The Secret to Better IEM Rigs (for touring bands)

[@breadmoneymusic]

Adam Neely slowly moving away from being the Vsauce of music to being the Technology Connections of music.

[@rebmcr]

"Thanks to the magic of buying thirty-two of them..."

[@PANDORAZTOYBOKZ]

Unironically could see Adam and Alec doing a crazy collab. Of what? No clue, but it would undoubtedly be incredible.

[@PearHellforge]

I love it. People will finally open their eyes to the technical side of music, which they've been actively ignored because music is an art.

[@jjptech]

Imposible, he needs more wrath for that and irony

[@caalmadacaalmada6618]

He can be both

[@price.gaines]

A couple comments from a pro AVL installer and FOH engineer. 1. You don’t actually need to know how to solder to terminate a PowerCon connector. For the male ends, there are 3 labeled screw terminals on the inside, and as long as you know which colours in your power cable are live, neutral, and ground (easily found on google), it takes about 90 seconds with some wire strippers and a precision screwdriver to put a powercon end on a cable. The panel-mount terminals sometimes require spade terminals or soldering though. 2. You can save a lot of money by buying your own ethercon connectors and making your own cables. Learning how to terminate RJ45 is fairly easy, especially with passthrough connectors being so widely adopted and reliable nowadays. You don’t even need to solder the shield wire anymore, most shielded RJ45 connectors have a little half-circle crimp terminal on the back of the connector that you can just wrap the shield wire around underneath. Premade shielded ethercon is super overpriced imho. You can even use premade shielded cables and just put your own ethercon barrels on, as long as you can easily remove the strain relief on the premade connector.

[@doproductions2008]

Spot on comment. Also wondering what you think about ground issues from FOH or accidental double phantom powering issues considering the catracks don't seem to have an isolated split. Seems like a recipe for disaster, but maybe I'm missing something. When he mentioned the weight of the catracks, I thought to myself, yes of course the catracks are lighter, there's no transformers!

[@coffeedudeguy]

Just have to make sure the Cat6 cables have stranded core, more pliable and less prone to copper fatigue like in solid core ‘install’ Cat6

[@jakubpodesva9802]

Amen!

[@JamesG.Griffin]

I wanted to say that you bas... (Presumably) Very nice person Edit: crimping ethercon sucks tho ngl

[@eflizotte]

I will say, I find the approach Adam took for power to be a good one. It would be much harder for the locking connectors you saw to come undone in travel than a spade crimp or a screw terminal. Unless the power cables in the rack were very well relived of strain, you risk something coming apart and having live, exposed wires in the rack. I know there are boots for PC etc… and I’m not saying it’s a significant likelihood of failure… but I find Adam’s approach here to be less likely to fail and less likely to be dangerous if it should

[@leroysquab]

On error proofing: I will always remember an instructor's quote from many years ago, "if you think you can make something foolproof, you have greatly underestimated fools."

[@jasonclark1149]

I heard a similar version which has haunted me for many years: "Nothing is ever foolproof, because the universe is constantly producing bigger fools."

[@davidmiller9485]

@@jasonclark1149 Both of these are from Mark Twain. Yours is more like the original but both get the idea across. Mark Twain has many quips that seem to apply to life and as I get older the more they apply.

[@ChiliDUDE27]

I remember seeing a comment on foolproofing from an engineer that went something along the lines of "you're not trying to build a floor that one person can walk across, you're trying to build a floor that one idiot can drop a fridge on."

[@SpencerHowe]

Hell yeah, this my dorky shit

[@gabevreyes]

Same. I heard “Over Ethernet” and I came running

[@thomaswhite3059]

System design! System design! I'm gonna do spreadsheets!

[@insolace]

Our band lives in the Behringer/Midas ecosystem. We bring our own mics and have the SD8 and SD16 digital stage boxes, and each member has their own P16 personal mix station. We have a 100FT ethercon cable we run between stage and FOH (if the venue doesn’t have any available) and we give the audio engineer (if we dont have our own) the M32R console on a keyboard stand, or they can mix from an iPad. These days most engineers know the X32/M32 consoles, and our touring session already has all of the DSP settings dialed in, so it doesn’t take a new engineer long to get a good mix up and running. And our ear mixes are always right where we left them. The beauty of digital consoles.

[@ricardohylton857]

This is pretty cool…. I never thought of just providing FOH for the venue their own mixer… Thanks

[@insolace]

@ this also keeps our lines separate from the other bands, they just set aside three channels for our LR/SUB outs

[@aidanknight]

Feel like I commented on the previous iteration of this rig but here I am again: Every independent band should be doing this, it's so worth it to have your monitoring consistent from night to night (although there's also inconsistent ambience from room to room which is another unforseen issue that you don't know until you've tried a rig like this). I'm building a studio with analog audio over ethernet right now, so this is right up my alley ;)

[@grantgardner9075]

I am a working electrical engineer and I learned a lot from this video. You applied your expertise in video editing and presenting information to so clearly describe the requirements, the design, the process, and the results in a way that I look forward to incorporating into my work. Engineering is a hat that fits you well

[@GaryRuschman]

This is making me so happy that when I toured full time, it was with an a cappella group working acoustically in concert halls!

