The Monastic Office: A Comparison

[@AmericanShia786]

I like the Anglican Breviary better than any of these three. However, I find the Benedictine Breviary to be the easiest to use. Once the Anglican Office Book 2nd Edition arrives, I plan to use the AOB 2nd Edition with the sermons and martyrology of the Anglican Breviary to supplement. I will keep the Benedictine Daily Prayer as well, for sermons and martyrology. That's just my personal taste. But all three books are good. Your comparison was excellent. If one does not need sermons and martyrology, I really like the CTS Daily Office used by the Anglican Ordinariate. Its fully Catholic.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

The AOB 2nd Edition with the Anglican Breviary is an unstoppable force!

[@WittgensteinsBeetle]

Very interesting comparison. I'm Melkite so I stick with the Byzantine rite (the Anthologion is my go-to office book), but I have enjoyed your deep dive into the western monastic office.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Thanks! The Anthologian is a fine book!

[@clevelandfan295]

Good comparison. I sold some things to buy the Farnbourough and I must say it is definitely the best of the 3 - physically and in terms of the office itself (it has the best translation and the rubrics are simplified in comparison to the LAP, easier to use). But BDP would be my suggestion for someone new to the breviary for how easy it is to use. The only problem I’ve ever had with the diurnals is that I miss going through most of the psalms. BDP takes you through all but 12, the two diurnals are only about half.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

I hope you enjoy the Farnborough! The BDP is honestly a great pick for someone who has no experience in an office

[@marcrodriguez7475]

I wish Carmelite (OCarm) breviaries are this easy to find and are published

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Carmelite and Dominican breviaries are tough to find

[@marcrodriguez7475]

@@ConvincedCatholicism i wish soon these orders can make a new versions of their breviary that is in accordance with Vatican 2 or atleast do some effort to republish their heritage.

[@tradicioncatolica4853]

Podré rezar el monástic Diurnale solo en la latín? Ya que no se nada de inglés

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Es preferido que el Diurnale es reza en la latín.

[@CatholicChickAZ]

I have the Farnborough edition, I love it. I wish I had Matins, but I’m not sure anyone even prints one for the laity to purchase .

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Matins is tough to find

[@quidocetbenediscit]

Lancelot Andrewes Press has a volume for Matins. With a little searching, it can easily be used with the Diurnal.

[@CatholicChickAZ]

@@quidocetbenediscit Thank you 😊

[@user-sm5tu9dq6p]

I bought the LAP over the farborough because I am not roman catholic and the LAP had the additional prayers I loved it so much i bought the LAP matins companion I dont even necessarily "pray" the office everyday but theyre very nice to read devotionally especially the matins because of the passages from church fathers Edit: I also want.to add... as to the build of the book... take care of it and it will take care of you... so far has handled heavy usage well but never really put it into my back pocket

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Glad you’re getting good use out of the LAP

[@justin_messer]

The assumption note in conjunction with the feast of Maximilian Kolbe leads me to assume that this was intended for use among high church members of the ELCA. Especially since the ELCA is the only Lutheran Church in North America that commemorates him.

[@FourEyedFrenchman]

Maxwell E. Johnson, an editor and compiler on Benedictine Daily Prayer, is a Professor of Liturgical Studies at Notre Dame, a pastor in the ELCA, and an oblate of the OSB. BDP is my breviary of choice right now, and it doesn't really bother me that one of the editors is a Protestant. The monks of St. John's Abbey worked with him on the editing and compilation, so it's not like they gave him free reign. It's a thoroughly Catholic breviary.

[@justin_messer]

@@FourEyedFrenchman I understand that. Just wanted to give some context?

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Thanks! ELCA makes sense.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Thanks! ELCA makes sense.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

I did not know he is at Notre Dame. Very cool

[@d-slice9064]

You should do a comparison on all the Byzantine prayer books you’ve reviewed! Not including the psalters

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Not a bad idea!

[@josephsoltero7326]

Benedictine Daily Prayer does not include Prime, as you say at around 14:21. It also uses "inclusive language" in the Psalms and avoids masculine pronouns for God in the canticles. For example, the Benedictus: "Blessed are you, Lord God of Israel, you have come to your people and set them free." Or the Magnificat: "From this day all generations will call me blessed; you, the Almighty, have done great things for me and holy is your name." For some this is no problem. For others it's a dealbreaker.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Thanks for the insight.

