The Vampire Diaries: An Iconic Mess

[@carmirhodes6851]

Friendly Space Ninja sacrificing his sanity for us yet again

[@friendlyspaceninja]

The sanity is still there! The brain cells, however...

[@mauve9266]

Perhaps it’s a form of masochism at this point

[@WhyfallinLUVwhenUcanfallasleep]

@@friendlyspaceninja we could practically see the light leave your body as the video went on

[@dariamorgendorffer7813]

Love the video. Agreed with most of it. What I realized re-watching the show is that most characters seem to be stuck up in a perpetual state of adolescence. Maybe because they all, for the most part, became vampires when they were late teens/ in their early 20s. All have raging hormones, loneliness issues, the need to oblige everyone to obey them and throwing constant temper tantrums when things don't go their way! Maybe, I’m a bit too critical. Totally agree with your comments about Elena. Never understood why everyone would automatically abandon their lives to save her. Particularly Bonnie! Like Damon and Stephan’s characters. Also, appreciated that Bonnie and Damon became best friends. I think that the Damon situation is based on the fact that writers should, sometimes, not listen to the fans. I understand that some fans may love a character, but if the writer thought more about what made sense instead of following what the fans wanted, Damon would have had a better storyline instead of becoming the new Jack Sparrow! I hope Kat Graham, which I love, will find better stories to portray the level of talent she has! You could see how unhappy she seems to be during the interviews. And she was too much of a lady to tell them. I wish one-day American tv would stop making shows so long. Do it the British style! Fewer seasons and fewer episodes per season!!! Please!

[@btarczy5067]

@@friendlyspaceninja TVD for the brain cells, True Blood for the sanity 🫠

[@user-qj9en1kp1m]

So, Damon shows up and people are afraid of him because he is dangerous. Then Katherine shows up, who is even more dangerous. Then it turns out that Katherine is on the run from Klaus, who is even more dangerous. Then it turns out that he is on the run from somebody even more dangerous...Bottom line, there's always a bigger fish.

[@Meanne77]

Maybe they should have chosent another place to run away from their bigger fish; doesn't seem a bright idea to all run/conglomerate in the same spot XD

[@Web497]

@@Meanne77 klaus ran from silas loweky no way he wanted to speak to jane ann THAT BAD lmfaoo.

[@rabl3535]

Qui-Gon was right after all

[@Yun_er]

lmaooooo

[@revi6482]

Wait. Who did Klaus run away from? I stopped after everybody was fucking everybody else.

[@jojokiwi1888]

Matt's survivability was so strong that even the show itself died before him

[@indisverycold]

matt solos everyone

[@SonGoku100YearsLater]

That’s bullshit he only survived because Julie plec didn’t have the balls to kill him off in the earlier seasons with plot armor magical shitty rings that made no sense while any sense of stakes went out of the show

[@random_meta]

@@SonGoku100YearsLater well.. it makes sense since the actor was dating plec. She couldnt kill off her boyfriend.

[@Jeremy-wp4yh]

@@random_meta 🤣🤣🤣 is this true? That could explain why Matt had NO romances on the show. Not even the Rebecca thing worked out.

[@ayyeeShivani]

I know right!

[@mynameispaul553]

The amount of neck snapping in this show is also hilarious

[@im.a.little.dead.inside5522]

Especially just the slight turn to the side sometimes, like yea u have super strength n what-not but seriously dude, I could've done that harder xD

[@DrJohannPryce]

Alaric is a really fine specimen

[@raeste.claire7093]

I wonder if it was to save money? Cause some acting and sound effects are way cheaper than cgi blood or prop knives and blood

[@hihiglug]

​@@raeste.claire7093 good point, they really used the cheapest way to kill off a character as many times as possible lol

[@Rashel.J]

Damon and Bonnie were actually together in the books. Their chemistry on screen was so beautiful. Obviously because of the writer’s treatment of Kat they didn’t want her to have a happy long term relationship. Bonnie & Kat Graham didn’t deserve the way they were treated. Still bothers me to this day.

[@shhshduejajeiwkfbuwtsvxhg]

For real it angers me that they made LITERALLY EVERYTHING CENTERED AROUND ELENA LIKE TF

[@sydnaja104]

well, thanks god they didn't actually put it in the series. people can ship them but it wouldn't make sense because of how much he loves elena, and the relationship he has with bonnie is only made of friendship which is amazing

[@godiswatchingyee2633]

@@sydnaja104oh my god

[@elisa9992]

@@godiswatchingyee2633they spent 5 seasons building damon and elenas relationship and damon and bonnie hating eachother so i dont think it wouldve made any sense for them to suddenly fall in love at all

[@sydnaja104]

@@elisa9992 thank you🙏🏻

[@edgarallenhoe3518]

I LOVE the stupid doppelganger lore. I think it's hilarious that Elena and Stefan are revealed to be literal magic soulmates _after the show has clearly decided that Elena will end up with Damon._

[@JDM-is-my-name]

Truly outstanding move

[@aaliyahgriffin781]

The doppelgänger storyline in s5 makes no sense and was only created to invalidate the stelena relationship and prop up delena so bc of that it has so many inconsistencies bc that was it’s sole purpose 😂

[@Veganqueen123]

THISSSS

[@georgiad4939]

And… if the soulmate story is to make any sense Stefan should’ve ended up with Katherine and Elena should’ve ended up with Tom who was literally killed after one ep

[@Jamangel]

Right LMAO

[@SallyBerry9]

Amazing! At the ripe old age of 27, I’m finally old enough to play a teenager on the CW!

[@inzaghiscornsalad7034]

please this made me cackle cause it's so true ToT

[@eskindermamo4178]

it's literally impossible to have an experienced actress that is a teenager to play these roles. Why are people giving them crap for this?? it should actually not matter. I'd rather have the perfect actors than appropriate actors. The success of Game of Thrones is proof of this. Emilia Clarke 24 at the time was playing a 12 year old and no one protested cause the show was brilliant. Idk why it's suddenly different for tvd

[@SallyBerry9]

@@eskindermamo4178 My issue comes from the fact that actual teenagers see TV teenagers and think that they should be looking like that, instead of a normal 12-19 year old. Also because a lot of the time, the use of older actors is to skirt labour laws and get away with heavily sexualising underage characters. They did actually age up Daenerys for the tv show to 16/17, rather than the 13 she is in the books. That helps a little bit, and so does the fact that Emilia Clarke looks a lot younger than her actual age.

[@Redpanda99998]

@@eskindermamo4178 there's teenage actors who can 100% pull these rolls off. Look at any non American tv show

[@Redpanda99998]

@@eskindermamo4178 also they aged up all the characters for game of thrones show

[@ellyyahum6546]

I think nina is a good actress. I never once thought, "wow thats bad acting" just, "wow, elena is annoying and contradicting as a character." She was able to play it well regardless

[@ninafusilier4352]

Lo

[@musicislove90]

Yes! Agreed. Maybe I've just seen enough egregiously bad acting that I'm easily impressed, but considering she played multiple characters on the show, I think she did a great job.

[@bkimatab]

She was horrible as Elena, but great as Katherine. Maybe because enjoyed the role of Katherine much better than playing Bella 2.0

[@johnnyfive4436]

Maybe Elena was not a good character. But she killed it as Katherine Pierce. It came to the point where I liked Katherine more then Elena.

[@inzaghiscornsalad7034]

@@johnnyfive4436 literally every sane person likes katherine more than elena, me included.

[@TimoCruz177]

I would totally watch at least 3 seasons of klaus and stefan in the 1920s just terrorising everything and everyone for the fun of it. both actors had such good chemestry it amazed me how quick they ended that arc

[@Alceeeee]

you're weird.

[@dragonslastfyl2203]

maybe couple of episode not a season

[@TimoCruz177]

@@dragonslastfyl2203 I mean, a 8 episodes season, 40 ish min each episode. thats a season for me not this madness they used to do with 24 episodes of almost an hour each

[@dragonslastfyl2203]

@@TimoCruz177 yeah I was right couple of episode not a whole 20 something season because that would be boring and I don't wanna see the one of the best character aka Klaus and one of my favorites character Stefan go to be boring.

[@brandonmatt5952]

Yes yes!!! We can hope

[@trinaq]

I hated how they wasted the potential of Bonnie. She wasn't treated the same as Elena or Caroline, the white female protagonists. We never got to see Bonnie's home life or her relationship with her parents. For the most part, she was just treated as the "Brains" of the group, designed to support the other characters.

