you do. I'm not uhhh negging or poking fun at your pronounciation, just sharing this long string of thoughts I had because of it. I'm dealing with a break-through COVID case right now and am prob delirious.

[@joannehakvoort1236]

Oof same with the covid. I hope you get better soon!

[@AliceCappelle]

you may be right, I only saw it written :o

[@jolp9799]

i think it's funnier if i convince myself it's pronounced just like the rapper lol

[@rubyoland]

Haha!!

[@marianar2948]

APPLE BOTTOM JEANS, BOOTS WITH THE FUR, THE WHOLE CLUB WAS LOOKING AT HER, SHE HIT THE FLOOR, NEXT THING YOU KNOW SHE GOT LOW LOW LOW LOW. Who knew this was a comment on social classes all along? Even if shawty has fur boots (a object that indicates traditional wealth) she still goes low: this is an example of how even middle class citizens who get social approval from their creative pass times are down on their status at large.

[@drefloresca95]

10:15 yo that's literally my job lmao i've felt some shame in having a very routine repetitive job as a designer bc of the lack of prestige but i genuinely enjoy it when im not thinking about what other ppl might say about my job

[@PokhrajRoy.]

Omg you’re sponsored by ‘The Guardian’? Félicitations, Alice!

[@flowergirl5962]

So glad someone has FINALLY talked about this and put it to words!

[@sitinazariah9097]

YES

[@tikalupit]

This video is a fraternal twin to Kidology's "Creative Work" Is Not a Thing and I love it!

[@coscorrodrift]

Love her channel

[@malenaoliveira6549]

I feel like the class struggle of the creative class resides in exactly what you mentioned: that we think that we deserve and should be living a lifestyle we can´t afford.

[@JoelLessing]

I have to confess my mind got sidetracked by the idea that creativity is inherently sexy and that perhaps the shift in interest from athletes to "nerds" as the "Big Men" who command a new iteration of "trophy wife syndrome" might reflect some kind of cultural evolution that is recognizing mental agility and acuity over brawn and force. I mean, here we are living in a country where the Pentagon OPENLY fetishizes an army of robots and drones, capable of dominating the world based entirely upon our facility in AI and cybernetics. Sorry for this digression, but I do not think in a linear fashion!

[@beingearnest123]

This made me feel so seen and so much better about my life. I went to a private school, have a university degree, and have lived a very comfortable life (holiday abroad once or twice a year and all that good stuff). Yet I am on the brink of turning 30 and I just accepted a job in London that doesn't pay nearly as much as my parents were making at my age (and my mom never even went to university). It's pretty much an entry-level salary even though I've been working for the past 8 years. In order to find a semi decent ROOM (can't even dream of renting my own apartment) to rent in the city, I have to spend more than half my salary. I know I will be okay because I have my hometown and parental support to fall back on and I plan on "climbing the ladder" at work but this isn't the independence I was hoping for at the age of 29... it's HARD out here! A part of me doesn't want to live in an expensive city, barely able to save any money... but after a year and a half of living in the suburbs with my parents because I couldn't find a job, I feel like this is my best option.