[@duromusabc]

Because of the Vatican 2 document Sacrosanctum Concilium Post Vatican 2 Breviaries lack Prime

[@albertsmyth9616]

‘Inclusive’ language! Wow, I had no idea. Thanks for letting us know. That is completely insane & I’m SO relieved I didn’t waste my money buying it. A lucky escape: Phew!!

[@SpiritofAloha11]

I would've bought the Benedictine version- because of your video in fact - if it didn't have a post VII kalendar. I like the 30 day cycle (which VII adopted), because it's realistic. But... a pre VII kalendar with all the octaves and observances has become very important to me. I ultimately got the EOB and am loving it.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

EOB? The octaves are very special!

[@CatholicSamurai]

As a Benedictine Oblate, I pray all the Hours from the Benedictine Daily Prayer breviary (if I need to pack extra small/light for travel, I switch to the Farnborough Abbey Diurnal). I much prefer the BDP as my normal mode, and like it more in most ways, except a few things: 1) Psalms are intentionally "inclusive" in many sections of the psalms (always replacing "blessed" with "happy" and removing most mentions of masculine placeholder pronouns; "Blessed is the man" becomes "Happy are they" and "sons of Israel" becomes "children/people of Israel"). 2) Some of the concluding prayers are just really hippie-ish. I actually really like most of the intercessions found in the litanies, but a number of those concluding prayers have that sense of benign, hippie-ish, kumbaya flavor from Liturgical Press. 3) The Lutheran/Anglican considerations baked into the whole breviary (not just inclusions to the calendar, but a general mindset throughout the whole thing) is frustrating as well (this arises from a fixation on non-Catholic Benedictine Oblates, which is really just small population in the UK/EU and even smaller here in the US; Esther de Waal just made them seem like a bigger deal than they really are IMO). 4) Prime is omitted, even though it would barely add any extra pages to the textblock. I just want those first 3 things fixed (adding Prime is just extra) in the BDP breviary, and I'd be totally content. EDIT: I simply *cannot* prayerfully enter into the texts (and I've tried for many years) when I'm constantly parsing through antiquated English translations that publishers always pair with Latin. I wish someone would publish Latin-English side-by-sides that uses something like RSV2CE for Psalms/Scripture and normal English for everything else.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

To get an edition of Monastic Diurnal with modern English would be very good!

[@tusolusdominus]

Would praying the Catholic version of the diurnal in English be not liturgical? I’ve heard people say it’s not.

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

Well, this is kind of controversial. Lay people have no obligation to pray the office. To pray the English side is considered “devotional” rather than liturgical. But it still counts as authentic communal prayer. Its not like praying in English somehow invalidates it

[@tusolusdominus]

@@ConvincedCatholicism Interesting, so praying LOTH would be liturgical though? This might be a stretch but I figured it’d be liturgical because the church has now invited lay people to pray the office, and thus any approved versions now would be liturgical. If not though, I’m a tad disappointed because I wanted to give the traditional offices a try but they all seem to be non liturgical in English, which bothers me a bit cause I like participating in the prayer of the church. If it’s all non liturgical as a layman though then that makes this an easy decision lol

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

@@tusolusdominus to be totally honest I don’t think you are performing a lay liturgy of sorts when praying the office. I really wouldn’t overthink it and pray what you want to do

[@tusolusdominus]

@@ConvincedCatholicism That’s a good point, it’s not like God looks at any heartfelt prayer as less. I’ll look more into the diurnal, thanks for this!

[@stephanottawa7890]

That Lutheran note is odd. I think that any Lutheran could observe the Assumption in the sense of Dormition. She died just as anyone else has or will. Now the BVM is with God....What is wrong with that?

[@ConvincedCatholicism]

I do not know enough about Lutheran theology to make an educated comment

[@hanng1242]

Luther believed in the Immaculate Conception. And Mary's perpetual virginity. And her bodily assumption into heaven. Luther himself actually had quite a devotion to the BVM.