The First-Person Dungeon Crawler I Didn't Know I Needed

[@jojodelacroix]

Hold on bro. Gotta purge my corruption right quick.

[@xzero4985]

Fellas, is it gay to purge corruption with your homies?

[@arckinenso7615]

Is it a red flag if a guy tries to purge my corruption on the first date?

[@TanasinnAZ]

You say it wasn't a review, but it still sold me on the game. These types of videos are perfect.

[@xzero4985]

Aww, thank you!

[@fireplayblaze]

ohhh nice mary skelter series, its great to see more people liking the series. this series is pretty much my favorite series of all time.

[@JoshuaPAMployee]

SAME!

[@xzero4985]

It's peak dungeon crawling.

[@grayrodent8232]

Some things about this games I feel people should know, if you want to simply breeze through the series don't bother with Nightmares, play both games on the Mary Skelter 2 package then Finale. The dungeons in Nightmare were absolutely massive and there was a lot of jank so Mary Skelter 2 trimmed a whole lot of it, an absurd amount, but the pacing and balance of skills was thrown out the window so now you might actually be nerfing yourself by unlocking advanced skills due to the Mana/Power ratio on higher levels. It is unironically easier to just punch enemies in the face until they die in the Nightmares Remake. The Remake had a lot of QoL changes that simply didn't reconcile with the new layouts but also made it easier to break the game in half so it serves its purpose, pulling you through it until you reach the end and start Mary Skelter 2. Mary Skelter 2 as a whole is a much better experience that was properly designed with the new development philosophy in mind so it's a lot less jarring. Also, the purge minigame is pretty much entirely optional, you might just want to do it once for each girl so you can get the skip boost but really only ever wasted blood on Thumbelina since I was absolutely liberal on my spell usage, ans even then the boost of mana and stats was extremely minimal. Also, lick SUCKS, never use it for it's intended purpose the only one with a somewhat useful blood skill is Snow White, otherwise the only reason you lick is making sure the girls don't go murder hobo on you.

[@XionSteel]

Yeah, though its recommended to try out both games to get a different story perspective, Skelter 2 has both the non finale games for the price of 1, which is nice. As someone that played the standalone Nightmares on steam before the other games came out it ran ok, only really running into major problems in the extra dungeon beyond Gretel that's absolutely massive. There seems to be a memory leak on that map that never got fixed so once you explore around 1/3 of the map, the game hard crashes. But all in all there is no real reason to buy Nightmares outside of maybe playing it for the mechanics that got overhauled to match the 2nd game (mainly to change how corruption spreads and swap out st and full aoe skills, for line and column attacks).

[@orga7777]

Interestingly enough, I think if you play the 1+2 Collection, you should actually play 2 first because of reasons dealt with in that version of 1 in its extra dungeon at the end. Spoilers. The mechanics of 1 are certainly more outdated compared to 2, so it takes some time to get used to it again, but for story purposes, I think it is still the best order to play the games. 2 then 1 then 3.

[@CongaYT]

You turned what normally would've been a 2 hour long review of the game into a 5 minute long video, thankyou

[@xzero4985]

The day I put out a 2-hour video is the day I hang up my KZbin hat.

[@uhagi6720]

Holy s***, someone talking about Mary Skelter. I randomly found this game during a Switch Sale and was very suprised by how enjoyable it actually was to clear the entire game. Bosses were pretty brutal and required you to have a good plan as you stress out because someone's dying every second turn.

[@xzero4985]

Yeah, Mary Skelter is like a sleeper hit.

[@Skelter48]

Yknow i only got the game after watching Idea Factory live stream it early. It looked so colorful and now i have tattoos from the game lol

[@xzero4985]

That's really cool!

[@Sephyroth97]

