The truth about Sweden's COVID policy

The Swedish government's decision to forgo lockdowns as most of Europe, Asia, and North America's political leaders forcibly closed businesses and schools in the early days of the pandemic became one of the most controversial COVID policies of 2020.
The New York Times in April 2020 designated Sweden "the world's cautionary tale," and President Donald Trump proclaimed that "Sweden is paying heavily for its decision not to lockdown" as an early wave of COVID deaths hit Sweden harder than its Nordic neighbors.
But to Swedish officials, "it looked like it was other countries that were engaging in a dangerous experiment," writes Cato Institute senior fellow Johan Norberg in a policy paper entitled "Sweden during the pandemic: Pariah or paragon?"
The attacks on Sweden's laissez-faire approach were short-sighted, says Norberg. Today, Sweden's COVID-19 death rate is not an outlier, and its excess death rate from 2020 to the present is the lowest in Europe.
In a retrospective report on the country's pandemic response, Sweden's public health officials say that they should have more aggressively protected senior citizens and tested and quarantined travelers from COVID hotspots in those early days, but consider the focus on public health recommendations that people can "follow voluntarily" over coercive lockdowns was "fundamentally correct."
Norberg also points out that Sweden avoided the economic contraction that its neighboring countries suffered, as well as the learning loss experienced in countries that closed schools for months or even years.
Join Reason's Zach Weissmueller and Liz Wolfe for an in-depth discussion with Norberg about the lessons to draw from Sweden's pandemic policies this Thursday at 1 p.m. Eastern on Reason's KZbin channel or on Facebook.
Sources referenced in this conversation:
Johan Norberg: Sweden during the pandemic
www.cato.org/policy-analysis/...
Trump: Sweden is “paying heavily” for not locking down - April 30, 2020
x.com/realDonaldTrump/status/...
NYT: Sweden has become the world’s cautionary tale -
www.nytimes.com/2020/07/07/bu...
Sweden’s Corona Commission: coronakommissionen.com/wp-con...
Imperial College report on COVID-19 mitigation: www.imperial.ac.uk/media/impe...
Trump on Sweden, White House Coronavirus Task Force briefing, April 7, 2020: • April 7, 2020 - Member...
Bernie Sanders: U.S. should look more like Scandanavia, May 3, 2015: • Sen. Bernie Sanders Sa...
Anders Tegnell talks on herd immunity on BBC HARDtalk, May 19, 2020: • Coronavirus: Anders Te...

[@lostinsweden5039]

I'm a Brit in Sweden. I have NEVER been more proud of my adopted country, after over two decades here, than I was, am and will always be over our bloody-minded refusal to be bullied out of our policy during Covid

[@williamford8027]

just part of the great psycological experiment, don't have to push sth to vaccine addicts

[@yggdrasillundberg1455]

A fellow Swede, i say👍🏻🙏

[@peterp4037]

swedes don't need any of the lockdowns because cashless and digital id are the norm for years there.

[@Cobbido]

It's because Sweden is already compliant enough to the overlords, no need to test it

[@hamstsorkxxor]

​@@Cobbido Which overlords? Please elaborate.

[@fredwhinery8016]

As an American physician, I now follow the Swedish public health policies.

[@0ooTheMAXXoo0]

Our own pandemic plans that we have followed every other previous outbreaks that could become pandemics were ignored for COVID. Basic knowledge about biology and virology were ignored. Greed and "control for the sake of control" seems to have been more important than health of the masses to the powers that be.

[@serpentines6356]

​@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 That first sentence, doesn't make sense. Can you clarify? Give an example?

[@LRVitusR]

​@@serpentines6356 My suspicion is that @0ooTheMAXXoo0 meant to write: "Our own pandemic plans that we have followed [for] every other previous outbreak (delete the "s") that could [have] become pandemics were ignored for COVID. In other words, @0ooTheMAXXoo0 omitted the word "for" after the word "followed", incorrectly pluralized "outbreaks", and omitted the word "have" after the word "could". No Ernest Hemingway, but plenty understandable. EDIT: make singular "pandemics" and add the word "a" before the newly singular word "pandemic" Thus, it would read: "Our own pandemic plans that we have followed [for] every other previous outbreak (delete the "s") that could [have] become [a] pandemic (delete the "s") were ignored for COVID."

[@davidwright5094]

@fredwhinery8016 So you get your national leader to threaten on TV to imprison anyone who congregates, indoors or out, in groups of size larger than 50 -- I see.

[@foxtrotjulietbravo5536]

@@LRVitusR - What a joy and a delight to see someone use our language properly.

[@plweis7203]

We now know that Sweden was the model for every other country, which was intuitively obvious to millions of us at the time.

[@loneycornel778]

Models 🤦‍♂️.

[@Dowlphin]

Yes, there is no excuse, just evil politics. All the data was presented, the points made, but the wicked actively tried to suppress discourse and particularly the truth. It is a giant crime against humanity committed by so many politicians who have so much blood on their hands that they could drown in it.

[@louisejoel]

Definitely a better looking model

[@realitymatters8720]

So, it was obvious that more covid deaths in Sweden then the rest of scandinavia was a better policy ! How does that work ?

[@danlinnell9359]

All the countries that locked down including mine dont want a "look back" at lockdowns. Nobody wants to acknowledge a disaster of their own making. If you dont acknowledge it was wrong, you can always do it again is the theory.

[@MrGunnar69]

Why does the opposition not criticize? We all know the answer to that question.

[@foxtrotjulietbravo5536]

@@MrGunnar69 - Did you ever hear of the Great Barrington Declaration? No? If the media isn't allowed (or chooses not to) report the positions and reasoning behind the opposition the general public isn't aware of it.

[@realitymatters8720]

More covid deaths pr. capita in Sweden compared with all the other Scandinavian contries negates you idiotic post !

[@4gui429]

This is another great example of the biggest problem with the global media model today, which is the copy and paste that generates opinion media instead of fact-based media. The media is based on the premise that the more panic the better. Sweden was crucified by the media at the time, shown as a bad example to follow, an irresponsible State. I'm Portuguese and I've never been able to recover from the damage that 3 months of lockdown in my country did to my finances. I already had great difficulties paying my bills before and as a result I am broke to this day. My social assistance was 60 euros per month. It was absolutely necessary to lock it down, it seems like it wasn't, but the copy/paste media made it seem like it was and so it was and they never went back to say they were wrong. There is no responsibility in the global media, there is only the quick click model, more advertisers the better, no matter the damage caused to society, this model needs to be reviewed, there must be a component of social responsibility and consequences when damage is done.

[@Justin_Beaver564]

Social media has a way of magnifying mob behavior in a way that wasn't possible a generation ago.

[@MrGunnar69]

Why do you blame the media when it is the politicians who shut down your country, politicians you probably voted for.

