THE STATE OF M43 (2018) (is it dead?)

[@KimCruz1]

who's jumping ship?!

[@akivabernstein4723]

Kim Cruz I’m not a m43 user but I’m jumping to Panasonic from Nikon (d850) But I had my eye on the g9 before they announced the S1/s1r.

[@KimCruz1]

nicee what brought you to m43 specifically?

[@77edwilson]

I jumped to Fuji. I've actually tried a few systems and the Fooj just hits me in the feels... The styling and film simulations are ama-azing. The Pen-F was close but the ergonomics of that camera sans a grip made me sad. So I am rocking an X-T2 and an X100F. In all honesty, M4/3 would cover my needs (as it would most) but I am a huge fan of having intimate control of my camera with all the dials.

[@KimCruz1]

i feel ya the fuji cameras look good! personally i like the pen f but never used it... trying it in store i thought the grip might be an issue like you said.. any thoughts on the xt3? i feel like that isn't being talked about enough but the features and specs on that camera are incredible!

[@AndrewSowerby]

You can get really nice third party grips for the Pen-F for as little as $20. It shouldn't be a showstopper. Makes you wonder why Oly didn't include a good one in the box, so as not to put off so many potential buyers.

[@Astrolavista]

I'm not leaving M43 any time soon, the size and cost of the glass on the new EOS-R for example is prohibitive! M43 is here to stay :)

[@KimCruz1]

yup so true! the size AND weight but i also wonder how big the 10-25mm f1.7 from panasonic is gonna be... of course not ff size but how big compared to m43 lenses?

[@VistasNatureWildlifeFilms]

Same here!

[@BobK58]

I shoot for fun. You can get a new EM10 MkII with two kit lenses that cover 28-300mm equivalent for $700. The camera comes packed with features and the silver model has a very retro look. The size and weight means you won't mind hiking with it or annoy people with a big lens when doing street photography. It may lack a bit in the video side but I'm mainly a stills person. Thanks for the video.

[@KimCruz1]

i feel you m43 is great as a small package to take around for anything and no probs glad you stopped by!

[@dudragon49]

The main advantage of M43 is weight!

[@KimCruz1]

yeah ff camera bodies have gotten smaller and lighter but the lenses.. my god the lenses!

[@Jellias11]

Its funny because I just bought my first micro 4/3 camera and lenses because it was so cheap. I was able to get awesome prices from people running from the format. I have no idea why people would jump to sell their kits but I’m excited to see the deals.

[@KimCruz1]

me too!

[@genxtechguy]

I agree .. love my GH5 and GH5s ... and not yet swayed to go full frame. Too many great lenses available that I have yet to try ..... also, crispy audio, what mic are you using?

[@KimCruz1]

who is the gh5s man i haven't even been able to try that camera yet! for mic i found the cheapest mic with decent quality i could find..... the rode video micro lol

[@hectordejesus8718]

The g9 is looking very good for what I do. I shoot more photo then video. In going to just use my g7 till I hit a wall.

[@KimCruz1]

that might take a while the g7 is a pretty good camera!!!

[@hectordejesus8718]

Ya I'm right there to hitting a wall on my Sony a55. But I still love that camera.

[@datapro007]

I hope you are right Kim. The question remains, can Olympus and Panasonic make money in the middle between mobile phones and the pros?

[@KimCruz1]

datapro007 yeah that’s true! Here’s to hoping I’m right too haha!

[@LegendaryGauntlet]

Less weight, less bulk for that carry on luggage, better lenses, like f/1.2 that you can shoot wide open and get perfect results, less costly (even considering the high end pro lenses..), FF will not compete anytime soon. Also that best in class Olympus IBIS, the manual focus clutch, fantastic weatherproof system, etc... It seems Panasonic are adding FF to their own portfolio but in reality they had been making cameras for Leica for quite a long time and it's the logical next step to promote their lens mount (which i believe Pana had a lot of input in.. if we see its history). So for them it's more a question of branding, i dont see it taking anything from their m4/3 division which was going by itself quite well and is stronger than ever due to video, drones, film making..

[@KimCruz1]

yeah i agree especially for the video, i don't think m43 is going anywhere and the system is perfect for beginners all the way up to the seasoned pro!

[@GA96_]

I had an a6000, I got it for the portability and amazing stills quality for the low cost. However, I've realized I'm more of a video guy with occasional portrait shoots, and the overheating on the a6000 with long video record times was unbearable. Switched to M43 with a G85. Sure I wish it was a little smaller, sure I wish it had slightly shallower DOF for my occasional portraits, but the overall package simply can't be beat.

