The (Trans) Egg Prime Directive

[@roseplate279]

Yeah, I feel like the creator of the prime dir-egg-tive (haha, please laugh) meant it to be the subtle difference between "dude, you're trans," and "hey, do you think you'd prefer to be a girl?" If you see someone suffering, you shouldn't ignore it

[@matteodelgallo1983]

Autistic/Neurodivergent rizz is *powerful* stuff, don't diss it bruh

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

It is powerful lol, but not always in the ways I want it to be

[@GhostIntoTheFog]

If Autistic rizz were an RPG stat, I think Trash’s would be maxed out. Holy crap, an RPG where ALL the stats are neurodivergent-related needs to happen.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

@@GhostIntoTheFog that would just be Delicious In Dungeon lmao

[@no0n34ta1l]

i have way too much autistic rizz for me to handle, i be pulling bitches while im trynna buy a cat ear hat, its insane

[@npclucario7005]

TRUEEEE

[@mich_elle_x]

For a long time it was difficult for me to accept that I am non-binary because I was suffering from the imposter syndrome and thinking that I am probably not trans enough. So I will agree that it is improper to call someone trans if one do not identify as one but it can be, at the same time, useful to challenge possible preconceptions that can prevent someone from recognizing one's authentic identity.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah, I think messaging like "You don't have to be trans enough to do the things you want to do" can be very helpful. Like you don't have to be trans to seek what we would call gender-affirming care. You can be a man on estrogen or a woman on T. You can be a woman and get top surgery. Being trans and having that identity isn't necessary, you can just do what you want with your body. That mindset can help release people from the pressure to be "trans enough" and sometimes will help them realize they actually are trans. A lot of the time people don't even realize how dysphoric they actually are because they've suppressed it so long.

[@autodidacticartisan]

Trans Impostor syndrome is so real. I feel like everyone in my life Is either Ignorant about trans issues and therefore not accepting enough to tell or They are lgbt themselves and they will tell me I'm just "not a real trans person", "trans people don't look like you ". But I think most of it is just in my head, I think that most people would actually be accepting. But it still terrifies me

[@Emily_Entropy]

I didn't get the memo and have been actively cracking eggs daily. I'm a Trans Woman, and I do peer counseling for people explicitly dealing with denial issues. If you suspect someone is Trans, please help them as gently as you can, as soon as you can. The longer they go through life in denial, the more psychological harm they'll have to overcome... if they ever start to heal.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Thank you for your service!

[@kayla8402]

it could really be rephrased as "make sure you know the person enough not to cause additional defensive repression". Telling some random coworker you see at lunch a few days a week might be what they need or might create additional denial; it's a caution to be careful. Less direct phrasings may be more appropriate as well, gentler like you say.

[@electronics-girl]

Yeah, I do think the Egg Prime Directive is good up to a point, but I don't think it should be interpreted *too* strictly. I told my therapist in college that I wished I was a woman, and all she ever said about it was "Why do you think you feel that way?" She never said that I might be trans. It took me another 25 years to figure it out, and I'm still mad about that.

[@mirithilrose54]

I'm a cis woman and what I find so degrading about terf retoric is that it assumes that people don't have a single ounce of agency. And that trans people just go around telling everyone they are trans and suddenly... boom they go and transition. The reality is so much more complex. People are often dealing with these feelings for a long time before even speaking out. I can't imagine having to deal with that loneliness. But I can imagine that having someone to talk to would save lives. What I'd also like to add is that I'm from The Netherlands (which is still fairly progressive) and while reading articles about gender clinics it was pointed out that all the doctors where cis people. They didn't hire trans doctors because they might be biased. I don't know if this has changed in the meantime, but I remember thinking to myself how utterly ridiculous this is. Doctors are professionals and if I was someone who wanted to transition I would also like to get the opinion of the pros and cons from a professional who has been through this.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah there's this weird perception that everyone is biased except white cis straight men. Everyone else is biased and political. It makes no sense and yet keeps people out of jobs.

[@jan_kisan]

the "_still_ fairly progressive" sounds... sad 😔 yes i am aware of what's going on in your country as well as in many others... stay strong ❤‍🔥 and thank you for your understanding!

[@rseequest]

As a transperson, I know the reluctance amongst other transpeople to give direct advice. Given the frequency of suicidal ideation, despair and suicide however amongst transpeople, cracked egg or not, I think it is important to be open about assistance, such as proper medical, therapeutic assistance for a floundering egg.

[@thekirbycrafter7229]

I know this is a serious post, but im now imagining a chicken egg with fins flopping about on the table 😭😭😭

[@improvetheword9691]

I nmm nbnn bnn bnnnn nnnnnnnn​@@thekirbycrafter7229

[@natsmith303]

This is not 100% the same thing, but I feel the similarity speaks for itself. I identified as genderfluid and went by any and all pronouns for about 9 months. Only within the past couple weeks did I realize I don't actually experience gender euphoria when being treated like a man like I do as a woman. Well, when I mentioned those feelings to my enby coworker, they immediately replied, "Ah yeah, going from non-binary to transfemme is a classic arc," and I was like, "Well... no. No, I'm still *okay* being called a guy." A week later, I came up to them and said, "Yo, I'm she/they now. You, uh, you were right last week." And they simply smiled and went, "Yeah, I knew, bestie."

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Lol that is a pretty common experience I guess!

[@bijou.miszou]

it would have been weird if someone had told me "i think youre a girl" but someone saying "what you are describing sounds like gender dysphoria" would have hit completely different. Having an identity shoved on you isnt a good feeling, ( even if it's the one you end up developing) but someone noticing your pain and validating your feelings is good and should be done. I think this is where to concept of "egg" fails the trans community. Figuring out your identity is way easier when you arent struggling with dysphoria

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah absolutely!

[@dribanlycan]

I had a friend who was lamenting wishing she could be a girl and i was like "you can be a girl if you want yah know"and she was like "huh..." and came out like a year later.

[@ruckly1241]

I do have a bit of a bone to pick with the Egg Prime Directive. Last year, when I finally started seriously questioning my gender, I sent my spouse long emails where I brain dumped every conflicting thought of why I could be, as well as why I definitively wasn't, actually trans. I wanted a third party opinion help to cut through the anxiety. But instead of doing that, my spouse just replied with "Well, that certainly could be dysphoria." Now, we've been married for a decade at this point. They've been out as non-binary for most of that time. They're even friends with, and mod for, a trans twitch streamer who does a lot of "Trans 101" style content and is used to cracking eggs. If anyone was in a position to give me some clarity, it was them. But nope! "Prime Directive. I can't tell you." Even when I asked, point blank, to their face, what their opinion was. Needless to say, that was pretty frustrating. Naturally, I know that my issue is less with the Egg Prime Directive and more with my spouse's interpretation of it. And to their credit, they've been nothing but supportive of me the entire time, even when they weren't being particularly helpful.

[@tikimillie]

“Finally” started questioning your gender? That kinda sounds like it was expected of you. Be aware that back in the 90s, kids fashion was mostly gender neutral and that this hypergendering of colors and fashion is a step back in the wrong direction. If i were you i wouldn’t label myself but experiment regardless to figure out was feels right. If your partner thinks it sounds like dysphoria i think you should definately act on it though.

