The Girl Defined drama is off the rails

[@ab6525]

Dave actually having a decent take on the Barbie movie awhile Bethany is just not getting it AT ALL was a wild time for me 😂

[@trala8911]

I will admit, I was genuinely surprised by how intelligent and nuanced his take was. I shouldn’t have made an assumption like that, but I really didn’t know he was so thoughtful and intellectual. I’m sure he is a great conversationalist. I feel terrible for him that he’s stuck in a marriage with Bethany. On the off chance that prayer works, I’m praying that he has a chance for understanding that divorce is acceptable, and is an option for him if he is unhappy. Marriage is about more than sex and money.

[@livw2180]

@@trala8911 It is so clear how mis-matched they are intellectually. I can't imagine being stuck in a relationship like that. And not just that but to also have all your private things (sex, arguments etc) turned into public content to shill some stupid courses. I didn't come into this video thinking that I would be feeling sympathy for Dav but here we are.

[@boots1622fan]

for real he has a better take on it than most people ive seen, even some on the left. so many people just get sucked up in toxic masculinity and/or anticapitalism(i mean valid, but the movie addresses these things). like my BIGGEST gripe w the movie is that theres not enough lgbt, like there's not a single actual gay couple in barbieland and that is so weird to me, because it feels like the message is 'you can be whoever you want to be, as long as you're still technically heterosexual!' which. oof. but its a movie about gender, not a movie about sexuality, so i guess i can deal. conservatives make this weird stink about there being a trans actress but i didnt know there was one until they complained so theyre so weird for that.

[@joelman1989]

I know haha. I didn’t even get much of that. I just thought it was funny. In a weird twist of reality I learned more about that movie through Dave Beal than I did from any other source.

[@writeonshell]

​@boots1622fan the lack of LGBTQIA+ representation is especially weird with how many girls I know who had at least 1 barbie who's hair was cut off and who played the role of Ken in relationships with the other barbies (me included 😂).

[@cee8ch]

Dav’s take on the Barbie movie was a pleasant surprise. Kinda makes me emotional knowing Bethany literally does not care about what he’s saying. He connected with it, had tons of valid points, and genuinely appreciated the movie for what it was. I really hope he finds happiness; he seems like a nice, smart guy.

[@yoohsuke]

Making her the actual man-bashing one she is supposedly seeing in the people who put out/like the barbie movie

[@LunarEleven]

It's not a surprise at all if you see/hear any meaningful conversations where Dav is allowed to get his thoughts in. It's constantly baffling how he ended up with her, she seems absolutely insufferable in every way and he's expressed unhappiness in their marriage frequently. This is why the whole concept of marrying the only person you've dated with divorce not being an option is so wrong. He constantly blames himself for how unhappy he is but anyone can see she's the main problem. When your partner is the source of the vast majority of your unhappiness, sometimes you try so hard to blame yourself because YOU are the only one you have control over. You want to be the problem so you can fix it. You gaslight yourself just to have some hope. The more he works on himself, the more he'll realize what a toxic person he chained himself to. Sad. I think he just ended up with her because he had low self esteem and now he's stuck. At least he speaks his mind despite always disagreeing with her, and prob gets denied all that amazing God-honoring sex every time he does. Worth it! 🙌🏻

[@peppermintgal4302]

Also, the way she is super passive aggressive towards him in her posts, it's very easy to speculate that she's using their peer group's religiosity to pressure him into some kind of conformity. It seems like she's the one who gets to do whatever she wants, because that somehow validates the Christian mandate, so long as she can sort of massage her religion into the proper shape, and she does the same thing to weaponize it against others.

[@Cat_Woods]

@@LunarEleven "and prob gets denied all that amazing God-honoring sex every time he does." But if he was traumatized by conversion therapy, maybe that will end up being the silver lining. I hope he gets out of the marriage.

[@anhingasnakebird9947]

@K.C-2049 It was her sister Ellissa that he liked but she wasn’t in to him. It’s not a secret because Bethany has talked about it. I think they both settled. Bethany wanted a taller, older, more established man.

[@andicrossley6562]

The cognitive dissonance in Bethany is when she says "If it's not your humour that's okay. That's why it's my account and not yours. Don't take it so seriously" when she's spent over a DECADE making everything OTHER women do her business, and dictating what is and isn't "acceptable". It's absolutely infuriatingly ridiculous.

[@KhayJayArt]

"Rules for thee but not for me" type beat

[@cyrusunderscore7315]

I'm just gonna say it. She deserves to have nosy Christians telling her what the right way to have an intimate relationship is, judging her for doing things differently than them. To me, there's nothing wrong with what she was posting, as long as her husband is also okay with people knowing that much about their intimate life, but she's a mormon and she happily promotes that restrictive, repressive lifestyle. Eat what you serve.

[@theexploraholic]

So when it’s on her account “if it’s not your humor that’s okay” but when it’s in the Barbie movie it’s black and white not okay… very interesting

[@forcelightningcable9639]

You oughta find a way to have her read that lol. She’d lose it 😂

[@suitdoggy4707]

Seriously! What happened to posting for God they were preaching? Isn't it not her account but God's account? Is her God telling her to post about oral sex with her husband?

[@Vivi_LaRue]

I love that they are “anti-feminism” whilst simultaneously benefiting from the rights/privileges/benefits brought about by the feminist movement.

[@dismurrart6648]

I was in a class once, and this anti feminist woman said "the country I come from, men made a law that for every so many male owned businesses, there has to be so many female owned ones." Men gave us that, not feminism. The poor teacher looks dumbstruck and said "that exists because x feminist org in y year fought to get the un to pressure your countries government." I felt bad for the teacher but I was inspired by just how good her world event recall was for feminist actions on other continents, and her ability to keep her cool in the face of absolute stupidity

[@xcidgafhamas]

privileges… white women just got exposed 😂

[@everylaurenislemons]

You mean Girl Defined are hypocrites???? I’ll eat my hat.

[@corneliahanimann2173]

if I could just describe the feeling of beauty I feel for this tale where two women heavily preached that women are supposed to be subservient to a husband, and then them slowly going "well this isn't all we really expected it to be" once they got married...I feel so much schadenfreude over this! life is beautiful, when you have the right sense of humour

[@bluueorb]

The cherrypicking lol 😭

[@annjay2581]

When I was 22, 16 yo boys looked like literal children to me, wtf is wrong with Bethy 😭

[@qjtvaddict]

Look at her

[@Raddiebaddie]

Yeah that’s like finishing college vs half way through high school. Drastically different life stage and development

[@chilltheheckoutwithava1454]

Fundamentalist Christianity is what’s wrong with her. It literally stunts your maturing process.

[@adriannam.9891]

No literally 😭 I’m 21 and my little brother is 15. I could literally never see a 15/16 yr old as anything but a child. What is wrong with her

[@abbie_joan]

bro im currently 23 and even people who are 18 look like kids to me... really does prove that predators shouldn't use the "i didn't know their age/i couldn't tell" excuse because even when considering that some people go through puberty and look a little older than they are you can definitely still tell they're literal children just by their mannerisms and the way they talk. Creeps like her have absolutely no excuses for going after children especially since she thinks she's the perfect partner but still decided to groom a child instead of finding someone who's her own age.

[@rachelk4805]

It's so gross how Bethie can't be godly enough to submit graciously to her husband's opinion on the Barbie movie.

[@SPECK4ever]

😂😂😂

[@spaceface320]

Totally unsurprising she isn’t a feminist because she spends so much time centering men in her life (rather one Man) while also claiming to be sex-positive that she might as well be named Carrie Bradshaw. Bethany was really out there trying to jump on the “Barbie is a man-hater, and I advocate for men!” train while her own husband (a man) gives a very nuanced and insightful take about how he perceived the movie and reflected on manhood. No wonder his point flew right over her head

[@Travelling_with_my_dog]

LOL

[@baylabe]

The way I snorted at this 😂

[@CrystalCordova]

Ew her name is “Bethie” 🤢🤣🤣

[@jamiekamihachi3135]

Honestly Dave’s interpretation of Ken in the Barbie movie sounded pretty solid and it clearly resonated with him. It honestly makes me happy he enjoyed it and also feels like an unintended metaphor for his marriage.

