The MOST Important Question About Abortion

Trent Horn teaches how to stay focused on the main question when debating pro-life issues. He discusses how one simple technique can help clear away the clutter of pro-abortion arguments.
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[@Lulue_90]

"As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy." Luke 1:44

[@myriamc.]

Amen!🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽

[@johnharkness6304]

@robertstephenson6806 FAR too long, most people won't take the time to read that. The Bible is also silent, as far as I know, on nuclear war, which is clearly evil. Excellent argument tho' for why we have the tradition of the Catholic Church teaching through the centuries for all these issues which aren't covered by the Bible.

[@ErikPehrsson]

@robertstephenson6806it says nothing of abortion but it has a lot to say about killing other humans.

[@johnyang1420]

Checkmate

[@e-man1634]

"I will send a flood and murder every person on the planet including pregnant women, making me the biggest abortionist and mass murderer in all of history " God:Noah's ark.

[@Lulue_90]

Jeremiah 1 1 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations."

[@hippios]

bad verse to quote, because its talking about before the baby was even formed in the womb, so it doesnt counter the abortionists, and the verse doesnt say anything about the baby being alive

[@jeffgriscoa8131]

@@hippios you is a person, regardless if it’s before the womb or in the womb. It doesn’t say it or that. You, me, him, her…. This is referring to people.

[@kevinkelly2162]

Another after the fact prophecy.

[@cnault3244]

That verse is about one specific person he has appointed as a prophet.

[@Irislaurel]

The more information we have about abortion, the more we'll shed light on the atrocities of it. Hearts and minds will change. ❤

[@bigfootapologetics]

The "context" box under this very video is trying to dodge Trent Horn's question by calling abortion "ending a pregnancy." By doing what, fact checkers?

[@rensinclair4218]

Mind your own business

[@firebug3256]

@@rensinclair4218 "quit sticking your nose in other people's business and let me murder people"

[@bigfootapologetics]

@@rensinclair4218 It's everyone's business when innocent human beings are being killed.

[@IWasOnceAFetus]

​@@rensinclair4218What if your "business" involves killing other humans on-demand? Should we mind our business then?

[@patrickpeters8200]

@@rensinclair4218 we are minding our own business Sinclair. Our business is to protect life, ALL life. Just like injustices in the past, slavery, civil rights for all, etc… which all were legal at one time, but never were those things right! Neither does abortion! Just because the baby becomes an inconvenience shouldn’t be a reason to terminate their life. No reason is good enough to terminate a life, since the life did nothing except live! 😜 so we are minding our own business…. Life is our business!! ❤️😎 Walk over to light Sinclair. You can do it!!

[@myriamc.]

Oh my word!!!😮😟 Thank you, Catholic answers and Trent Horn!🙏🏽😔

[@marccrotty8447]

It is unjust to take innocent human life. Be prolife.

[@katrinagiovanni891]

Praying for an end to abortion in our nation . To restore a right relationship between men and women . To end the fatherless epidemic. To end the single mother epidemic. To raise strong families with two parents. ❤️❤️🙏🏽

[@HillbillyBlack]

Over 1 BILLION Catholics Globally and The problem I have with the Roman Catholic position of topics like this is that their offensive is nonexistent. The “one true Church” isnt even a foot note of effort in this arena. They love to talk about it and talk about opposing abortion, but they never do anything about it. I’m talking protesting every single abortion clinic on the planet. Rome has more immaculate, materialistic resource riches at it’s disposal than any other church on the planet. They could finance the biggest effort to protest every single abortion clinic on the planet, and make a real difference. Simply sell its gold wealths. Have church in peoples homes as Peter did. Sell all you possessions, pick up your cross and follow Christ. The truth is, I think most catholics and even most protestants prefer to talk about it more so than do anything about it. But, many reformed Protestants are actually doing something about it. Namely, apologia studios. So I would encourage people to think very clearly about the moral implications of such an argument as this. There’s talking about it, and then there’s getting off your ass and doing something about it. James 2:15-16 ESV If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, [16] and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, be warmed and filled," without giving them the things needed for the body, what good is that? Fund apologia studios and put action behind your prayers.

[@corkyduke8673]

@@katrinagiovanni891 your idea of a family isn't everyone's idea of a family and you have no right to intervene with someone else's family. Do you want someone to intervene or tell you that your family is wrong?

[@christinemcguiness9356]

Thank you Trent. May God protect the unborn and guide their mothers🙏

[@e-man1634]

Would that be the same God who is the biggest abortionist and mass murderer in all of history? Ya know. Sent a flood for Noah's ark, murdered every single person on the planet including pregnant women.

[@DriveInFreak]

Why do you not only support child molesters, but forced birth laws that kill women?

[@rensinclair4218]

Magic isn't real. Stop harassing women

[@2timothy477]

Amen! And their fathers too.

[@ShowMeSomething1]

Half the earth’s population doesn’t even believe in your god, Or believes in a different god, and millions don’t believe in anything at all, this IS reality. 🤷‍♀️

[@celestialblissfulness]

Excited to continue with this, thank you 🙏

[@catholiccom]

You're welcome! Be sure to leave a review when you're done with the course, we'd love to hear your feedback 👍

[@josefreire6122]

Thanks Mr. Horn. Truth is always attractive. May God bless you.

[@davegaetano7118]

One of the most effective ways to show the humanity of the unborn is to show people pictures of what abortion does to the unborn. Doing this can be especially effective when pro-life or pro-abortion initiatives are on a ballot.

