The Interborough Express - A New Subway Line, Or Not?

[@mmhoss]

It's a shame that tunneling is so prohibitively expensive. If it weren't, the MTA could get this connected to SIR and run it all the way to the Bronx under MNR. Then it'd actually connect all the outer boroughs. Imagine that, the MTA being legitimately ambitious for once in our lifetimes. What a sight that would be

[@MysticTransit]

I think if there is enough demand, and push for it by those who live on the island, it could definitely happen in the future.

[@alexandreguttmann7757]

​@@MysticTransit I totally agree but the big obstacle with such a project is the soil content in the Narrows being too loose and soft for tunnel construction. It is probably doable but insanely more expensive than say even the Gateway tunnel between manhattan and new jersey.

[@domineeksanford8043]

@@alexandreguttmann7757 🤔🤔🤔

[@thedabbingslurpee6780]

They could maybe build a track on the bridge that connects Brooklyn and Staten Island

[@brownguy51]

@@thedabbingslurpee6780 unrealistic

[@BritishBeachcomber]

It's about time NY spent some serious money on the subway. The London Tube, light rail and tram system has been under continuous improvement for decades.

[@bonda_racing3579]

We don't have trams in nyc your best bet is a bus getting you between train stops.

[@taxesv1nce142]

They already spend big money on the subway, the problem is that usually the money goes into fancy stations instead of improving the often unreliable and terrible system that we already have.

[@PeterHKwok]

@@taxesv1nce142 We can forget the Tube, remember that Russia has a smaller economy than New York State alone and Russia's public transportation all around is so much better than anywhere in New York, Nizhny Novgorod / Gorky wipes the floor with the MTA's various underfunded public transit services

[@taxesv1nce142]

Note that at for two years the commissioner of transport for London was a former MTA President.

[@CraigFThompson]

And London doesn't stay in operation the entire day either....

[@leonardheiden]

I would love to see an extension or a branch to LaGuardia running above the freeway, like the AirTrain on Van Wijk. A one-seat ride to the airport from Brooklyn would be great.

[@qjtvaddict]

No need just extend the Astoria line and use that from Astoria

[@sygneg7348]

@@qjtvaddict Except for the fact that Astoria residents are incredibly stupid and when the MTA actually tried to create a connection to LGA Airport via the Astoria line Astoria residents revolted against it and set up expensive lawsuits which made the MTA too scared to continue the project.

[@quanbrooklynkid7776]

@@sygneg7348 damn

[@CraigFThompson]

@@qjtvaddict Except that they'd all hafta go into Manhattan....

[@murdelabop]

Extending this line into the Bronx is such a no-brainer that I'm surprised it isn't part of the plan from the outset.

[@CaseysTrains]

Problem is, CSX and Amtrak share the Hell Gate Bridge and with Penn Access happen, the Bridge will have little roam for any other kind of transit. If it was part of the Regional Rail/Commuter Rail Network like MNRR is, they could get away with possibly sharing the line but then you have the question of where is it going to terminate because there isn't much room to put turn around tracks or seperate platforms. So that probably why The Bronx was cut.

[@banksrail]

@@CaseysTrains You’re right. The Bridge does have room for 4 tracks and is only triple tracked which could offer some more space and time slots. The problem is, is that there is no way their going to run service with 8 minute intervals over that bridge 😭.

[@qolspony]

@@banksrail What's wrong with the bridge? And why can't it be 15 intervals as a compromise?

[@banksrail]

@@qolspony as the other comment I replied to promptly addressed. The Penn Access project is already underway. That will most like push the time slots available for the Bridge to it’s limits. This project wouldn’t even make it across the bridge. The best choice is to have it connect to LGA along the Freeway.

[@brmnyc]

@@CaseysTrains The Hell Gate Bridge has room for four tracks. One track was removed years ago. I believe Amtrak only uses two. I don't know if the third track is currently used by either Amtrak of for freight.

[@AutumnLeavey]

I live by the Roosevelt ave stop and this would change my life, the g is great but there’s so many stops it takes forever

[@TrainsFerriesFeet]

I can't believe this has taken so long; there's needed to be direct train connections between Brooklyn and Queens for decades.

[@landocalrisian2014]

Yo, sidenote, like the background music in this video. I think this line should be done. It would make many ppl lives easier.

[@TheStarswearee]

As a bronxite i wish it went to the bronx, as I could get to queens mroe easily.

[@DavidJohnson-dp4vv]

Because that actually fucking makes sense. Do you think commuters in Singapore, Shanghai, Hong Kong, Tokyo or Londond have to go downtown to take the subway to the outlying areas. Hell even DC is building the purple line in Maryland.

[@CraigFThompson]

@@michaelmorales1475 And just WHERE would the MNRR line terminate?!

[@EndIessProductions]

⁠@@CraigFThompsonwhat did he say?

[@nah_144]

If this became a commuter rail, It may cause a commence in a commuter rail modernization project where fairs will be simplified, seating in trains will be Longitudinal and transversal and frequency could increase. This would be great!

[@MysticTransit]

I never even thought about that. That would be a huge benefit should this appear as a Commuter/Regional Rail Line.

[@erikkrauss8481]

More like EU or JP

[@EpicThe112]

@@erikkrauss8481 Which EU route choices are 3 doors double-decker train Paris France KVB signals 55-76cm height S-Bahn Rhein-Ruhr Hagen Wuppertal Dortmund Germany

[@erikkrauss8481]

@@EpicThe112 huh?

[@RideoutB]

I explore the tracks frequently (lots of entrances) and it would be much cheaper to convert it into LIRR Or metro north, there are places in which they could easily add stations, however these old stations were rebuilt into buildings making it near impossible to revive some of the abandoned stations When it comes to transfers to other train lines there could EASILY be a transfer to the N given the tracks are near connected at some points, but for trains like the f it would be more difficult as there’s a grocery store where the station would be, for the Q it wouldn’t be too hard they would just have to knock down the abandoned MTA electrical facility to make room for connections, for the 2/5 trains it’s impossible but given the MTAs budget it’ll prob be commuter rail

[@Railoffroader2]

Any businesses in the way of station locations- Eminent domain. 👈🏻 See Ya!

[@josephshields2922]

The Flatbush station was torn down to build the Phillip Howard Apartments.