[@Edelwiess1066]

💯

[@davidkonevky7372]

I really hope what happened in that podcast serves as an awakening for him, he's not talking with her, he's talking with all of the buzzwords and talking points she learnt from her manipulative family and right-wing social circles

[@romywhite290]

Getting absolutely RAILED in a God Honoring way.

[@kasocool2812]

"fuck me in the ass cause I love jesus" popped into my head when I read this

[@Andy-xx3tt]

Missionary only 🙏

[@gh0stpuppi333]

Looking submissive and breedable (in a God Honoring Way™)

[@torijeri]

Dave being 16 when she was 22? All of Bethany’s weird posts shitting all over him constantly? Talking over him and never listening to his pov unless it’s the same as hers? him admitting he was miserable and ultimately blamed HIMSELF? someone save this man, he is so trapped.

[@qjtvaddict]

She is a Christian girl boss

[@moonsodas]

i genuinely feel so bad for him

[@specializedchemicals6669]

​@@qjtvaddictgaslight gatekeep girlboss as they say

[@YellaBellaReno]

I’m gonna make “Free Dave” merch to raise some money for his new life.

[@frogloover7774]

@@YellaBellaReno honestly dude? I'll jump on that LMAO

[@hispringtime]

Bethy: Be your own boss! Be a mom and a business woman! Also Bethy: FeMInisiM BAD!

[@sighsgkj]

What happened to "submit to husband"??

[@Snowfoxie1]

@@sighsgkjhe disagreed with me about the Barbie movie so clearly he is LIVING IN SIN.

[@singingsiren82]

Bethany's obsession with sex is what happens when someone is required to repress it for their whole life. Sex is great, but even workers don't talk about it as much as she does.

[@starlightpancake]

As a former sex worker you are way off base

[@Zectifin]

she might have shit opinions in most things, but its hilarious seeing other christians tilt at her sex talk.

[@chelscara]

The last time I talked about sex that much I was 16 and thought I was “putting myself out there for people to talk to if they had questions”, which did happen a couple times, but I’m sure for 99% of people it was just really weird and awkward. 😂😂😂

[@Undrconst]

@@starlightpancakeoh shut up. Sex workers aren’t talking about sex as much as she is. They have it, get the money and live their lives. Don’t compare yourself to others.

[@Stepatee]

​@@Undrconst the sex workers I know do not talk about it really...it just is what is. But gurl you had me dying...😂

[@maximumbees]

her spending a decade shaming women for spicy thoughts and then turning around and posting spicy thoughts makes me angy

[@FortheLoveofBees]

Her next course will be “god honoring divorce for Christian marrieds” and I cannot WAIT

[@DimaRakesah]

Or she will go down the "divorce should be illegal" route as a way to prove to the world that SHE is still the godly one because SHE didn't want the divorce.

[@FortheLoveofBees]

@@DimaRakesah fricccckkkkk you’re right I hate it

[@DimaRakesah]

@@FortheLoveofBees Crowder taught me that little trick 😉

[@FortheLoveofBees]

@@DimaRakesah right?! he’s such a loser 🤮

[@JudgementalBudgie]

They should keep going. Maybe they'll turn normal someday

[@61119038]

In a live, Dav said that Bethany's oversharing has made him so depressed he dealt with su**idal ideation in the past. Absolutely heartbreaking. How can she reconcile her behaviour with her world view of honouring her husband? Wild.

[@anarcho-communist11]

The sense I got when I saw them together is that he was intentionally making her look bad by disagreeing with her and sounding vaguely condescending. I'm not standing up for her at all but he doesn't seem as innocent as he tries to appear.

[@almosteverywhere]

when dave said it's not his wife and parents' fault for how miserable he'd been, it genuinely broke my heart. he's clearly been through so much guilt-tripping and gaslighting from every person who's actually supposed to care about him. he can't see that it IS their fault. they did this to him. i wouldn't be surprised to find out bethany groomed him, even. the post about them meeting when he was 16, plus how these kind of people treat their unmarried daughters like dead weight? a sexually suppressed older woman and a queer child who's going through god knows what kind of abuse in his household? yikes. that doesn't look good at all.

[@Puuws]

he is the only one who can come out off that confusion, it has to come from the inside

[@briandunfee4326]

Why is every comment on this video so over dramatic. You don't know the dude's situation. Stop pretending like you do. Let him be

[@renee4736]

@@briandunfee4326we clearly know enough, grooming, queer, and miserable.

[@LucaGlitchy]

17:50 "I was 22 and he was only 16 years old" That raised so many red flags for me, she seems so causal about it like??? Girl?? That's illegal??? She's so chill about just admitting to grooming, hope David gets out of there and realizes how fucked up that relationship is. Grooming isn't Godly!

[@sarahbearbabygirl]

she legit was so crazy that she had to groom a guy to be her husband instead of finding anyone her own age

[@SilkyLew]

Grooming is common, though, in Christianity.

[@LucaGlitchy]

@@SilkyLew it shouldn't be, that's fucked up

[@SilkyLew]

@keeperofthe7keys1987 I only speak on what I know. I used to be Christian.

[@TheDoomBlueShell]

​@keeperofthe7keys1987 My country that like 87% of the population is Christian is in the top 10 of countries with more child marriage. Here is extremely common to guys +30 years old "fall in love" with 12 years olds and they can marry inside the church if he waits until the girl is 15. You should read Mathew 7:3-5 because Christian countries in general have a lot of problems with child marriage and just now many places are fighting to stop it even with a lot of pushback from Christians groups.

[@Heidi2003]

I hope Bethany's husband finds happiness.

[@tommiegnosis]

I kinda feel badly for him. I feel like he was groomed, even as an adult. Their toxicity is the same reason I don't always support huge age differences even if the man is older. Often, tho not always, the older person is going for younger partners so they can more easily manipulate and exploit them. She was desperate to get married and men her age knew better than to entertain her crazy ass so she went for someone younger and vulnerable (forced to be straight).I don't think this is always the case but it definitely happens more than it should.

[@gladitsnotme]

I don't. He's a grifter and a blasphemer. He deserves every consequence from every bad decision he made in his life.

[@rileylynn5815]

This, we can all agree on.

[@shadowzach00]

didn't he have gay conversion therapy ?​@@tommiegnosis

[@Hoppy_is_a_bunny]

I need him to find happiness

[@Wiingashkikwe]

Preying on STAH mums, saying “Pour into”, “all of the things”, and “scale up yourself” are 100% MLM hun terms.

[@nope19568]

seriously, the second i heard they were selling courses and stuff the mlm alarm bells in my head were aggressively ringing lol

[@DimaRakesah]

Also I don't see how someone can spend years railing on how all women should be SAHM so they can fully devote themselves to their family, and how working for a wage will make them miserable and ungodly, then be hun botting as if it's not the very wage slavery they warned women against. You're spending so much time on your "at home business", doesn't that defeat the point? People like Bethy want to have their cake and eat it too. I wouldn't care that she is working from home if she hadn't spent years demonizing women who have jobs.

[@Wiingashkikwe]

@@DimaRakesah also if they have a home “business” they wouldn’t be STAH mums, they would be mums who work from home lol.

[@katiefont1572]

like she HAS to be selling MRR, right?!?!?!?!

[@DimaRakesah]

@@Wiingashkikwe Exactly! A SAHM is someone who makes homemaking their full time job. Working from home means you ARE a working mom with a career, you just do it from home. Which again, is totally fine, but Bethy has preached against having a "career" for years. Now that she HAS a career she doesn't admit she was wrong, she just pretends it's different and doesn't count.

[@PacificallyYours]

I’m waiting for Dave to realize his true self is Kenough and make a tell all TikTok that Bethany has to try and spin.

[@PacificallyYours]

Not a Dave Stan, just think he’s a victim of Christianity (while not everyone who chooses Christianity is a victim, some are. And going to conversion therapy twice he MAY be one)

[@kaitlynmorgan4613]

how did bethany get the idea that the barbie movie shows no one wants to be "ordinary barbie" when they literally did a whole thing like "being ordinary is okay. we should make an ordinary barbie to show that" like 😭😭??

[@ennuiblue4295]

She went in strictly to hate on it, her husband actually was receptive to what it had to say. There's no reasoning with someone who has their mind made up and is not even paying attention 😒

[@reddipageshouston]

Lol, women watched Barbie and left their toxic husbands. Bethany's husband watched Barbie and wants to leave her.