There's a special order if you truly want to play this trilogy, since the creator wants you to play 2 first and there's True Endings and stuff, I'll write it so people know: - You can read Mary Skelter 2's novel but avoid the last couple of chapters (the ones that have the name in the index and are marked as "Bonus Chapter"), this is going to help you understand the state of the world. So, technically you have to avoid ch 7 and technically even 8 but 8 is not as big of a deal. - Then you can play the whole of MS2, you only have a bad ending and the True one but it's literally just the choice before the boss that decides it so you can just play everything normally no problem, watch the sub events as you go to get to know the characters more. - Now you can do the same for Nightmares, reading the novel but avoiding the last couple of extra chapters that are named. - You play Nightmares normally, there's a choice in your room in ch 3 of the game but I've heard everyone say that if you get it wrong it lets you go back, maybe just keep this in mind to be sure. Here too, you'll have a bad ending then the normal one (you need to find 3 items but if you explore everything you'll just get them), THEN you do an extra dungeon for the new stuff. You also need an extra character but it's found in the road for the new extra stuff so, yeah, you're bound to find them. So, again, no real problem, just warning you of some things. - Now that you got the True ending of 1 you can read the extra chapters of 2 and 1's novels but at this point they're just that, little extras, they can't hurt you anymore :P - There's technically an extra novel that explains some stuff that happened in 1 called "Hikari o Arika" but it never got translated, you can find a recap online if you're curious, Nightmares only has its prologue. Nothing super essential but it clarifies a thing or 2. - Now, guess what? Finale has a novel...that's...not...in the game...Finale has 2 and 1's novels but not its own...ok? You can find it online so it's whatever. Here I'll give you and arguable personal advice and tell you you can read all of them except the marked one as always (this one is VERY important you don't even look at, it contains the most spoilers of all, be careful, it's ch 11) but I'll suggest you play the intro of the game first, just the first couple of hours and then you can read the novel except that one chapter ( that i believe they just didn't put in the online version at all just to be safe, actually). - Just play the game I guess; Finale doesn't really have any strong twists, aside from some things later on but aside from those, it's all kinda obvious. It sounds like a lot but basically I just wrote "read the corresponding novel first but avoid the extra chapters"...I just made it look weird. Maybe warn other players about the novels, if you find them on the net.

[@xzero4985]

Wow, I knew that I was playing them out of order but I didn't know that the correct order was so intricate. Thank you for the detailed breakdown!

[@user-kr5vm8nk1d]

I’m so happy this vid turned up in my feed. I adore Etrian Odyssey and I’d never heard of this game. Thank you!

[@xzero4985]

You're welcome! Enjoy!

[@TheELASESINADOR]

Played the whole saga and compared with other first-person dungeon crawler that I played, Touhou Artificial Dream in Arcadia (a Persona 1-like game with Touhou story and characters), and both Legend of Grimrock (it's real-time combat instead of turns), Mary Skelter falls under a strange category. TLDR: Where other games are mechanically better done in terms of pacing and slack for strategy, MS fails but gives an interesting story and world. TADiA is perfect mechanically in the sense of pacing. It gives you the tools, show you the ways, usually if you find a difficult fight is because you did not prepare correctly, forcing you to grind other characters (Personas), but the mixing cuts heavily the grind. The only "bad" thing is the story doesn't follow traditional escalating goals, it's more like a tour along Gensokyo and their inhabitants, which is perfectly fine for getting to know the series or if you are already a fan. LG 1 is very maze-like due to the limited environments, but LG 2 solves it. The mechanical pace of both games are well done. You never find a too difficult encounter unless you search for it, and there is no grinding because most of the enemies does not respawn. Though you end playing more dancing a waltz than direct confrontation because positioning is the most important aspect of the game. The story otherwise is very lacking. There is one, you read logs from other people, but it doesn't feel an adventure of yours, but tracing down adventures from others. MS story is the best of any of the previous games, specially because it's original (has more space to develope) and it works over it, though it has a repeating problem. Without getting into spoilers, the best game for me is Nightmares, but not because it's the first game in the series (which you can skip story-wise because it's remade on 2, where you play it after finishing 2), but because it's the first one I played. If the characterization is the most important thing for you, though I feel Nightmares is the one doing the best job, 2 can also provide the same with less play time. And there is the problem, you get the same characterization through all 3 games, so it gets repeated 3 times. In some cases not even that prevalent because you're expected to have played 1 and 2 on 3, but you still get the same, which feels a limitation of being different games more than a series progression. Ambientation for me is top-notch, music is brutal (never skipped Nightmares intro, the best of the saga by a large margin), the Quest system is flawed... Feels more a hindrance to complete than what rewards, specially because many are RNG-based. Mechanically is where I find the worst in MS. RPGs have by definition barriers every now and then for fixing the pace of the player in the game, which by playing it on the most difficult version (which I don't recommend), has a very grind nature. Okey, then the solution is easy, just play on Normal or Easy, no? The problem is that you cut the grind, but there's still grind, which if you read your skills, plan out everything and go prepared, shouldn't happen on any difficulty. What I'm referring to is that, at any of the barriers of an RPG, the good implementation provides some slack where you can overcome a difficult fight through planning, and that's something MS lacks a lot. AoE attacks are essential on your party, and devastating if they come from the enemy side, and there's nothing you can do about it. Breaking through using the enemy weakness feel sometime a waste, being most of the time more important raw damage than strategy. Blood... I love the way the game manages the protagonist importance in the team story-wise, but the implementation gameplay, though cool, fails when you always are lacking blood to maintain a sane full-team, even when not using the character other than for that specific task. In the end, I feel you roll-over the enemy, or the enemy roll-over you, and there's no mid-point where the previous 2 games have. The only game that I did not feel this so hard was with Nightmares, because the enemy level is well placed if you do everything at the stage of the barrier, and I believe it's because the maps are massive. Do I recommend MS? Yeah, because of the story, and if you like to disconnect grinding in a RPG, this series is perfect. However, if you search for better paced or mechanical games that give slack for strategy, MS may not be the game for you. If you like to explore maps and have a lot of time, play Nightmares first, otherwise skip it and play 2 directly (and after finishing it, continue with the remake of 1 within 2). And don't worry if you think you'll have to repeat Nightmares on the remake within 2, there's a decision on the start of the remake that skips 3/4 of the game, prompting you to the new things much faster, though the Nightmare's post-game is completely cut from the remake (mostly maze gameplay, not much story).