[@c.i.6950]

and who owns the media? top tip: same cabal that owns every other globalist corporate entity. It all comes back to the same banksters. Have courage.

[@Coco762011]

The biggest thing wrong was the population allowing FEAR to overcome them, giving the authorities a free hand to put ridiculous mandates in place… Mandates are not law. People do not unite when UNITY is the way to fight back.

[@bsmithhammer]

This bears repeating for those of us in the U.S. - because of our ill-informed lockdown policies, the demographic with the least probability of serious Covid symptoms (kids) inherited the worst consequences. Consequences many kids are dealing with to this day. When combined with the economic impacts felt throughout the country, that we are still dealing with, further lockdowns for the same virus are absolutely not an option.

[@CaptZdq1]

Lockdowns for any disease are absolutely not an option. Neither r masking n social distancing n vaccine mandates.

[@MrHarumakiSensei]

No lockdown for any virus in history has ever worked. They never stop the disease and only make things significantly worse overall.

[@williamkz]

Congratulations to Sweden. It's great to hear about a country in which the government respects the people, and the people respect the government. The continuation of junior education is a lesson to the whole world.

[@louisejoel]

I hope one day we have that kind of respect in NZ and Australia

[@miguelacevedo4691]

These conversations are important to have. People are tired and want to move on from the COVID conversation, but we have to be accountable and understand what worked and didn't work, otherwise, we will be bound to repeat the same mistakes.

[@johnsheehy4192]

We should not forget the hubris of authorities who pretended that they knew what they were doing. Science is still in an infantile stage, especially the soft sciences like public health. The softer the field of science, the more room there is for corruption.

[@Gabrielle4870]

The "mistakes" were deliberately made so I wouldn't get my hopes up.

[@CaptZdq1]

@@Gabrielle4870 Exactly.

[@williamford8027]

spoiler alert -nothing worked

[@iamanomas]

Even when all the various responses to this pandemic have been analyzed and recommendations are made as to how the response to the next pandemic should be handled, none of them even if implemented will work because suggestions made by those in charge will not be taken up. Nobody trusts anybody anymore. Our governments, our institutions and even the medical community (also divided) will not be listened to. So good luck to saving humanity.

[@truth-uncensored2426]

This is so ironic, in Brazil the "far right" ex president Bolsonaro was suggesting to follow a Covid approach which was basically the same as the Swedish one, with more emphasis on social distancing and seclusion for older people, but without paralyzing the country, and he was completely vilified by the entire media, so much so that public opinion changed negatively about him in this period.

[@johnl5316]

there was not any need for social distancing

[@bogdanpopescu1401]

@@johnl5316 there was need to protect the higher risk groups of people, ideally by voluntary measures and by offering them help instead of the horrendous policies implemented

[@johnl5316]

Yes, that was done for vulnerable people in nursing homes Florida. I'm 73 now and lived quite normally during that period as did my sister, who actually went to gambling casinos@@bogdanpopescu1401

[@CaptZdq1]

It was, of course, a double standard n the usu. hypocrisy.

[@williamford8027]

he also warned of pharma influence , of course he had to go.....

[@yamishogun6501]

Norway was following Sweden but buckled under what health officials there said "enormous pressure from the U.S. and the W.H.O. The Norwegian health department showed that the lockdown did nothing to slow the virus but hurt children's development.

[@zwcdamien]

That sounds made up. I couldn't find anything on the internet to back up your claim. What's your source?

[@yamishogun6501]

@@zwcdamien The Spectator reported this in spring 2020. The Week ran an abbreviated version.

[@DigiMannen]

Norway and Sweden are similar countries in terms of socioeconomics and health care. Norway implemented extensive COVID-19 measures, such as school closures and lockdowns, whereas Sweden did not. In Norway, all-cause mortality was stable from 2015 to 2019 with a mean mortality rate of 14.9 (100,000 person-weeks) In Sweden, all-cause mortality was stable from 2015 to 2018 with a mean mortality rate of 17.1 but was lower in 2019 mortality rate 16.2. The COVID-19-associated mortality rates per 100,000 person-weeks during the first wave of the pandemic were 0.3 in Norway and 2.9 in Sweden. In Norway, all-cause mortality in 2020 was with a mean mortality rate of 14.4 (100,000 person-weeks) In Sweden, all-cause mortality in 2020 was with a mean mortality rate of 17.6 Sweden did not test many in 2020. Large Immigrant groups that did not follow social distancing in Sweden had very high death rates compared to ethnic swedes. foreignpolicy.com/2020/04/21/sweden-coronavirus-anti-lockdown-immigrants/

[@yamishogun6501]

@@DigiMannen 1) coronavirus hit Sweden harder and earlier than Norway because Swedes travelled to Italy whereas Norwegians did not as vacation times were later. 2) Norway's long-term care is much better with small boutique nursing homes unlike the very large ones in Sweden. 3) Norway closed schools until the end of April then reopened. Sweden closed high schools and universities.

[@notaviking6997]

Norge. BS

[@jeankutzer1556]

One thing not mentioned was that most countries including the United States had a plan in place to deal with a SARS type outbreak but almost every country threw that plan out the window and just winged it except for Sweden. They were the only "normal" country to stick with the plan. America spent millions of dollars and tens of thousands of man hours putting in place. When America abandoned that plan early on no explanation was given much less an apology after their complete failure in dealing with it plus the contradictory policy's and lies and deciet which continues to this day. I live in a rural area in Texas with a regional hospital, adequate but small. A local hospital at one point ran an article on how they were overwhelmed and tents were being considered to deal with this crisis. I went there immediately and saw a fairly empty parking lot. The ER had one person sitting in it a mask down below their chin. So I walked down the hallways and most doors to rooms were locked. Only a few beds were occupied anywhere in the hospital. Those locked rooms? They were removed from available bed listing. So therfore capacity was nearly full. Altered data and outright lies and deception.

[@randallanthony1794]

It was one big lie for global government and ruin America

[@spencerantoniomarlen-starr3069]

He does say that at @24:30

[@Peteruspl]

Initial guidance was also in line with those plans, but it changed with reports of 10% death rate in Lombardy (which probably failed to get any of the non-symptomatic cases). It's obvious they were scared just like the people, there were some unknowns still and original "worst scenario" was really grim. Also special interests were pulling that way. In Poland we don't have the kind of Big Pharma as US, but government (right-wing nationalist govt that is in conflict with EU!) was visibly scared and mandating draconian laws/rules day by day. Including ass-backwards stupidity of banning walks in forests and parks because after everything was closed people were "converging" there... and oh my god look there's 10 people on the same path! Arguably this at a steep price had squashed 1st wave in Poland, but by 2nd population was fed up and skirting it left and right, but the farce continued for years. In my local clinic there was mask requirement until early 2023.