[@PCLHH]

I hope Bethany´s husband finds the husband he deserves and lives happily ever after.

[@stuff1784]

@@PCLHHLMAO

[@stuff1784]

@@PCLHHI know men with feminine energy can be straight but gosh, I get gay vibes from Dav!!!

[@DiligentThroat]

@@stuff1784and what does speculating about that do for you? What smidge of purpose are you getting from hoping a man is a different sexuality? I just hope he can leave this weirdly abusive marriage.

[@magiaistnieje]

@@DiligentThroat they had a video that is now deleted where they told he attended "gay conversion therapy" twice and hence the comment about him getting a husband.

[@ElixirSpice]

I want to point out that Bethany's husband actually hasn't been to conversion therapy and he did address it in a video. Fundiefriday is a creator that made a really informative vid about girl defined. I say this because this rumor seems to be born out of a joke but also people thinking them being awkward means he's secretly gay. This actually harms the lgbtq community by suggesting bigoted or awful religous people are secretly in the closet.

[@kalehead0075]

Yeah- let’s fact check this stuff before posting it online.

[@Moon_Child_Mari]

You’re absolutely right, but also the number of bigoted people that are actually closeted is.. more than you’d expect, honestly. I am really curious to know where this rumor came from because I learned about them from Cody Ko and Noel Miller and I think some of their comments said something similar. This was years ago.

[@ElixirSpice]

@@Moon_Child_Mari Yes, there are bigoted religous zealots in the closet that act this way but suggesting every awful person is secretly gay does in fact harm lgbtq in the end by the mere association of homophobia and violence being indicators of someone's sexuality. It actually works as an excuse to let people off the hook for homophobic and transphobic behavior. Either way speculating that someone is secretly gay or has been to conversion therapy is homophobic in itself. It reinforces stereotypes about gay people.

[@neurisms]

Thanks I was confused why the thing about conversion therapy was dropped in without any further context. Seemed like a pretty big part of the story lol

[@TheLisclark]

Hey ElixirSpice, I really liked your take on all this and am a fellow follower of Rev Jenn. and James over at FF. If you don't mind, I'm curious, what do you think about the speculation and discourse around Speaker Johnson​@@ElixirSpice?

[@charliepaige196]

Y’all when I tell you my jaw DROPPED after that age reveal… younger man? Girl you were a grown ass woman ogling at a 16 year old wtf. I really like Dav after watching this and I truly hope that he finds a better life outside of his predator wife.

[@kiryn5977]

Yeah....I knew she was older than him, but I didn't know she was THAT much older than him, or when they met. 🤢🤢🤢 Judging from Rachel Oates's second video on Bethy's sex courses, it seems that she's trying to downplay that aspect of their origin story these days, as in that "course" she was def trying to make it seem that she was 30 and he was in his 20s when they met. ://

[@DottieMinerva]

She continuously publicly humiliates her husband. That marriage is a train wreck and she’s over compensating for it.

[@tasheve3015]

it’s sad but also kinda funny that bethany was extremely sex repressed, to the point that she didn’t even kiss before marriage (which is still wild to me) and is now suddenly obsessed with it, even going back on her ideas about purity culture. it’s ok for her to tell others what they can and can’t do with their sex lives until it applies to her and she realises how good it is.

[@GabbityGabby]

I think the sexual repression had a lot to do with the way she acts now. I grew up in that movement myself, and it seems to be that the women either get hyper sexual or they shut down and are never able to enjoy it because they can’t shake the feeling that ‘it’s wrong’ even after marriage. Both extremes are the result of unhealthy attitudes towards sex in these cases, I think. Totally agree it’s pretty strange to see the arc of her channel from ‘sex bad’ to ‘sex positive’. I could almost say it’s an improvement if not for all the other awful things about Girl Defined…

[@FabricofTime]

I've seen this happen multiple times with Christian women; they get married and seem to suddenly think they're sex gurus who personally discovered the existence of the orgasm. Discussing married sex in way too much detail became a trend in Christian circles around maybe a decade or so ago; it's very cringe, and definitely a reaction to the repression of purity culture.

[@krumdelakrum]

That's exactly what it is, and her whole vibe of like 'guys did you know orgasms....are fun??' its like girl... duh. You didn't just discover a secret no one else knew.

[@cassi6528]

I wasn't ready for David to have such nuanced opinions about the Barbie movie, it's funny to put his well thought out and insightful points next to Bethany's more vapid and half baked talking points lol

[@Kylie_h]

Fr like I would honestly be here for Dave starting a movie review podcast

[@teijaflink2226]

He seems like a really likeable person, his wife seems so weird though and a pervert who gets of from oversharing her sexlife lol, which is funny considering she at the same time tries to be a prudish Christian too.

[@sydneydinks]

Legit! I found it hard to figure out my own thoughts about Ken’s journey but Dave nailed it in a simple way…here for him when he does a deconversion podcast🤞🏻🤞🏻🤞🏻

[@user-th1pv6ks5o]

He has been going to Secular therapy, I'm surprised he still hasn't deconstructed yet tbh.

[@DimaRakesah]

My favorite Girl Defined moment was a video where they were talking about what amount of makeup is "godly", and read directly from the bible a verse about all these things women shouldn't do with their appearance. One of those things was "braiding of hair" and guess what? They braid their hair all the time, one of them was even wearing a braid as she read it. They didn't seem to even notice that they were literally not following the verse themselves. It just goes to show that it's really about finding validation for what they want to believe anyway, and they can easily ignore the rules they don't agree with or can't justify.

[@eevee2411]

'But with braiding hair they don't mean... braiding your hair! They mean changing your appearance excessively from how god meant it to be in order to be attractive to men!!! Don't you know our interpretation of the bible is the only right one?' /s

[@ngocto3290]

Rules for thee but not for me!

[@talynhastime9343]

It baffles me why anyone would take makeup or clothing advice from the Bible, a book written over time thousands of years ago that is full of people who are of a completely different geographical location AND culture than a fundie Christian living in America. Why the hell do people take lifestyle advice from this book? It’d be like someone in modern day Brazil organizing their life around something written by someone in 5AD China. Where is the relevance?

[@TattooedLuna]

Trixie Mattel did a reaction to that video and it was hilarious!

[@abbyabroad]

YESSSSSS

[@ellicurus]

I think we tend to see Dav as “the good guy” because of his proximity to Bethany so it’s easy to compare him to how awful she is. He’s obviously a better dude than most Christian trad husbands on social media that we’re used to seeing, but if we can take a step back and look at the things he says and believes in all on his own, he’s really not all that much different. Like, he interpreted a movie more as it’s meant to be, but that’s like the bare minimum of cognitive ability. But it seems like he did such a good job because of how badly Bethany did absorbing and talking about it.

[@Unhappytimeaper]

Everyone freaking out when the white, Christian guy is able to understand basic media literacy; the bar is truly on the ground when it comes to look at people

[@Sarah-re7cg]

I don’t think he’s necessarily “the good guy” and I think you make a great point. Honestly, what I see (and this is a very narrow bit of information ie only stuff he and Bethany shares online so it’s important to take that with a grain of salt) is an individual who has been raised and indoctrinated in Christian fundamentalism, and is trying to navigate the world from the constraints of a high control group. He seems like he’s struggling a lot and shows sincerity in trying to better himself, but anytime he shows any kind of actual growth, he gets this backlash from his family and community. Like I can tell he’s actually thought about the Barbie movie and my jaw was on the floor when he brought up the concept of existentialism and showed interest in it (one of my degrees is in philosophy, he seemed to have a good faith curiosity in it instead of shutting it down and calling it demonic or some stupid shit I always hear from fundies). Idk, Bethany’s follow up post directed towards him was very ominous and pointed all directions towards abuse. That being said, I think we can both recognize the harm he’s perpetuating actively and hold space for someone who is in the throes of an incredibly high control group and marriage. But also people aren’t obligated to do so nor are they responsible for the well-being of religious extremists. It drives me up the wall when people try to say women need to engage with incels to deradicalize them and that is such a fucking naive, dangerous and fundamentally misogynistic take.

