The Hip Movement Dominating Professional Golf! 🏌️‍♂️

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

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[@justinhoskins4]

I don’t think people understand how valuable these videos are. Worth more than almost any lesson I’ve ever paid for and it’s FREE on KZbin. Thanks

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@justinhoskins4 we enjoy doing them so it’s always great to hear they help 🙏🏻

[@Nickporter17]

Not disparage other instructors. I guess everybody learns in a different way. But I want to be given a lesson in anatomy and physics through and through. Not have somebody watch me hit 50 balls and say the same thing over and over. You absolutely nailed it! So much value here!

[@kenjoersz8495]

These recent videos on the correct concepts of hip flexion and extension are pure gold. They greatly help me with my coaching and my own swing. I can’t thank you enough.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Awesome! Glad they’re helping 👊🙂

[@justinswearengin5912]

I’m right there with you. Realizing the trail hip is basically extending the entire down swing is what dit it for me. I’ve been trying to hold the right hip “back” FREEDOM!!

[@johnatchley9754]

It seems to me, an 82 year old who has played for over 60 years and is delighted to be still learning and improving thanks to KZbin and videos by great teachers like you two, things that didn’t exist 20 years ago, that a critical element of early extension to avoid is changing the spine angle and standing up just before and at the point of contact. The angles you show between the thigh and hip change as you demonstrate, but you retain the spine angle. I think the tendency to stand up is a reaction to the centrifugal and centripetal forces exerted in the downswing. Depending on your swing speed, a 300 gram driver head can effectively weigh up to 100 pounds. It is only natural to pull backward against that weight, causing your torso to stand up and both arms to straighten. A bit like the hammer throw in track and field events. And of course age and flexibility play a role. But what you are explaining can help. Focusing on the alternating movements of the hips can help you to keep the spine angle steady and rotate the shoulders around it. One other quick observation. You mentioned very briefly that in rotating the shoulders you want to avoid turning the torso sideways and back so the head gets over or outside the trail foot. To me, that is super important. It is one of the most common and easiest errors to slip into. When you rotate the shoulders correctly the way you then show, keeping your head over the ball, it can feel odd, like you were almost doing a reverse pivot or exaggerated stack and tilt. And of course you need to let the hips shift forward getting weight onto the lead leg. It can be a lot to keep in one’s mind, it’s work, but isn’t that one of the great pleasures of golf! And if you manage to combine all these things together (don’t forget the other things you two teach about the right arm and wrist angles) and hit a sweet, pure shot, it’s truly rewarding. The feedback loop in your brain says, yeah, I want more of that.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Golf medal post there, John 🙌

[@Tominator8376]

Being 72 years old, I very much can identify with John’s comments - they convey my thoughts almost exactly. Thank you both for giving us old guys the roadmaps to keep working on and to keep enjoying this great game!

[@jasonkelley6185]

Man, I hope I am still playing golf at 82. I might still have another 4 decades of this sport!

[@johnk.atchley5079]

The cool thing about golf is it is one of the only sports you can play at any age, from 5 years old to 95 years old. It has benefits similar to dancing or Tai Chi. The point is to get your body to move rhythmically and in sequence. Carts are a big help. Up until about 25 years ago I carried and walked and despised carts. Then around 18 years ago I got a folding push cart. Then after a colon cancer operation in 2015 and a quadruple bypass heart operation in 2018 (both successful) I finally decided to use a cart. Another major development that I think has extended the time we can keep active year round and afford to do so is the indoor practice bay with launch monitor, like the ones I use at the PGA Tour Super Store here in Rockville, Maryland. I paid just $149 for a one year membership and use of the bays is free, as opposed to $15 per half hour for non members. I go in for an hour at least four times a week, and can do so when the weather is bad or cold and after dark. I can simply use the driving range setting, or actually play a course where I use every club in the bag. The technology has gotten so advanced that you really can get benefits. As for the social aspect of golf, I don't have a regular group, but go out as a single, usually during the week in the afternoon when green fees drop, and will play with anyone of any age, gender and skill level. I maintain a GHIN handicap and play around five of the nine Montgomery County municipal courses that are in superb condition and affordable. Pocketbook constraints mean I can play only about twice a month and take advantage of a senior discount package. Two weeks ago I played in a group that consisted of a scratch player off the 7400 yard black tees, no one on the 6800 blues or 6400 whites, me on the 5850 green tees and two ladies on the 5000 yard gold tees. Everyone played at a good pace, we made it in before dark, and we all enjoyed each other's company and had a good time. I wish you the best as you enjoy those next 4 decades! @@jasonkelley6185​

[@jasonkelley6185]

@@johnk.atchley5079 I also go out as a single more often than not, and I love playing with other people on the golf course. I'll have to see if there is a PGA Super Store anywhere near me. That is a great deal! I just got back from renting a bay for an hour for $35 to get details on my swing. Happy golfing!

[@WolfheartFPS]

Thank you guys. Its funny how some things click with others while they might not click with you. This explanation clicked with me.

[@SpineLine_Golf]

I've watched this as well as your video from 5y ago on "Clearing The Hips In The Golf Swing" - what a great combination! So clear and logical, I'm in awe of you guys. Now all you need is some method to give immediate feedback on exactly how to make these movements , let me know if you are interested & I'll share...