[@foxtrotjulietbravo5536]

I think this was much more a case of "Never let a crisis go to waste." rather than an actual health emergency. A local reporter in Orlando did the first story on large medical facilities reporting deaths due to covid rather than deaths with covid. One guy died from injuries sustained from a motorcycle accident but because he tested positive for covid his death was listed as due to covid. This was a scam from start to finish.

[@baysidessi]

@@Peteruspl Banning walks in the forests isn't as bad as a man on a surfboard in the ocean by himself in Southern California was arrested.

[@JonasAlexanderson]

In the summer of 2020 my elderly parents got a new apartment. As they both are over 80 years old they needed a lot of help from me, their grand children and others. It’s my strong belief that they would not be alive today without this help, not from COVID but from stress. That we were able to help them during this move was crucial for their health. This was in Sweden.

[@Gruner69]

Thank you for holding and sharing this discussion about Sweden’s COVID policy.

[@torbjornulrichs8570]

My dad 82 years old died in covid in Stockholm 1st of April 2020 in a home for elderly. My wife is working in a home for elderly. It is clear to me that the reason why so many elderly died is that the homes for elderly are understaffed and to a high degree rely on temporary staff. In my wife's work place they put the covid sick in a special department. But the temps could work there one day and the next day they work in an non-covid department because they don't have a steady job.

[@BosisofSweden]

Yes, that is the way it spread but as the next answer says it would have spread anyway. I think the larger problem was that we ordered a non treatment policy regarding our old people. They weren't given the right treatment and it also took a while to find out what that was.

[@torbjornulrichs8570]

@@BosisofSweden Nope, disagree, I found a mistake in my text, he didn't die in the home for elderly, he got Covid there, he die in Södersjukhusets brand new infectious decease department. He was just too old and fragile to take any advanced treatment. The only solution for him was not to get it at all.

[@niklasbengtsson1299]

So true

[@johnsheehy4192]

The big anomaly of Sweden, IMO, is how they avoided having any weekly excess mortality after the end of the Alpha wave. Since April, 2021, cumulative excess mortality in Sweden has decreased 0.2%, while rising 4% in both Norway and Finland, a steady rise (until Jan 2023) with no correlation to infection waves.

[@louisejoel]

If this is true it makes sense as they probably developed some immunity from early exposure. Early exposure wasn't great though as the virus was worse then so slowing it down wasn't a bad idea. Also, they didn't send their population into panic or delay treatments for other medical conditions like most other places did.

[@johnsheehy4192]

@@louisejoel I've since found that when you break it down by age, Sweden did have excess non-Covid deaths in younger people post-rollout. I don't believe that Delta was really much milder than the original variant; it just made less of an impact in a lot of places because they already had immunity to similar variants. Compare NYC to Florida in the Delta wave; Florida had their biggest wave of excess death due to Covid infection during Delta; NYC had no excess deaths from Covid infection to even show on a graph at all. That's because Florida had very few Covid deaths compared to NYC, going into Delta. It was only Omicron that seemed to be innately less virulent than Wuhan/Alpha/Delta, so avoiding Wuhan and Alpha probably didn't mean a "safer" Delta. Delta was only statistically safer for populations that already had most of their severe disease up front, but this is no consolation to an individual whose first SARS-2 exposure is to Delta.

[@louisejoel]

@@johnsheehy4192 Yes, I agree. I caught the virus or RSV in March 2020 in NZ and had a 2 year post viral syndrome as you would expect with a retrovirus rather than a coronavirus. Have not caught it since. Was disgusted by public health covering this up and not admitting locals were catching it from tourists, and then forcing the "treatment" on people

[@realitymatters8720]

This happened in all the Scandinavian countries, and Sweden had more deaths from covid pr. capita then the others. This negates your point entirely, it is as of yet not illegal to look up things !

[@marcusberggren9241]

I want to point out that Tegnell's popularity rose BECAUSE of the fact that he is one of the people, not a politician. he said how it is and was honest with the public about risks and the reasoning. They did the best they could with the information they had. It wasn't perfect.

[@ChristinaChrisR]

Please continue talking about it. I’m Swedish, I appreciate this talk, of course there are a lot of more things to talk about - even though an hour, an hour and a half is much better than the usual media interviews that lasts only a few minutes, it still isn’t nearly enough time and that’s of course ok, one has to choose the topic/s discussed, and then follow up later (I think is a good thing). What I’ve been concerned about from the beginning is the complete absence of talking about TREATMENTS. And here we are, three years later, and still crickets. It just blows my mind. It’s very important to talk about the lockdowns and its implications, and the vaccines and their positives and negatives in a very honest way (sadly youtube isn’t the place for the latter, still after all this time!), but why the silence, absence of discussions, at least in the main discourse, about the complete lack of anyone as far as I can see (on state levels) discussing and recommending early treatment? (Wow that last sentence was a mouthful, I’m sorry if confusing or unclear, maybe I should take the time to word it better and reflect on my English skills…I hope you all get what I mean though.)

[@Mrbobinge]

Johan Norberg survived American waterboarding with such grace. No pain was inflicted during filming. The whole thing, mature measured informed enlightenment. A great pleasure. Thanks to all.

[@davidbutcher550]

The great thing about the American Education over Sweden is if you keep Americans out of school it won't affect their education.

[@debrahunt5374]

I want to know why the US abandoned the standby pandemic protocols that had been adopted before the pandemic to use during a pandemic. Who decided to ignore the science and instead go into brutal and damaging lockdowns? What did these people gain by purposely distorting science and destroying lives?

[@louisejoel]

They gained a lot of money from it

[@AlexKall]

Likely political panic, they saw many other countries introduce lockdowns and they saw the media shit storm that occurred against Sweden who followed the plan. This happened in many countries. The difference with Sweden as also mentioned in the interview is that Sweden has a different approach between agencies and political leadership. Sweden relied more on science as we knew it at the time based on the knowledge of the epidemiologists rather than feelings, politics and social media/media opinion.

[@AlexKall]

@@louisejoel Not sure how you came to that conclusion, I'm also wondering who "they" are in your reply? Who gained a lot of money from the lockdowns?

[@louisejoel]

They wanted to scare everyone into mandating a jab and make a fortune

[@louisejoel]

@@AlexKall Some businesses got huge payouts for doing nothing but it was the drug industry that made a killing. The lockdowns were not lifted until people took the shots

[@johnl5316]

at the age of 70 I realized from the data (John Ioannidis, J Bhattacharya, Michael, Levitt) that Iwas not in danger given my good helth and that my nephews and their kids were not in danger. here in Florida I behaved normally. I did not socially distance or wear a mask unless a store demanded it.