[@IAmJustAPers0n11]

who's the streamer? if you don't mid sharing.

[@ruckly1241]

@@tikimillie I've identified as agender for a years by that point, but I never really considered myself trans or nonbinary because I hadn't actually 'done' anything other than just declare it. No effort to socially transition or change my appearance or anything. I don't have any strong feelings relating to gender, one way or the other. Which makes doing a deep dive on my gender like trying to define the outline of a washed-out shadow. So it was never a question of "if?", but one of "how much?" and "is it worth doing something about it?" The label of "agender" still covers a good 80% of it, but the rest I had set aside as "shit to figure out later". What finally prompted the "need to figure it out now" was noticing that my hair was thinning and that, while I'm ostensibly a straight man, I resonate more with the stories of gay women. So I've been on HRT for about 6 months now, which has definitely helped with the hair loss. I still don't know what any of this means for me socially or what I want to transition into, if anything. But now I can tell myself I'm doing something about.

[@ruckly1241]

@@IAmJustAPers0n11 Her name is Willow. And her Twitch channel is just called "Willow". She plays games in addition to chatting about trans related topics. According to my spouse, she and I have similar taste in games. There were a bunch of conversations that I read as "You know, the two of you have an awful lot in common..." that I once described, out loud, directly to them, as having a "your egg will crack when you're ready" vibe. Which made them playing coy all the more aggravating, in a loving "why can't you just make this easy on me?" kind of way.

[@tikimillie]

@@ruckly1241 yup yup thats good. Good luck mate!

[@Mir_Teiwaz]

I wouldn't tell someone they're trans, but I would ask if they've considered it as a possibility.

[@alexelion7084]

I did that when I came out myself to someone and they made some very eggy statements (to the point that I still believe there is a very high chance they are trans) and they just declined and said they don't have dysphoria so they can't be trans. I didn't get to correct this and say that (bad) dysphoria isn't a necessary criteria for being trans and they can be a girl if they want to and I'm not close enough to bring this up again or even get the opportunity to do so. It's so frustrating because I feel like there is someone who could use some perspective but I just can't do anything

[@pseudomugilidae5897]

I've cracked a few eggs, but in the way of just kinda talking about my own experience around folks i think are eggs. It's surprisingly effective just to be like "oh, yeah before i realised i was trans i was suuuper depressed and dissociated and hated my body, that didn't all go away but it got way better once i started transitioning" I think the "I" statements are the key.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah, "I" statements are good!

[@mrpieceofwork]

IDK anyone IRL who's trans (autism tysm for making me a hermit), BUT I have known quite a few "weirdos" in the past, and it always felt to me, that if they starting going in a certain direction which allowed them to be MOAR who they actually were, I would support them, however I could.. while never PUSHING them in that direction. I think just merely allowing someone to be who they are, goes very far towards that "goal" in itself. No need to push.

[@Fren-m3i]

IMO as a trans person one of the best thing you can do for eggs is just live your best life, be your favorite self. I remember seeing gender diverse people for the first time and thinking "oh wow, they look so amazing, I am so happy for them" as that admiration became more and more like envy I knew it was time for me to transition too. Be the change you want to see in the world. Its not on trans people for not telling potential eggs the benefits of transitioning. Its the wider conservative world's fault for making it something so intimidating by hiding the history, creating a toxic popular culture, and legislating to make it harder in the future.

[@lauriebannion1432]

I wish someone would have broken the egg prime directive with me. There were numerous times I would ask the trans people I knew questions about how they figured themselves out, or I would just say things out loud about the way I felt, hoping someone, ANYONE would respond and say "Hey, I know what you're going through". I did it for literally years.

[@brianthatweirdbarberguy]

please please at least drop a hint or something if you think someone might not know they're queer. just thinking about another 40 years not knowing is pretty upsetting. edit: okay maybe people were dropping hints. I'm not actually sure what someone could have said lol I'm just salty because it took so long

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Lol the hints weren't direct enough! Many such cases!

[@GhostIntoTheFog]

You’ve just given me new language to describe the neurodivergent prime directive I operate under. I will never flat out ask someone if they’re neurodivergent or tell them that they are. At best, if they’re clearly struggling (and clearly neurodivergent) and they’re someone close to me, I might suggest to them that they consider the possibility. You never know if someone is closeted and not ready to discuss it or if they’re even aware of it themself, and asking them straight out might backfire. I’m so open about being AuDHD, I hope I can inspire those around me to be open, as well. Of course, once someone comes out as neurodivergent, their neurotype is virtually all I want to talk about (which some people might appreciate and some not - LOL).

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Oh man, I wish someone had told me I was autistic a hell of a lot sooner.

[@GhostIntoTheFog]

I can only imagine what my life would have been like if I knew I was Autistic from childhood and was raised is a neuro-affirming and supportive environment. I spent roughly half my life not knowing and roughly another half masking and in denial. When the pandemic hit, it motivated me to re-examine and embrace my neurodivergent identity. A lot of ableist people whine about neurodivergent content creators “tricking” people into thinking they’re neurodivergent; those creators liberated me and helped me break free of my own egg.

[@Veela666]

The Prime Directive was basically just the Prime Suggestion.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

So true lmao

[@pedroff_1]

Last year, my egg got cracked in a pretty funny way. I, for some reason, had started HRT while still considering myself cis. After finally telling some people about it, many asked and/or assumed I was trans. After denying that was the case to some people, I started thinking more seriously about it, especially after I told a friend and she replied showing me a song about being trans. It stuck in my head and I eventually came to the conclusion that, yes, I do want to be a woman, not just to have boobs

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

So many people start HRT "in a cis way."

[@lenaofthevalley]

for me years ago, I met my best friend and knew he was trans bc he started using a new masculine nickname and I basically asked if he wanted to use he/him pronouns and I just used them between our close friends until he felt comfortable to come out. and this past year, i realized I was genderfluid (after suppressing it for 4 years) and i did have talks about dysphoria with that friend because I was confused; I always thought no I'm not trans because I don't experience it in the way he did. now he gives me advice to get my mom to understand my identity and how I want to transition..😭 we were both eggs hatching at different times

[@artosbear]

I feel a lot of the hesitance like you talk about comes from so many of us being abuse victims, so much, and abuse is extremely pervasive in the country built on large scale abuses, surprise. Its not cop talk it's "preparing to try to evade or receive abuse." Don't do this, do this, do this thing just so and I won't set my abuser off, if I do this it'll be a little abuse but it'll prevent a bigger abuse etc. Its super hard to escape that mindset, its super hard to stay out of that mindset even after you do learn to leave it. I'm a chaotic bipansexual whatever autistic trans nb hot mess myself I *needed* other people to tell me before I could say a lot of this stuff myself. I needed teachers 30 years ago in my 40 year life rather than 10. I'm still needing teachers but I'm seeking them out, for learning how to expand my outward gender expression. I think...we are eachothers business and eachothers harvest (Akwaeki Emezi)

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Ooh, good point!