[@petterrong1590]

7:05 This is the most important part of this video. By reducing the weight, you've given up transformer isolated split and opted for a passive split. It definitely does not fulfill the requirement of "error proof", since this introduces several drawbacks, like possibility of ground loops, signal degredation and of course introducing two stages of phantom power by accident. Also, Ethercon cables isn't a specific cable type, it only refers to the plug used. You can get Ethercon plugs for pre-terminated CAT cables of your own choosing. Or buy cables with Ethercon ports that doesn't weigh that much. However, you don't want them too thin either when they're bundled up together like the loom you showed

[@elliotcrane]

That’s what I was thinking about the transformer-less splitting, good observation.

[@raygunsforronnie847]

"Double phantom" isn't a thing so long at the standard is followed. -48V on pin 1, +48V on pins 2&3. Over the decades I've generally specified transformer splitters, but "wye" splitters tend to be fine so long as "we" have control over every connection to an input or output, and all our power comes from the same service. Any other hums or buzzes are from a failing or failed device, not a ground loop, and a transformer would not fix the noise problem. The AES finally arriving at a "Pin 1" standard helped, too, and separating the chassis ground from signal ground solved a bunch of noisess left over from 1980.

[@N.SLASH.A]

Pro tip: in low / odd-colored light situations where color coding can be difficult to see, tiny zip ties can be leveraged, 1 tie for input 1, 2 ties for input 2 etc. you can count them w your eyes AND fingers. Clear shrink wrapping your labeling can also help whatever labels you do use last longer.

[@jamesbyronparker]

for those of you doing this, audio over cat5*, ethernet isnt the cabling it's a packet switching protocol in network gear, I know its a seemingly stupid technicality but for anyone buying gear search that term, if you search ethernet you'll wind up with dante and similar tech, which is awesome (and a sometimes better, if more expensive solution) but not at all the same thing

[@forrcaho]

Yeah, "analog ... over ethernet" was breaking my brain, until I watched and found out he just meant the cables. Ethernet is a computer networking protocol.

[@AJMansfield1]

@@forrcaho Though if it _was_ actual ethernet, you wouldn't have to stay with copper at all really -- just put in some SFP transcievers and turn the entire stage snake into a single 2mm diameter run of optical fiber. (Unfortunately, I don't think there'd be any economical way to keep it fully in the analog domain with fiber -- not that it's impossible, but you're looking at VERY expensive custom transceiver hardware instead of cheap standardized SFP modules.)

[@jerry.berumen]

it could be more expensive but a Dante/AVB rig would be the next step for him. just one case for the rig, one more for the foh splitter and a long ass cat 6 cable

[@csnicholson]

@@jerry.berumenit is super expensive, but wouldn’t that be a dream, 1 cable like 16 channels of I/O

[@vinigretzky97]

@@AJMansfield1 Yeah, insisting on analog audio when you are going for 32 freaking channels (with so few players) seems very strange. At some point in the signal chain (both for the IEM and FOH), there will be A/D converters anyhow.

[@TonyBullard]

I totally get this obsession. I had a few shows where I was so rushed to get things going that I messed up some things, and the show suffered for it. It was then that I decided that there's no over-planning for the stage. Take your time, set up correctly, and make sure it's all PERFECT, so that you do a good show, and the people paying get a good show.

[@THEPurpleEgg]

I solidly understand about 40% of your gear videos (really just the IEM videos, tbh), but they are still so fascinating and TEACH ME SO MUCH, even if I don't understand what language you're speaking sometimes. Please don't feel afraid to make more gear vids!

[@txsphere]

I don't know what he is talking about but I like listening to him talk while I have dinner. Thanks Adam, nice to hear from you.

[@GizzyDillespee]

I think when he says Cat5 or Cat6, it's the number of lives the cat has left...

[@andrewmunoz9642]

I've been trying to catch the band for years, but things never seemed to line up. Finally had a chance to attend the show in San Francisco a few weeks ago. Such an amazing performance. Thanks for the great music and content!

[@sledgehammer-productions]

This is the sweet spot in the Venn diagram that is me: electrical engineer (I know how to solder ;-) ) + musician + member of the FOH body of the student music company. Would love to be there when you soundcheck (April 1st in Utrecht, maybe?)

[@jerrywelsh_]

I've been watching and learning from your channel for years now. I've taken away so much from them that have aided me as a musician. But man, I don't think I've ever felt more connected to another musician on the internet than when you described your final thoughts and need for respite while onstage - sparking an obsession to build an error-proof rig and relieve the trauma of pre-show fuckery. Felt this in my soul, dude lol.

[@martinvannostrand8488]

I’m a house engineer. I’ve seen some awesome IEM rigs that make everyone’s day easier and achieve great results. I’ve also seen hack job IEM rigs from well intentioned musicians who didn’t fully understand how the rig needs to be set up. The best configuration imo is to have an analog split in the rack with a set of tails that go to me. I’ll patch the tails of your snake into my stagebox one to one, and patch the stage into your IEM rig. DONT FORGET THE TAILS I only have so many XLRs and there are probably other bands playing too!

[@Pinkybum]

This is exactly how we do it. I have an 8 channel snake with 6 labelled channels. FOH mics up the drums. It's so easy and fast. We do need a mic on the kit somewhere to get some rhythm though but that's on us! I'm not sure what you mean "stage into the IEM rig" though.

