The General Contractor Threatened me

[@seanfalter9903]

Stanley, been there, you speak the absolute truth, they will chew you up and spit you out and not think twice about it, I’ve gotten tired of being a general contractors stepping stone and only do jobs that I’m in control, hence no more sub contract work, I feel your pain, keep up the great content!👊💪

[@7779-c3m]

Same here, Just Fired my biggest contractor .

[@ASGDirtworx]

Stan, you are a wealth of knowledge and experience. Smart people will listen to you and succeed. Thanks for doing what you do.

[@kylequinn1963]

Facts. I started my business 8 years ago with Stan's videos as my guide, just bought a mini skid loader yesterday and a set of forks today. Built from nothing and now I'm ready for anything.

[@dustinmarquand5301]

These stories are golden wisdom. Thanks!

[@notsure6182]

there are GC that brag about bankrupting subs on every project. it is free money for them if you go broke. be careful when playing with big boys

[@tabbott429]

This why Ive stayed in residential ONLY working directly for the homeowner. I refuse to be treated that way and i always get paid as soon as the job is done. Literally the day i finish i get the final check. No waiting no middlemen ho headaches. I like small jobs with low overhead. I can respect guys like you for doing what you do.

[@H1262.0]

I’m own a Mid Size GC company. I always make sure my subs are paid and well compensated. On our bigger jobs 10 million + I always have my sub trades request scheduled draws. Not all GC’s are crooked.

[@oswaldorabanal485]

I agree, the massive company I work for always pays N30 on time. They do over 100mill.

[@gordowg1wg145]

Yeah, if the company is so cash-strapped they can't handle the intermediate payments, they're not one you want to work for because that's a huge red warning - especially if the name "trump" is associated with the project.

[@chrisanthony579]

I have done small government projects (schools, libraries) where it's written into the prime contract that I couldn't pay subs until the government paid me, the GC. I always told subs that if you don't like these terms, best you not work in commercial because it's the way it is. The AIA pretty much f-ed up the industry many decades ago.

[@Don_P.717]

I've been a GC and a sub. I've always paid subs in a timely manner. We have done both commercial and residential. Each time you enter into a contract with a new client there is the risk that the other party is dealing in bad faith. In commercial work you learn not to deal with those companies again. There is the opportunity to "learn" which contractors to deal with. When each contract is with a new client that opportunity does not exist, each is a new individual. I have run into far more crooked homeowners than crooked contractors. The easy shot is to paint contractors as cheats and that creates a climate where it is ok to cheat someone who you believe is out to cheat you. I've also worked with subs I trust multiple times who come through. Most people on a commercial site are experienced and know what, when, where and how to do their jobs. If it was easy everybody would be doing it :)

[@jn1ty]

This is typical in a lot of businesses. I had a medium size Truck parts and repair business and some of my large customers would send me a letter saying they were now going to pay me every 90 days. I got a lot of work from them so they figured I would just say OK. I am not a bank. I need the money to run my business. I just told them NO. I would ratter not do business with them if I have to float them when they have all the money.

[@CZAnthonyX]

I love watching your guys work after a long day of work myself lol

[@Dirtmonkey]

Glad your here

[@jeffmcbride469]

I have never done what you do, but I appreciate this video, and frankly it applies to many other areas of life. Thanks Stan!

[@briancoffey6814]

There was only one general contractor that I felt like a friend and not a tool and that was walton contractor out of TX. I done a lot of work for them in Florida and ones a month at least the owner of this larger company would come down and spend the day with us and if we needed anything he took care of us like his own. I worked under him for 3 years and wish I would have took his offer to work for him as I later found out he was looking for someone to take his place. He was a big mentor and inspirational man in my life. Like you said it's rare to get that level of respect from a general Comercial contractor, especially on those million dollars, and plus jobs

[@Joseph-jx8bl]

Just came across you page…….good stuff. Can’t wait to watch more. Keep grinding

[@LawnsAcrossAmerica]

Cash flow is so important in this business and having to wait 90+ days (or up to 5 years!) to get your full margin takes a lot of good planning and budgeting. On top of that it's a largely seasonal business. So many challenges. Good stuff all around Stan!