[@mauve9266]

Honestly they did bonnie dirty and it’s so obvious. It’s odd cos so many people I talked to say Bonnie is one of their favourite character cos of her potential, shame they didn’t utilise her more

[@lesbiangoddess290]

I will never forgive them for what they did to bonnie

[@nightmare-fuel]

they really dialed the ‘token black friend’ trope up to a thousand. And then pairing her up with itty bitty Jeremy. Honestly so disrespectful

[@blaah9999]

Same behind the scenes sadly. :(

[@nyx8633]

i see u everywhere

[@a.t.6610]

"I simply believe Katherine Pierce is the best character in the show" She absolutely is, no question, no debates.

[@thattransgirlanthonyyyy1082]

And that's on period

[@ohjordyn8312]

It’s still so funny to me how much I LOVE Katherine but at the same time HATE Elena, but they are played by the same actress. Those characters were so wildly different that I really honestly forgot it was the same person while watching the show. Crazy.

[@sophieamandaleitontoomey9343]

A man of true taste.

[@gm.8805]

katherine was a good character in season 2 and 3, until she became pathetic in the later seasons

[@thattransgirlanthonyyyy1082]

@@ohjordyn8312 literally

[@mariaGreenDay4ever]

The biggest plot hole is that Elena became a doctor without going to school at all

[@winniedahbarbie]

THIS. I HATE WHEN SHOWS DO THIS 😂😂

[@ahmarionreeves5775]

lmaoo didnt go to not one class all the teachers got ate up lmaooo

[@Pookie_2003]

Elena in the last episode of season eight said that she went back to nursing school in the time skip

[@KarishmaChanglani]

These vampires tend to compel all their financial and logistic problems away so who knows.

[@jubileevivace841]

@@Pookie_2003 but you need to go to medical school to be a doctor lmao

[@ayaassi892]

no one talks abourt how elijah and klaus made up the whole story about the moonstone to get everyone to look for it. smartest move ever.

[@katelyntaylor7384]

I know right! They make up this bullshit about the Sun and Moon curse, that it can free the werewolves from turning every full moon (I think they get a choice about turning whenever they want) or that it can allow vampires to walk in sunlight, as a whole species. But it can only do one or the other, depending on who casts it. So not only are both vampires and werewolves searching for the moonstone and doppelganger, they're RACING to do it first. Really, Klaus and Elijah worked smarter, not harder

[@BertheChan]

The mere fact that Silas is supposed to be Greek and is dressed and styled as a Roman man is really adding to the walking ✨plot hole aesthetic ✨ for me. :')

[@nkl5793]

Don't forget the language and American accent Lmao they didn't even try

[@thecavalieryouth]

@@nkl5793 lol, at the very least they could've spoken what I like to call Jane Austen's English - her work is still hugely popular, sounds very "distinguished" and proper to us now but is still understandable to modern English speakers.

[@leomcshizzlepjocastdeserve1631]

fr 😭

[@furioussherman7265]

They say the Greece flashbacks took place 2,000 years ago. 2,000 years ago, Greece was a part of the Roman Empire; you'd have to go back another thousand years or so to get Ancient Greece properly on its own.

[@leomcshizzlepjocastdeserve1631]

@@furioussherman7265 greece is part of the roman empire but we know that the roman’s didn’t care about changing peoples culture the people in ancient greece still wore their traditional chitons even during the roman empire

[@stellablake6200]

Omg I just realized when Elena meets Stephan one of the first things she says to him when he tells her his name is "I know, we have history together" 😂😭 No wonder he was afraid she might actually be Katherine somehow

[@sashhhaa4874]

It just took me 5 minutes to realise that ‘history’ in this context refers to the academic subject instead of the past 😅

[@b.l7491]

One of the only moments of genuine clever writing in the show

[@stellablake6200]

@@b.l7491 Painfully true lol honestly I wouldn't even be surprised if it was unintentional

[@azahazel]

​@@sashhhaa4874it didn't register in my head until i read this comment...

[@shavelbrown3198]

I had to when I got your comment😂😂😂

[@savannaaah]

HEAVY on the “y’all are ready to forgive a whole lotta shit if the person is good looking.” Same thing applies to Pretty Little Liars.

[@winniedahbarbie]

*Cough cough* Cheryl Blossom in Riverdale

[@TheZombiehunter24]

Jackson from Teen Wolf! Years later I will still say that character is scum of the earth.

[@LS13.]

True. But here everyone is so morally Grey they are good and then bad and then good again

[@amandabutterfly151]

FR

[@kaveenasingsandcosplays3441]

​@@LS13.​Not the main girl characters like elena, bonnie, and care, who are mostly good. And matt, Jeremy, elijah, and tyler aren't that psychotic.

[@grethenana]

I've waited AGES for someone to mention Damon's friendship with Rose being so pure and without extra motivations, thank you friend, someone finally notices

[@MissyFayeYah]

I just rewatched TVD and then found this video damn near a year later, but that scene, even now as an adult woman, breaks me. Almost weeping lol it was such a sweet and sad moment, but it was beautiful. His character deserved better. They all did fr. Such a tragedy how they did them.

[@joecantina7580]

I watched TVD after a big moment for Rose's actress in The Walking Dead. I am OBSESSED with Lauren Cohan as an actress because of her talent. I was SOOO excited watching her in TVD. She did so good and it was nice seeing that side of Damon for once!

[@AfridaHabib-dr6oi]

So pure that he did sex with her lol.. which friendship does that

[@trinaq]

It's upsetting that Kat was treated so horribly by both the writers and the producers. She outshone most of the actors in the show, and I hope that she'll get the big break and high profile roles that she deserves.

[@blueblack3591]

Her instagram was amazing

[@shoujokadyan5502]

she's been doing a lot of netflix romcoms recently

[@jamalwilliams3674]

Why are you everywhere!!??

[@ToriR94]

@@jamalwilliams3674 i was gonna say the same thing lol

[@oceanfive5]

She literally being doing films

[@thatgirlinautumn5995]

Kat Graham is seriously so talented. Plus she speaks *5 languages* - three of them fluently. They could have unleashed hell with her as an actress, in the best way possible. It’s insane that she didn’t get to

[@ramonapiercesalvatore5917]

It's sad, really. Such a waste...

[@ramonapiercesalvatore5917]

@@TheGhostofAbigailMills Bonnie should have been a part of the badass witch triad along with Davina and Freya. She should have become a political force in the supernatural world. A leader and a teacher.

[@rockysalvatore435]

@@TheGhostofAbigailMills lmao you just care about representation quota kid

[@driathewifeofAgatha]

@@rockysalvatore435 um no seeing as Ian threatened to quit the show over the treatment of Kat, I think op is right and you're just contrarion edge lord 😌

[@rockysalvatore435]

@@driathewifeofAgatha you're gay. Black wash is gross. Kat probs played victim and race card to guilt him

[@alyssaj6579]

There is a theory that Kai actually tied Elenas life to Stefans. Cause Elena essentially woke up right after Stefen died. Elena wouldve remained asleep cause Stefan is immortal and no one would dare kill Bonnie.

[@nelle1899]

the way this actually makes sense lol

[@shinikoa]

the way they should have hired you to write the show lmao

[@aubee2744]

Then why did she act like she did it

[@Heroesfullyalive]

But Julie Plec and the other writers HATE Kat Graham so of course they'd put it on her... Make her life more miserable.

[@parisewellington3664]

I really like this theory! It makes sense and it's the type of shit Kai would do to make Damon suffer cuz if he killed Bonnie then he would have killed his best friend and still not gotten elena back and then if stefan never died he would have suffered eternally without a witch to even figure it out because again no Bonnie. But the writers aren't that smart🙃

[@lydiacc]

Elena was a victim of bad writing, Nina was always a fantastic actress.

[@lottesummer5884]

so true

[@aggelikhzt8014]

Joseph Morgan as Klaus Mikaelson is the best thing TVD could provide! Joseph's performances and his ability to portray every emotion artfully,are phenomenal!!!

[@thomasraines1396]

He just chews the scenery every time he’s on screen.

[@fabianbiere5653]

True daniel's but savage elegance also deserves high praise tho

[@em-yq1bv]

right. He was too good in the role and bodied klaus too well

[@shotototoroki1118]

no but when Damon eased Rose into her death with that dream where she could finally feel the sun, i fucking sobbed

[@bondpenelopebond]

still one of the most beautifully sad scenes imo.

[@m_here1]

just watching it in this video nearly brought me to tears

[@wellthisisinteresting4912]

That was fucken beautiful

[@alleyj826]

Same!! As he was recapping I was thinking “damn I sobbed during that scene!”

