The Obsessive-Compulsive Church: Counting The Wrong Things | Matt Dabbs

[@revolutionofordinaries]

Have you ever been part of a church like this? What was it like? Also, if you had to mention one thing that is worth "counting"/paying close attention to what would it be?

[@KenFord-hw8lj]

This question always reminds me of I Chronicles 16:11 Seek the Lord and His strength; seek His face continually. This to me is what I count, what is the focus. Am I continually seeking Him? Am I leading others to seek Jesus? This is the first and primary thing to ‘count’.

[@revolutionofordinaries]

Amen to that Ken! Thanks for taking the time to comment! @@KenFord-hw8lj

[@dwighthaas2684]

This is the sign of legalism, where all boxes must be checked...5 acts of worship, check, invitation and invitation song, check, etc.

[@revolutionofordinaries]

That was a made up construction to give CofC's a unique pattern to: 1) establish themselves as the one true church and 2) try to force others to comply.

[@oldtimey7599]

@@revolutionofordinaries Great video as always. I'm actually looking at this from the DOC side of the isle, I was struggling to make a comment on your video until I saw this sub-comment. I'm dealing with different problems in our doc congregation. Our problem isn't to convince anyone of the 1 true church or enforce anything so that we can have control... We are warm and welcoming, we're also apathetic to the crowds, or lack of crowds - we're going to keep going down the path and if anyone wants to keep walking with us, they can. We checked all the legalistic boxes a long time ago, and even forgot how or why we checked them. Nobody even remembers why we do things the way we do. If you dig into history and you explain it to them, they'll say, "that's interesting" and move on. We just keep doing things the way they've been done for 100 years and changing anything will upset the complacent. (We have no doctrinal problems - No creed but Christ, no book but the bible. Believe what you want, all Christians are welcomed at the table). Somewhere along the way, we just timestamped ourselves as a non-creedal generic Christian church that welcomed who ever came off the street. We also forgot how to adapt with the times. People still come in off the streets, but it's tough to get them to come back, because society has changed, nobody wants to hear a blaring organ in an empty sanctuary with 4 verses of a song that nobody knows that matches the sermon preached that day. Nobody wants to hear that and nobody's coming back after hearing that. Now everyone's aging and we forgot how to turn a visitor into a repeat visitor and turn a repeat visitor into a member and how to turn a member into a deacon and how to turn a deacon into an elder... All the old folks are wondering why the visitors aren't in love with our organ, or our flowers, or our beautiful stained glass (All of which were controversial innovations in 1900). I guess I don't know what to say. God Bless you guys.

[@maryannwrayTruthbeTold]

Excellent teaching. Very rich and on point. Thank you🙏🏼

[@revolutionofordinaries]

You are welcome Mary! Thank you for watching and commenting!

[@1Word2218]

Your thoughts cause me to think about Revelation 2:4 "But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first." We obsess over the things we love. Maybe we obsess over the wrong things because we have fallen in love with earthly things (attendance, budgets, church programs, etc.) and have fallen out of love with our savior Jesus Christ. Maybe the best way to stop obsessing over the wrong things is to rekindle our love of Christ.

[@revolutionofordinaries]

Oh man...that's exactly it! Wow...so insightful.

[@1Word2218]

To be fair, God's Word is the insight.

[@eugenejoseph7076]