[@KieranStrix]

I range from “hey, buddy…” to “I’m a professional cook; we’re makin’ omelets”

[@helamsirrine]

As the least useful voice in this convo... a cis bi man who repressed for decades and still has a few of those brainworms... I'll try to apply this to my experience. At different times in my life, I think I might have rejected someone who was gay coming to me and telling me that they think that I am gay. I remember doing this to some bi kid that I barely knew, who was acting out at a party and inappropriately hitting on my sister. I clocked him instantly, but I didn't know why. I was in the repression zone and so was he, and the same sort of fundie one at that. I was barely deconstructed from my religious stuff while he was in deep. He was repressed because of fundie beliefs, but younger and more sexually experienced than me. We ended up arguing at length after I overheard him do a queer sounding voice, realised what was bothering me about him, and I suddenly way too loudly expessed, "Oh that's it! Yer gay!" He was flirting with all the girls at the party with a 'nonthreatening flamboyant queer' sort of affect that dropped otherwise. I was the worst person to try and talk to this dude about his sexuality from the closet, but after he was inappropriate towards my sister in front of me and her boyfriend, I ended up playing pool with him and trying to reason with him, including discussing religion and his sexuality while keeping discussion of my own off the table. I eventually drove him into a rage and he choked me until I passed out on his downstairs floor under the pool table, only to wake in the morning with a disturbing black substance staining the floor near my open mouth. My sister and her boyfriend were like "That was a bad idea." I never saw that kid again. I was in his house ffs. I get the "first, do no harm" thing, and the 'prime directive' reference seems to make that point. You can't assume that yer life experience, wherever you are in your journey, is necessarily applicable to someone else's. You don't know how they will react to you having clocked them. You might drive them to repress further, or lash out, or self harm. That said, I think it is important to be available to help those who need it to the extent that you can. If that means cracking someone's egg in a particular situation... try to be gentle. "Do not interfere" may be a good general principle, but not if it means leaving someone who is hurting twisting in the wind while a simple kind word could change their life for the better. Don't be pushy, but be available to help. It's a delicate thing, and I think that's the point of the directive. Just don't be so dogmatic about it that stops you from helping people who need it.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Wow. Yeah, you have to look at the situation and consider it, rather than following any strict rule.

[@frazkintsukuroi5836]

Trans elder here :) I think there is a ton of nuance here. It's always good to make a distinction between "the spirit of the rule" (what the rule literally says) vs "the law of the rule" (what the intent behind the rule is) The spirit of the rule - I believe - is to not push people into an identity that might not apply to them and/or they might not be ready for - for any reasons imaginable. The uncomfortable truth is that we can't look inside of another person's head and see, without any ambiguity, the full scope of their perception of self, their perception of gender, their past experiences, their current context, their perception of us, and how all of those aspects impacts their decisions. The prime directive is aimed at _preventing harm as the result of pushing any identity onto others_ due to having this "imperfect information". Anyone who values the wellbeing of another over being validated about their perception of said other, should heed this imperitive under any and all circumstances. _However...._ Pushing an identity onto someone is something completely different then creating a safe space for them to breathe and learn. If I meet an egg, I always try to drop the same four messages: 1. Your experience of self is valid. It doesn't matter what your gender is or is not. I - as a human and a trans person - want you to be happy, safe and sound, and you should aim to use gender in whatever way that enables those things the best 2. If you feel like identifying as trans feels more natural / in-line with your own perception of self, then I - as a trans person - will wholeheartedly and unconditionally accept you as my equal. 3. When in doubt - experiment. I will happily facilitate those experiments and provide a safe space. If people give you shit (trans or otherwise), then fuck em / tell me. 4. You can always change your mind, nobody should ever force you to "pick a side" and you don't have to be sure about anything at any time in your life, ever, because: see 1. If anyone, at any time, ever asks me whether I think they are trans, I always have the same answer: "You could be, but whether you are, or are not, is ultimately your decision to make". In my experience, it's never actually about the label. It's about their ability to be comfortable in their skin, and to feel accepted _regardless of_ their label. When you are still figuring shit out, it's far more important to focus on living your gender then it is to properly label it. Also, no matter how strongly you feel the need "I told you so" or "I knew it", to someone who just got out... Just... Please don't... You're not helping anyone, and potentially harming them. Again - what do you value more: the wellbeing of the other person, or being affirmed in your own views? If you really need to get it off your chest (which is understandable: you feel what you feel) then find someone else and vent to them discretely about it.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Oh absolutely. The "I knew it" and "I told you so" is often the most harmful part of this kind of situation.

[@frazkintsukuroi5836]

​@@Trash-Garbage-Trash 100% BTW: I now realize that I use "you" without a clear target which might imply that I was accusing you of this behavior, but I was more just talking "to whom it may concern" rather than a specific person. Sorry if that got lost in the message

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

@@frazkintsukuroi5836 I understood you lol! But thank you for clarifying, it's so hard to be clear and communicate effectively on the internet!

[@McCbobbish]

cracking eggs is our sacred duty. I'm not here to just be *accepted*, I'm here to fucking *recruit*.

[@Chrys4l1s]

As a gender ascencionist I think people should just be allowed to do whatever makes them feel comfortable with themselves and think about identity after the fact (if they even want to)

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Oh absolutely!

[@Chrys4l1s]

@@annsh.6487 not really its pretty self explanitory, gende abolition's already being used by terfs and shi so i personally dont use it

[@Jane_8319]

I too an a muppet trapped in the rough approximation of a human body

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

@@Jane_8319 it's a surprisingly common nonbinary identity lol

[@LumbChu]

This came to me at the right time. Just visited a great friend of mine. They mention they are closeted. They are interested in my makeup. I feel like im early on in my transitioning even though I've been going through this for years. I'm not gonna let my friend do this alone and make the same mistakes I did😭

[@Fenan_21]

Ive been on my gender journey for roughly a decade and now have finally understood that I lean more towards a trans-nonbinary/agender fluidity, I had no idea that I was experiencing dysphoria until I saw myself fit the feelings of dysphoria but I always felt "male" because thats what I was told and what I kept telling myself. Its super important to take your time and take the experiences of others as those, experiences of others. So many things that I know I can never fit or dont want to fit prevented me from questioning further and the lack of discussion outside of discovery just makes discovery feel more demotivating than questioning

[@alexelion7084]

I feel "female" a lot myself, also because that's what I've been told and also just how my body looks and this is a huge source of dysphoria for me because it is an internal feeling and doesn't match up with other internal feelings. Like, I feel like I am a woman and at the same time I feel like that's fundamentally wrong. It's so wild and so hard to explain. Funny thing is I used to say at some point that I'm "definitely not trans, nonbinary at best" (something like this, had to translate it) and guess who turned out to be trans-nonbinary too. Rigid definitions definitely hurt more people than they help, they make people either not pursuing something that would make them happy or do more than they'd actually want to do because of a pressure to "fit the mould". I still think labels can help, but they are just words and can never encompass everything

[@1fareast14]

"You sound like an egg". I hated that shit, especially from very binary people that didn't understand what it was like to choose a direction amid the ill-fitting options available to me. Its so patronizing to suggest that I don't know anything about myself, and comes with a lot of projection from the person saying it. The way to handle this is to ask questions and suggest things to try. Or talk openly about gender without pushing an agenda. Edit: It's especially bad for lonely people who can only relate to those very similar to themselves. "Please be transfem so that I can collect you as a friend" If you're looking for a mirror, you don't get to paint others silver.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Agree!