[@Dirtmonkey]

Totally agree!

[@chrisanthony579]

Over the years I have seen many small contractors fail simply because they couldn't manage the money side of it. It's sad because here we are with a huge trade labor shortage. Chasing the dollar, growing the business based on demand/work load instead of growing based on finances is simply not wise. Stan a very seasoned and wise business man; said it himself "we were once of the biggest..." I personally don't want to be the biggest, I want to be the wealthiest. Maybe Stan put his penis away and looked at his bank account. Hence, doing less big commercial and more smaller residential.

[@stewardslandscape]

I'm a small potatoes landscape contractor, 25 years in. Other guys will tell me how commercial is where it at, but I've always felt like the risk and impersonal nature of the job outweighs the potential profit. I do well working residential, directly for my customer, and never risk more than I can afford lose.

[@sergeiboers2009]

Learned that the hard way ONE time.... started adding some fine print to our proposals that specifically says the proposal is based on drawings we received at the time of the RFQ and that final installed qty's might differ from what is state on the proposal and in the even that it does, they need to use the unit price listed to figure for the payment for the installed qty. Then we go through the subcontract with a fine tooth comb to make sure they included that little snippet, and if they didn't, we don't sign until they amend it or add it. I am surprised how many people don't know that you can negotiate the contract terms, they aren't final. A lot of GC's here try to add in a line that you are at their mercy for schedule and if they tell you to bring in more guys, you have too, and if they need you to start work with less than 24 hours notice, then you have too. We make sure to cross all that crap out. Like you said, they will use you anyways they can, and throw you under the bus to make themselves look better at any chance they can.

[@landonmiller5882]

It's now 5% max retainage in MN. Yes, subs are the bank for all commercial projects. It's messed up. All projects should have an escrow fund setup and as soon as work is invoiced the escrow 3rd party pays out the invoice within a week.

[@chrisanthony579]

The Owner is the escrow. The Architects control the money.

[@brian2359]

Love these videos Stan! God Bless

[@Mack.of.all.trades]

It always grinds my gears how gc act. It should be we go on the job, finish, and when they do their payroll they pay the subs. If the GC is really paycheck to paycheck with their owner / government, they shouldn’t be in business.

[@juliemunoz2762]

With commercial construction you have to stay on top of the paperwork and always protect yourself with pre liens and don’t be afraid to file them when they don’t pay. They cut checks fast when the landowner gets a lien slapped on them. And don’t tolerate that 60 or 90 day payout. 30 day is the max you should accept.

[@robsdeviceunknown]

Grats on the 1 mil subs bud. You deserve it. I know what put you over and brought more good folks in. The new "type" of videos you started doing. It told a lot of folks that you are indeed "one of us".

[@Dirtmonkey]

Thanks 👍

[@gerdberg4188]

Looks like Zac has a hangover

[@wolverine89893]

I can see where retainage can be used, I would use it only if a sub- contractor, did sub-par or shitty work was being done. Then I would hold that for 5 years, if I was a General Contractor. Also Stan I love these stories, they let us know it is not all rolling in clover. So keep telling those stories, they are very interesting to hear. 😯

[@opticalinch]

Stanley, incredible info for others doing business.

[@kylebrown2689]

Stan makes some of the best videos out there about being a contractor. Im Currently on a huge project as a Sub and they haven't paid once on time. Carry cost for 4months minimum.

[@SledgeHammer43]

Stan if you mentioned the projects you got screwed on other contractors in your area could find out the general contractor who screw guys so they don't work for them. Sooner or later they won't have subs that will work for them.

[@blackopsrocks]

Stan. I have stopped putting in starter block as of this year. I pour a footing with my steps as needed. I sell that as a warrantable wall. I save about a hour of labor and 100 dollars materials for every 10 feet. Also, for big walls, its a faster approval process for engineering if required. (Like the sams club we did, wall exceeded 8 feet)

[@AW-yv9sq]

Do you have any videos of that

[@blackopsrocks]

@@AW-yv9sq best Ive got is pictures. I dont make social media or branding a focus of revenue.

