The sad truth about Little Mac in Smash - An Ultimate character analysis

[@omega0786]

As a mac main since smash 4 this felt like I was in a therapy session.

[@omega0786]

@PlayerSomeGAMES sometimes I think to myself was it really worth it putting so much effort on to learning to play little mac

[@omega0786]

@PlayerSomeGAMES and then I see all my progress and is good but no matter how good i get with him i can never really do much about recovering is nerveracking I mistake and I might just lose the whole fight by just getting hit once in the air and is just for frustrating that when my opponent sees he cant beat me in the ground they do everything posible to toss me off the side instead of facing me

[@omega0786]

It feels like this never ending argument to whether hes good or not and I fear I will never get closure

[@omega0786]

@PlayerSomeGAMESthank you hes been my most wanted character for about 11 years now and I am extremely happy about it and will main him forever

[@WanabyGoogler]

•OMEGA•07 “ Friends: Zoner mains-“ wHy D0nT yoU PlaY LitTLe MAc ANy mORe” Me: *drags cigarette” you wouldn’t get it man.

[@andresgil7506]

Little Mac has something that no other character will ever have, the heart of a champ

[@diegoantoniorosariopalomin2206]

Ryu and Ken : Are we a joke to you ?

[@captainmega6310]

You might as well be.

[@andresgil7506]

@@diegoantoniorosariopalomin2206 i think of them more like Zen-guys

[@Sansonius3rDaSlayer]

Much love bra

[@Aisaka115]

And a neat pink hoodie. Or wireframes?

[@0ctopusComp1etely]

Hey, I've mained Ike since Brawl released. I remember the years when performing NAir once meant you just killed yourself. And look at it now. Anything can happen, Mac mains. You've just got to keep fighting.

[@shmooters5599]

It’s all we’ve been doing my good sir, other then crying of course

[@bevvvy1374]

Except Ike wasn't designed as if a toddler made him. Even in Sm4sh he wasn't a terrible character and a lot of his moves were good(Back air, up air at times, forward air, etc.)

[@xoav]

Ganon main here. Things do get better in time. Mac should be fixed by his third game.

[@Sansonius3rDaSlayer]

Mac main till death.

[@dbooth3975]

If they buffed macs recovery and aerial game he would be the next brawl meta knight

[@pree76]

"His side B is very good recovery" *Watches joker grapple 50 ft off the stage*

[@QualityInternetTrash]

**Watches Lucas and his Pk Rocket, his double jump and air dodge**

[@grotto185]

@@QualityInternetTrash *watches pit use up b near the bottom blastzones.*

[@cloudbat2830]

These are accurate 😅

[@RinZDR]

Byleth: *Pathetic*

[@diamondlords5014]

Hello fellow Pickens cult member, fancy seeing you here

[@ericgrant754]

From a mac main to a mac main, this makes me teary-eyed.

[@joytotheworld56]

It truly does man.

[@MRGOLDMINEDUDEGAMING]

Than drop him

[@shmooters5599]

Muggy Ssb no we are loyal boys

[@thecpmr6276]

Hey. Ever since his trailer, we've all known something. Winnin' isn't easy. You gotta work for it.

[@hamboharambe9982]

@top text top gun

[@gallo123]

Who would win? An inconsistent, bad designed piece of doodoo or A very optimistic boi

[@brunop.8745]

Neither

[@HylianKirbo]

@@brunop.8745 *hello darkness my old friend...*

[@wonder815]

*GuYss ThIs Is sO CrInGeY!1! I pLaY FoRtNiTe!!!1!*

[@sniff494]

Who would win An original comment A boring copy pasted boi

[@wonder815]

@@sniff494 ?

[@fantomp1773]

Solution to platform camping, make his moves destroy platforms

[@davishmayo1643]

the ultimate buff

[@AnakinFury]

Make his neutral B like One Punch Man's air punches. Then Mac would have a useful projectile.

[@francescolombardi3438]

@@AnakinFuryLike Knuckle Joe's Vulcan Jab?

[@ayar2]

Solution to platform camping?? pick another character, or dont go to tournaments at all, people will do anything to win.

[@GoldHeartWarrior]

This could work.

[@k96man]

When game he comes from is all about dodging and punishing you would think his Dodge wouldn't be such trash

[@runningoncylinders3829]

That would actually be a good way to buff him. Make the invincibility period earlier, last longer, and have an option for attacking out of a dodge.

[@danielquigley5090]

To be fair his dodges in punchout are also kinda trash, by design, mind you, but in the late game you get fractions of a second or you'll get bopped

[@thejedisonic67]

@@danielquigley5090 the difference is in punch out your dodges don't get slower and your invincibility frames decrease

[@johneden2033]

@@runningoncylinders3829 Lol I just commented saying the same thing. It's so weird that a "boxer" character plays absolutely nothing like a boxer.

[@Spubbily01]

Nintendo: Does not nerf any of the OP characters. Also NIntendo: Nerfs little mac into non-existence.

[@Liliana_the_ghost_cat]

Also nintendo:buffs pikachu

[@ravensquote7206]

Little Mac: *Exists anyway, because good luck counting him out that easily*

[@TheAZNinvasion]

I think his design is purposefully flawed. He has always been an underdog. That's what makes winning with him so satisfying. I do think they've been overdoing it just a bit though. Nerfing an underdog just seems cruel.

[@_AniWatch]

Yea it's like steppingsteping on a broken toe.

[@bevvvy1374]

Underdog isn't the same as being almost unable to win against competent players

[@TheAZNinvasion]

@@bevvvy1374 I agree. Like I said, they're overdoing it.

[@blue1764]

@@_AniWatch best analogy ever.

[@RESNone208]

They buffed him in 3.1

[@SaiyanRick]

I swear...whenever I play against ppl that use Mac, I just feel so bad. Like not in a condescending way, but just that, I know macs recovery is ass and the second I push them far from the ledge, I gotta watch them fall to there doom. Had so many Mac players just SD on there last stock when I still have 3 stocks or 2 stocks. I literally find myself apologizing when I send them far away and watch them drop with no chance to get back. I even tried using Mac myself and realized...this man needs a saving grace. Like get this boi some milk containers full of buffs. 😢

[@matthewmorrison3745]

Then you have the people who think they're the shit despite both players being down to 1 stock

[@SaiyanRick]

@@matthewmorrison3745 thats a fact!