[@elindauer]

I've never heard early extension explained more clearly. Great work as always.

[@robertcramer9653]

I've followed you guys for years (you've helped my game immensely), but this video has by far been my biggest "aha" moment. Such a simple concept but so easy to overlook. I've always struggled with firing both my hips (I was taught the reverse C, bump the hips and throw the hands method at a young age), leading to all sorts of compensations, back pain, and snap hooks. In all the work I've done to try and fix that early extension, I never once considered extending the trail hip while going into flexion on my lead hip. I'm training this in the gym now to build muscle memory, but already, in the mirror, my body action looks so much better. THANK YOU! You guys are the best coaches out there. Keep up the awesome content. One of these days, I'll have to head down to Orlando and buy you a beer!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Sounds good!!!! 🍻 😊

[@cowboys402005]

This is the best explanation of early extension on YT.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Thank you! We hope it helps 🙂

[@BeefyPreacher]

Can you do a “why you need a -13* swing path” next?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Asking for a friend? 😛

[@johnbaranco7438]

This made me laugh 😂

[@TheBamanda2]

😂

[@Mr.Helper.]

What’s 13 swing ?

[@phreak761]

​@@Mr.Helper.-13⁰ swing path

[@prycealderson9352]

I have watched a google amount of your videos. I consider this video the holy grail. A must see for every golfer. It’s amazing how many internet “experts” still preach backing both sides into the wall….

[@petecross22]

I’m a 6 handicap. I have watched these gentlemen for many years. I have come to the conclusion this channel is for advanced golfers. They break down components of the swing with so much detail I struggle with understanding their back and forth conversation. I love their enthusiasm and their dedication to teaching my favorite sport…..it’s just too much information.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@petecross22 what we teach is about as simple as it gets - good grip, good setup, on plane backswing, arms lower as body turns, on plane downswing. And the more advanced the player, the simpler it gets. Checkout our live lessons to see how we teach. On the other hand, when we’re explaining a topic in a video that millions of golfers get wrong or are confused about, we’ll take the time to explain it (with data) in detail. For decades, too many concepts have been dumbed down to the point of getting it wrong, and that has lead to more frustration and wasted time for anyone trying to improve. We just believe it’s important to explain the concepts as correctly as possible, then at the end, give very simple ways of implementing them.

[@petecross22]

@@AthleticMotionGolf you are so thoughtful to respond to my comment. Thank you very much for this perspective. And thank you very much for your generous content. We share the same passion for the greatest sport on the face of the earth.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@petecross22 wow thanks for the kind words 🙏🏻

[@russdaley5333]

Fantastic video, gents! Excellent companion to your Saggy Knee video. As Mike says, the golf swing is a puzzle. You guys are helping me get the pieces in place. Thank you!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Love it! Sometimes it can feel like the puzzle of a snow storm 🥴

[@vincentkingsdale8334]

8:13 I would like to see some measurements with center flank on each side instead of center chest. Sidebending and rotation plays a huge part in these measurements, which is a little misleading. Either way, the important part is that the lead hip moves back a bit through impact, and doesnt thrust forward. The best view is the top down, and you can measure the anterior and posterior translation from start to finish. You already did this video, which is one of my favorites.

[@bensontan4525]

This is a perfect follow up video to the saggy hips one. Great spotlight on how the lead and trail work in opposition or in tandem. Thank you again for this amazingness! 🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@bensontan4525 thank you!!!

[@BP_Cali]

I’d suggest that as we get older, the early extension is the body’s way of protecting the lower back. Adequately covering the ball at impact puts some pressure on the lower left back for RH golfers. Do you have good stretching or flexibility exercises for the older or aging golfer?

[@16pennynails]

Great instruction as always, the correct hip motion shown here was discussed in a recent video of yours about"saggy leg syndrome" as well, highly informative.

[@robkedgley8350]

This is awesome! I was taught to push hips back and ‘crunch’ lead side which wrecked my swing & body! In doing this I’m feeling lead heel coming up off the ground , is that all good? Thanks! Rob

[@alipajooman]

Definitely a bold video title. But I have to say I’m all for showing the same concepts in different ways. We all need to find our own feels to get the correct movements…it’s accessing the right tools to verify the real, that is my challenge.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

What's the big issue in your swing?

[@alipajooman]

Posture throughout the backswing and transition. I tend to extend at the top into transition (lift my head at the end of the shoulder turn)... there are drills I used to do to fix this during practice but it's a wak a mole feel some days. So I have been taking your advice and slowing it all down and doing checks on camera. Thanks for asking.@@AthleticMotionGolf

[@David-yi6ij]

Thanks again for another amazing video, this explains so much and really explains what Rory is really doing, when people saying he squats, which is really not true.

[@cubfan69kmz85]

I saw the title of the video and I said to myself that I finally do something well in my swing.🤪 In all seriousness, intuitively I always thought pushing both hips back could not be a great idea. It is amazing how false narratives on social media regarding the golf swing has people chasing their tails and wasting a lot of time doing the wrong thing. I am sure you will catch some flack from the Social Media “golf professionals”, but most of us know better. Keep preaching the truth. 👍

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Early extenders have half of it right 👊😅

[@WarGolf]

Best team, instruction and info on social media.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

🙏🏻👊

[@WarGolf]

@@AthleticMotionGolf if only I could get to central Florida for a lesson. It’s on my bucket list!