[@johnsheehy4192]

This whole situation has revealed just how screwed up the semantics and assumed context of risk is, in public health discourse. It does not matter, at all, what your risk of hospitalization or fatality is, from a specific trigger. What matters is how much it *increases* your risk above the background risk that already exists without that added trigger. So what has happened to the public is a semantic bait-and-switch; people were led to FEAR Covid as if it were a disease that took out people arbitrarily like ebola or bubonic plague or war, but we got a disease where most of the victims were statistically due for a similar event, like being several years past your life expectancy with comorbidities to boot. So, fatalities "with" this one disease are not necessarily extra or excess risk, especially at this point in time where the virus is endemic. The risks of the intervention seem to be all extra, and you only take them on by rolling up your sleeve. The risk is direct and clear. People react to numbers without ever understanding what they actually mean, and authoritarians love that fact. The extra risk, even to people who are elderly with comorbidities, was not tremendous even in the Wuhan wave in big cities in the Spring of 2020, and it is even much lower now.

[@lenasoderberg2583]

and there is why Sweden did good. Despite most dident be in danger we still distanced. That way we dident put thoes that was in danger was safe. You could get realy serius danger even if you are well. Dont asume so much

[@johnoliver4199]

Sorry I am posting so much. But this is a fantastic interview of a fantastic gentleman.The only part where he lost me a little, I want to address is the fact that the solution to other countries poverty and civil rights and conflict problems cannot be to cram the entire population of those countries into all the first world countries, obviously that is not possible. And will result in the destruction of both, the fleeing nation loses it’s work force and most able( mobile) citizens and the immigrant receiving country will be rapidly overwhelmed and suffer well known problems culturally, economically., potentially security wise too. The solution obviously is for countries to correct their own deficiencies, We send a lot of money to try to help. It has nothing to do with being mean, Xenophobic or selfish. It is just common sense. Virtue signaling fixes nothing and in fact has been weaponized by intellectually dishonest and opportunistic activists and politicians. Do not be bullied by those people.

[@B_Ruphe]

Sweden wasn't "the one European country that didn't follow the herd and lock down". Hint, the other one was laughed at and in particular its president, but behind his antics, there was as serious a decision about what approach to the pandemic to take by the Belarus authorties as that of the Swedish ones. That's right, it's Belarus, which located is well and truly in Europe (the boundary is 2000 km east at the Ural watershed).

[@ekesandras1481]

Belarus just wanted to elegantly get rid of some of its pensioneers that are a constant burden for the national budget.

[@williamford8027]

he turned down the WHO bribe

[@casperhansen9975]

Europe, geographically...

[@redpilled7002]

​@@ekesandras1481if that were the case, they would have put them in hospital and injected them with remdesivir and put them on ventilators like other countries did.

[@Nak_4]

Exactly, thank you for noticing.

[@tokelahti]

In Finland, there was this strange thing that government made some bans, but legally most were recommendations, but the way they were told, they were perceived as bans. And the style of speak was done like that in purpose. Saddest thing was, that the leaders of elderly homes took the isolation as a mandatory and sick people died alone without their family with them. Administrative court had to make a ban on that ban for elder homes and that of course took a long time.

[@demistar6644]

Never again!

[@vertitis]

There is only one reason why Sweden didn't close down during the covids. And that is because Sweden couldn't due to the constitution. We can only lockdown during a war, but not during a sickness spreading. And yes schools did close down and run classes through internet. We had so many people being hysterical and some polititians proposing to make registrys of "Non-vaxxers". The biggest reason Sweden got so many more deaths than neighbors in the beginning was because they put people of their meds and onto palliative care. As you may know that is horrible for people that already suffer from breathing problems so people dropped off like flies for a while. We had doctors that warned about this but they lost their license, got silenced while being publicly shamed by the media. Sounds familiar?

[@vertitis]

Forgot to mention. Tegnell knew the reason why the virus got into the eldercare. It's because a huge amount of healtcare workers were and are migrants and they don't really care much for hygiene. This was also later supported by the migrant groups being the most common group to be infected by official stats. No connection was drawn because that would make people question the mass migration. You may wonder why un-educated migrants that barely knows the language are working in the eldercare. And that is a good is a good question, the simple answer is that it's an integration project and it also fixes the groups unemployment statistics. So a Swede needs to get a grade in healthcare to get the job, but a migrant doesn't even need to know a word of Swedish and barely able to speak English either. Yes that makes significant problems, everyone in this field knows of the problem but people are still too afraid to question it.

[@Libertariun]

Is there, are there, any sources we can look up which document what you’re saying, which isn’t “pasteurised” by the tech giants and political prop people?

[@davidwensboposaric5498]

DDR/Stasi was always jealous about swedes never having to be coersed or forced by their government. They wouldn't have had to spend so much resourses on informers and keeping archives if they knew about the Swedish magic sause to get a completely obedient population. The talk about "people trust in the gouvernment", impliyng that this is based on having done good things, makes me sick to my stomach.

[@Camicore1]

I agree with you. Also... The healthcare system didn't cope so well as people seem to think. Triage was done and many elderly and chronic ill couldn't get access to healthcare. That's how they "scaled up"...Just denying the people that have payed high taxes their entire lives to have healthcare if needed. 😳 //C~🇸🇪

[@Zynt0xik]

For all of those saying Sweden did the right thing: As glad as I may be that things went comparatively well for us in Sweden I would not have wanted to see the results of this approach in a place without publicly funded health care and heavily funded social welfare, like say the US. We had constant access to free testing and online advice and affordable emergency health care when things got bad. No one had to hesitate and ask if they could afford seeing a doctor for their symptoms, making people more likely to seek health care if they needed it. The Swedish population generally rates far higher in trust for government and agencies (even compared to most other countries) so most people still followed the recommendations to stay home if possible and not socialize outside of the household. Because of this Sweden did suffer financially, there were many businesses that went under because people still social distanced and stayed home. This level of trust also plays into why Sweden has some of the highest vaccination rates as well, and far far higher than the vaccination rates in the US. And the social funding helped even further, the government funded the increased amount of sick days, taking the burden off from employers to pay sick leave. Any symptom and you stayed home with paid leave for up to three weeks without having to show a doctor's note, making people less hesitant to stay home if they had symptoms. The fact that we have separate sickleave to care of a sick child meant that more schools and daycare centers could be open on the condition that if the child shows any symptoms they were immediately sent home and parents could stay home with their sick children until they were fully well. And there were restrictions, especially on size of gatherings of people (including private) and no permits for events like concerts, bars had to close early and had to keep all guests seated, no mingling was allowed and heavy restrictions on places that offered dance floors. but most other things were indeed just recommendations. As for the healthcare not being overwhelmed. Well, it is a good thing Johan did not have to work at the hospitals during the pandemic, the burnout of the workforce was severe and it was in a constant state of emergency and running low on supplies. patients literally died unsupervised in corridors because there wasn't actually enough rooms. It was *not* a story of Sweden's success, it was a warzone. The results in Sweden are more nuanced than "don't do lockdowns=success".