[@fistinair1979]

​@@Pinkybumif he's anything like the engineers in talked to before building out iem rig, he means he will run his mics into your split.

[@brandonesteves432]

As a sound guy, thank you. Some bands have tried bringing in their own IEM racks and most of them do a great job, but once in a while they don’t know what they’re doing and make my job very very difficult. Rehearsals are good for your gear! Practice practice practice the boring stuff and the venue will be happy to have you back!

[@tommoffitt4813]

For anyone considering using the 25-pin modular snakes, I used them in the drum corps setting and the prospect of those tiny pins getting bent in a rushed patching scenario was a hell that no one should consider putting themselves through.

[@fuzzylogickben]

I have been trying to decide between DB25 and audio over ethernet and I think you've sold it to me. The number of times I've had to straighten the pins on 5 pin DMX is too many and DMX is supposed to be repatched frequently. DB25 is more of an install solution and I don't want half of the band anywhere near it!

[@raygunsforronnie847]

DB25 suck if they will be routinely mated/unmated by mere mortals; the pins bend easily and if you try to bend them back, they break. The connection cycle rating for RJ45 is around 1,300, IIRC. For some owners 1300 might be 2 years of rated life, for others 1300 cycles could exceed their personal lifetime. Another fragile connector that should be avoided if routinely connection cycled is the ELCO/Edac. Breaking a pin means shipping the cable off to a technician, or investing $400 in tools, followed by investing in a whole new set of pins, heat shrink/Hellerman sleeves, and hours of your life after you discover you can't just crimp on a new pin and have the wire reach.

[@fuzzylogickben]

@raygunsforronnie847 fantastic advice! As someone who has only had experience of multi pin connectors in installs it makes sense why all touring systems use those giant circular multi pin things that weigh about as much as a small dog.

[@raygunsforronnie847]

@@fuzzylogickben There are several circular connectors, the more forgiving of handling and easier repairs come from Link in Italy. Whirlwind W4 are difficult to field repair.

[@jouebien]

If you want a connector in the same form factor that isn't as fragile, then I'd suggest the Centronics Connector. It also has a significantly less annoying locking mechanism and the pins are further spaced apart which makes them easier to solder.

[@aglide]

It's cool to see someone else doing this. Usually when you talk about this type of solution on sound engineering forums, the majority of the people are skeptical. I've been using the SoundTools CAT boxes and CAT racks for the last year or so, and it seems to be holding up. By using "turnaround" XLR cables, I've been able to convert one audio channel on each CAT box to be a return for monitoring. So an output on the mixer gets patched with a female-female XLR cable to the CAT rack, and then a male-male XLR cable on the musician side gets patched to a wedge. With this setup, each member of the band gets a CAT box with a vocal input, two instrument inputs, and a return channel for their aux mix. I'm using a Behringer X32 Rack mixer, so I currently use their 8-channel SD8 digital stage box on the floor next to the drumkit with a digital AES connection to the X32. However, the two CAT racks I have still have two unused 4-channel etherCON inputs that I could rely on if I wanted to drop two CAT boxes over by the drums and rack the SD8 in with the mixer (the X32 Rack only has 16 physical inputs on it). We haven't used the split capability yet because we don't play too many gigs where we'd bring our mixer without also running FOH ourselves. But it's nice that all of the boxes and racks have etherCON outputs to allow us to split it when we evolve to that level. The cool thing about the SoundTools CAT boxes is that they also have their own etherCON output that would allow you to split right at where the musician plugs in if you want. That's the best thing about this system. It's very flexible and can grow and adapt to different approaches. One interesting product SoundTools offers are the "Sound Tails". It's an all in one cable that has etherCON on one side and 4 XLRs on the other. Since it's not a breakout box that you supply your own cable to, it seems like it would be quicker and have one fewer failure point. The downside is it's a finite length, so you must have your split etherCON outputs within 60" of the FOH mixer inputs. For etherCON cables, SoundTools offers a few different choices. They are expensive, but In Dave Rat I Trust. They have a line specifically called "SuperCAT Sound" that they've optimized for this 4-channel analog audio thing. I've just been using their regular "SuperCAT" cables so far without issues though. They cost a bit less, but are still not what I'd call cheap. 25' cables to get from the CAT boxes to our mixer rack have been enough for us on the stages we play.

[@rebmcr]

Point of order from a network engineer: Shielded Cat6 is NOT just "one better" than Shielded Cat5. Cat6 is designed for fixed cabling, it has more fragile wires inside, with a plastic insert to try and bolster them. It's particularly sensitive to repeated coiling & uncoiling, and is pretty badly-suited to an on-stage and on-road life. Cat5 is designed to be the fnal link under an office desk, getting kicked and scuffed for years on end.

[@Timocracy]

Electrician here, still can't get used to how bulkier CAT6 is - it feels more sturdy, but as you pointed out, it's the opposite with frequent stress.

[@rebmcr]

@@Timocracy That sturdiness is the plastic insert!

[@HerbaMachina]

that doesn't make sense, how would the wires be more fragile? They still need to be the same guage as cat5 and cat5e to be compliant in current capacity for POE injection.