[@miles6711]

SaiyanRick ikr one time I won against a little Mac just by using’s Yoshi’s neutral B.

[@solitudeguard8122]

Thats why I always go for a spike whenever I knock them too far to recover

[@BugzyHamster]

Alright then bud 1v1 me. I won 5 tournaments with Mac and I feel like I can abuse his recovery

[@gamrage]

I feel like Ken and Ryu do pretty much everything that Little Mac should have been able to do. AND THEY HAVE PROJECTILES!!

[@stonersudowoodo7143]

And they do it better

[@DisplayThisOkay]

Mii Brawler too. Even tho he's pretty flawed himself.

[@Mr100Supermariobros]

the people mac goes up against are legitimately superhumans tanking straight hits from bulls, running faster than a bullet train, upercutting a bull out of of a stadium, punching so fast that they leave afterimages, destroying buildings with their bare fists, being trained by a bear, moving a fully loaded truck with their teeth, creating clones that can fight, etc mac is also so fast that when he stuns and delivers multiple hits on an opponent in-game, the timer slows down to show how fast he actually is

[@runningoncylinders3829]

@Manek Iridius Giga Mac is pretty special. Too bad that was relegated to the Final Smash.

[@lorenzguanzon2690]

It would be pretty cool if they redesigned him, pretty much based his move set based on all the boxers from different fighting games like Dudley, Balrog, Steve Fox, and so much more. With all of their techniques combine, we can make Little Mac so much better then the moves he has today. Reason he’s the champ isn’t just about hitting hard, he has an arsenal of techniques that boxers wouldn’t have. What they put, “what would a boxer do? I know! He is a hard hitter let’s go with that! He’s tiny but madly strong the best boxer in the world!” They put basic knowledge not did a good enough job with their homework. Plus seriously? Not an air fighter??!! Fucking worst decision when this game is FUCKING PLATFORM FIGHTING GAME!!! God these designers are dumbasses! We’re gamers and we do a pretty good job putting what ideas to give for Little Mac and make his design unique.

[@Awesoman9001]

Mac in normal smash: meh Mac in WoL: *deep breath* ONE PAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWNCH!

[@MTFaye]

This

[@sonicxburner]

Awesoman9001 what is wol

[@Awesoman9001]

@@sonicxburner world of light

[@sonicxburner]

Awesoman9001 thanks

[@Awesoman9001]

@@sonicxburner No problem

[@pawejakowiecki9055]

Any character mains: - Your main is bad. - NOOOO it's perfect!!1!!1 Little Mac mains: - Your main is bad. - We know.

[@Kat0407]

I mean, Steve is like one of the best

[@Squirtle_Squad_Supremacy]

Ganon

[@smoceany9478]

top tier mains: my character is actually shit tier, none of my attacks work as theyre supposed to, anyone who says my characters good doesnt know this game low tier mains: my main could destroy god with a blindfold on, this is the greatest character in the game

[@0knothing443]

Peanut: _"I'm gonna pretend I didn't hear that"_

[@wingedbluj1674]

That dude gave Mac wings.

[@Kiteminu]

13:37 I got so used to Ultimate Knockback that I thought that wasn't going to kill

[@BlackandBlack018]

King Weedede facts

[@Underworlder5]

i remember when i first saw ultimate footage and all i thought was "wow, that is going to KO... never mind". i had that thought process about twice a minute

[@jocabulous]

leet

[@theninjustice138]

I don't understand why Sakurai cannot have Mac's Side B have reset ; - ;

[@anthonys3587]

My brother mains Little Mac and this is the thing he complains about the most

[@DroppyD]

As a little mac main it physically hurts me when i could have recovered if my side b reset

[@shane3350]

I'm a Lil mac main also. If side b would reset, I would have zero complaints about his many other disadvantages.

[@jakedanielsen4512]

What is reset? Can somebody please explain, I tried looking it up

[@pretzels7437]

@@jakedanielsen4512 moves comes back after being hit. Think of someone hitting with a weak move after you use up b you can use up b again

[@NesuProps]

To make Mac slightly viable is: 1- Removing his penalty of using Side B once. 2- Improving his grab range and at least giving back throw a more knockback, so it wouldn't be a situational kill option at 145%. 3- Arranging his airdodge to have a more decent distance and functionality. 4- Fix some inconsistencies on his ground game for his follow-ups

[@kfoley275]

I'd also slightly buff his aerials so they deal 2% more damage, and kill sub 300% (I'd say around 230), and give nair knockback (but have it kill at 500)

[@mrmwm5446]

NesuProps Also give him 12 jumps

[@NesuProps]

Outta of my ring.

[@bobjeezorham7658]

Nah, just put super armor on all of his moves.

[@derpyquagsire6678]

Also fix his ko punch to actually be strong in the air. Make straight lunge in the air be more like Ike side b. Give ridiculous super armor on charging straight lunge. Buff his gentleman so it's easier to do the Dream Land Express

[@The_Mister_E]

"Okay. Little Mac. We made his ground game about as good as a realistic boxer should be, and as a result his aerial game isn't his forte!" "But what about if he wants to get a kill around the edges of the blast zone, where it's just plain easier to kill? What if he's getting pressured off stage in a game where you die if you're off of the stage?" "Pssh! Then just Don't Get Hit™!" "You know he isn't the fastest, bulkiest, nor the hardest hitting character in the game right?" "Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh THE DIE-HARD PLAYERS WILL ADAPT OKAY?"

[@lorenzguanzon2690]

honestly, though, it's like they don't know what kind of design they were looking for. Do they think that no aerial game would work in a platform fighting game? Freaking Bullshit character design.

