The future of Warhammer Horus Heresy

[@TaliaTheNeko]

Since I started playing Heresy, I have made "my own" praetor, He has his own backstory. I mean, he nothing really great. He's just a praetor with a wargear combo that anyone else could take. But HES MINE. I designed him that way. I gave him a back story. (He leads an assault company of Death Guard under Calas Typhon's great company). I feel like I have ownership of my force and how I design it. On that note, the ability to still kitbash models is big for me and our gaming group. The ability to do that in standard 40k is becoming more limited with the release of more monopose models (among many more flaws). For me HH is like the wild west of kitbashing infantry models and I absolutely love it.

[@scrubsrc4084]

I did the same with my emperors children champion.

[@dicedoom7162]

feels like good ol days of 40k. nice

[@christopherdean4848]

Absolutely agree with this - this is why I'm interested in warhammer old world. You can make your own guys. It's actively encouraged and has always been this way. GW's main game systems have become almost 100% play out of the box and nothing else and it's really not in the spirit of the hobby.

[@AcheronBlade]

My biggest hope for HH is that GW leave the rules alone and don’t touch them. One vote for no new edition please, just release more models we need and they’ll make plenty of money

[@Infernal_Puppet]

The core rules have a lot of problems, challenges, wound rules, outflank, deep strike, and to a lesser extent reactions need some fixing. The entire ZM mode as written in Cthonia is awful and encourages samey lists that circumvent the scoring and deployment rules. The current army books have some atrocious balancing where many options are awful to the point of not taking, but while others are completely out of wack that they invalidate units 2-3 times their points cost for no reason. It’s not good.

[@AcheronBlade]

@@Infernal_PuppetI contend that GW being GW will screw things up even worse than what you think doesn’t work now if they go for a new edition. I’d rather they forgot about the rules and the community just fix things in events or clubs rather than count on GW to somehow miraculously figure out how to write good rules (never going to happen). All things considered I’d rather have current state core rules than what it could become with GW’s reverse Midas touch. Just look what they are doing to 40k or AOS as their “mainline” games. Being a main game and getting GW attention is actually a curse, not a blessing.

[@Infernal_Puppet]

@@AcheronBlade That doesn’t make much sense. Second edition was not a complete departure from first and I wouldn’t expect a new revision to either. Also the studio who handles HH is not the same one that works on 40k and AoS. Relying community fixes is bad because it divides the community and makes it harder to pickup games with people not in your own playgroup.

[@AcheronBlade]

@@Infernal_Puppet so essentially you did not like most of the changes from 1st based on your list above, but you also believe they will make 3rd better? Ok. Will leave it at after to disagree.

[@_PickleNick]

Love the no cp rerolls, no constant rules changes and the ability to convert my models. I've given my legion my own flavour and created a story for it. What I would love is more plastic kits (looking at javelin and og land speeder), quicker releases (not sharing horus heresy Thursday with epic releases). Rules for the knights errant. More character releases (Nykona Sharrowkyn, Revuel Arvida) Mk4 and 5 plastic

[@sturm9087]

Id like to see more stuff for the other factions in the game. The number of people (me included for a long time) that avoid heresy because of all the marine focus is so high. Oooh Id also like to see some skitarii added to the mechanicum.

[@thomascoutts9242]

Horus Heresy - Siege of Terra - city fight rules. Plastic Breachers and despoilers in the box (painted as IF and WE)…. Throw in a couple of rhinos and a leviathan and it’s a good complimentary box to the current age of darkness box

[@Junkwaffle1]

I like this idea a lot

[@LSTPcobra]

I remember when you said Horus Heresy should have the same rule set as 9th edition lol. Good job they didn't go that direction!

[@wintersSEO]

I was wrong. I was so wrong.

[@paulturner9675]

Hey Winters. I am seeing a split in our GW player base (and I am old having played since '92) - there are the fixed systems and lists (HH and Old World) and then there are the "live" games (40k and AOS) where you chase the Meta even as a casual player. Then you have the Specialist Games like Legion Imperialis (which as an old Epic player I absolutely love) and even Warmaster which is having a rebirth in Australia through the fan-based Warmaster Revolution. So yes, FAQs and Erratas are good for these "fixed" and "specialist" games, please understand the audience and keep the rules and lists as they are, and narrative based.

[@padanfain7466]

Absolutely spot on. My entire gaming group has changed to HH. Mainly because we are all grown asse adults with jobs, friends, families and lots of interests. It takes a few years for us to get an army ready. This might be the first time in 20 years there is a real chance I will actually finish painting my army! There is still lots of opportunity for plastic kits, and with the slow and steady release schedule I don't think they will change it for a good few years yet. There may be some FAQ's, but no real changes.

