The Social Classes Of Goth

THE VIDEO IS FINALLY HERE
After planning this out for months and finally able to meet up, me and my friend Raegan are here to explain the idea of how the gothic subculture has managed to include itself in not only the working class status but also within the middle class and even partly within the higher class nowadays
I hope you all enjoy this video
xxx

[@darkheart665]

As a goth who lives in Alabama, thrifting has become a necessity to dress goth. I can't really afford the expensive stuff on the net. But, I always find great things

[@saylremi]

Shout out to Alabama goths! :D

[@darkheart665]

@@saylremi holy shit! Another one lol. Not many of us down here

[@saylremi]

We are few, but we are proud! 😂

[@nineinchthread]

I know this is three years ago but I live in Mississippi and enjoy all the styles like goth,emo punk and more so it's cool to see an Alabama goth

[@bansheesioux5569]

You're supposed to do it that way in the first place. Goth is vintage. It's not off the current rack

[@crowntheraven1372]

Okay, back in the “old days” of goth, we had no real name for ourselves, it was just the beginning of the subculture so it was more of a movement at the time. The mainstream culture called us Darklings and so it stuck in America for a short time. It was a music magazine in England who quoined the term “gothic music”, which was directed towards Sisters of Mercy who were unimpressed by this & canceled a concert for they felt insulted. Now back in late 70’s into the 80’s we (the old bats) as teens & children had 4 main ways of getting info: telephone, Mt.v and news papers and pen pals (my older sister had one in England). So that’s pretty much how the subculture’s name got over here, in America. The dress was up to the individual and if they felt creative at the they get dressed. Some dressed to impress, some dressed to the liking of their favorite bands, some dressed to stand out, some dressed in their own unique fashion. The point was (and still is) to show your individuality and creativity while giving the mainstream culture the middle finger... sort of like Pretty meets Gritty (I’m pretty in my own way & could give a fuck of what you think). I was cild in the beginning of our subculture, but had to hide it from my parents. Why? Because of the damn media who had no understanding about us and parents who scared stupid by the mainstream culture who had a distaste for the strange & the unusual, no pun intended...though Beetle Juice did help putting a bit of humor to the mainstream culture’s fear. Thank You, Tim Burton. Why am I telling you people this, so you will stop taking the subculture for granted. Stop picking it apart like it’s some sort of science project or sociology project. Then I suppose you lot would do this for you have no to little understanding of what we had do in order to live without the negative consequences. Now it’s quite common to see us from time to time, to see a 45yr old woman with a red mohawk wearing either a black skirt or pants, a sweater with skulls all over it. Does it really matter where you fit in? Not at all. All that you are you for you and for no one else. This has generation has so much to offer, so much creativity stirs within each of you (the two of you certainly have an 80’s look I have yet to see in years & it brings backs lovely memories). This is why I say the meaning of the gothic subculture is “Creative Individuality”. Be your own person, be inspiring to others as others be inspiring to you🦇 M

[@futropolis]

I remember very early on it was called Death Rock (which I loved). One of my favorite records at the time was "Hell Comes To Your House" & everything by 45 Grave. :)

[@MF-rp9ox]

@@futropolis right, yeah I don't even think I heard the term goth until '84?? Dark punk, black punk/rock, names like that. Any military surplus store was a goldmine for boots and black jackets.

[@lushkitty734]

I used to call it Underground /Alternative , Gutterpunk and Batcave. An elder of mine remembered it as Death Rock which I thought was weird as we were living in the same city at the same time the subculture started branch off from punk but neither of us knew the other's term. The first time I ever heard Goth was early 90s. I totally miss the '80s

[@Pixie-gp3zu]

Thank you for putting it so well! From another old bat ❤

[@ingridcarolinemusic]

Absolutely ADORE Raegan's hair. She seems like such a smart and sweet person. Thank you for introducing her to us!

[@iminvibecheck6353]

Hot Topic is more Emo/Scene and mainstream now... it kinda sucks. Also around where I live there aren't many places where I can get clothes, so the internet is my friend.