[@NeuroCordis]

I actually finished Mary Skelter 2 a few days ago and am on Mary Skelter Nightmares now. I definitely like Mary Skelter more than Labyrinth of Refrain but I still think Rance VI The Fall of Zeth is still my favorite DRPG. Once I finish Mary Skelter I'm going to play Dungeon Travelers.

[@xzero4985]

Cultured. Extremely cultured.

[@WakkaMadeInYevon]

On the topic of Refrain, I will say that, while I liked Labyrinth of Galleria overall, the randomized dungeons in the second half reeeaaaally wore me down. I think Refrain's more tightly-designed experience holds up better. Though if you don't mind like 2/3rds of the dungeon design taking a nosedive, Galleria does tell a gripping story, same as the first game. The music is also top class, including a feature from my favorite vocalist in video game music. I kind of feel like it's one of those games where suffering through the bad parts is kind of crucial to getting the message. Like Lob Corp. Or it was just time constraints resulting in a pretty glaring flaw. I do hope we get another game in the series, nonetheless, preferrably without the backrooms. Playing through Dungeon Travelers 2 right now and really liking it. I can see why people praise this as one of the best from the Vita, and even overall. I plan to do 2-2 after (though 2's postgame will keep me busy), but the Mary Skelter series is absolutely on my bucket list and maybe this video is a sign to get on that. Now please, Atlus... Drip feed me new Etrian content. Even just crumbs of news. I played Metaphor, I know it's on your mind too.

[@orga7777]

I found this series while browsing the Switch games on a whim. Got the 1+2 Collection and loved it. Bought the collectors edition of 3.

[@xzero4985]

Great purchase!

[@Lightstation_]

Idea Factory/Compile Heart always nails the character art and design

[@xzero4985]

I agree with this! Even when their games are lacking in other ways, they hit this note right.

[@kidrobot.]

nahh

[@hikarisama306]

Stranger of sword city is a great game, with great story, and characters.

[@xzero4985]

It's on my wishlist to check out at some point.

[@Sephyroth97]

@@xzero4985 Be careful for an enhanced version of that game called Revisited is only available in the bundle with saviors of sapphire wings; it has extra content and reworks. Also, saviors of sapphire wings itself is simpler, so it's recommended to play that one first but they're not connected in any way. Technically saviors of sapphire wings takes place in the same world as Demon Gaze but it's like 1000 years prior

[@Raidenze]

Idk about great story since it's designed so you can't even feel attached to a character, but gameplay yeah.

[@cbrana4649]

Looks fun! I’ll try and check it out one of these days. Thanks for your hard work on these videos!

[@xzero4985]

You're very welcome!

[@hadookin47]

This definitely reminds me of Persona Q, my favorite Etrian Odyssey-style games

[@xzero4985]

I WISH they would remake those two games for modern systems. It probably won't happen, though.

[@UgyBoogie]

I started playing the first Mary Skelter I think three times now. Always got a few hours in before losing interest. But I love the aesthetics and mechanics of the game so much that I even bought all of the sequels when they were on sale. Still hoping I'll get around to play them one day.

[@Gamorou]

I love seeing Mary Skelter get some love

[@DarkClaymore555]

I'm always surprised how absent Mary Skelter is from DRPG recommendation lists. Labyrinth of Refrain usually makes the cut but Mary Skelter doesn't for some reason. I currently like Refrain more, but Mary Skelter is really close and might even come on top by the time I finish the final game (which I'm currently playing). It already started on a very strong footing by letting you simultaneously control different parties across different dungeons, which creates a multi-POV story.