[@N3Knowledge]

I feel like the concept they were going for when designing Mac was poorly handled. It's true that he would be better off being more adapted to work on a platform fighting game, but even with just being a boxer, and being super athletic, it was flawed. Boxers, or just Martial Artists in general, are trained to be able to have high mobility. They need to be able to move around in any direction as means of avoiding hits. Looking at it that way, Mac suffers in some very key mobility areas. His roll is one of the worst in the game, having some of the least amount of intangibility frames of any roll. I see no good reason for Mac to not have a fantastic roll, since good boxers are able to dodge and weave in any way they need to to gain an advantage, but Mac's roll leaves him more vulnerable than most of the other characters in the game, which is bogus. Also, he has some of the worst air mobility in the game. Now, I understand why his air attacks are bad. Punching in the air is generally a bad idea in a real fight, since a good punch is generated from your hips, your core, and a strong planted stance, which you can't really get in the air. What I don't get is why he can't just move in the air better. He is 107 pounds and super ripped, yet he falls really quickly and has one of the worst jump heights in the game. I don't think anyone that ripped in real life would have such a piss jump height. It's better than Jigglypuff and Kirby, but they have 6 jumps. It's better than Snake, but he's strapped with heavy kevlar and weaponry at all times. It's better than Ganondorf, but he's slow in every way. Everyone else in the game has the same or better jump height than Mac. His jump height is worse than Bowser, which is ridiculous. I think Mac needs every part of his ground game and general mobility to not be amongst the worse, and to be at least average or good. It is true that Boxers aren't allowed to grab people when fighting, but if a boxer were to grab you and attack you, I guarantee that that boxer is going to do some major damage. Mac's grab should be good as well. Increase his grab range, make it faster, and give him something off of his grabs.

[@MSCDonkeyKong]

@@N3Knowledge It goes deeper than that, Mac's strategy in his actual games is that since he is such a small man compared to someone like Mr Sandman, Bald Bull, or even me, Donkey Kong, his gameplan revolves around dodging his opponents attacks and striking back when they're vulnerable. He literally only has 3 moves in his games being punching, dodging and blocking. Blocking is only ever used for big rushdown attacks like Honda Rush, so his _primary defensive option is his amazing dodging abilties_. So why does he have a shitty roll, airdodge, & air mobility? Even if his arials are weak, it makes less sense for GODDAMN LITTLE MAC FROM PUNCH OUT to have shitty dodges. I also find it out-of-character for jolt haymaker to exist in his moveset at all, just delete it. Little Mac would never do that in Punch Out, and he never could. That's not the Mac I know, the Mac I know uses his great evasion to dodge attacks and hit with quick attacks, not this bootleg Bull-Rush bullshit. Even then, Bull Rush can't be hit out of startup in Punch Out. The move is iconic because its scary to go up against this big fucking man while your only hope is to hit him in the stomach _while hes charging at you at mach speeds with an instant-kill attack_, and its triumphant when you overcome an obstacle like this. Imagine if you could hit bald bull while he's at the back of the ring and getting all revved up! He would be such a clown! Well, you can do that with jolt haymaker, or you could just jump over it and abuse its MASSIVE endlag. I could probably eat 2 bananas in the time it would take Mac to recover from Jolt Haymaker. And why does he have the meter from the Arcade game? Who the fuck wanted the meter from the arcade game attached to the character from the NES and Wii game. He should've had Star Punch. What the fuck is his uptilt supposed to be? Why doesn't he uppercut you like Mii Brawler, CONSIDERING HE DOES IN THE GAME AND ITS ONE OF HIS 2 GODDAMN PUNCHES. Mac needs a redesign extremely badly, even with being a boxer he's this weird amalgamation between how he fights in his games and how the enemies in his games fight. They gave him jolt haymaker because "wouldn't it be cool if he did bull rush, the most iconic and out of character move for LITTLE FUCKING MAC to perform in Smash?" Urgh, this is some F-Zero levels of home series representation here.

[@ThiccJuicyNut]

@@MSCDonkeyKong You good?

[@ThiccJuicyNut]

And so we did, we adapted into something

[@KazeMemaryu]

I said from the very beginning that Mac is a completely misdesigned character within the context of SSB's general flow. The fact that he loses to pretty much every character in the game simply due to his terrible air-game is an almost insane conceptual issue, and basically makes him unsalvageable without actual redesigns. Buffs alone won't balance him out - he needs new moves. A good anti-air, an anti-projectile, and a proper setup tool to make him more unpredictable, in addition to giving him actual advantages (like way superior shield damage or less endlag on whiff).

[@PaypsAgain]

I think his aerial was killed bc in punch out Wii his three star punch sent him a good few feet into the air and usually did 1/2 to 3/4 of the opponents hp

[@Luigiofthegods]

They should have designed Mac to consistently play like he looks in Replay Hut videos, dancing around his opponent and pulling off Sheik combos with the perfect precision and execution, like a real boxer does.

[@Underworlder5]

ideally, he should play like in punch out: examining his opponents habits and exploiting them. dodging attacks, leaving the opponent vulnerable while he responds with a flurry of punches. intercepting the attack to leave an opening, looking for the perfect moment to end the match there and now... but gets punished hard with every mistake he makes

[@waluigist]

Luigiofthegods like in his reveal agains dedede

[@dustymcwari4468]

He actually plays BETTER than in Punch-Out: in the actual games Little Mac’s attacks are weak and have less priority than every other character, it’s more like THEY have the armor, not Little Mac himself; his punches are a single punishable straight punch, just some good old one-two combos for as long as the enemy is stunned, and an uppercut; and his meters, regardless of game, if you get hit, it decreases to even empty the bar completely in the older games, whereas in Smash it just goes up for getting spanked over and over, unless of course the meter is full. In Smash he’s more like a Boss version of himself, a miniature Mr. Sandman even.

[@fattytan1377]

Make him a punish character. But I suppose I use Luigi so nyeh. I punish as a second nature anyway

[@ivrydice0954]

IRL Boxer combos are fake. No way they dancing like a ninja.

[@edfreak9001]

Little Mac: the character that is pretty much inarguably the worst character in the game and yet still nobody wants to fight against him.

[@JustButton]

edfreak9001 worst, but volatile. KO punch is upset city if you disrespect it

[@np8139]

Well yeah, it's like winning a fight against someone who's handicapped. If you win, no one is impressed. If you lose, people think that you really suck.

[@homerunhitter9024]

Mac online is about as cancerous as the Belmonts are.

[@Redbird-dh7mu]

Little Mac may be fairly bad, but he always has a shot for victory, his KO punch is there if things are going badly, and he is still fairly dangerous on the ground. He is the ultimate underdog, he may not be the best, but victory is never out of reach... unless you play against any character that can launch you, in which case watch out.