[@GreenThingonTV]

Both Cat6 and Cat5e coming in solid and stranded wire. That's what determines the "where used" not the "why used". The "why used" is speed and bandwidth.

[@petougao]

We call these wall and fly types. You would need a fly type then, with non-solid wires.

[@5adb0i]

Those Van Gogh exhibits were amazing! I’m so glad I got to catch the one in Miami for my bday last year lol I’m defo gonna be sending this video to some friends in bands, the timing is perfect

[@spoddie]

It's not audio over Ethernet, it's audio using Cat 5 cables. Ethernet is a digital networking protocol, all you are doing is using cheaper cables than conventional XLR cables which has both advantages and disadvantages. Most likely most musicians won't care about the nomenclature but it's important and this channel is very technical.

[@JorenVaes]

Yeah, this got me very confused. I through it was something like Dante, but no, it's just using a different cable and connector (that isn't even strictly ethernet...)

[@this-one]

They're clearly Cat6A

[@rustyvee20]

I'm so grateful for our avocado toast, coffee and aviation laws for musicians, especially as a West Aussie! I was lucky enough to make it to your Perth show and was blown away to see WA on the schedule. See you next time!

[@jacobburns8440]

I commend the effort put into this setup! Have you considered bringing a sound engineer on tour with you? I know it would cost a lot but it would be invaluable. A good sound engineer who understands the band is essentially another band member. Not only would it help the mental load of all of these tech issues, but they would also help shape your sound as a band. Don't think of sound engineers as a last thought or a means to an end but rather a part of who the band is.

[@bbellomusic]

I’ve been watching videos to help me build an IEM rig, so you’ve posted this at the perfect time. Thank you sir

[@dasonmusic]

Just saw Sungazer in Santa Fe, NM. everyone go see them for your own good. You don’t understand the level of skill Adam has until you see him live. The same goes for Shawn Crowder. One of the better nights of my life. Also I met Adam after the show (hey Adam) and he is genuine and humble. The encore in f#minor was ridiculous. The tempo and the sax… seriously unreal.

[@MCasterAnd]

As a former stage tech, this is a really cool solution. Well thought out. A good solution to a common problem, but one which doesn't completely re-invent the wheel (some solutions can be quite... unique.). I recommend to all musicians to do your stuff as analog as possible. Oh how many times I have worked with relatively small bands which travel with crazy digital setups with dante going here and digital snakes etc. It usually creates more issues for everybody than it solves. Going as much analog as possible ensures that no matter what issue you hit, you WILL be able to get everything up and running without too much fuzz. And this is especially important if you do not travel with your own crew...

[@SkarbyPalace]

thanks for sharing your knowledge to us amateurs 😭🙏

[@angelosartore2179]

Greetings from Australia. It's nice to learn you all enjoyed yourselves here! EXCELLENT explanation of your IEM rig.

[@AthensHorseParty]

I want to say I really appreciate you doing videos like this, even though I imagine the "viewer market" for stuff this niche isn't as large as some of the other subjects you cover. I am currently planning a tour for next summer and constantly weighing different set up options and calculating what I should invest in and how to have the best results and reliability for the precious resources I have to put into this. Thanks!

[@andyg-avi]

15:36 I feel this so hard right now. I've been working on building my IEM Rack and and trying to play shows at the same time. I kept running into issues with my rack and its been so busy and stressful. I finally had a chance to test my rig last night and it worked for the most part. Im having trouble with imbalance LR on the mix and don't know how to fix it. But im just glad I can hear myself and the band now. Our album release show is In a month and I am looking forward to using this rig. Thank you Adam for making the videos and doing the research to make things like this accessible. If you ever come to Nebraska with Sungazer and need a funk band to open for ya, The Groove Lagoon and I would be honored. Love your work magic Bass man

[@Victorbrotto]

You sucessfully made a colorblind FOH Engineer's worst nightmare

[@rainbowkrampus]

They're also numbered. So unless the engineer is also innumerate, it should be fine.

[@LoftyAssertions]

@@rainbowkrampus But what if he is colourblind to black, he won't be able to see any number at all :O

[@rainbowkrampus]

@@LoftyAssertions I think they just call that blind blind.

[@iandoesallthethings]

Yeah, blue next to purple is my personal nightmare

[@steffengotsch]

I’m colorblind and had no trouble distinguishing the colors he used. If they were six different shades of green and brown and red you might have an issue.

[@FVDaudio]

In some cases (depending on the technical rider and your requirements)... Depending on the FOH console (Avid ones for example), your Presonus console can communicate AVB via network cable, becoming the stage box directly without requiring the analog split (reducing weight and space). And if you place an external AVB-compatible network card (or dongle) to the laptop, you can integrate backing tracks, metronome, control signals, visuals, etc. through the same AVB network, handling additional digital tracks, with their due processing without affecting the physical/analog channel count.

[@MalikEmmanuel]

an apple computer's ethernet ports are AVB compatible out of the box.

[@raygunsforronnie847]

As the "house guy", NO NO NO. Don't give me a gain-shared digital split. Analog is fine.

