The Imprisoning War - Downfall Timeline - Zelda Lore

[@ZeldaLore]

Huge thanks to Zeltik for providing the footage of Link dying in ocarina of Time 3D!

[@GooberBoi6000]

Why did you say it like that😭

[@collimruckman136]

Never thought this would be relevant until now

[@FreedomAndPeaceOnly]

_" Zelda needs a Hero~ !!!_ _... and he's gotta be fast and he's gotta be tough but he is taking a 100 years nap! "_

[@seratonyn]

Wake him up already >_

[@ladiesfirst9030]

Year

[@feminhodiniz]

Comming here after Tear of the Kingdom just be assure that they are two totally different Imprisoning Wars.

[@xscythe67]

Not just 2.... 5 or 6

[@RevanMartinez]

When I was a kid my friends and I wondered SO MUCH about this. A link to the past was the most recent game out back then.

[@lilaznnboi]

seems like foreshadowing for Tears of the Kingdom

[@TheBreadPirate]

I'm glad I was able to stumble upon this channel! You did a good job at explaining a really complicated part of the lore.

[@ZeldaLore]

Trust me, it was hard to write the script due to the amount of inconsistencies and retcons xD I had to consult a friend who also studies the lore deeply to fact check several information. Thanks for watching! I'm glad you enjoyed the video!

[@TheBreadPirate]

@@ZeldaLore Dear Lord! I'm glad not to have to deal with that in my videos. 😅 You have my respect!

[@ZeldaLore]

@@TheBreadPirate don't get me wrong, it's a lot of fun!

[@neomp5]

sounds like it would make a good hyrule warriors game

[@darthsidious8596]

The most intriguing part of Zelda lore.

[@psychoapplesauceeater8562]

Who’s here after Tears of The Kingdom? May 1, 2023 2:32pm

[@strife9878]

that was a deep cut ... Didn't see anyone predict that in their theories 😂. Hope the ending breaks the cycle , some purists are not gonna like that 😂

[@Djnightmare14]

Wow gotta love me some leaked game play

[@jarrodbautista5521]

Dude I knew the Imprisoning war sounded very familliar it was from A link to the past

[@Red1Green2Blue3]

Another lorelol from nintendo unfortunately

[@DJHaze36]

Refreshing my memory for TOTK! 😀

[@ericknovamx]

Who's here after totk?👀

[@SeanRaine]

whose here for a spoiler free explanation after the beginning of totk?

[@fionnhealy8583]

Take a drink every time he says “of time”

[@MrJmZack]

Excellent work, ZL!

[@ZeldaLore]

Thank you!!!

[@MrJmZack]

@@ZeldaLore you're welcome~

[@59rlmccormack]

Marvelous job, love the dramatic final boss music!

[@Masterpain33]

I never actually played Zelda heavy until BotW. So this timeline is my favorite and first. Will go back and play the old ones after Tears

[@yunzhaomusic]

Underrated Channel...

[@ZeldaLore]

Thank you!

[@maksimilijan5029]

I transcribed a speech from a video by another youtuber talkin' about Four Swords Adventure, that pretty much sums it up: "This was originally going to be the Imprisoning War game... Now I imagine that some of you out there gonna respond with "?"... And some of you but I imagine some of you out there gonna have the same reaction I did when I first found out this news which was (Heartbreaking) Because that would have been so awesome - those who don't know the Imprisoning War was the big hole in the Zelda timeline and they they were deliberately leaving it open see here's the thing in official canon - Ocarina of Time is the Imprisoning War -they may change all that in the future but that's how it is right now - but it doesn't actually line up. Ocarina of Rime does not fully fit all the pieces of the Imprisoning War as we are told it and that is always bugged the theorists and fans of this timeline like myself, so this game now actually becoming the Imprisoning War and fully connecting Ocarina to this - to Link to the past would have been perfect it would have filled in all of those blanks and really showcased so much... It was going to be awesome... Now... and then the problem is Miyamoto came in and said it was like, I almost don't believe it - he said "it was too complicated" he said "the story was too complicated get rid of the story" what ensued is the story of Four Swords Adventures - which if you really analyze it is all over the place... Now there's some really good stuff here story wise that I'll be talking about that but the reason it's so inconsistent with itself is because half the story for this being the Imprisoning War was already written and they just kind of adapted that to the new story in order to accommodate his frankly draconian whims. Now I know there's gonna be people out there that disagree with me on this but again this was something they were already doing this is something they were getting ready well in advance [...] and again was a perfect puzzle piece for the Zelda franchise and instead he just kicked it out. Now - less story, too complicated ... What?, I want to smack you, Miyamoto! [...] Because simply if you play this game you see so many of the pieces of the imprisoning war in here the advancement of Ganondorf into again and the the adding of the Trident to the equation and it's connection to the Twilight which I'll talk about later the imprisonment of him by the maidens who are who effectively are the sages you know all of these pieces are in place I digress... I suppose there's one other thing I'm gonna mention here because it is relevant more so here than it was in Minish Cap originally the four sword we had reforged and then empowered, was gonna be the Master Sword. The original purpose for Minish Cap was not just to tell the origin story of all of Hyrule but of the Master Sword itself and if you think about it that really makes all those puzzle pieces just lying right over the place because especially with this game if you imagine it's the Master Sword instead of the Four Sword you really starts to see show how this was the Imprisoning War and how this would fit basically perfectly into the Zelda timeline but, instead it's the odd man out... Because the four sword is a completely different sword it's only used three times, technically two times that actually matter and these two times... It is then basically forgotten and never looked at again because Miyamoto insisted it not be the Master Sword..."