[@gibsonn2018]

I’ve never seen it but the recap alone had me tearing up 😭😭

[@orefamzy9832]

damon didnt just "sleep with" caroline, she was compelled for a majority of it. statutory rape aside, which is crazy to say, it was rape and it is never addressed. elena was a terrible friend

[@josecarlosrocha1022]

So? like Damon kills people all the time, so you are telling me that raping someone is worse than killing? At least you get to live after being raped and Damon compelled her not to remember that, so to Caroline before becoming a vampire it's like it did not happen

[@majorknight859]

It wasn't quite rape. Caroline did have a thing for bad boys and it's established that they definitely flirted in their original conversation. I think it was always meant to be like a one night stand but because Damon got all "hungry" people assume the entire ordeal was just a rape when he could have just sucked her blood without even sleeping with her

[@fatikh_]

​​​​​@@josecarlosrocha1022 dude, if you are fine with being r@ped under certain circumstances, you do you. but don't tell others that r@pe is nOt tHaT bAd. also, the op didn't say anything about damon's moral compass, but, looking at it not in a bad faith, they were probably telling you, that r@pe is yet another reason why damon was a horrible person. in fact, it's elena who's mentioned to be "a terrible friend". jeez, a lot of you guys never fail to justify and invalidate sa, do you uh, and... after being r@ped you'd rather die than live with the trauma, all the shame, guilt and body memory. especially in the world full of people like you. but yeah, tell me about not being able to put yourself into victims' shoes because you associate yourself with the predator, without telling me

[@yourstepsister2018]

Okay and Klaus killed Elena’s aunt, Tyler’s mom, he killed Elena once, his sister killed Elena the second time, etc. And Caroline still slept with him, yet Elena didn’t get mad. Who’s the bad friend?

[@vomo8322]

@@josecarlosrocha1022????

[@TheCCress]

Bonnie's hair being a wig the whole time has me FLOORED. She is absolutely stunning with her natural hair. Also those are amazing wigs! Like dang! Snatched!

[@baymoo]

THIS like i thought it was her natural hair though just overly styled looks so NATURAL??

[@TheCCress]

@@baymoo it lays so dang FLATTTT like wow the CW knows how to install a wig. And the fact that they kept her widow's peak?!??! So gorgeous.

[@brunanizer2181]

elena’s wig though, tragic

[@c-puff]

I'm from South Africa and one day someone is gonna have to explain to me what the hell America's problem with natural black hair is because I very very VERY sincerely don't understand what the problem is. Like it genuinely makes 0 sense to me whatsoever. And I know the short answer is "racism" but my brain goes "But that's not a good enough answer!! That's just stupid!"

[@ibugfishi]

@@c-puff it really is based upon racism and oppression, though. children, women, and men, all with uniquely textured hair (including both afro-textured and curly hair from any other race) have been met with all sorts of prejudice due to their hair texture. i know italian women- who are naturally white- with the curliest hair that have been profiled and singled out because their hair isn't "clean and pretty" it's the prejudice that forces people to feel as though their natural black hair isn't good enough. it's prejudice and racism that makes black children feel like they need to wear wigs even from young ages to be treated like their white peers with straight hair the bullying gets bad with curly hair, and even worse with afro-textured hair. i don't want to downplay the harassment that people get for having curls, i'd know, i have immensely curly hair, but the hate that black people get for a feature they cannot control drives them to want to change themselves- because otherwise, they will absolutely lose opportunities in education and in careers on-top of already being racially profiled, the beauty standard doesn't make it better.

[@alchemicreduction3819]

At one point in season 5 or 6, Damon, the character himself, screamed at Elena, "STOP DEFENDING ME!!" I wonder if that was scripted or not lol but it shows how frustrated Ian was with this role

[@mackenziewoloschuk7375]

Lmao makes sense either way But even funnier if it was adlibbed

[@natb9919]

It would've been scripted because if they didn't want it in they'd cut it out or just get him to redo the scene until he does it the way they want. That is funny though, they probably wrote it in just to please Ian so he didn't get too annoyed and leave the show.

[@GTAVALE]

Wym lol it was obviously scripted, and why would Ian be frustrated in his role

[@alchemicreduction3819]

@@natb9919 oof but that stop defending me really did feel personal lol at least it shows

[@freddierodriguez3036]

Team Damon all the way!!! 😂

[@Fierra2000]

About Bonnie: Funny thing is, in the early books, Bonnie becomes the narrator after Elena dies. AND she and Damon become love interests. So it confused me when the writers refused to make ‘Bamon’ a thing. I know you said it wouldn’t make sense for their characters, but…that’s only because the show writers never made the effort to make it make sense.

[@areadergirl8449]

and thats good tbh

[@madeezyfosheezy]

bonnie also isn't black in the books so

[@areadergirl8449]

@@madeezyfosheezy yeah exactly

[@eleventhten9170]

They almost tried to make 'Bamon' work in Kai's prison

[@JulyIzHere]

@@madeezyfosheezy how is bonnie's race in the book relevant to the comment again?

[@chasewainscott8739]

At the time of watching this, I’m at the end of season 3 and I can already see some of the cracks starting to form. Elena repeatedly messes up the heroes’ plans by going behind their backs and doing something stupid, Stefan has already gone through the exact same ‘overcoming addiction’ arc twice, Damon has flip-flopped between bad and good guy like 6 times, and almost every conflict is solved by Bonnie being a deus ex machina.

[@IImYourAtlas]

The chemistry paul and ian had as brother's was believable for me, mostly because they became good friends outside the show and now have a bourbon company together

[@ohhmangos]

Tbh I kinda wish FSN talked about the Bourbon gimic the show had-- like fr was it an ad for bourbon in general bc every episode "we're out of bourbon :(" xD

[@JDM-is-my-name]

That's weirdly cute, imo

[@erstequeen]

Wait, they have a bourbon company together now? I love that

[@Monie71793]

😮🥺🥰

[@Monie71793]

@@ohhmangos 💯🤣🤣

[@Skyismify]

Nina doesn't get the credit she deserves. She played several characters and I think she did it well. It's not often that the same actress can make you completely dislike one of her characters while making you love a different one on the same show.

[@rahbeeuh]

Tatiana Maslany would like a word 😉

[@ericchiriac6058]

@@rahbeeuh the actress from orphan black? While the show dragged , her performance was top tier

[@rahbeeuh]

@@ericchiriac6058 yes, that's her! Her performance was most definitely top tier!

[@darkjester3391]

@skyismify Then what happened because i hated all of them ? lol

[@denisablaskova3269]

Still gotta give them credit for portraying them? I mean person that never acted wouldn't do it good at all.

[@runningcommentary2125]

Something I've never understood about things like Twilight and the Vampire Diaries is why do these vampire men, who are over a hundred years old, bother going to school. Why not just claim to be a man in his twenties who looks younger? Can you imagine how excruciating being permanently stuck in high school when you're over a hundred must be?

[@macklyon7476]

I’m pretty sure that Stefan only went back to high school to be near Elena. Which is still stupid, but not as bad as Twilight.

[@JessLoveyy]

I agree. I never understood that. And the Cullens went to high school multiple times. Why? So stupid

[@mariellem7820]

Twilight should have just been set in university/college. So instead of collecting high school diplomas, the Cullens could have been collecting different college degrees. This would make it make sense why they keep going back to school

[@nadiadare7226]

Stefan just wanted to get to know Elena personally, and it's easier if he studies with her. The Cullens wanted to live in one place longer: a few years in school, a few years at university, and for ten years they had a more or less permanent home. Surely over the centuries it gets boring to move every couple of years. Little is written about this in books, but all Cullens have at least a couple of diplomas. It is not always possible to complete the school-university cycle, sometimes someone breaks down, kills and you have to start over. They don't always live in the same house as a family. Sometimes they get separated and everyone does what they want, but they love to be together. And also just needed to bring Edward and Bella together. It is unlikely that she would have chosen a university not in a sunny city. And most likely it would not be quite for teenagers. University - Fifty Shades of Grey. School - Twilight. Stefan seemed to change his personality every five years, even though he didn't go to school before.

[@realestsienna]

so stefan could be with elena…

[@belladonnnaxox]

The “a new black character” thing has me in stitches 😭😭😭😂😂😂😭😭😭😭 it’s also present in Grimm, which I hate

[@larsdewit6521]

I mean Grimm is a villain of the week show. 95% of introduced characters are only there for one episode so i'd call it less egrigious as opposed to a series with a continuing storyline episode to episode

[@RescueGoat]

I saw Ian Somerhalder at a convention once. He really wanted to speak about the charity he was running at the time and tried his best to talk about topics he cared about. He got so frustrated when all the fans did was screech, request him to perform popular lines or ask his opinion on certain ships. It was sad to watch.

[@thomasraines1396]

Man that really sucks.

[@sophieamandaleitontoomey9343]

He seems like such a cool guy. I don't blame him for having such negative feelings toward the show now.

[@alexforce9]

But...its a convention. I mean, I feel for the guy, but that have the same vibe as to go to a college party and get mad when people dont want to hear about your bionic collection. Just the wrong crowd.