We started attending a new church in our neighborhood last year, with approximately 75 people in attendance. Only one pastor . The pastor's son led worship with his guitar. At first, all seemed wonderful. However, after a few months, we started noticing the senior and only pastor did EVERYTHING. He did the announcements, He prayed for the service, he prayed for the elements on Communion Sunday. He led the weekly prayer meeting. At the occasional men's breakfast, a short testimonial was shared (15 mins tops) and he preached for another 30 minutes. As we prayed and pondered this situation and considered leaving (he wasn't the approachable kind) he announced out of the blue that he felt called to the west coast to help out a church that needed a pastor. The following Sunday and that his son would now be the head pastor, 'later, alligator'! No consultation with faithful attendees, no prayer, no anointing of this new pastor. Just an announcement, and that was it, we have a new pastor. That should've been the clue for us to leave, but we extended grace and patience to this new young pastor as he leads his first church full time. Anyway, we thought maybe this new appointment was going to be better. Perhaps he would involve some of the saints to participate in the ministry of of the church. I did ask for space to run a Men's ministry for men struggling with porn addiction and he gave me a key to run weekly meetings in the basement. He announced the ministry at first and told him I should be the one to announce it since I would be leading it. However, after a year of running the ministry, he no longer announces that we have a ministry for men. This is unfortunate since stats show that 70% of men, including Christian men, struggle with this, and based on that stat, we have at least 20 men in our church who most likely struggle in silence because, for some reason unknown to me, he no longer mentions it. A few months later, we started to see that his father's model had not changed. His son does EVERYTHING TOO. He did ask me to help out with worship, as I play guitar and had some experience many decades ago. Now at 65, I was bit nervous at first, but do my best. Sadly, this 30 year old, know it all (sorry..) started to act like my talent agent. "You're singing this song too fast. You missed a word, Remember, you're doing this for the Lord!!. You sound a little too country, I'm not kidding." One time, he had me sit on the side on the small platform because, and this is the really sad part, for me, but also for him, that he couldn't see how demeaning that was for me. The reason being that he was now doing Livestream on KZbin for all his sermons and weekly bible studies and probably didn't want one old country grandpa to be the face of the Worship. We are heartbroken over the fact that after much prayer nd tears, we are finally making the decision to leave. There are so many wonderful older saints that we've come to know and love. But we can no longer subject ourselves to this kind of control. We will be meeting with those closest to us to let them know of our decision. Sorry for the long story but I'm sure that some people reading this can relate. God bless. We hold nothing but prayer for this young pastor that the Lord will bring maturity so he can serve humbly and stop this unhealthy management of God's saints.

[@revolutionofordinaries]

@@eugenejoseph7076 Man..that's rough! Reminds me of this video on Narcissist pastors - kzbin.info/www/bejne/fXuWi5dmmbd1rpY

[@theverystones2643]

@@eugenejoseph7076wow that sounds rough. Young pastors can be remarkably immature and blind to their errors. All about the front, the facade, the wafer thin show. That’s the be all and end all. Once you’ve seen it and tried to effect change you can only move on because they won’t receive it

[@alastairhopkins245]

Christians should be concerned about Numbers. They should also be concerned about Genesis, Exodus and Leviticus!!!

[@revolutionofordinaries]

Ha! Love it! People often stop their read the bible through in a year in Numbers...lol

[@paul-hn7ck]

RIGHT ON . MATT. YOU HAVE MY ATTENTION.......YOUR WISDOM AND DISCERNMENT......THIS TEACHING IS NEEDED. THREE THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON............WHERE 2 OR 3 ARE GATHERED THAN I AM IN THEIR MIDST. WE DONT WAIT ON THE LORD AND BE OF GOOD COURAGE AND HE...........AND HE WILL STRENGTHEN THINE HEART. ..........WHY IS THIS?? BECAUSE IT CLEARLY SAYS. FAITH COMETH BY HEARING AND HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD.........WELL. BOYS AND GIRLS WE HAVE A HEARING PROBLEM BECAUSE WE WALK IN THE FLESH............MOST CHURCHED HAVE NO CLUE ABOUT THE TEACHING IN ROMANS. AND DONT THINK THE PASTORS WHO WENT TO BIBLE COLLEGE AND EVEN MORE BOOKS. THE SEMINIARY.........THEY IN THEIR FLESHLY MIND WALK IN THE FLESH........THATS WHY THEY DONT WAIT ON THE LORD..........THEY LOVE THE WORLD AND NOT THE FATHER ITS CLEAR THEIR THINKING IS IN THE FLESH...........AND ITS CLEAR IN GODS WORD........THOSE THAT WALK IN THE FLESH CANNOT PLEASE GOD .............CHURCHED BUT NO CONFESSION.....WHY IS THAT.........BECAUSE ONLY IN SMALL GROUPS 2 OR 3 ARE GATHERED DO THEY DO THAT.....THEY DONT CONFESS IF ITS IN A LARGE GROUP...........HAVE TO BE SMALL AND ITIMATE AND SHARE THE HEART HURTS AND LET GODS WORD HEAL........LOT OF HURTING PEOPLE WALKING IN THE FLESH AND I WILL BE BOLD TO SAY THAT THE PASTORS AND SOME OF THEM HAVE BEEN PREDITORY ON THE WEAK WOMEN AND GIRLS AND BOYS FROM BROKEN HOMES INSTEAD OF HELPING THEM.....THEY PREYED ON THEM....YA. THAT HAS GONE ON FOR YEARS.....AND KEPT QUIET IN THE CHURCHES TO PROTECT THE PASTOR AS HE NEEDS AN INCOME FOR HIS FAMILY WHICH IS MORE IMPORTANT THEN TRUTH THAT SETS FREE.......JUST SAYING MATT........HEY THIS HAS GONE ON..........HMMM YOU SHALL KNOW THE TRUTH AND TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE.......I THINK THE HOLY SPIRIT KNOWS WHAT HE IS DOING MAN......ONE SANDWICH LESS OF A PICNIC.......NO WISDOM YOU DESTROY OTHERS LIVES. IS HONOURED AND WE GIVE HIM THE GLORY INSTEAD OF THE PASTORS TAKING THE CREDIT.........OR CREDIT FOR THE CREDIT CARDS WHATEVER COMES FIRST. BLESSINGS MATT.....YOU ARE SHAKING UP THE WOKE AGENDA OF THE ENTITLED..............PAUL JOHN OTTAWA ONTARIO CANADA.. PHIL 4:8 WHATEVER YOU ALLOW IN.........THATS THE DEAL YOU GET...........WHATEVER IS TRUE AND PURE AND WISE......YOU GET THAT.