[@heavycritic9554]

The healthcare system was short-staffed in the major cities, as well as having too few supplies locally, because of decades of cutbacks (the right-wing local government in Stockholm actually introduced a bill to cut back on healthcare in the middle of a burning pandemic). The thing that almost completely overwhelmed the healthcare system wasn't Covid-19; it was political ineptitude. It usually is.

[@Wildatlanticocean]

Lovely civilized and informative discussion from John, Zack and Liz

[@liberty-matrix]

African countries with the lowest vaccination rate had the least Covid!

[@dafyduck79]

Cause Africa has young population and average Covid dead is cca 80 years old

[@Mrbobinge]

Maybe 'cos Ivermectin. For decades, kids have been taking the pills for other ailments. African doctors should come forward and tell the world.

[@johnsheehy4192]

​@@dafyduck79 Where are the "per capita" data for age/comorbidity groups, then? That's what you need to look at. Lumping all ages together, all towns and cities together in a large country, and all such large observational cohorts hides real signal. Anyway, when fatality associated with a pathogen is happening mainly in people who are statistically due to pass at around the same time anyway, fatality associated with the disease is a very poor metric of what is going on. Any real problem is going to express in excess fatality and expected-life-years lost; not the discrete body-count associated with the disease.

[@louisejoel]

Sweden was more civilised. I had that or RSV in NZ 2020 and was treated like dirt by people who were scared of catching it from me. Was stuck in a room and had an early and extended lockdown from March 13, 2020 on. Many people did get sick in NZ in the tourist resorts first but we can't say exactly what from as there were no tests until April. It could have been RSV, a bad flu or something in the contaminated water or air. I was shocked by the terrible behavior here in NZ. Nothing kind about it

[@stevedolesch9241]

I posted this in the shorter version : Up to now, as a person with a physical disability, I stress, NEVER got the virus. I'm in Québec. I got the three vaccines only because of the inhumaine passports to be able to have a coffee in a shopping mall's food court. I didm't want to stay at home all day for months. That, all three of you, is being practically a prisoner of war or being on house arrest for not committing any crime whatsoever. The thing is when we are forced to do something against our will, there will be more deaths, especially excess deaths. The psyche can and does more harm than what Sweeden experienced.

[@safsult]

But you gave yr freedom away...for a bogus freedom , think about that

[@randallanthony1794]

Sweden did the right thing and trump didn’t say that.he applauded Sweden not condemmed

[@liberty-matrix]

“The vaccine was not brought in for COVID. COVID was brought in for the vaccine. Once you realize that, everything else makes sense.” ~ Dr. Reiner Fuellmich

[@randallanthony1794]

Excellent

[@anntellgren9618]

Good conversation, but I was disappointed when Johan didn’t correct the statement that Sweden has a smaller immigration then the US. The US population is 15% foreign born, while the Swedish population is 25% foreign born.

[@tovekauppi1616]

Yeah, it definitely didn’t sound right to me that the US has a much higher immigration than Sweden. It gets me thinking of the fact that in the late 00s, a single municipality in Sweden (Södertälje) had accepted more immigrants from Syria and Iraq than all of the US and Canada combined. I’m guessing he didn’t correct her because either a) he wasn’t specifically prepared to talk about it so he didn’t have the numbers and didn’t want to say something wrong or b) he’s personally in favour of low immigration so he didn’t mind her portraying Sweden that way.

[@coole6825]

So you think that one of four people living in Sweden is foreign born?? Its one of five, 20%....

[@mariaolsson1269]

In this case I am so proud to be swedish!

[@aidanhickey5610]

Excellent, informative interview

[@Tony-wu4wk]

Im a Swede and i remember being bullied by 2 Norwegian friends during the pandemic. They felt sorry for me that our government was killing us all and how dumb we are for not locking ourselves up. The amount of bullying you received from foreigners online just for being Swedish was pretty extreme back then.

[@Joppi1992]

It's pretty extreme now as well, but for other reasons. I don't know what's going to happen, but the popularity of the far-right has risen, due to those other reasons. Based on how that has gone for other countries, I suspect Sweden will become a brutal place to live in for at least a decade after the next election. Whether it will benefit or not from that upcoming increase of friction, is something only time can tell for sure though. However one thing I can say for sure, is that Sweden has lost a lot of its past international standing, and will continue to lose more of it from the upcoming period of increase in friction.

[@timowayne6993]

I remember this living in Norway at the time as well. But what surprised me was how paralyzed Norway became during crisis. They decided to follow Denmark step by step instead of Sweden

[@EyreEver]

He was saying that at that point Sweden had 20x the exposure of the neighbors they were being compared to in 2020.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Trikala Greece: Endless mourning at the funeral of the 15-year-old! Grief over the sudden loss of the schoolgirl. She collapsed while having fun with her classmates on a trip to Trikala. Not once, but twice, the 15-year-old girl who "passed out twice" in Trikala last Saturday night May 06, 2023 had twice a heart attack when she was having fun in a bar with her classmates with whom she had visited the city as part of a school trip.

[@JacobAnawalt]

I had the worst/stranges flu I've ever had in Feb 2020 after a co-worker came back from an extended work session in Korea, well before we started talking COVID-19 in the US.

[@Starphot]

Me and other friends had a strange cold with night fevers for a couple of nights at that time. We met at a banquet and compared notes on that on March 1 just before the lockdown. Only one of the 500 or so club members died of COVID during the lockdown. Others died of age related things.

[@johnoliver4199]

I had ( most likely covid in November 2019 after hanging out with a hotel population coming off international flights in Florida. As soon as the had a blood test late Feb I showed Covid antibodies. It was indeed peculiar very bad headache almost more than I could handle , took along time to recover but no hospitalization. Was in my early 60s. Because of this I felt no need to risk vaccination. Still 50% of my sense of smell is gone 3 and 1/2 years later. Covid was here much earlier than they admitted to or knew. Blood bank’ testing later confirmed this I think.

[@dixonqwerty]

What many don't mention in the context of the pandemic, is the differences in social behaviour between countries/regions. As a swede I would say that social distancing was almost a national sport even before the pandemic. How swedes meet and greet each other differs significantly from for example Italians. Italians are used as an example only because a widely spread stereotype of Italians hugging and cheek kissing in excess compared to other countries. I love Italy by the way :)

[@louisejoel]

People hug in NZ, it was a nightmare. Many people didn't really take the lockdowns seriously and the virus went through the tourist resorts in Feb-March. NZ was not Covid naive like everyone thinks. America did badly as they are so unhealthy there and some were given end of life meds as treatment.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Ilioupoli Greece: 35-year-old man in Ilioupoli went for a walk, collapsed and died, on July 05, 2023. A 35-year-old man was found dead in the Chalikaki park in Ilioupoli and was spotted by local residents, who notified the EKAB. The rescuers who arrived at the scene found that he was dead, while the Police ruled out criminal action. As his father testified, the 35-year-old who worked in a supermarket in Alimos, had gone for a walk from his house which is nearby and was not facing any health problem.