[@golfista37]

This is great so many videopros trying to get the sacrum back and it leads to worsening upper body moving the club over the top of the plane and pulling across it

[@justnews9738]

Excellent guys. Much appreciated.

[@whitneyhewatt7808]

Excellent explanation for those who understand it and have likely experienced the feeling. Thanks for this one, one of the best that so many can relate to.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Glad it was helpful!

[@stevebeskid4398]

This video is an awesome demonstration and what we were working on at the end of my last in person lesson and what I'm still working through on my own. That piece of the left side on backswing very eye opening.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Right! It was helpful in my own swing to see both sides at the same time 🤓

[@paulweylandgolf]

Love this video and 100% spot on. Big Mike you are looking great. The Titleist hat doesn’t hurt 😃

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Thanks brother! Titleist hat takes away the 10lbs the camera adds 😄

[@johnshearer9477]

Uncle Mike in one previous video you spoke of leg swing. How it's easier for people to swing their leg forward than backward. Does this early extension tie into letting the pelvis move forward while allowing the backward leg swing to occur?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Yessir 🙂

[@stevejackson9173]

Very illuminating indeed. This is exactly opposite to what I believed happens. Can't wait to try to incorporate this into my swing. Thanks for all the fascinating work you do guys.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Let us know how it goes 👊🙂

[@stevejackson9173]

Will do!@@AthleticMotionGolf

[@justinswearengin5912]

Awesome video guys! So,the knees are the primary “driver” for this motion to occur properly?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Yessir the knees are a big deal in good flex/ext of the pelvis 👍

[@Shizi7]

I have a more recent (2023) DTL view of Tiger hitting an iron. As he transitions to the downswing, I noticed that when his knees are parallel to the target line his hands and club handle are still up front of the right shoulder. I looked at my video swings from the same angle and realized that my hands are down around waist before my knees are parallel to the target line. I have lost significant club head speed and I feel this is why. I seem to remember that you did a video on this. If so, could you direct me to it. Thanks.

[@jeremyburns8567]

Very nice work and great information on the legs/pelvis leveraging during the entire swing! You guys rock!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

🙏🏻👊

[@rickholtcamp]

Do you guys have a video where you drop lines outside both shoulders like the line you put on the left shoulder in the BIG Secret to pivot and shoulder turn video?

[@chachichochacorta8577]

Gentlemen, great video as always. Very informative. I have a feeling that golf coach from Superstition Mountain will be making a video countering your theory soon. Question: In the downswing, should one be pushing the lead hip back with their lead foot stomping on the ground to get the hips turning toward the target or should one use the core (back and abdominal muscles) to turn the hips toward the target?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

🙂theories in golf abound when there's an absence of measuring. We're old enough to have started teach when all there was were passed along theories and feels. Some were sound. Some have been blown up. Thankfully we're in a time when we can just measure what great players do and share the results. Golfers can then better choose what path they want to take. In the downswing, there's more pull from lead side than pushing from the trail side according to force plate data. We find getting the player on their lead side early enough typically takes care of a lot things. We have used "pushing away from the target line" for some players, but it's not necessarily a universal intent that needs to happen. The biggest increases to rotation at impact typically come from not over-rotating going back, and having the club in a position that requires rotation. There always has to be a reason to rotate. When there's not, you'll hit it worse if you rotate more.

[@chachichochacorta8577]

@@AthleticMotionGolf Thank you for the detailed reply. I like the idea that "There always has to be a reason to rotate."

[@MD20-20]

As usual, great vid guys. Solid information. Love the KISS method!

[@JTeeDub]

Do y’all have an opinion of the gravity golf swing and his theories… the takeaway seems odd but other than than it seems they’re hip movement is similar to what you guys point out that most pros do.

[@cubfan69kmz85]

If done correctly, there should always be a hip against the “wall” at all points during the swing, correct?

[@shanemcknight415]

I am gonna take this to my simulator and have an absolute blast. I can't wait.

[@jasonkelley6185]

Who knew Mike had such great hair! Lookin good big man. Oh yeah, and great content too. Literally never seen anyone explain the difference in angle between lead and trail side. Eye opening, just like most of your videos.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

haha some how there are still a few attached up there. It's crazy seeing these movements from each side at the same time. The swing is so much more symmetrical than we realize. Understanding that has helped a lot of golfers in lessons.

[@michaelparsons541]

Question: Do most or all instructors that use Gears teach similar techniques or teaching styles? Just curious

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

I don’t know. We’ve captured and worked with the majority of your pros in our database. That does make for a unique perspective into that data, but I’m just not sure of how others utilize the system.

[@jussitoivanen9544]

Great video and a whole new concept could be a gamechanger👏 Tiger did that both hips back drill couple of years ago. Any comments on that?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

He's the most photographed/recorded golfer in history. Of all those photos and videos, I've only ever seen one shot of him doing that silly exaggeration. Understanding how these guys think and their sometimes twisted sense of humor, it's as likely that was one of the all-time best pump fakes in history than it's something he routinely works on in history. But one thing we do know, he sure wasn't doing it when he was dominating and winning everything in sight.