[@hannahgeraghty4201]

Right now all I'm hoping for is Sisters of Silence models released. My favourite army has one 5 model box, one forge world character, and one 150€ transport

[@Bellerophon3]

I've been planning an Ultramarine Heresy army for years, but I need plastic breachers!

[@heckinmemes6430]

"Well, lets add some xenos." "Yeah, and a mission deck, with points!" "YEAH! Maybe each legion gets it's own liber?" "YEAH! How about some big tournaments, so we can see what the competitive players are taking." "YEAH! Then we can use that to 'balance' the game!" "YEAH! Then we can throw all this shit in the trash every 2.5 years and sell them everything again!" "OOOH! PRIMARIS IN HERESY?!" "YEAH. MONEY MONEY MONEY MONEY!" You know it's coming.

[@LordCrate-du8zm]

Heresy has its own dev team. They would never allow that.

[@greyknight8192]

I also love how for some legions , the specific rites of war combine really well their style of fighting, especially when adding in certain characters etc.

[@clo8076]

The Liber team making the Panoptica rules and so on are amazing! They really took HH2.0 to the next level and in a great way!

[@TheExcessus]

Panoptica is bloated as **** though, and includes a looot of unbalanced things. Nobody I know still play with it...

[@clo8076]

@@TheExcessus That’s interesting. I have found my friends and I enjoy it quite a bit. Sorry you don’t like it much.

[@sturm9087]

@@TheExcessusI’m guessing you also don’t know a single person that plays militia or maybe even solar auxilia as their main army then. I can’t tell you the last time I’ve seen a battlecannon before picking up panoptica which is ironic seeing as thats the standard and most common gun in the lore. Besides as long as you’re only using the stat and rule changes and not the new army lists/units I don’t see how it could be bloated.

[@trajanthegreat2928]

Model-wise, main things should be plastic troops and legion praetors for all legions. Despoilers in particular are a key part of several legions, breachers add so much flavour to a list, recon marines are very popular this edition. We've still got 5 legions without praetors (Iron Warriors, Salamanders, Raven Guard, World Eaters, Iron Hands). I would much rather GW do a good errata rather than a new edition, there are lots of things I would change about the game but a new edition would just have different problems.

[@deleted4577]

Once plastic Mechanicum drops there's gonna be a bunch of ad mech players jumping ship that're salivating over the 30k range while being told "tough luck buddy, be happy with your stilts guy". It's the rules that's really selling me on it though, 10th edition is basically just tabletop XCOM with a 40k skin and, while that can be a lot of fun, it's just not what got players like me to fall in love with the game.

[@LordCrate-du8zm]

At least 40K Admech can have some love in 30k.

[@dan_the_lizard]

I personally like the idea of Xenos rules. It freshens things up for a new edition without having to go crazy with rule changes. I’d also implement different timelines you could set your armies in. This would be a purely narrative feature, although might restrict certain versions of characters to a certain time period. You could have Great Crusade - Everyone is loyalist fighting against xenos and unconquered human enclaves. Age of Darkness - The current Heresy time period and The Scouring - Traitors falling back to the Eye/Maelstrom (allowing more corrupted versions of the traitors to be represented and perhaps resurgent Xenos empires appearing now the Imperium is weak).

[@quakeSanchez]

What I want in 30k: 1) No crazed carousel from 40k with constantly changing rules. 2) Rule support for xenos - having a constant power armour fest on the table is exhausting and was always exhausting 3) I would like my army list book to be slimmer. If I wanted to slaughter somebody with a brick, I would go outside and get a brick. 4) Slightly more love for tanks and other vehicles. 5) And yeah, my bitz box is HUGE, but it would be smart to release breacher/despoiler upgrade sprues. It is silly at this point in type.

[@Blazetwoe]

If they did Xenos the way they did Daemons... I could see that happening, so people can make their own aliens or create the existing stuff with the rules, and offer that variety, story telling aspect to it. I think that could work.

[@jaworski105]

What Xenos are featured in the Heresy? The orks stop being a concern after Ullanor, the Eldar are all but disappeared, and the Necrons havent awoken and the Nids wont exist for 12 thousand years.

[@Blazetwoe]

@@jaworski105 It's not quite so black and white. The narrative is open enough to depict incursions of various xenos, which happens in some books. Eldar, Orks, Megarachnids are just a few to mention that were in the books. The extent of said books is not the limit of the narrative, that is right down to the individual themselves. The idea is to let people make up their own, just like they can make up their daemons, you know, for fun.