[@MysteriousAsteria]

Hot Topic seems long over emo and anything alternative. Since scene is now mostly dead. Hot Topic now cater more to nerds, in my opinion

[@Gothiqueluv]

HT is for teenyboppers. It's all rainbows and unicorns now. I remember when you could walk in and it was really dark and spooky. The people that worked their looked like they just came out of the club. Really impressive. It had "teeth" back then.

[@valentine4220]

go to a thrift store

[@lushkitty734]

@@Gothiqueluv Indeed. HT died for me in 2002 although the best years were '94-97. (Personal opinion)

[@areyousureyouenteredyourna85]

I remember way back when I saw my first Hot Topic, at first, my mom was kinda freaked out about that place, but within minutes, she was talking about old music with strangers and asking me which skull necklace I liked best. Mom had sone cool moments.

[@mordaciousfilms]

The two of you have the most fantastic style. Glad I found this channel recently!!

[@afz902k]

I never thought it was possible for someone in this day and age to look as 80's as Raegan

[@solivagant9249]

I think it's dumb that some alt fashion brands market themselves as being upscale but the quality isn't very good. When I think "luxury clothing", I think fabric cut on the bias, taped seams, very high-quality materials, and those quasi-couture details that make the clothing worth the price and pleasant to wear. There's normie stuff like plain black jeans/leggings and t-shirts maybe with a macabre logo, maybe the occasional collared shirt - they're not even that spectacularly made - and the other extreme is club/photoshoot clothes that aren't practical for everyday wear because they're too theatrical and made of delicate synthetics that are dry-clean-only, don't wear well, sweaty, and not particularly comfortable. They're beautiful but in a costume/cosplay/masquerade type of way. I get they're catering to vegans with the synthetics, but if the goal is environmental, then making everything out of petrochemical-based polyester that will take at least a millennium to biodegrade is defeating the purpose, there's very little high-quality linen, organic cottons, hemp fabrics, repurposed vintage fabrics, or other sustainable materials in the brands with eccentric designs. Say what you will about Tripp pants (or the Poizen Industries ones that were similar), but they at least occupied that middle ground of alt clothes where they could be dressed up or down whether you were going to a club or doing daily life stuff, and they were made of that broadcloth-type heavy cotton that was comfortable, relatively durable, and easy to care for. The stereotypical baggy Tripp bondage pants were a product of their time and it's totally fine if they stay in the memory of the late-90s to mid-00s, but I want alt designers to make clothes again that are eccentric AND meant to be worn for normal life.

[@LauraCordes]

I adore Reagan's natural hair. I have long, wavy, ash blonde hair that I once dyed into oblivion. Now that I've stopped coloring it after the pandemic, when I grew it out again because I couldn't get in to my hair stylist, it's much healthier and growing back thicker. I've thought about dyeing it black again, but knowing that I can keep it natural and still keep my newly rediscovered aesthetic is reassuring to me, like I can be my pale blonde self and still be goth, because nothing about my appearance negates my love for goth music, and goth has been and always will be a music based subculture, not a fashion statement or a feeling.

[@MissLizzy882]

I love how in-depth this video is! Thanks for covering this topic so well. I truly hate the whole "higher class goth" thing - it's not about how much expensive brand stuff you can buy. Having said that goth is not only about aesthetics - holy crap Raegan is BEAUTIFUL!! It's like stepping into the original scene - you both look amazing.

[@Saeuglingsfledermaus]

Great video! :) I hope to see more of Raegan, she's very eloquent and fun.

[@sweeneydeville598]

Negative&Decadent thank you! And hopefully

[@MusicManiaacify]

Does she have a KZbin?

[@Fruitbat-tb3lg]

I’m 51 now. My mum helped me make some of my clothing at the time. My Lagatija Nick bum flap was made out of an old Nottingham Forrest football top. A black string top made my right arm piece. The rest was such a mish mash of clothing. I painted a polystyrene wig head and made hair for it and carried on the end of a long pole. My gloves were made out of socks and boots laces. Sometimes though we would get dressed up as other pop stars such as David Sylvian or Thomas Dolby or Killing Joke army garb one week or even Spanish western themed another. Yes, I got beaten up quite regularly back then lol

[@apothicblair6564]

Loving Raegan's look! I'd imagine this is how Madonna from the early-mid eighties were to look like if she was goth instead.