[@alnickerson2525]

This video, along with the “Saggy Leg” one, were very helpful. I had an “ah-ha” moment practicing these. Thanks!

[@EaglesEric1]

I was once told the back pants pocket side forward across the wall then stay in place, as the down swing starts the front pants pockets moves back to the wall. Is this the feel?

[@chrisbye8203]

Like the new set. Top video as always.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

If you're ever around Orlando, you'll have to stop in and see us 👊

[@jacquestaulard3088]

VERY cool graphics and database. How do you 'feel' this from the inside of yourself, being that it happens in under 2-3 seconds, back to sinish?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Whatever YOU need to feel should be based on you making this movement correctly. Slow enough to actually do it at first, then you’ll know exactly what you need to feel. Golfers struggle to improve because they’re on a constant search for a new feel that will let them make the swing they want at full speed. We’d all be playing on TV if that was possible 😊

[@davecohn6407]

The pelvis is divided into two hemispheres -a left hemisphere and a right hemisphere . Both hemispheres can and do move independently from the other hemispheres to small extent . The pelvis is connected to the feet and the ground via the femurs ( thigh bones) , which are tightly encapsulated within each respective the hip socket on either side of the pelvis . To assume that both sides of the pelvis flexes to the same degree during transition assumes that the left femur and the right femur are similarly flexed at the top . But this is demonstrably NOT true with the trail hip and femur “almost “straight and the lead hip and femur much more flexed ( bent) . From that position at the top it is simple anatomy to have lead hip ( femur) start to extend ( straighten) during transition; at the same time the trail hip ( femur) will flex ( bend) . This may cause the pelvis to move slightly downwards as the lead hip ( femur) initially retains its flex and the trail hip ( femur ) gains flex . The term “early extension “is a golf term and not an anatomical or kinesiological term . Much better for golfers to focus on the lead hip ( femur ) straightening and the trail hip will naturally follow , ( provided weight is correctly distributed at the top) .

[@JTeeDub]

What muscles should we use to shift back to center? I keep feeling myself push off my right leg and I’m having trouble shifting back to center otherwise.

[@iacas]

I think you'll find that the best might feel like they push a little, but I describe it more as a "fall" because the lead leg gets shorter. The lead ankle, knee, and hip joint flex, lowering the left hand side and lowering the pelvis slightly, pulling the body forward a bit. Your trail knee extends some in the backswing, and pressure beneath it decreases in the early downswing, so it's not really "pushing" much at all.

[@Carsonsimon]

*edit, should of waitied till the end of the video since you litrally said what i have just wrote here...😄 Let me get this correct... In the backswing the lead side would come away from the "wall" and extend while the trail side goes towards it. The downswing the lead side goes back towards the "wall" the trail side extends and comes away from it... But making sure your just turning around say, the centre point of the pelvis. Taking out and forgetting the fact that there is any lateral movement...litrally just the rotation aspect...

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Correct 👊 It's another way to think about and visualize turning around the center of the pelvis like we've talked about in the past.

[@paulwhite6367]

Thank God.....trying to squat/push both my hips back while still rotating to hit the ball is near physiologically impossible. Thanks for making sense of this.

[@TonyLuczak]

Brilliant as always!

[@NoahThomas-qf7bo]

Terrific video editing/production! I see you, Mike Granato.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

👊🤓

[@ayotollaofrockandrolla7219]

I’ve noticed that the majority of tour pros have some early extension. Most if not all lift the handle at impact. Is that your common analysis as well ?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Some do, and we’ve helped some of them not do it lol. I wouldn’t say most though. The problem with looking for EE in video is that the camera needs to be directly behind the hip or butt cheek from DTL to see it somewhat accurately. The farther the camera is towards the ball line, the more it looks like EE. Even though it’s it actually happening. That camera perspective is a real pain 🙃

[@Rich-in6ds]

The problem I have is that the right hip doesn't just come off the wall, it rises upwards and the leg straightens rather than regaining flex. This means my pelvis overall has risen higher and forces me to make compensations. I feel its from trying to swing from the inside such that the club exits impact right of the target line.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

I feel your pain. That’s something we’ve both had to work on as well over the years. Make sure that trail knee is regaining its bend😉

[@johnhue8933]

Have you got Cameron Champ's swing on GEARS it looks to me he hip hinges more than the average tour player?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

At what point of the swing do you reckon he's doing that?

[@johnhue8933]

@@AthleticMotionGolf Freeze him at transition with an iron swing when the left arm is level with the ground at transition, it appears to me he moves his knees less far forward when he bends his legs pushing his backside back more and bends his upper body more over than most tour players. A lot of players look to me to have their knees further forward more towards the toes at sit down than Champ and it is this rather than the degree of knee flex which pushes his backside back more, if you had his leg bend but the knees further forward the hips would not go back as far. I see what he does is more not moving his knees forward at sit down than deliberately pushing his backside back, what he does do as you describe is move his lead hip behind him while moving into sit down.

[@Prophecy23JC]

9:55 You stated the lead side flexed 16 degrees, but you were supposed to be addressing how much he flexed from the top. It was actually 37 degrees from the top. Wow. That means while his trail side extended 13 degrees, his lead side nearly tripled in flexion.