[@KimCruz1]

i think so too and any camera will have it's own compromise. i know what you mean with the g85 being a bit bigger than you want because i feel it too! but then again.. compromise. Using the gx85, the grip is too small for my to carry around all day (i like to grip my camera rather than use a strap), and using a gx850 (gf9), there isn't enough control rings for me to use it the way i want to! then when i use ff cameras for work i realize, the g85 isn't quite so big and heavy afterall.. and then i realize the g7 and g85 isn't much of a sacrifice at all!

[@ChrisWilliams-nf8kl]

For many people (myself included) larger DoF is the main weakness of the system, not a strength. Currently you increasingly have to spend a LOT of cash to buy fast OEM lenses (I wouldn’t even count f2.8 as fast either except perhaps for long zooms). The new 10-25 f1.7 will, I wager be eye-wateringly expensive for something that will give the equivalence performance of a 20-50 f3.5. Recently I’ve become increasingly frustrated with this situation and was strongly considering going back to 35mm (mirrorless- not my venerable 5Dii). I’ve just bought a G9. Why? I’ve also bought a Sigma 18-35 after trying a speed booster with my Canon glass. The Sigma with booster will give me the equivalence of a (roughly) 25-50 zoom, ultra sharp f2.5 (the booster makes the 1.8 a 1.2!). The price is decent, I can live with slow or manual focus and although it’s going to be a beast in terms of size and weight, when I don’t need shallow DoF or ultra low light shooting, I can pick up one of my smaller lenses (and my GM5) and still have something ultra compact. It’s a shame I’m having to go the route of adapted lenses to achieve this - there’s been a decision within Olympus/Panasonic to massively up their prices on ‘premium’ glass. That could kill the system. I do only expect it to be five to ten years before the single ILC is seriously challenged by multiple-array, computational devices, but that’s another topic...

[@KimCruz1]

i know what you mean about their premium glass lol... i don't own any and i don't think i'll ever be tempted to buy one just because i think there are better options like you already said... however, with computational devices... i think that's already piquing my interests as it is! the google pixel 2 had some really insane tricks up it's sleeve.. and i think panasonic is already looking into similar things with their full frame cameras- rumor is using AI to improve AF.. no telling how well it works, but very interesting way of going about this problem!

[@ChrisWilliams-nf8kl]

Kim Cruz Oh yeah there’s already a lot of computational grunt that goes into ILCs and we take for granted things like NR, demosaicing, distortion correction and help with subject tracking to name a few. One thing that doesn’t seem anywhere near plateauing (unlike the efficiency of current sensor models) is processing power. I’m talking more about multi-sampling from small arrays and stitching with the algorithms applying sophisticated routines to ‘invent’ missing detail. It completely changes the image capture paradigm as well as what constitutes a good image (veracity vs accuracy). It throws up a few conundrums- but I suspect most people won’t care if they’re getting a great looking image from a tiny, convenient device. It’s coming anyway - the L16 is a good proof of concept but with implementation that’s a long way off good enough IMO.

[@zardosspinosa6944]

i am heavily invested in M4/3 and is the perfect format for my main genre travel, that said I probably carry too much gear but I love using the different lenses and it all fits into my diminutive Lowepro Slingshot 150 and my images are plenty awesome enough, however there is something gorgeous about the FF sensor which is particularly evident in portrait photography

[@KimCruz1]

yeah i agree full frame still has that advantage in depth but honestly, i do wonder if clients ever comment on that or if it's just us camera nerds lol... to be fair, i've never had a client ask/complain about it on m43!

[@zardosspinosa6944]

Kim Cruz you are so right on that score, I have taken many beautiful portrait images on my Olympus and they look fantastic when printed and my subjects are blown away by how gorgeous they are, but there is your personal quest going on and I know my images are going to look even better with say a Sony A7iii, maybe one day, but not a priority at the mo

[@AndrewSowerby]

I don't actually shoot with M43, but I can't see why extremely shallow depth of field is good for portraits. Even on APS-C, I may have to stop down a little bit to get the subject into proper focus. That FF 85mm f/1.2 is fine if you only want one pupil in focus and the rest of the subject mushy as hell, but... Why? ;) I just don't think it's as big of a deal as some people make it out to be, at least, in practical terms.

[@zardosspinosa6944]

Andrew Sowerby agreed, if you are doing studio portrait photography you do want to get everything in focus, if you are doing environmental portraiture which tends to be more full body or 3/4 you can get beautiful effects when you melt the background

[@AndrewSowerby]

@@zardosspinosa6944 why stop at FF then? Go Medium Format ;) I enjoyed Zach Arias' video on the subject. Very funny... And true!