[@marianalm2566]

I like so much, I think is the first video about the social class of Goth, I love it!

[@Sanniz]

Aww... your friend reminds about a "gothic" Madonna in her early years... loved that style when I was young in the 80s. I must confess I now mostly buy the more mainstream nu goth style. My health take too much energy so I don't have what it takes to make my own things. I used to sew my own outfits, even corsets. But for me the music still are the most important part. My clothes was all type of styles through the years. I loved that goth didn't have a must be type of fashion during the times I was more extreme looking myself. Now I'm 50 and just buy things that works for me and my body shape.

[@christie_exist]

The longer I have been in the subculture, the less I started to care about fashion.

[@Ravensikkness]

Right? Now it's just black shirt black pants and shoes and a call it good.

[@christie_exist]

@@Ravensikkness Most likely, yes.

[@Ravensikkness]

@@christie_exist Yeah. But I have my days when I wanna full on show off who I am with my fashion. But I'm pretty expressive with my makeup. Sometimes my hair.

[@christie_exist]

@@Ravensikkness I am like that if I have to go to a birthday or something.

[@lenaleewalker7704]

i dont care about it as well, i just wear black tho but sometimes when i go out or go to a festival or stuff like that i really like to dress up a little

[@moongem4489]

Does Raegan have any online/social media presence where we could follow her? (If she's okay with you giving that information)

[@monikintin.3377]

Drab Majesty playing in the background 🖤🖤

[@Cleo-von-Patra-11-11]

"Cyber celebrity" is what it should be called!! Intelligent and thoughtful debate-really interesting!!

[@maxshea4762]

I was Goth before there was a name for it. People thought I was trying to be punk and told me I was not punk. Punk was defined by its adherents as what it was NOT. I'm a real punk. You're a poser. Eventually, I concluded punk was nothing because every definition of it was roundly denied.

[@monikintin.3377]

I think Alexander McQueen also has goth aesthetic. I like the advant garde goth look which I can’t afford actually. I prefer the goth clothing as darkly unique and individual rather than all goths look the same or wear the same brands. I wish I have some talent to make DIY avant- garde look.

I've seen a couple of waves of goth influences leaking into the mainstream, and when I was younger, it kind of angered me, cos I was doing this, even just for a couple years, and then all of a sudden, it's in the magazines. Now, I still look at it cynically, but at the same time, I know that means it's going to be easier to either find cheaper knock-offs in stores like Target, or in another year, there'll be so much at the second hand shops. I've never been a fan of the current Big Goth Brands, killstar and punk rave. I don't have an especial nostalgia for the brands that were in, when I was in high school, I just don't like what they put out.

[@cindyr4459]

Love this video! You're both so fabulous. I'm a big fan of DIY, and also like to buy new (affordable) stuff to mix and match. You can find plenty of cheaper things that aren't goth brands that look fine on their own or altered. Also, thanks for mentioning natural hair! I used to dye my hair, but stopped a few years ago. My hair is naturally dark, but turns reddish in the sun. I love the whites and silvers that are starting to take over. And I love my natural curls. We don't all need the same hair. Goth aesthetic is supposed to be unique/personalized and influenced by the music. As for careers, I think it's fine to have a job that pays well. The point is to not buy into the mainstream's attempt at commercializing a subculture, at making it look shallow from the outside. And don't forget it's roots.

[@nevermore3928]

Don't forget Post-Punk.. I think that helps to delineate the punks from those who punks would not call punks!

[@Cinnabar_and_Chalcanthite]

Omgoodness, you guys are soo cute! I'm from the original generation of our subculture, before it had a label, now a grandma. Glad to soo you bright, adorable guys. I'm so happy it is making a come back. We always hit the thrift stores but that was back in a time when we were teens, dead broke and thrift stores were actually cheap. Good luck, health and prosperity to you.

[@iamsarahtonin]

Love your makeup,Raegan.