[@Khushi-Shah]

@@alexforce9 Fair enough, though I do think those people should have heard him out for a little bit at least.

[@alexforce9]

@@Khushi-Shah Well, I imagine them mostly being teen girls and boys so we cant expect too much of them hahah

[@tonichan89]

Damon's actor seems like such a standup dude. Just by what he said about people making excuses for his character, and then also stand up for Bonnie's actress with the leverage he had. Few people will do things like that.

[@angelaholmes8888]

Yeah I really have so much respect for ian for doing that

[@indisverycold]

absolutely love ian so much respect

[@lordsathariel4384]

and then they started a bourbon company so being a standup civil person probs helped with marketing

[@HomerXXX]

What did he said about his Character and Bonnie ?

[@rahbeeuh]

Ian Somerhalder didn't stand up for Kat Graham. That was a rumor made up by TVD fans. I've searched everywhere and it's not documented anywhere. So while Ian is a standup guy, he didn't risk his job for Kat's.

[@fable5745]

My rage for everything they did to Bonnie is eternal. Man her and Damon were fantastic together (maybe because they were two of the very few good talents on the show oop-) What they did behind the scenes gives me blinding hot rage. I agree that shes pretty much one of the best talents on the show. And man, I love Ian standing up for her, but it's the absolute worst that he had to do it.

[@gallarinas]

BAMON 4 LIFE YASSSS

[@Monie71793]

💯😩🤣🤣💔

[@trinaq]

Seconded, I hate how they constantly belittled Kat, and shut down her opinions. Kudos to Kat for standing her ground, and refusing to return to that toxic environment.

[@fable5745]

@@malinzoe FSN goes into the tip of the iceberg in the Bonnie Bennett chapter!

[@crimson_auror]

Yes Bamon would have saved Damon as a character for me. I couldn’t stand Elena and her being with Damon made me hate Damon.

[@smolpretty4497]

I actually think the theme of an addict is always an addict is compelling. Vicky Donovan being a blood addict because she was a drug addict is an interesting concept

[@lnt305]

I think we deserve more nuanced takes on addiction

[@magical571]

nuanced how? going into her bloodymus anonymus struggles? addiction is an illness, and it changes how your brain works, it's not so easily escapable without help, and relapses are common.

[@Rae.Harper]

They say an addict is always an addict because all it would take is one little slip to be back on the thing they are addicted to… and most times an addict will jump from one thing to another… so Vicky being a junkie, going from drugs to blood, makes total sense.

[@zillobeast5257]

@@Rae.Harperthe entire reason people become addicted to things in the first place is to cope with reality and as escapism so vicky going from a drug addict to blood addict makes no sense bcuz she would just continue to do drugs as a vampire and the sensation should be even stronger as a vampire, the plot line is stupid and your ignorance of how addiction works is showing

[@8niidle13]

The thing you said about platonic relationships, I felt that with Stefan and Caroline. I was so disappointed when their relationship started to turn romantic, I just wanted Stefan to have another best friend like he used to have with Lexie. And Caroline also really deserved a platonic relationship with a guy, because she was always wrapped up in this romance then that romance and it just got old really quickly. So yeah, when they turned that friendship into a romance I was really disappointed and lost even more interest in the show. Thank god they at least kept the Bamon friendship

[@aaliyahgriffin781]

I completely agree also the fact that Stefan and Caroline do not have any romantic chemistry whatsoever like Caroline had chemistry with pretty much every guy on the show except the one she married

[@monicacreator3168]

Bamon should have been romantic and Stephan and Caroline should have been platonic

[@sophieamandaleitontoomey9343]

I will never forgive them for putting him and Caroline together. It makes NO sense.

[@gallarinas]

@@monicacreator3168 exactly

[@Jamangel]

Right like not everything has to be romantic when it's Caroline with a man lmao but the wedding was cute🤷🏾‍♀️

[@IL-nl9jn]

To clarify the point you made about the soulmate plot taking away the agency and the chemistry of Elena and Stefan, it's actually worse than that. Because If we *god forbid* follow the logic of this myth, Stefan is not Elena's soulmate. He's Katherine's soulmate. The guy that Elena was supposed to fall in love with is some firefighter named Tom that we see in season 5 and gets immediately killed. It makes 0 sense.

[@MW-xd6hy]

Not even! Cause Katherine is like 300-400 years older than Stephan. So, according to this stupid plot point there must have been one "Stephan-ish guy" in Katherine's times and also another "Elena/Katherine-ish girl" in the time that Stephan was born IDIOTIC

[@JV-ic6to]

Im ride or die for Tom

[@aaliyahgriffin781]

The doppelgänger storyline in s5 makes no sense and was only created to invalidate the stelena relationship and prop up delena so bc of that it has so many inconsistencies bc that was it’s sole purpose 😂

[@Monie71793]

@@aaliyahgriffin781 💯😩🤦🏽‍♀️

[@denomen3391]

also if stefan and elena's dopplegangers had children would that not make all the dopplegangers a little incesty? idk i didn't watch the show

[@isobelduncan]

Nobody was mistreated on set more than Kat Graham. That being said, nobody even cared about her except for Ian Somerhalder. On another note, even Nina Dobrev admitted she that enjoyed playing Katherine more than she did Elena.

[@ClaudetteVioletta]

People Say "Why is race important for You?" But never ask "Why was race important for them?"

[@angelaholmes8888]

Not surprised that nina said that because elena was a boring character to me

[@GameOn71213]

@@angelaholmes8888 they should have given Katherine a redemption Arc instead of making her the final villain.

[@smirglepapier531]

@@GameOn71213 they did. And THEN STILL BROUGHT HER BACK AS A LACKLUSTER FINAL VILLAIN. As much as I hated the traveller season, Katherine was confronted with her mortality, met her daughter Nadia and died somewhat in peace. We got to see her vulnerable side ant tbh aging Katherine was so interesting. (Ripper virus aside, that whole story was absolutely stupid)

[@isobelduncan]

@@angelaholmes8888 Yeah, looking back, Elena was a terrible character, yet they tried to frame as the virtuous heroine that you're supposed to be routing for. Katherine, however was supposed to be unlikeable and self-centred because she was an antagonist, but even she had more depth and character than Elena.

[@pavel228]

35:00 In my opinion, having Klaus possessing Alaric added to the buildup. First, you here of him, than from him, than experience his danger and his manners to a before beloved character, until you finally see him. This was just perfection. So I see it.

[@sahasraveda4505]

just like how silas was also introduced tho

[@DisabledDoll]

Matt should’ve worked with Joseph on Klaus before shooting

[@DimaPreo_]

I stand by the fact that Elena turning into a vampire ruined her character entirely. Part of what made Elena’s character so important is that she’s the epitome of human, and a lot of its good qualities. She’s compassionate, loves helping people, and has strong will. A fundamental part of her character is that she’s a human in the world of supernatural, as we see from her perspective. She’s also the voice of reason for the (obviously) human viewer. But her becoming a vampire tears apart what made her character good. She just becomes an overly good vampire with no interesting duality in her vampirism and humanity (like Stefan.) she’s just… seen as perfect by everyone. And nobody acknowledges her flaws (and no, her feeling “grief more than anytime” doesn’t count) I loved Elena seasons 1 & 2. Even moments in season 3 are good. It’s when she becomes a vampire the show starts down spiraling.

[@chickensoupfordinner]

I agree. Especially when she was awful to her friends because she loved Damon and couldn’t understand why Caroline and Bonnie would have an issue with him after everything he did to them and their families. Also the college plot was ugh.

[@emmaatkinson7379]

I feel like they only acknowledged in canon Elena's terribly boring, narcissistic characterisation a couple times. Either via Katherine (but she's mean, we're supposed to hate her, doesn't count), Rebecca (ditto), and Caroline when her humanity was off. Those two or three episodes of Caroline telling the bald truth about Elena to her face were VERY cathartic though. I think the writers were so invested in creating the "perfect woman" (Elena) and the "perfect romance" (Delena) that both ideas just lost all interest, nuance, depth once that was kinda achieved in their minds. Like their storylines eventually just boiled down to what big bad is going to get in the way of Damon and Elena being happy together this week. At least Damon had his friendships with Sherriff Forbes, Bonnie and his brother to fill him out a bit. Elena was just so... empty at the end. In the playbook of YA media your protagonist is supposed to be relatable and likable, but people often make the mistake (like with Bella Swan) of making them so everywoman and generic that they just aren't interesting at all.

[@afinecuppatea]

This is my exact thoughts on Elena!! I loved "human" Elena, but once she got turned, it's like her sadness and grief just intensified and yeah. :'D Kudos to Nina Dobrev for doing the best with what she was given. I never hated Elena, but she just becomes background noise from season four on.