[@xzero4985]

People keep mentioning Labyrinth of Refrain, I'm really going to have to give it a shot.

[@kidrobot.]

because labyrinth is actually a good game. this is sold on the fanservice characters

[@FeverSensei]

absolutely loved the first game and I honestly forgot there was a 2nd and 3rd, time to dive back into this series. I really enjoy the aesthetic and concept of this franchise, no other jrpg have really been able to scratch that itch

[@xzero4985]

Personally, the environments notwithstanding, I do like the overall aesthetics and vibe of these games.

[@ozymandias8523]

You sold me! Btw it's the first time I saw games of this genre, thanks.

[@xzero4985]

Good to hear! Enjoy!

[@SAMURAIch]

Back in the day I've finished Demon Gaze 1 and 2 on psvita, after that I've never played dungeon crawlers, but looking at your review it's kinda similar to Demon Gaze and I think I'll like it too! Thanks for the vid!

[@xzero4985]

I enjoyed Demon Gaze as well, so my guess is that if you liked those games, you'll like these ones.

[@miamha]

Mary Skelter is so slept on

[@xzero4985]

True. I'm planning more videos about sleeper gems like this one.

[@alch3mIx]

Nicely succinct review, thanks!

[@xzero4985]

You're welcome!

[@maidofstitches7289]

I love this game. Can't stream it for certain reasons, but I LOVE it.

[@xzero4985]

Yeah I don't know that I've seen any streams of this game.

[@niyo919]

I swear I'd heard of this title before, and when I looked it up, it's because it's published by the same people that did Neptunia. Def checking this series out, thanks dude.

[@xzero4985]

While I liked the Neptunia games, I'd say these games are a step up from them in terms of overall quality.

[@eternalbuddyman200]

Just played the whole series in 6 months ago, it was actually my first Dungeon Crawler and RPG(that I take seriously.) I love it

[@xzero4985]

It's peak dungeon crawling.

[@rigbone3587]

Great video brother, glad to see you enjoyed this one!! Keep up the great work 😎

[@xzero4985]

Thanks!

[@jackzubo6028]

Honestly to me "Better than i thought" perfectly describes this game. I'm not a fan of dungeon crawlers. This was almost my first one, but i quite enjoyed the first game. Gotta play the other ones sometime in the future. Btw if you're wondering what was my first dungeon crawler, it was Demon Master Chris...

[@xzero4985]

I'm sure that's a wholesome, fun-filled family game!

[@SystemRush]

In regards to your comment about the visual design of the dungeons, each dungeon is meant to represent one of the girls, all of which as you know are based off of fairy tale characters, the city streets is Alice's Area, The Dorn is Gretels, Downtown is Cinderella, etc.

[@xzero4985]

Didn't know that! I'll pay more attention to that next time I play the game.

[@SystemRush]

@@xzero4985 No problem, hope that makes it seem less clown vomit and more well-thought out game design, cheers.

[@MultiJellybones]

aside from EO, I only had eyes for Labyrinth of Refrain. TY for introducing Mary Skelter

[@Azenatrail]

What did you think of Labyrinth of Galleria?

[@nanahiiragi723]

Never heard of this series thank you I will try it for sure

[@xzero4985]

Good luck! Mary Skelter 2 is often on sale for pretty cheap, and is well worth it.

[@juanmiguelsebastian1477]

Game reviews should be like this. Pointing out the good and the bad of played games. I always see game reviews focus only on the good and not the bad because 'they harm the popularity of the game' not thinking that the bad can also attract potential players.

[@xzero4985]

Awww, thank you so much!

[@kidrobot.]

lolno

[@hassanico9999]

It's very much worth noting that the first Mary Skelter (only on Steam) and the Mary Skelter 1 remake included in Mary Skelter have VASTLY different dungeon/map design. We're talking maps that are 3x to 5x times bigger in the original Mary Skelter. It's generally agreed the remake dungeons included in Mary Skelter 2 are the go to version to play, although this poses a narrative issue as the intended order is MS1 -> MS2 -> MS1 Remake (though if you don't care about plot you're fine starting with 2).

[@RedRust]

Great video, cool looking game, subbed.

[@xzero4985]

Thank you!

[@Witch_of_Pandemonium]

def gonna try this thanks for introducing me

[@xzero4985]

You're welcome!

[@threeep4023]

Have you tried labyrinth of refrain? That’s my personal favorite dungeon crawler.

[@xzero4985]

Not yet, it's on my wishlist!