[@garyking4032]

I don't understand how you can talk about the state of MFT and not mention the BMPCC4k? More dynamic range, better codecs, bigger screen compared to the GH5, and at almost half the price of the competition (or a quarter of the price if you're looking at internal raw) - it's the most exciting MFT camera around right now - even if it is more of a video camera that shoots stills rather than a hybrid. Great audio by the way, you're voice sounds superb.

[@KimCruz1]

thanks man and i should've added the black magic but i don't know enough about the camera although i've seen plenty of test footage- the colors and dynamic range look great!

[@garyking4032]

It certainly bodes well for the MFT system... Plenty of videographers are snapping them up with speedboosters :)

[@AndrewSowerby]

Why didn't they include a flip screen of any kind? That seems like such a strange omission for a videography camera.

[@dragancete]

I love the m43 system, sure there's other good options but I choose m43 for the smaller setups and the incredible good image quality.

[@KimCruz1]

me too!

[@jasone2240]

I jumped a few months ago and love it. Greater dof control and eye AF. The combination is amazing for kids portraits. I loved my panny for general photography but i was tired of taking portraits only to find that not quite focussed. My phone had a better hit rate. I was tempted to update and the pen-f was gorgeous but user groups were reporting similar portrait focus probs. The g9 seemed better but still not class leading at af and a similar price and size to the a7iii. With my a7iii it's a genuine surprise if it's not focussed.

[@KimCruz1]

that eye af seems like a big change and hopefully something olympus or panasonic start integrating (somehow without phase detect lol). the continuous af has never been great on m43 but i find for stills subjects my hit rate is pretty good! obviously, having that in c af would also be welcome...........

[@markshirley01]

Yes - the A73 is the camera that has lit the fuse under FF mirrorless.

[@wahabdilawar]

Very comforting. I am a Nikon user and got an Olympus O-MD EM10 II just a couple of months ago. Shot the moon with my Olympus O-MD EM10 II with the Tamron 18-400mm lens adapted to it and I loved it. Thank you very much for your time and effort. You've got another subscriber. Please share the link to that list of lenses, which you showed in your video. I would like to start building my MFT lens collection.. especially with the expected price drop on EM-1 mark II after the possible release of its successor.

[@KimCruz1]

hey man welcome and yeah m43 cameras are more capable than people think i think! Here's the list of lenses, i'm not sure it's always up to date though! hazeghi.org/mft-lenses.html

[@MitchMichelleOfficial]

I own a G4, G9, and GH5s. But I still have my doubts about the format for the future. I love that fact that lenses will be cheaper and more abundant eventually, but I'm super disappointed in Panasonic for basically releasing their (most likely) last m4/3 lens, and basically dumping the format. No matter how you frame it. It's great that you're a fanboy, so am I, but I'm also realistic.

[@KimCruz1]

lol yeah let's see! i hope this isn't their last lens!

[@MitchMichelleOfficial]

agreed!

[@davidkeel]

I came across this the day after finding out about the full frame compact camera the Sony A7R2 and A7R3. I have only just discovered the Micro Four Thirds world and bought the Lumix GX9. I feel like I want to sell it already after finding out about these two cameras from Sony.

[@KimCruz1]

definitely a fair choice! just have a look at the lenses in the sony ecosystem first because they are quite big... just an example, the sony gm 24-70 is even bigger than the canon L 24-70! im sure you can still find some nice small primes though but just make sure you check out the size and weight of the sony lenses first.

[@melvinch]

@@KimCruz1 The Sony E-mount was designed with APS-C sensor in mind. Using this mount for full frame with that short flange distance means lenses will have to be much bigger to concentrate the image onto that big sensor. So Sony bragging about full-frame mirrorless being a compact camera system is basically false advertising.

[@davidkeel]

Thanks Kim. I actually have a Canon 24-70 from a few years ago. But thanks for mentioning the size of them. I do hope Sony make some decisions about new lenses

[@KimCruz1]

@melvin chong i wouldn't say false advertisement but i know what you mean lol.. the body itself is impressive- around the same size as a lumix g7, and definitely smaller than the GH5.. but the lenses.. oh the lenses!

[@KimCruz1]

@david keel no worries and yeah it's definitely worth a closer look, that gm24-70 is a beast! not much heavier but because of the smaller bodies compared to a 5Div, it feels heavier to lug around, at least for me.

[@thedvsmonkey]

In the past 3 months I’ve bought 4 cameras - Sony a7r ii, Panasonic G85, G7, and finally the G9. I just sold all of the Sony gear yesterday. I think it’s safe to say I’m sticking for the long haul!

[@KimCruz1]

nice! what happened to the a7rii? what did you like more about the panasonic system?