[@jaychon8418]

so no lateral move toward the target by the hips to start the release of the swing?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Yes, but here is lateral hip movement during the entire downswing. We have a number of videos that detail how hating movement 👍

[@rjswish]

Never want both sides of the body doing the same thing at the same time! Gold nugget. Just had to type it so I remember!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

👊🤓

[@freddym6643]

Does the center of the pelvis work towards the target significantly in the downswing? People don't want to "hump" towards the ball, but should we "hump" towards the target?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Towards the target (and parallel the the target line), yes. Significantly. But not towards the ball/target line.

[@richardjohnson-tb5pz]

If I understand this correctly, you are saying that the pelvis moves in a symmetrical fashion around it's center just as if someone were walking while keeping the feet on the ground?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Yes in the first part. Still trying to visualize the second part, but I’m inclined to think you’re right there too 🤓

[@MoltasElliver]

Does the hips turn on the same plan as the shoulders or level to the ground?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Not on the same plane and not level to the ground.

[@sghsdgdfg]

Okay! Reason I’m asking as I have seen some instructors using an alignment stick and putting it through were the belt buckle is. Then they say to keep the alignment stick parallel to the ground from the top of the swing to trough impact

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@sghsdgdfg we haven’t found one example of a good player coming close to doing that. I can’t imagine that advice comes from someone who measures what happens in the swing.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@sghsdgdfg Also sounds like a good way to mess up someones golf swing for life...

[@neilsmith2240]

The alternate views which show the angles where the camera moves around “with the pelvis” seem to suggest the angles don’t change as much as would appear in the DTL view. Are you able to explain the difference. Is the DTL view just an optical illusion ?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

That’s what we meant by camouflage. The angles look different no matter where we place the camera because the angles themselves are 3D. That’s also why we showed the real-time numbers as he moved. The numbers stay the same regardless of where the camera is positioned.

[@neilsmith2240]

@@AthleticMotionGolf awesome thanks! :)

[@conorw1989]

Is staying on the ass line throughout the swing a pre-requisite to a good swing? Does the lead cheek need to be on/through the line in the downswing for all body types?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Great question. It's a good idea to have one check on the line throughout the swing. It's typically a good visual that a number of other things are working properly. The number of players who don't do that and play great golf is far fewer than the ones who don't do it and are highly inconsistent.

[@sjgraci]

A bit confusing. There's good hip extension and then there's bad early extension. I'd say most think of early extension as the left hip moving off the wall, as opposed to back, during the downswing and the center of the pelvis moving towards the golf ball. I've never thought of the right hip extending towards the ball on the downswing as "early" extension. There is some interesting video out there of pros getting closer to the ball on the downswing, particularly with driver, that appears to be early extension. Nicklaus was said to early extend. Perhaps it's just the camera angle?

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

The left hip is already off the wall in the backswing. From down the line, you can really only see the trail hip on the wall so we folks see that move off, they see EE.

[@jamesmc81]

would you guys ever cover swing-weight and counterbalancing? Its more of a clubfitting topic(even though most clubfitters give you the standard d3/d3 - that same as the pros- which is nuts - we don't get issued blades and tour stiff shafts as standard- why swing-weight??). Id argue swingweight & total weight have the biggest impact on body movements as far as clubfitting and equipment goes- its the swing after all. Your lessons on how you move the *weight* of the club in the back swing really helped and got me thinking. To the point I experimented with a lighter SW - this really helped me implement your advice. would love to hear your thoughts.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Now that the Athletic Motion Golf Club is open, we will do more equipment and club-fitting videos. GEARS club fitting is on another level. We think it'll be eye-opening for a lot of golfers. We're even considering starting a new channel dedicated solely to equipment/club fitting.

[@jamesmc81]

@AthleticMotionGolf gears club fitting, of course! sounds epic. You're gonna be rustling twice the feathers now, boys!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@jamesmc81 yep it’s already started. We’re gonna put a major dent in clubfitting coming soon

[@davehill5539]

I got a kick out of your “the choice is up to you…” comment” - thanks for the details.

[@ZeeK33NKS]

So the “Squat” (cam young) is an illusion and is probably weight loading in the legs. Sounds like Posture Posture Posture is the move!

[@Practicallee]

When seeing the animated figures; it would help if the figures have labels of what club they are holding:\ shorter/longer iron, or driver

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@Practicallee it’s always a 7 iron unless noted otherwise 👍

[@KIMIゴルフ]

I wanna push like buttons 100 times🎉 thank you!

[@glen.simpson]

an entire video covering the sacrum would help so many

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

What would you like to know about it?

[@glen.simpson]

when people grasp how the tail bone moves toward the target as the backswing coils, it is then that they move forward. To talk of the backswing without talking about the tail bone seems to leave out probably the most challenging, but important component of the backswing....I'm a big one for development of swing feels related to core actions, not peripheral.... that is, the mind gets stuck in the arms and hands, not the torso and pelvis...... but players will never get the right feel and action from that core pelvic motion until they internally grasp the tail bone action..... some do it naturally, the naturals. anyhow, a little anatomy visualization of the tail bone would help many not stand into their right side so much... letting them achieve a more effective, and appealing to look at geometry.....@@AthleticMotionGolf