[@lihns]

That edit is some heavy stuff. I definitely feel like I can personally relate to it at least partially. Hope you’re doing well now

[@Chucanelli]

I appreciate the idea behind the egg prime directive, like at best it’s recognizing that being a safe container/space for meandering explorations is really important. But I think refusing to engage at all is often not helpful. My approach has been to ask open-ended questions. “What-if” questions can be really helpful to get the gears turning without triggering defenses. Like “What do you think would happen if you could magically snap your fingers and do/change this thing?” It can be a fun and liberating mind-walk for both people, and in my experience it can plant a seed that they can choose to give more attention to in their own thoughts later. I’ve been on both sides of that kind of question, and it’s been wonderful to be part of healing and discovery for myself and my found family.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

I love all the unique perspectives people are bringing to these comments about how they think it's best to approach this topic with people they think may be "eggs." I think that's a good way to address it!

[@alexjames7144]

Addition: It is unethical to break the egg prime directive if you have bet money with another friend, because it's bad sportsmanship to interfere with the odds.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

lmao, a very common problem

[@computer1up]

I mean… isn’t the solution simply to *ask* someone if they’re trans instead of telling them? Might be just enough clear cut nudge to get them going in the right direction, whether they end up being trans or not. All while not imposing it on them.

[@beautifulgirl219]

I guess I don't have a position on the egg prime directive. As a trans girl I've had lots of people want to talk to me about my being a girl, I don't always pass. It does occur to me that the earlier most MTF girls begin transition, the more successful they are at passing, and that can be important to many, maybe most, girls. I had women I was dating tell me I should be dating men, and clearly they felt no "bisexuality prime directive". This was before I'd accepted my bisexuality. It wasn't until later that I appreciated that my female lovers were encouraging me because they knew how feminine / girly I would feel / experience myself, with men. They knew the woman I am. Accepting my bisexuality has been more challenging than accepting I am a girl with something extra. As for "blowing up your life", I resisted it for career reasons, but realized I would never feel loved by others, OR MYSELF, if I didn't come out completely as a girl and bisexual, and for me, my bisexuality has the same necessity. My secrets can be toxic for me. I knew I was a girl inside from quite young, and also had crushes on girls when quite young. It wasn't until after puberty that I started desiring boys, as a woman. I still don't experience myself as a gay man, and there are gay men in my family that I LOVE. I love that the trans / queer community has the diversity of thought and experience that it does. I don't feel a need to encourage uniformity in others about egg directives, sexual orientation, or much else. If I woke up each morning with a different gender and / or sexual orientation, would it be a bad thing? I don't think so. I LOVE being a MTF girl. I love girls, and I love boys. Cheers!

[@charlespentrose7834]

“Look, that's why there's rules, understand? So that you think before you break 'em.” ― Terry Pratchett, Thief of Time The way I see it is it's very much situational. I haven't really been in many situations where it's been an issue. But I can think of a couple. - In the first one I was a child and knew basically nothing about transgender people so when a male seeming friend said "I want to be a girl", so of course it didn't twig that I probably was dealing with a girl. - In the second I was an adult, knew a bit more but not a lot about transgender people and had subconsciously figured out that the person I thought of as my brother is actually my sister. (Was completely unsurprised when I learned and then proceeded to learn as much as I could about transgender people and realized I'm nonbinary) Nowadays if someone told me they wish they were a gender other than the one they were assigned I'd ask if they've considered that this might be because they actually are that gender. How strongly I'd word my response would vary from delicately suggesting the idea to saying "Sounds like something a girl would say" depending on context - the latter example being a case where I knew she desperately needed gender validation.

[@EvilAng3la]

This is exactly how I feel about it. The rule isn't there to be an absolute, but to make sure someone thinks before they act. Because if you help crack someone's egg, you need to take responsibility for the outcome. Maybe they'll be ready and will be glad. But you might make things worse, and you CANNOT just shrug your shoulders and walk away if that's what happens. Approach it with care and be ready to support them with whatever happens.

[@forest.02.]

a while ago when I was meeting one of my boyfriend's friends for the first time they kept saying "four months" and when I asked my bf what that meant he said that his friend was making a prediction that I would turn out to be trans in four months from then. it has been well over four months since then and I am not trans yet. I guess im a Easter Eggplant (the eggplants that actually look like eggs) not an egg.

[@spaghettification427]

"Wonder egg priority" is a fantastic anime about children who experience trauma and suicide which includes multiple trans and queer characters. Maybe this is merely a coincidence, but there is a very similar phrase to "egg prime directive" repeated throughout the show.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Huh, interesting!

[@Jane_8319]

I’ve always thought the idea was stupid. Just say “have you considered you might be trans?” Instead of “YOU ARE TRANS”. Obviously don’t assign an identity to someone but you can give your interpretation lol

[@hughcaldwell1034]

I think the egg metaphor actually works really well for this discussion. In my opinion, you want to create an incubator -- a safe, warm environment conducive to hatching if and when the egg's ready. What you don't want to do is smash it open to see if anything's inside. I used to know someone who took the latter approach and it was not pleasant to watch or experience.

[@mr.cauliflower3536]

You expect me to have tact?! In this economy?!

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

🤣

[@esr1412]

"i had a similar problem, this is what i did, you might want to give it a try and see if it works for you" is a good approach, i think. The problem i had with someone breaking the egg prime directive is that, a couple of years before i actively started to question, my ex one day straight out told me "you're queer, you're queer af" and at the moment i thought they were projecting. I shut down the idea, and years later when i started to explore my identity, the first thing i thought was "what if it's just suggestion? Am i an imposter? Maybe I'm just a cis guy trying to get into queer spaces for some reason" and i kept thinking of my ex telling me i was queer. I think they should have helped me with a bit more care than just outright tell me i was queer so i could realize, when the time came, that it was my own discovery.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

That happens so much, I guess that's probably the reason the "egg prime directive" was invented.

[@lihns]

I had a bad experience with a friend who did not follow the egg prime directive. I was slowly coming to the realization that I want a female body and perhaps be socialized as female, and my friend who was early in her own transition kept telling me that the things I was interested in were things that she also was dysphoric about, telling me that I need to just come to terms with it, what I should do, etc. I guess it doesn’t matter to a lot of people because I’m trans now and i guess there’s folks that say I should be grateful for her cracking my egg, but at the same time it felt like an assault on my own life, like I had no agency and I was merely designed to go down these already chosen paths. No self determination. I’m not sure if this is coherent but hopefully it is. And don’t worry we’re still close friends, I don’t take it personally.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Ooh, being expected to feel grateful for that sucks

[@cherenkov_blue]

I know this is probably a hot take, but I think a lot of the "prime directive" is rooted in bitterness. Up until quite recently, it would be rare (and also usually unsafe) for someone to be open about their feelings regarding gender to a friend, let alone for that friend to suggest that they might be trans. Most people just had to figure it out on their own. Now that there is wider acceptance and an online trans community where anybody can ask questions regarding their gender, I feel like some of those people who had to figure it out by themselves are envious of that support. In fact, I've seen parallels between how people talk about the "directive" and how transmedicalists talk about medical gatekeeping. And let's think about it for a bit: does this idea of "they'll just go back in the closet if they're explicitly told" even really make sense? No, it doesn't. If you have internalized transphobia, you just have it, and were struggling with it before you ever told anyone about your feelings. It's not some disease that's triggered by someone telling you that you're probably trans. To think that going back into the closet is a likely outcome of being told you're possibly trans says way more about how you personally had to deal with internalized transphobia than it says anything about the wider world.