[@cnault3244]

"when pro-life or pro-abortion initiatives are on a ballot." You are presenting a false dichotomy. The debate isn't between pro-life and anti-life or pro-abortion and anti-abortion. The debate is between pro-choice and anti-choice. No need for any debate on abortion. If YOU think abortion is wrong, YOU shouldn't get an abortion. Problem solved.

[@davegaetano7118]

​@@cnault3244 He issue is reality. Not what you think or what I think.

[@cnault3244]

@@davegaetano7118 ??? what does "He issue is reality." mean?

[@davegaetano7118]

@@cnault3244 It means what matters here is the truth about the unborn, not how anyone feels about the unborn. We must conform ourselves to the truth, not try to conform the truth to our own desires and opinions.

[@cnault3244]

@@davegaetano7118 "It means what matters here is the truth about the unborn, not how anyone feels about the unborn." Go on, what is this so-called "truth about the unborn"? "We must conform ourselves to the truth, not try to conform the truth to our own desires and opinions." Go on, what exactly is this claimed truth.

[@MerchantOfClicks]

I like how the youtube context box uses the euphemism "pregnancy", rather than actually calling it a child: "Procedural abortion, a procedure to remove the PREGNANCY from the uterus." wtf?

[@Nahnah111]

I know right?! Like, what is a pregnancy if not a baby, and why is abortion necessary if it's NOT a baby? Such silly verbiage to justify such evil actions

[@crazyedswonderfulworldofso9370]

Excellent Trent! Looking forward to more.

[@laurelwarner5073]

Thank you for this Trent!

[@melissat9120]

"Some people who resent cats may waver on the answer..." 😂 All jokes aside, a very helpful video!

[@francissweeney7318]

Jesus said " I knew you in the womb." That is enough to convince me through the Holy Spirit that a human receives their soul in the womb.

[@Richie_roo]

I just bought Trents course on abortion

[@2timothy477]

Thank you so much for this, it is so needed here in the UK, whom are killing on average 500 children per day, 'So help us God!' Please pray for our government, as I do daily, that they will repent of the evil's they commit. Steven.

[@HillbillyBlack]

Over 1 BILLION Catholics Globally and The problem I have with the Roman Catholic position of topics like this is that their offensive is nonexistent. The “one true Church” isnt even a foot note of effort in this arena. They love to talk about it and talk about opposing abortion, but they never do anything about it. I’m talking protesting every single abortion clinic on the planet. Rome has more immaculate, materialistic resource riches at it’s disposal than any other church on the planet. They could finance the biggest effort to protest every single abortion clinic on the planet, and make a real difference. Simply sell its gold wealths. Have church in peoples homes as Peter did. Sell all you possessions, pick up your cross and follow Christ. The truth is, I think most catholics and even most protestants prefer to talk about it more so than do anything about it. But, many reformed Protestants are actually doing something about it. Namely, apologia studios. So I would encourage people to think very clearly about the moral implications of such an argument as this. There’s talking about it, and then there’s getting off your ass and doing something about it. James 2:15-16 ESV If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, [16] and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, be warmed and filled," without giving them the things needed for the body, what good is that? Fund apologia studios and put action behind your prayers.

[@alessandragiammattei63]

Thank you!

[@jockchicken3595]

Tactics is a great book!

[@robertortiz-wilson1588]

So intelligently put!

[@JuanMartinez-xl2oj]

Great video!

[@stephenwhitacre5208]

Good trent. I am glad you made beautiful truth videos like this. It is sad that abortion is still allowed. Its ends the life of unborn children, puts women through unimaginable pain and suffering and destorys families.

[@crohunter100]

Even planned parenthood knows that a baby in the womb is a human being. They’re not stupid. The debate is whether it should be allowed or not allowed. And I say no because there is no justification for child murder

[@JoAnnFuir]

Planned Parenthood is America's biggest Abortion Mill.

[@ricardodiazdeleon134]

Catholics CANNOT be pro abortion in any way, shape, or form. There are no medical exceptions. When the mother is at risk, the catholic doctor should always try to save both even if the baby needs to be extracted from the womb, but never by deliberately attempting to kill the baby.

[@DriveInFreak]

Yet you are alright with a group of people that rapes children. Go figure.

[@kevinkelly2162]

But all catholics are child abusers or supporters of child abusers.

[@extract8058]

Mother is never at risk lol that's just a liberal talking point.

[@DriveInFreak]

@@extract8058 LMAO

[@extract8058]

@@DriveInFreak you know they're lying don't ya?

[@sandyg7770]

Abortion is legal in the Vatican City State, an independent country where no one goes to jail for abortion. They voluntarily adopt mostly Italian laws, which legalized abortion in the 1970s. Yes, Catholic teaching is against abortion, but the Church doesn't make it a criminal offense in its own sovereign territory. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't this exactly the pro-choice position?

[@statlerwarldorf2583]

Did you stay asleep since you wrote this BS? Go back to sleep.