[@robertroberts5218]

I loved this interview. Very balanced.

[@seriouslyyoujest1771]

Mandated shutdowns, and closure of schools was ridiculous. Can you imagine 2:54 what it did to the young kids? Expecting that they could be educated at home.

[@louisejoel]

I think the excessive amount of drama created in my part of the world was terrible for kids

[@didaye22]

Thank you to share with us

[@bertcervo3014]

A country where actually intelligent people make recommendations to government and those policies are actually then accepted and followed through??? A public where people actually TRUST and believe in what real experts and government officials actually present?? Where is that place?? Can I come?

[@JonathanRossRogers]

1:02:44 It turns out that the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy was right along.

[@Venoms60]

People in the north of Sweden usually are very distant to each other due to natural distance. They said about the 2m rule between persons.. "Do we have to be so close", so the probem as such existed ONLY in Stockholm, nowhere else in Sweden.

[@williamchamberlain2263]

Why don't you link to Imperial College London's covid spread model?

[@paolaamatosabatelli3025]

"I would say we had healthy debate".. tells paramount

[@aba44000]

As a Swede i am sorry to say that people as Tegnell are very rare and soon totally gone. We will follow the totalitarian states next time even though they will go wrong.

[@HandsomeHank357]

I am also Swedish. Tegnell is an idiot. I asked a colleague of his how he is. The answer was that he is someone who tries to get a round ball through a square hole on an IQ test.

[@mariepalmgren8986]

Johan, VAT on food is 12% including food in restaurants (Sweden)

[@JacobAnawalt]

"Might not see our family members [across the Atlantic] for many many months is a huge human toll" is such a wealthy 21st century point of view. A hundred years ago people regularly paid that toll moving just a few hundred miles away.

[@Lewtable]

That's just whataboutism though. Psychologically the difference in level between the two people doesn't matter, only the discrepancy of the current and the norm for each person. You're right in what you're saying, but the psychological effect of someone from the 21st century mentioned in your comment is still the same as it is for the person doing the same at a smaller scale centuries past. I don't think you should belittle someone because of the world we're living in today operating on a larger scale than it did hundreds of years ago. You might as well say that I am not allowed to complain about hurting my leg walking because a guy broke his leg entirely a long time ago walking a treacherous trail.

[@fixed-point]

You really went off-topic towards the end of the video. I suggest that in future videos in your COVID series that you stay focused on COVID. Or maybe make two separate videos from the same conversation.

[@musikkimies]

Regarding immigration (around 1:20:00), the percentage of foreign born in Finland is much higher than the percentage that she listed - at least in Helsinki -- but also likely in other larger cities, and even in the countryside.

[@TheAlmightiest]

I am Swedish and would liked it if you mentioned the how the deaths of elderly per capita compared to the rest of Europe.

[@TheAlmightiest]

@@martinbergholtz8676 Where are you getting these numbers from?

[@tokelahti]

You should check those excess mortality charts by age groups. There might be something very revealing…

[@joecaner]

Not now Cato!

[@seal869]

Great content. A thoughtful discussion...several years after the fact.

[@yongbinsong9676]

I firmly believe that after all Sweden was right.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Xanthi Greece: Sudden death of a 52-year-old active Brigadier General in the 4th SSS died. He felt unwell at night and was taken to the Xanthi hospital where he ended up on 04/09/2022. Another sudden death was registered in our country, as the director of the PB of the SSS, Brigadier General "Athanasios Vourdislis", SSE class 1991, "passed away" at the age of 52. According to the first information, Brigadier General Vourdislis felt unwell during the night and was taken to the hospital of Xanthi where he ended up. The first confirmed reports speak of a sudden death due to a cardiac arrest.

[@dr.julia-heyakarcic8862]

Sweden was the only country who got it right.

[@galaxytrio]

I'm certainly interested in more analysis of public health response to SARS COV2! Hard to think of many things more significant and consequential in the last fifty years, in the West, at least.

[@KM-xf1ft]

Also, shutting down schools, especially for younger kids, would mean the kids had to be at home and their parents at home too to look after them. Meaning fewer people could work.

[@brendagriecken2915]

Corporations move wherever they can get the cheapest labour. I’ve worked in unionized environments both as a worker and supervisor for over 40 years. I’m sick and tired of hearing about all the lazy people. The vast majority of people are not lazy but instead extremely hard working.

[@brantcunningham4333]

Good 👍 stuff. Great job. 😎🚬

[@lenasoderberg2583]

Jisses i missed Hans Rosling during the pandemic. Next best was Tegnell. I read Hans books and listent to his leasons before he died and i knew what line Sweden was going to go. I was so supprised when other locked down

[@vassiliosca5715]

Achaia Greece: 60-year-old pharmacist died suddenly in Achaia on May 22, 2023. Mourning in Achaia for the pharmacist Tassos Ralis from Platanos. He passed away at the age of 60. There are many farewell messages, such as that of Patreon municipal councilor and doctor Andreas Nikolaou who expresses his sadness at the sudden death of his dear friend.

[@thytess]

I think that one of the reasons why it worked so well for us in Sweden is that we don't live cramped quarters. We don't have huge schools for younger children (ages 6-15). We don't kiss each other's cheeks when we meet or hug, we're probably a bit more social from a distance than in many other countries.

[@markmonge7947]

Now we know? Remember that we knew all of this almost from the beginning. The issue you ask? The professionals were cancelled. Mc cullough. Malone helloooooooo

[@PragmaticPursuits]

Have you done any analysis or comparisons as to how many African nations handled the pandemic specifically around treating Covid and prophylactics used to prevent Covid ?

[@hugosk33]

[Censored]

[@AlexKall]

Would be interesting to know.

[@Karl-Benny]

What a copout to say it`s Different in Sweden and that it wont work in other places Afraid to say we were wrong

[@vassiliosca5715]

Trikala Greece: Teacher "Mary Karagouni Voulgari" passed away suddenly and unexpectedly at the age of 54 on 11/08/2023. She will be buried on Sunday 13/08/2023 at the Holy Church of Agios Konstantinos in Trikala.

[@Soldrakenn]

At 35:16 is one of the most important charts and analysis!