[@seanrichards9569]

Unfortunately AVB from PreSonus is NOT compatible with other AVB networks without an external AVB box, one of the downsides in general to AVB in our current audio universe. ‘Milan’ compliant AVB is slowly growing to accommodate more brands, but as of today just being AVB is not going to make a PreSonus talk to anything other than a PreSonus. Same deal with MOTU, who also use AVB, but again using their own protocol. However, I am curious about what you said about Apple Laptops being AVB compliant out of the box, the idea being that one could connect a playback laptop directly with a Network cable instead of going through an interface. I’m going to have to research that one a bit. But end of the day; speaking as a FOH engineer, as much as I dream of the day when all these desks and DAWs speak each other, almost none of them do and you certainly can’t take out an IEM rig like this and hand someone a Network cable and expect to plug into a house setup expecting it to work. That scenario would currently only occur on about 2% of your shows, if that.

[@ScottUhlMusic]

Nice man! This is pretty brilliant. I remember you mentioning this, and it’s cool to see how it’s set up. I’m working on a video of something similar with the Behringer X32 rack with the Midas 4816 O as the splitter. I use an S16 as our stage box, which connects to the X32 with a single ethercon cable and sends 16 inputs and 8 outputs over that one cable. Then the Midas connects via a single Cat5 cable and then we have 16 channels of labeled tails to give to FOH. It’s super fast and really efficient. Although some limitations are: the S16 is heavier than those breakout boxes and has its own 2u case (same with the Midas splitter)…. I believe this can only be done with 16 channels…. And the split happens pre fader/eq/comp/etc… but post gain. Going into Allen and Heath boards in particular has been troublesome since they don’t have PADs on most of their mixers for some dumb reason. But we have a scene saved with the gain set down by 10db specifically for that. But it’s been incredibly consistent, more “compact” than light weight, but still decent, and is relatively error proof. I just hope more companies start to integrate the audio over Cat 5 setup for splits. It’s so much cleaner and easier.

[@gabopenav]

I go the music tribe way, I love how practical splitting is through a midas/behringer stagebox/splitter

[@IWannaGoMissing]

Allen & Heath input channels don’t feature a pad because you can imagine it like they start with the pad in. Instead of you having to engage the pad, the input gain range just includes that range the pad would cover on every channel It’s a “but this goes up to 11” kind of scenario

[@jason.braatz]

That 4816-O splitter completely hosed me the one and only time I tried to make it work, FWIW. To be fair, it was at a divey venue where we were certainly the first band to ever attempt to bring our own IEM rig, but since the signal wasn't a true split it (in conjunction with the divey venue's questionable sound setup) resulted in a terminal amount of noise we weren't able to fix in the time we had before we had to bail out of using it. I'm sure there's a way to make it work but it wasn't worth the risk to me - sold it and got a set of S8's.

[@joewilkie]

Thanks for the video, and many others I haven't commented on. I've enjoyed seeing your progress as you adapt your rigs over time. The quirks section got my attention, because it hightlighted what I experienced myself a couple years ago while searching for a proper splitting solution. The solution that worked for us was to go digital, using the 24Ao by MOTU. Our 6U rack includes a 16x8 rack mixer/stage box (MOTU B16), some wireless units and a heaphone amp (drum IEMs and backups for wireless units). If we're self-mixing, that's all we need. We have a couple spare outputs on the stage box that cover the Mains. If we're playing a proper venue with a sound person, we place the 24Ao rack next to the venue's stage box, patch to 2m tails (picked this for weight concerns, since the box can be anywhere my ethernet cable will reach) and we're ready to go. We keep the 24Ao in a 3U rack, with the breakout cables 3 x (DB25 to 8MXLR) permanently attached with strain relief and labeled for rapid, error-free setup. We looked into all the different technologies (Dante, Waves Grid, AVB). We chose AVB for its idiot-proof self-configuration. Plug in stuff and it works. We didn't get hung up on what well-funded venues were buying, because we knew if we could deliver analog signals via xlr we'd be good to go anywhere. Another great benefit is we can push a virtual soundcheck to the FOH, looping a performance in our DAW and sending to the FOH. "Fader flip" from DAW to live sources is as simple as selecting a routing preset. We could always do this in a closed system, like our old Allen and Heath Qu16, but pushing recorded signals to FOH using traditional analog splitters is not possible. There are several videos online that showcase the 24Ao with StudioLive hardware. I can verify it works beautifully and will save you significant weight in splitters and multi-pair audio cable.

[@nikolaki]

Great video. I've just started using analogue audio over ethernet and I think it's been a game changer.

[@ashleydoodkorte]

As a touring drummer on ears (that, apart from setting my own mix, has nothing to do with the setup of the whole thing) who has never been interested in this kinda stuff, I was amazed to be super enthralled by this. Awesome setup, can see how this would be a breeze in those highly stressful, second-band-on-the-bill, 15-minute changeovers! Love it!

[@unitcode_machine]

I totally built my last IEM rig based on your previous video, though because i do electronic/industrial music i really only need 4 tails for FOH Took this on tour with my band over US/CA and sound check took 10 minutes max! Total run 42 shows. :D

[@MrBitflipper]

It's said that experience is the *worst* teacher, because you get the lesson after the test. That's why it's so helpful to learn from others' experiences. Thanks for sharing!