[@Christina00nline]

Exactly right! Abortion was and is and can be only ever legal because people abused the science to try and say that the an unborn child is not a human being. In every abortion debate that I've had, including when I myself was an ignorant pro-choice person in my younger years, pro choice argument revolves around woman's right to bodily sovereignty. "I have a right to govern my own body." Which is a resounding, "Yes!" But when you introduce the fact that an unborn baby is also a human being, you have a second consideration, the bodily sovereignty of that person. Pro-choice must deny or try to minimize the importance of that second person's bodily sovereignty because they are smaller or because they are dependent or simply try to make it as if they are not a person at all. But if we can place the central concern of the bodily sovereignty for both peiple, mother and child, in the discussion, we would see that abortion is clearly, indisputably immoral and should be completely illegal. Look at the case of conjoined twins. Indisputably they are both people even though they share a body. In some cases, like twins conjoined at the head or at the side, they even depend on one another for bodily functions (the same as a baby who is considered "not viable" because they cannot yet have any chance of survival outside the womb.) In some cases, one conjoined twin is weaker than the other. When you recognize the bodily sovereignty of both twins, you realize it becomes murder to kill one of them for the sake of the other's bodily sovereignty. Even if one of the twins is weaker, say she depends on her sister more than her sister does on her, and her sister has a stronger body that she would be able to live on her own, if the operation to separate the twins would run the risk of killing one of them, it is not done. You cannot do a procedure to separate the twins and give them each their own independent body if it will certainly kill one of them. If the doctor had knowledge beforehand that doing the operation would certainly kill one of the twins, and he continued with the operation anyway knowing full well that it would kill one of the living twins, he would be charged for murder, malpractice, and lose his license. Sometimes, the twins must actually wait until they are stronger, to revisit if the process of physical separation without harming the other twin could be done. It is the same case with abortion. It is unfortunate if a woman doesn't want to share her body with her baby, but just like conjoined twins, she would have to wait to separate her body from the baby's body until it could survive on its own. When you realize that the baby is a person with its own right to bodily sovereignty, the medical practice has to change. It's no longer an abortion, but when can labor be induced safely and without harm to the baby?

[@mrscharmless]

That’s a good point, never thought of it that way!

[@trumpbellend6717]

It's disgusting how so many people like YOU attempt to justify the slaughter of *HUMAN SPERMATOZOA* I mean they are ALIVE and a *"human life form"* that contains a complete and UNIQUE human genome. Why are you not protesting when these "children" die by the BILLIONS every day? Often they end up in a tissue and get flushed or in a bin. Why are you not declaring such actions as attrocities and acts of genocide ?? Sometimes they are even swallowed alive yet you don't even bat an eyelid 😱 Why are you not demanding the law be changed to recognise this as an act of cannibalism ?? 🤔🤔 How people like you simply right them off as somehow not "human beings" is disgusting. These are human "BABIES" it doesn't matter what stage of their development they are at. Who are you to make some arbitrarily determination as to WHEN this human life form has "value" or that they are not "human beings" simply because they have not fully developed yet. Monsters like you say spermatozoa don't matter because they don't have a brain or consciousness. You talk of them not having a "personhood" and say they can't feel pain or emotions and this makes them not "human beings" But they have the potential to become people like you and me, if you stop flushing them away. It's funny how all the people who think killing spermatozoa should continue to be legal and moral were once spermatozoa themselves 🤔 What kind of "life" do you think they are ..... canine life ?? Feline "life" ?? No of course not they are HUMAN "LIFE" Shame on those that regard them as an "inconvenience" and their own desires and pleasure as more important 😡

[@timdom843]

👍👍👍

[@trumpbellend6717]

It's disgusting how so many people like YOU attempt to justify the killing of HUMAN SPERM I mean they are ALIVE and a *"human life form"* that contains a complete and UNIQUE human genome. Why are you not protesting when these "children" die by the BILLIONS every day? Often they end up in a tissue and get flushed or in a bin. Why are you not declaring such actions as attrocities and acts of genocide ?? Sometimes they are even swallowed alive yet you don't even bat an eyelid 😱 Why are you not demanding the law be changed to recognise this as an act of cannibalism ?? 🤔🤔 How people like you simply right them off as somehow not "human beings" is disgusting. These are human "BABIES" it doesn't matter what stage of their development they are at. Who are you to make some arbitrarily determination as to WHEN this human life form has "value" or that they are not "human beings" simply because they have not fully developed yet. Monsters like you say spermatozoa don't matter because they don't have a brain or consciousness. You talk of them not having a "personhood" and say they can't feel pain or emotions and this makes them not "human beings" But they have the potential to become people like you and me, if you stop flushing them away. It's funny how all the people who think killing spermatozoa should continue to be legal and moral were once spermatozoa themselves 🤔 What kind of "life" do you think they are ..... canine life ?? Feline "life" ?? No of course not they are HUMAN "LIFE" Shame on those that regard them as an "inconvenience" and their own desires and pleasure as more important 😡

[@Hunter-ox6kh]

@@mrscharmless agreed

[@RonMaxfield]

Here's three questions of thought. Abortion If life ends when the heart stops beating then when does life begin? When does the human heart start beating? If a beating human heart determines a living person doesn't Life begin in the womb?

[@agentjs09]

I love how KZbin now thinks I have to be educated about abortion with their little "context" box every time I watch a pro life video.

[@Hadrianus01]

In my experience, abortion debates focus on legality, not morality. How do you respond to assertions that abortion should be legalised? Which is a separate issue to whether abortion is moral or immoral.

[@EverySingleSaint]

Why is murder illegal? Should the legality of murder be a separate issue to whether it is moral or immoral?