[@idomaghic]

New to the channel, impeccable conversation, will subscribe! Regarding the Science article at 56:40 there's a couple of related articles in Swedish media, especially by DN and Eskilstuna-Kuriren (both unfortunately paywalled), about how the Clinical Frailty Scale was used to triage who at the elderly homes in the Stockholm region would be allowed to get emergency care (drawing the limit at dementia(!)). While bureaucracy makes it difficult to pinpoint exactly who (and there's likely not a single person) is responsible for the directive, the directive itself combined with doctors likely feeling pressured by the general urgency to sidestep their legal obligation of individual assessments likely contributed a significant amount of the Swedish elderly care fatalities. Interestingly, the DN publication by journalist Maciej Zaremba was criticized by the Swedish Media Ombudsman (Medieombudsmannen) for emphasizing the responsibility of a specific individual involved in the directive, however this also made it possible to read the article in full as part of the ruling by searching for "Zaremba Medieombudsmannen".

[@Top12Boardsport]

Natural immunity is the way to go if you have a normal healthy immune system. At least 5 years of natural immunity when you have recovered from Covid which millions already have done. The wax people have in the best case only postponed the inevitable.

[@notaviking6997]

The story of corona 19 in Norway 2020. March 8. No patients with corona at Norwegian hospitals. March 9. We have 2 patients, March 10. We have 9 patients. March 11th. We have 14 patients. On the same day, Denmark goes into lokkdown. March 12 We have 29 patients in hospital and get our first death. And we went into lockdown. We were encouraged to stay at home until March 26. And work from home if they could. But there was no rule, some followed the advice, others did not. The Prime Minister knows that in Norway there are 450 beds with equipment and personnel that can take corona patients, with relocation to other departments, and setting up tents, the capacity can be increased to close to 1,400 beds, but due to a lack of personnel, the places will not last longer than approx. 30 days and then with reduced quality. fortunately, we manage with the 450 beds. Of course, we have started with the tactics of infection tracking and quarantine. (Those in quarantine were called in sick. That means 100% paid from day one. ) Because of the testing, we were ranked as the third worst country in the world, in terms of infection.In an interview, our Prime Minister made it clear that, should the worst happen, she was afraid that there would not be enough places in the hospitals. So she chose to put Norway in lokkdown, and hoped it could slow down the infection enough, so the hospitals managed the tasks they had ahead of them. There are later some who claimed that she acted in panic, but that is just nonsense. Now we are going to travel very far north in Norway, to a city called Tromsø. There we meet a lady who is a Swedish nurse, but who has worked for many years in Tromsø municipality, and who is the manager of the five nursing homes they have there. There is a Swedish journalist who will interview her about Norwegian nursing homes and corona. The headline in the newspaper was, 0 dead, 0 infected And in parentheses «You were too late» She was explaining that in Sweden there are 70 infection control doctors, but in Norway there are 356, there is one in each municipality, so the day Norway went to Lokkdown she got a plan by the infection control doctor, about what she should do. She also explained that on each shift, there was at least one nurse, and at the slightest suspicion of infection, protective equipment was on. After an hour, I clicked again on the Swedish online newspaper, and discovered "You were too late" had been removed. So there were probably some in the newspaper who thought this was too much criticism. In 2020, we had 436 corona deaths. Excess mortality Minus 0.4 percent. During the entire pandemic, I wrote up daily those who died with covid 19 in the Nordic countries. In 2022, I thought I could share that information with others. So I started making 14 day reports. Here is the first one I wrote. Update 14/1 2022 Corona dead (The Nordic countries ) Sweden 15513 Per 100k 149,5 Last 2 weeks 203 Died Denmark 3 468 Per 100k 59.7 Last 2 weeks 201 Died Finland 1 724 Per 100k 31.1 Last 2 weeks 160 Died Norway 1 381 Per 100k 25.6 Last 2 weeks 76 Died Iceland 44 Per 100k 12.5 Last 2 weeks 7 Died Corona dead 2020 Corona dead 2021 Corona dead 2022 Sweden 9 504 Sweden 5 806 Sweden 203 Denmark 1 298 Denmark 1969 Denmark 201 Finland 561 Finland 1003 Finland 160 Norway 459 Norway 846 Norway 76 Iceland 29 Iceland 8 Iceland 7 Population: Sweden 10.4 Denmark 5.8 Finland 5.5 Norway 5.4 Iceland 371k Vaccinated (The Nordic countries ) 1 Dose Finished Extra Dose Reported Iceland 87,0 % 83,0 % 62,5 % 13 January Denmark 83,1 % 80,6 % 55,7 % 12 January Finland 78,7 % 75 1 % 30.5 % 12 January Sweden 76,6 % 73,4 % 28,2 % 13 January Norway 79,7 % 73,4 % 40,2 % 13 January Source VG. They are ranked according to finished.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Trikala Greece: Teacher Mary Karagouni-Voulgari passed away suddenly and unexpectedly at the age of 54 on 11/08/2023. She will be buried on Sunday 13/08/2023 at 11.30 am, at the Holy Church of Agios Konstantinos in Trikala.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Parga Greece: A middle-aged foreign tourist woman suddenly died of a heart attack on 14/09/2023 in Parga!

[@aba44000]

Do things in panic…… have we seen it in other areas???

[@mrlarry271]

Regardless the aftermath of those lockdowns has been really bad and still dealing with the inflation and such to this day. Makes the appetite for further lockdowns low. Government force did not get rid of the virus in the end anyway. Felt like a huge waste looking back at it.

[@CaptZdq1]

It was indee a huge waste n it was also crimes against humanity.

[@JohnDoe-jp4ff]

I'm still wondering if Sweden was just a different social experiment, or if it was truly different. The fact that The New York Times absolutely didn't like Sweden makes me think that the latter is true.

[@robertroberts5218]

Please conduct a similar interview based on India and a retrospective view of its COVID experience. Thank you.

[@BlueSpoonFarm]

I didn't see my son for over 2 years because he had moved to Canada before Covid hit. We were unable to cross the American Canadian border.

[@liiv3354]

Please explain Africa? Uganda compared to Ukraine? Please !

[@davidwensboposaric5498]

@8.20 - pure sugar coating of the sad fact that any "recommendation" by Swedish authorities supercedes all regular coersions by any other country, with few exeptions including countries like North Korea. How this came to be has to do with a mind pathogen that is not on FHM's or WHO's list of potential threats, but ought to be.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Paphos Cyprus: 23-year-old Kostas Arestis from Paphos has passed away suddenly and unexpectedly on 17.08.2023! The death of 23-year-old Kostas Aresti spread sadness in the community of Anarita in Paphos. The boy had no issue with his health! In an announcement by the family to Pafospress it is stated that: "Our beloved son, brother and grandson passed away at the age of 23, Kostas Aresti from South Africa and former resident of Anaritas.His funeral will be held on Sunday 20/08/2023.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Thessaloniki Greece: The news of the sudden death of a 31-year-old kindergarten teacher, who was found dead in her apartment in Thessaloniki on January 13, 2023 has shocked the local community of Kalambaka. According to information from ThessToday gr, the unfortunate woman was assigned to Aridaia, however, she resided in Thessaloniki. At noon on January 13, a family friend found her dead inside her home and informed the relevant authorities, as well as her relatives, who live in Kalambaka.