[@Oldhammer57]

Ullanor, Orks and the Luna Wolves would be great. Then when everyone has gone home you can set up a victory parade!

[@jesperwallin]

Flatten your gaming table and march across it!

[@theresevoerman7109]

GW: "so, what you want is a complete new ruleset, tournament friendly, updated every two months, no new plastic troops AND a range wide price increase!? You got it, lads. Much love."

[@Marcus-es5of]

Only things that need changing imo is get rid of sunder (makes tanks much more survivable) no more brutal and change intercept reactions. The libre panoptica peeps already wrote some xenos rules so it would be sweet to see those included officially 😊

[@crazyman0937]

I love HH. I sold off almost all of my 40k stuff to fund my HH and Legions stuff. I came into the hobby during 7th and havent enjoyed 40k since they did the big chances from that. Like the artist in the Fulgrim book (paraphrased); Its is the imperfections that make the art perfect

[@aron582railways7]

I think they could've made a book called legiones astartes which was universal rites of war and the generic units including the ones from the pdf. Then their could be a book for loyalists or traitors where they fleshed them out more with more unique wargear, rites of war, specialist units and named characters

[@TaliaTheNeko]

Agreed. I'd like to see love spread across the legions a bit better. Sometimes it does feel like haves vs have nots.

[@daemonnexusknight]

I must say, I have had more fun with Heresy than I thought I would. The depth of the armies, even though it is primarily Marine versus Marine, is surprising. I would like to see more balance between weapon options and I personally think Dreadnoughts need something of a nerf as they seem too powerful.

[@HermanVIII2]

@winters SEO , have you ever looked into the Liber Panoptica rules set? community made update that adds everything from tweaks, missing units, to Orks, Eldar and Daemons.

[@wintersSEO]

No

[@sturm9087]

@@wintersSEOI’m not a huge fan of the panoptica army libers that add new units and armies. However the balance changes from the base game panoptica update is really great. It fixes a lot of the overtuned things like dreads and the undertuned things like battlecannons and the militia army

[@HermanVIII2]

​ @wintersSEO , As sturm said, the balance fixes are the real draw of the Panoptica rules, though the addition of some units is nice. Adding rules for Knight Dominus models and Skitarri Rangers/Vanguard are much appreciated.

[@Sean-nb6sj]

​@@wintersSEO Even gw like panoptica,alot

[@xTRYxHARDxSMGx]

I really believe that heresy and old world is the answer gw has given because of all the backlash to all the rules changes for 40K and aos, I really believe they won’t faq the hell out of this game because 40K exists and it’s a specialist game

[@ryanrules247]

Th fans have done a fantastic job of coving the Xeno races rules wise. Orks and Eldar are pretty must 100% finished by various groups, all very good and fluffy. Would be nice to see GW's take on it though. I stopped playing 40k after starting in 8th, as it was insane the number of rules changes. Heresy is a nice steady platform, i can build an army, i can build lore for my group, and i can tell a story with every battle. It also helps i can leave the game for a few months, come back and still pick up and play without issue. Moving to a 40k style release/rebalance system would kill Heresy for me 100%. Heres to hoping against hope they don't move in that direction.

[@Perkustin]

I really hope the Edition isn't changing next year, However i think they should release an updated, more user friendly Rulebook and very substantial Faq and Errata in the book/free to download (including a full pass on points costs e.g not costing dreads the same as when they were 'Walkers' and got popped by a stiff breeze) next year. I think the Xenos thing is tricky right now and bring Heresy the same issues plaguing Old World because people subbing in existing armies from other systems on mass leaves GW in a really tricky spot (i know defending the huge Corpo etc). They had to drop Old World despite it being hotter than a ghost pepper in a neutron star because they had a new edition of AoS to launch. However i think Xenos are going to appear eventually. I think the 'Age of Darkness' rules should only get a new edition with a new setting, 'Age of Darkness: Badab', 'Age of Darkness: Armageddon', 'Age of Darkness: Apostasy' etc, and ALWAYs retain the 3rd-7th Ed. (WS/BS/AV, +(x)pts per model) core 'engine'. They could then branch out with supplements, This edition would wrap up with Siege of Terra, but i think it would be cool if the expansion books should be uncoupled from the core rules and present new smaller settings, for example the first string of expansion books would be for Heresy, despite entering the 'Badab' era (Badab would act as a great 'Interim edition'), 'Visions of Heresy: The Scouring', 'Visons of Heresy: The great Crusade (The first Xenos rules introduced)', then move on.