[@jimwacker6582]

What the Bronx really needs is east-west rail.

[@Railoffroader2]

@@jimwacker6582 Ahyup!

[@DDELE7]

The project could force the MTA to rebuild the Flatbush Avenue Terminal to add storage tracks for the 2 & 5 and future proofing for any expansion of IRT Nostrand Avenue service down to Sheepshead Bay. One idea is maybe building a new station beneath the old one. Expensive, yes but it would need to be done in order to avoid the Bay Ridge Branch right of way.

[@Dan_isreal.08]

Also can’t forget the fact that there was passenger service on the Bay Ridge Branch until 1924 operated by the LIRR, so tbh it would make sense to have it as a LIRR city terminal zone line

[@andyrob3259]

I think this is an excellent idea and when implemented people will always wonder why it didn’t happen earlier and in fact want it extended. As someone that has lived overseas these sort of lines are great for cross city transport and eliminate needless travel into and out of the city.

[@thenyctransitguy]

I’m greatful for this video I’m a 100% with the IBX, question would be possible that we can collaborate our resources and do a full documentary on the IBX?

[@jbcali1274]

The bronx to staten island without going through Manhattan would be amazing. There is an unfinished tunnel that was made from Brooklyn to Staten island in the early 1900s .Its 100 feet long but itsca start

[@jacobshraybman8720]

Living in Brooklyn, I have dealt with issues going to other parts of the borough such as bay ridge. I think this would be a great addition to the transit system. I just hope it wouldn't take too long to complete.

[@MysticTransit]

If all goes well, the project *should* be completed around the same time SAS Phase 2 is completed.

[@mikevanriel7573]

@@MysticTransitLook how long it took to build phase 1 of the Second Avenue Line.

[@CraigFThompson]

@@mikevanriel7573 SSHHHEEEITT! Look at how long the city has PROMISED that there'd even be a 2nd Avenue line before they actually started construction!!

[@stevenroshni1228]

Interesting idea to have it be a Metro North expansion which might help the possible scheduling constraints of why the current plan doesn't go to the Bronx. I think SIR rolling stock having it be a subway is best for cost and consistency.

[@qjtvaddict]

Through running

[@danielchou5895]

Metro North expansion is never going to happen. Metro North is already progressing with the Penn Access Project which runs over the Hell Gate Bridge which makes the Metro North expansion literally useless and a waste of money.

[@qjtvaddict]

@@danielchou5895 no it doesn’t extra connections can be added over 125th manhattan and south Bronx to the rest of metro north. The Penn station access won’t be frequent anyway more excuses are stupid stop making them

[@adamrubinstein3015]

Extend it through Staten Island via reactivated north shore line to the NEC at Elizabeth, perhaps terminating at Newark Penn Station. Extend Hudson Bergen Light Rail south to interchange with IBX at Port Richmond

[@adamrubinstein3015]

This would also create a direct connection to EWR

[@edwardmiessner6502]

Although I am not from NYC I'm thinking, don't build it as light rail, tram, or BRT. Build it either as a subway, commuter or regional rail, or a hybrid like the SIR. A commuter or regional rail or an SIR-like hybrid could be extended across Hell's Gate due to FRA compliant trains. So can a subway if it's converted. Light rail, trams, and BRT cannot.

[@MysticTransit]

I think a hybrid Regional Rail/Subway Line would definitely be the best option. Maybe not a full Commuter Rail Line because; 1. You would be sacrificing capacity, & 2. Passengers would need to get used to a new form of transit, despite it having the same fare as a subway.

[@musicforaarre]

Screw FRA Compliant. Make 2 separate subway tracks on the north side of the bridge (put the 4th track back in), and keep them separate from the south 2 Amtrak tracks. Please read my comment above. Aarre Peltomaa

[@edwardmiessner6502]

@@musicforaarre I am sure that there’s an engineering reason why there are 3 existing railroad tracks on the Hell's Gate Bridge and not 2 - my guess is to accommodate the rail traffic. To put 2 regular subway tracks on it you'll need space for 5 tracks and a crash wall, or a separate deck. With a SIR like railway you might get away with 4.

[@CraigFThompson]

@@edwardmiessner6502 Two tracks are for Amtrak, and one is for freight. There's an empty trackway for a fourth track.

[@pbatommy]

Running it as a commuter rail line under the LIRR would be the best bet. Trying to run it as a subway line would become a regulatory nightmare.

[@gregodessite]

LIRR seems the best, also, it's possible to reinstroduce passenger service on Lower Montauk branch, so ... it will be possible to have one seat ride form Bay Ridge/ Borough Park/ Midwood / etc to Jamaica

[@youss3403]

I Think its better off a Subway Line, Since it looks better as one, and LIRR Owning it will also be a nightmare, I Think This "New Line" Should Have R160s Running Along it, As Theres no point in making it a commuter rail if its making local stops

[@gregodessite]

@@youss3403 I would agree to any mode of operation, just let trains go! I live in Sheepshead Bay, my best friends live in Bay Ridge not far from Brooklyn Army Terminal. It's miserable to travel my transit, the last time - I took Uber.

[@rockyrockafella8527]

@@youss3403 I don't think those tracks are electrified, so they would need a diesel engine to pull them.

[@youss3403]

@@rockyrockafella8527 True, But You can Add A 3 Rail Onto The tracks, AND If you look at track map, It’s there, But the problem is, The tracks go into 1 and Go back into 2 and continue

[@michaelmorales1475]

Whatever it ends up being, I just hope it actually happens, and ends up being very helpful.

[@CraigFThompson]

Just as long as it's NOT a BUSWAY....

[@vincentguzman7056]

Yo the background music is fire

[@MysticTransit]

Glad you think so. It's Lofi music.