[@JimmyVeteranAudio]

I was literally shopping for an IEM solution last night. What I'm looking for is something modular - something that can grow with me from a solo act to a full band as needed, and isn't a pain in the ass or huge investment for new band members as they come on board. Thanks for doings these!

[@brandonesteves432]

It will always be a pain in the ass. Understand that now and the future will be a lot easier on you ;)

[@rachelfey]

Taking control of our in ear monitors was one of the best decisions I've ever made. Behringer XR18, splitter strip, and a thoroughly labeled passthrough to the front, we stuck some LED's in the rack for good measure. It's consistent and as idiot proof as possible. This is for a regional cover band now, so I don't really have use for the stage boxes and stuff. We're not playing anywhere that we can't just reach the rack with XLRs. I'll definitely consider doing this when we upgrade.

[@TheAntibozo]

NB that is not "audio over ethernet". Ethernet is a network protocol. It is defined for use, among other things, over UTP and STP cables with RJ-45 connectors, but just because you are using that cabling doesn't mean you are using ethernet; ethernet is an inherently digital protocol. You could say you are doing audio over shielded CAT-6.

[@tobyzxcd]

The comment section to this already Incredibly Informative Video is another Incredibly Informative goldmine

[@wolfbane65]

This is actually interesting to see this kind of thing deployed. In the professional lighting world we use this exact same ethernet breakout box trick to move DMX universes around with 4 universe boxes. Additionally for larger rigs we use 8 universe cable and breakout boxes with a circular locking connector colloquially known as CPC connectors. The cable for these larger ones is literally 2 x CAT5 lines fused together at the factory. The many points of failure and also similarly convoluted signal routing means we have to do extensive labeling and paperwork to ensure that the correct signal ends up in the correct location.

[@sharchik916]

Such a good emotional point at the end there. Struggling with that currently. Thanks for acknowledging it.

[@rocgod]

Audio over ethernet has been a gamechanger for my iem setup. I have my splitter and mixer in one rack and all our transmitters in another, i connect the two using 2 ethernet cables and It makes setup and breakdown effortless!

[@devondeswardt6239]

Very well thought out solution to a weirdly underrated problem. Thanx for sharing, Adam!

[@Bladavia]

2:12 How do you know about that one, Adam ?

[@JordonBeal]

IEM rig videos are an entire KZbin genre in and of themselves.

[@NicolasPerrault]

We just ended up with a very similar rig in Inherit The Ashes. For the majority of bands I tour with as a FOH engineer, we use a x32 as a stage brain, plus up to 1 stagebox (usually for stage left 16ch and stage right 16ch). That all gets sent via aes50 to me at FOH where I lovingly manage each signal on my wing console. If you ever wanna just tour with a dedicated FOH person in Europe, hit me up. Who knows, maybe our schedules match.

[@ciaduck]

A coworker who was a former roadie once told me, "You have to do it perfectly 100% of the time. Because that one time you don't, might have been Stephen Tyler's microphone."

[@Timof2009]

Ringing in the new year with ADAM NEELY!

[@krizzi666]

You just solved a problem that I needed to solve 5 years ago, this video is gold.

[@LoftyAssertions]

Absolutely love the musical translations of the different chapters, such a great idea. 5:15 also yes, blessed to be an Australian musician, there's multiple Musician Unions - we also have an official minimum wage of $250 AUD per musician per show coming into effect in most states. I've had an 100% success rate with that despite being in a state where it isn't in effect. Also I've been paid tens of thousands by the government to do arts projects here and overseas, all costs additionally paid for. Our grant system actually has a good culture and social sustainability focus (when the liberals aren't in majority seats)

[@mitdemall]

Wow, maybe the one Video of you I enjoyed the most xDD I’ve spend quite some time in my live thinking about musical setups (most time Electronic Music). Your end thesis is such a joyful take on this. Helped a lot to hear this :)

[@ghgodsexposed]

I love the use of the 6th Suite prelude! Definitely an underrated piece

[@robbgosset674]

I have a pet peeve about referring to Category cabling and the signals that go down it. The cable is a category cable (cat 5, 5e,6, 6a etc) with RJ45 connectors on the ends. Ethernet is the digital signalling that's used to carry Internet protocol traffic down a physical medium, this could be a category cable or a fibre link, or over WiFi. Dante is an audio over Ethernet protocol. AES50 is a digital audio over category cable standard. These are analogue audio over Category cable, the only standards involved are the pinout and the fact you need shielded cables. This comes from working in lighting for a manufacturer that used RJ45 connectors as the DMX input on their fixtures (these were for permanent install so it's OK according to the standard). Trying to explain to someone "no, these don't use Ethernet, they use cat5 cable, they need straight DMX, they can't understand ArtNet, no streaming ACN won't work either, yes, the gateway is needed, those XLR to RJ45 adapters in the spec are necessary and shouldn't have been scrapped, yes, what you've referred to as an Ethernet cable work but it's not. fucking. Ethernet. no, don't plug it into the network port on your computer, oh, sparks and smoke, no, we won't be paying for those repairs and the damage is definitely not covered under warranty" I get a bit pedantic about this sort of thing.

[@mcdavyg]

I haven’t seen many of your videos but this is great. Can’t wait to see more live rig content!