[@glen.simpson]

all your videos are face on and side on ... yielding internal swing concepts that reflect such training...... and neglect things like sacrum action.... and if someone doesn't grasp the tail bone action they will never develop an effective backswing.... so when you do a full sacrum video, I'll subscribe....for what it's worth,haha.... I just think 90% of golfers don't realize how the bottom of the tail bone moves toward the target on the backswing, and unless they do it naturally, they will never get their hips working effectively.... never get a good backswing....and you know the story from there. @@AthleticMotionGolf

[@mquettan3]

I think that I have identified a problem with these numbers... The issue here is that the center of the chest and the knees can move independently of one's hip flexion/extension can they not? Like, lateral moves also affect these numbers a little. Overall, wonderful video and a great point to be making. Extension itself isn't bad, too much in the wrong way at the wrong time is bad.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

I’m so visually oriented that I’m trying wrap my eyes around what you’re saying lol. I’m not sure there would be flex/ext without the knees and check being able to move independently, or at least it wouldn’t be realistic. I also agree with that because we stand in two hip sockets, it’d be tough for lateral movement to not have some impact on the numbers too. I think all that’s part of the number. I do like how your 🧠 is working 🤓

[@mquettan3]

@@AthleticMotionGolf Lol! Lemme see if I can paint a picture via text. Imagine you've got the suit on. And you're constantly monitoring these angles... You're in golf posture. Some neutral hip flexion so both of these angles are at the same exact value. Just standing with a little crack in your knees, addressing a ball. Now sway your chest towards the trail side without moving your hips or knees... The sensors on both sides of the hip, and the sensors on both knees haven't moved. ONLY the sensor on your chest moved towards the trail side. I think that movement affects these two angles. Creating a greater angle on the lead side and a smaller angle on the trail side. Even though I would not say that lateral chest movement changes one's hip flexion necessarily. They can move independently. The same probably happens if you move just one of the knee sensors laterally to the left or right. Both lateral knee movement and lateral chest movement (relative to the hips) occur in the golf swing so some non-zero amount of change in these angles is attributable to lateral movement. What's interesting is that a good amount of that lateral movement happens in transition. So some dual hip flexion during the brief moment of transition could possibly be hidden in these numbers by the lateral movement. But, probably not to a meaningful degree. Like, the overall point of this video still stands. I just find this interesting.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@mquettan3 ahh now I see what you’re saying. I’ll try to remember to test that! Our experience whenever we’ve tried similar “isolation” tests is that we way underestimate how sensitive a measurement tool GEARS is. Meaning even if the only goal is to sway the chest like your example, the hips and knees will move to accommodate it. We see that all the time in the physical screening test that GEARS does. Where the goal there is to physically isolate at movement, but it’s never really truly isolated.

[@mquettan3]

@@AthleticMotionGolf Ah yes, the struggles of being a squishy human. The world needs more robots... Or less. One of the two.

[@petermartinaitis8166]

Watch a short of Bryson Dechambeau trying to explain his golf swing, and you can see quite clearer his right leg straightening underneath him.

[@sozsoz6062]

I think that your data and explanation do not necessarily deny the squatting theory. In my view you would have to measure and compare the changes in the height of left and right pelvis above ground. I would assume that at the beginning of the DS both of them start going down which I would call squatting (regardless the extension taking place at the trail side simultaneously - trail side is squatting forward). Is that possible explanation to the contradiction? Thank you guys! Z.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

It's even simpler than that. Any lowering or lifting of the pelvis is measured by how much the center of the pelvis moves, right? So if the right side lifts 2" while the left lowers 2", the pelvis didn't lift or lower. I just tilted. With that in mind, would you think the pelivs lowers more in the backswing or downswing? And how much would you guess it lowers, on average for a PGA Tour player with a 7 iron?

[@sozsoz6062]

I agree. I do not think it lowers in BS and it lowers a bit (comparable to lateral shift during recentering - so less than inch) at the beginning of DS.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@sozsoz6062 I can’t think of an example of a player who doesn’t lower more in backswing. The downswing avg is ~3/8”, but is over and working back up by lead-arm parallel. We don’t like the term “squat” because no one thinks of 3/8” being a squat lol. Most golfers tell us they think it’s 4” - 6” of lowering their hat needs to happen in the downswing. That’s flat out malpractice for those pushing that idea.

[@sozsoz6062]

Ha, I have realised that I may have a different perception of the start of the DS - when the body starts the (recentering) move forward to the target and not only when the club changes the direction of motion. That could shift the weight of the body lowering move ("squatting") from the BS more to the DS, right?

[@paulweylandgolf]

In my swing on backswing I do the opposite my lead side angle actually decreases and my trail side angle increases I am working on that with K Motion side bend parameters, and it’s improving

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Yep, that’s how to do it 👏

[@paulweylandgolf]

@@AthleticMotionGolf Part of the reason my lead side shortens or increases angle instead of lengthening or decreasing angle is because of my excessive lateral sway of pelvis of over 3 inches early on backswing that I saw last May on 3D That excessive lateral sway was causing my entire lead side torso and pelvis to increase the angle. So I am trying to blend a little rotation of the pelvis as I have a 1 to 1.5 inch lateral shift of torso and pelvis instead of 3.5 of inches with no rotation That make sense?