[@TranscendentAzure89]

Really great explanation of the different options available and what could be done with the line overall! I can't lie, a part of me still kinda feels like just on Keep It Simple Stupid principles and my own inherent bias, that this line should just be a subway line just because its the easiest way to have all the "linkage" and fare concerns addressed by maintaining parity with what already goes on in the MTA subway system for normies like me (that and I just really like subways lol). What's more, the region being served by this should be catered to in a way where it doesn't alienate any potential regular ridership and I'd think a whole subway line that just plays nice with everything already available is as straightforward as it gets. At the same time, the bits you pointed out near the end about the commuter rail compatibility with already existent infrastructure along with the bit of trivia (I genuinely did not know about this at all despite being a NYC resident for my entire life) about how the stock for the Staten Island Railway work and are also FRA compliant to boot made enough sense as to why that'd probably be the move. If it does that though, it'd be cool if it gets a special designation, maybe as an honorary "subway line" on maps lol. Finally, just want to add that I'm definitely feeling like this should eventually become its full intended design and run into the Bronx since the borough is hurting for ways around the city that don't involve Manhattan and the previously proposed map just feels *right*. From my own observation and playing with Brand New Subway, I thought it would have been cool for it to have a second line running its length (perhaps a "local" variant) which would split from the line going north into the Bronx after departing Randall's Island station, go over Robert Kennedy Bridge, then become a cross upper Manhattan line via the eventual SAS 125th Street extension. Everyone gets a little something with that where the Interborough/Triboro gives Brooklyn an west-east line that moves through very transit sparse regions of the borough on the latter side, Queens gets another north-south line and a quick link into the Bronx + upper Manhattan that isn't bogged down to hell in midtown Manhattan, and the Bronx gets more coverage in its southeastern most landscape as well as that Manhattan-divorced method of getting to places in Queens and Brooklyn faster, and even Manhattan gets another east-west cross option that if they so chose could lead them through Queens into Brooklyn without the rest of Manhattan to ride through.

[@CraigFThompson]

Love your "dissertation"!!

[@Chris6d]

You should make a video talking about the Nostrand and Flatbush Avenue extension proposals, the 2 to Sheepshead Bay and the 5 to Kings Plaza. Also a video about the "New Mannahatta" proposal. Love the content

[@MysticTransit]

I'll definitely be making some videos soon on the various expansion proposals for the subway system. Be on the lookout!

[@Da__goat]

Oh this makes sense, exactly why it has taken so long to finally get to the drawing board in NY. Now if they could continue the train further from its Jackson Heights station to stop at LGA, then Ditmars, and then two branches, one across 125st and the other directly into the Bronx. (Obviously this second part can come later). And then in the south extended across the Narrows to Staten Island, which is very shallow and a sunken tunnel construction method could be used to make it affordable and minimize interruptions to the shipping channel. Now if they could extend the G train to terminate at or near Ditmars it would complete the loop, with the G in the west and the IBE in the east. Providing all of these connections would be fantastic for these areas and provide a much needed connection between important and populated areas.

[@CraigFThompson]

"Very shallow"?! Approximately how deep is the Narrows (and the rest of the waterways in the NYC area?!)....

[@oat5662]

It needs to happen

[@believer5497]

I'm actually feeling what You suggested. If the Interboro we're built as a "regional system",then it would be able to use the Hellsgate bridge trackage to the new stations being built for Metro Norths without grade separation/train protection. Smaller Hybrid cars like the like modified M9s at 75ft NYCT size ...with adaptive boggies that will meet platform heights at intergrated like Jamaica.,the entire Atlantic Branch could be incorporated into this route,along with the Rockaway branch And Montauk. This could be the beginning of a whole new regional hybrid system that will join the subway And Commuter rail systems together. Even the Airports are linked via a new air train. It's can be done.

[@qcdmc2000photos]

Great idea to improve rail service in NYC

[@karywilliams7399]

Great way to spend the birthday. Sitting back with a transit commentary playing😄

[@MysticTransit]

Happy birthday!

[@Shuotography]

I think one tricky aspect of making this new line a part of either the LIRR or Metro-North is that the fare structure and ticketing procedure could be seen as less desirable than if it's to be integrated into the NYC Subway, at least in the eyes of public. This is because at least currently the NYC Subway still has a system wide flat rate ($2.75) fare structure that requires only 1 tap/swipe per trip. Meanwhile the commuter rails have more of a distance based fare structure and the tickets are checked on board versus at the gates or turnstiles. Also the fares of some trips are significantly higher if you are to take the LIRR or Metro-North versus the Subway and Bus alternative. I actually know people who would go out of their way to avoid making their trips to parts of Westchester and Long Island on the commuter rail lines simply because making the same trip via subway and bus is cheaper even if it's often also slower. Obviously the situation would be completely different if the NYC Subway is to adapt a distance based tap in at your origin and tap out at your destination fare collection scheme used by some transit systems around the world. I think it's relatively uncommon in the US in comparison to the flat rate system. The BART in the San Francisco Bay Area, DC Metro, and Seattle's Sound Transit Link Light Rail are the 3 domestic systems I can think of that uses it.

[@Theincredibledrummer]

As an Aucklander, definitely agree that our trains would be suitable. They have good capacity and are comfortable. Our trains also share track with freight and run at 10 minute frequencies at peak, so is a good model to use

[@jimbo1637]

Do you know who owns the commuter rail tracks in Auckland? Here in the US freight railways are notorious for causing delays to passenger service since they own almost all the rails in the country and prioritize their trains. I worry that if we tried to implement 10 minute frequency it would end up being 5 minutes some times and 30 others depending on frieght schedule...

[@Theincredibledrummer]

@@jimbo1637 our government owns them basically

[@jimbo1637]

@@Theincredibledrummer that makes sense. Unfortunately, unless the MTA figures out some way to make sure passenger trains have priority this service is probably going to be slow and inconsistent.

[@quanbrooklynkid7776]

@@jimbo1637 damn

[@CraigFThompson]

Except that your rolling stock is similar to freight trains in the sense that they don't provide a FORWARD VIEW....

[@BelugasAreCool]

Chicago needs exactly this, currently it’s faster to get to the other side of Chicago (North-South, vise versa) on a bus faster than a train since you have to go through the city and transfer depending on what area of the city your going to

[@mingkee27]

The Bay Ridge section is used for freight trains.

[@KongDavidNow]

Personally, idc if it should be a commuter rail or subway, I just wanna be able to use the metro card so if I want to transfer I won’t have to buy a whole new ticket just to get on

[@GunHillTrain]

The Interboro Express, in theory, is a great idea. A couple of points. Extending it north to about 50th Street and 28th Avenue in Astoria would provide a transfer to the Metro-North line being built over the Hell Gate bridge. That would give most of the benefits offered by the previous RPA Triboro plan. Staten Island? I don't see a tunnel being built anytime soon. However, a ferry between St. George and Sunset Park (dropped in 1964) could be linked to the IBX.