[@thedvsmonkey]

I have a history with Panasonic (I had several Panasonic video cams) but all of the equipment was fairly old so I sold everything and was talked into the Sony. Don't get me wrong, in theory the Sony equipment is amazing . . . but . . . there were a few things I couldn't get past and once I bought the G9 that pretty much clinched it. I thought I could deal with the abysmal battery life (by buying 8 batteries) but I didn't even use the video features and the batteries were draining faster than I could charge them. It was very disappointing to have battery life dropping without even being used in the cam! I was constantly hitting the SD card door open just in the way I always carry my still cams and had even launched the card out of the cam a few times. The door is just too flimsy and easy to knock open for me. I also thought I could get past the ridiculous menu system but it was laborious at best. The Panasonic is so much more familiar and easy to set up. I don't even have to look at the buttons on the G7 and G85 to change settings and if you know one of them then you know both. Being able to share batteries between those 2 cams is a nicety as well . . . although battery life isn't even a concern since they last sooooo much longer than the Sony batteries. I don't regret getting the Sony first since it really lit my pilot light to get back into photography but getting the G85 really put me back into the videography. I use the G85 for the vlogging and run and gun stuff. The G7 stays on the tripod and is only for my "studio". The G9 is my still cam. That's the order I bought them and each was to serve a purpose in my long term plans. So I'm done buying cams for awhile and I need maybe 2 more lenses to fit my needs. Sorry for the long reply but I wanted to give you a thorough explanation for the method to my madness.

[@leanderhoefler7054]

I recently picked up the Olympus Pen F for my street work. I think M43 is the best system for street. And that camera is just perfect so I will only switch to something else when Olympus releases a weather sealed version of this. Can‘t wait for the Sigma 56mm to be released though

[@KimCruz1]

i HOPE they release a weather sealed/pro version of it! such a pretty camera with surprising omissions like weather sealing!

[@leanderhoefler7054]

Kim Cruz Yeah that‘s really a shame. Still my absolute favorite camera, my EM1.2 is getting quite dusty since

[@PolytheneBoy]

Even if prices between FF and M43 were comparable, the lens sizes and weight make it so hard to be interested in FF. I can go out with my GX80 and a small shoulder bag and have as many lenses as I want with me, and will hardly notice the weight.

[@KimCruz1]

i agree! i have to use a 5diii at work and sometimes i just wish i could use my g7!

[@whatsupdate]

To me full frame is the most versatile format. The only m43 advantage I can think of is easier IBIS. The longer depth of field can be achieved in FF by stepping down the aperture. I mean m43 has limitations in terms of bokeh and low light that there isn’t a workaround for. The m43 doesn’t provide anything that can’t be achieved by mirrorless FF that I can think of.

[@KimCruz1]

i think the longer depth of field is definitely an underrated option because of diffraction. at some point, every lens has diffraction and on m43 it's usually past F8.. however, the long depth of field you can achieve at F8 on m43 is like F16 on ff... of course you can stack images on a ff sensor too! and yes in terms of image quality ff may be the most versatile, but you have to balance that with ergonomics and weight as well!

[@JeanV1986]

Size and weight!

[@philipwilkinson3888]

Nice vid! Thanks for the info

[@ChrisWhittenMusic]

Agreed about the Blackmagic Pocket 4k. It's a brand new M4/3rds camera and looks to have been a huge sales success on pre-orders. Arguably the two biggest cameras in semi-pro and b camera video are the GH5 and Pocket 4K. How that can exist alongside this so called doom and gloom about M4/3rds I have no idea.

[@KimCruz1]

lol and that's not even talking about the beginners and even pro photographers on the system!

[@wahabdilawar]

This is definitely off-topic, but do you know when black Friday deals will start in B&H, Adorama and other photography stores? I am planning to satisfy my "GAS"...☺

[@KimCruz1]

lol no i haven't, unfortunately i don't get those deals in this part of the world but i'm sure there are great deals on at the moment!

[@wahabdilawar]

@@KimCruz1 Neither do I, for I live and work in Saudi Arabia, but I can order online. Thanks for the reply.

[@yvsevyse4562]

Tbh, planning to join m43s for telephoto lenses. Those small, yet cost friendly lenses is a must. Plus, from what ive seen, most of the m43s lenses are good.

[@KimCruz1]

yeah they are certainly compact! just make sure to scout the lenses that you want because for as well developed the lens lineups are on m43 compared to other mirrorless systems, they aren't as plentiful as the canon and nikon lens lineups so you won't get as many tiers of lenses (in terms of prices) i.e. an f1.8, an f1.4 and an f1.2!

[@KimCruz1]

whoa that's a pretty serious setup what are you shooting!?

[@yvsevyse4562]

@@KimCruz1 as of now, im just looking at the 35-100 f2.8 as my main lens for the system. I do have a canon FF, but i only use my primes and nothing more. Im not really kin on lugging around long and heavy lenses, going further than 100mm for FF - makes taking photos less fun and more of a task to bring after 4 to 5 hrs in a trip or moving around the city.