[@MetZelRio]

I'm guessing you're going to get a big influx of viewers on this video...

[@ZeldaLore]

It's already begun XD

[@baroslair9378]

Great video! I have a small problem at 4:00 though... While I normally don't follow the books because of their mistakes, the book says this on page 93: "The Knights of Hyrule are a clan that protect the Royal Family, their members descended from the Hero who governed the Crest of Courage." They seem to have mixed the pendant (crest in Japanese) as the crest of the Triforce of Courage, but they seemingly imply that the Hero of Time had descendants, known as the Knights of Hyrule!

[@ZeldaLore]

The hero of time couldn't have had descendants in the downfall timeline if he died.

[@baroslair9378]

@@ZeldaLore that's my point! He's only stated to have been "defeated" or "lost"! Not "died". I'm not sure if the Japanese says that he dies, though.

[@Cretaceous158]

Or it was that the Kokiri Emerald was actually brought to the forest by Link's mother, and originally belonged to the knights.

[@liamfowell8661]

Just being picky here, but I don't think Link did actually awaken Roaru. It was Roaru that set link on his quest to awaken the rest of the Sages.

[@InhabitantOfOddworld]

It's almost like you could predict Tears of the Kingdom

[@DCul]

​@@InhabitantOfOddworldI thought the same thing lol

[@darthsidious8596]

One correction: The corrupted Sacred Realm in the adult portion of OOT isn’t the same entity as the Dark World. The Dark World was created when Ganon got the complete Triforce after defeating Link and beginning the Downfall Timeline. The Triforce itself states that Ganon’s wish created the Dark World.

[@ZeldaLore]

The wish was retconned as far as I'm aware. The sacred realm according to current canon will transform into the dark world if the heart of the one who enters it is wicked or unbalanced.

[@darthsidious8596]

Zelda Lore The Sacred Realm did indeed become a realm full of monsters as a reflection of Ganondorf’s heart, but that doesn’t mean it was a duplicate of Hyrule or that it change people’s forms.

[@ZeldaLore]

@@darthsidious8596 the sacred realm became a dark world that reflected Ganon's darkest desires, it was a mirror of what Hyrule would look like under the rule of the Demon King. That's why it looked similar to the Light World and Hyrule.

[@firionkaiser8291]

@@darthsidious8596 The Sacred Realm did become the Dark World. The only reason why it is the way it is in ALBW is because Link restored it in ALttP. Plus think about it, Ganondorf was sealed in Sacred Realm with the full triforce, and it's confirmed in ALttP that during the Imprisoning War everyone knew the location of the triforce which was the Sacred Realm however they didn't know it became the Dark World which transformed them.

[@erikabutler6893]

@@ZeldaLore A way of retconning it while allowing for some consistency of both stories, would probably be that the Sacred Realm began to take on its Dark World appearance when Ganondorf entered it. However, Ganondorf's wish on the Triforce is what causes people's forms to change when they enter the Dark World. The manual's description of the Moon Pearl, which prevents Link from having his body changed when he enters the Dark World, is that it "protects its bearer from the power of the Triforce". So it must be the Triforce's action that is causing people to change forms. In OoT, however, we don't see people's forms changing by simply entering the Sacred Realm, so what must have happened is that Ganon's wish caused the Triforce to take on that operation.

[@Nickname10344]

And opened the Door of Time within the Temple of Time using the Song of Time by playing the Ocarina of Time. Link pulled the Master Sword from the Pedestal of Time and was sealed in the Temple of Light in the Sacred Realm.