[@Sarah-re7cg]

@@UnhappytimeaperI think the shock is warranted because these communities are very high control. Their thoughts, their actions, what they eat, what media they consume, what education is “appropriate” is all HEAVILY regulated and policed by one another. The concepts like existentialism that Dave was bringing up was genuinely shocking to hear coming from his mouth and his ability to actually engage with the movie in good faith was even more shocking. Not because this is basic shit people should be able to do, but because high control groups suppress the ability to do so. Like people who are indoctrinated don’t know what they don’t know and are purposefully barred/handicapped from being able to think critically or for themselves.

[@Unhappytimeaper]

@@Sarah-re7cg I think the comment to good guy is a reflection of how so many of the comments on this video feel baby-ing(?) to him? Dave despite everything is a perpetrator in this cycle of religious belief and has continued to be a negative person to many minority groups over the years, we can feel sympathetic to his situation while still not infantilizing his actions or self. And to a level, because we know the level of Bethany and openness to everything we want to side with Dave more because her opinions are always getting the comments from her perspective (either relationship or opinions). All of this is to say, while Dave does deserve to be in a better spot I find a lot of the comments wanting to justify that he is just a “decent” person in a bad spot with really what is just one movie review and personal take the media literacy of Barbie is not that hard to understand.

[@magicalmomo9987]

I don't think anyone sees him as "the good guy" but more like they see that there's more hope for him to possibly change for the better in the future while not being under Beth's and religion's influence. He's very clearly starting to do some deconstruction of his faith and is (most likely) seeing a secular therapist. I believe Beth is only seeing a religious counselor atm because she doesn't trust secular therapists. He's also clearly very unhappy with Beth and she's particularly rude, overbearing, and ignoring his wants for her own benefit. People are just wanting to see him do better because there's potential for him to do so based on how he's been acting lately. That doesn't mean he's suddenly a "good guy" or that his past or current actions are forgiven. Obviously not.

[@RachelOates]

Was just watching this randomly and was shocked to see myself, thanks so much for the shoutout! Great video and calling Bethany the 'Andrew Tate of Christian mums' may be the best thing I've heard today! :)

[@carlgrimeseyepatch27]

Dave being so present, grounded and intelligent on the subject of Feminism, Existentialism, Barbie?! It’s comforting that even a christian man can see the truth and reality of society and how it treats women. He deserves an intellectual equal and someone that doesn’t shut him down on every occasion.

[@FlaviusTheGrumpyCat]

Bethy is so overbearing and brain dead. For a "trad wife" she sure does try to overshadow her husband. Hoping Dav gets to one day find the happiness he deserves.

[@Kris-wo4pj]

isnt he the "converted" gay guy? hopefully he finds himself a husband.

[@SAVYWRITESBOOKS]

​@@Kris-wo4pjthere is no evidence of that. There's a rumor he went to conversion therapy, but conversion therapy is equally as common with bisexual people and MORE common with asexual people than homosexual people. Statistically, a person who goes to conversion therapy is more likely to be bi or ace (and theoretically could have a successful opposite gender relationship) than to be gay.

[@cjboyo]

@@Kris-wo4pjNo, that’s a homophobic rumor.

[@KingOfGaymes]

@@Kris-wo4pjNo, he said in a video that he hasn’t been to conversion therapy.

[@Just-in-Space]

It’s a very common system in trad and fundie circles. Women are the “neck” that turns the “head” in evangelical culture. You see a lot of women leaders in the shadow while spouting and publicly claiming to be yoked, subservient and under the will of there husband. It’s the dichotomy of traditional values and reality.

[@yoyohayli]

25:55 Holy shit. Hearing that Bethany was insisting that telling girls "they are enough" is a BAD thing actually made me start to cry. I have struggled my WHOLE LIFE feeling like I will never be good enough for myself or anyone around me (even when I was a Christian, that I would never be good enough for God) despite what anyone else told me, and despite anything I did or didn't do. This struggle that's haunted me is why one of my favorite songs is literally about being "Good Enough" despite not being able to believe it yourself. It's why the Barbie Movie had my face streaming with tears way at the end, for both Barbie AND Ken. To tell a girl she is NOT "enough" is literally to tell her she might as well kill herself. That is ultimately what this struggle leads to. Suicidal ideation. Because what is the point of living if nothing you do will ever be good enough? Why even keep trying? When the cycle of misery and failure will just keep going. It makes me fucking sick and she should be held directly to account for that. I hope her child isn't a girl (I don't know anything about her kid) and I hope she never has a daughter.

[@DimaRakesah]

I think that people like her who get angry about the idea of "You're good enough" dislike it because they inherently want to keep people feeling low enough to be maliable. As long as people are always unhappy they will keep coming to them for "advice" on how to fix it. As usual, it's about control and manipulating people. Whenever I see messages like this I remind myself "this person just wants me unhappy so they can control me" and that makes it so much easier to dismiss them without letting their bullshit get to me.

[@stannosaurus]

She must be so insecure that she believes other women must come down with her. She doesn't want to see other women happy as just themselves because it would undermine her idea that women must be "Godly" to find joy. Bitter, hateful, sad.

[@Eleosx]

I am so sorry that you have felt this way! I have also struggled with perfectionism and feeling unworthy of existence because I held myself to such a high standard that being bad at something (even something I’d never tried before) would make me spiral into feeling unworthy of love or happiness. I was raised Christian but since leaving the church and seeking therapy have over come the majority of these feelings. I hope you are able to see that you are enough and your existence is valid! I don’t recommend listening to Bethany she is not a deep thinker, her thoughts on the Barbie movie attest to this. She uses the words/interpretation of others and an outdated world view as a way to profit from religion. I think she says it’s a bad thing through the lens of the Christian belief that as humans we aren’t as good as god and must beg god to make us better. If people (Christian women) were to believe they are enough as they are, then those people (Christian women) would not feel the need to pay her or watch their insidious videos on how to be a better Christian woman. It is my belief that she was so offended by the message of the movie because she interpreted the message as a threat to her financial endeavors. She is a vapid materialist who has thrived under capitalism in the name of her god.

[@georgieeve2026]

If you have two $20 notes, and one is scrunched up, it doesn't make it worth any less. It still has the same value :) Schema Therapy is really good for reprogramming negative deep core beliefs/core wounds. I hope you find healing around the wound/belief of "I am not enough." Bless you ♡♡♡

[@sydneydinks]

@@Eleosxtea it’s all about money and control 😪

[@adunsire4517]

Well done video. One (sad) note: they actually have two kids, a boy and a girl. That's a whole other can of worms in terms of how she posts about each one. You would think she has one... but there is another she doesn't seem to like. I think it's easy to feel bad for Dav because Bethany is downright unlikable. I do think we should all remember that Dav is an adult who has chosen to stay in this relationship and bring children into it. He also has a pretty solid history of supporting some pretty troublesome views. His comments about things like Barbie are hopeful but... he is raising a little boy and a little girl in a fundie environment. I hope he realizes he is a white man with a good job (in Texas!) and if anyone can get out of a troubling relationship and do better for his kids, he can.

[@DimaRakesah]

Some part of me does have sympathy for people who were raised this way and it probably seems as though they cannot get out. After all, leaving fundamentalism would mean leaving behind their entire support structure. Family, friends, church, etc. Religion is such a huge part of their lives it would be like starting everything over again. BUT I have no sympathy when people continue to push it onto others. It's one thing to be stuck in it, it's another to try to spread it.

[@Idontwantanat]

While many love to think that he is gay, i disagree, especially given that there is no evidence and the “they deleted it” excuse makes no sense when you consider everything they do is immediately archived by people. In his post denying the rumors he says he doesn’t believe being gay can be changed by “therapy”, maybe he means it in a non-bigoted way, given that he tends to have more nuanced takes than his wife, but his wife is homophobic and she’s made it clear. So for a while I’ve wonder what he actually meant, while i agree that sexuality is not a choice, i’ve met many fundies who agree with me for the wrong reasons, basically if you’re gay you’ll never be anything more than a monster to them.