[@JTC2227]

I ❤ NYC Subway & Metro North Railroad

[@rockyrockafella8527]

Also I would love to see the old LIRR Rockaway line put back as a subway line.

[@josephshields2922]

I've been saying this for years. There is already a road bed there owned by the LIRR. It connects every subway in Bklyn + the LIRR East NY Station. It was originally "THE Manhattan Beach RR to Coney Island. In the 60's they wanted to build a Cross Bklyn Expressway over it but residents protested and stopped it.

[@TechGroupF430i]

Commuter makes best sense because Fremont Secondary is connected to NEC and Hell's Gate (which continues north towards the MNR) as well as Fresh Pond Junction that is directly off the LIRR Montauk Branch are right along the route. Not to mention (as some have pointed out) the line is regulated by the FRA, not the FTA, meaning there's no shot for a subway at all. Between that and the provisions being sought after for the once-proposed Cross-Harbor Rail Tunnel, it's quite obvious what direction they'll lean in.

[@miguelsaavedra4361]

I personally love the r44 car because I do like that seating

[@CraigFThompson]

Now only if they DIDN'T cover up the forward view window....

[@jimwacker6582]

It needs to go to the Bronx.

[@epicrapbattlesofhistorymrbeas]

you are such an underrated transit youtuber. i really like your content also yeah, a commuter rail line for this would be a great idea

[@MysticTransit]

I'm glad you enjoy my content!

[@thomaspatterson5913]

I think it should be a commuter rail and I think they should do an expansion from New Rochelle New York into the Bronx over to Hell gate Bridge into Queens. And enter change from Metro North Railroad to Long Island railroad at Sunnyside Yard in Queens and that stretch should be operated on the L I are are rules from Queens into Brooklyn

[@gregodessite]

I am looking forward to observe the construction at least, in Midwood area.

[@schwenda3727]

To hell with just one interborough line that goes everywhere in NYC BUT Manhattan… they really should strongly contemplate building LRT TRACKS (with bus & first responders allowed/designed for them to drive on) along the: >Verrazzano >RFK/Triborough >Throgs Neck & Whitestone Bridges added either onto the outside of the existing bridge deck… vaguely similar to Auckland NZ’s bridge but said “clip on’s” being 100% for transit usage. THERE’s your baseline for an Interborough SYSTEM… directly plugging into several MORE existing subway lines in transit deserts like perhaps the Utopia corridor in East Queens…

[@douglasjgallup]

I’m thrilled with this idea but I think the MTA should also concentrate on adding infill stations on Metro-North and LIRR and run the lines within city limits as a RER-style service. We could really add tons of service and capacity by thinking of those lines within city limits as a supplement to subway service. Through running of LIRR and NJT should be a project they start taking on.

[@banksrail]

You had me until “Through running.”

[@kenw7287]

@@banksrail What's wrong with through running? Paris RER, and pretty much all of Germany's S-Bahn systems work so well to integrate an entire region. I wish that every major US city had S-Bahn equivalents.

[@banksrail]

@@kenw7287 It’s politically infeasible. New York and New Jersey can barely come up with a coherent way to find the new Hudson tunnels. What makes you think they would through run service. Would be nice, but it’s just not going to happen.

[@kenw7287]

@@banksrail I'm well aware of the dysfunctional relationship between New Jersey and New York. We can circumvent petty interstate politics concerning funding, maintenance costs, and revenue sharing by adopting a concession/franchise model. I would like to see Tri-State area regional rail privatized with a foreign train operating company operating the trains while the states would be in charge of maintaining the tracks, signals, and the stations. This has been done successfully in the United Kingdom. As for potential candidates, I think that Trenitalia or Nederlandse Spoorwegen (Dutch NS) would be the ideal candidates. They have experience operating rail services outside of their own countries, but are not as large as SNCF or Deutsche Bahn. This is important as politicians and bureaucrats would not like the French and Germans dictating regional rail operations to them. MTR is out of the running due to political concerns with its relationship with the Hong Kong government. The various Japanese rail companies have no experience operating rail service on infrastructure that they do not own.

[@CraigFThompson]

@@kenw7287 There are technological differences between the NJT and LIRR/MNRR/subway equipment; these will hafta be resolved before any consideration is given to such an idea.

[@kenw7287]

The Interborough Express can be a new hybrid rail transit line like the London Overground. We (transit enthusiasts) in the US have to stop thinking about rail transit as a dichotomy between urban heavy rail and commuter rail. The possibilities are endless once this way of thinking changes.

[@Alexander-ru3qc]

Definitely agree with this....I believe it should be a subway line only for pricing of the fare...I don't give a damn what type of train style they use...

[@ExotiKZBoy17]

I think the MTA should create a subway line, connect it to the SIR, rename it so it can give Staten Island the connection between boroughs they need.

[@queens.dee.223]

There are FRA-approved DMUs. Put the same fareboxes they have in buses with MetroCard and OMNY readers and charge the same rate. Then these can coexist with freight with some clever scheduling. It'd take my car off the street for many trips to Brooklyn!

[@MysticTransit]

I'm not sure if I agree with the DMU idea, I would much rather prefer EMU's, but I like the idea of including OMNY Readers on-board the trains.

[@queens.dee.223]

@@MysticTransit I agree with you in an ideal world. My ideal path forward would be electrify and use EMUs. My second choice -- and I think this is the path of least resistance today, no electricity pun intended! -- would be to use DMUs and then convert them to battery-powered EMUs when that concept is fully proved and partially electrify where it's convenient.

[@CubeAtlantic]

i'm not a New Yorker or big NYCT, or Metro-North/lirr enthusiast anymore but this would be dope, & revolutionary tbqh in my eyes it would make more A1, & high-quality that interconnects, and transfers via line, & et-cetra in all the 4 boros hopefully they'll extend it to Staten Island or some areas of NJ.

[@tsx1009]

They need to expand that service into Staten Island. That would definitely help every person on the island

[@conordrogalis6487]

It sounds like you want to turn a subway line into a commuter rail line by adding more frequency and subway seating arrangements. Commuter rail line would at most run every 15 minutes on peak hours. So I think it would be better as a metro if it needs more frequency and is more for short rides than a long commute.