[@rabbitsnrayguns]

Started in 8th loved it, then 9th came and I was a little annoyed but it was bearable, then 10th came out and I checked out completely. This year I got into HH and I am a happy camper. Loving it. A proper war game with direct ties to the lore I love.

[@Orlunu]

New thing that would be cool would be a lot more emphasis on the mortals of the setting, and a more sensible reaction system for interaction. A few things like monstrous-creature dreads/speeders just need to be rolled back tbh. They've never found a good response to the AP/Sv issue for heresy, and my biggest change would just be to go to the fantasy system where AP modifies armour saves but your invuln is taken as well as the armour rather than in place of.

[@newtpondskipper]

I've lost interest in 40k as I don't like the direction it's taken. I love 30k and if they cleaned up the main rules a little and set the main rule books up better I'd be happy with just this set. Now I would like to see the rules for the Solar Auxilia and the Militia to be competitive and not the spam mess they are now. I love those armies and right now there is no drive for me to buy them. Otherwise everything you said is on point!

[@knoxminis1211]

There are definitely a few changes needed: - Vehicle damage table is terrible and they blow up to easily. - Knights are terrible (no brutal?) - Custodes die too easily (6++ is next to useless), their weapons are incredibly short range, Telemon's are an over-costed a joke, etc. - Custodes have no rites of war at all. - Legion-specific terminators should all be WS5 - Something should change with objective control as Line units often die too easily and most games end up being just kill-counting in the end I will say of all the things I hope NEVER makes its way into Heresy are actions and the card-based system like we have for competitive 40K. Also, no strats or CP.

[@Malky24]

Isn't being a Terminator a form of punishment for White Scars rather than a promotion?

[@sturm9087]

Aren’t custodes one of the most powerful armies in 2.0 though?

[@knoxminis1211]

@@sturm9087 I have about 10K points of them and they’re not that great. But admittedly, I do play against a lot of Mechanicum locally, which has a ton of AP2 shooting. I don’t get to play them into marines too often.

[@sturm9087]

@@knoxminis1211 I’ve only seen them like twice and once was against demons which they cut through like butter so that really shaped my opinion of them. The other was solar auxilia and I bet you can guess how that went. I’m sure mechanicum probably plays better into them with all their robots.

[@knoxminis1211]

@@sturm9087 Yeah, if you can shoot Custodes with AP2 before they make it into combat, there’s not much they can do. I mean that applies to other armies as well of course. Custodes rules are a tad boring too. No rites of war.

[@pillowchicken]

So many comments here reflecting this. THIS fundamental design and ruleset is what 40k was for so long, its identity. And they threw it away. There are things i liked about 8 and 9th ed, but it isnt really 40k. The way they are going, i doubt any further interations will end up improving the game. If anything 3.0 would double down on the things ppl dont want/like. Just look at 9th and 10th design. My withlist for a 3.0/2.5 beside fixing the core rules jumble: - Making reserves "like" 40k feels awkward and too powerful, so they had to implement the Intercept meme to counter that again. - Revert the majority of Legion traits back to 1.0. Makes every Legion many times more thematic and fun. For example IF having more to it than all the guns. - Retune Reactions. They are fine, they were sort of in 1.0 anyways, but shooting reactions are too powerful still. - Keep Dreadnoughts and alike with Toughness. Just reduce their wounds. We houserule T7 or above as -2 Wounds and it works perfectly for my group. - Brutal is a nice tool, but too powerful the way it is implemented right now. It literally multiplies damage output by x on individual models. - PDF Armylists and Legacy are a joke. Daemons and Militia are missing few but vital things from 1.0.

[@jaegerbomb269]

I just want more plastic infantry! Destroyers, Recon, and Breechers, for example.

[@Daclaw79]

Love your Horus Heresy battle reports, hope you keep them coming, it’s far better than 40K.

[@jasonmorgan5069]

Watching this as I am finally building my first 30k army. Got into the lore and hobby about two years ago because of 30k Fists, then got distracted as friends got into 40K. Cannot wait to have my army built and painted so I can try out Heresy.

[@ep1phany62]

Prefer 6th/7th, but it was based on 6th/7th so was happy that most of the rules were kept. I haven’t rolled dice since 7th ended, so I started HH because I really wanted to play again. Played my first game (of anything) in 10 years, a month back, and really enjoyed it. Raven Guard 4-6 Dark Angels. Could have tied if I’d rolled higher on the D3. Happy with my choice of Raven Guard. Taking them to a narrative event in November.