[@Zectifin]

yeah. My gf and her sister had an abusive mother and their dad was a very passive chill guy who was the fun parent and always nice. Problem is he always stuck by her, even when they both had good income jobs, and let her do the abuse and they never fought about it. When I met my gf her and her sister were grappling with their feelings about their abusive mom and favored their dad. over time both of them eventually came to the conclusion that he was a shit dad cus he could have done something to stop her or at least left and they could have had some time away from their mother, but he took the easy route. Her sister even cut both parents off and she had a special bond with the dad and was definitely her favorite. Just because someone is the better parent or nicer person doesn't mean they get off scott free if they stay with the asshole and let them be terrible to the children. Especially when they have the means to leave and aren't dependent on the terrible spouse or going to lose a large chunk of income from having to support the terrible spouse with alimony.

[@hanatemonstas4485]

You can feel bad and see he is an adult. Its not black or white, especially when your upbringing is indoctrination, but I think its easy to view it like that when its people in groups you dislike.

[@charissa6648]

This is true even for abuse victims yet somehow if they are women; the entire internet will somehow treat the like infants. Which is very harmful to dv victims. The lie is they cannot escape, these are the lies of the abuser and are often reinforced by the internet. You can be a victim and also are responsible for your choices! Then there is the aspect of indoctrination...which is more complex. So, both things can be true, people can feel compassion for him and also still hold him responsible for his decisions.

[@dianwei32]

I know it's a typo, but I desperately wish "duel income" was a thing. Challenge people to duels, winner gets the other's money.

[@asteridshydrangea-jt2hf]

Surely it’s going down at a RenFaire somewhere. I believe!!

[@rand0mn33ss]

It's honestly hilarious to me how she went from villainizing sex to finally realizing it's great and becoming completely sex obsessed. It really puts on display how purity culture doesn't work, especially when none of them are educated about sex and are traumatized and completely uninformed when they finally have sex with a spouse.

[@trash_bender420]

Imagine having to do a group project at school and Bethany was in your group. Nightmare nightmare nightmare

[@mariaantoniajosephajohanna]

She was homeschooled so at least she only had to torture her siblings like that ig

[@davidkonevky7372]

​@mariaantoniajosephajohanna oh that explains everything 😂

[@lilyfoster6605]

i have actually had to do a few projects with extremely religious people when i was at school and when i tell you i had to cut out SO much “god” bs. i don’t mean this in a mean way, believe what you would like, but these projects had absolutely nothing to do with religion or god. they also tried to “convert” me multiple times. it was an absolute nightmare. maybe hell is real and if so, i think it was these experiences.

[@Sqeptick]

I feel really bad that Dave feels pressured to live a phony life because his parents indoctrinated him into a cult. Hopefully he breaks free eventually and discovers happiness.

[@Idontwantanat]

I think it’s too late, he has children now, even if he “breaks free” he’ll never break free from the family he was forced to create.

[@Butrnife15]

​@@Idontwantanat It's not over for him. The best thing he can do for those kids is live true to his values even if they change and no longer match Bethany's. He could be their touchstone to a life outside of their own indoctrination.

[@Its_Asteria]

​@@IdontwantanatI mean even with abusive partners. Many people even after divorce love their children. Cause it's not the children's fault.

[@Idontwantanat]

@@Butrnife15 yeah but it’s him against everyone, realistically even if he tries to raise them with different values the rest won’t, and quite frankly I don’t think even he will try.

[@Idontwantanat]

@@Its_Asteria abusive parents do tend to alienate their children from their ex-partner though.

[@HiatusHangover]

I hope he is quietly deconstructing and gets the courage to leave. He deserves to be happy, given she’s been grooming him since he was a teen.

[@Starfish-kx3du]

Not everyone has to deconstruct

[@emilyperrett6648]

I hope Dave knows there's communities out there would understand him and want to help him. It's not fair to be trapped in a dynamic like that, you only get one life

[@effarig4017]

The absolute world of difference between Bethany and her husband's intelligence and media literacy is so damn embarrassing

[@slantos2668]

They sound like a Harvard graduate (him) trying to engage in intelligent discourse with an orangutan (her)

[@Butterfly-ql4pg]

Dav: I thought Barbie was a beautiful think piece on how we shouldn't let society define who we are 🥰 Bethy: Feminist movie bad! BLECH!!! 🤮

[@absolutelyalice1754]

His thoughts were so articulate and well thought out. Even if he didn't agree with how the message was presented, he was able to recognize what the message was suppose to be and understood where it was coming from. I feel so bad for this guy because he is clearly ignored.

[@erinnadia0409]

One of my favourite things they did was in a video they said "braided hair is sinful and ungodly" while they had braids in their hair 🤣🥲

[@crizmeow8394]

There is always that thick layer of irony present on any religious “influencer” who makes their entire income by selling shallow insights to their gullible audience, and then acts shocked when the moralistic audience they have cultivated rejects their out of pocket behavior afterwards. The entire course literally reads like every other mlm post out there where you pay way too much money for someone to tell you the most surface level knowledge imaginable. I think girl defined is stuck in the middle of the road approach that I’m certain worked back in the day, they come off as mellower compared to other grifters, but their “wholesome” sweet we are just girlies approach does not mesh with their more extreme ideals that either alienate their regular more normal audience, or makes them a target if they attract the more extreme types and then can’t keep up with their more fringe believes in the long run.

[@davidkonevky7372]

Yeah, it seems like they've got to stick to a specific audience because they're trying to expand a little to far for their range. They either ditch the god honoring religious videos, or the capitalist MLM self help and sex videos

[@baby.yogurt]

Had to pause the video to come and clarify something that I believe you got wrong here regarding Dav supposedly having gone to conversion therapy. From all the coverage I've seen on this rumor, what I know is that there was a video where Dav and Bethany were adjusting their camera while filming a video, and were asking each other "is it straight" and Dav jokingly replied "define straight" (referring to the camera's position). this rumor of Dav potentially being secretly gay surfaced after this clip spread, and a short while after, Dav addressed it himself in a video he made solo (don't remember what video, but he spoke to this rumor specifically) to clear up the confusion and state that he had never been to conversion therapy, and was not gay. Not sure why I'm seeing so many people still perpetuating this rumor, but as far as I know it's been put to bed for a while now. (I believe also FundieFridays covered this whole thing in one of her older videos on GirlDefined.) Gonna use a phrase that one of Bethany's IG followers used "I pray that you understand where I'm coming from" lol, I'm not trying to be antagonistic or assume that you had bad intentions making this video or anything. I just feel it's important to not mix in false rumors with legitimate criticism of public figures who do harmful things, so our criticisms don't lose their impact.

[@chelscara]

I do want to point out Bethany is the one that is still perpetuating any queer theories with her “living in sin”, “not her fault” posts. I do agree it should be noted in the video that he’s denied it if it was in the video but… I don’t see it there. Just the comments about body language after the Barbie movie and Bethany’s weird posts.

[@ananastea]

it’s actually a nice point! it saddens me immensely when i see false accusations or illogical jumps when someone is trying to argue for what i actually agree with, it’s as if the whole thing risks losing its credibility. there are quite a few in this video unfortunately…

[@novalinnhe]

Thanks kindly for the correction.

[@allycorley184]

Selling a course about how to sell courses is comedy gold.

[@AltClev37]

Bethany’s husband is absolutely lying to himself. This is a case of “I got married and had a child too early and now I regret it all” spouse. It happens and it’s way worse when someone is “religious” and they feel so much guilt for feeling that way. I hope he finds his true happiness one day cause I believe him being married to Bethany was a mistake.

[@app1escruff]

Omg not Dav understanding Barbie’s themes way better than I did… I find his take so endearing. Poor guy. But I’m glad he’s thinking for himself, hopefully he’ll continue on that journey and find peace.

[@momomomo__]

bethany completely missing the point of the barvie movie explains why her husband relates so much to ken. i hope he can somehow find a way to leave this marriage and find people who actually can support him and love him. he seems like a pretty chill dude who got raised and wrapped in a circle of religious extremists and can't find a way out

[@ilya8132]

I get a lot of toxic masculine energy from Bethany; the same kind I feel when men approach me and give off "entitled", "predatory", "money driven" vibes. Finding out how she met her husband sunk those feelings in further for me, as well as all the ways she's been apparently trying to get money. It's ironic.

[@thelastholdout]

It sadly makes a lot of sense why Dav would connect so much with Barbie. He's living out every problem that both Barbie and Ken face in the movie. I really hope that he eventually finds a path to happiness, because so far it sounds like Bethany is the successor to her abusive mom's tendencies.