[@MysticTransit]

I mentioned Regional Rail in this video, which in a lot of cases, runs at a high frequency. Look at cities like London, Tokyo, and Berlin. Commuter/Regional Rail can be frequent and provide a Metro-Like experience.

[@banksrail]

@@MysticTransit I see what you mean. But there’s no way you’re going to get a frequency of 8 minutes across the Hell Gates Bridge. Especially because of the Penn Access project. The bridge is going to be busier than ever.

[@conordrogalis6487]

@MysticTransit I just see making that line part of lirr or north metro force other train lines to run more frequently so the system will be consistent. There will be alot of money lost running more trains on less frequent lines. The suburbs aren't as built up to handle 8 minute commuter trains in rush hour. I live on long Island BTW and I don't see people wanting to change there commute to the city feeling like a subway. I believe best solution would be add the line to subway network and use it like light rail since the line stays in the city limits.

[@dwaynerichardson5380]

I propose that this new line have a station at Utica Ave. That would take away the foot traffic from Utica Ave (3,4) station.

[@stevenroshni1228]

There will most certainly be a stop at Utica Ave, but the line is near Ave H, not Eastern Parkway.

[@maxwellapton9538]

It would have a transfer to the 3 train at Junius Street most likely

[@dwaynerichardson5380]

@@stevenroshni1228 What I'm trying to say is that people who now take a daily train from Queens to Manhattan to catch the 3 or 4 can in the future take the Interboro to Utica. Thus avoid Manhattan all together.

[@medic2299]

Would be great. Metro North is already planning to add three stations in the Bronx for the New Haven line of Metro North to take passengers to Penn Station via the hellgate. As far as this Bay Ridge line, that would be equally great. Tracks already exist in both instances, just need stations / other infrastructure and lots of $$$$

[@CaseysTrains]

I'd love to see a Diesel Light Rail/Diesel Mulitple Unit system similar to the River Line who can use the existing freight and commuter rail tracks along the corridor. The train stops at cheaper-to-build Low Platform stations that can allow freight trains to still pass through without a complicated guntlet track installation and you can still add turnstiles or stairways up to existing stations like Avenue H.

[@HowardMessias]

Diesel? Seriously? Electric, batteries or hydrogen(faster acceleration between stations, less pollution).

[@CaseysTrains]

@@HowardMessias I only say diesel because of fact that if shares tracks with freight there isnt much room for 3rd rail. Maybe overhead like it was back in the 60s However, that cost hella money to string wire. So batteries, diesel, I'm iffy on hydrogen by why not anything that can get the line built fast.

[@HowardMessias]

@@CaseysTrains I'm not too sure about hydrogen either, Germans are testing it right now so let's see, meanwhile the UK has been extensively testing/using battery power, (they've been demonstrating it in the US recently, ex London Transport District Line "A" stock!).

[@HowardMessias]

@@CaseysTrains Battery/electric appears to be right see this, ex London Underground District line D stock. kzbin.info/www/bejne/i5C8ZmZ-mLmDeKc

[@DavidJohnson-dp4vv]

@@HowardMessias Yeah good ol diesel. Why should New York compete with Tokyo, London, hong kong, Singapore and Shanghai. Good ol diesel commuter rail is good enough.

[@calvinkendrick851]

Similar to what I commented in the other video about the IBX. If they don’t go with the triboro Rx plan, they should at least extend the last stop of the IBX into Astoria and build a station there so that they IBX and the Penn access line can meet and become a transfer point in order to make things fair. That way bronx residents can still get to pages like eastern queens and to bay ridge.

[@hshxhsbdv7]

I'd actually much prefer the interborough line to be a regular subway, but if it wasn't, I'd much rather have it be a LIRR route. And if they're gonna start working on this plan, they should improve service on the G as well.

[@MetroShadow1]

I'd look into sending it to LGA, although the Bronx plan isn't terrible either

[@Fidel_cashflo]

Bronx would probably make more sense since the N line extension to LGA has been gaining momentum ever since Cuomo got canned

[@peskypigeonx]

Idea: how about both

[@Bolivar2012able]

It's a process of continuous upgrades. Not only is dead rail network being given new life in London, in the Provinces the same is happening with such a city as mine (Liverpool) planning to use old Freight Lines as reinvigorated Commuter Track. Also battery trains are also being considered to run services into the regions outside Liverpool. Allowing these services to run into the center without need to transfer from diesel powered units, to electrical powered units.

[@kusiciel]

I miss new york

[@bryantrivera1852]

Could definitely happen because people who lives in Bay Ridge and works in Jamaica, the time can cut more than half instead of taking the F Train at 4 Avenue - 9 Street

[@coolboss999]

This should definitely be a subway line. It would be the most impactful and beneficial IMO if it turned into a subway. Instead if using the bridge, make a tunnel if the MTA has to between the 2 boroughs

[@thetrainguy1]

It would help but it cannot be done for cheap. The branch is a standard heavy railroad branch. You cannot mix the two. The FRA won't allow it.

[@MysticTransit]

Exactly, which is why I propose Regional Rail.

[@coolboss999]

@@thetrainguy1 Your right. After the video, I realise that a commuter or regional rail would be better than the subway

[@banksrail]

@@MysticTransit The only disadvantage of having it be a commuter rail is that there aren’t any maintenance facilities along the route. Where a subway could used the existing L and M train tracks and use their maintenance facilities. A lot of people don’t think about that when they propose routes. The trains have to lay up somewhere.

[@Railoffroader2]

@@banksrail If they went through with this they’d have to add facilities somewhere in Brooklyn or Queens and maybe have the yard at New Rochelle reconfigured?

[@FTrainProductions]

As a Bronxite myself, it’s a shame that the Bronx portion isn’t included in the plan and it even inspired me to make a reaction video on it from a Bronxite’s perspective. I hope they at least have a transfer station to PSA to get into the Bronx from Queens/Brooklyn at least.

[@moraimon]

London Overground may be a predecessor for this project.

[@MysticTransit]

I think the London Overground is the thing the MTA should look at the most when deciding the best possible option for this line.

[@thomaspatterson5913]

I agree commuter rail Metro North Railroad and Long Island railroad expansion is the way to go these new lines in and out of New York city into the suburbs

[@paulborri]

It reminds me of Syracuse Ontrack.