[@tabletoppdx]

You hit the nail on the head. If GW just follows that they'll have another hit on their hands. Between this, Kill Team and Old World the specialist studio is killing it.

[@tomgledhill7]

Maybe I’m crazy, but I definitely prefer resin. I like how few components there are, where the seams are, how detailed they are, and the weight of them. I have 40 breachers and I’m going to cry when they disappear from resin (I want more 😂)

[@Rikshazam]

Horus Heresy noob here. I totally agree. Don’t change the rules! It’s already amazing! Plus, I still haven’t got the hang of it.

[@graemebeech1395]

Agree that the rules only need a tiny bit of tweaking, but (for the channel's games) maybe come up with a few house rules? Plastic kits would be ideal, but there are plenty of great weapons and upgrade kits on sites like Etsy and people like March of War. (I know since Winters gets stuff from GW, he might not want to say this?) As for xenos in HH... maybe? There is a ruleset out there for Eldar; "Liber Antiqua". That team also write updated rules tweaks for the main game too.

[@sneakybeak4032]

My Alpharius and Alpha Legion specific components all just arrived, so hype for Heresy as a first timer

[@grahamroden8897]

All good points, tweak not change. My only additional comment would be to introduce a smaller rulebook. The big books are a little much to carry around. The red books that v1 had were far better for my back.

[@johnwhite2412]

My son and I recently began playing HH. We love it. Less gotcha moments than 40k. Reactions are brilliant. Game play decisions determine the outcomes, less so than list building. Bad dice roll? Too bad. No command point spends for rerolls.

[@Kaibongdeity]

It needs an faq/ bit of a fix for the 2-3 main issues but that's it. Generally agree with everything you said. Breachers,recon,despoiler, ccw sprues, javelin/ Sabres/ etc. I'd love a black book for crusade / pre heresy with orks / eldar in

[@ericsmith9212]

I feel as long as Heresy stays away from the competitive scene it will be fine . I am not a fan of it,but I hope it stays away from tournaments.

[@christopherfreitas6510]

Spot on brother, after 8th Ed and half way through 9th, we got a massive jump in "competitive" play for 40k . And that's when it all went down hill. The has no fluff, flavor, or fun in it anymore. It's just a bland, base, meta chasing platform now ...

[@ericsmith9212]

@@christopherfreitas6510 I agree. That's why my gaming group makes a concerted effort to stay away from the Meta. It is the worst thing that ever happened to 40k

[@greyknight8192]

Wouldn’t mind seeing the “Go to Ground” rule again

[@PaxSierra]

Amen. Totally agree with no need for new edition. Finish the line of models.

[@CharlesCranford-y9k]

Meant to say buy your Space Marines army again.....yeah. Buy over and over sounds....terrific

[@stevenotrob6513]

Here here. Love playing horus heresy. I would add more missions.

[@markhorton9345]

Orks in heresy makes sense really. Be nice to try and have an Ullanor style battle!

[@James-37]

Heresy is amazing. Since 2.0 came out everyone i know has left crappy 40k and gone full heresy. Easily 30+ players, regular campaigns and events at my local. Glorious

[@MrTurtledude0001]

Gonna finally start playing heresy later this year. 40k for me is fun but I LOVE heresy lore soooo much more. The looks of the marines are better and I love all the tank options.

[@DimitriHarkov]

Highest time to get rid of the 'I go - you go' turn sequence. Alternative activation or even better: simultaneous turns turn HH into a much different and much better game. No need for reactions anymore, too, if they'd go down that route.

[@jesperwallin]

Since asking you Winters on your live stream last week avout fielding knights in HH, I’m going to start from there. Then I would love to field some lovely orkses along the line. The game sounds great - though I don’t want to paint marines.

[@loltwest9423]

Macca from the Outer Circle would like to have a word with you about the quality of rules in 2.0. Look, I love the system a lot, especially when compared to 40K 10th Ed. But there are some very blatant rules for writing problems. Characters who should not be at the same point cost are special legion units that have anti-synergies, and the Raven Guard's Legion trait is practically nonexistent when compared to the Imperial Fists. There are severe and noticeable balancing issues across the board and, unfortunately, blast and template weapons are kinda just...bad. Then, there's the ever-prevalent problem of the Contemptor Dreadnaughts. Unless there's been a boatload of changes that I've somehow missed, I retain that the Horus Heresy really could've used a balance patch of some kind, or just more people reviewing the rules and making sure things are fair and balanced because...yeah, they weren't, not at all. 2.0 suffers the "Death by a Thousand Cuts" and it's a shame. If they would just iron out the wrinkles and buffer the scratches, it could be perfect.