[@cpt.kimintuitiondemon]

Thanks for taking the time to share these learnings!

[@BassDawStew]

I also run the PreSonus 32R, but I am still quite happy with my ART S8-3 splitters.Probably because I don't use as many stage boxes and snakes. I find it interesting how many "pro sound" folks don't like the PreSonus gear or the QSC Touchmix boards, where I have only ever had good experiences with both of these. I am fairly certain this is a difference in "set it and forget it" vs. actively riding the faders. I often do not have the luxury of having a separate sound engineer for monitors or even for front of house, so these boards fit a very nice niche for me as a bass playing backround singing crowd entertaining having to run the sound person.

[@MixMeMcGee]

I just built out 2 stages just like this! Great design!

[@purposeinpresence4494]

Sick, musician+audio engineer! Now we’re cookin.

[@KyleBGanger]

Happened to be in San Diego for your show, was a great experience!

[@kaden6149]

Been running this setup using Whirlwind's Catdusa for the 6-piece I FOH for! Saves so much effort! You specify to get STP cables, but I would go a step further and recommend full EtherCON cables for durability and ease of setup

[@Timof2009]

10:57 - Lets hope the house audio engineer isn't colorblind LOL

[@BaseballsNotDead]

My thoughts exactly. I would f up a couple of those colors.

[@danielmccready1501]

I was thinking that too!

[@randomViewer-ks5ni]

or working under crappy monochrome LEDs that make every color look the same

[@JohnR31415]

Colours *and* numbered labels…

[@petougao]

SYMBOLS! EASY TO DISCERN, BIG, HI-CONTRAST PICTOGRAMS! But, yeah, was also worried about colorblind techs. When I think about this problem more, neutrik could make some keying system. Not really a triangle, square or pentagonal, though those would be cool, but a universal configurable keying. There are some smart engeneers over at neutrik, they can make someting nice, I am sure.

[@UnfinishedIdeas]

Yes more stage tech and touring production videos from a hybrid musician/band perspective please!

[@igorzavalnyi5341]

The problem discussed in the video can be elegantly solved with Stageconnect technology from Behringer/Midas. They have 16 out 1RU devices that you digitally connect to your Behringer Wing Rack or M32/X32 Rack mixer. You patch all your inputs into the mixer, and then digitally send copies from your preamps directly to those Stageconnect output boxes. You could do the same with the AVB stage boxes from Presonus, but unfortunately they don’t have dedicated output units. Yes, your gain settings will affect the FOH, but it simplifies the routing and patching. Even easier way to tour would be to use Dante for digital splits, but unfortunately not all venues are ready for that yet

[@douglaswhite1624]

Adam has become the Tony Stark of live rigs; I am very impressed, but not even slightly surprised. Great video, thank you!

[@riffking2651]

Thank you so much for sharing this with us! This is a brilliant setup and it'll be such a helpful thing to build for a band who's gearing up to start bigger touring runs

[@_grigoryta]

The thing with Ethercon is you don't really have to buy preassembled cables, you can pretty easily DIY (and also repair if needed) them yourself even with pre-terminated CAT6 (actually that's even easier since you don't need to learn how to terminate ethernet yourself, but you can do that too and save even more money), there are kits that can be assembled over regular CAT6 cables. So you can have it be more robust on the connector side AND lightweight of a cable overall.

[@smabacon]

Great video. I’ve done videos on how I built my bands Soundcraft IEM rig but this has given me some great ideas on how to improve it, particularly with the Ethernet bits! Subbed!

[@AndyChamberlainMusic]

thanks for posting this Adam, I've been looking for something like this for when I show up to random jams in my city on a whim

[@XaleManix]

Oooh, an updated IEM rig from Adam Neely just in time for me to start lobbying to my band (again) that we NEED to switch to IEMs? Sign me up!

[@stevelawrie9115]

I had no idea that you were coming to Australia. Glad you guys made it here, maybe next time. Your ad for givewell sounds the most useful ad I've heard so far. We're sick of donating to corps.

[@SziontificMystic]

this is the premium stuff! appreciate this kind of nutrition over fast food anyday

[@Regalado_Aspic]

Perfect! see you guys on tour in Toronto!

[@lyyretv1126]

Informative! Looking forward to seeing y’all in PA

[@stenmartens7179]

being an IT guy with self taught electrical skills and a lifetime musician this has been a challenge i've been thinking about too. the thing that surprises me most is that you're sending analog audio over an ethernet cable with relatively thin wire compared to wires that are used for audio? although AD/DA conversions would possibly make this rig less efficient and fitting for your usecase, the beauty about digital is that signal is either there or it is not, and it can be extended relatively easily where as signal strength plays a detrimental role with an analog signal (and quality deterioration over distance).

[@raygunsforronnie847]

As the house FOH person mixing your band for the first and probably only time, give me analog. I don't want to deal with making your flavor of digital work with the house flavor of digital (brands, formats, protocols, clocking, etc) and you sure don't want to share control of head amp gain between FOH and your IEM mixer. Giving me an analog split does not involve additional AD/DA conversions and even if it did, I'd submit it would be undetectable under show conditions.

[@antronx7]

Analog is easy to troubleshoot under stressful condition.