[@Darth_Insidious]

Idk, getting called an egg all the time by trans people can get old quick. Especially if you are just taking your time with experimentation and observing your feelings about stuff.

[@kallie5125]

I hate that my like took brought it up to 667 but you had me at the intro

[@someoddusername5677]

Im trans and I've never heard this term. I just see people constantly calling internet personalities eggs.

[@dankdreamz]

When I was around 30 I was crossdressing and after hooking up with an older trans woman she looked at me and said "you're cute but you're wasting your time." I asked her to elaborate and she said "You're obviously trans" as she walked out the door. At the time that didn't hit me in a good way. Cognitive dissidents caused me to think "you don't know me" as I rejected the idea. I don't think it held me back from transitioning or even helped me transition. It was just such an out of pocket line that unfortunately has haunted me. Like she was completely right. I was a cutie and it took me 8 years to start living authentic. Like I totally understand the sentiment. She was trying to impart but I think if she would have explained gender euphoria I would have been like oh dang I am trans.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah, unfortunately a lot of people aren't the best at communicating those kinds of things. I'm glad you figured it out eventually!

[@Darth_Insidious]

I just appreciate that trans people have a "code of honor" about this stuff. Especially with how many make egg jokes in my direction already. Really just ends up in me spending more time thinking about it before coming to the same conclusions about my body and prefered day to day gender presentation.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah I'm actually really tired about all the egg jokes people seem to think are fine and normal things to say about strangers online. So few of the trans people I know in real life behave that way.

[@Jelly_Skelly]

What's best for the individual is paramount. There will never be a hard and fast rule that covers every scenario. Some people may do better if they come to the conclusion themselves, others may need some validation and gentle guidance. I can absolutely understand the desire to err on the side of caution and not risk harm.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

@@Jelly_Skelly oh absolutely, the stories people are telling in the comments reflect so many different experiences. Some people were called eggs and it pushed them back in the closet while others wish someone had said something. It depends on the person

[@danielodors]

The algorithm is trying to tell me something with this video...

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

I didn't even think about that particular implication of this video lol

[@Drakus986]

My take on the Egg Prime Directive is that it applies to a person until they start to express curiosity into transness, whether it be about themselves or in general. It takes a while for many people to actually sus out how they feel about their identity. Trying to rush that process can lead to people having second thoughts even if they arent wrong, feeling like they were pressured, and/or not fully addressing any baggage they may still carry related to gender and sexuality. We have to let people grow at their own pace, but if they come to you asking questions or looking for info, give it to them. Should also point out that that once the Prime Directive is out the window, that isnt excuse to start labeling people with 100% certainty. Offer suggestions they should look into and read up on so they can decide themselves.

[@AJ_Battle]

Like the reason for the prime directive in ST is to let civilizations develop to a point where they wont be manipulated by advanced civilisations when they join the community. Telling someone they might be trans doesn't have the same stakes.

[@CovertSaxman]

My friends group in college referred to ourselves as “the Trashbags”. I don’t think our name ever resonated with the other members of the group the way it did with me. We aren’t friends anymore, but I often still identify as “a Trashbag”. Now I’m aware I had always been performing masculinity for my peers and it has taken me a decade to come to terms with the fact that I don’t experience sexuality the same way as others. I’m a demisexual non-binary penis-owner and I’m still coming to terms with that in some ways. Your channel resonates with me in a way very few others ever have and I’m so glad you make this content that affirms me and that KZbin saw fit to introduce me to your channel. Trash discourse is the best discourse lol. Thank you for the exemplary content!

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Thank you! I'm glad it resonates with you!

[@rushomancy]

My experience is that a lot of people questioning gender feel like they're not allowed to be trans, that they're imposters and can't say, do, sometimes even think certain things. So when talking to people who I suspect might have some gender stuff going on, my focus is to give them permission, to tell them all those reasons they have in their head about why they can't really be trans don't actually make them not trans, that having doubts and not being sure about things is normal. At the same time it's important for me to let them know that they don't have to do any one thing in particular to be trans. The easiest way for me to do that is to give people permission to be whatever they want to be rather than putting a label on them.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Oh yeah, that's a very common experience! And those people often do just need/want reassurance that their feelings are okay and that they're not appropriating the trans experience and they're allowed to use those labels if that's what they want. I think that's a great approach and a great way to look at it!

[@Shield-Theyden]

Yes! Labels need to work for us, not the other way around. And yeah, I remember, early in my exploration, feeling like I wasn't "trans enough". That I couldn't use that label because it would be stolen valor or something. And so many of my friends related similar experiences.

[@Smallshotty97]

I live in some kind of quasi space of sexuality where nothing ever really feels quite 'right,' despite being the things I'm obviously attracted to, and this is kinda paired with a general sense of non-binary in my head. I had someone in the past who asked me if I felt like an egg, or if r/egg (I think it was) felt like a comfortable and reflective place for myself. I told them no, but over time afterward they felt like they continued to press and press on to my sexuality and being as if it was their personal homework to dissect and confirm my own being to me through their belief. It was incredibly frustrating and very disheartening. I think this Egg Prime Directive can be good.

[@ChristianCatboy]

When I started coming out in 2020, I seriously did NOT know that being trans was a real thing. I'd been a fervent religious conservative my whole life, and had carefully kept myself ignorant of the entire subject. Fortunately, one of the first gay guys I tried to date told me right away that he thought I might be trans, and suggested some YT channels for me to check out, to do my own research. I'm VERY glad that he was so direct, because I was in a desperate mental state at the time, and really need that kind of help. I suppose my egg had already cracked at that point, tho, since I was openly asking queer people for advice to sort out my gender confusion.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

I'm glad he did that for you! Just another example of why we sometimes need to break the prime directive!

[@Charolette21]

Hmmmm, how about this metaphor: A civilization knows of the federation and the concept of the warp drive, but actively denies anyone the chance to join “those aliens” and forbids the warp drive to be made under severe punishment. How do you help the people who want to leave and join the better option as smooth of a way as possible? *fixed typos

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

That's honestly a great way to look at it. Most trans people know it's an option and maybe even want it but feel immense pressure from society not to do it and dread at upending their entire lives and very probably losing relationships, friendships, jobs, etc. The answer is to provide material support. Literally help them get their life in order so that when they transition they have a social support network even if theirs falls apart as a result.

[@mkjmoon8263]

Love the thumbnail definitely a deciding factor for clicking on the video! Glad i did. I think the subtle approach is probably one of the better ways of going about it because its life changing and some people are not in a position where they can turn their life upside down. Theres also a time and a place for direct and i know there are plenty of us who had that last bit of egg peeled away by a friend. Side note "a Muppet trapped in a vaguely human body" is now entering my lexicon lol

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Thank you! This is definitely one of my best thumbnails yet! I definitely support the gentle approach!

[@Jiian]

Assigned Coward at Birth... I feel so called out.

[@redlunatic2224]

I think it's important to keep in mind that society at large is not a neutral factor. Your gender is very much assumed and enforced. So this isn't really comparable to the ST prime directive at all. I'd say that, unless it can bring obvious harm, people should feel free to speak about it. HOWEVER, remember that it's a personal thing. Don't say things like this to strangers on the internet, especially not in public. You don't know them, and if you're thinking about saying it, it's quite likely you're not going to be the only one, so dont add to the pile unnecessarily.