[@wintersSEO]

You can have great balance and terrible rules and you can have terrible balance and great rules and the Heresy core rules are pretty darn sweet. The balancing act, in a system with Titans and Primarchs and Erebus, is bound to upset a few people because Erebus exists. Points can be changed in the next edition to better balance things, but I'd rather they didn't burn down the core rules - which I'm rather afraid they might do - and which was kinda the point of the video.

[@sturm9087]

Honestly I wouldn’t mind the bad balancing if it didn’t feel like every change was made to ruin militia. They got the short end of the stick in pretty much every possible way by having their artillery and tanks heavily nerfed, being limited on the stuff they can bring like vehicle squadrons unless they use their army rule to get them back, losing access to many unit entirely like the macharius + baneblade variants + thunderers etc, and just nonsensical points costs like militia fire support squads somehow being MORE expensive than space marine heavy support squads. I honestly cannot understand how the Heresy rules writers somehow thought it made sense to look at a militiaman with a lascannon and a space marine with a lascannon and decide the space marine should be the cheaper one. Not to mention the militia and third line army rules that literally just make the army worse. Its hard to have sympathy for the legions with bad traits cause at least your traits don’t actively make your units weaker.

[@loltwest9423]

@@wintersSEO Alright. I get that. I wouldn't want GW to throw the baby out with the bathwater, either.

[@BittermanAndy]

@@sturm9087 you think Militia are bad? (Well, yes, they are, but...) Try Daemons of the Ruinstorm.

[@sturm9087]

@@BittermanAndy I’ve only seen one demon game so I can’t comment on how good or bad they are. What I can say is I’ve never seen militia win a battlereport since 2nd edition of Heresy released and I try to watch every militia bat rep I can find. I think I’ve seen like 10-12 and militia have lost all of them quite badly

[@afriendlyonionbro4621]

It's only been 2 years since 2.0, and I hope it is at least 5 before 3.0. That being said, I wouldn't mind a 2.5, with a few amended rules, some qol updates in the format, and a paperback edition for ease of carrying too and from games.

[@icklemoo]

just needs abit of balance in the factions between marines vs non marines armies ... perhaps look at contemptor stat lines to bring them inline abit for other factions . I think if they dumbed the rules to 40k / aos levels it would prob kill the game for many HH players I would love to play my orks in heresy but I am cautious that at this point the game then is becoming a lore driven 40k spin off as such ... and will start encroaching ... plus the orks in heresy era were ,much more powerful than the 40k era ones its seems in general ...good idea but not sure if it would be something healthy for the game in long run ... on other hand it could totally attract more 40k casual players into the game system which is a win . id really like to see them though the balance the army books .. mechanicum/solar auxilia/ militia etc need abit of love with more power to help them out abit more .. or they need to dumb down marines somewhat which I dont think would be the best idea ..

[@SonOfTerra92]

Only a talent like Alan Bligh could write a well balanced holistic Codex Xenos.

[@Ushoron]

I bet Heresy 3.0 will be "more inclusive" and more "welcoming for new players" as they turn it into a 40k/AoS style game. I don't trust GW to not screw it up.

[@ttv_swincher8004]

I’m almost done with my ec army and I’m waiting for the phoenix terminators and kakophoni squad to be in stock

[@aidenodonoghue]

Really would love to see a Tallarn campaign book with Forrix and generic warsmith models released for Iron Warriors. Also more plastic things...

[@truffleshuffle34]

Wish the would release the black books again.

[@sumeetbains750]

Agree with many points in this video especially the beginning. Heresy thrives of stability and give folks time to make big armies, its not a skirmish game. If they are going down this new edition every 3 year route it WILL kill the game. It suffocates choice and stifles hobbying, as people make armies according to lists they have drawn up. I am slightly concerned about the direction in which it is going. ALOT of people havnt got a full force ready yet at the 2 year mark of 2.0 and if we get a new edition next year with sweeping whole sale changes it disrupts the community massively.

[@andyashbey133]

If they ran one of those subscription mags like conquest or mortal realms for HH I and probably a lot of players would try it out in a shot

[@jeffers1985]

It's a very good game. Some of the legion traits do need tweaking. However the mournival community have provided some very good changes and mission packs

[@Swarzyc]

Im waitibg for models to start my sisters of silence army

[@johnp4000]

I think the constant changes around 40K are purely for the competitive side, as long as you don't have a tournament scene with Horus you are safe.

[@warrvenom4537]

Everything you said is golden if they had a clue they would hire you!