[@pennyandlionel]

Hi Matt! Wanted to ask you... do you observe that Sabbath? (Friday to Saturday)?

[@revolutionofordinaries]

I do not for a few reasons. First is Romans 14 which talks about each person making a decision about special days and it being okay to disagree on it. Second, Sabbath along with kosher, circumcision and the festivals/feasts were all identifying markers of Judaism. These were the things that if you didn't do them, you were out in the OT. These things are not necessary as identifying markers of Christians per Acts 15 and Galatians. Thanks for asking!

[@Blaisesongs]

@@revolutionofordinaries Respectfully, Isn't keeping the Sabbath one of the Commandments? It's part of the decalogue, not ceremonial law. So, if we're going to break the command to keep the Sabbath, I guess that frees us up to break all the rest at will. ??? There are many places in the Old Testament where God gives reminders about keeping the Sabbath. And the 1st Christians were Jews who kept Sabbath. The 1st place Paul would head in most of his missionary journeys was to the synagogue on the Sabbath to teach and share the Gospel. I don't recall Sunday observance being a thing until Constantine required it. This is one reason I'd like to start a house church, for conscience - so that there's someplace to have church where the Sabbath can be kept with those of like mind, without becoming a 7th Day Adventist. I've been enjoying your channel. Thanks for all the info on house churches. I'd say there's the freedom to keep Sabbath, or Sunday, observe a liturgy or have it informal. I think that the covid event made many wise to the idea that having churches controlled by government because of a business status really needs to be reconsidered. And the overhead of buildings and property really is burdensome. God bless your work and your fellowship!

[@n9wff]

@@Blaisesongs Colossians 2:16-17 I believe we need to be careful to understand fully the rules God created for the Jews concerning the Sabbath. No work whatsoever. No cooking, no chores, no cleaning. They were required to make the Sabbath meal the day before, in relation to the manna God provided as the Hebrews walked to the Promised Land. Do we follow this competely? Paul made mention that the Jews were demanding the Gentiles comform completely to their standards. This happened to the Galatians with circumcision. Yet, Paul wrote that the true "rest" is when Jesus makes His Second Return. Even Jesus mentioned some of the foolishness, when He referred to rescuing an animal on the Sabbath and He healed on that day. The body needs rest, no doubt. Yet, the work we are called to do isn't paused on the seventh day. That won't stop until the Second Coming.

[@markstewart7527]

Crouds followed Jesus but most did not believe Him & finally they killed Him. Numbers do not indicate truth. He was full of grace and truth but most rejected Him.

[@revolutionofordinaries]

That's a great point Mark. Thanks for the great comment.

[@paul-hn7ck]

WOW...........WEL L IF YOU WALK IN THE FLESH.....YOU SOW TO THE FLESH......JUST PICKING UP AND LIVNG OUT THE WORLD IN THEM O C D......OUT OF COMMON DECENCY HMMMM PAUL JOHN OTTAWA.......CALM THE THINKING....TAKING CAPTIVE THE THOUGHTS TO GLORIFY GOD THE HOLY SPIRIT IN US.

[@revolutionofordinaries]

Too true!