[@Alexander-ru3qc]

I feel like this line should be run by the metro but it uses whichever rolling stock fits best for expansion and rules...making it a commuter line and hoping that MTA institutes a pricing system that is comparable to the subway line is a wish and is something they don't have a track record of ever doing...the LIRR has been at Jamaica station for a long time now and it still cost like 8-14$ to get into Manhattan with no sign of getting lower...commuter rail works in other places around the world pricing wise bcuz the people that run it can see the benefits of that...even though MTA does run LIRR, Metronorth and the NYC Subway they seem to run like competing entities which don't want to work with each other...

[@MysticTransit]

I never said Commuter, I said Regional Rail. Regional Rail, in this case, similar to a Subway, would NEED to be priced at Subway Fare, or the line won't get use. Period.

[@Alexander-ru3qc]

@@MysticTransit my bad you said regional rail...but like you said it needs to be priced at a subway type fare...which if it's regional rail it won't be...this country or this state for that matter aren't known for making the smartest transportation decisions

[@Alexander-ru3qc]

@@MysticTransit also I really don't care what type if train style they use I just want it to fall under the subway umbrella of the MTA for pricing reasons...they could use a steam engine for all I care as long as it stays the same fare as taking the 4 train....

[@drakeil]

I may have commented before but I have some new ideas. At the northern end have a transfer station to the Metro North line into Penn Station and up into the Bronx to CT. Maybe even a transfer or direct trip into the East Side Connect so that people in Brooklyn have an alternative way to get to mid town. After this transfer station have it extended to LGA (an East side Connect ride to LGA too?) Maybe make the trains like the New Haven with dual modes so they could ultimately go everywhere: on the LIRR, Metro North AND NJ Transit as a through service to Newark and Newark Airport (Newark Airport to LGA connector?). SIRT under the bay to LGA and the everything listed above? Even do an ultimate partial loop line from EWR/Newark to Staten Island to Brooklyn/Queens, the transfer station and to LGA? Even the East Side Connect? Maybe even have a branch line to connect over the abandoned LIRR line that goes down the the A train to the Rockaways to do a link for all three airports (using the JFK Air Train transfer)? I stop now. My brain hurts. ;)

[@survolte5486]

I think its good but should be a metro since its serves 2 boroughs and is trying to make fast transportation between the two boroughs

[@CTrail1711]

Like the Harlem Line in the Bronx with 2-3× the frequency.

[@CTrail1711]

Extend the line to Stamford or New Haven and have 15 minute frequency all day on the upper and lower New Haven Line.

[@tysonstransitcam2190]

This project should be part of a three tiered road and rail project across Brooklyn. Tier 1-Existing Line to be used a commuter rail Tier 2-Lower Level- Cross Harbor Tunnel connecting the Newark Bay Extention to Brooklyn and then as a highway underneath Tier 1. Interstate 78 would be redirected here (Holland Tunnel would become I 578) Tier 3-Sub Lower-Cross Harbor Runnel for freight , lowest level since gradient cannot be as steep

[@frank.l181]

I think if L.I.RR would take over it would be way to expensive for NYC residents because it a communter railroad. M7 and M9 are not designed for this short frequent stops.

[@markydee48]

It would be better either as MNR or LIRR but if it becomes a commuter line,, the fare has to be the same as the subway otherwise people would avoid primarily because of cost. If we make it LIRR, why stop in Queens? Head on up to MNR and connect both RRs and provide some well needed connections. Making it part of the subway wouldn't make much sense if they are to share the tracks with NYAR. A bus way is absolutely pointless

[@fredashay]

Metro North shares trackage with Amtrak along the Hudson, so I think it makes sense to make it a branch of Metro North and connect to the Bronx shore line to either terminate in the Bronx or Grand Central. And yes, I know that creates a misnomer to have Metro North extend into Brooklyn, but cest la vie...

[@jimbo1637]

As long as there is still freight service on the right of way it pretty much has to be commuter rail. We can't have frieght trains interfering with subway schedules, otherwise delays could spiral.

[@bonda_racing3579]

Should the freight service be redirected? Or just build new lines along side it?

[@iman2341]

The core Overground routes operate much high than 4 tph with the East London line running 16 tph, soon to go to 20!

[@gregodessite]

By the way, will the last stop in Bay Ridge be 4th Avenue or Brooklyn Army Terminal? (BAT has a connection to NYC Ferry)

[@MysticTransit]

Brooklyn Army Terminal.

[@daviddixoniii5460]

I personally think the Governor is making a mistake not revisiting the Original RPA Proposal and extended this project into The Bronx. Growing up in The Bronx I attended and graduated from St. John's University in Jamaica, Queens. I was going to St. John's before the Metro Card was ever created, so it was a hassle with the commute. I was using the Old School Subway Tokens and it was a 2-Fare Zone because there was never a free transfer between Subway and Bus. If the RPA was around back then, my trip to school would've been much quicker and more convenient from The Bronx to Queens without ever going through Manhattan. I applaud this project, but I think that's what they should consider.

[@MysticTransit]

I think the Bronx portion will come as an extension to this line if ever built. I can't imagine they would completely leave out a section that's so important.

[@kenw7287]

I think that Penn Station Access is complicating the Bronx section. There's only a limited capacity on the Hells Gate Bridge, and it's going to be difficult to fit both the IBX and PSA.

[@CraigFThompson]

That governor has ALREADY blundered on the congestion pricing policy; if she'd only have agreed to it, public transit in NYC would DEFINITELY improve!

[@brucehain]

The MTA has put out a video promoting Interborough, that promotes three alternatives for modes: Commuter Rail, Busway or Light Rail. The video puts the Light Rail version as generating the most riders, but these things are often... It must be that the Freight Carrier Railroad Engineering FRA Revolving Door Cabal wants it that way, because to me it sounds like a big debacle and the wrong choice. (That's probably WHY they want it that way.) They will have to buy scads of new electric vehicles of a kind they have no experience with that require special provisions for maintaining them somewhere, and a special catenary system for traction not compatible with anything else, plus special short-length, low-level platforms. (They probably what them narrow so they'll fit inside the existing footprint of the line, or close.) The vehicles will of course be incompatible with the other two passenger rail systems, in case anyone want's to connect the line to anything to generate some traffic. (I don't see much hope for it otherwise, in terms of passenger draw.) Instead, they will want to expand trolleys into the middle of the streets somewhere as: STREETCARS - a painfully regressive idea, which NYC has thankfully managed to avoid in the face of a couple of well funded attempts to do that. The number of failed streetcar lines in the US never ceases expanding, and they're outrageously expensive. Yet they find it necessary to do stuff like free fares, and they're constantly running people over in gruesome accidents. We don't need that crap here, and I'm afraid they're looking at Interborough as a kind of gateway to the new world order - i.e. worse.