[@mx_problematique]

the way Dave seemed to connect so deeply and sincerely to the barbie movie legit makes me kind of emotional. I had a hugely fun time with it even though i found it a little trite, and im with him about the lack of sincerity in it, i think its cool that he found it so meaningful. I hope he keeps following that identity and performance thread and gets to a healthy place in his life.

[@SeltzerinShadow]

Dave relating hard to Ken and appreciating the growth and self-actualization separate from Bet- i mean Barbie's, is very telling. He seems to really be trying to find himself while still church and people pleasing.

[@frizzyrascal1493]

Exactly. He was basically groomed at the age of 16. And the body language speaks volumes. He doesn’t look comfortable at all. I feel for him.

[@PCLHH]

He should tell her he´s going on this pilgrimage, but then just go off-grid and enjoy things he does and discover himself a bit. And then leave her! bam.

[@rachel_ellingson]

Jesus Christ…. I knew that Bethany’s marriage was problematic… but I did NOT know that he was 16 and she was 22… literally what!?!? I feel so sorry for David. He’s problematic too but I hope he can get out eventually and find his true self whatever that is. Sounds like he’s been pressured / coerced/ in a cult lol all of his life. Whether he likes men or not he has been told how he feels is wrong his whole life and was preyed on by marriage culture and a grown woman who wanted a teen she could mold.

[@AS-jr1jm]

Dave HAS addressed the rumors about gay conversion therapy in a video he made. He denies the rumor completely, and there's literally no proof of there being a deleted video.

[@AmarisFrede]

I once read a quote that went something like: A lot of priests tell women to stay with their abusive husbands, because if they admitted that they are abused, the women might not just question their relationship with men, but their relationship with their religion as well. I guess it affects all genders, seeing how Dev is being treated.

[@babysmokie7179]

Their differing views of the Barbie movie is hilarious and eye opening, Dave is like so close to finding freedom

[@missychan63]

Actually, he created three. Someone who is born intersex was BORN intersex- which means they were made in his image and he made them perfectly. These girls are just a tad confused. 😂

[@meowmeowmeowmeowcatoncomputer]

Intersex happens in nature as well, to other animals and even flowers. Hermaphrodite flowers are flowers that can self pollinate and have "both parts", a little different than an intersex person lol, but roses, lilies, daffodils, etc. are all examples. Another ex. Just like how human men can have Klinefelter Syndrome (XXY chromosomes), so can regular animals and such. The calico fur in cats is not a true "fur color" but a mutation tied to the XX chromosome which is why they're almost always female. But male calicos are very very rare but are possible! They just need to have both an XXY chromosome mutation and the calico mutation. But it makes it so that male calicos are infertile (well, not certainly, but it's almost impossible for them not to be despite having intact male parts). Same for torties, or any tri-color cat. Nature is so interesting! So beautifully weird!

[@yoyohayli]

Jesus, it sounds like Dave is way less brainwashed than Bethany is and is experiencing dissatisfaction at her trying to drag him down into the pit of "we're all bad, we're all bad, and we all deserve to die!" Side note: That phrase is LITERALLY what my pastor (back when I was a Christian) would have the WHOLE CONGREGATION (yes, even children and toddlers!) chant with him. AT LEAST once a month. It is so disturbing to think about now, but back then, I truly believed it.

[@TheDoomBlueShell]

Don't doubt you because has so many music that plays inside the church that boils down to that message many stuff is quite creepy when you take a step back and start to really understand what is being said

[@hanatemonstas4485]

@@TheDoomBlueShellThat’s a bit forced. I mean, people also this for non-religious songs too.

[@TheDoomBlueShell]

​@@hanatemonstas4485 I don't think these non-religious songs are played to kids tho, like when was last time you heard a kid singing "I don't deserve my own live because I'm a sinner"? Or "Since I'm born I'm sinful and don't deserve love"? Because both of these messages are common in gospel musics and were the themes of last year Christmas music that was song by little kids in my parents church

[@hanatemonstas4485]

@@TheDoomBlueShell Ring around the rosy, Humpty Dumpty, Its Raining Its Pouring, Jack & Jill, London’s Bridge, etc were all taught while I grew up as nursey rhymes for kindergartens to sing despite the grim themes. There is also a lot of pop songs popular with adolescents that romanticize unhealthy and toxic behaviours (“Im going to kill my ex and their bf/gf too”, “I’m the bad guy”, “You should dump her because I love you more”, “Every single guy ever is straight and loves women’s big butts and if they don’t, they are lying”, “Every girl/woman is a bitch/hoe and is after my money”, etc. Meanwhile, there werent many songs I remember growing up where the lyrics or focus was about being worthless or endorsing creepy behaviour. Most were Bible tales, or elevating about God’s power. That can vary by denomination and church community so I believe you have encountered them.

[@valolafson6035]

Isn't being a stay-at-home mom already a full time job?

[@KizzyDreamer]

Labor wise, yes, but it doesn't make money. She could be easily be a mommy blogger that exploits her kids for views to raise them The Christian Way™️ but I guess she doesn't want to go that route lmao

[@DiligentThroat]

@@KizzyDreamerplease don’t give her any ideas

[@jennifergeorge7280]

@@KizzyDreamer what she’s doing is awful but I think it’s good she doesn’t exploit her kids.

[@Burningheartcelosia]

“Our business isn’t for youth” “Our business name contains the word girl”

[@ELoouise323]

So they’re anti-Feminism but they support making money and women preaching the gospel. 🤨

[@erenjinchuriki]

This is a fallacy. Making money and preaching the gospel (as opposed to pastoring) isn’t opposed to “anti-feminism” (or at least it isn’t opposed to biblical womanhood). There’s a lot to criticize them for, but this isn’t one of them.

[@reesahufnagle9165]

it is just a way for Christians women like this to justify earning money while claiming to be stay at home moms. Truth is they are not letting their husband provide for the family if they working from home. They are not following what they teach by doing this

[@cynister7384]

@@erenjinchuriki "I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over men; she is to keep silent." 1 Timothy 2:12

[@smiledance4933]

​@@erenjinchurikiwithout feminism women wouldn't have anything they have now. Businesses, bank accounts, agency, options etc.

[@chilltheheckoutwithava1454]

Welcome to the cognitive dissonance of fundamentalism.

[@lovegabija3005]

God, I seriously wish Dav the very best. He seems so thoughtful and intellectual with his thoughts. His take on the movie was a shocking surprise. I couldn't imagine not having mentally stimulating conversations with my partner. It would drive me insane.

[@alienbearcub]

I really never thought for one second thought Girl Defined in any way would take this weird turn

[@em84c]

She must have been struggling so much before she got married! 😆

[@BBB-to4cc]

My mind wonders during sex and it was really hard for me to realize the reason. It’s not just fun and games. I took acid at a festival and my man and I got intimate in a tent and i had an epiphany that all the trauma I had been through in relationships and family life made me scared of intimacy and I felt out of control in my own body, like I was a ragdoll being used. I was raised Christian and I’m still healing from it and lot of Christian women feel this way bc we are taught we are not in control of our bodies and that we are to be used by men and society. She didn’t approach the topic at all. She said “are you traumatized? Then buy my advice that won’t help you… I just know you’re desperate”

[@abbyabroad]

Disassociation is so real 😔

[@mothermakeup7481]

I would love for Dave to be a movie critic! His takes are so well thought out. He needs to start his own podcast, reviewing movies! I feel so bad for this man. He deserves happiness. Bethany is not physically or mentally or emotionally attractive at all. I am sorry if that sounds harsh, but sometimes someone’s attitude can make them ugly to me.

[@MeowCatReturns]

On the topic of passive income/digital products: the “digital products ” she sells are just watered down versions of other grifters’ digital products telling you to others digital products. Our economy has just become an MLM of us selling each other pdf downloads/crappy marketing kits back and forth. We’re living in the scammiest timeline.

[@Tolly7249]

I feel so sorry for Dave. He's so obviously unhappy and uncomfortable in this relationship and I want better for him. He deserves better.

[@manic_girl]

And the fact that Bethany still would look down on s*x workers like me… girl. The call is coming from inside the house when it comes to purity culture.

[@bobanoda]

Right, like it’s funny that she thinks she’s breaking down purity culture by saying that sex inside of marriage is okay. Like what?????