[@Smeik2901]

nobody wants to fight a smash and dash attack spamming piece of shit. I have yet to see a little mac using anything else than side b and smash/dash attacks

[@Ancor3]

I think that Mac could vastly be improved by the reworking of a single move, his counter. Both Incineraor and Joker have shown us just how powerful it is to have a counter that boosts your stats and moveset, giving the same thing to Mac would help him immensely. Imagine having a counter that fills up your KO meter, especially if you'd give Mac the option to hold down counter like Joker can. Mac's problems with projectiles would largely be solved, people would have to actually fight Mac. Mac would have a decent landing option, but he would still have bad recovery. If they rework his counter, Mac will jump from the absolute bottom tier to mid-tier in a heartbeat.

[@bobijameep1344]

funny you talk about Incineraor because , correct me if i'm mistaking but, doesn't little mac's smash attacks do slightly, pitifully nigh negligible bit more damage if you hit someone after super armor - ing a attack. it would be nice if they could buff that damage if so.

[@vishalmenon4595]

Although I find this interesting this would end up being yet another nerf to his recovery cause I've personally used the counter to recover on many occasions as well as seen others do the same but if it's switched to a joker or incin counter it would completely stall his air movement if he does it in the air and well... we all know what happens after that. The character barely makes it back when he has momentum in the air

[@aeris1257]

This would greatly add more reason to use grabs to exploit little Mac, especially when landing. I don't believe he should hold the counter but I do think it filling the K.O meter is a great idea. I think they should buff his spot dodge. It's fast and has a small amount of intangiblity. Stuff like that I think should be fixed to give him an answer to people with grabs like Samus, Bowser, ect and an answer for projectiles.

[@crinsombone5380]

I think his counter should feel more like Punch Out and lock opponents into a combo, while also filling his ko meter. I think his ko punch alsi needs a rework. I think you should be able to stall it and aim it in different directions, while having high defense and super armor while performing and stalling it, plus giving it less starting and ending frames, and the ability to recover with it if used in the air. It could make it broken but I think you should only be able to fill the meter with parries, dodges, counters, and air attacks so that more skilled players could use it more, and it would feel more like Punch Out

[@Brandonious15987]

@@vishalmenon4595 I don't think that would be a problem as long as you can release it on hit to still preform a counter.

[@leaffinite2001]

Seeing the footage of the marth and simon camping at the end absolutely enrages me. Its completely unacceptable for a character to be that shit its infuriating

[@JCElzinga]

you should see me camp him with pikachu and quick attack then...

[@leaffinite2001]

@Puppy 47 im not so self-deprecating as to play lil mac, dudd

[@wingedbluj1674]

You know, when I play Mac (I main him too), I don't feel like I'm playing smash, I feel like I'm playing Punch Out. In his own games, Mac's always been at a disadvantage, and I feel this translates well into smash. Weather or not this feeling of constantly being behind your opponent was intentional or not, Mac is and always will be the underdog. This is actually something a lot of people can relate with, me included. How many people out there are the best at what you want to be good at? Exactly. People can relate with being the guy who seems like the whole world is against them, but still have the strength to fight for their goal. They fight not because they WILL win, but because they CAN win, even against all odds. That's why I will never betray my main, no matter how low he gets. I'll be there with him to the end.

[@komo4379]

Winged BluJ I agree. He has always been at disadvantage because of his opponents because of strength or height as he is nicknamed little Mac. He’s just a regular boxer, a underdog. Imagine a boxer fighting a pink blob that can swallow him😂. He always finds a way through those obstacles in the end tho and so can you. You just have to practice I guess

[@RinZDR]

The thing is an underdog has the chance to beat the strongest things by extreme skill, but in smash? It´s impossible that a little mac player beats mkleo or even any of the top players, (excluding online cuz it´s doodoo) the only way is by having mkleo randomly sd´ing or being extremely lucky, and even that´s hard, In paper it´s a good concept but it´s just not brought to it´s full potential, with actual buffs, he could potentially beat a top player, but for now he´s just a noob killer, good against scrubs but crap against good players. And before you mention Zero beating mkleo, that was an online match, giving leo a disadvantage and Zero was mostly mashing cuz it´s online.

[@manologamerss5801]

That's not at all how I remember Punch Out feeling. Being behind in Punch Out, especially in TD (TD Soda Popinski is still the only one I can't reliably beat) means you're getting your ass kicked, and the main thing you should be aiming for is to take it as a learning opportunity, you need to learn the opponent's habits and patterns. You CAN struggle your way to a victory, with chocolate bars and proper recovery, but you do it through consistent effort, you aren't just forced into disadvantage the entire match and then pull a win out of nowhere. If you know what your opponent is going to do, you don't get put into a disadvantage in Punch Out, in fact the last game is strictly made with the ability to no-hit fights in mind, and the better you play the shorter fights are.

[@gilbertguerrero2916]

I have mained little Mac since the dawn of smash 4 and continue to do so in ultimate and I can say I have NEVER seen that happen in ultimate. 21:50... This character is a travesty I tell you... EDIT: also the 2nd worst nerf Mac got was the removal of the orange alt...

[@iggnifyre6333]

I miss black-shirt-yellow-shorts Mac

[@zeadogs8174]

@@iggnifyre6333 The one with the orange gloves? That was my main costume choice for Mac.

[@cronasan6931]

They really should just add an alternate costume option kinda like slap city for all relevant characters like Mac Mario Wario Link etc and have 8 palletes for them all lord knows I'd be using a black variation of the wedding Mario if I could Also seeing that Neutral B whiff just made me so unhappy I had to put the video down for a bit just like why?

[@NightMare_SSB]

I miss blue mac

[@Luigiofthegods]

Gilbert Guerrero They should give him 16 alts again but change the color of the wireframe to match the costume so they don't all look the same

[@thecrimsoncreep6665]

"Little Mac has the single worst counter in the game" Mii Brawler wants to: -Know your location

[@sirstack59]

In ultimate?

[@thecrimsoncreep6665]

@@sirstack59 Mii Brawler didn't have a counter in 4 you fool. Of course Ultimate.

[@zeadogs8174]

@@thecrimsoncreep6665 It's weird that Mii brawler has one of the worst counter in the game but Mii swordfighter's counter is insane.

[@thecrimsoncreep6665]

@@zeadogs8174 The only issue with Mii Sword's counter is that it sends upward, which makes cheesing recoveries impossible unless they die from it.