[@mram03]

We’ll it’s not exactly a separate issue. Traditional Murder is illegal because it’s extremely immoral…though people would probably not use that terminology. However, you can still use the same arguments to point out why abortion should be illegal if you get the person to realize how evil/immoral it is - it’s murder. I will say though that if they do say it should be legalized because more women will die due to back alley abortions, you can respond with an equivalent example. If particular immigrants from Africa who practiced Female Genital Mutilation came to America, would it make sense to legalize FGM? They would likely say no because FGM is terribly wrong and unjust. Clearly, many young girls would die or be harmed because of back alley surgeries though. Isn’t that an issue? They might say yes, but realize that legalizing it is still very wrong because of the intrinsically evil act. Hence, while we would pray for all the women who have suffered from BAA and try to stop it from happening, making abortion LEGAL because of women’s safety gives you this equation: (memorize) “So you’re saying we should make it safer for bigger people to kill smaller people so it’s safer for the bigger people?” They might say, well the unborn are not people. And that draws us back to the one question: What are the unborn? Hope that was helpful. I got most of this stuff from Trent’s book- Persuasive Prolife. You should definitely read it! be made legal because many

[@Iustusxi]

Laws are based on moral principles. And legality is not set in stone? It’s sometimes arbitrary and VERY VERY subjective.

[@gunsgalore7571]

It's true that it's possible to believe that something is immoral but that it shouldn't be illegal. For instance, I would imagine most people believe that adultery is immoral, but I also believe most people would not want it criminalized. However, this kind of logic only covers certain immoral actions that are perceived as being less evil than the big "no-nos." For instance, murder, rape, abuse of a minor, theft, and fraud are all illegal because they are immoral. These things are typically considered to be far more seriously evil than adultery, and that is why they are illegal. Now, pro-lifers such as myself believe that abortion is not just immoral on par with adultery, but immoral on par with murder. In fact, we believe it is murder. I think that, regardless of whether or not you agree that abortion is murder, you can agree that if it is murder, it should be illegal.

[@christopherneedham9584]

What is and isn’t legal should be based on what isn’t and isn’t moral.

[@josephology3290]

Have a CONTRACEPTION debate please!

[@hollyd6277]

You sound like an abolitionist, Trent. ❤‍🔥

[@Rorschached]

Pro-baby killers will dodge all around this question though, and will say things like "An embryo isn't alive" or "A fetus isn't alive", and will have completely different, ultimately subjective answers about when a human being is considered alive. This is all of course because if they admit the reality that an abortion is the killing of a living human being, albeit one in an early stage of development, then they will have to accept the horror of what abortion really is.

[@danmelia3951]

Hi Trent, great job as always! Please also consider a talk about a point pro-aborts often keep to themselves and that’s their false idea that abortion is a necessary evil due to for example, fear of overpopulation. Luke 12:24 is proof overpopulation is never going to be a problem. People mistakenly think evils are sometimes necessary when In actuality, they aren’t evil at all, rather God’s justice. God’s justice comes in two forms, the one that is reserved for God alone to carry out that mankind is never allowed to carry out, and the second is the justice of God he permits (nothing of God is evil. Only the devil and man commit evil) and desires man to carry out when man commits injustice. Examples being just jail time for criminals, just self defense, just firing of an employee. We know abortion is never just with the only exception of saving the life of the mother. Please rid America of the “necessary evil” lie and confusion.

[@kimmyswan]

Is there a distinction between a human being and a person? If so, what are they?

[@Iustusxi]

We need more philosophical and moral principles against it out in the field. The most I see is legalistic and has not a lot of weight with random people.

[@DriveInFreak]

Please feel free to explain what is moral about molesting kids.

[@Iustusxi]

@@DriveInFreak Feel free to explain to me why you think every Catholic is a pedophile. Id love to hear your Astute reasoning!

[@firebug3256]

​@@DriveInFreakyou'd have to ask the people at drag queen story hours, I'm sure they have some great reasoning

[@DriveInFreak]

@@firebug3256 What's it like to be such a wussy that you're scared of a man in a dress?

[@kahner93]

More important question: What does it mean to "kill" something? Is it immoral to have a mole removed because it is human life? Similarly, if we encountered an intelligent non-human species, would it be okay to kill them because they are not human?

[@JoAnnFuir]

You cannot compare an unborn human being to a mole. An organ/body part is not a human. It is only part of a body. An unborn baby is an entire body with it's own separate DNA.

[@noel42069]

Hello, I’m a donor to Catholic answers for about a year. I WANT TO CANCEL MY DONATIONS. I have not found a user friendly way to do so on your website- please let me know what I need to do to STOP MY DONATIONS, short of contacting my bank and disputing charges

[@statlerwarldorf2583]

maybe it's a sign from God not to stop supporting life

[@mashah1085]

In other words, the OTHER questions are uncomfortable or even counter-productive for the "pro-life" agenda. Like "Why do you NOT want to prosecute a woman who self-induces an abortion with RU-486 for murder...if that's a "murder"?" (BTW, if you do...please speak up and speak loudly and on as many media outlets as possible)

[@ffnh3130]

I support Trent's upper chest hair. Let it grow!

[@christinadoherty9450]

Any abortion debate, always go back to the baby in the womb.

[@kevinkelly2162]

Yeah, that is why most abortion debates are conducted by men.................

[@ShowMeSomething1]

Baby’s are already born, it’s a fetus. FACTS. 👍

[@christinadoherty9450]

@@ShowMeSomething1 Abortion: A baby can live without it. -- As a former fetus I agree.

[@ShowMeSomething1]

⁠​⁠@@christinadoherty9450Correct, and as a former fetus it makes sense that it was in fact your PARENTS who made the choice for you to be here. Not yourself. And it’s obvious that a baby can live without abortion because they are already born. 🤦‍♀️

[@princessc660]

why does the cannon law says you can as a girl marry at 14 and a boy at 16. The fact a 14 and 16 year old could marry anyone at any age in the church bothers me for example 14 and 24 year old could get married. At 14 we are not fully mature yet and could die from child birth or get infections.

[@user-rn5tz8pj5q]

not any age. as with all marriages, it requires the priest to analyze it thoroughly. it is permitted of course because in the past, it was quite common to marry that young.