[@playitfuckingloud]

Bethany IS a sex worker, though she will never understand that.

[@manic_girl]

@@bobanoda she goes “I no longer am ashamed to talk about sex” ok? Most of us have been on that page Bethany.

[@darcyhoodtube]

It’s not something to be proud of… not saying any girl is worth less or not “pure” because they’ve done sex work but it’s not the amazing job feminism has made it out to be. I know a few ex and still current sex workers and they wish they could get out if it, they’ve almost been killed, they’ve gotten diseases, they’ve been forced into it, by people and by poverty. It’s not something to be proud of.

[@tigaliyt]

@@darcyhoodtube Bae... at some point, you'll have to realize the reason it's such a dangerous line of work is because of the stigma people like you propagate. It's absolutely something you can be proud of, and the more normalized it gets, the more eyes on the poor working conditions, and the more things will improve. What do you expect to accomplish by shaming them? Deter people from pursuing s work? That worked out so great during the hundreds of millenia of history of humanity, right? Also, before you point out trafficking and its repercussions: the problem is the trafficking, not the s work. Tons of people are coerced into all manner of unsafe, unhealthy jobs or resort to them out of desperation.

[@K.Marie119]

Beginning of the video: Does anyone else think Bethany sounds like she's pitching an MLM? No? Just me...? Middle of the video: Getting the strong feeling that we're watching Dav continue to grow and develop as a person while Bethany remains stagnant, fighting tooth and nail to make it seem she's not being left behind.

[@Cminorputitincminor]

22 and 16 is WRONG. I’m 21, and I can’t even imagine even romantically looking at any of my 16 year old brother’s friends. The maturity difference is vast. A six-year age gap is really not a biggie later on, but the difference in maturity, in development between 16 and 22 is massive. This is GROOMING.

[@ananastea]

finding someone attractive and acting on it are different things.. and we are not talking about liking kids, but someone who is generally in your age range. i’d argue that “wrong” is subjective and it’s our culture that defines it as wrong. nothing too wrong with just finding someone 3 years younger let’s say attractive and maturity levels vary from person to person, they aren’t only defined by age

[@cynister7384]

@@ananastea You can't say that someone who could've already finished college is in the same maturity range as someone who is barely half done with high school. I'm sure there are exceptions as there are with everything, but this is very, very unlikely.

[@ananastea]

@@cynister7384 i’m only saying it’s not absolutely black and white with age in some cases. i personally see nothing too WRONG in the attraction (the original prompt from the video - she only said she „laid an eye” on him). but even if we go further - in a relationship of a 16yo girl and a 22 yo boy, if they are shooting to date for marriage and abstaining from sex (so that it would be legal in that department, cause i think a lot of age gap talk stems from that). they might even be long distance. they are 18 and 24 in 2 years, and again, someone might be quite mature by 18. depends on a girl and a boy. but there are a lot of other things that aren’t likely going to work - like differences in religious views or material wealth and requests in that department. it bugs me that we never talk about these, but a 5-6 year difference is a red flag immediately and without consideration.

[@cynister7384]

@@ananastea Even without sex, someone who's 22 dating someone who's 16 would still very much be grooming.

[@ananastea]

@@cynister7384 i wouldn’t be so sure to say that in all of the cases. but what is it - illegal? not advised - maybe. my only argument here is that “plain wrong” is not always the case. the dynamics aren’t always determined by age alone.

[@Clownkhitty]

You honestly deserve your platform bc every time I watch one of your videos it’s quality content presented in an easy to absorb manner. I hope you reach 100k!

[@cherrycookie7365]

honestly, Dav seems great and like he's really doing his best with the upbringing and peers he had and has. I hope he can find his people and be happy

[@Sparkyinbozo-xe9fn]

Don't feel too bad - he's shown some really bigoted opinions towards LGBT people, enables his wife, and does creepy stuff (like wears her virginity ring as a necklace). Like, sure, he's less bad than she is, but he's still bad.

[@saritavenkatapathynaidu9533]

I do think it’s important to remember that he still perpetuates many garbage views and has long supported mens’ rights, being an active member of groups to that effect. I think a lot of the conversations about Dav reflect some of the things I see(/have personally experienced) in Christian dating culture. Like many older adults at church, most of the community criticizing Girl Defined *infantilizes* Dav and that takes a lot of the accountability aspect away when he really does need to be accountable for everything he’s done to promote and raise children and do work for fundie Christianity and purity culture and mens’ rights. Clearly, Bethany used this infantilization culture to her advantage, and it does seem like Dav was groomed by her to some extent, which does make him a victim. That said, being a victim and doing a heap of wrong and terrible things are not mutually exclusive. And one of the other ways we infantilize him as an audience is to perpetuate the false rumor that he’s in the closet when it’s been heartily disproven many times. Rumors about people’s sexuality are really never a good thing, they draw from queerphobia and lean on stereotypes, and no one, NO ONE *OWES* ANY PERSON OR GROUP AN EXPLANATION OR DECLARATION OF THEIR SEXUALITY. I think it’s terribly infantilizing to imply he doesn’t know his own sexuality and that he’s just being controlled by Bethany - as if everything in his life and all his choices have been without his consent and manipulated against his will. This is simply NOT true, and I’d warrant that if there is something in him to be respected, it’s not just a take on the Barbie movie, but holding him accountable for the incongruous take between Barbje and how he takes accountability for those issues in his own life, or lack of said accountability. Dav is an adult man who has definitely been manipulated at times, and I’d say he qualifies as a victim in some senses. But he is, nonetheless, an adult man who deserves the kind of respect for his personhood that *includes holding him to good values when he’s living his life, not just talking about a movie.* Dav has probably been degraded and punched down on for a lot of things, people take advantage of his nature in many ways, but just about everyone has had relationships or experiences with these issues and many of us have worked to overcome those challenges and to move beyond victimhood as we mature and become better people. Dav should be held to a higher standard. He should be held accountable for the bad he’s done and the purity culture he promotes. One take on the Barbie movie does not make him enlightened, but yea, I appreciate the seeds in him that suggest a moral flower *could* grow. Respecting that possible outcome means holding him to breaking free and being better, and he’s an adult man who can put his food down to quell the cycle of abuse. It’s hard and everyone who goes through this is worthy of compassion and room to grow. But when someone is abstaining from that growth and their form of maturity is only reflected in commentary but not in their values and their real life, they have to be held accountable. Dav is an adult and he participates in this shit, and he shouldn’t. I appreciate that he’s deeper than this whole charade, but I’d like to see *him* engage his own depth and match his mind and heart to the external values of his lived reality. Don’t infantilize people who are already subjected to that kind of treatment, and no one is *just a victim.* Seeing the complexity and the flaws of those we address in criticisms like this is an important aspect of the criticism, and refraining from idealized visions of their character allows us to actually hold them accountable for the output and total effect they have on the world. @cherrycookie7365 - this is so not directed at you as an intense criticism. I agree with your take but it spurred this thought in me as I’m reading a lot of these comments and I think the infantilization aspect needed to be voices in the talk about accountability for all he’s done and not just that commentary. Have a lovely new year!

[@cherrycookie7365]

@@saritavenkatapathynaidu9533 hey, that was a lot of insightful stuff! You're right, I guess it is easy to see him as a victim good boy in this, and it's more complex than that. As much as Bethany is older and probably could control him to a degree, he is his own person, I totally agree. I acknowledge he's still deep in fundie culture and perpetuates their hurtful narratives. It's just that while he is indoctrinated and believes all that, moments like when he talks about the Barbie movie feel like wow, if he grew up in a different environment, he could be a completely different person. I mean, I guess that's true for every indoctrinated person, but it's like, Dav feels like he spends a lot of time trying to critically think about things (not that he always comes to good conclusions, but he seems way more thinky and ponderous than, say, Bethany) and sometimes it feels like he gets close to poking open the shell of the egg he's in, if that makes any sense? So it makes me root for him to break out of this stuff entirely one day. Leaving a religion or faith can be a very long gradual process, and in my experience, stuff like "Hey, this Barbie movie did some stuff with gender norms, and actually, that was pretty cool, even though it doesn't exactly agree with my faith" can be a stepping stone to breaking through the indoctrination. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and have a lovely new year as well!