[@KimCruz1]

it becomes a chore! of course ff has it's benefits but weight and size is not one of them! unless you're trying to build muscle at the same time as taking pictures of course..

[@alanplatt888]

I think the FF mirrorless revolution is a money making opportunity to boost production and sales and will spike in 2 years the fall off dramatically as technology outweighs the bulk and costs involved. I see the software and sensors removing lowlight and AF issues completely. 8K 16K frames per second not too far in the future. Pixel shift and frame stitching technology will boost any detail deficiencies. Size of camera and lenses with a retro look will remain a fashion. Photography is about the photographer not his or her equipment.

[@KimCruz1]

lol well i wouldn't go so far as to say it's basically a hoax, there's definitely a demand for it but it would be interesting to see if the trend heavily favors full frame just because most cameras right now are not full frame... although it is worth mentioning that because the entry level market is dying, manufacturers aree focusing on their high end cameras so that may be something else to consider..

[@alanplatt888]

No hoax, a market leaping to claw back investments before the bubble bursts. M4/3 bucked a trend with a new approach to "professional photography" and wowed the big boys with it's innovation and popularity. Entry level ?? Camera phones will decimate that concept. Point and shoot.........yes, small, effective, stabilized low light capable sensors, military grade optics plus ease of portability. Coupled with Adobe's future post problem elimination solutions, on a phone or iPad. the future of Instantaneous global image transfer, I think this will rule the consumer market. Why would a professional eye require more than that.

[@TheIvanDM]

There is only two market segment for Olympus now - street/travel photo enthusiasts and fanatics of course. First way is logical and honest but it needs to lower their price (to compete with smartphones) and... looks like they're not gonna do it.... preferring fanatics... It's sad...

[@KimCruz1]

let's see because at least from youtube, lots of pro photographers have moved to m43 and not just street and travel photographers! but yes, a price reduction is very very welcome! i hope you're reading this olympus!

[@smiff4748]

Low to mid range DSLR's will go long before Micro 4/3. Has anyone bothered to ask Panasonic whether they are dropping Micro 4/3, I read recently that Panasonic are committed to the system so who is right. Micro 4/3 manufacturers know that not every one wants or can afford a full frame camera, they need a camera system that caters to the needs of the masses and that's micro 4/3. Personally I don't really care what happens, I have basically everything I need in the way of lenses and camera bodies, I also have the Lumix GX9 coming soon so I'm sorted. My Lumix cameras are excellent and even though they are not perfect they suit my needs and give good results.

[@KimCruz1]

yup panasonic continued to reiterate during photokina and in interviews afterwards that they are committed to the m43 system- personally i dont think m43 is going anywhere.. there is still space for updates to lenses (hopefully for cheaper), and f1.4 and f1.2 variants. also bsi sensors and better c af and video af! still much room to grow!

[@Itsallgoodtogo]

Pocket 4k coming to the market... You can't go wrong with m43

[@KimCruz1]

it's a great mount. also, seen some tests with the black magic.... nice colors!!

[@jackmckechnie5801]

I pick up my EM1and use it as much as I do my Fuji...I won't be giving it up...but you need to change a little. A little more sensor work...backside illumination...They need to start thinking about the future...And an upgrade for the PenF ....make that front dial with interchangeable functions on the F..but with a price tag around the FujiXT20....

[@KimCruz1]

totally agree with the interchangeable functions and price reduction on the pen f too! and apparently the c af on the pen f isn't all that great as well, please upgrade that as well!

[@gardawg]

i still love my g7 and if i wanna be a little bit professional stuff i would take G9 because fullframe mirrorless is too much professional for an amateur like me, but i love to buy it if my skill is good enough for them

[@KimCruz1]

yeah and i agree and even then i think ff cameras and lenses are sooo hard to justify just because of the extra weight! honestly just looking at image quality i don't think you will even notice a difference with the G9! but lenses will make a difference! ben aqua did a nice comparison between the g85 (similar to the g7) vs the g9: kzbin.info/www/bejne/q2GpfnWGj72Eaqc

[@bobdrawbaugh4207]

No, I’m not jumping ship. If Olympus and Panasonic stopped making cameras today. I would stock like a couple and continue to use them for years. As you said full frame lens aren’t going to get smaller,.

[@KimCruz1]

lol me neither but it's hard to imagine m43 dying anyway! the lenses for m43 even compared to apsc cameras are significantly smaller as well!