[@sirstack59]

@@thecrimsoncreep6665 in that case mii brawler actually has the strongest counter in the game with a 1.5x multiplier

[@faldororlaridon2691]

As a Little Mac Main in smash 4, I was so ticked off about all the people who got their hands on the Ultimate Demo and said "Little Mac is so busted, Nintendo needs to tone him down!" As soon as the game came out we found put he was not that great, you can't make such rash decisions based on a first impression of a volatile character. I'll still play Mac and have a good time, in spite of his flaws.

[@notfunnyperson3496]

“Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it” ~ K.rool

[@roy43222]

Same i still love little mac and honestly i like using him more than anybody at times because since he struggles i like me a good challenge not that i wish for him to suffer but i hope he will be remembered for who he is

[@CoolBuster2002]

Nice devotion 👍

[@Squaw56]

I also admire your dedication but I honestly don't understand how anyone has fun playing mac. Unless your just trashing bad players, playing as or against little mac is a chore. The most optimal strategy like discussed in the video is to platform camp, and when you're fighting a half decent mac there's no reason not to. Whenever I come up against a mac I'm never thinking "oh this will be fun" lol it's always either "free" or "guess I'll sit around for the next 7 minutes."

[@roy43222]

@@Squaw56 lol i try my best and even if i lose i tried

[@jordantorres49]

Shout out to the people who main little mac y'all are the real champs 😭🏆

[@lordtullus9942]

I main little mac because I love playing as him. That's it. I got worse and worse with marth and link so I keep them around as other characters I play with. Now I have a 9 character "rotation" including mac and its quite enjoyable. If ZSS wasn't complete ass. And no, not in the hot way.

[@bleuthepichu]

Thanks, it's hard being a Mac Main

[@istoleyourwaifu9218]

Thanks ❤❤❤

[@donlazar471]

thanks buddy

[@broccoliboi6707]

Thanks, Little Mac gives his all and so do I!

[@hiimjusthere802]

Who would win... A goddess with a magic stick Or A really good boxer

[@coolguy02536]

Little Mac he's a really good boxer

[@Lone_Shadow_Masanaga_the_Spear]

@@coolguy02536 xD

[@sandeequigleyshapiro7703]

Little Mac is not a really good boxer HES THE CHAMP

[@The_child-catcher]

My money is on the out of shape plumber.

[@Ruhimiya]

This is a really good video and I appreciate the time spent analyzing this character, but this just made want to cry because of how bad mac actually is.

[@nomnom2298]

If you want to get good at little mac you have yo get good at predicting once you're good at that little mac will be very strong

[@thecpmr6276]

Keep fighting, man. We all just gotta keep fighting.

[@oniuserjh]

good lord smash 4 looks like its in slow-mo when shit gets hit hard, maybe they could make his neutral b a charge and store style move like samus neutral b or dk's. would need some more start up frames but it would make it dangerous and usable

[@ken7007]

You know what that's a Perfect idea I don't know why they didn't do that with him

[@troykv96]

Little Mac suffers a lot basically for being a noob killer. And Ganondorf is even better at that anyway.

[@lordtullus9942]

I will agree here ONLY because of your micaiah pfp

[@Sanguinor_Energy]

basically this

[@Dabajaws]

I don't know about that chief

[@StardustNRP]

Not to be that guy but wasnt the point of ultimate to be a complete disconnect from melees technical play (at least according to sakurai) so isnt having a noob killing character a bad thing?

[@Avengedtenfold]

@@StardustNRP Eh, noob killers vary in style from game to game. Ganon just has really easy kill pattern that are hard to pull off against people who know when to block, grab or punish correctly which new players don't really. In melee basically every character is a noob killer if the other player knows the game's mechanics.

[@ventbott]

James charles : makes a 40 minute video exposing tati Tati : makes a 40 minute video exposing james charles This guy : makes a 40 minute video exposing a video game boxer

[@BrainlessWizard]

Can't wait for the 40 mins video of the videogame boxer exposing Rekzius

[@swigtimefoxy4422]

Brainless Wizard plot twist: the coach makes the 40 minute video exposing Rekzius

[@memperkasaya2078]

Who asked

[@Sappysappster]

4:40 You forgot one major perk here my dude *-DORIYAH!*

[@kachosuffer7]

normie

[@dankeykang868]

Nice to see someone speak about a character most people forget exists

[@anasazilespider5574]

how can we, he everywhere in quickplay

[@daed1819]

*Wii fit trainer wants to know your location*

[@redshepherd32]

@@anasazilespider5574 yeah but mostly cause the handful of people who remain loyal to him despite the flaws. That, or are deliberately handicapping themselves online.

[@anasazilespider5574]

@@redshepherd32 ah true, kinda like the people that used wii fit in sm4sh

[@rarenaoto7633]

who tf is duckhunt

[@rileyclevenger7260]

Since Mac is a character that relies on reads, what if they implemented a feature that extended the length of his side-b and up-b for every successful counter? Or better yet, what if he had a Revenge feature like Incineroar that made his aerials slightly better

[@PaypsAgain]

Fun fact:His up b is worse in the air than on ground making it usually useless

[@james8616]

He doesn’t rely on reads though, his grounded movement only loses to sonic I think? He can catch up to anyone that isn’t in the air, react to anything if he needs to

[@AidanRatnage]

I main Little Mac, it suits me perfectly because I have no off-stage game.

[@vickdagoat4980]

You dont think maining mac is why you have no off stage game?

[@AidanRatnage]

@@vickdagoat4980 Nope, I also main Ridley.

[@ahappyiguana2475]

#BuffTheMac ? Maybe? I mean Ken was kinda laughable in Ultimate and then 3.0 came and buffed him makig him a real threat, so why not Mac?

[@felixc.4294]

Still hoping man...

[@franknieto6740]

Despite everything, there's still so many of us who choose to play Little Mac, and are fighting against all odds. I just found Peanut on YT about 2 months ago and his dedication to Mac is unlike anything I've ever seen. It gives me hope in my little Mac heart

[@wetube6513]

I also main little mac and I realise that 90% who plays smash plays little mac all wrong.

[@jonathansmith6302]

What if his side B in ultimate had heavy armor in terms of buffing recovery? You can decide the max tanking percent of the heavy armor. Or maybe light heavy armor for charging smash attacks so weak hits don't make him flinch when charging? If these changes were to come as well as other buffs I would not have issue with it because of the counterplay.