[@sunnyandthechlo]

I think the view on him is hope that he could ‘get out.’ Not even to stop being Christian but realizing that Christianity is more about love and forgiveness and leaving the judging to God. Not going to erase the harm he has perpetuated, but it could help others to realize the ‘fundie’ way isn’t the only way.

[@sillysnailguy]

i think you should more overtly credit fundiesnarkuncensored for all of the community’s work in collecting/finding/archiving these posts and how it went into making this video possible

[@nopenope3632]

Everything about Bethany, from the way she moves to her 2010s American girl doll wardrobe, is so deeply Christian Mom Cult aesthetic. I wish I could see into an alternate reality where she was just a normal adult because I can't even picture what she would look like.

[@Travelling_with_my_dog]

I'm pleasantly surprised at how nuanced and intelligent Dave's opinions are about the Barbie movie; not surprised at how bitter Bethie's take is. I hope Dave someday learns to accept himself.

[@CallmeMelinanow]

This is so surreal. As a n adult who was raised in a fundamentalist house, I am shocked. I am not a Christian now, but I would have been shunned if I had spoken publicly about private matters between my husband publicly like that! And to be so materialistic all the time and constantly ask for money would have be a matter that would have the congregation elders knocking on my door. These are fake Christians. They are the worst representations of Jesus I’ve seen all day. I’m convinced they don’t know their bible, or even the story of who Jesus was. My very first reason of that is the scripture says that women should not speak at church, and only ask questions at home privately to their husband. Maybe Bethany needs to meditate about that.

[@DimaRakesah]

I don't think they are "fake" so much as they are doing what so many religious people do, which is interpret their religion to say what they want it to say anyway.

[@skullchimes]

cherry pickin ay@@DimaRakesah

[@kiryn5977]

It's funny, Bethy looooves to throw shade at other Christians for being "cherry-pickers", and rails against the idea of them being allowed to "not take Scripture as a whole" and yet.... Pot, the kettle's calling from inside the house. XD

[@CallmeMelinanow]

@@kiryn5977 My point exactly. I’m no longer Christian, and don’t care about those arbitrary rules, but she claims to. She spews all this “do everything to God’s glory” bs, and changes her content to be overtly sexual all the time. What? This is the quiet, humble, subservient, wife we should all aspire to be? I think she just needs to spend a while in an environment that reflects what she claims to be all about.

[@PCLHH]

...especially since she´s so against Feminism.

[@justmaddiess]

i’m actually shocked they asked their followers to come up with 25k in ONE week

[@andjela7847]

i died every time you YELLED when BETHANY capitalized a WORD

[@Oogabooga814]

Dave's analysis of the Barbie movie is genuinely the best take I've heard from a man on the movie. He REALLY got it and connected to it personally.

[@ryshow9118]

I can never not laugh at how shocked these two seem to be at how the community they grew around sex shaming being ashamed of sex😂😂

[@suitdoggy4707]

What I find so weird is that this is the same women that talked about posting godly or modest clothing. But now they're posting about oral sex because they see it makes money. Either the internet and greed has slowly destroyed their original views or their views were weak to begin with and only thrived off the attention they were getting.

[@em84c]

I guess she thinks its ok now if you are married Christian couple

[@OkamiLyra]

I feel so fucking bad for Bethany's husband. It feels like she groomed him, manipulated him into being her husband. I hope he can separate from her one day and be somewhere where he's happy, and not stuck with a toxic person line her. And those poor kids having her as a mother, good god...

[@LucaGlitchy]

She admitted to meeting him when he was 16...she was 22...that is really creepy groomer shit

[@valentinarosas5322]

He’s a grown man who decides to stay in this marriage, BRING TWO CHILDREN INTO IT, and raise them in a fundamentalist environment. How is that excusable?

[@LucaGlitchy]

@valentinarosas5322 ...girl do you know how grooming works?

[@OkamiLyra]

@@valentinarosas5322 You don't know how manipulating someone and grooming them works do you

[@adhdhikaru]

@@valentinarosas5322very valid points, HOWEVER that doesn’t invalidate that he might be a victim too; when he met bethany he was still a child himself!!! overall VERY messed up situation for everyone involved

[@obsessedWMistyDay]

It was so stupid that she said she that she didn't understand why it was so important for girls to be told "they're enough". It was obviously her family issues were shining through. She was definitely never told she was enough because that shit makes me melt. It's a nice feeling knowing that what you're doing is enough.

[@luancosta199]

So you're telling me this woman married a man 6 years younger than her (meeting him when he was 16) that has attempted conversion therapy multiple times and openly admitted to suicidal adietion, while constantly talking about their fights and we're supposed to believe she's an authority in relationships 😭😭😭😭😭

[@jazwhoaskedforthis]

Thought the conversion therapy thing was debunked

[@Ikine557]

The conversion therapy thing isn't true, but your point still stands!

[@lazyfoxplays8503]

LMAO at the section where the group of people she spent 9 years telling to be modest and feminine are slowly turning against her when she suddenly takes advantage of the sex positivity feminism has allowed her to have. I wish she could have enough self reflection to realize all the comments she got was exactly what she had been saying to others. Edit: OMG THE ENTIRE SPILT TEA OF ALL OF THIS IS SO GOOD

[@Honeymooncake]

3:40 im in no way trying to defend mr clean here, but he does have some semblance of a point. Extremely low body weight (which is oft required to have a visible six-pack) isn't thought to be the best for your overall health, for men or women. There's a lot of people who exercise and diet in a way that Isn't technically good for them. I think that tends to happen when you focus on trying to emulate someone else's body rather than focusing on bettering your own body to its fullest extent

[@guava7102]

i think dave saw himself in barbie and her freeing herself from her “design”…someone get that man and the children out of there!

[@krisismav]

literally was just talking about girl defined with a friend yesterday, excited to see what lore im missing 🤭

[@silvermillennial]

I really need Trixie Mattel to get it together and get into this drama WITH THE SWIFTNESS.

[@mjewrites]

in Bethany’s post promoting her online course, she keeps using phrases like “passive income” and “bring in an income” “pour into the household funds.” She’ll say anything to avoid using the words “full time job” or any kind of phrasing that directly relates to that. She doesn’t want to admit that what she does is a JOB, that she is a WORKING MOTHER. The cognitive dissonance with these women is infuriating and sad.

[@alhsr1]

I am literally praying that Bethany’s husband escapes that relationship

[@timemachineto2009]

So proud of all your growth this year Austin

[@marlasinger8274]

the conversion therapy thing was only a rumor, there is no proof of them actually saying he was in conversion therapy

[@victoriablake3826]

It’s not uncommon for womens minds to wander during sex and get in the way of finishing. It’s not necessarily a sign of adhd or ‘hating your husband’. Maybe best not to add shame around it.

[@darkgirl222]

The “Christian” way of giving criticism or advice “I’m sharing this in love”. No, you just want to say whatever you want to say.

[@yeemcgee8149]

I loved Dave mostly understanding and enjoying Barbie while Bethany sat there angry and not sure what to do

[@Sara-dp5dg]

She was 22 and he was 16 When they got together!? Are we sure David wasn't groomed? He was a child!

[@qjtvaddict]

Woah 😳

[@ananastea]

where do you see that they got together at that age? it’s only that they met in church?

[@Sara-dp5dg]

@@ananastea you can literally see her admit to it at 17:52 Did you even watch the video?

[@ledaooa]

@@Sara-dp5dg They just went to the same church. They first started dating and even just meeting up one-on-one when Bethy was close to 30. They barely ever talked before.

[@Sara-dp5dg]

​@@ledaooanope she says they first laid eyes on each other which has romantic context behind it. It's gross. She basically waited till he was legal. If the genders were reversed y'all would be calling that man a predator

[@migoreng7789]

tbh hearing dave speak in recent videos... dude is one feet out of the bucket already. i feel bad for him, he's trapped in less than happy marriage and bethy has no problem with using their relationship as content, sharing things she probably shouldn't. i wonder if they still use the same toothbrush 🤢🤢🤢

[@shesaballer35]

I feel like Dave in a way related to the Barbie movie because he is going through struggle trying to find his identity. I hope he can find it someday and be happy.

[@DarkArt888]

Not gunna lie I wasn't in the girl defined anti-fandom deep enough to know about Bethany's husband, but now i'm high key invested in his character arc now.