[@thomasmosher2465]

the political and medical context is left out when we call this a moral issue. the american center for OBGYNs, MAYO clinic, and most accredited healthcare institutions speak on abortion as healthcare. states are becoming pregnancy care deserts after abortion bans because doctors and OBYGNs feel they can’t do they job and states with an abortion ban have higher maternal mortality rates. experts matter or they don’t. no one is saying you have to get an abortion that doesn’t mean religious beliefs get to overcome science and medicine just because

[@JoAnnFuir]

Science has demonstrated that human life begins at Conception. That's a biological fact.

[@Birthdaycakesmom]

A hostile uterine environment in which a developing human feels only stress and agony from their mother rather than a loving bond blessed by biological precursors and underscores is primed for an addiction to stress, to cancer, and to drug and alcohol addictions. And they act like they are saving a life when in fact the only thing they can prove is this is the only life they can offer to this human, one marred, scarred, and basically offered up as a human sacrifice bearing the marks of shame and humiliation of his mother upon his flesh and paralleled in both her genes and the world them as a pittance to their God using this poor and innocent developing human’s flesh as a ticket to heaven. And to the child, hell.

[@Sue-xv8os]

To say the least about the infants, babies, toddlers, and little kids who are the wrong nationality, the wrong color, cry too much, aren't cute, won't cuddle, have missing limbs, crack-addicted, have fetal alcohol syndrome, etc. that nobody wants to adopt. They spend their lives in a broken foster care system till they age out -- Where do I go? Who are my people? Who are my ancestors? Do I have any siblings? Why did they get rid of me? What's wrong with me? But pro-lifers only care about the pre-born, never about the already born.

[@corkyduke8673]

Everyone has the right to life no one has the right to live at someone else's expense, if I need a kidney do I have the right to force someone to donate theirs to me? The answer is no, why then do you feel like fetuses deserve more rights than the woman carrying it or me? Until you are just fine with the government controlling your life in any way STOP trying to control others. You just make yourselfs look like self-righteous hypocrites.

[@statlerwarldorf2583]

Why pick a cat and say someone would waiver?

[@Kefa...]

Minecraft

[@Iustusxi]

Roblox

[@Kefa...]

@@Iustusxi , moincroft.

[@catholiccom]

Minecraft

[@albavellozo6035]

What happens if they start blessing same sex marriages?? Do we go to Orthodox mass but keep our true Catholic biblical beliefs? I’m so worried for what is to come. We must all pray for the Church. Lord have mercy on us 🙏🏼

[@urfavebookworm]

Kyrie eleison, Christe eleison

[@DriveInFreak]

Do you mean "true Catholic biblical beliefs" like raping children?

[@kevinkelly2162]

Your catholic beliefs are not Biblical.

[@sorcyboi2848]

Þey're not going to start doing þat

[@marccrotty8447]

Alba. Attend the Latin Mass.

[@ShowMeSomething1]

Just because a fetus is human in species (because we ALL are) doesn’t make it a PERSON, you have to be born first, Birth is what gives the earth it’s population of PEOPLE. 👍

[@JoAnnFuir]

Read Psalm 139. 😊

[@Droppedcroissant1]

What gives people the authority to decide which human beings are persons? And why is your beliefs of personhood right compared to all others beliefs through history?Don't you think all human beings should be considered people?

[@demtron]

$29.95 to learn how to defend the right to life. How sad. For a topic this serious it should be free!

[@bryanwirthlin4444]

In this economy, $30 basically is free. I can't get lunch at a restaurant for that.

[@amieatkinson176]

Nothing is free, of course. It costs to print, market and ship books. A person's labor was involved in writing the book. How should those things be paid for? I have often bought this book in multiple copies for $5 each from Catholic Answers and given them away. They make it as available to all as they can.

[@cnault3244]

"how to stay focused on the main question when debating pro-life issues" But it isn't a debate of pro-life VS anti-life. It's a debate of pro-choice VS anti-choice.

[@jacquelinen5059]

You only say that because that’s the way that you and pro-abortion activists want to frame it because it sounds better. Saying you are pro-choice is no more an accurate statement of your position on the policy than saying you are pro-life. Pro-choice is vague and we only know what you mean because it’s a slogan chosen by your movement, but it was carefully chosen over the much more accurate phrasing of “pro-abortion”.

[@cnault3244]

@@jacquelinen5059 "Pro-choice is vague" Pro-life is vague. When the topic is abortion, many of the people that claim they are pro-life are also for capital punishment. That negates their pro-life claim. Explain exactly how pro-choice is vague. "it’s a slogan chosen by your movement" It's not my movement. My view on abortion i that is an individual believes abortion is wrong, that individual should never get an abortion. Problem solved. " but it was carefully chosen over the much more accurate phrasing of “pro-abortion”. Wrong. A person could have the opinion that abortion is wrong but can also believe that their opinion does not trump another person's right to make their own choice.

[@jacquelinen5059]

@@cnault3244 yes, I said both were vague. I don’t feel like it needs an explanation, but sure. “Pro-choice” tells me nothing except you are in favor of a choice being made. Which choice? By whom? “Pro-choice” could easily be applied to any other situation where a choice is involved for example the choice to buy a cat. A pro-life person also believes in the right for somebody to make choices regarding their pregnancy. One choice is adoption, however that is not the choice being discussed. At the end of the day If you told somebody who is not familiar with the conversation revolving around abortion that you are “pro-choice” they would need you to explain what you mean as opposed to say me telling somebody I am pro or anti fracking in which case i have successfully communicated my stance on some kind of issue. “Pro-life” has this same problem so personally I don’t like either. They were both carefully selected by their respective movement to elicit a certain emotional response by people. The more accurate phrases are “pro-abortion” and “anti-abortion. Yes, somebody can have the opinion that abortion is wrong however they still hold the view that abortion should be legal and available in our society, making them for all meaningful purposes, pro-abortion. What I have seen though, is that all pro-life people are fine with referring to themselves as anti-abortion, and yet pro-choice people absolutely denounce the phrasing of pro-abortion, likely because prochoice is much easier to swallow than pro-abortion despite the fact that it does indeed communicate their position more effectively.