[@ataruDev]

So here are my proposed changes for a better Little Mac: The main goals here are to make his weakness less apparent while keeping his playstyle in tact. Let me know what you guys think. 1) give grounded side-B really good invincibility / armor. This would help him beat zoning. 2) make it so that he can store the charge on neutral-B. This gives him a way to force an approach from the opponent, and gives him access to a really scary kill move. 3) aerial neutral-b gives him vertical momentum at a similar angle to wolf flash. This gives him one more recovery option, and helps him deal with platform camping just a little bit. 4) completely change down-b. Instead of counter, give him an invincible dash downward, similar to Lucario in Project M. He now has a better landing option and can pseudo-waveland.

[@bradleylindsey3540]

I don't know about anything else, but in my eye I'd change down-b to a counter that doesn't hit back. It just activates a powerful windbox that completely separates Mac and his opponent. And then if you get a counter by a slim margin, you get a "star" that powers up your next smash attack or something.

[@Mimiiii_VEV0]

you guys have some pretty badass ideas here, too bad that nintendo will never try to do something similar :(

[@Chadmiral]

@@bradleylindsey3540 Well in Smash 4 Little Mac *does* have a custom move that allows him to dash forward when the counter is activated.

[@orinshauger8491]

It would be awesome if he had something that works like clouds limit break. It would possibly be OP, but still awsome. Neutral b can be a fully charged straight lunge That comes out as fast as DKs punch. Side b will be the KO punch, but the reach can be shorter than a normal side b. It might keep the move roughly the same. Up b can make the second punch continue the rising momentum and have a third finishing uppercut. Down b, like 11thhour Breadford said, gives you a star and increase knockback for a smash attack. And when the counter hits, a free roll in whichever direction you want will be given. Like lucario and greninja on the ground.

[@Chadmiral]

@@orinshauger8491 I like this idea of yours...a lot...

[@cerwiggle1609]

I would give an extremity for there to be a video this well-made and informative on every Smash character

[@MrJapanUnderground]

And now we have Peanut making Little Mack look like a god.

[@forresttoyne8559]

I think if you take mac versus peach you get a perfect example of just how important aerial mobility is. Peach has decent to bad moves all around but shes a top tier skill pick because of the aerial mobility .

[@siveon298]

"Buffer system" Is that whats causing everyone I know to airdodge and SD at least once a night

[@uraccountcrashed8845]

yes

[@siriuslywastaken]

Yeah buffering is poorly designed Honestly I'm beginning to think most of ultimate is

[@afromarco005]

@@siriuslywastaken you are just bad thats all

[@siriuslywastaken]

afromarco005 or maybe you don't understand enough about how the game plays.

[@salj.5459]

R U Sirius Fuck the buffering system and short hop macro. The two WORST changes in Ultimate.

[@buttersddragon]

They should've made his counter in ultimate the combo counter custom move he had in 4. It'd give him a unique counter move, and it'd be a better representation of his games seeing as when you get a hit off on the opponent in punch-out, you generally don't just get one strong hit and instead get set up for a string of hits.

[@iggnifyre6333]

THANK YOU! for this video. I've been saying for a while now that people who ask to get buffs for Little Mac need to realise that it won't make him good. Buffing what's good about him won't make him better, and buffing what's bad about him still won't make those moves good because they need a complete overhaul as moves. Little Mac as a character is just stuck in the wrong game and I struggle to even call him functional, having half the moveset that other characters do. I REALLY wished they'd change him going into Ultimate but at this point they might as well remove him just so they can add him back with serious changes.

[@darienmiller1032]

This video gave me the inspiration to create a similar video about kirby, as I've been feeling disillusioned with him since the beginning of smash 4. Thank you making a great video Rekzius!

[@autumn4442]

"The sun may not look as bright on the horizon as I originally thought, but is that because the sun is rising or setting? I guess only time will tell." Dang, great way to end the video. I've always wanted to main little mac, but I don't have a wii u or switch. But If ever I do, I'll play little mac from time to time, and will always hope he gets buffs.

[@YannickMertens-fk9nr]

“LIL MAC MAINS RISE UP” “wait” “he can’t do that”

[@memetos9375]

Lol

[@atomiclight8574]

Can YOU grab someone with boxing gloves! That's what I thought

[@aeris1257]

You fight crocodiles with cannons that can launch the balls at an extremely slow rate and suck and blow it in another direction, a hedgehog that can essentially move at the speed of sound, and a guy that farts with the force of a rocket launching into space. It's a fair point but they've thrown logic out the window so many times in this game especially

[@isavage3740]

Kirby literally doesn’t have fingers

[@aeris1257]

@@isavage3740 😂😂😂😂

[@callmeaweeb4169]

@@isavage3740 lmao

[@runningoncylinders3829]

I've always wondered how Strong Bad types with boxing gloves on, but whenever I try asking him he deletes the message.

[@excelsior7345]

Ways I would buff Mac: -Give him back his Smash 4 combos -Give him the least amount of end lag in the game out of all of his moves -Increase the range slightly on his side+b -Increase range significantly on up+b -Give him more damage output -Make his counter similar to Grininja's, giving an answer to projectiles -Give his aerials a bit more viability. Just a bit. Give them more range or keeo them out longer Ways Sakurai and his tean buff Mac: _MoRe SuPeR aRmOr_

[@felixc.4294]

Sakurai pls. Add this man to your design team

[@ElDrHouse2010]

how to buff mac: dont who gives a fuck about that boring ass character

[@runningoncylinders3829]

@Samuel Amadi Even Wii Fit Trainer has Dhalsim's freaky yoga powers. What's Mac's excuse? He trains so hard he never makes time to study the arcane arts? That'll ensure his foes will always be three steps ahead of him.

[@runningoncylinders3829]

@Samuel Amadi If Smash ever decides to carry on but with cutbacks to the roster I 70% feel like they'll demote Little Mac back to Assist Trophy. That'd be the saddest retirement ever and a real slap in the face to him.

[@CornCarson]

@@ElDrHouse2010 hard agree. Pacman is more relevant in smash. Fucking PACMAN.

[@scarffoxandfriends9401]

"Buffer system doesn't do anything for anyone" Ice Climber mains: hold my hammers

[@felixc.4294]

They did buff his Jab a lot in 3.1.0. Surprised that that wasn't mentioned

[@andresortiz9558]

This was made before 3.1.0

[@spreadwuvokay]

Also that was nerfed

[@broom2839]

Little Mac feels like a character they wanted to design heavily around boxing rather than the actual gameplay of Punch Out. Unfortunately, you can tell they don't know shit about boxing considering Mac has a terrible grab and has super armor on his punches. Remember the time Floyd powered through a right hand to his jaw from Manny and proceeded to uppercut him through the roof? No because that's fucking stupid. Not to mention that the super armor doesn't even make sense for Punch Out anyway, since the game heavily emphasizes NOT getting hit.