[@futropolis]

Really fun video, you two look fantastic. Cheers!

[@ladylaudanum8663]

In the 90's we had hippie goths, gamer goths, computer geek nerds, ravers popped in and it was all-inclusive. Indie kids. You could be one style on one day and another the next and nobody cared. People made their own clothes - mostly victorian stuff like corsets. We wore multiple slips and fishnet stockings as sleeves with army disposal boots. We all did it cheaply. If you could afford a store-bought cloak or corset you were either working or you had rich parents. Corsets would set you back 500 AUD - 700 AUD. Satin gloves 25 years ago were 25 or 20 AUD. Shop bought wasn't just expensive but most of us couldn't afford it anyway.

[@danceswithgoths]

Yes that was my experience of the 90s too. It was very much an anything goes era.

[@areyousureyouenteredyourna85]

A better era, some might say, but we don't yet know what awaits upon the horizon. Even though humanity seems beyond hopeless right now, never forget that destruction breeds creation, and that new creation can be good OR bad, it will just take time to realize which.

[@steelcomrade6871]

I thought the earliest goth fashion was in the 300s A.D in Eastern Europe All you needed was some bear skin, massive axe and a severed head of a Roman I'm not trying to be offensive I'm just saying what I thought

[@tkl7049]

The way you put it being covered in dead carcases sounds pretty goth to me

[@areyousureyouenteredyourna85]

Severed heads are punk rock as fuck. Haha!

[@Anonymous-wb3nz]

I wish more people were this good looking in the scene.

[@mapndo2337]

Givenchy has been doing some very Gothic and New Romantic otherworldly stuff for over a decade thanks to Designer Ricardo Tisci.,.and now he's at Burberry. I think a lot of the stuff you showed is actually late to catching on. There were others sooner. Very insightful. BRAVO!!!

[@DamarisEveryDay]

Great video! I valued my mother's sewing machine 🖤 id get small things from hot topic like band tees or spiked type stuff until I made it myself.

[@amialice6005]

Y'all are such an aesthetic!!!

[@BeautifulMutant]

Honestly, for me, I can usually afford some of the brands like Blackcraft and Killstar here and there when I can gather up enough money for it. The problem I often run into is the shipping price. Oh, dear God, the shipping price! Nothing like having to throw another $25-30 onto a $50 order, amirite?

[@ademcanvaner2567]

I really like this video due to its subject matter. I've always liked the DIY approach because one can create something totally original. Whereas when one buys things brand new, it's replicating the mainstream concept of trends.

[@peterkarargiris4110]

Good point. When the 'brand' becomes more important than the style, you've joined the mainstream.

[@ademcanvaner2567]

@@peterkarargiris4110 That's exactly it. What MANY people don't get is that "goth" is a genre of music. Any "fashion" that a goth follows is an expression of how they feel inside which is brought out by the music. It's not a fashion, and it's not a style. It's connected to the genre directly. So anyone who believes otherwise and also thinks that one is "goth" solely based on their appearance regardless of what they listen to is greatly mistaken.

[@koolchem6653]

@@ademcanvaner2567 I completely agree! This is my philosophy on the subject, as well.

[@peterkarargiris4110]

Great discussion guys. I'm old enough to remember Malcolm McLaren coming here to Australia in the early 80s. By that time, far from being some sort of avant-garde guru, he presented himself as just another pop singer - a flash in the pop pan. Back then Punk made very little impact here in Australia. Since then Punk has largely vanished, at least in my part of the country. Goth however is alive and well, nourished by the internet. Fortunately, we still don't have 'Hot Topic' or a home grown clone. Like the rest of the world, many of our new clothes and accessories come from all over the world via on-line shopping. Social class in a goth context does not exist here, not to my knowledge anyway. There are just people with more money and people with less money. How they spend that money depends on taste and we all know that just as money can't buy you love, it can't buy you good taste either. I very much enjoyed this chat guys - well done.