[@jwstout007]

Gotta respect the short click clips to avoid demonetization, my homie Metronome owns the IP ;)

[@aeiplanner]

Yep, I’ve been wiring studios using analog over CAT6 STP cable for several years. Works great….even with phantom power.

[@danielpirone8028]

I was aware of the tech - but this was a fantastic set of real world specifics!

[@basspuppy133]

Pro-tip regarding looking for analogue audio over ethernet cables. Not only do you need to make sure it's STP (shielded twisted pair) and not UTP (unshielded TP), you need to also make sure it has a drain-wire inside the cable if you want phantom-power passthrough for condenser mics.

[@AndrewWilde]

Oh man, as a house technician I wish more groups brought full IEM split systems. It makes setup much faster as you mentioned. As far as the patch location on the IEM mixer goes: Digital patching. If you're digital patching your inputs, your ethercon breakouts can be 1:1 too. FOH engineer takes a picture of your patch and boom, done. If you're always doing it the same, you could include an advanced patch list with your rider. When I've done touring and splits like this, I typically keep the flexibility on my end to change where things are going (different stage plot, new inputs, etc). It lets me change something then just yell back to FOH what input its coming down. If I see it on mine, but FOH doesnt, it narrows down the issue quickly. On the presonus, you could have two scenes: The default of how you like it, and a 1:1 so you have that reliability without needing to shuffle things around. Being able to easily troubleshoot (cause lord knows i've had to pull apart racks mid tour) is also important.

[@kiersplat]

If you have the cash to invest in the hardware, Dante can make this super easy and less quirky. The devices store the routing which means they automatically resolve their routes upon being plugged into the network. Many many more channels of audio can be routed over a single RJ45 too.

[@djsparkyy]

The supercat ethercon cables are awesome as well. They're the only ethercon cables that coil like mic cables. Very durable as well. Dave Rat from Rat sound is the one behind all that stuff, he's a great dude and has a great KZbin channel as well. He also has a sound tools line that is all great stuff for people running live sound.

[@Zack-Hates-Youtube]

Hooray! Been waiting for another IEM vid! 🤘

[@Markplaysmusic]

I'm old school and did gigs on the back of low loader trucks and flat beds at local fayres, pubs, clubs and open air festivals in tents, we did 1 sound check - 3 tracks, fast loud, slow ballad and something in the middle about 7 minutes then went on about an hour later. I've fallen off my badly made drum riser from a flat bed - broke 3 ribs and played the gig anyway. We used a sull studio sized desk - 64 channel and a snake that weighed the most of things we had, even my iron work on stage. All that was in a Luton van with backline, amps, instruments and several band members and 3 roadies.

[@Sidekicc777]

Watching an Adam Neely new video on the first day of 2025 is a great start for the new year ❤

[@dawnshape]

Hi Adam, thank you for all the tips. Your video made me think of that one time I had to patch colored cable under colored lights. Not something I want to remember :D

[@ndykman_pdx]

I really hope that brands like Personus really embrace this and provides ethernet versions of their products and really have XLR only at the last point needed (for the mics).

[@MalikEmmanuel]

There are a lot of brands using different protocols to get audio over a network cable. The problem is that the most expensive one to license became the standard.

[@Salamanderfs]

I was actually having the very same thoughts about my IEM rig a few months ago about switching to analog audio over CAT5e and getting rid of the ART S8 3-way splitters which have been heavy and a nightmare to patch in such a small space when this does the same thing and is much lighter. The only difference I would do in our system versus Sungazer's is that I would do the splits at the Musician's end on the stage and not giving the FOH/audio engineers a bunch of tails to go to their patch bay. The disadvantage with this however is now I have to carry a bunch of shorter XLR cables to still give the FOH audio the sends from the Split Boxes after the mics get patched in (Soundtools Cat 8 box/Radial Catapult TX4M).

[@wesleybrehm9386]

Thanks for coming to Salt Lake City! Great show.

[@artysanmobile]

Saving a successful setup gets you way far along to a preset that works right off the bat. A typical soundcheck with a solid preset should yield a very short check time during which music can be the focus.

[@raptros_]

For the last issue (the stress of dealing with problems under pressure), I think the systematic and rational approach David J Agans lays out in his book /Debugging/ could provide some comfort and focus. (The Checklist Manifesto by Atul Gawande also provides some insight into how one can decrease the challenge of high pressure situations.)

[@keithbroughton4476]

Overall, pretty nice work on the rig! Consider CAT5E STP and buy the Neutrik NE8MX Ethercon shell that can be retrofitted over existing RJ45 terminated cable. Much cheaper (and lighter)than buying ready made CAT6 Ethercon cables. The audio won't know the difference. As a house FOH engineer, I'm always happy when a band comes in with their own IEM rack.

[@mattdangerg]

Awesome video, very informative

[@j7a1k1e]

I bet you could use a keystone patch pannel like in a traditional network rack to save a little more weight and space to manage all your RJ45 cables inside the rack. You can even buy colored keystones to keep things organized. Not to mention you can buy cat6A cable in whatever color you want. Or if you want cables in black, you can buy cable boots in various colors to coordinate patching without messy tape

[@colossalbean1348]

sungazer tiny desk when??