[@ZeldaLore]

Hahaha. It's even better when you realize that the Master Sword is also called the "Sword of Time" xD

[@jeffdcgamer1077]

Makes me wonder watching tears of the kingdom the imprisoned war story was A bit altered with the zonai involved makes me curious for A link to the past remake with the zonai in the future

[@jeezed2950]

Opening the door of Time inside the temple of Time with the song of Time by playing it with the Ocarina of Time, in the game called Ocarina of time.

[@ZeldaLore]

To obtain the Sword of Time placed in the Pedestal of Time to travel through time

[@bdhuffman42]

Great video. One note though... I don't believe that Ganon's wish from ALttP was rewritten by OoT. Whenever Ganon kills Link, he takes his and Zelda's pieces of the Triforce to make his wish.

[@ZeldaLore]

While this video focuses on the interpretation by Hyrule Historia and Encyclopedia, I am actually in complete disagreement with the timeline placements and a lot of the book (they were created by a third party and the books contradict a lot of information in the games as they are the writers interpretations, which they mention in Encyclopedia on page 8). ALTTP's backstory and OoT are too differently for ALTTP to be considered a "sequel" in the direct sense (for example Ganondorf claims the full Triforce when he enters the sacred realm in ALTTP and becomes Ganon then while in OOT it splits). I see the events of the imprisoning war and Ocarina of Time as parallel events, not taking place in the same continuity, and both having unique yet similar events playing out.

[@ladiesfirst9030]

@@ZeldaLore then why are you using them as sources

[@ZeldaLore]

@@ladiesfirst9030 that's the great dillema. The books, currently, are regarded as "canon". If I ignore them entirely (trust me, I want to) I wouldn't be covering everything. The issue specially comes with the Timeline. We are given one in the books, but it's wrong in so many levels. Yet we are told it's "canon". That's the main complication I have when making my videos TBH

[@ZeldaLore]

@@ladiesfirst9030 the general rule with those books is that the games ALWAYS come first, and the books are merely the interpretations of the writers, which are a third party, which Nintendo just accepted without reading them through thoroughly or editing them. Nintendo could easily release a new book in the future which could render Historia and Encyclopedia obsolete. I do want to note that I did make the mistake in the past of using the books as supplementary Canon to the games, when the games must and always will come first. All that is in the books that is not in the games must be regarded as "ambiguously canon".

[@firionkaiser8291]

​@@ZeldaLore To be fair Nintendo never said ALttP was a direct sequel, all they said was that OoT was a prequel to ALttP. Though yes they did say it was supposed to be about the Imprisoning War, they did end up placing it before that. Here's the thing, taking every word as gospel in Zelda, you're gonna find problems. The series itself is known for either changing info or being completely wrong from an in universe perspective (Like how we were told the sages made the Master Sword, but come to find out it was SS Link who made it). It's the main reason why I don't mind the Historia's downfall timeline inclusion. It keeps Nintendo's desire as having OoT being the origin of ALttP's Ganon, it keeps the involvement of the OoT sages which Aonuma himself stated that their involvement in OoT led to the towns in Zelda II being named after them (this was stated long before HH too) and it still paves the way for ALttP. We have no idea if the OoT sages were ever involved outside of this point. Its a legend, so everything not meshing in together is completely fine. It's just one interpretation of a whole story. Even ALBW fused elements of OoT, IW, ALttP, and some other new event while completely forgetting about OoX. Hell even Nintendo made a timeline specifically for ALBW, with OoT coming before ALttP and having ALBW put after LA.

[@RobertChambers1522]

I don't think Ganon obtaining the full Triforce was retconned in OoT, and that the Downfall Timeline was created specifically to avoid that retcon and have a situation in which Ganondorf can obtain the full Triforce, given that both are canon. We just don't have a version of OoT where we see Link fail other than facing a game-over screen. But what would have caused the event that Link is defeated? More time-travel shenanigans?

[@koiyune]

game: take a drink every time he says "time"

[@KBXband]

I always thought that the "imprisoning war" was the entirety of Ocarina of Time. Makes sense. The seven sages seal Ganon away after he touched the Triforce.

[@ZeldaLore]

It was supposed to originally. Ocarina of Time was meant to be a retelling of the imprisoning war detailed in A Link to the Past. But as they continued with development, they continued to change and alter the story to the point it literally contradicted the events of ALTTP's manual. The seven sages from Ocarina were named after the towns of The Adventure of Link to show thr passage of time for example, and the Zora early on were the green monster variety (and there's even concept art of that too!) Despite the lore and story contradictions, it seemed they wanted ALTTP to follow the adult timeline following Ganondorf's sealing. But then they made the wind waker. Historia then attempted to try to fit ALTTP in by altering the events and having Link get defeated. I personally don't like that, but this video follows the Historia and Encyclopedia timeline of events. I did make a video fixing the Zelda timeline if you are interested, and I go into detail over all this!