[@kayla8402]

Yeah even the GDB's description is plenty good. For every trans person who says "if someone had just TOLD ME..." there's a dozen who are so on edge and in denial that you MUST be careful. But the apparent experience of it as a universal could be restated. Unfortunately the author got absolutely swarmed by disingenuous internet responses to like... one sentence taken as "transmed" and has kinda backed off from it so I don't anticipate updates. "Trek breaks the prime directive all the time" naw. There wouldn't be a story, if we saw the other 99% of the time, that things go as intended. The Directive is ALWAYS balanced against potential harm done, and drawing a fine line is difficult. But like a lot of trans experience, people are so intensely traumatized by their specific experiences, they have a hard time hearing that telling apparent eggs flat out can be harmful. It's just a caution to know the situation, and approach with care. Because yes, the reflexive denial thing absolutely does happen. I also absolutely agree, with social pressures the way they are, that more firm statements are sometimes VERY helpful, because of course people will dither for far far too long, but also that's part of why the neutral "engine" metaphor doesn't really work? Because people have whole lives of justifications and pressures holding them back. Just... be cautious. If you're at the point of the person telling you about their experiences, you're probably in a position to say something, even. But random coworker or friend of a friend you aren't close to but see around regularly? go easy.

[@pythosdegothos6181]

IF the thinking a person is trans is based on social expectations EG: a male that wears "feminine" styles, or a girl liking more "masculine" things, there should be NO "egg cracking" and NO suggestion one Might be trans. Being someone that has had not only "normies" think there is something wrong with me do to my preferred style, I have had trans advocates insist I was "trans in denial". Another grand example of this recently happening is the one around F1nn5ster. For years Finn had people call him an "egg" and ask questions about him (he still goes by male pronouns when last I checked, and he is definitely struggling with being male, but preferring feminine expression, which should not be limited by ones reproductive role), being on HRT, which he did admit to using when he "came out" as trans and since seems to have retracted that. Bottom line...it is REALLY BS to make assumptions of people based on social norms which in and of themselves suck. It is just the other side of the same sexist coin that says a "feminine" presenting male is some sort of pervert or mentally unstable. Oh and YES gender non conforming people are very much pressured by the trans community to transition, I speak from experience.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah it does happen. I think this is mainly an issue online, with content creators or behind the wall of social media. Social media emboldens people to behave this way. As someone who mainly dates feminine men and masculine women, a disproportionate number of those people will transition, but still a majority won't. But people online get obsessed with this idea of "eggs" and "cracking eggs" and transvestigating or egg hunting celebrities and creators. This idea is a reflection of how chronically online so many people are. I have also never experienced this from the irl trans and/or sapphic community. When I talk to trans men about going on HRT and feeling afraid to actually come out or talk about it they usually say things like "You can just be on HRT and not socially transition for as long as you want, or just be a butch woman on HRT. It doesn't matter. Do what YOU want." My only bad experience was a person who had a strong social safety net and never had to even consider that their loved ones might reject them, that they might lose their job, that things could go really wrong if they transitioned, who treated me as if my life was the same as theirs and I was just being a coward with internalized transphobia. That experience did push me back in the closet to some degree. But it was one out of the dozens of trans people I interact with irl. The parasocial relationships and fandoms make this problem much worse, it's really not like that in real life. In my experience. People were so weird about Finn.

[@pythosdegothos6181]

@@Trash-Garbage-Trash very weird. He sounds so very much like myself, but I did not have a bunch of simp chatters pushing on me being an Egg. Though I definitely got the opposite (mockery for being "feminine")

[@gencreeper6476]

In a way I can relate to why some may feel the egg prime directive is the right thing and not just because of my current questioning. I was diagnosed with autism and had to face that at an early age and actually trying to tell my friends they were autistic when I thought they were didnt help put them in a bit of a denial mode

[@Jelly_Skelly]

I'd also mention that while certainly not all trans people are autistic, but there is a lot of overlap. I would be diagnosed autistic, not for lack of trying, but having to make assumptions/guess shit is a nightmare. I appreciate the explicitness and it seems most of us do.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

@@Jelly_Skelly I struggle because I learned the preferred way of communicating (weird hints) but then it switched on me and suddenly people want me to be direct. It's very confusing switching between the two preferred communication styles.

[@fluffycritter]

I'm old enough to remember a time when people would actually try to "recruit" each other into transness and it was definitely a bad time, and observing the sorts of outright emotional abuse and manipulation that came from trans folks who wanted to forcibly grow our ranks led me to decide specifically that I would be happy to share my own experiences with others but that I would never try to convince someone else of what was true. That said, if someone expresses eggy sentiments in my direction, I'll definitely open up about some of my own experiences with the hope that it helps them to gain an understanding.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Ooh, I think I know exactly what movement you're talking about and it was big yikes. I think you have the right approach!

[@fluffycritter]

@@Trash-Garbage-Trash I don't think it was a movement so much as bad behavior from individual people. This was late-90s/early-00s, and a lot of it was from people who gravitated around one particular notorious online personality quiz (which is STILL online all these years later, ugh).

[@jarhead72]

It was really hard for me to accept that I am Trans. My partner had apparently already clocked me as Transmasc but didn’t say much until I started being open with them about my feelings and exploring with my gender and pronouns. I remember when I was voicing that I was still unsure on my pronouns, they eventually asked me why I still used she/her if it didn’t make me happy, and if being referred to by a more masculine/neutral name I’d been using online for years made me more comfortable and happy than my deadname. That really helped solidify it for me that I am Trans and going by a new name gives me joy and their acceptance helped me to see that that was okay, and helped me to accept myself. I do think it probably helped I was already openly questioning my gender by then and had been thinking about it for a long time, but my fear really was still holding me back and that conversation helped me a lot. I’m not sure how long it would have taken me to accept these feelings completely on my own and without support. When my partner was then later struggling with their own gender, I tried to help them explore their feelings, and just listen and be supportive in a similar way, and I think that helped them a lot too. Support is of course really important and I think, even in situations where people may be less open, it’s still okay to prompt people and help them explore their feelings or give suggestions. I do think it’s also important to remember though that we shouldn’t be telling people who they are, and ultimately it’s their decision and their journey. They are allowed to take as long as they require to figure themselves out in their own time. As friends, it’s just up to us to be there during that time to help support them, whether that is just by listening or by helping them explore their feeling and giving them suggestions/prompts on what they may be feeling. I think either is fine, depending on what you think will best help whoever you are talking to, and as long as they comfortable with what you are saying.

[@blakemtg47]

I’d never tell anyone they’re transgender but I’d say that they might be and they should possibly explore that

[@jackm.j.3549]

It took me way longer to come out because there was this cis girl in my circle of friends who kept saying "you'd be so cute as a trans person. It's meant to be." When i finally came out people's "we knew all along" felt more invasive and icky rather than supportive. Needless to say, I don't hang out with that group anymore.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

@@jackm.j.3549 yeah "we knew all along" feels so bad. I did feel good about the "OH! That makes sense" responses though.