[@3fkups]

As a first person dungeon crawler fan myself since the era of Might and Magic I subscribed cause of this video. Would like to hear about what other games you tried to look for for something as good as the Etryan Odyssey series. The Mary Skelter series has a lot of unique and innovative mechanics introduced to the genre which is nice. I think the weakest aspect might be the story. I also felt like casters felt super weak compared to physical attackers and their abilities took waay too much mana to use. Maybe they get better later on but I didn't stick with it. If you haven't tried it yet I'd recommend Operencia the Stolen Sun.

[@thatanonwholurksmoar7386]

Mary skelter mentioned? On our soon to ve over 2024? Lets freaking go!

[@twilightnight6283]

I can see that this game was inspired by the SMT series, specifically its older version that wasn't released to the West.

[@ianbraun271]

Another one to consider: Shin Megami Tensei - Strange Journey. Original version is on Nintendo DS. Redux version on 3DS

[@xarksins]

Reminds me about danganronpa with all the pink wonder how good the story is tho.

[@ademisc]

I suddenly want to play Stonekeep again.

[@bappibhai1]

For someone who have loved Doom RPG 2, I'll give it a go

[@DBinitiate]

Mary Skelter immediately makes me think of Labyrinth of Refrain and Labyrinth of Galleria. Mainly because of the amount of extra systems involved. I prefer the simplicity of Etrian Odyssey in this regard. Less focus on the various auxillary systems to power up your characters.

[@xzero4985]

See, the extra systems were a draw for me. None of them are clunky or cumbersome, IMO, and I like having that option to really maximize a strategy.

[@scanchannel3259]

Glad to see this trilogy rise in popularity (You can tell i'm a fan because i have the characters in my profile picture.)

[@kidrobot.]

its not rising in popularity

[@scanchannel3259]

@@kidrobot. Not here but sure.

[@kidrobot.]

@@scanchannel3259 sure bud

[@scanchannel3259]

@@kidrobot. Do we have a problem?

[@kidrobot.]

@@scanchannel3259 do you have a problem?

[@XionSteel]

It is indeed quite hard to find games like Etrian Odyssey since I found that turn-based Dungeon crawlers seem to fall into 2 categories: There are the ones with Wizardry mechanics that you see in games like Wizardry (obviously), Operation Tokyo, Class of Heroes, Stranger in Sword City, Undernaughts and Zangetsu. These are the games with random re-rollable stats, hard limit on shop items that are generally useless to buy since a majority of your best items comes from monster drops. here is also where you often find the recognisable hidden mechanics that the game doesn't always tell you but you see overlap for between these games. Things such as luck working for both crit chance and dmg/debuff dodging, and having 25 agility allows for full power duel wielding. You either like these or you don't since this is also where you tend to find perma-death mechanics. Then there are the ones more suited to exploration and tends to forgo the above mechanics to have a more straightforward power scaling. Games like Etrian Odyssey, Mary Skelter, Demon Gaze, Persona Q, and Dungeon Travellers. These rely more on class passives and learnable skills to build your team around, which wont always make or break your experience if you build wrong and is a lot more forgiven since it doesn't take long to revert and re-level if you aren't happy with what you have (not to say these games are easy because they really arent lol). There is no perma death you just have to explore and get to the goal (whatever that may be in their respective game). Not necessarily a 3rd option but there are games that kind of combine the 2 very well, which are Labyrinth of Refrain and Galleria. Their stories are much darker but the trade off is one of the best experiences i've had in a dungeon crawler. The floors can get quite intricate, there are no random encounters, there are ways to warp and break through walls. Weapon weaknesses are present which causes for some really challenging fight including optional super bosses. You have the ability to have up to 15 total party members (based on coven slots) in a team, soul reincarnation to let you move passives around different classes. This overall is to help with the difficulty of the games. Since your party are made up of dolls there is no perma-death but there is instead dismemberment, including arms, legs and even the head for an instant death. That goes both ways in fights sometimes letting you cripple enemies and sometimes instantly ending the fight, with an equal chance of maybe wanting to leave because your knight just lost their sword arm (Which you can get which hand is their dominant one). Just cool overall, but again very dark.

[@xzero4985]

Interesting write-up. I have played several of the games you listed but had forgotten about them -- Demon Gaze in particular was one that I remember enjoying.

[@FukuritaMariko]

I remember seeing this game series through the Neptunia fan community and remember it looking really weird and scary for my taste and looking at it now still kind have those same feelings but did own one of there games still have yet to play them

[@lysibee]

bro this recomended me and its a bless because i didnt know tht much cool games are existing lol

[@thomasblack1127]

Personally my favorite Rpg hands down. Story, difficulty, interactions and designs are peak. Though my favorite is 3 simply because Pyre Jp voice actor is too adorable.