[@MasterArkannor]

Hang on. The ICoL graph at 33:25 projects deaths by 1 July 2020. The WHO graph he is reading at 34:10 is displaying the data for 2 July 2021. Am I missing something?

[@LRVitusR]

I noticed the same thing. Anyone passing through, are we missing something?

[@MasterArkannor]

​@@LRVitusR I checked the Imperial College of London data and also the WHO dashboard. The documents were correct, Zach just read the wrong year from the WHO data. The 2 July, 2020 data shows the protection to be even more wrong. The protection for Sweden was approximately 96,000 deaths by 1 July 2020, the WHO report for 2 July 2021 was

[@idomaghic]

Yeah, I noticed it was the wrong year as well, but it only drives home the point of how incorrect the projection was; even a year later it was still wayyyy off from actual cumulative deaths.

[@Venoms60]

One thing I have noticed is that bakteria or virus travel with money from hand to hand. In Sweden, people that handls money in a restaurant do not handle food. There is exceptions of this.. but in general. Swedes alwas have learnd to "wash their hands" before eating or after rest rooms. Never ever warm air hand dryer. Take shoes off inside a privet home etc. Not many others do these things.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Trikala Greece: A police officer died due to heart attack at the entrance of the Trikala Hospital! The 45-year-old man felt unwell and went to the General Hospital in Trikala, but he did not make it! "A new shock was caused in Trikala by the sudden death of a 45-year-old man, who died on Sunday morning on August 27, 2023 due to severe heart attack at the entrance to the Hospital Trikala". The 45-year-old, who according to trikalanews gr sources is a police officer and works in Athens, was at his home in Trikala, when he felt very unwell, which forced him to go to the Trikala General Hospital. However, he did not succeed. Upon arriving at the hospital, he collapsed and died at the entrance, of a severe myocardial infarction. The doctors immediately made efforts to revive him, but to no avail. The wife of the unfortunate 45-year-old is a tragic figure, who is even reportedly pregnant with their first child.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Nafpaktos Greece: Sadness in Nafpaktos! "Labrini Ladia" has suddenly passed away on 26/08/2023! The sudden death of Labrini Ladia at the age of just 53 spread grief in Nafpaktos. Labrini Ladia was a teacher and the news of her death was announced by her colleague Stavros Moutopoulos. The funeral service will be held on Sunday, August 27 at the Holy Church of Agios Nikolaos in Lygia Nafpaktia.

[@vassiliosca5715]

Chania Greece: A beloved doctor suddenly passed away! A few days ago, the doctor-pediatrician Michalis Anagnostakis, who was especially loved in the area of Kissamos suddenly passed away on 08/09/2023. The funeral of the young deceased will take place tomorrow, Saturday September 9, at one o'clock in the afternoon from the holy church of the Transfiguration of the Savior in Voulgaro Kissamos. The body will be in the church from 11 am. The burial will take place in the cemetery of the Holy Church of Agios Konstantinos.

[@margaretalaine3581]

SWEDEN didnt Have Any STRAGEGY AT ALL!!

[@GlassDragon0069]

US 37 in the nation in schooling to hurt children even more not at government top list

[@Medietos]

Reply by a Swede: Thanks for the video.The voluntary was not reaklly so, since the recommendations were mostly taken as unspokenly mandatory, like a church had large space between chairs and only allowed a very small number of participants in the sevice, which was divided on 2 more than usual. If there were in fact higher number of deaths, it should be taken into account that Sweden has, as the only country and if I am correctly informed, extra high border limits of microwave radiation. These borders are sky-high with their effects on energy, health and functioning. My mother who was taken to hospital with her heart issue getting acute, was said yo have Covid without them examining it and her overall health /disease, but more presumed, I was honestly told up in inquiring. Staff/doctor also falsely claimed that she was doing well, although she was actually much sicker than I was led to believe, which caused me to relax more and not try to talk with her than I otherwise would have done (due to my own condition). Her exposure and terrible isolation there, weak and fearful in severe acute illness and bodily failure, and without them helping her communicate and telephone me and me getting the correct info was cruel to us both. What if she had died, -without us even getting to talk on the phone! It is well known and felt, that the immune defense is strengthened by love and support by close ones. I felt terrible, stressed and sleepless for long and ended up getting ill myself from the concern of not getting information on how to care for her, a sick old one. It is well known and felt, that the support and love of close ones strengthens the immune defense in both parties. I was hate-crimed as I questioned the unfounded diagnosis and the withholding me of the truth about her state and info how to take care of her afterwards. She couldn't breathe, drink and eat acceptably. I have had medium bad Covid 2 x and got no healthcare and was isolated, not managing. That is not right for our country.

[@andersjohnson9565]

4:40 The Economist's reporting made repeated use of cell phone tracking data during the pandemic.

[@PerpetuallyTiredMusician]

Yes my country did a thing... Great. I shudder to think what would happened if the current government would have been in charge at the time. If you think for one second Jimmie Åkesson would have bothered to shove his hand up Kristerssons ass to make him puppet out a "yes Tegnell, let's go ahead with the strategy, let's believe in the Swedish people to show solidarity and do the right thing" you are not just stupid but beyond saving. Thank fudge this happened while adults were still in charge. Which in a round about ranty way brings me to the point I want to echo. We got lucky that the politicians in charge at the time decided ultimately to not make this a political issue and instead followed the people who gave expert advice on account of being experts and not because they lean a certain way or another politically. Also pretty sure that the UK and other European countries had similar tactics planned out but were scrapped due to political panic and opportunism. Peace

[@derekslaven3454]

problem with prediction models is they are just predictions based on data inputted and can be altered to give the desired result to which you need to convince someone you know what is going to happen and you know better than them so they should comply to your instructions.......not many or if any predicted results from models used actually came close to their predictive results...........

[@vassiliosca5715]

Trikala Greece: 36-year-old woman falls dead in Zarko Trikala on April 27, 2023. Relatives are talking about a sudden and "strange health problem"! Today at noon, family, relatives, friends and colleagues will say their last goodbye to the late "Panagiota Papapostolou", who passed away at the age of just 36. , leaving husband, children, parents and siblings in mourning.

[@eltoncooper-ic2dp]

I agree with the Swedish reaction to the pandemic. I wish Trump had made the same call as they did.