[@jacquelinen5059]

@@cnault3244 so regarding your original comment, I don’t think with either of the ways you framed the debate are accurate. The accurate phasing would be pro-abortion vs anti-abortion.

[@cnault3244]

@@jacquelinen5059 "“Pro-choice” tells me nothing except you are in favor of a choice being made." Only if you choose to misinterpret what it actually means. Pro-choice means you support the right of the pregnant individual having the right to decide what they want done with their own body. It means you may not like the thought of that person choosing to get an abortion but you realize it is not your decision to make, it i their decision.

[@Jack_AJCX]

Apologetics imply that God is controversial. God is not controversial nor is He "difficult" to defend. On the contrary, the Devil is impossible to defend. I don't debate unbelievers and those who love deception. I make points and testify to the truth. I choose to rest in God's victory. It's the sinners who are fighting an impossible battle, the battle to dethrone God. Such is the Devil's aspiration. By the way, Catholics are idolaters. You shall not worship idols. Exodus 20:4, Revelation 19:10

[@Sue-xv8os]

Do you honor the Sabbath? You've already demonstrated that Matthew 7 Verse 1, about not judging others isn't something you respect.

[@Jack_AJCX]

@@Sue-xv8os I am trying to keep the Sabbath. Even though I'm not a Christian, I don't buy or sell on Sundays. When I worked on Sundays, I gave the money that I earned to church. We are called to judge righteously. John 7:24 Proverbs 31:9 1 Corinthians 2:15 Leviticus 19:15 There's a difference between speaking the truth and judging hypocritically.

[@Sue-xv8os]

@@Jack_AJCX Although I abhor the Catholic church, I have Catholic friends who I love & cherish. Your comment about Catholics being idolaters seems judgmental to me.

[@Jack_AJCX]

@@Sue-xv8os Why do you abhor the Catholic church? If you don't like the Catholic church because of what it practices, don't you think that it's loving to rebuke Catholics so they don't perish in their sins? Rebuking in love is not hypocritical judgement. It's a fact that Catholicism indulges in the worship of idols. Speaking the truth is righteous judgement. A judgement is what God says.

[@Sue-xv8os]

@@Jack_AJCX Here's a story for you: Christ and Moses are standing in the back of St. Patrick's Cathedral, looking around. Christ is confused at the grandeur of the interior, the baroque interior, the rococo baroque interior, because his route took him through Spanish Harlem, and he was wondering what the hell fifty Puerto Ricans were doing living in one room when that stained glass window in St. Pat's is worth ten G's a square foot? --Lenny Bruce

[@Demonoicgamer666]

To be a person you need a personality, to have personality you need consciousness until 20-24 weeks. With no consciousness there is no life, you may say what about people sleeping or people in coma’s they have consciousness because they have a functioning brain.

[@JoAnnFuir]

Read Psalm 139. 😊

[@Droppedcroissant1]

Why do you get to decide which human beings are persons and which aren’t? Don’t you thing all human beings should be considered persons? Decide who is a person has happened before and it always ends up in tragedy’s.

[@Demonoicgamer666]

@@Droppedcroissant1 because to be a person you need a personality. At the end of the day I’m a bodily autonomy supporter at heart which compels me to believe that the government shouldn’t interfere with the use of my body. If it’s against my will to use my life to protect, create or save someone’s life then I don’t want to be forced into it now I can’t speak to if I would or wouldn’t because I’m a guy and will never experience pregnancy but I know I would not expect others to do it.

[@Droppedcroissant1]

@@Demonoicgamer666 So when does personality develop? Also animals can show personality should they be considered people? And your definition of what is a person is based on your opinion, like all peoples definition. If I were to say to be a person you need to have to have a iq of of 70 would I be wrong? I think all human beings should be consider humans. The main problem with abortion is that it is killing a innocent human being. The government can say you should not use your body to kill another human being, especially if they are your innocent child. Also all laws are really the government saying what you can and can't do with your body. Bodily autonomy can be limited if effects the life or health of others or yourself, it is not absolute right. A example is neglect laws, parents must use their body to provide for their child, they can not opt out of using their body and let the child starve to death.

[@Demonoicgamer666]

@@AdamWEST-yu2os don’t need to because I’m gay so I’m not worried about making someone pregnant. Also I’m not very sex positive at the moment, not cause I don’t like but because I don’t have a boyfriend and I’m not hooking up again.

[@lornekay8948]

You ask the right question but not everyone has the same answer. My belief is that an egg is not a chick or a chicken and that a foetus is not a baby, child or a person. I respect people who believe otherwise and ask only that they respect me for my beliefs. It is absolutely wrong to force others to abide by your beliefs by manipulating government and judiciary to carry out a religious agenda. OK?

[@Sue-xv8os]

Your "belief" is a fact, just like an acorn isn't an oak tree.