[@noobymaniac]

Great vid! Might have to check this one out.

[@yan_dj]

The setting makes me think Danganronpa x Madoka Magica

[@xzero4985]

I can definitely see that in terms of the look of it. The story is not nearly as strong as either of those works, though.

[@hylianfelldragon1308]

NGL I would play both this and the Etrian Odyssey HD Collection on my Switch whenever I'm in the mood for a DRPG with slight differences in preference depending on my mood. Etrian Odyssey for when I'm in the mood for party customization and this game for when I want more of a story.

[@iguoyrxayananikihs9505]

Looks interesting. The only first person dungeon game I have ever played is Bunny Black.

[@Mmalficia]

its always been a toss up with me between the marry skelter series and stranger of sword city series as the gold standard of blobbers on pc , now if i could find something like that with random dungeons ide be set 8)

[@xzero4985]

Definitely going to pick up Sword City next time I see it on sale.

[@TurboMaid-y6p]

Really loved the story to death. Started with MS2 and ended with MSF. I would say my problems starts at Finale.

[@Mr.Roboto_]

I would recommend looking at Labyrinth of Calleria or my favorite Legend of Grimrock

[@xzero4985]

I've had a lot of recommendations for the Labyrinth of Galleria / Refrain. I'll have to check them out sometime.

[@DieKao]

I was actually looking for good games in this Genre to try, aside from Legends of Grimrock (which somone recommended to me). Mary Skelter being from IF does intrigue me since I did like the Neptunia games.

[@rumotu]

Have you played labyrinth of refrain or SMT strange journey? Cause those two are in my top of 1st person dungeon crawler

[@xzero4985]

I played Strange Journey on the original DS but didn't get very far. I keep seeing people recommend Refrain and I will have to check it out sometime.

[@Lapis_Sheep]

waow... Mary Skelter video

[@xzero4985]

Yep!

[@UncannyXmeme]

Gonna buy this

[@xzero4985]

Good, much better than stealing it.

[@kasupy_barrett85]

Got it for discount. Worth it.

[@xzero4985]

Definitely!

[@dementovoid2255]

After watching this, I'm really tempted to get into this series, but wanted to ask about how performance was. I've seen a few Steam reviews mentioning that the game would crash frequently, has anyone who's played ever had issues with this before?

[@xzero4985]

I don't know about Steam but I will say that I don't think it's ever crashed for me on Switch.

[@dementovoid2255]

I see, I'll probably buy the Mary Skelter games during the next Steam sale. Thanks!

[@exile1412]

I bought the game immediately. Mind you, I didn't watch (yet), or try a drpg before. No thoughts, just a hunch. I don't usually impulse buy. Also, it's on sale. why not? if I don't like it, I won't be mad, just glad I tried it out.

[@xzero4985]

I think you'll be pleasantly surprised, as I was.

[@exile1412]

@@xzero4985 Yeah I was! I've enjoyed it so far.

[@lovingfool2060]

was really tragic soul hackers 2 dropped the FP dungeon crawling from its identify, its still probably my top fav still for its dungeon designs being more based on the buildings they take place in, which is a novelty you really dont see often

[@KaptenN]

As far as first-person dungeon crawlers go, I have yet to see a game that's more appealing than Legend of Grimrock.

[@matheusestrela5302]

Love the etrian series too, played all of then on my 3ds, but found this mary skelter randomly on steam and its was a very enjoyable experience, its a bit clunky in comparison to etrian, but the characters and combat is more dynamic for me

[@xzero4985]

I like all the additional systems Mary Skelter offers over EO.

[@RikThunder33]

I had no idea this genre was still alive o.O Intruiging. Game mechanics sound nice. Though the character art scares me away.

[@luckydapirate]

never played mary skelter but i love EO and Labyrinth of games

[@Orange_Swirl]

I had Mary Skelter on my Switch wishlist for forever, and never bought it. If Mary Skelter 2 goes on sale (and it probably will at some point), I'll be sure to pick it up

[@Orange_Swirl]

By the way, I love both the character and environment designs.

[@xzero4985]

Well worth the money, especially on sale. Lots of content there.

[@shibumi8]

Never heard of this one but I’ll give it a shot. Essentially EO Hot Topic/ Prison Girls edition.

[@xzero4985]

Oh man, I remember Prison Girls. Yeah, there's definitely some similarities there.

[@astrea555]

I heard the switch version is better than on PC, I'm confused but the series looks very cool to me. good vid!

[@xzero4985]

Someone else in the comments said the Steam version crashed a lot, which I've never had happen on Switch.