[@darthsidious8596]

I enjoyed this. Excellent narration.

[@ZeldaLore]

Im glad you liked it!

[@EtaM29]

So there are two different wars - this imprisoning war which is actually likely the second imprisoning war because of its placement after OoT. - the first imprisoning war which is in TOTK, takes place not to far after SS which imprisons what is very likely the original ganondorf who is trapped under hyrule.

[@ZeldaLore]

Most wars in the series can be categorized as an imprisoning war (Seal War in Japanese). The war of Hylia vs Demise for example is also an Imprisoning/Seal War where Demise was Imprisoned/Sealed as the Imprisoned/Sealed One. I don't believe the events of the past of TOTK to be before OOT at all, but loooong after all the games after the Hyrule we knew fell and was forgotten from memory, and a new one created by Rauru was founded with him as it's first king.

[@xscythe67]

There are 5 or 6 versions of the Imprisoning War

[@zakzerak7191]

Ur Videos are incredible keep up the good work :)

[@ZeldaLore]

Thanks!!!

[@GalacticStarForge42]

You have really good videos, keep them up.

[@ZeldaLore]

Thank you!!

[@sanicguy4145]

Tears of the kingdom has really confused me on this. Are the sages in LTtP the same as the ones in TToK or is the name just a reference.

[@jeffdcgamer1077]

Probably the same from lttp like the descendent of the sages from ocarina of time

[@sethmooseknuckle]

The sages in lttp were all hylian. Unfortunately over 600 years passed between the imprisoning war and lttp. However totk flipped everything on its head and made almost this whole timeline non canon. Afterall its hard to kill a dude over and over if hes actually been sealed this whole time. The triforce? Nope not a thing anymore. Ganon having the triforce and his whole goal of getting it. Nope never happened. The sacred realm and dark world? Nope dude was sealed under the castle and it never happened. Its a shame what nintendo did to this timeline. As a lore buff im extremely disappointed in this move. To just axe so many games and events that people grew up with is insane.

[@jeffdcgamer1077]

@@sethmooseknuckle My guy how right you're are 100%, it's sad honesty because how hype we were when we found out that Ganondolf was returning to find out this isn't the same guy who ruled Hyrule before with A iron fist some people look at it not A big deal but to us OG hardcore Zelda fans the lore is what held us together and made the franchise legendary.

[@InhabitantOfOddworld]

I mean, to be honest, the "lore" was already pretty terrible. The concept of the "Decline Timeline" is bad because it only relies on Link (the player) dying. Firstly, that's not part of the OoT story in the same way that the Child and Adult timelines are, and secondly, it's a cheap cop-out. Why is a new timeline not created anytime Link dies? Why does every game not have a "Link Died" timeline branch off at every opportunity? I never really understood why Nintendo decided to mess around with time in the first place, beyond the fact they wanted to relegate the 2D games to one continuity and create another to justify Wind Waker. Either way, nearly all lore needs a reboot once it gets messy. Marvel's done it, DC's done it. It only makes sense that after what, 15+ games, they would start looking at a reset.

[@InhabitantOfOddworld]

​​​@@sethmooseknuckle While they were hylian in ALttP, OoT changed them into their respective races. The only thing ToTK is changing in that respect is making Rauru a Zonai, but he's the only one named AFAIK, so the ToTK could be a different set of sages, like how ALttP and OoT sages aren't the same, and Rauru's name being just a reference

[@Enat1510]

There are more ways to be defeated than to die in 1v1 combat. The downfall timeline is a timeline where Link never even managed to reach Ganondorf and had to abandon it by going to the past, changing events there (Bottom of the Well/Desert Colossus) and thus create a new timeline where he can be victorious.

[@NottyDuder]

My problem with "Ganon defeats link in the final battle which causes the downfall timeline" is that it would imply that Link must have defeated Koume and Kotake to get to the final battle. They are alive in the downfall timeline so Link even making it to the final battle doesn't make sense to me. Make it make sense please

[@RetroGoosen-ux8ty]

The Demon King will return

[@soloknight7197]

Tears of the Kingdom retconned this

[@ZeldaLore]

Different events

[@soloknight7197]

@@ZeldaLore honestly it was a missed opportunity

[@elder_sphinx7846]

​@@ZeldaLore yeah but now there's two Ganon dorfs.

[@jeffdcgamer1077]

They kinda botched the lore my best bet tears of the kingdom and botw is actually take place from A alternate timeline of the downfall timeline

[@IsaiahSalvagno]

The hero of time Opened the door of time within the temple of time using the song of time by playing the ocarina of time and pulled the sword from the pedestal of time 😂😂 jeez what a mouth full.