[@bloodyblade916]

You guys do some great wall work and construction

[@docfeelgood512]

Yep ! 37 years in the business. Normally, have about $500k of my money out. Waiting to get paid.

[@rccalhoun]

i am a general engineering contractor (demo, earthwork and asphalt paving). plans and specs with dates mandatory in all my bids and contracts. ive got a million stories.

[@oldworldchris4187]

Good lesson, nice quality work!

[@christophercharles7302]

I just noticed the 1 million subscribers...Congratulations!

[@Dirtmonkey]

Thank you!

[@robertvannicolo4435]

Stan bigger isn't always better, like you said, just because big job doesn't mean big profits

[@dschon7]

Retainage is a funny but important thing. I just bid commercial work 110% lol

[@kenb4426]

Hey Dirt Monkey. Hadn’t come across one of your videos for a while. Just a quick thank you. Your videos on retaining walls gave me the confidence to tackle a big retaining wall project on my own. Wall is still looking good 5 years in and still have the Kubota (well yea had to have a tractor 😅).

[@stuartreadman118]

It’s just the same in England, I used to work for building firms, they were an absolute nightmare, never wanted to pay, wanted the cheapest price, then used to take main contractors discount of the invoice just for the privilege of having to work for them

[@nicholasmendoza6159]

This is where you get a better relationship and contract with the general contractor when working with them.

[@nicholasmendoza6159]

Another thing to do is offer discount terms. I increase the price on my end to cover the discounts etc. So i would up my price 10% for a 3% retention and offer a 5% discount if they pay within 30 days and an 7% discount if paid within 10 days. Tje best practice is all the discounts are realized on the final payment, not the progress payments. Another thing inahve written is that all the payments need to be within the net/discount for it to apply. If they accept your bid and dont take advantage of the discounts, that typically means your total bid after discount was lower than the competition, so you know you can increase your prices.

[@larryspiller6633]

I worked for nearly 30 years for a Union General Contractor. Mostly in Heavy Highway and Industrial and refinery settings. Waste Water (Sewage) as well. The Contractor took on few commercial jobs because of the problems associated with them. Our problem was our Sub contractors. As the General contractor, when your subs don't show, YOU become the sub. None the less, it was a fair way to make a living. You learn how to work as a team to bring the job in on time and hopefully under budget without a stinking punch list. Peace.

[@nintendbro3275]

You should think about starting a podcast or something. You've got the energy and charisma for it, a wealth of knowledge and experience, and where I think you'll really find your edge is that you seem like the type of person to bring out the best in others, so I think you'd do well at extrapolating quality information and stories from any guest tradies you bring on. But that's just like, my opinion, man 😂

[@jafopt]

Guessing that retainage is for their warranty. If something fails they don’t wanna pay for it.

[@RCMServices]

I never had issues getting paid on commercial projects. It is all how the contracts are written. Don't ever sign a contract that you can't live with. Retention is usually based off the owner signing off on the project. The last project I did, invoiced the GC on the 20th and was paid on the 10th via direct deposit.

[@edframers1335]

i agree with you 100%,,, but we just keep doing those jobs, chasing the old mighty dollar.

[@jimmythepirate494]

I do not ALLOW anybody to threaten me, not a little, not a lot. You pick any single person with any amount of money and watch their inability to threaten me without consequence. I subcontract flooring, let a plumber, carpenter or gen con talk down on me, they will be paying just to make what comes with talking crazy to me, go away. We cannot allow others to prove their "strength" by diminishing ours.

[@markadams5429]

Great video Stan! Congrats on the 1 million subs! Well-deserved! Curiosity question. If they can hold 10% up to 5 years, is that held in an escrow? My first thought is what if they go out of business, what happens to that money then!?