[@dragongrandmaster]

got a special switch edition of mary skelter i have no idea what to do in the game

[@JoshuaPAMployee]

Play it

[@dragongrandmaster]

@@JoshuaPAMployee the puzzle s its also confusing to wherte to go

[@JoshuaPAMployee]

@@dragongrandmaster if it's 1 or 2 think of it is DARK SOULS first person because all areas are connected AT FLOOR 1. Finale is to explore every nook and cranny switch teams and move items between parties until you find the solution!

[@drakofox1362]

As someone who played the whole series of this game and another called Death End ReQuest made by the same dev team WHOLLY COW THESE GAMES ARE HARD but fun lol love the games the nightmares especially. So i gotta ask everyone whats your favorite thing about this game (and favorite character to)

[@xzero4985]

My favorite character is easily Sleeping Beauty.

[@user-zezezozodarkdomains]

the first game plays the best with mouse, also the first JRPG i ever experienced to play better with mouse as back in the day Japanese console ports with full mouse support are very very few.

[@SAAisar]

I really really really like your voice. You have an extremely smooth cadence and are very easy to listen to. Do you have an editor? While your content is very compelling, the script is not very punchy, and the thesis is a little boring. Not unsalvageably so, just a little! Have you watched NeverKnowsBest? You guys kinda have the same cadence. I know the lengths of your videos and his aren't remotely comparable, but I do think if you spent a little more time punching up your theses and really telling me why I should be listening to your take, it'd make the viewing experience more interesting! This was really very nice to listen to regardless, sorry if I came off as super negative. I wouldn't write as much if I didn't think you had potential. I'll definitely look forward to your future videos!

[@xzero4985]

Some people really like my voice, others can't stand it. I try to be the opposite of hyper YTers: chill, laid-back, but still dry / sarcastic humor at times. All of the work on my channel is done by me, with the exception of occasional help on thumbnails from my wife. I will check out the YTer you mentioned. I have been trying to focus on tightening up my writing for videos in recent weeks, so your feedback is spot-on and appreciated.

[@cannibalraptor]

Is this by the same people who made Labyrinth of Refrain? Cause it looks similar and that game was pretty good

[@thomasthecoolkid7228]

I've never played Mary Skelter and I _still_ love it. The setting, the characters, everything is top notch. Compile Heart and Idea Factory just _do not miss_ in terms of visuals and characters.

[@PuchimonExtreme]

The story is fairytale characters trying to get out to the surface (they are stuck underground) Alice (in wonderland) Jack (and the beanstalk) Red Riding Hood. etc. There are three games. I find the first game to be the best since it really capitalize on the whole "classic era feeling" and the characters also develop from here. Everything after just feels different identity wise or already have certain character identities established (and therefore shafted) What do I mean by classic era feeling? We have fairytale characters and this is the ending song to the first game. kzbin.info/www/bejne/oIaXoZyuq9d9hKs

[@nanashikural]

2 games in this genre I can recommend are Operation Abyss/Babel: New Yokyo Legacy

[@makikuma91]

I get it. Nothing beats Etrian Odyssey, tho. I always felt bothered by the lengthy dialogs in mary skelter and the weird difficulty range. Etrian Odyssey felt more "adventure" to me. Mary Skelter more "visual novel". They both aren't bad, tho. I wish there were so many more dungeon crawlers, man...

[@xzero4985]

It's not a dead genre but it's not thriving like it used to be.

[@AtaeHone]

Where does Labyrinths of Yomi land on your scale?

[@xzero4985]

Haven't played it but it is on my wishlist!

[@Seloliva1015]

The "touch minigame" lost me so hard. But the music sounds awesome.

[@xzero4985]

The music is amazing. If the touch minigame is all that's holding you back, I'd say give it a try. It's nearly if not entirely optional, iirc.

[@dralakba-dusk31]

have you hear of Labyrinth of Refrain and its sequel Labyrinth of Galleria? i like those 2 a lot too 😊

[@xzero4985]

I think I played Labyrinth of Refrain but couldn't get into it. I may give it another go.

[@JULR0W]

It's a bit confusing at first to tell people that Mary Skelter 2 includes the first one as well, but I think I like the series WAY more than Etrian Odyssey, maybe because I am an edgelord. Persona Q1 and 2 are great dungeon crawlers as well

[@xzero4985]

I'm not an edgelord (I don't think...) but I definitely much prefer these games to EO at this point.

[@Dr_Doomfans01]

Feels like playing DnD Eye of the Beholder game in SNES 😁

[@RaifSeverence]

As much as i like mary skelter, my fave DRPG is still Dungeon Travelers 2-2

[@Guesswhoisarya]

Bro I just warmed up to watch the rest of the video. What do you mean “thanks for watching”?