[@afinecuppatea]

@@chickensoupfordinner yessss omgosh that was painful to watch. Initially I was so supportive of Delena, until I thought about, who in their right mind could love someone who literally tried to kill everyone they cared about at one point? y i k e s

[@danhumphrey8357]

Yes!!! I loved human Elena, but when she became a vampire, I just didn’t feel that girl next door energy anymore.

[@katelynnbehr9131]

Personally I think Damon falling for Elena made perfect sense for his character, especially taking Katherine into account, but her falling for him? Especially after Stephan? Yeah that never added up to me

[@javierlopez9789]

Yeah Damon was The one who could never get over the obsession for Katherine

[@tormu5189]

I don't really care about Elena so it doesn't bother me, I like Damon with Elena and I like Stefan without Elena.

[@lolaloves6574]

Exactly, they needed to focus more on Elena and what she would get from choosing Damon. It made perfect sense for Damon to love Elena and even benefit from her love but they kept making Elena’s motivation nothing but “Oh she secretly wants danger.” As if Stefan didn’t bring danger as well. I realize I liked Damon’s character in that season 2-3 era more than Delena itself.

[@aaliyahgriffin781]

This is so incredibly true Elena falling for Damon is so incredibly out of character for her and made her regress as a person

[@softjytsu]

For me, I wish they would've allowed Elena to be alone much longer than they did and let her figure out things logically

[@mariannnnnnna]

Elena's vampire arc should've been about her overcoming her survivor's guilt -- not out of the blue, of course, but it would've been nice to watch her come to terms with everything that had happened to her up to that point. Instead, she devolves into the person she was always accused of being, almost like a self-fulfilling prophecy of sorts. Elena suffered a lot as a character because when it came to her, the writers were all about telling, but never showing. For a good reason, we never see Elena as the happy, fun girl with lots of friends during the first 3 seasons, but I never understood why she wasn't given the chance to heal or change for the better like Caroline was after her transformation. She just gets worse even though the writers had the perfect arc to make her progress as a character in a convincing way. I don't even think Elena is as bad as people make her out to be, she's just a waste of potential. I know TVD was never supposed to be a series about grief, but it had potential enough to at least talk about it in a more meaningful way, yet it never did.

[@baymoo]

this the fact that it made her have more guilt i will never understand that.

[@Jessica.Shawnte]

I use to hate Elena I still don’t like her but I agree she isn’t as bad as I thought..I still think she’s not a good friend and she is a selfish

[@04kam00]

Honestly Nina’s acting in the show was really good, even though you know it’s the same actress it’s easy to forget because she plays the different personalities very well.

[@cami_cosmos]

If i had a nickel for every multi-hour Vampire Diaries video essay I watched, I would have two nickels, which isn’t a lot but it’s weird it happened twice.

[@ayeshad5170]

For realllll 😭😭 the fact that I've watched Jennys one like 3 times

[@rozziedenisse2995]

Which one is jennys one? 😂I wanna watch it too

[@Sayojen]

@@rozziedenisse2995 Jenny Nicholson

[@rozziedenisse2995]

@@Sayojen thank you

[@coudywane888]

Now just imagine if Mike’s Mic also made one 😩

[@TaraMooknee]

I really hope the cast members of the show see this. I don't just mean The Vampire Diaries - the cast of *any* show.

[@fusselmietz5929]

Hey Tara, nice seeing you here! I love your videos!

[@TaraMooknee]

yo!!! you included me!!!

[@inkchip7351]

I'm such a big fan!

[@witherton8340]

I would pay a lot to see the whole Riverdale cast watching FSN's video about them

[@thecavalieryouth]

I'd actually say the writers of any show should watch vids like this because points are made, no lies can be detected and only facts were presented.

[@seasons_of_stories]

It's no secret that Bonnie was an extremely disrespected and regressively written character. But I'm about to present an example that I have not really seen anyone bring up. In Season 1, after her Grams dies for Damon and Stefan's wishes, instead of getting to deal with it on screen with help, she straight up DISAPPEARS from the story for FOUR consecutive episodes. They say she goes to stay with family and like...you're telling me she is just gone from school for THAT long? And the next episode spends time focusing on Damon's pain of realizing that Katherine was not in the tomb, and that she never actually loved him. And that's heartbreaking, yes, but Grams DIED. And yet the next episode focuses on everyone BUT her grief. Hell even ELENA gets to comment on Grams dying and the only thing she could say was that it brought back too many memories of HER OWN parents. Yeah. She made Grams pointless sacrifice and Bonnie's grief about herself. And when Bonnie comes back...the show focuses how much she is hurting Elena's feelings for daring to not wanna be around her and the Salvatores after her Grams literally died for them. She even lays out very explicitly why she can't bring herself to be around Elena and Salvatore brothers because her Grams died opening the tomb and trying to close it so the tomb vampires don't escape and her death was for nothing because the tomb vampires GOT OUT ANYWAY. And she did it because Damon and Stefan wanted their help, with no regard of whether it's something they SHOULD do. And I thought maybe this will make Elena see that having the Salvatore brothers in her life doesn't just affect her, it affects EVERYONE around her. And Bonnie said she doesn't wanna make Elena choose so she's just gonna take herself out of the equation because she can't stand being around them. And then Elena, Bonnie's supposed bff, just LETS HER. She's sad about it but she does NOTHING to prove to Bonnie that she wants her in her life and that her happiness is just as important to her as her relationship with Stefan. I thought this would get resolved by Elena choosing Bonnie over Stefan because Bonnie had been here for her since the beginning. But no. BONNIE is the one who has to make the first move. BONNIE is the one who has to apologize to Elena for hurting her feelings, even though her Grams DIED for the vampire brothers Elena at this point of the show CHOOSES to keep around. BONNIE tells Elena that she's sorry for being a bad friend and "not being there for you when you needed it" even though I didn't see Elena do ANYTHING for Bonnie when her Grams DIED. Don't get me wrong, there are certainly more egregious cases than this one of Bonnie having to put her own grief aside for people who clearly don't care either way about her. But this was the first time I actually noticed it and it completely threw me off guard because I NEVER see anyone cite this as an example of Bonnie being extremely disrespected and used.

[@neodigremo]

Julie Plec had an issue of making characters disappear completely when they did not interest her instead of trying to actually write the plot they needed. It is not only Bonnie who had this happen. Also, yeah, Kat Graham got it worse than anyone on the show.

[@Jeremy-wp4yh]

When Caroline's mother died, they dedicated an entire season finale to her. It was also all about Caroline getting her emotions back and stefan giving her memories. It's interesting how nobody cares about Bonnie.

[@VenusiaViolet]

Elena never failed to make me physically sick with the amount of annoyance she purged from my system.

[@vxjinin]

Grams died purely because of DAMON 's obsession. Stefan DID NOT want Katherine back. I loved the Bonnie's bloodline. Everyone related to her was cool.

[@Jeremy-wp4yh]

@@vxjinin yet we knew nothing about any of the witches. None of them came back (even though they promised to stay in touch). Even the moonstone witch.

[@kookiesnmilk9601]

1:00:24 my man totally forgot about Tatia; she’s only mentioned a couple times mostly through flashbacks. And even though she’s sorta an afterthought with all the vampire lore, she really adds to the Silas and Amara no kids plot hole. As mentioned in flashbacks, Tatia partook in the creation of vampires by non-consensually donating all of her blood - she was murdered - to Esther - the murderer - for the mikaelson’s to drink for the transition; they either drank it before Mikael killed them or after. I can’t remember but it was used. Her blood was also later used to bind Klaus’s werewolf side which was why, subsequently, it was important for a doppelgänger of Tatia to be used in the ritual. Essentially what I’m getting at is Esther didn’t choose Tatia at random as there had to be something magical about her in the first place for her to be used in the creation of vampires. i.e. she was a doppleganger herself. This plot itself makes sense….sorta. It also explains why Elena came 500 years after Katherine as Katherine herself came 500 years after Tatia. However, following the logic of Amara and Silas not having kids and adding in the existence of Tatia, you could say it is implausible for vampires themselves, not just the Salvatore’s, to exist, as Tatia’s existence shouldn’t even be probable.

[@nostradamus1162]

THIS BOTHERS ME SO MUCH, they act like esther chose tatia randomly

[@laharlkent]

Star wars did the same thing with anakin, just came into being cause person needed.