[@royreynolds108]

Most commercial jobs are by bids and the lowest bid usually wins. You invoice what you have bought and delivered to the job site and have done in that month. You are paid by invoice minus retainage less what has been paid previously. I was the estimator for 2 contractors who did work for the US Gov. and private companies either as a subcontractor or the job and they also did work for companies by straight contract by negotiated price. When we did subcontract work, we would get the full set of drawings and specs to make our take-offs from. We usually prepared our bid and submitted it to several general contractors for the project. We usually did not have any trouble getting our money. We even had one owner take up for us with one of our suppliers when the supplier drug their time about supplying the material in a timely fashion. It was hilarious.

[@scotts4125]

I had a guy installing a kitchen for me and putting wood T&G on a high ceiling. It was my house and I was acting as an owner GC. I got to talking to this guy. In a previous life he and a partner had a large drywall company doing mostly commercial work. He did a huge job with lots of change orders that never got signed off. At the end of the day the jobsite handshake wasn't enough. They refused to pay him. They had to declare bankruptcy. He told me that job amounted to $250,000 owed and not paid. His fault no doubt but still nuts. He and his brother had a rolling scaffold. His brother was the cut man and handed this guy the boards to be shot into the ceiling. They did an amazing job. This guy was clean cut, serious and a good worker. His brother was a hippie free spirit type. I later found out the serious guys wife ended up leaving him for the brother. Unreal.

[@Dirtmonkey]

thats a sad story all around

[@emanarfarm3736]

Good story Stan. Regards, from retired General Contractor.

[@Dirtmonkey]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@godbluffvdgg]

As a general, you have to be very flexible...Most trade guys are "up to their asses in alligators" If you're considerate you will give your tradesmen a heads up as soon as you get a tentative go from the client. You want them to put it on the backburner...We all need to be cognizant of other people's schedules. I know it's hard to believe that everyone's world isn't revolving around yours...:)

[@Infoulnessyeshallknowthem]

Sounds exactly like the film production industry

[@pshanahan]

I started my company in 1982 when I was 22 years old and said I would never do commercial work or new construction!only did residential retro projects or government work.Always got paid .But I know quite a few people that got screwed by scumbag general contractors that do it as part of their business plan.Horrible!

[@bduncan9724]

I'm a plumbing sub. Been there done that. Your 100% correct about everything

[@chrisanthony579]

Commercial GC for around 30 years, the past 5 years as a sub contractor. For some people watching that aren't in the business, you were a little misleading on the retainage. The GC isn't holding your retainage because they want to, they are doing it because their owner is holding retainage on the entire contract amount so every sub that working on that job hasn't been paid. We did some wood trim as a sub on a movie theater. They held my retainage for over a year because the site contractor had some bad dirt (pumping clay) under the asphalt. I have been in business long enough that I simply add 5 or 10 percent for certain projects/contractor so I don't have to worry about when or if I get that last 5 or 10 percent. Retainage is basically an owners insurance policy that the work will be complete to 100% and the GC just passes that expense onto their subs. Almost every state I have worked in and I have worked in many, has laws written where the prime GC must pay their subs within a certain amount of time after the owner has paid the GC. Most are between 7 and 10 days. You are correct. Subs are tools. The tool isn't getting the job done, you throw it away or put it on the shelf and get a better tool. Our lowest profit margin jobs are usually small local government where anyone and their brother can bid the jobs. (schools renovations are the worst) I thought about getting into residential but I don't have much patience for homeowners. In commercial, you are generally working with experienced professionals. I guess the moral of the story is, if sub contractors are looking to get into commercial, be prepared to have some very deep pockets or a significant line of credit.

[@ianbelletti6241]

I agree that the bigger the project the tighter the profit margins.

[@StormyITO]

1) Retainage is negotiable. I have negotiated 10% to 5%. 2) You can file a lien if they hold your retainage. If you file a lien they won't get paid until they pay you. 3) A lot of contracts spell out every plan page on the exhibits page and they will hold you to every page, even a page for another trade that might show scope in your trade. 4) The biggest bullshit they love to put your contracts are: Composite clean up crews, liquidated damages, accelerated schedule and an indemnity clause that is predatory. DPR even put in their contracts that any tool you buy to perform the work must be turned over to them at the end of the job.