[@WhiteWulfe]

I'm more than happy with the setup I currently have (G85), although I wouldn't mind getting the G9 at some point, and maybe a GH4 or GH5S. Biggest reason? It's small yet powerful, and while low light performance may be one of it's weaker points in comparison to full frame, there are several tricks to combat such. Excitement for the S1 pretty much died out for me a few days after Photokina predominately because a new article would come out about the S1(R) but have virtually no new info - that and the suspected price (north of $3k CAD seem to be most guesses) Arguably that announced (with no real info) 10-25mm f1.7 zoom has also piqued my curiosity, although such is price dependent, because if it's even remotely near $3k CAD I'd rather just get two of the Olympus f1.2 Pro lenses... Besides, alongside the smaller bodies and lenses, I actually LIKE the crop factor the camera has, because one hobby I want to get into (astrophotography) most micro four thirds sensors are actually USEFUL, and in fact are one of the more common sensor sizes in dedicated hobbyist level astrophotography cameras, with the IMX294 being the new hot commodity (especially from ZWO, although being peltier cooled, arguably it's cool and chill, but that's being silly and geeky :P). Why do I say such? Well, in astrophotography sensor size is one of the lowest concerns, as you're doing long exposures and stacking, but the 2x crop factor means you can go with a smaller, much more portable telescope and still get some of the widefield targets you want - for example, M42 (Orion Nebula) can fill most of the frame using a micro four thirds sensor camera with a 61mm apeture 360mm focal length telescope (a 73mm apeture 430mm focal length telescope does this almost perfectly), while an APS-C sized sensor requires a larger, and subsequently heavier telescope. That 360mm f5.9 telescope also conveniently fits in a backpack, as would a camera tracker, and you could then just put it all on a semi-decent carbon fiber tripod, and voila, "inexpensive", portable astrophotography setup that's light compared to most "full on" astro rigs. Won't do 10 minute subs/exposures, but it sure is a lot easier to carry on your back than even most "entry level" equatorial mounts (which are 25-35lbs all in at minimum for mount+tripod+counterweights) ....I tend not to really do anything wider than 35mm (equivalent) with my photography though, so that probably plays into things... But I've been tempted by some of the Laowa wide angle lenses, I won't lie. And that Olympus 8mm fisheye.

[@KimCruz1]

wow i had no idea there were specialized astrophotography lenses but yeah being able to adapt is good! also, i actually have one of the laowa wide angles and if the weather and location permits I might do something with astrophotography in a couple of weeks but let's see first! is fisheye vs rectilinear a big concern in astrophotography?

[@WhiteWulfe]

@@KimCruz1 I'm guessing you meant specialized astrophotography cameras ^_^;;;; Altair Astro and ZWO are two of the main hobbyist ones (varying from $200 to $2,900 CAD depending on the sensor and accessories), all the way up to some of the absolutely insane but very good ones that SBIG makes (that cost, uhm... Some of them full out setups cost as much as that Red Raven setup from Apple USA....). Basically they're a camera sensor with specific anti-bloom tweaking (an issue that can occur during the really long exposures astrophotography uses), and at least an active fan cooled sensor (Altair Astro), or a TEC/Peltier element actively cooling the sensor 35-45C cooler than ambient to significantly reduce dark current energy (sensor and random noise that happens during long exposures). Temperature controlled ones also have the benefit of being able to use master bias, dark, and flat files since you can just build such for particular temperature ranges. The biggest downside about dedicated cameras is that you need a power source (typically an external battery of some sort) as well as some sort of computer (either a laptop or a fully fledged tablet), and if you're going to have all that you might as well spend the extra $450ish CAD on top of it all to get a guidescope and a camera for that because then even on a tracking mount that might only get you 2-3 minute exposures normally it can suddenly make them 5, or even 10 minutes long without any trailing. If you meant lenses... The ones I was mentioning were small, portable refractor telescopes from William Optics, specifically their ZenithStar 61, and the ZenithStar 73. Both are quite small, fit in a backpack, and are lightweight. They won't see as far as telescopes with larger apeture, but you also don't have to worry about throwing out your back if you take it with you backpacking, or for a walk (because you don't have a car) As for fisheye vs rectilinear... Sadly I honestly don't know whether such is a concern or not, as space stuff I'm more interested in the far away shots than I am in taking a wide angle lens and getting the "traditional" milky way galactic core shot. The biggest issues you can run into with any lens is comatic aberrations, which is where stars wind up getting stretched along the edges. Some lenses are bad for this, others not so much. The Olympus 8mm f1.8 is rather good about it, despite being a fisheye lens. If shooting with a standard tripod, a lot of people will live by the "600" rule, "500" rule, or "400" rule, which is basically take that number and divide it by the effective focal length of your lens to get an approximation of how many seconds you can go before you start to see star trailing. An example would be the Panasonic 25mm f1.7, where by the 500 rule you'd be able to 'get away" with exposures of about 10 seconds long before stars start trailing. If shooting with a camera tracker, this can be a lot longer, but can require stacking exposures in photoshop since over time the ground becomes this big blurry mess while the stars remain crisp and clear (aka easily fixed by having several long exposures of the sky, and then one or two shorter length long exposures of the landscape itself, then merge in post)