[@enochliu8316]

Yes, streetcars, the idea of which has been re-introduced into the UK and Australia, under the name of tram, and has proven successful over there.

[@brucehain]

@@enochliu8316 Yes, they were introduced (again) first in Western Europe, rising from the ashes of WWII, when people were glad enough to accept anything they could get. It was 1994 before they started thinking about it here in the US. The first was Newark Light Rail (formerly the Newark City Subway, the last passenger line in the US that covered costs ((before they wrecked it with cheap-ass "street running" smack down the middle of Broad Street, Newark - through a grade crossing elimination district (((they felt obliged to issue a FONSI (finding of no significant impact ((((on the environment)))) with the attendant dismemberments and fiery collisions. Yes, "Light Rail" is really an innovative and cost effective way of extorting money, by the now-international Freight Carrier Railroad Engineering FRA Revolving Door Cabal - My Heros!

[@alexandreguttmann7757]

This project is long overdue. It should definitely be regional rail for the simple fact that it can be shared with the (still important) freight line. And it should go through the Bronx via Penn Access taking advantage of the Hell Gate Bridge and terminate at New Rochelle where an existing yard is already available as a facility. It would also be cheaper to implement than a subway, though there needs to be a discussion on what kind of train should be used. EMUs like the M8 would be great (taking advantage of the existing catenary infrastructure in Queens and the Bronx), but that would raise the cost of the project considerably as the implementation of catenary/3rd rail infrastructure would be needed all the way to Bay Ridge. Fares are another subject of debate. I personally just think that any regional stop within the 5 boroughs should have the same fares and turnstiles as the subways, which would make transfers between subways and regional rail extremely efficient throughout the city. Such a system exists perfectly in Paris, but perhaps we are dealing with NYC where each rail system has its own bureaucracy, making this integration improbable. Thoughts?

[@sideshowbob]

I'd like to see the current freight only line that branches off the Hell Gate Bridge on the Brooklyn side upgraded to electrified commuter rail double track & then tied into the LIRR main line going to Jamaica station via a set of flyovers (would require some property takes). This would provide a direct connection between Long Island & the Bronx, eastern Westchester County / SW Connecticut. The current New Haven Line equipment (M8's) can already use all 4 power systems in the area (2 different catenary voltages & 2 types of 3rd rail DC shoes), since this line would have to transition from catenary to 3rd rail, just like the New Haven Line does now above Mt Vernon (altho a different 3rd rail system). I've lived in CT for decades & have known plenty of folks in SW CT who turned down jobs on Long Island (Queens/etc) because the commute is impossible - vehicle traffic is insane, by rail requires travel into the city (the East Side access improves things a bit by allowing direct x-fer in Grand Central rather than having to travel over to Penn Sta but still not ideal). I'm sure there are folks on Long Island who've turned down opportunities on the "Mainland" north of the City for the same reason.

[@charisecopes2237]

9pk

[@_Breakdown]

BEST as a *SUBWAY-STYLE-TRAIN* to EASILY INTEGRATE w/SUBWAY SYSTEM. (LIRR makes no sense b/c (1) it doesn't service L.I.! (2) it would be used by NYC residents (3) more people can fit! (4) a conductor checking tickets every 2 mins is a hassle for riders)

[@MysticTransit]

1. I Mentioned Regional Rail 2. Same as 1 3. Same as 1 4. Same as 1

[@_Breakdown]

@@MysticTransit 1. ? 2. ?? 3. ??? 4 ???? i used the word "subway-style" . . . I have no idea what your response about "regional rail" is supposed to mean (?) But thanks for uploading a really good video! 👍Cheers! 🙂

[@kindacringe9031]

Hey you think you can do a least used station for the Q line? Btw love the vids keep it up!

[@jetfan925]

2:48 *Western Queens and Brooklyn

[@MysticTransit]

Western Queens & Brooklyn would be the area the (G) Train serves. Not this new Interborough Express Line.

[@IIAOPSW]

The whole distinction between regional, commuter and subway is kind of artificial. In Tokyo there are trains like the JR lines which act analogous to the LIRR/MN except within Tokyo itself the stations are spaced more like a metro service giving commuters a single seat ride to most destinations. For intracity commute you pay with the same transit card as if it were a subway. The BART in SF is also like this, with metro-like spacing along Embarcadero but commuter like spacing once it leaves city limits. When you think about it, there's no reason why LIRR/MN should bring all the passengers into Penn/Grand and then force transfers to the nearest subway line. LIRR could have local stops in Manhattan at 3rd Ave, Broadway and 6th Ave for direct transfers to the 4/5/6, N/Q/R/W and B/D/F/M respectively. MN could have local stops at 63rd and 57th for direct transfers to the E/F/N/M/R rather than forcing all their commuters into the shuttle or 4/5/6. Now that the MTA controls both the subways and the regional rails, treating them as separate entities is nothing more than unjustified historical habit. So forget the hard line dividing subway and commuter. Focus only on practical implementation. IRX should be like a subway in the sense that you pay for it with your metrocard, it costs the same as any subway line, and you can transfer to subway lines for free. IRX should be like commuter rail in the sense that the rolling stock and driver qualifications are the same as a Class I railroad just like the PATH. IRX could maybe merge seamlessly with one of the LIRR / MN branches to give a single seat commuter/metro service, with passengers transiting beyond a certain point required to have a full ticket rather than just a normal subway fare.

[@TheRailLeaguer]

The thing is that for the LIRR, the East River Tunnels don’t allow for easy construction of stations in Manhattan, same with a portion of the Park Avenue Tunnel south of 59th Street for Metro North trains.