[@jerryrolen9639]

Always file intent to lean when awarded the contract

[@jcharles5852]

Stan can you do an episode on how to write up a commercial bid. I have been wanting to bid on Govt jobs but the bid process is overwhelming.. Thanks keep them coming !

[@1231skip]

I agree with @H1262.0, I as well am a commercial GC and we treat all our subcontractors as an important part our team, because in the end the quality and craftsmanship depends on the team. It’s a shame that there are a lot of bad apples out there!

[@hydelake224]

Retired GC estimator here. A couple points. Never submit a quote without a complete listing of includes and excludes that is based on the specification section(s) of the work you are doing as well as your firms capabilities. Discuss these includes and excludes with the GC estimator responsible for your spec section Also, in my experience, no contract I ever wrote was returned without markups by the sub. These markups must be initialed by you and the GC for the contract to be valid. In the contract require your includes and excludes be made part of the contract via markup. Never accept a partial set of plans from the GC, you want the exact documents the GC is using complete and up to date, same with the specs. Thanks for the videos. PS always have in writing whether the spec or the drawings supersede in the event of a conflict.

[@jeffshackleford3152]

Yes, the specs or drawings thing has saved my ass more than once. It has also " lost " me several projects as well, because people are just bidding I don't even know what, like their all in bid is less than my material.

[@mikshmt91]

I called it quits on commercials jobs I got sick of the bs

[@chrisanthony579]

The sad part is; it's not even the GC's. It started with the Architects and their AIA contracts giving themselves and the Owners way too much power of the purse. Instead of paying the general contractor after the work is in place, they should be paying the general contractor before the work gets done so they get their workforce paid within a few weeks of doing the work.

[@cecilmckeithan5088]

Someone should introduce Zake to coffee 😂

[@tedgerstenslager2949]

So true. As a prior glazing contractor, the general contractors sole job was to beat the subs out of money. Every reason ,excuse, lie in the book not to pay you. You work 4 days a week and chase money one day a week without fail.

[@diegomontoya796]

Never clean up after another tradesman.

[@dustinmarquand5301]

All of what you've said is why I've mostly stayed out of commercial..

[@notsure6182]

commercial is way safer then residential in my experience

[@mywifesboyfriendisfire]

"bigger projects = bigger problems" Amen to that! Oh, the stories I could tell.

[@andrewmiguel8951]

Thats why I don’t call my self contractor, cuz I call those people lazy, cuz they will try to hire the cheapest one or try not to pay you, I got my my license as a contractor but I always call my self like a small company construction.

[@andrew8504]

The longest I've ever had to wait was 87 days. Communication with the owners/GC's are the key.

[@kylequinn1963]

And this is why I only do residential. I get paid at the end of the job, period. No waiting.

[@cyclopsvision6370]

If the contractor retains 10%, just factor that free interest on the 10% retained money into your bid so you don't lose a single penny that you are entitled to.

[@Dirtmonkey]

yep- but then you don't get the job

[@cyclopsvision6370]

@@Dirtmonkey if you want to race to zero, you're just screwing yourself, and your employees over

[@danielchurchill9004]

Stanley way back when I was new to the biz i think I was in my early 20s gave a general a price he looked at me funny and said double it so I started thinking to my self he is going to want a kick back He saw the look on my face and said it is all yours.... did 5 more projects for him same thing!!!

[@RobertMashburn-k6b]

The big companies always had what I called professional stallers to slow down paying you and using your money. They always had excuses on something that needed fillled out or something else. Usually a month in between instead of telling you everything up ftont

[@richallen8742]

One thing you forgot to mention. The retainer is kept so the subcontractor will come back and perform any kind of warranty work. That is why it is set up give a general contractor a way to hold the said sub contractors feet to the fire to come back for warranty work. If the sub got paid in full the attitude becomes I got my money….Why go back??? Responsibility for warranty falls on the GC. He uses this hold of a % for the warranty period specified in the contract. There are many stories out there about some contractors not going back to perform warranty work or work put in place sub par. That retained money can then be used to bring another sub into repair the faulty work. Tell the whole story not just your side.

[@darknes7800]

Flip side of retainage is the GC (many) who will keep the retainage and say "there are unresolved issues" and refuse to pay the final 10%.