[@bestcutie]

It's not his fault, the Doppelgänger storyline is so confusing considering it's been retconned a handful of times by J-Plec. Hard to understand as a casual viewer. He still has a point going off of the second narrative. Since Amara didn't have kids, Tatia couldn't have existed as well as everyone that trickled down from her. Granted the argument in the series would be "nature finds a way" so they just jumped to the closest relative to continue the bloodline to get the Petrova's. But even Qetsiyah herself diminishes the bloodline aspect though because she says there is a set every century. Not impossible, but really obnoxious to have copies of the same person every other generation in a family. That's like the third iteration of this narrative that makes everything make no sense whatsoever etc. Also side note Tatia (Off of Originals) gave her blood willingly. Esther I do not think gave her details on why she was special though. Blood was put into wine to turn the Originals. Tatia died a couple days later as she stumbled upon Klaus and his victims, when she tried to run Elijah killed her by accident due to his bloodlust. They took her to Esther to revive her but it was too late, Esther took this opportunity to once again use Tatia as an ingredient for the binding Hybrid spell.

[@Shinigami00Azael]

But there isn't any reason to believe that dopplergangers need to even relate to one another. That was the theory for Elena and Katharina relationship, but in the later seasons we find Katharina's daughter and she doesn't look like she was a mother at any point. In the end, dopplegangers are just a magic phenomena. Tatia died during courtship with Ellijah and Klaus, probably didn't have children of her own. Not to mention that we have her from Scandinavian/Native-american descent, Katharina from Romanian descent and Amara from Greek descent. The idea that in reality they needed to be related is a conjecture from FSN part, and non-sensical one to boot.

[@chloeemary]

@@Shinigami00Azael hey! Just wanted to mention in season 1 or 2, they say Elena is an ancestor of Katherine I’m pretty sure that’s why they did the whole adopted storyline- so I don’t think that was meant to just be a theory but I could be very wrong.. And around season 3 or 4, Elijah and Klaus (at dinner with Damon and Stefan- negotiating the return of the rest of the mikealson siblings) mention that Tatia, had a child by a different man so i think it’s likely they’re all part of the same lineage but I guess we can’t know for sure 😂

[@hcneysenpai6673]

Bonnie and Damon literally held the show together with their friendship towards the end. they didn’t have to do kat / bonnie so damn wrong

[@Boom_Bianca]

Agree

[@MrAnybody04]

They should've ended up together period. the only reason she didn't end up with Damon is bc Julie Plague is racist and hates to see a black character get a fraction of attention.

[@ariadneblue2201]

I feel so vindicated whenever I see someone defending Bonnie nowadays. To say I was attacked for liking/defending her, when this was airing, would be a severe understatement!

[@ariadneblue2201]

@@skylightstudios3250 The soul of the show!

[@blueblack3591]

Attacked? Wow

[@MrsUzumaki]

Those were dark days

[@ariadneblue2201]

@@blueblack3591 When I said it made sense for Bonnie to hate Damon in season 2, he tried to kill her AND her grandma died because of him trying to open that tomb, people wrote that she's a b word, that her grandma was old and would've died soon anyway etc. When we were made to believe Bonnie died to protect Elena at the end of s2 and a few of us said that's not okay, Elena doesn't deserve for one of her friends to sacrifice themselves, she is not more worthy of life than Bonnie or anyone else, people wrote that Elena is the main character and Bonnie is only there to protect her. When we complained Bonnie should've been invited to the ball in s3 we were told she is not important, why would she want to wear a dress and make herself pretty - even though Bonnie was never a tomboy. When we complained that Bonnie deserves better love interests we were told tvd isn't abt Bonnie's love life. When we said she keeps losing her powers and is constantly in pain, we were told Elena and Caroline suffured like way more. When I hoped Bamon would happen, because they are a couple in the books and Bonnie/Damon always had crazy chemistry, I was asked how on earth did I think that Bonnie is prettier than Elena, and why would he look at Bonnie when he could be with Caroline/Rebekah/anyone else. And a lot more. And I tried writing only the gist of it, but us Bonnie fans were definitely cussed out on the regular or told she is not important, mostly by delena fans honestly. I was never a rude person, I never wrote about a show I liked in derogatory way, but people were almost always horrible when you said you're a Bonnie fan. I'm so happy she's better liked now 🥰

[@Watcher-pl1lr]

@@ariadneblue2201 That's really awful. And a demonstrative case of racism that may not involve racial slurs but still affective. I'm sorry you guys had to go through w that. I haven't watched the show, but from what I've seen. Bonnie could easily take center-stage and be her own compelling protagonist. She deserved better. And you guys deserved better too. Hugs. 💜

[@tinamaryland4271]

Another thing to point out how Bonnie was being disrespected and how it also plays into racism is that you notice that Bonnie never had a “Cinderella moment” like Elena and Caroline and even Rebekah had numerous times, even when she won Prom Queen. For some reason she never participated in the mystic falls beauty pageant (yes I know that only founding family girls can only participate but they did mention that there was a girl who was participating that wasn’t part of a founding family so yeah Bonnie could’ve participated too) and she didn’t attend the Mikaelson Ball, when prom happened we barely saw her dress and thank god we didn’t see much of it cuz it was horrendous and they didn’t even bother with her hair. Elena, Caroline and Rebekah all had their “Cinderella moments” during prom but not Bonnie even tho she was prom queen, they insanely downplayed her. All the big fashion moments that show had almost never had Bonnie in it because “coincidently” she was doing something else or when she was there, she always dressed down so her white female counterparts could shine more. Her wardrobe was always bland and boring compered to her female counterparts and like you mentioned she never was able to style her hair the way she wanted too. This plays into racism because black women are never seen as beautiful women in the eyes of white society and also we know that Bonnie would’ve upstaged all of other female characters because Kat Graham is the by far the most beautiful actor in the whole show and so if she had a “Cinderella moment” like Elena Caroline and Rebekah had, she would’ve upstaged all of them with easy and the writers and producers knew that too and so they made to keep her out of the big fashion moments in the show. Her wardrobe did significantly improved in S7&8 but that was because Elena and Rebekah were no longer in the show and so they let her have better outfits than she did before.

[@isabelsteurer7573]

true. her wardrobe was honestly infuriating

[@IronKore]

Mainstream media baby. Eternally led by color

[@gm6393]

Wow I never noticed the clothes thing, but now that I think about it I never noticed her outfits the way I did Elena’s and Caroline’s

[@barbiepombo]

omfg this sucks ass...it's terrible they did her this much dirty. Justice for Bonnie and specially FOR KAT

[@awesomereviews1561]

Well in the book Bonnie was a red hair from Irish descent, so that’s that. And the other issue was that Kat and Julie Plec ( the show runner) disliked each other a lot. That’s a lot more likely reason for her character getting the short end of the stick than racism. Or at least look into the facts before crying wolf at the first sign.

[@erizamisorafujoshi7002]

"I don't know it and I don't think the writers know it either." This sentence is awesome 👏👏👏

[@erizamisorafujoshi7002]

Me quedé en la segunda hora, continuo el vídeo otro día

[@Glutiam]

I think Nina is actually a pretty good actress considering I always forget (and it feels I’m not alone here) that Katherine and Elena are played by the same person

[@jbabylucus1641]

Yep. People love Katherine and tatia but Elena, naw lol. Katherine was by far Nina’s best moments

[@terrarossaa4971]

Yes if elana was actually written as semi interesting and not so bland I think nina could have show cased her skills much more. So good thing she had katherine at least.

[@dsur89]

I think people forget that Elena's character is a naive 17 yr old teen cheerleader i think her Elena acting made sence more as an adult

[@mickcrump7799]

Nina is an amazingly good actress! The character of Elena is a bit lackluster, and she does actually change a bit in seasons 5 and definitely in season 6. Nina was able to make Katherine feel like a completely different individual than Elena, even while playing both characters. Watching both of them in a scene together, you easily forget that it’s the same actress playing both these layered and nuanced characters. And Elena did have a major tendency to be insufferable a lot of the time, but I contribute that to the writing, bc Nina always did the best with the material she was given, and I will openly admit that she has brought me to tears multiple times during her time on the show. The episodes where she turns her humanity on and when she turn it back on are heartbreakingly amazing. I think Matt, Jeremy, and Tyler were mostly eye candy, but the rest of the cast was rather solid in the acting department, even Enzo was capable of breaking my heart at times.

[@ClearKnowingFeelingHearing]

@@mickcrump7799 “eye candy” lol, my eyes skipped right over them and went directly to Nina and Kat 🥵🔥 but I guess they looked ok... for guys. If any guy looked REALLY good, it was definitely Damon imo

[@mewdreamer]

As someone who never saw The Vampire Diaries, I really thought that you were joking when you said that the series glorifies the Confederacy, so it was a weird feeling when I realized that it was not a joke. That scene of Bonnie smiling while they were dressing up as Confederate soldiers was so uncomfortable, especially with how her actress was treated on and off the set too. Matt Davis sounds like a huge racist creep too.