[@xzero4985]

I try to keep my videos short. Fun fact: Most people don't watch past the first minute of videos -_-

[@dahunlee_acousticguitar_covers]

thanks for the cool 'not a review', also sold me enough to at least give it a try. Also take my sub lol.

[@xzero4985]

I appreciate your subscription!

[@sangerzonnvolt6712]

this plays like Legend of Grimrock

[@TheELASESINADOR]

LG is real-time combat, like Zanki Zero. MS is turn-based, like Persona 1. Other than the combat gameplay, they're still dungeon crawlers, though LG has better puzzles than MS.

[@yggreuyri5822]

Why is Yumina the Ethereal not mentioned? It's one of the OGs first person dungeon games

[@xzero4985]

Because this is a video about Mary Skelter.

[@ZKP314]

Does it have difficulty comparable to Etrian Odyssey?

[@xzero4985]

I would say Etrian Odyssey has a higher difficulty level, just because it has fewer options for optimizing your team.

[@Roge9]

looks cool

[@Asterra2]

I waited a heck of a long time for Etrian Odyssey to come to PC. When it finally arrived, I was reasonably pleased that the framerate was essentially unlocked (a big worry I had), but extremely disappointed with the 1080p presentation. That's why I made mods to completely overhaul EO1 and EO2's graphics so they meet today's 4K standard. I feel a little guilty at getting sidetracked before I could play EO3, which in turn meant I never got around to fixing EO3's 1080p graphics, which probably left some people hanging.

[@hito-sama]

My first "dungeon crawler(?) " : doom But now best dungeon crawler i played is Daphne Variant

[@shadowmaksim]

Some particular statements aside, I guess I'm just glad to have randomly come upon a positive video on "Mary Skelter". Between some parts of its aesthetic and it being developed by a studio that a lot of people immediately dismiss, the series largely seems to have been ignored when it comes to DRPGs. Which is kind of a shame cause, while it might not be perfect and quite messy narrative-wise (seriously..."2" includes a remake of "1" with story additions that require finishing "2" first to even access, much less all the novels that are actually crucial to the overall story), it's just a solidly enjoyable series. But sadly, that's kind of the norm unfortunately. I don't really see much talk about "Labyrinth of Refrain" and "Labyrinth of Galleria" either despite those being pretty darn good as well. I guess outside of "Etrian Odyssey" and some popular IPs utilizing the formula like "Persona", it's just a genre that rarely gets attention. Anyway, some bonus info: The main artist and character designer of the series is Kei Nanameda. In addition to "Mary Skelter", they've worked on both "Mugen Souls" games, "Trillion: God of Destruction", all three "Death End Re;Quest" games, their next major work is the upcoming "Todokero! Tatakae! Calamity Angels", as well as some other smaller contributions. The funniest one to me, that I don't see credited anywhere, is that they did the design of a single character in "Eiyuu Senki" (for Archimedes) of all things. The composer of the series is Yoh Ohyama (Yo Oyama), often associated with ZIZZ STUDIO. They've worked on "Process of Elimination", "Bar Stella Abyss", surprisingly "Yomawari: Midnight Shadows" apparently, contributed a couple tracks for "Mad Rat Dead", did a ton of stuff under Nitroplus, etc. They've been around.

[@xzero4985]

A LOT of the replies to this video have been talking about the Labyrinth of games, enough that I've decided I'm going to play them at some point. I'm glad you liked the video (my statements aside). That's interesting information about the artist. I've got a lot of those games on my to-play list.

[@pokinginpractice9108]

You can argue that this has better gameplay, but I still prefer the fantasy dungeon exploration theme and lore of EO more.

[@xzero4985]

Valid, but I don't think I'll ever play EO again unless it's on a dual-screen system. The mapping in the Origins port is way too clunky.

[@lunard8690]

swords and serpents for NES and Dark Cloud for ps2

[@ralphso5567]

1st person dungeon ctawlers makes me get motion sickness

[@xzero4985]

That's unfortunate. There are some great games in the genre but I don't know of any that have options for reducing motion sickness.

[@damasake]

Is the pink there just censored red blood?

[@protectedname1301]

That's the enemies blood. Red blood appears at CGIs, the MC shooting their blood out, and some the jails(I think)

[@Sephyroth97]

It's just how it looks, extremely bright, in contrast to the dark environments.

[@thomasthecoolkid7228]

Oh no no no, the monsters _canonically_ have neon pink blood. The blood of the humans is still red.