[@richallen8742]

@@darknes7800 GC’s that do not pay their retainers are known to the subs and do not get the best pricing from their subs at bid times. - So they have a weapon as a sub as well. Adding their retainers on their final bid for poor GC’s is a common practice against poor paying GC’s. As a GC I see it first hand. We are a good GC and schedule payments early to our subs and have a payment system setup ahead of time based on work put in place by the sub, to keep them happy and gain good pricing from them. We are the largest GC in the world. We hold retainage as a warranty tool. If the sub doesn’t return for warranty work we use their retainer after threatening letters that we will use their money owed to pay for the warranty repairs. Both sides of what happens all out front

[@kmadigan1347]

I am a superintendent for a general contractor, i see first hand how my office screws over subs. I come from carpentry so i understand. The Project managers dont understand how things work on site.

[@MASS1866]

You should out this dealership AND salesman. These guys ruined the truck market

[@seanmcne]

I would assume there have to be good generals who don’t jerk their subs around - is it a goal, in commercial, to keep working with the generals who treat you more like a partner? I would think it’s a balance as residential could be a real dumpster fire as well 😀.

[@oswaldorabanal485]

There are definitely large companies that pay well and on time. The one I work for does 30 days without fail. When others call me and explain the terms I usually just deny the project. I do a lot of residential and commercial. Resi can be a dumpster fire but only if the homeowner is crazy. Usually it’s the contractors fault when resi goes bad. Every once and a while we get crazy homeowners but not often.

[@AceEverett]

Well, it's obvious the GC was hoping to pocket the half of the project budget he was somehow gonna get you to do for free. Even if you had signed though, he would've wasted time in court to still lose.

[@ryanksiazek]

As a general contractor Senior PM on numerous commercial projects, I always made sure and still to this day that no one is allowed on site that does not have a contract and insurance certificates completed. I always talk to the subs and say "you are one of our apparent lows and I am calling you to make sure you are bidding the right plan set and I want you to review everything and let me know if you are completely covered. I have emailed you access to the current plan set and specs. If you find something let's talk about it and let me know what your contract price will be." If there was something in the plan set or specs that was important, I have a conversation and point it out. Many GC do suck. They don't do their appropriate work, don't follow through on their fiduciary responsibilities. Lazy is my opinion of them and they should not be in the business. This GC was angry because he is legally tied to the entire plan/spec and he will have to pay out of pocket for anything he missed. Now there are some really great GCs who do work hard to make sure everyone fully understands what is expected and what is in the plan/spec, but it appears that over the last 30 years they are becoming rare and no longer the norm. It is a shame because in the end it is the owners who end up paying the additional expense the subs and suppliers are adding the projects to cover for exposure and expenses which do not add any value to the real property being built, updated, renovated, remodeled, etc. There are 3 things that make up any project: Price, Scope, and Time. When there is a simple mistake like this GC made, compounded by no safety nets to catch issues in the front end.

[@davidsmith8083]

Love that shirt!

[@STEVE-lk2ft]

As a sub you should always specify how much work you are proposing to do and maybe specify the page # of the plans you are working with. And if you are the general contractor make sure you know exactly what the sub is proposing!

[@BrentLong-o1d]

If your going to do commercial work you need to work for GC’s you have a relationship with and they treat you like a partner in lieu of a subcontractor. They are out they but you need to limit your work to GC’s who value your work.

[@BrentLong-o1d]

There are good and bad trade contractors also.

[@anotherbrother369]

Appreciate your Videos. We ate 15 Seconds to Midnight BTW... Have you utilized Factoring? The average is 1.5 to 3% Keep your head on a swivel-

[@brianhopkins5251]

good story, do more.

[@cjones1262]

200 percent true. I prefer big residential over commercial. Better profit margins by far.

[@stuartlafrancis1371]

Chose your G C carefully. You don’t have to work for them .I have paid subs in certain situations before we received payment .also there is the ability to lean a project as a G C or sub

[@DefinitelyNotRin]

I'm a digital artist contractor. I'm signed into a bad contract that they hold my money indefinitely until I terminate my business , in which case they will continue profiting and selling my work. I will get the check cut for all the extra money they owe me , at the cost of losing the passive income that they will then continue to earn and not have to pay out.