[@chrisbatson8748]

I love m4/3. I just got a great deal for X-Mas on a G85, 12-60 and 45-200 lens with some extras for 797.00 at Adorama ( B&H had the same deal ) . I am selling my G7 and 12-32, my Panasonic Flash ( I use constant light 99% of the time ) and the 45-200 new in the box for almost what I will have in the G85 and 12-60. ( about $200 less and I already have a 45-150 that is very good ) The 12-60 used is going for $250 alone. My X-Mas video came out great. Shot in 4k for over an hour, downscaled to 1080P and got to pull great stills from the 4K video of reactions to gifts. I am going to get an aftermarket grip and I have a great setup with the G85 for 4k and photography and a GH2 for 1080P video and some photography. Both of these cameras and lenses together weight less than my FF Nikon and 24-70 VR lens I had, which weighted as much as my D300S and 70-200 VR lens or 70-300VR FF lens. I know ISO 3200 and under is great and ISO 6400 is decent on the G85 so I use my F1.7 lens to stay under those restrictions and my life is good for way less than the Nikon's cost. I am not anti-Full Frame at all, I am glad something much lighter came along that does what I need. It likely isn't for everyone but it damn sure is for me. None of my Nikons did video worth crap. I don't know how ppl use Sony's with 10 minute limits. For shooting a real movie, ok, I get it, for shooting weddings or normal stuff, unlimited is good. Now I just the money for the 7-14mm F4 and I am set. ( $800 new or around $500 used ) Just my 2 cents.

[@KimCruz1]

Chris Batson that’s quite a set up!

[@chrisbatson8748]

@@KimCruz1 I think so also. I also have the Panasonic 25mm F1.7 and the kit 14-42mm to put on the GH2. I have both Nikon and FD adapters for some old FD lens and a few FF Nikon lenses. Oh, and a Pentax adapter for some SMC Pentax lenses from my Film camera. My wish list is still the 7-14mm for really wide and maybe a 15-25mm F0.95 lens for super low light. Full Frame and DX are great until the weight takes its toll on you. I used to carry a FF and 24-70 F2.8 and then a DX with 70-200 or 70-300. I can now take 2- m4/3 cameras covering the same range and both cameras weight the same as just 1 of the Nikons/Lens did. Maybe the technical image quality is not always as good but I get shots I couldn't before trying to change between 2 heavy setups. My life is easier now and I am thrilled about it. YMMV.

[@tonkatoytruck]

If it does not have IBIS............................ its just another camera.

[@KimCruz1]

haha!

[@akivabernstein4723]

I mean they announced the new lens for m43 and it’s promised to be a god send. So that’s a plus.

[@KimCruz1]

honestly if that lens isn't going to cost me a mortgage i might consider it just because it's got an interesting zoom range!

[@RedbeardComms]

If anyone is interested, I'd recommend trying a focal reducer/speedbooster. I just got a Viltrox EF-M2 for my G7 for $130 on eBay, and it's made a world of difference. If you're fine with your D.O.F. on your native M43 lenses, don't worry about it, but I was interested in trying it out, and the results are amazing! P.S., thanks as always for the vid Kim, keep it up 👌🏻🔥

[@KimCruz1]

thanks man and you know... apparently every serious videographer 'eventually goes with a speedbooster and larger lenses' lol! so maybe you're already ahead!! but yeah honestly i might give it a shot in the future but at the moment i really enjoy m43 primes!

[@RedbeardComms]

@@KimCruz1 I'm glad you're making your lenses work though! I already had some EF glass from my past Canon cameras, and it was cheaper to get that speedbooster than some nice MFT glass! If you can make MFT primes work, all the more power to you my friend 👍🏻

[@KimCruz1]

thanks man yeah if i already had lenses like you i think i would've done the same! m43 glass isn't the cheapest but at least we have a range... nothing like canon and nikon tho!

[@RedbeardComms]

@@KimCruz1 That's where MFT adapabiltiy is great!

[@jerrytldpl]

MFT will be fine. They can't dump this huge segment of the market (people who want light, compact and semi pro / advanced (but not expert) equipment).

[@KimCruz1]

yeah it wouldn't be wise to do that although i would also say there are also experts using m43 for pro photography and videography! it's not just us amateurs on the system haha!

[@karunverma1]

I agree, M43 will remain a small niche product but never die. Just check the size & price of any decent full frame mirrorless lens. Its clumsy ergonomics & economics.