[@bioluminescentlyunfolding5716]

Had to laugh ruefully at "assigned coward at birth" - in my bi wilderness years, I autistically rules-lawyered myself deeper into the closet that way. I engineered roundabout conversations with two or three friends who were gay or bi: I needed to talk about it yet not openly instigate it. People mostly didn't react, so I thought I'd broken a rule by trying to talk to queer friends about my own latent bisexuality. I was encountering a lot of ambient biphobia then. I felt a dis-permission to be other than straight, yet was drawn to queer people/culture. When I heard gay guys felt oppressed by the Gay Best Friend thing, I worried I was a "___ hag", and that I'd be committing cultural appropriation if I let myself explore queer stuff. Same with the stories of lesbians hurt by bi girls who "were really straight". Now, I suspect many ARE bisexuals who re-closet due to biphobia from both sides. But I didn't make progress until a) I found friends happier re: their own identities who either reached out to me, or were cool when I told them, and b) lucked into getting a gay therapist. You'd think I'd learn, but more recently, I've also sensed a silence around my gender questioning, and I let that slow me down too. *facepalm* Ironically I've taken the same approach re: likely autistic folks I know: I use mutual social media networks to share my autistic experiences and resources, but don't ask them, "have you considered..." and I don't push myself forward as Explainer Of Your Possible Autism. A caveat: often, I've later realised they weren't seeing posts I hoped would help. Or, where I'd directly shared with a newly diagnosed friend some post-dx support I felt could help them, I later learned they'd talked themselves out of those things because they felt their autism didn't measure up to mine. This is internalised ableism; even people with significant impairment often reject support, as they feel they're taking it from someone else. So maybe we do need to be more explicit in saying to friends we know well who seem to be struggling, "Hey, I could be off-base, but if you've been questioning whether you might be _____, then that's okay and you're allowed to explore that..."

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

I can relate so hard to most of this. Internalized ableism for sure, and having to be really wary of biphobia and being seen as just a straight girl trying to have a gay best friend when in reality I'm trying to have a community of my fellow bisexuals. Navigating this as an autistic bisexual person is really tricky.

[@franciszekdo]

I think it's something that needs to be handled with sensitivity and respect. Being supportive and open-ended with someone who seems to be having gender troubles is a good thing. I would have loathed someone telling me I'm trans, people acting like they know something about my own internal experiences makes me deeply uncomfortable. It's also like.. when it comes to my life and experience I had a lot of mental health and trauma I needed to de-tangle first. I'm glad I got on the right antidepressants stabilized with that first.

[@CovertSaxman]

Also I would love to see you do a collab with Doki Doki Discourse, have a little discourse-off, I’d watch that in a heartbeat

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

That might be fun!

[@Emo_Catgirl0]

It really depends on scenario, i have a friend who is an egg but they still explore their feeling since they are genderqueer so i respect that and push them towards their goal whenever they ask, but some other people you shouldnt push them as it could hurt them and make them become transphobic, ive met plenty of people through my life but ive only met a few eggs each ive dealt with differently. I was treated with the egg prime directive and honestly it hurts, i probably would have transitioned earlier but i also understand that i did lose my entire family and my entire old friend group, so it did blow up but luckily i was able to find a different household i can rent at ^w^ but yeah treat it individualistically and then it shouldnt be an issue

[@MxlexywithaY]

I've literally only had 1 person directive me that i know of. I said something eggy, and they said " huh, have you ever questioned your gender?" and that stuck with me

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

That's a fairly respectful way to do it I think!

[@IT_217]

As a closeted trans woman, I suspect my friend at work, who is a lesbian, has figured it out and us talking about Kristen Stewart may or may not have helped clue her in...

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

You can tell by the way women talk about Kristen Stewart how gay they are lmao

[@_Imperium_]

wow everyone just immediately told me i am an egg, and no one followed the prime directive. still cis though.

[@The_Jovian]

I think a lot of people would benefit from internalizing the phrase "read the fucking room"

[@alexandriatempest]

Plssst, like "reading the room" is possible

[@ThePiedPiperOfVienna]

Sometimes it feels like the Egg Prime Directive is in conflict with "protect baby trans at all cost". I mean, it doesn't get more baby than egg. (I hope the anti-abortion crowd doesn't read that) I'm trying to think back how I would have handled it if my egg had been cracked forcefully. My best guess is that I'd at first tell them they are crazy but have that thought stuck firmly in my head, until I ultimately accept it. I actually think I would've preferred that, saving me some lost time. On the other hand, who am I to influence someone else's life that much, even if it probably is to the better. Damn, tough question for a Monday evening.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah, it's a fine line between helping someone and traumatizing them in this case.

[@ThePiedPiperOfVienna]

@@Trash-Garbage-Trash Totally. Life is complicated and things are situational.

[@kkai-a]

It seems like youtube is trying to tell me something with this recommendation

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Oh no, this video is breaking the prime directive!

[@babblgamgummi6029]

I think the concept desperately needs a more fitting name. The prime directive is literally make sure you never give them any kind of information at all, while the "egg prime directive" is basically just don't try to decide other people's labels for them. I get why people misunderstand it

[@JoanDoe-pq5fu]

I'm in the life explosion navigation part right now lol. Trying to navigate divorce and how to come out in a tphobic workplace while now wondering if I have to get on hrt immediately since I may not have access soon. I just wanted to try to limit my life to one dumpster fire at a time. 😢

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

yeah that part really sucks!

[@jeremythegee5428]

I think that it can actually be super crtical to follow...someone close to me kept implying I was just "a few steps behind them" when I first started exploring gnc and let me tell you...that slowed everything down. to this day i won't use the term they used for themselves at the time just because of how deeply upsetting it was to hear before I was ready.

[@Jetsetlemming]

4:00 I can't get over how much this quote is like "yeah idea is so fucking obvious we don't even need to say it everyone just does it automatically, because duh you gently work your way up to that kind of issue everybody knows that. But I'm going to name it and make it a 'rule' that 'forbids' things anyway LOL" no wonder the meaning's shifted so far off that people will yell at you just for pondering about celebrities and even fictional characters on your personal account that obviously that celebrity (or fictional character LMAO) isn't reading, while citing the "prime directive".

[@Jetsetlemming]

also my go to opener for someone who seems like they need it is "hey... quick question, how do you feel when a cashier calls you sir/ma'am?" and go from there. Ironically it's if they say "I'm fine with it?" or "huh? I dunno why'd you ask." then I get much more explicit, like "oh huh, I was kinda getting trans vibes from you but I guess maybe not?"

[@lidu6363]

20 seconds into watching the video and I'm loving this Morpheus persona 🌚

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Thank you lol, I drop it immediately but it was fun to do!

[@espressosoup]

I've had my egg crack over and over again, but I convinced myself over and over that I was crazy. I don't know if someone saying something would have helped. Most of the time people assumed I was gay... And I guess I would be if I could transition, but they didn't know that 😅

[@Sarcasticron]

Ironically, the Prime Directive WAS created by a cop. Sorta. Gene Roddenberry was a cop before he became a writer and created Star Trek. He had a variety of careers, actually. He was also a fighter pilot and war hero. Interesting guy.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Whoa, I didn't know that!