[@georgetinwick3450]

I have noticed lately that some high level players are also giving lessons and they are saying the right hip znd right knee and right shoulder go down and under the left hip not out like you guys are recommending. Iam very confused about this obviously critical move. Can you clarify pls

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Can you define “high level?” Are they measuring what the best players in the world do?

[@georgetinwick3450]

@AthleticMotionGolf Tks for responding so quickly. Padick Harrington is one that comes to mind other coaches are studying many top current players in slow motion and saying the same thing as Padric. So i dont know. I have followed you guys for a couple years now and i appreciate everything you do. For us. I believe my major problem is early extension but so far. I have not been able to find a cure. Tks again for your thoughts

[@georgetinwick3450]

World Class Golf also go into great detail and study the movement of great players all thr way back to Jack's time. And perty much say what Padric says.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@georgetinwick3450 awesome, thanks for the reply! Some folks have used “high level” in the past only to find out they were talking about the scratch player from their club 😊 Paddy is definitely high level lol. He’s also been in to see us so we know in detail what happens in his swing. What he does is exactly what we’re showing in the video. We haven’t found any exceptions to that. To be clear though, all of these players are lowering their trail side, we’ve talked about and shown that in many past videos. That absolutely happens at the same time the trail hip and knee are moving out and around like we’re showing here. Anyone who says the trail side works under the left from a height perspective is absolutely correct. That’s a very easy to see these days. Anyone who says the trail side doesn’t move out and around from a depth perspective is incorrect, because that’s also very easy to measure these days 🙂

[@georgetinwick3450]

Tks so much for looking into my request and clarify this confusion. Iam probably the only one who has trouble understanding this tricky all important movement. I haven't tried to make it part of my downswing yet due to winter weather in my area. Looking very much forward to using your advice in the spring tks again

[@andrewconnor4429]

Amazing! So that's why I feel like I'm running out of room, I'm trying to spin around on my pelvis and maintain angles, when really it's a blend between my two sides that keeps me in healthy positions... Did some swings and can already tell, this is going to help with hitting it pure and flush big time, get more accurate with my position at impact so hand eye has less to do, never even conceived my torso could flex and extend differently on each side... like a bomb going off! Amazing work gentlemen!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Let’s go!

[@shmeme8971]

Early extension is caused by the hands and actually has nothing to do with the hips themself. It’s a necessary reaction to an action from the hands and the body adjusts and says “you better stand up or you’re going to miss the ball”

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

It's possible that might be true for less than 1% of the golfers struggling with EE. But EE is measurable for how much and when. For the rest of the golfing population, it happens in the backswing way before the "better stand up" reaction. kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZnrbnZ95f7d-iZYsi=uWJX96cbenLR502s

[@leerieser8765]

Hey guys how would you define the term spinning out relating to this video ? If we are looking at a pro swing and he feels this is hurting his game because it sends his hand path out and slow . He does the pipe drill/ split grip rory drill and works for him then it disappears and he thinks its the spin out. Got a super fast body and trying drills like the bowler drill . I thought to ask the gurus themselves and the timing of this video will help a brother out . Many thanks

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Learn to internal rotate the lead hip on the downswing. This will require some lateral motion….also the tilting of the pelvis will help prevent spinning. Flat pelvis usually spins flat.

[@leerieser8765]

@AthleticMotionGolf awesome thanks for getting back to me and the advise . Makes perfect sense . You guys rock

[@sirtogii5216]

Wow, what an eye opener. How many videos are out there on the "crouch" move? A million? The pitfall of taking a microsecond of a movement I guess.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

There’s a lot out there for sure. It’s crazy how stuff like that becomes a detrimental fad for a while. Especially nowadays when that stuff is easily measured.

[@kd6507]

I think this one could use some further clarification on exactly from where you're measuring the angles. The point on the chest is not obvious. I'm my minds eye i wanted to look for hip angles but that's not what y'all are presenting so that threw me. Also, looking good Mike!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Thanks brother. The spot on the chest is the dead 3D center, so inside the center of the chest. It’s the common location for each side.

[@kd6507]

​@@AthleticMotionGolfthanks for verifying. It took me a couple of rewatches to realize the 'protractor' itself was rotating about the z axis through the swing. Lol

[@JonSmith-c6d]

This is why gears, with your analysis, is so good. The speed guys insist that you have to get taller in the backswing and I get why that would increase speed (increase potential energy) but you can’t anatomical flex and get taller (can you?). I’d prefer to try and copy what the best players are doing and they are not too shabby when it comes to speed. I remember a coach telling me to imagine I am trying to squeeze a tennis ball on my trail side while releasing one on my lead and vice versa. Thought he was bonkers till now!. Tx

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

He was ahead of his time 🤓. The whole lifting thing has been completely overdone and/or misunderstood. Much of it seems to have roots in what Jamie Sadlowski did in his swing. What's missed in that analysis is he started his swing with over 50 degrees of knee bend. The normal Tour pro is in the ~15 degree range lol. So of course he going to lift when he starts moving, but he's lifting to get himself back into more of a normal range. The golfer's COM lifts a good bit just by swinging the club to the top. That's plenty of lifting "help" to generate serious speed from the drop when applied correctly. The Tour pros lower their bodies more in the backswing, than they do in the downswing. That tells you how much COM lift there is just from swinging the arms and club to the top. ZERO need to lift the body in the backswing to take advantage of physics 🙂

[@juanbotha6634]

Can you please do a video on side bends in tue swing? So many videos out there that encourages side bend and I would like to know how this correlates to turn.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

It's in the works as we speak. It's actually our next PRO's vs AM's video. It is going to be quite the eye-opener considering what many folks are trying to or being taught to do. Stay tuned 🤓

[@juanbotha6634]

@@AthleticMotionGolf great minds think alike. 😂. Ive always struggled with less space in my downswing which causes me to have to stand up. I dont think things like pushing buds back or forcing massive side bends will fix this.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@juanbotha6634 haha. Yeah what’s causing that is typically happening much sooner than you see the lift.