[@qolspony]

If they are proposing the Metro North through Co-op City into Pennsylvania Station, there is no chance for this new subway would go into the Bronx. It is too many agencies to go through to make that happen. And the benefits, although there, it expensive and harder to implement. Besides, the Metro North runs more than enough trains to serve that corridor well. And the demand is just not there for this type of service. There is still a chance to extend the second avenue line into the Bronx. It has a much less complicated route and serve more people. However, the MTA is deadset turning it west towards Lexington Avenue. And if I can tell, it is written in stone.

[@qolspony]

@@TheRailLeaguer I'm aware. But as with everything, that could take several generations to initiate. But first we have to get through phase III and IV before anything concerning the Bronx can happen.

[@Railoffroader2]

There’s a provision in Williamsburg at South 4th Street from many decades ago too, but….

[@qolspony]

@@HelloooThere I never said that and I agree. I was specifically talking about the abandoned Bay Ridge branch. You can't place a subway on that bridge.

[@Railoffroader2]

@@HelloooThere 🤭

[@donschwartz9585]

You couldn't run a train from Bay Ridge to The Bronx using this model. The Bay Ridge branch of the Long Island Railroad runs through Fresh Pond in Queens then heads to Jamaica. If you were to switch the train at Fresh Pond to the freight tracks, tracks it would cost a fortune. You'd have to electrify 90% of the route. While it might be a good idea I don't see it happening in my life time.

[@Nelson-od9ns]

That should be great and also from Newart, LGA and JFK

[@Tdel04]

Hopefully the Metro North gets this.

[@andrewskigordon4941]

I think it will become a high speed subway line using the open gangway r211

[@cafelate9515]

Why can’t they make a train going to Staten Island. The traffic is very bad there and this can cut down the traffic

[@chrismilcetic2179]

What do you think about the New Manahatta project?

[@MysticTransit]

Its interesting, however, a big chunk of it is impractical.

[@JellyMations]

2:44 is based

[@Waltjoh100]

The BQE traffic is unforgiving.

[@odemata87]

There was a reason why passenger service ended on that line in the first place. Now when speaking of develop of the surrounding areas where are you speaking of? Much of that line in the southern part of Brooklyn passes through suburban residential homes so what type of development are you thinking about? Towards the eastern part Brooklyn you already have the L Train running parallel. Going through Queens, you already have a very developed residential area. These areas with the exception of eastern Brooklyn which still has some industrial elements, have high property values that won't leand itself to rezoning or redevelopment without overcoming some serious hurdles. It would be better if they extend the 2 line further into Brooklyn, create a line running along utica Ave, and maybe extend the J or L, F train express service as well N, into areas where people actually travel

[@odemata87]

@@TheRailLeaguer I'm suggesting the extension where you have known commuting patterns of higher compacity that can at least bring in decent and consistent revenue. Also as I said before for, areas like Maspeth where this line passes through are high residential, what development is going to spark in those areas where they're already zoned? You're not going to raze these homes for higher occupancy ones or turn suburban like areas into more urban? Room for expansion at best is in eastern Brooklyn where it's already served by the L, 3, and to some extent the LIRR. Much of this line would be redundant. If anything increase freight service to and build where there are existing places for transfer spots. Reactivate spurs to especially in South Eastern Brooklyn for that.

[@odemata87]

@@TheRailLeaguer I think there maybe I'm not explaining myself clearly enough. There no bus line that serve such due to a lack of a worth while commuter pattern. The line will be redundant where it runs parallels with the L and N. A express F and N would better serve those areas which has an establish higher demand commuter pattern. And again where this freight line traverses, much of it very develope and expensive residential homes, with no room for further developing (no one razing their home for higher occupancy ones). Have you ever actually been to Maspeth, Midwood, East flatbush, Bensonhurst? I won't divulge where I reside but I can assure that I have a very intimate knowledge of the areas I speak of

[@odemata87]

@@TheRailLeaguer if this line passed through desolate areas then I can see where growth would be a benefit. Also as said before there was a reason why passenger service was discontinued on that line in the first place. commuting patterns haven't changed by that great amount to warrant for such. If built it that line would be very under utilized with probably some section more than others which would quickly spur service cut backs that probably would have been better served with dedicated express route. People in the areas I've mentioned already are in want for an express F as well N service. Extending the 2 further into brooklyn would also be more sensible, have you not seen the amount of people who exit flatbush terminal to only continue their reverse commute by bus? Also bringing forth a line to run along utica ave would also be more sensible. Extending the J via an El further into Queens and the L into brooklyn are more sensible wand would spur more actual growth on those areas

[@odemata87]

@@TheRailLeaguer so you're saying people in those areas are currently driving to Jamaica? What are you even talking about. If that were the case then why do you have so many express busses that go from those areas to Manhattan? I think you're the one who has very little understanding of these areas. Have you see at Jamaica terminal for the E and J how people board vans that go further into those areas of Queens, how will this line help with that unlike what I supposed earlier? How will this line alleviate the congested B46 running on Utica Ave of which these passengers are making connections at the 3 and 4 utica Ave station? They are not heading higher than average to Queens. Number still show many people commute to Manhattan with some reasonable to the outer boroughs and even fewer inter Borough. This is line will be under used period and will spur growth in an already residential heavy area. Those with cars in those areas are not driving to where this line traverses and those that are still doesn't warrant the expense because there will be very little return.

[@odemata87]

@@TheRailLeaguer population growth where exactly? In Midwood, Flatbush, Maspeth? Lololol do you even know the make up of those Areas? Clearly you know more than me and the MTA should hire you for their development and planning team.

[@Syouis]

mta would make bank if somehow they extended bay ridge to staten island,

[@JustTheCommuter]

It's going to be commuter rail due to CSX owning the track And CSX needing to run there as well

[@Railoffroader2]

MTA Long Island Rail Road owns the tracks Queens to Bay Ridge

[@shaunizzkool]

I’d rather this be an actual subway line. Maybe extend into north eastern Queens later on

[@Michael_afton698]

what cars will be on the new line?

[@MysticTransit]

We don't know yet.

[@Bassotronics]

The Interboro exists for years already! It’s called the G train.

[@CraigFThompson]

Yet another line is badly needed....

[@ShawnClarkNYC]

Couldn't this be Subway adjacent like the PATH in NJ?

[@MysticTransit]

The PATH isn't a Subway, it's actually classified as Commuter Rail, this is because it runs alongside the NEC for part of it's route.