[@curiousdisciple]

@@lornekay8948 you are correct that an embryo is not a fetus and a fetus is not a newborn and a newborn is not a toddler. Just like an oak sapling is not a 20 foot oak tree but it is still a living growing oak. Zygote, embryo, fetus, infant, toddler are all the same kind though-human kind. And they are alive. We ought not intentionally kill innocent human beings, and a human being’s worth does not depend on their stage of development, size, or location, but the fact that they are a living human being. What people are aborting are not just potential human beings, but human beings with great potential. We cannot just “respect a woman’s choice” when that choice is to kill her developing child. And it is not necessary to hold any certain religion to see the immorality of elective abortion.

[@lornekay8948]

Some people believe that abortion is morally wrong and others do not believe the same. Some people believe that eating animals is morally wrong and others do not see a problem with it. Some people think that premarital sex is immoral, and there are many who do not. The problem with the abortion issue is that anti-abortionists feel so strongly that everyone should think like them that they manipulate the government and judiciary force their opinion on everyone else.

[@Sue-xv8os]

@@lornekay8948 The abortion/contraceptive issue shouts loud and clear everywhere (a woman's issue), while Viagra (a man's issue) is a no-show. No one hears even the tiniest squeak.

[@lornekay8948]

@@Sue-xv8os Viagra is not a moral issue for anyone. People do not really have strong, moral beliefs about erection. But you do raise a very good point why isn’t vasectomy being outlawed by the religious right? Why are these anti-abortionists picketing vasectomy clinics

[@TerryMcKennaFineArt]

This is a typical set of word games. But you cannot assess what the unborn child is - what are its rights, what are its right compared to the mother's for example or even if it a person with rights, without examining it as it really is. So are the 2 cells united a person? If you say yes, then do you really believe that the cells are equal to the baby when born? Only belief that conception magically transforms the 2 cells into something grand would allow you to grant to the cells full rights compared to the mother. For me, the life has no dignity and an abortion is perfectly reasonable. A significant number of these zygotes are destroyed by the body long before birth with no harm done, no gnashing of teeth, no weeks of mourning. Some of these pregnancies end before the woman knows she is pregnant. The word games here are part of the way humans understood things before science became dominant. The ancients understanding of the physical world was full of complete nonsense. For example, the heavens was thought to be a distinctly separate world from Earth. It was considered "perfect" so the planets had to me perfect circles and to move in orbits that were also perfect circles. The Ptolemaic system of cosmology created epicycles so that the planets travelled in little circles while traveling in a larger circle around the earth. This compllex nonsense was developed in order to explain motion that was really an ellipse (so not a perfect circle). All of the universe of bullshit before science - like the 4 humors as described by Hypocrates - were just nonsense. So here too - nonsense. A scientific understanding of the cells as they become a baby is the only fair way to assess abortion. And we need to admit that women have used medical abortion for as long as they knew of medically useful herbs.

[@firebug3256]

The only one playing word games here is you. So if two cells aren't a person, when does it become one? Three cells? 100 cells? A billion cells? Pro-life Christians are the only ones not picking an arbitrary hypocritical standard of life by saying it begins at conception. Meanwhile pro-abortion people can't decide when it begins and hold contradictory views of how taking a life should be punished.

[@trumpbellend6717]

​​​​@@firebug3256 No dear you most certainly ARE _"picking an arbitrary hypocritical standard"_ *HUMAN SPERMATOZOA ARE "ALIVE"* they contain a complete and UNIQUE human genome. Yet you and those like you are not protesting about the BILLIONS that die every day. Because you make a subjective and arbitrary determination as to when human life has value. 🤫

[@ninettam8372]

@TerryMcKennaFineArt In reality women will have backyards abortion if they cannot access safe abortion. As a Christian I prefer the second option. Reality is not a philosophy class. It's messy and complicated.

[@trumpbellend6717]

@@ninettam8372 Hi, can you see a reply to my comment the thread has 3 replies ( 4 including this ) but I can only see 2 ? 🤔

[@ninettam8372]

@@trumpbellend6717 I cannot see neither your comment nor the reply.

[@christopherton]

I’m pro cockroach. They’re edible :)

[@francissweeney7318]

The catholic church talks abortion, but fails to rebuke the wealthy and powerful for their support of abortion. Hypocrits all.

[@user-ks3qr5fk6m]

The Church speaks against abortion all of the time. It just falls on deaf ears.

[@DriveInFreak]

@@user-ks3qr5fk6m The same "church" that rapes children?

[@marccrotty8447]

Francis. Any hypocrisy in the Church does not change the fact that abortion is murder of the preborn.

[@trumpbellend6717]

​@@marccrotty8447 "Murder" is the intentional illegal killing of another human being, the intent of an abortion is to remove a fetus from a human being and it is not illegal.

[@bryanwirthlin4444]

@@user-ks3qr5fk6m To give the OP some credit, we could actually be doing a better job at calling out prominent, wealthy and powerful individuals for supporting abortion. Case in point, Joe Biden. That man is Catholic, disown him if you want, but he is actually a baptized Catholic that goes to Mass, at least sometimes. The dude is one of us and yet, he doesn't get called out by the hierarchy, threatened with excommunication or even called to public repentance for public sin. We could be doing better is all I'm saying.

[@MasterKeyMagic]

you conservative converts are the worst. if they reject the gospel, we are to dust off our feet, not force them to abide by it with the threat of force against them through a state power.

[@ninettam8372]

Wow. You have so eloquently explained why the Church keeps people far from God.

[@ZarathustraX]

"Do nothing? That's your wise advice?"