[@juanbotha6634]

Thanks. When are you posting videos again of your live lessons? They were really good as they were about things a general golfer struggles with.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@juanbotha6634 we’re doing those each month in our new membership. I’m not sure when our next one will be on YT.

[@xwaleze]

Bravo...

[@JoseMusa-ww1kc]

I am trying to stop cupping my wrist on the top of the swing. Can please help with this issue. Thanks

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

If a dead flat wrist is 0 degrees, cupping is positive degrees, and bowing is negative degrees - what do you think the avg number is for a tour pro?

[@justinhenthorn1043]

-5 degrees

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@justinhenthorn1043 way off 😉

[@psycho8771]

It's probably like +1 or 2 +2 since a lot of pros have more cup than bow on average

[@jamesbriggsgolf6212]

@@AthleticMotionGolf I’m gonna go with +8 given we start with a bit at address

[@davidmeeks7449]

Amazing. So many times the fix is the opposite of what players think.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

So true! What a game 🤬🤪

[@randydover3370]

I call that driving the divot forward.

[@ahkau4612]

Maybe do a V2 of the video. The messaging didnt seem too clear.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@ahkau4612 what was unclear for you?

[@cubfan69kmz85]

Guys, in theory I totally understand what needs to be done. In practice, however, when I do it in front of a mirror slowly I feel like I am going into extension on both sides in the downswing. I hit some balls this morning and though I didn’t go near as slow as I should have I was having a heck of a time getting my left hip to the wall. Backswing looks ok. Path looks ok. I don’t no. 🤷‍♂️

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

At the risk of soundly like Capt Obvious, that’s what practice is for 😉. If I told you I had a salad for lunch yesterday but I really didn’t see any changes to my belly when I woke up this morning, what would your advice be? 🙂. Many of the habits we create in our swings won’t be unnoticed right away. But that doesn’t mean the work isn’t helping.

[@cubfan69kmz85]

@@AthleticMotionGolfabsolutely correct! 😊I am a grinder, but my problem is I want to learn everything yesterday. Thanks for the reminder. 🤘 👊

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@cubfan69kmz85 right there with you! 😆

[@pieman2010]

This is the biggest difference between amateurs and pros in my opinion. When I learned to flex the right hip it was like magic.

[@carolinamountainliving7501]

The example used looks like Scottie Scheffler

[@Y_M1967]

In the words of the infamous Kevin Shields “ under turned, stall and dump is no good” from the Manzella forum circa 2009. Hahahahahahahahaha

[@gregn7868]

I have a hard time feeling how the trail knee extends, the trail hip extends, the lead side does the opposite, and yet we end up with our pelvis tilted towards the ball. I know its correct, just difficult to feel dynamic like a real swing.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Which part of the swing are you referencing?

[@gregn7868]

@@AthleticMotionGolf downswing

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

@@gregn7868 the trail knee bends not extends in the DS👍

[@GoatZPLN]

My hips move about 1” closer to ball in backswing- and stay right there on down swing - can’t fix- watch all your vids 900,000x … +2.5 hdcp

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Do you feel that negatively affecting your shots or hindering your consistency?

[@Ibizassini]

Seems like the right knee never reflexes from P4 but continuous extension!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Knee flex is supper tough to see in 2D. Starting at P4, then to 5, 6 and 7 his right knee goes - 19, 21, 25, 28. He falls in the mid to lowish end of the "good" range, but his left/right bend ratio is right on the money. Meaning, the knees cross (hit the same flex) at the right time, and then he has 2:1 bend at impact.

[@PetSKi67]

And a flying elbow!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

That's just how the trail arm graphics look. The players aren't flying elbows like that. The measurements aren't take from the graphics 🙂

[@wonderjesus]

Lads this is beyond genius

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Thank you!

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

👊🤓

[@Profrominglewood1]

player 2 brooks keopka

[@garychristianson3881]

Proper extension by default cant be eary extension so you never need extrnsion that is too early

[@chongannyap7562]

Whilst this is high level biomechanical analysis for the DS movement, for majority of club golfers watching this, this method to "early extend" the Right hip is risky for many as the THRUSTING of the hips will decrease the SPACE on the right during the DS, which invariably result in him standing up and raising his shaft and causing toe hits.

[@AthleticMotionGolf]

Standing up and raising the shaft happens when the trail hip stays back. The right side coming through is what allows impact to happen on the trail side - a hallmark of good impacts 🤓

[@patrickwheeler7107]

Because you arm swing. Stay relaxed you won’t early extend.

[@stevetanikawa8891]

I have a laser attached to the butt of my club. Do you have a video showing the desired path a laser at the end of the club should point to.