[@KimCruz1]

yeah i think it's got a good place in the photography and especially videography world at the moment!

[@martyptx]

I have had a G7 for 2 years, and it’s been great, and I just upgraded to a G9, which is an amazing camera so I’m not going anywhere...

[@KimCruz1]

i only hear amazing things about the g9! if it shot 120fps i would've bought it already!

[@paulm8157]

👍Spot on. I love the ergonomics of M43 and put up with low light trade offs. That said watch Olympus’s next announcements. The company may surprise w/a new APS-C (or other new larger sensor) line-up. That would be consistent w/co moves to entirely new lines of lenses.

[@KimCruz1]

yeah let's see not sure if olympus will start a new system elsewhere, they are certainly very concerned with increasing the performance for the next gen so i'm looking for upgrades more on the processing side rather than the sensor side but who knows? they could surprise us with upgrades for both!

[@markshirley01]

I think M43 will hang around. More importantly you can see where the manufacturers money is going tho. If I was starting out now I'd find it tough to invest in M43 to be honest.

[@KimCruz1]

yeah honestly just an upgrade in sensor tech to a bsi sensor and a fix in video af and c af would do it for me!

[@StaffViet2009]

the m4/3 current iso performance are still not up to my standard yet, even APS C still struggle anything above 1000 maybe wait for next 5 years, things will get better! weight is not really a matter to me, because you gonna add weight to your lightweight mirrorless anyway, you want high build quality as possible? metal all that feel cool? your camera will need more weight! and what's up with Full frame hype? full frame will never be my choice unless science find a way to defeat physics of designing len!

[@KimCruz1]

so true sensor tech gets better and better but lenses haven't really gotten smaller!

[@kevinhouse4720]

M4/3 need to take the cinema route. Prores for video codec

[@KimCruz1]

that would be nice!

[@ambocc]

I love m4/3, but I want something that is equal to a FF zoom lens at constant 2.8. So when m4/3 gives me 1.4 constant zoom lens, I don't think there will be a need for FF and m4/3 will take over. Lens technology will eventually get there.

[@KimCruz1]

i hope so but i also wonder how big that f1.4 lens will be! i wonder if it'll be as big as a ff lens haha

[@ambocc]

I think it would be worth creating a video exploring that possibility and figuring out if m4/3 can match FF bokeh as lens technology gets better. Panasonic will be giving us 1.7 zoom. Still .3 off from what I want, but what is preventing them from creating a 1.4 besides being bigger.

[@rvineyard5770]

I’m sticking to m43.

[@KimCruz1]

lol me too

[@willprice7475]

Great video. I'm biased though. (G9 user)

[@KimCruz1]

lol me too.. we all are!

[@dannyly]

I made the jump to m43. I got to use a GH5 on a shoot and I fell in love. I had a A7III with just the 16-35mm. I sold the body for $2300 (I sold it overpriced because it was out of stock everywhere) and was lucky enough to find a used GH5 for $900. I use the remaining $1400 to buy the noticron 42.5 and the 12-35mm II and still had money to spare.

[@KimCruz1]

that's a great setup! how are you finding the nocticron so far?

[@WarmWeatherGuy]

MFT would disappear if people stopped buying them but I don't see that happening. KZbin is full of videos of people switching from FF to MFT for various reasons, mainly less weight. Camera sales dropped dramatically when cell phone cameras got so good. To get people who ditched their DSLR because their cell phone is "good enough" to come back Panasonic is giving away the G7 near cost. Then the G7 customer will spend more money on lenses and more expensive cameras. Here is an interesting video: How Many Megapixels In A Billboard kzbin.info/www/bejne/i3TEi6dro8mFjZI

[@KimCruz1]

thanks for the insight man and yeah i love that video from f stoppers!

[@AndrewSowerby]

Why would Panasonic ditch M43? Look at all the manufacturers that still produce APS-C even though they've had FF for years, and those sensors are much closer in size. M43 has a lot of advantages, and FF offers different advantages. It's great that Panasonic are getting into the FF market - good luck to them - but I can't see them throwing the baby out with the bath water and dropping M43. If they do, they'll regret it.

[@KimCruz1]

agreed! and even compared to apsc lenses, m43 lenses are tiny! no way you can replace that without significant jumps in technology either in machine learning or through some way of increasing the light magnified... that machine learning is getting spooky though! that might take over the whole photography/videography market altogether but not right now lol...

[@AndrewSowerby]

Some of the tech going in to cameras now is getting scary, I agree. Maybe we're not too far away from the day when the cameras don't need us anymore, and rise up to destroy humanity ;)

[@78285725]

Yeah.. only if you dont have the money. hehe