[@BowieBarks]

I admit, this is the first time that I've heard of the Trans Prime Directive. I unfortunately am in spaces on the internet where instead people get a lot of pride about how many eggs they crack. As you stated early on, they exclusively mean it toward binary transfem folks. It makes me rather uncomfortable how the conversations turn toward describing others in parasocial, one-sided relationships as eggs. This ends up leading to a type of militant discussion in the communities that I'm around as to what does and doesn't make someone trans, excluding the rest of the wide trans specturm or the idea that people should have any agency over their identities.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Those same kinds of people really like to invalidate nonbinary identities and "crack their eggs" to try to turn them into binary trans people. It's weird.

[@BowieBarks]

@@Trash-Garbage-Trash That as well. I realize that this is a small portion of transfem people. But it is really offputting to me how often my identity is questioned or outright denied by other trans people because I'm not the "right" kind of trans 😔

[@chloe-fy4wc]

Telling someone “Oh that sounds like you might have dysphoria, have you looked into that ?” or “I have felt similarly and it was due to my dysphoria” is the best option i think, since it’s not pushy and helpful. Tho there ARE times when you can tell someone that they’re trans, but it is nuanced. And imo is only appropriate when person is about to take the leap. I did this a few times when a person changed their presentation, name, pronouns yet still doubted so i just kept saying YES YOU’RE TRANS COME ON

[@GaleGrim]

Generally with things like eggs I like to phrase it in terms of myself. "I used to feel that way I get it. What changed? Oh, I realized I was trans non-binary. Yeah turns out it wasn't normal for me to feel at odds with my gender. God did it feel great to finally know what was going on!" that way they don't feel like they are being called out, they are just learning about me, and if they happen to resonate with my story (I can only hope that) it will help pave the way for them to hatch.

[@MistahFox]

I've seen benefits to both approaches as I realized I was trans. I texted the one trans friend I was closest with and they hit me with the "Oh honey I've always known" which on the one hand was nice for the sake of my own head it was a realization I came to on my own so I could easily deal with any doubt that someone had made me trans, but on the other hand what the hell, why didn't they say something lol

[@alexandriatempest]

I think thetes a difference between "telling" and "not engaging". If someone wishes they were a girl, point out that trans women exist, point out that total amount of baddies there are who didn't start put looking like twinks, and so on. Don't let they suffer, help them through it and make sure they they see the rep. That helps on their journey.

[@HeatherRose23]

Most of the time I avoid saying anything direct, like, "hey, you sound like you're trans." If someone does sound like they're describing feeling like they're trans, I may say I've felt similar things, but the amount of detail I'll share depends a lot on how well I know and trust them with personal info about my experiences.

[@technobeagle9598]

As someone who grew up basically surrounded by trans people the prime directive is very hard to understand for me. I’m still quite young but coming from a high school where you have token straights who are repeatedly being teased about it and it really is just a casual thing to try a new set of pronouns or change your name in the space we all shared really gave me an over optimistic perspective on how normal being trans is. I literally came out to my parents by being like “hey can we try out new name and pronouns it’s not really a big deal :)” to be smacked in the face that yes, it actually very much fucking is. Also my favorite joke for a while has been “getting transed” from when it was first me being transed to me transing friends who came out after me. Obviously in the moment this was through support and affirmations but I also never understood why it was so taboo to toss around transness. Like ok, if you’re not but you’re engaging with it earnestly and the idea that anyone could be trans and it’s not necessary a huge deal is being more normalized what harm is being done. But I’m young and have made efforts to surround myself with trans people in my social circles (even ones who don’t know yet [not on purpose just because stand users attract stand users or whatever the phrase is]). Like obviously I wouldn’t push someone to come out but i did have a friend who literally admitted she was transgender but said she wasn’t going to acknowledge it until she was less busy in the same breath she said she has been learning blender as a hobby and got an unpaid particle physics lab position. Like girl don’t you even want to do the fun stuff with friends that has no consequences if you know already???? She got out of her shell eventually but I had been planning to forcefem her with help from the rest of our friend group. We still want to do that just for fun but now she’s in on it.

[@vladtheinhaler93]

Well shit, I've cracked eggs long before I was even out of my own shell!

[@widnawz]

I feel like there’s not a singular answer to this. The ones who cracked me definitely didn’t follow the Prime Directive and I don’t know if I’d have come out or even had the opportunity to had I not been given that push. That said, I’ve also had friends who were pushed out before they were ready and ended up either repressing for a few extra years or just simply not enjoying their new gender for the longest time. I feel like the Prime Directive is a good rule to follow generally, but if you’re close enough friends with someone where you know you can be a bit more open with them and are conscious of their limits, I see no issue breaking it.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

I think that sums it up pretty well!

[@GreenTengu97]

If someone tells me something that sounds like egg talk, I wouldn't just out and tell them they are trans, but I WOULD suggest they explore that idea further. Think about it some more, see what they think. I don't think I cracked someone's egg specifically, but I DID I guess... Help a bit of the shell that was still stuck on go off? A friend of mine already considered herself nonbinary, and came to me asking about some stuff, I said something along those lines to her, and a few weeks later, she figured out she's a demigirl.

[@_allegra]

If a cis guy says "I wonder what it would be like to wear a dress", I'll say "try it!" If a cis guy says "why do I keep imagining myself as a woman", I'm gonna say "...tell me more". I think stuff like the Egg Prime Directive is a good baseline cos it it's aimed at that lowest level of understanding: people who can't/don't/won't think. Like speed limits - it's there for all people, at all times, in all conditions. Even though there are times and places where I could safely exceed the speed limit, that's not useful for the dude who needs to be told "don't stomp on the accelerator when it's raining at night and there are school kids crossing the road". Funnily, I actively called myself an egg for a few months before accepting I was trans lol. I knew which way things were heading... I just needed time to sit with the idea and adjust to it.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Ooh, that's a really good analogy!

[@MegaTurtleRider]

I never knew there was a rule but I see why it generally make sense. Outright telling someone might have the opposite effect, because not everyone has the same understanding of what being trans means. Not to mention the internalized phobias they might be carrying. But rules ought to be broken, and if you see your friend struggling, you could nudge them along. Talk about your own experiences, give them some reading material if they ask for it. Tell them how you figured it out. What I think a lot of eggs need to understand is that cis people generally don't think this way.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah, it needs to be about helping the person, and doing the right thing for their specific situation.

[@michaeleberl2222]

I feel like out trans people can spot each other with "the look", as if with nothing more than our eyes we can say "I see you, and I can see that you see me". Where as when cis people are trying to figure out what type of gay I am, they ask things like "do you watch Drag Race?" But yeah, trying to sus out an egg is another thing entirely. (This is coming from a 40 year old trans femme experience of the Muppet variety, btw... Old school Ani DiFranco fan.)

[@slauthordraws3363]

“muppet trapped in a human body” omg same gender 🤝

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Lmao it definitely describes me

[@masonm6253]

I feel like for a lot of people the prime directive flys out the window as soon as the person doing even slightly eggy stuff is a content creator. Inevitable their comment sections become filled with people just saying “egg” or “🥚” and I hate it so much. That isn’t helpful at all.

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Oh yeah, people are more than happy to project whatever they want onto artists and content creators, and cross their boundaries.

[@SebastianSeanCrow]

3:05 I personally believe it should be a case by case basis

[@Trash-Garbage-Trash]

Yeah, just like the real prime directive!