[@loganp7043]

When you’re a GC watching this 🙄

[@terrancemcintyre8062]

Aireko in Puerto Rico is horrible to their sub contractors...... Their favorite phrase to customers is "change order?...nice" then they screw the sub contractors .........walking away is the best way to handle these dbags.....

[@BCN263]

yeah, more stories please

[@MNDon53]

I was just there, walls look good

[@janlesinski4719]

Liabilities and bastards that don't pay been there

[@jeffkoss5975]

What Happened to the Bobcat excavator?

[@prestonmoore8643]

20 year operator the value in your videos is bar none sir

[@charleswise5570]

Stan, have you ever been the general contractor on any of your commercial jobs?

[@Dirtmonkey]

No-im not licensed to be a GC

[@charleswise5570]

@@Dirtmonkey thanks Stan!

[@CU96821]

Yes, more "war stories" please!

[@STEVE-lk2ft]

You keep on saying “square feet”? Is that the length of the wall x the height for retaining wall builders?

[@Dirtmonkey]

square feet is length times height= square footage

[@1pjmac]

What did you find out about your machine that broke down on the wall project at the school

[@samjohnson3311]

It was a fuse lol

[@tom1966mac]

I was a project manager for a General. You as a sub have to include in your proposal that your bid estimate becomes part of the contract documents. Therefor when you sign, your quantities are spelled out. Your proposal would be rejected for insufficent scope. Normally I would call the sub and inform to change the scope of his bid. If he can't or won't resubmit bid timely, then its the next guy with a bid. I probably wouldn't invite you to bid again on another project. Believe me, your the problem in this scenerio, even though your bid documents were faulty.

[@TheCdrbaby]

Yup bud all we are are tools to them and they don't even know the difference in hobo freight and milwaukee

[@wayne3325]

Are last job was 800,000 they held for 3 years. Man it hurts the pocket

[@timl3605]

Stan & all subs: Is there a trade organization you can join to help each other & educate yourselves? Dealing with generals like these sucks! I've been a general contractor working in remodeling & in NARI (National Association of the Remodeling Industry) for 30+ years. It attracts the best people in the industry with honesty, integrity, etc. The lone wolves/ people with no integrity, are dishonest, don't/ won't pay to be part of a group like this as they already "know it all" !!!😆 I am part of a group of 10 remodelers who meet monthly to talk about things you guys are talking about plus so much more. We are competitors, but the closest of friends & have helped ea other countless times! I wish you all the best & feel for you. BTW: I live & work very close to you Stan!

[@BrianOsborne-sj1ny]

Brunt work boots What do you think about them?

[@mderline4412]

*This is the rather tacky kind of behavior, one of our ex-Presidents used to engage in!* *Character matters, the choice is ours to make!...*

[@tomcole4736]

Contractors take advantage of their subs every chance they can. They try and get you to do work at their house or their lake house they are doing, get you to put that labor and material expense in your next contract with them on another one of their projects, then they beat you down on that price because they say you are high. You say of course I am high. I am including the work my guys and I just did for you on your lake house, which is weekend work, its travel work, but you dont want to pay the money,. Well, your family can use the house for a weekend that will make up for the work. Do not get involved with these types of builders, they will only screw you. I learned the hard way. They try and be friends but then they wind up screwing you.

[@jonsaircond8520]

Commercial work will sink you in short order if you don't know what your doing or do. I'm down to 1 big account I've got a 20 year relationship with and trust. My buddy plays that game and while he "can" make real good money he is always hunderds of thousands behind. He has done some projects that want 180 days out to pay it's nuts

[@kdcustomwoodworking]

True every word The problem is the General Contracter ha s a junior college grad with zero expernice .The Sub become teachers with no pay where do I sign up ?

[@Tagerrun]

Is it possible to ask for a percentage of the money up front?

[@Dirtmonkey]

nope