[@ZeldaLore]

And the sword is also known as the "Sword of time" too xD

[@KingdomKing13]

Just in time

[@hobbyjapon3172]

Thank for french translation !

[@plooper14]

So that was the imprisoning war…

[@GoreGutztheImpaler]

Zelda talks about the imprisoning war by name at the begining of TOTK think it confirms the downfall timeline?

[@ZeldaLore]

It's a completely different event, which just shares the name as a callback to ALTTP, but it is unrelated in its entirety.

[@NotARussianDisinfoBot]

Well, cool. I was wondering what the heck Zelda was talking about.

[@ScorchtheHawk]

This ain’t what she was talking about

[@NotARussianDisinfoBot]

​@@ScorchtheHawk Yeah I've been piecing that together myself as well.

[@annoyingbookgirl]

So is any of this connected to totk?

[@jacktwelve1710]

Nope, this is for a link to the past.

[@jasonofa3633]

Totk's event of the same name makes me think that BOTW and TOTK is set on a different timeline from what Nintendo has given us. It's not part of the SS timeline, nor the branching three timelines. I'm guessing this is rebooted timeline.

[@ajwsings]

Nah, either there's 2 Imprisoning Wars or it's a retcon for the conflict of that name to be earlier (or later, depending on what theory you believe)

[@TMM3rd]

I have a theory, I think Both “Breath of the Wild” , and “Tears of the Kingdom” , take place in a complete parallel universe, or a timeline that got split way, way after the events of Skyward Sword, around the time the Kingdom was founded.

[@jeffdcgamer1077]

My thoughts exactly even tho they talks about the imprisonment war the story still feels off

[@LinkLovesCrawfish]

Funny the gods were actually zonai fhe whole time

[@mrk_g6499]

I’m not a fan of the split timeline. I love the lore but it makes no sense to me and the timeline has always been up for interpretation. I choose to believe all games take place in one timeline with a huge amount of time between every game.

[@red20753]

The split timeline is absolutely necessary for Twilight Princess and The Wind Waker to exist And it's not that hard to understand either, i don't know what "makes no sense"

[@mrk_g6499]

@@red20753 to me there supposed to be legends not multiverses

[@Asfgxff]

00:20 False. It was created if link fell to Gannon after the battle with Gannondorf.

[@ZeldaLore]

Ganondorf defeats Link, steals the Triforce piece from Link and Zelda, and becomes Ganon.

[@kingdaniel3519]

Ocarina of Time is the Imprisoning War, not something separate that followed later. The Imprisoning War describes the events depicted in OoT.

[@ZeldaLore]

No, the imprisoning war was an event that happened after Ocarina of Time. Ganondorf obtained the triforce in Ocarina, but the war came after the game if Link died, as mentioned in the video. This is canon

[@kingdaniel3519]

@@ZeldaLore I had to look again and you're correct. My mistake.

[@ZeldaLore]

@@kingdaniel3519 no worries. This part of the timeline is very confusing. So many contradictions and retcons xD

[@darthsidious8596]

Zelda Lore Shortly after OOT’s release, one of OOT’s developers said that OOT “deals with” the Imprisoning War and that they had Ganon turn into a pig at the end of OOT as a wink to that, althought Miyamoto gave didn’t insist on it. For a long time, fans debated the meaning of that interview, and then Hyrule Historia finally explained it.

[@sethmooseknuckle]

This is non canon now. And every game where we fought ganon in this timeline never happened thanks to totk.

[@thegamingjelly1719]

I mean, did Twilight Princess make this and the Adult Timeline non-canon? Did Spirit Tracks make this and the Child Timeline non-canon? All it means is that either BotW+ takes place so unfathomably long after everything else that it just doesn't matter which events happened (which is what I personally believe), or the Adult Timeline is the timeline in which BotW+ happens.

[@sethmooseknuckle]

@@thegamingjelly1719 those timelines arent connected so your logic is flawed. Secondly it doesnt matter how long in the future this is. If this game destroys existing canon then those games never happened. Use your brain. By the way totk and botw are in the downfall timeline in case your grey matter couldnt process that.

[@thegamingjelly1719]

@@sethmooseknuckle Not even gonna take the time to debate it if you're just going to throw out insults. You just lose instantly like that.

[@sethmooseknuckle]

@@thegamingjelly1719 Think what you wish. It doesnt matter. I lose i guess. But the lore is still screwed.

[@Cretaceous158]

Different Imprisoning war and different Ganondorf.