[@leolahulet2066]

Love your hair Raegan I used to have a style just like that back in the 80’s when I was a teenager and I was goth and still am sometimes

[@yesta7375]

Payed $20 shipping for some killstar boots when the town it shipped from was like 1 hr away. Hell no. A waste of money-- never again

[@mapndo2337]

I'm really digging the shirt Sweeney

[@greekvampy3690]

It was opiset in the 1990s the music was focused on in amrica when the 1990s started to end the goth fashion early 200s in amrica

[@areyousureyouenteredyourna85]

That's a wild shirt! I love it!

[@lucifermorningstar666prais7]

Wow! She is so beautiful I'm gonna cry because she looks just like madonna God bless her! 🤞🏻🖤🦇🕸🕷

[@frayansertzrave]

Great vid 🖤 Hi there! I'm a new subscriber!!

[@BeautifulMutant]

I have to admit, I squee'd a bit when I heard Drab Majesty playing in the background.

[@jamesgaskell3982]

Goth has always had its differences. However, so long as it keeps its core spirit intact then differences are ok.

[@philiparcher2868]

I would imagine that most of Goth people would D.I.Y in clothing, if they were creatively inclined... The difference being the quality of fabrics and access to a clothes-designer(if money wasn't a problem) As for elitism/snobbery between wealthier Goths and not so wealthy Goth-types, well it's just stupid... That just alienates people and definitely stunts the growth of the scene

[@maudelynn1728]

I'd love a makeup tutorial for this video... both of your looks

[@thelibrarian46]

A very concise account.

[@yeaesthetics3195]

you guys look amazing wow

[@justgween7573]

You get hate for not having your HAIR DYED? Ugh, and goths wonder why outsiders think Goth is pretentious.

[@cocon8287]

Raegan reminds me of young Madonna. She is very pretty ! :D

[@tradewindm]

I know chances are slim since the video is starting to date, but does anyone know what the first song is? I just love it so much but can't find it to save my life! Very interesting discussion throughout, that's the kind of discourse the goth community needs imo.

[@sweeneydeville598]

tradewindm demolition group- You better

[@tradewindm]

@@sweeneydeville598 Thank you so much for your answer!

[@pochacco7]

I immensely enjoyed your conversation. Do you guys would ever consider a discussion about POC and the lack representation in these alternative brands? They tend to only have models that are no darker than ivory and maybe 1 or 2 black models and that's it. And the constant excuse for the pale elitism is " we're trying for a Victorian deathly look' as a way to exclude people. For a lot of cultures, colorism has always been issue.

[@NoirL.A.]

that dude looks like the singer for HUMAN LEAGUE.

[@eldron29-a54]

Not really, there are a lot of Gothic Lolita brands with plus sized and affordable dresses. And you can always buy second hand clothes, a lot cheaper. Lolita isn't always the most expensive but the most high cuality way to dress Victorian.

[@lunaokittens9574]

Lady R is quite charming - does she have her own page?...

[@garycollingwood4002]

💙💙💙 VIRGIN 💙💙💙

[@colfaxpowers6829]

very nice! reagan is awesome!! glad you made a video together! @gone.to.hell.again.666

[@DJSTOEK]

🖤

[@sailorhamlett]

Does she have social media? She seems awesome

[@k0ilees936]

i honestly thought you were robert smith at first

[@vlatstrapes3931]

Nice video. Too bad I can't pick up the designers' names from hearing because they seem really interesting.

[@queenqueercoffin6696]

May I have the names of the artists and names of songs from the video playlist.

[@sweeneydeville598]

Demolition group- You Better Stay Alive Death Waves- Holy Grin Drab Majesty- 39 By Design Salem- King Night The Killbrides - My Old Scene Crystal Castles- Years Of Silence La Strada - Zelje

[@monikintin.3377]

Sweeney DeVille Thanks for lists. I am very impressed with modern day goth-ish bands. They kinda bring back good music to recent days.

[@Zzzsleepzzz]

thrift shopping and ebay :)

[@greekvampy3690]

Dont forget in the early 200s the politicians destroyed a lot of alturive subculters such as skate boarding pagen & wicca at lest in amrica that's a mager Conrrute to modern goth

[@bansheesioux5569]

What?

[@magoon993]

What's class gotta to do with goth. It's sad. Everything's about class these days.