[@Phun-Bun]

*Every smash player in existence: oMG LIttlE maC IS sO bad, wHo PLaYs hIm?* *Peanut: Allow me to introduce myself.*

[@WalkinStereotype]

Personally ways that I think they should buff Mac: • Increase his grab range • Give him a dodge effect like Bat Within or Foresight, but give him either more armor or to not take any damage when performing it. The idea behind this is to match his style of combat in Punch Out (Dodge and counter! Dodge and counter! -Doc Louis) and give him a better way to deal with air threats. To a similar effect, they could buff his counter too. I’m not saying for them to increase his damage though because Little Mac deals very little damage in his games as well. He’s meant to not be the strongest.

[@aliceisntleaving]

Having a dodge effect actually makes sense in the context of punchout.

[@jacemasood3019]

WELP looks like this story gets a happy ending! Post patch 13

[@notyou6674]

mac isn't a glass cannon, more like a good cannon that's been sawed in half.

[@notalive5479]

I would say that Mac is a true glass cannon. It is damaged by outside forces extremely easily, and shatters when you try to fire it.

[@joshriley2936]

We should ship some Flex Tape over to Japan, that might help fix Mac.

[@arnaud14]

Sakurai designed Little Mac for For Glory, and only For Glory :0

[@ayar2]

and even then it turned too powerful in the beginning that he was nerfed XD

[@runningoncylinders3829]

No Items Mac only Final Destination 2 Stocks.

[@Carolyne_games]

In smash 4 I played mac a lot and also thought that the counter wasn’t great, but couldn’t think of something better. After seeing incineroar’s down b in ultimate though, I started to feel that revenge is exactly what mac should’ve got ...

[@---ng7ke]

18:47 are we all gonna just ignore that amazingly big brain play, extending the hitbox on the bike

[@SareuoueMado]

How to fix him -Give his KO invulnerability frames until he can react again -Give back his down tilt and make better his grounded moves in general -Make better his airdodge -Give him back his side B when hit after using it while airborne -Change his neutral B, now it has a consistent hitbox and it can be charged -Change his aerials so they have angles that give them ultra combo potential, but giving them the same endlag and startlag they have now (This is important for the next point) -Changing down B, now it is not a regular counter but when someone hits you while using it, all of your aerials, tilts and jabs change their frame data for a reasonable amount of time so that they start on frame 2-3 and they can be cancelled in any moment of the animation to use another move, any normal move that seems affected by this property and has kill power lowers it power so instead of it being a kill option it turns into a combo option, this special is called "fast frame" or "fatal frame" -Make his KO consistent

[@lukejohnson29]

StereoDreamer Made, that would be so scary for other characters to fight against.

[@m_winewood]

Why would they allow him to throw out a move as strong as KO punch and not receive repercussions? You cant just throw out the strongest move in your arsenal for free. Naturally its your job to not miss and your reward is not being punished.

[@mamodokod]

Do people not know that KO punch goes through shields cuz I just run up and they shield I'll just KO punch

[@K3v1n343]

u just want to make him a broken character

[@lordtullus9942]

Problem with most of that: Smash was not created to be a competitive combo game.

[@purpkiddpurp]

This is one of the best Videos I have seen about Mac and Smash in general. I agree with everything you said here. Very well organized and well put together video. Spread the word guys. #BUFFMAC

[@TNinja0]

I don't quite like Ultimate's KO punch. Goodness, he kills himself if he uses it even slightly close to a ledge. That little jump he does just throws him off.

[@magikarpwillsurvive2695]

If KO Punch is used by ledge and Mac falls off due to the ending animation, jump immediately after using KO Punch and up B. He usually can make it back on stage

[@Midgetpokemon]

Dtilt UpB isn't gone. It goes by Dempsey tilt now. Watch Biglightning

[@aeris1257]

It's way harder to set up while fighting, especially since you can't run past people in this game, you have to be really close to get it to work

[@YounesLayachi]

I'm only watching this 40 MINUTES VIDEO ABOUT LITTLE MAC (of all things) because I know you make quality content xD It's crazy tho

[@four-en-tee]

40 minutes is short in my case. I'm used to watching video essays that are at least an hour and a half long. Content creators like MauLer have made series that are 3+ hours long (his longest video essay atm ranging around 9 hours), and one of my favorite video essays is a 5 hour long retrospective of TES4: Oblivion.

[@WinCla]

Little Mac is basically a man in depression arc.

[@bnc1430]

Drops like Hits like Dashes like Recovers like A brick.

[@mysterym6757]

Peanut on youtube IS the little mac player base

[@voltmanta7075]

On the fix Little Mac Project: 1. Down-tilt leads into combos ala Smash 4- return _all_ of his combos from Smash 4 2. Initial jump is higher (enough to reach lower platforms so gimping isn't much of an issue) 3. Side-b "recharges" when you get hit (makes being edge-guarded manageable instead of impossible) 4. Preference- Make his counter the Slip Counter from Smash 4's custom moveset. Less damage and knockback, but faster and knocks your enemies slightly away from you, allowing for combos instead of one strong hit 5. Something no one's talked about- allowing Little Mac to "pocket" the B-neutral, similar to DK's charge punch or Samus' Charge Shot. Despite the terrible lag, the mind games would be unreal if you could that move stored up and unleash it in any time during the match- you could use it as a quick movement tool, a way to circumvent mac's range problems (SA should be>most projectiles), and even as a way to recover if you're off the stage and have no other options The other options were super armor on Side-B and up-B, though i'm not sure if that would completely break him

[@Darkness19Z]

I feel like they need to remove the side-B flaw so you can use it more than once in the air and give it back it range on the ground. Remove super armor on his smash attacks but replace them with some type of shockwave,make it someone like Roy's sword mechanic where it dose more damage if his fist hits. Give back his tilt combos back,and give more range for his grab. Make his throws more easy to combo with. and more his jump a little higher and fix his shitty air dodge.