[@shanouboubou]

Matt Davis was so freaking weird to Kat Graham. I'm so glad he, Julie Plec and Caroline Dries are finally being called out. It's been years and I'm glad their past actions are catching up to them.

[@burrito2526]

@ThatImmortalMofo Did you even watch the video? He did more than just act ‘weird,’ he comes across as a bigot lmao. Obviously that person just said ‘weird’ to sum up everything.

[@trinityolusola394]

@@burrito2526 some people make excuses for bad people bc they know what they would be called out if their opinions and actions were exposed.

[@SnowAngelLunar]

Matt Davis was also incredibly creepy towards the young ladies of Legacies making remarks about their bodies. His Asian rant made things uncomfortable for Kaylee Bryant, who is half Asian. The screen time with the actresses who play his daughters were significantly cut in the latest season. It was obvious that they didn't want to work with him. Kaylee would end up leaving show while Matt Davis' creepy ass stayed.

[@vxjinin]

Sounds like? Babe he is a creep. Matt seems so freaking problematic.

[@mw5218]

Nina was actually the only actress that was similar in age to her characters, as she was 19 at the time of the first season, making her only 2 years older than her character

[@Kitty-t7h]

And the actor who plays Jeremy,he was only around a year older than nina!

[@mw5218]

@@Kitty-t7h yeah, but his character was supposed to be 14, so I'd say that age difference might be 'the worst' as he really looked anything but 14 haha

[@yourbabytee]

I like the fact that Katherine’s whole purpose was to give Elena to Klaus as a gift which is why she made Tyler become a werewolf and turned Caroline into a vampire

[@reizak8966]

I agree with you on Bonnie and Damon and the platonic friendship point. As a female with a lot of male friends, it's nice to see two people bond and not just see each other as a possible love interest. Bonnie was definitely still done dirty in every other aspect of the show. Edit: Yes, I know NOW that the reason for Bonnie and Damon not being together is due to racism from the writers, but at the time of watching the show I didn't know anything about what was going on behind the scenes. Knowing it now has completely ruined the show and I feel terrible for Kat Graham that she had to put up with so much BS on a regular basis.

[@a.d.e.l.s]

Yes, I love platonic friendships between different genders and it’s so rare in tv series like this. I actually wasn’t the biggest fan of Steroline either, I always loved their friendship and the relationship felt kind of forced to me. I know lot of people ship them but for me it just didn’t work at all.

[@beatm6948]

@@a.d.e.l.s "sounds like a disease"

[@beatm6948]

I absolutely adore them. I understand why they weren't a couple, and I don't like the why of them not being a couple, but I really appreciate a friendship like that, especially in a show so bent on shipping ppl together all the time. You know which episode is the one I've watched multiple times? The one where Damon and Bonnie get trapped in the thing with Kai. Making pancakes.

[@sarasthoughts]

The literal only reason why they were not paired together is that the actress is black. Come on.

[@Lara-we1ww]

they had insane chemistry and were better than delena lmao the only reason they didnt get together is because julie is a rac*st ass

[@Inlongrunwearealldead]

Ian Somerhalder and Robert Pattinson were so much aware about how messed up their character were . Both vampire diaries and Twilight were written by women and it's the male actor who have to tell them that the character they are supposed to present as heroes were toxic and messed up.

[@mariem8705]

Thank you, for calling out Julie plec and Damon’s abuse of Caroline, I can’t believe some of these fans just excuse his behavior. Smdh.

[@thomasraines1396]

It’s even more fucked up that Caroline just has to constantly deal with the fact that her former abuser is always around and they end up giving her some weird ass “frenemies” dynamic with him.

[@redwitch95]

Hell, even when Jenny Nicholson covered the show, she was like "well at least a female producer got to keep control of the series for its whole runtime". Like... she literally mentioned how racist the show was to Bonnie and the Romani (making them the fucking villains of a whole season and introducing them with a goddamn slur), but somehow it's *empowering* that Julie Plec was in charge? And that's just in the in-show stuff.

[@catharinrin]

@@redwitch95 Not going to lie Jenny Nicholson is lowkey racist and it kinda breaks my heart as someone into theme parks. One of my mutuals on twitter pointed out that she lied about a quote from the guy who played Finn in Star Wars, and not only did she block them. She blocked every single person who followed them. I didn’t even like the tweet my mutual made (which was extremely mild criticism) but later that day I was blocked too.

[@rahbeeuh]

@@catharinrin wait, what? She lied about John Boyega?

[@catharinrin]

@@rahbeeuh she posted a fake sc of john boyega talking abt reylos which was being shared around the sw fandom and jenny refused to delete the tweet when people informed her it wasn’t real, people were initially polite but she started blocking and then it got nasty fast it’s like she blocked everyone who even mentioned the controversy happened

[@thisguy8106]

I think it speaks volumes that Julie got attached to sooo many characters... But not a single black character.

[@red_agent3921]

Right that’s what I was thinking

[@yourgirljoyce4559]

Very true!

[@n1k3il46]

and its so werid how bad she treated bonnie and the amount of times she let her die

[@elisa9992]

What about marcel?

[@shinikoa]

isnt bonnie black?

[@hopemikaelson9990]

Nina played Elena, Katherine, Tatia and Amara perfectly. She is an insane actress, so talented, brilliant. She was the only reason I watched this show.

[@star0nyx]

Wow usually people say they hate her! It's nice seeing other views

[@Lonii04]

@@star0nyx like Nina as an actress and most characters... but haaaate Elena xD fucking annoying

[@Dariusvoice]

Agreed ✅

[@agatha1812]

loved her too!! didnt like season 7 and 8 without her

[@AriesGirl7719]

@@star0nyx For me, it was Elena that I didn’t like. Nina is excellent and did a great job with her doppelgängers.

[@phoenixdzk]

I lived to hear both FSN & Jenny Nicholson's 2.5 hour takes on a show I've never seen. Double screening while working is the best

[@Blindinglights25]

Jenny's Video is a Masterpiece

[@trinaq]

Seconded, I've never really watched this show, but I'd drop everything to watch Jenny or Ninja's takes.

[@JorgeLRojas-95]

Hell yeah brother

[@PerpetuallyDaydreaming]

I was literally watching her video for the 28th-ish time when this popped up

[@edgarallenhoe3518]

I watched her video twice when it first came out, then binged the entire series bc panini just so I could go back and watch her video some more.

[@thelemonoftroy]

I feel like the writers kept explaining away Bonnie’s powerful spells as “it almost kills her to perform these so she can conveniently only do it once in the entire show”

[@alexciad3741]

yess it was so annoying! they could’ve done SO MUCH with her since she’s supposed to be one of the most powerful witches in that universe

[@freddierodriguez3036]

Bonnie was my favorite. I cried several times because of her. I watch anything with Kat because of her.

[@Darlene-k2e]

The Originals do have daylight rings. Rebecca explains that to Elaina when she tells her how they were transformed. There’s a scene when Rebecca first received hers and she walks outside with her hand stretched in front of her to show her ring off.

[@siiri2052]

the most disturbing thing about this show was the southern belle theme. i mean, poofy dresses is all fine and well, but what about the slaves being murdered out back? that's not a 'wholesome' time in history. the whole series has a giant elephant in the room screaming to be addressed. this seems to be the main reason why the bonnie character was never properly written, because exploring her family history and her relationship with the town's 'culture' would have forced the writers to address the white characters in a less self-indulgent way.

[@Itszahia]

Exactly

[@Jae.Edmond]

OMG yes!

[@arabellasterwerf7980]

Agreed!

[@thecavalieryouth]

The most honest thing said and written in this show is when, after Tyler asks about the little houses/structures around the Lockwood property, his mom says, "no-one really likes to talk about the old slave days". And that's honestly the only answer I needed: we don't like to acknowledge or talk about the racial implications of Katherine having a black "handmaiden", or Bonnie only serving a purpose when the whites need their messes cleaned up, or... you get what I mean, it's endless.

[@aanyamallick7747]

@@thecavalieryouth exactly, my girl is a boss, she ain't no mammy

[@zgunderson90]

I think Bonnie and Damon having a plutonic relationship was needed amongst the constant romances in the show and to show how much Damon cared about Bonnie despite not being romantically interested only added to how awesome Bonnie was, and how human Damon can be and that he wasn't only concerned about Elena. Despite the later seasons being weaker than the first seasons, I think setting this Damon and Bonnie best friend relationship up was one of the best things from that point going forward in the show

[@angelaholmes8888]

I love damon and bonnie friendship

[@diegojose4173]

What is a "Plutonic" relationship?

[@sofiadeliz1935]

they end up together in the books

[@fariaalam2521]

I completely agree.

[@hadrianhexe9603]

They could have easily had that relationship with anyone else but purposely chose Boonie to be the one who Damon for some reason, doesn't want to be with...........