[@Rothgar59]

I play Space Wolves in 40k and with the way GW are going I don't think they will be around as a unique faction of much longer, I have looked at HH and really like the setting, but every Space Wolves HH army seems to recommend Grey Hunters, and Grey Slayers. two upgrade kits that are out of production.

[@CMTechnica]

Kitbashing exists, and unlike 40k, is entirely encouraged

[@huntersutton5489]

i really want them to make the Aurox Armoured Transport from the Solar Auxilia in plastic

[@wintersSEO]

Yep. Totally agree

[@BloodBuffalo]

I'm starting my white scars army in the spring for HH. Idk if codex xenos is a good idea since it's still a D6 game. I think inherently having so many factions having the same base line is what allows such a good system. Everyone for all intents and purpose starts at marine. You don't have to make an army FEEL stronger like say Tau to marines to custodes to necrons. Being hyper specific is why I'm finally pulling the trigger on the army. If it turns into 40k in the past I don't really see the point.

[@jamesespinosa690]

I think you're totally wrong. A d6 system can be balanced. They just CHOOSE not too. The company doesn't have any real incentive to make a 'perfect' rule set. If customers are 'totally satisfied' then they don't spend as much. 7th and 1.0 were actually really close to be 'perfectly balanced'.} It's difficult for me to really explain without examples, so I'd really love it if you could give me a couple or three examples of things you believe/feel to be imabalanced, and I'll do my best to change your mind!!! The reason why a d6 system works, is it gives us 2 layers of 'light, medium, and heavy' or 'weak, medium, strong'. 1 and 2 = youre at a disadvantage ,3/4 = your even, 5/6 = you have the advantage. So long as units and weapons are pointed appropriately, it is possible to balance most things!! Finally, the fact that you have to go through 3 layers of checks, before you can kill something (to hit, to wound, saves), designers have a TON of levels to control the balance with. Infact, one excellent example that pops up are how imbalanced vehicles have been, as compared to models with wounds, but especially giant monsters. The key reason why vehicles have always been underbalanced against them, is that vehicles don't come with a save!!!! Thats 1/3 of your mini's layer of defence, stripped away just because you have treads... The thing is, it didn't use to be an issue. But once they introduced HP and glancing hits, tanks become UP overnight.

[@BloodBuffalo]

@jamesespinosa690 choose is a strong word. Name a single D6 wargame with over 30 factions and variations that have deep lore tonadhere too.. Everyone that complains about GW leaves that out. The only maybe near one is bolt action but as it's historical every army is a baseline human.

[@RSBurgener]

What do I want to see? Anything for Iron Warriors that's not a head or a shoulder pad. I don't think that's too much to ask.

[@-inquisitor-9689]

Could not agree more, if they released codex Xenos, I'd be all over the horus heresy

[@BrotherPerun]

I just pray to Omnissiah that HH will not become 40k which became very boring for me rules and constant updates wise. Give us plastic models, tweek rules a bit but I love libers that do not get changed every few months.

[@gahrian]

What Winters said! Spot on!

[@deathlytree434]

The horus heresy is sooooo good i just wish there was some things taken from 9th stratagems & command rerolls and items lastly the faction specific subfactions i miss my valhallen three main characters rocking perks+items and the militia strat send in another wave 🤘

[@tabe8850]

Tbh, I want HH3.0 to be exactly like HH1.0 only with fixes for Psychic powers.

[@jaworski105]

Vehicles need a major boost and the Reactions system needs a massive overhaul.

[@BittermanAndy]

Yes, this. HH2.0 is an abomination.

[@Teemkill]

I love the rules, but I would like to see an expansion on the org lists, like they had in 7th with certain ones lending themselves to different unit types (spearhead for heavy etc.)

[@kurtl8425]

Wish I shared people’s faith in GW’s not messing with Age of Darkness. Of course they are going to change everything just to milk us for more money for the books. There are a legion of writers, artists and sculptors trying to make the best gaming experience possible. Then there are the “suits” in the front office simply trying to milk every coin they can out of the fan base.

[@de_polignac1108]

No those people are the problem

[@tunabros]

i love horus heresy but hate how i have to get into a lot of custom casting / kit bashing just to have lore accurate armies. i love the historical significance of this wargame tho

[@realsnice]

Just need a points balance and more options for the various factions. Make Solar Aux (a ZM faction) work for ZM.

[@jamescheeseright6412]

Little points adjustment for contemptors, tone down augury scanners a bit, maybe make reacting with heavy weapons a bit less effective... Problems solved!

[@cetx]

Agreed on all counts!