[@MasterKeyMagic]

@@ZarathustraX those aren't my words, those are Paul's, and the actions of the early Christians. if you feel the need to be intolerant towards those who reject the gospel, you're overstepping the authority that God gave us in preaching it. sure if you want to try and talk them out of it that's fine, but you cross the line when you force them to obey.

[@ZarathustraX]

@@MasterKeyMagic What are you even talking about? Who is forcing them to follow Christianity? We can force them not to kill children, that is fine. They can believe whatever they want.

[@MasterKeyMagic]

@@ZarathustraX Controlling people is wrong and unbiblical. They dont see it at children or murder. they dont see it through our eyes. They just see you controlling them which is true if you vote to force them to abide by your religious views. Dust your feet off and let God handle them!

[@3tmslmn]

Trent won't respond to anyone that doesn't agree with him. He is a coward. A typical bully that attempts to control others with his delusional "god" beliefs. He is a liar, as demonstrated in his videos.

[@velkyn1]

ask this quesiton: Why is any of your business when your god doesn't care about babies or children, etc, killing them repeatedly without a thought? Claiming some god agrees with you fails rather hilariously when your own book shows it doesn't.

[@ageroman]

So what do believe the unborn are? What is being aborted?

[@marccrotty8447]

Velkyn. Notice that Trent used logic and not God to condemn abortion murder.

[@mrscharmless]

God takes everyone’s lives, eventually. In His infinite wisdom, He has the power and the right to take any life whenever and wherever as He sees fit because He is God. We, as weak and fallible humans, don’t have the right to do that and He has explicitly condemned murder.

[@velkyn1]

@@mrscharmless So, your argument is that it doesn't matter if your god kills kids, since they'll die anyway. This means that abortion means nothing at all in the large picture, with your vicious god, and you've made the argument that christians shouldn't care at about abortions happening at all. Your god will eventually just kill them, right? I do love cultists whose morality is literally nothing more than might equals right, showing your morality is entirely subjective, dependent on who someone is, not any objective morality associated with an action at all. "God takes everyone’s lives, eventually. In His infinite wisdom, He has the power and the right to take any life whenever and wherever as He sees fit because He is God. We, as weak and fallible humans, don’t have the right to do that and He has explicitly condemned murder."

[@velkyn1]

@@marccrotty8447 Funny how he didn't. He falsely claimed, ignoring logic, that a fetus, etc is equal to a child. They are not just like an oak tree is not an acorn. I also love the excuse since this god kills children all of the time. Trent's question "what is it?" certainly doesn't matter to your god at all. It doesn't even matter to your god if the child did nothing wrong and had no control over any part of the situation. The question "what are the unborn?" doesn't matter to your god. Claims that abortion offend this god's morality simply aren't true. At best, you have the "but god said humans can't kill, but it can", which again is just more "do as I say, not as I do" nonsene from a moral failure. is it immoral to kill a 3 year old, Marc? We can both agree that is indeed a child, I'm sure. Your god doesn't think so since I'm sure there were three year olds assumed to exist in your stories about the flood, the exodus, the various genocides of the tribes by this god and the israelites, etc. If it is immoral to kill a 3 year old and it is *objectively* moral, why do you give a pass to your god when it does this and to no one else? You show your morality to be subjective, dependent on who someone is, not any objective morality at all.

[@rensinclair4218]

Someone's personal medical decisions are none of your business. Period. No negotiation.

[@firebug3256]

Quit dressing up your bloodlust as a medical decision. Period. No negotiation.

[@trumpbellend6717]

​@@firebug3256 It's disgusting how so many people like YOU attempt to justify the slaughter of *HUMAN SPERMATOZOA* I mean they are ALIVE and a *"human life form"* that contains a complete and UNIQUE human genome. Why are you not protesting when these "children" die by the BILLIONS every day? Often they end up in a tissue and get flushed or in a bin. Why are you not declaring such actions as attrocities and acts of genocide ?? Sometimes they are even swallowed alive yet you don't even bat an eyelid 😱 Why are you not demanding the law be changed to recognise this as an act of cannibalism ?? 🤔🤔 How people like you simply right them off as somehow not "human beings" is disgusting. These are human "BABIES" it doesn't matter what stage of their development they are at. Who are you to make some arbitrarily determination as to WHEN this human life form has "value" or that they are not "human beings" simply because they have not fully developed yet. Monsters like you say spermatozoa don't matter because they don't have a brain or consciousness. You talk of them not having a "personhood" and say they can't feel pain or emotions and this makes them not "human beings" But they have the potential to become people like you and me, if you stop flushing them away. It's funny how all the people who think killing spermatozoa should continue to be legal and moral were once spermatozoa themselves 🤔 What kind of "life" do you think they are ..... canine life ?? Feline "life" ?? No of course not they are HUMAN "LIFE" Shame on those that regard them as an "inconvenience" and their own desires and pleasure as more important 😡

[@Droppedcroissant1]

@@trumpbellend6717 Scientifically a fetus is a human being. A sperm is a human gamete cell. "Although life is a continuous process, fertilization is a critical landmark because, under ordinary circumstances, a new, genetically distinct human organism is thereby formed.... The combination of 23 chromosomes present in each pronucleus results in 46 chromosomes in the zygote. Thus the diploid number is restored and the embryonic genome is formed. The embryo now exists as a genetic unity." [O'Rahilly, Ronan and Muller, Fabiola. Human Embryology & Teratology. 2nd edition. New York: Wiley-Liss, 1996, pp. 8, 29

[@francissweeney7318]

The catholic church says one thing and does nothing especially to the powerful or wealthy. The same thing that He warned His followers about the Scribes and Pharisees. The catholic church is the Scribes and Pharisees of these times.