[@hexhiaa]

honestly if air dodge had little end lag it would be viable as fuck

[@QualityGamingStudios]

As a kirby main, I understand your troubles in smash 4

[@tornadoandy123]

The longer I watched this, the more upset I got. Even with the issues in Smash 4, I still mained him. But looking at all the points and evidence you've presented, it's enough to make a loyalist cry. Feels too damn sad, man. Either way, it was a great video. Good shit, my dood.

[@Phychologik]

4:44 PICHU WANTS TO KNOW YOUR LOCATION

[@TheCoooom]

The blue costume was my favorite too! Idk what they're doing tbh

[@plentyofpaper]

As a secondary character, Little Mac got a major buff in Smash Ultimate in that stage select comes before character select. If your other character can deal with tri-plats, you can stage strike other stages, and pull out Little Mac only if the remaining stage is reasonably favorable for him.

[@suitrBJ]

I genuinely believe little mac needs to be completely reworked. No more of this 'not an air fighter,' shit. I feel like little mac is less fun simply for the fact you have 5 moves you don't/ can't want to use. He needs to be a normal character. To trade for his grounded moves make him more technical, like dancing blade but many more.

[@nef36]

Little Mac's only move that is based off of gameplay from from his home game is also the worst of it's kind in Ultimate. R.I.P. Down B.

[@its_haydos]

HIS SMASH 4 KILL CONFIRMS ARE BACK BABY MAC MAINS RISE UP

[@baddragonite]

Smash Community: Little Mac Sucks! Also the Smash Community: They can't buff little mac he'll be so toxic if he got buffed!

[@CabeliotCometier]

How to make Mac's neutral 4x better instantly: Allow him to combo DThrow into KO Punch Let him grab release/DThrow into upward FSmash Let him punch projectiles out of the air consistently

[@Cerbleur07]

Rekzius: they removed the blue costume in Ultimate, why?, that's a dumb Nerf. Mario mains from 64, Melee and Brawl era (including myself): welcome to the club buddy.

[@markuscain4611]

Little Mac is basically Rock Lee without the agility and boosts

[@naotosenpai2789]

They just need to make him actually scary on the ground. Give him old dtilt Side b again if he gets hit and.it make go over projectiles. A actual grab Safe moves

[@slyfox9992]

It actually does go over a lot of projectiles

[@aeris1257]

In addition, I think that he should have invincibility on the bottom half of his body when doing side b, much like Cloud's down tilt

[@hi-i-am-atan]

I feel like it'd make more sense for one of his moves to be unblockable over improving his grab. After all, he doesn't specifically _need_ a grab, just a tool for mix ups and making "just shield him" less of an answer to him. I mean, really, would you expect a boxer to have a decent grapple? No, you'd expect him to punch around or _through_ a guard. I'm not sure what would be the most appropriate move to give the property to - maybe up smash, because it's an uppercut? - but there's certainly ways to solve the issues caused by a crappy grab other than just improving the grab.

[@aeris1257]

@@hi-i-am-atan making more of his moves unblockable would only make his weakness of range and air combat greater because it would promote that as a solution more than it already is. The match would be more based on dodging and beating out his moves with range and air attacks. A weakness that he can't get out of disadvantage really. It's fine that range and air attacks are his weakness but this would make it more highlighted and exploitable, especially since if you gave him more unblockables they'd have to dodge and end up weakening their spot dodge and rolls and grabs. Also I think it's fine to buff the range of his grab. Kirby and Marth has better grab range and one of them has nubs for hands and the other just uses one hand without sticking it out as far as he can. (less of the case with his dash grab cus it looks like his arm's reaching farther.) They through logic out the window many times, I think it's reasonable for Little Mac to have a decent grab and get good follow ups on them.

[@aeris1257]

@@hi-i-am-atan he doesn't heavily rely on grabs but it will benefit him in the long run, along with other buffs

[@mamodokod]

I hate how when I'm fighting someone with mac and win and they say you only won because the KO punch buts its because he disregards it and forgets it goes through shields

[@starlight5250]

How to make Mac good: Make his neutral B savable like Donkey Kong's punch. Cut the endlag by half. Make Mac be able to control his up b by slightly tilting it left or right in the air, like he can in the ground. Make counter stronger. Make KO punch be time limited instead of damage limited, like cloud's limit. Cut endlag by half. Give slightly more super armor to Neutral B as well. 15%.

[@TheSuperCasual2914]

Rekzius: Little Mac bad, throw away King of Skill, Peanut, and everyone who plays solo Little Mac: Hold my sports bottle

[@VeggiePun]

Mac is my boi I don't care what anyone says. He's the best boi

[@livingtoaster1358]

and my future dream is... to be the greatest little mac main

[@fammy1783]

As an elite smash little mac I have to say I am a elite smash little mac as if I'm vegan

[@bradley4612]

yo i went from 1 gsp to elite with mac fight me

[@mothermushroom_]

What gsp do you need for little mac elite? I'm at 4.6 million and still not in with him...

[@fammy1783]

Strip Dancer of the Frigid Valley - I got to elite as mac in the mid 4.7 million range so you are almost there!

[@MRGOLDMINEDUDEGAMING]

No one cares that your in elite...

[@fammy1783]

Muggy Ssb that's the joke

[@michaelsponseller5337]

*peanut has entered the chat*

[@inksaneluke7099]

At 4:43 as soon as I saw rage exists, I thought of the insane mario up tilt and up air chain. Ah, the Mario glory days....

[@AshenDemon]

4:42 BAD UP CLOSE... SHE'S GOOD ENOUGH. EVERY TIME I'M ANYWHERE NEAR HER, IT'S A GRAB (BECAUSE IT'S LONG AS HELL) OR AN UP B.

[@Z-ir]

I always hear about how easy he is to destroy, and how horrible he is, yet I feel like I see half the community saying they main him

[@rockythelittlemac3873]

Awesome content!

[@garrettoliva5154]

Bro he literally has boxing gloves on, no wonder his grab is ca-ca smh.

[@daevidpp445]

Garrett Oliva Kirby doesn’t even have fingers...

[@garrettoliva5154]

@@daevidpp445 #giveKirbyfingers

[@Timothy_-ve2zp]

When you were talking about how Little Mac’s trailer spoke to you and made you want to main him I know the feeling, I felt this way too about the Palutena trailer

[@cabinetthekid4575]

“You did good son... you did good...” -Doc Brown