[@christopherfreitas6510]

If 30k was as supported as 40k, and had/got as many new shiny cool models as 40k did, then no doubt I would be playing 30k instead.. it has its gems, but it's no where near 40k when it comes to the level of the models, and how much attention it gets..

[@Deadjim17]

I love Heresy! My World Eaters do need more Axes as well. Just give me 7th ed rules back in 40K!

[@lordmalal]

Another edition treadmill will be the end of 30k for me. It has already killed my interest in 40k.

[@euansmith3699]

Winters' copy of the Heresy rulebook looks like a squig chewed it. 😄👍

[@wintersSEO]

It's been used and abused, like every good book should be.

[@Kollider115]

I’m personally not a fan of the ap system and how the charge bonus is applied, but boy howdy when my opponent’s story is that detachment is the imperial fist bs vs my ravenguard does it certainly not feel like a collaborative story

[@tompayne4945]

Actually, Adeptus Titanicus is the best ruleset they ever made, but neing based on a familiar and stable edition is a big plus. Personally i would like to see vehicles get wounds/toughness/saves, and AP modernising like later editions.the 'get a save/no save' thing is silly and makes certain weapons useless .also, leave xenos as a fan project, orks are stupid and Eldar would have to be bullshit.

[@christopherdean4848]

Well said.

[@Shadowsword_iv]

Well said, agree on everything but xenos, if gw do that it becomes a direct competitor to 40k and we don't want that look what they did to legends after 9th edition of use all your heresy units here.. .

[@SonOfTerra92]

I love AOD. You love AOD. We love all love AOD.

[@raphie8488]

A Great Crusade expansion for example and only minor tweeks to the rules. Upgrade packs for close combat weapons, like the heavy/special wepons. Bringing back the removed units, with a new upgraded design. Plastic, more plastic! Base units in plastic, preferable everything in plastic! New Xenos for the Great Crusade expansion... in plastic!

[@greyknight8192]

HH is the best, not played 40K since … it reminds me of the old 40K rules before it went tournament focused.

[@jumpjiveswing8882]

Can't disagree with anything you said. Apply for CEO of GW now mate ;-)

[@zackcook5123]

Honestly I feel that Heresy is intended as a very static game compared to 40k. Last edition lasted like 10 years. Evidence? The slow release schedule

[@JohnR1298]

Yes Xenos for H.H. would be great 😊

[@BadMoon7555]

Agreed. Xenos would be a welcome addition. Hell, the entire liber xenos book could start with "dear player, please note: these rules are unbalanced and focus on the lore and setting. use with caution." I personally would welcome a new ruleset, with minor tweaks to the current rules. 1) A 5+ coversave when in cover for ALL tanks, not just 6+ (i know they get a 5+ in rare situations) 2) A new and actually useable advance reaction for the sons of horus. How can they both fire first and still have the enemy finish their shooting? 3) A complete re-write of the militia rules. They are unplayable as is, even if you really, really love them. 4) a re-write of the solar rules (as it stands, you cannot ally in a tankcompany. the tankcommander needs to be the warlors to unlock the cohort, but cannot be the warlord in an allied detachment.

[@Thedagda801]

On the money!

[@Instar_nine]

The game wasn't tested properly and there was extreme bias towards certain legions in 1 of the 2 testing groups. Flyers, superheavies were not tested properly to to lack of testers using the models or owning them. Spamming wasn't tested. Big volkite weapons were clearly not tested. Units were pulled from books or not in them as they forgot to put them in and panicked with last min pdf ie legacy units Lots of issues, I could go on but cannot say any more. GW is having to fix all this. It's a tidy up and they were given 2 years of free community testing. Panoptica have tested and fixed alot of issues for them for alot of things. So they will probably use alot of there fixes. It's unclear direction gw will go in but expect rebalance towards certain legions and fixing of flyers points and rules etc Its great to hear people's comments but you don't actually understand what happened with initial testing etc. GW doesn't want to be updating the rules so this new update they are doing is a one off to fix stuff. They are not happy about this situation but we're let down by external testers and specific staff as I understand.

[@BittermanAndy]

Yeah, the core rules of HH2.0 are so shockingly bad it cannot possibly have been meaningfully playtested. They even had to update the reactions rules (the main/only entirely new feature over first edition) four times in the first three FAQs, and they're still bad! Then as for the army lists, the balance is horrendous, and it only gets worse in the expanded lists like Daemons which are absolute garbage. I don't see how they can blame "external testers and specific staff" though... the problems were obvious from turn one of my first game, if not from just reading the rules as written. Literally all they had to do was play one game before printing the books and they'd have seen it. GW screwed up, GW must own it.