[@isthatlis]

the whole arc about Caroline carrying the new Gemini twins and then raising them with Alaric... it was weird as hell to me... like Alaric basically being a primary "parental figure" for the Mystic Falls teens then getting his former student to magically transfer his kids out his dead wife and help raise them? and have a slight romantic arc in a weird gross way? no. no. and no. that should have never left the writing table. i thought seasons 7-8 was a fever dream tbh. the writers started throwing out all of the logic around season 3/4. the Elena and Jeremy 'Kol kill', the Silas plot, why Klaus didn't find the doppelganger of Stefan's time, the older = stronger rule, Jeremy being a hunter, why Matt cannot just die.

[@shaylevene6754]

Matt cannot die was a simple explanation lmfao he was Julie Plec's boyfriend lmfaoo

[@noahrobinson2687]

I'm pretty sure they did that because Caroline's actress got pregnant and they had to write it into the show. The romance was still gross tho.

[@MastarNinja]

@@shaylevene6754 Honestly, that didn't bother me that much during TVD because I somewhat liked his character, but man was that painfully true during Legacies. Really wish he had left instead of Kaylee, and I'm still convinced that the whole Limbo arc was created just so he could stick around and have something to do.

[@melissaperez5370]

The original plan was to have another actress come in and carry the twins. however that storyline was then given to Candice due to her pregnancy. They could have just have Caroline be taken by the huntress for a few episodes instead of giving her that weird storyline

[@Vosiss]

OMG ITS MAGGIE!! 1:58:55 also listening to Ian express his frustration was honestly heart breaking. I can only imagine wanting the character you love being having more growth only for the show runners to just be like "eh it is what it is" which is essentially what Julie told him. It's almost like when you're hearing the Riverdale cast express wanting their characters to grow more only for it to be a giant waste of time.

[@aesouth6397]

I never really did understand the whole “turning off your humanity” thing. Like, if they really don’t feel anything anymore, why would they even like being so snarky and mean ? Emotions are literally what drive us, if you don’t feel sadness, anger, happiness or fear, then you don’t do anything at all. You just wake up, eat, sleep (which, for vampires, is reduced to feed). Vampires with their emotions off would be problematic for the good characters only bc they would drink human blood without giving a shit, and therefore would be killing quite a lot of people. So if you look at all the “emotions off” vampire in the show, you realize that Stefan might be the most realistic one, compared to Elena or Caroline.

[@momom9547]

idk bc i havent watched this show properly at all, but wasnt caroline just living her life with her humanity off? she just wanted to be left alone. the last thing she was doing before she started being actively mean and snarky was partying. and then stefan tried to turn her emotions on and it became obvious to her that people were trying to get her humanity back (which she didnt want). like, i agree these humanity-off vampires shouldnt be how they were portrayed on the show. but at least caroline, at the start, was just going to school and trying out for an audition

[@franciscoancer2618]

I think it's because of how they think. Since a lot of people think no emotions turns you into a jerk they start acting like jerks.

[@tathow1218]

I think they tried to clean this up in Legacies by saying that your not rational with your emotions. It's more like you're hyper focus on one emotion to ignore another Ex: Legacies Hope focus on anger with her humanity off to not feel guilty for being the cause of others death.

[@aesouth6397]

@@tathow1218 I just think it’s a bad reason to have a good character suddenly become bad for no reason at all, to put more spice in the story. 😅

[@rupaIii]

i interpreted it as turning off your conscience rather than emotions

[@radwamohamed_]

I am so happy that you mentioned about Damon and how people defend his action just because he is misunderstood. He is not misunderstood they only forgive him cuz they find him attractive. This man has done the most heinous things in the show and some how people forgive him and even in the show. He barely apologises especially to Caroline. He literally killed Jeremy in front of Elena and we were supposed to root for them as a couple. Damon is a better character on his own. I feel like Elena doesn't make him a better person and I'm not blaming Elena for his actions. I'm just saying that Elena makes him lose his mind and whenever they get into an argument or breakup he causes problems and hurts Jeremy. I like him better with Bonnie whether platonically or romantically they are good for each other.

[@lenaolishevska4070]

To be fair same goes for Klaus

[@crapreact5989]

@@lenaolishevska4070 they act like him becoming a Father is an excuse at least Kathrine doesn't care and she likes being bad and doesn't make excuses for her action she's evill.

[@radwamohamed_]

@@lenaolishevska4070 I was going to mention that too but this was only about tvd. When he talks about the originals I will mention it.

[@balabanasireti]

@@braineatingcats Meh

[@Jamangel]

YEP!!!! I like too add on to this cause when Stefan did something we were supposed to go crazy and think he's the most evil guy but when Damon literally kills a pregnant woman and assaults someone we suppose too think he's just a bad boy???? I like if Damon went on his own and got help he doesn't need anyone like Elena or bon bon cause he'll just hurt them again

[@lesmortimers4791]

I always hated the age-inappropriate casting of TV shows. I remember being a 15 year old, watching all these shows and wondering why I couldn’t look like the „15 year olds“ on TV. Well, I couldn’t look like them because most of them were nearly 30. You don’t understand that as a kid, but it gives you weird inferiority issues

[@xosecox12]

Did you watch Smallville? I was in fifth grade when it came out. Tom Welling was playing a FRESHMAN in the first season. 10-year-old me really thought that’s what freshmen boys would look like….

[@MsJayteeListens]

I think it’s in the writing and wardrobe/hair and make up. Nicola Coughlin was 30 in Derry Girls but she’s dressed like a 17 year old and written like one, particularly with the way she cowers in the face of authority figures.

[@dansandersss]

well Nina was 19 years old, so yeah...)

[@leptospiroca]

bro, still is the same right now. riverdale for example. who the fuck have those abs?

[@breezy3392]

Stefan's relationship with Caroline (the friendship) and Damon's relationship with Bonnie were great.

[@katejoseph6547]

It’s funny because they let the actor who plays Caroline sing a few times in the show but Kat who plays Bonnie can also sing and play, I think a few instruments. They finally let her play guitar a bit in the last season but Enzo makes fun of her the entire time

[@fariaalam2521]

You're so right about Chris Wood's natural charisma to be able to make a character come off so well. He's so talented and underrated as an actor.

[@personafanatic4597]

if you've seen him in Supergirl, he really sells the charisma in that too. gets the short end of the stick with supercorp fans but Chris wood did such a good job on the role regardless

[@lnt305]

Chris Wood was my least favorite part of Supergirl which is saying a lot given how trash that show was, lol. Didn’t actually watch Vampire Diaries so can’t speak for that one

[@Skyismify]

​@personafanatic4597 No one watched Supergirl. Feminist propaganda is terribly overdone now. No, thank you. But Chris is freaking amazing. I've never seen him in a role he didn't nail. Brilliant actor.

[@tormu5189]

The show literally couldn’t have gone ANYWHERE without Bonnie. Her character was one of the biggest plot devices of the series and they used her as a huge cop out for poor storytelling. They constructed her as the backbone of the show but treated her with the utmost disrespect. Bonnie was the definition of the “magical n*gro” trope so that all the white characters could have a better life at her expense. She was inarguably the most important character of this show but would be conveniently written out as “visiting family” whenever her character wasn’t needed, while all the useless, white characters got to hang around THE ENTIRE TIME. I wish there had been new writers to pick up a spin-off for Bonnie where instead of GOING TO FUCKING AFRICA…(because where else to send a black character than the entire continent) she goes to Salem (a callback to season 1) to reconstruct and expand the witch lore of TVD in a new world where Bonnie gets the damn happiness and fleshed out personhood she deserved.

[@amorra6024]

💯 I agree, I would love to see a Bonnie Bennett spin off series (without Julie Plec and Caroline Dries involvement of course) that focuses on Bonnie rediscovering her magical ancestry/roots and her rebuilding the Bennett bloodline by establishing her own powerful coven of witches. Maybe something in a similar vein to the OG Charmed television series, where Bonnie reconnect with distant family relatives, learn more magic spells/potions, and fight against evil supernatural creatures.

[@tormu5189]

@@amorra6024 Yes! Would have been really cool to have black writers on a show like that where every time a black character was introduced they weren't disposed of almost immediately. I would have loved to also to see Grams as a young witch! She's talked of so highly in the first season, she's sounded like a badass and she was beloved character. The Bennet ancestry is teased as being so powerful and well known yet we barely learn anything about them. They did such a disservice to the rich history and intriguing stories of the witches on this show. So many of the vampires on this show would have also crossed paths with Bonnies ancestors (as they mention to us) which could have given an easy connection to the TVD world and crossovers. So many of the characters were so much more interesting when we saw their lives outside of Elena, especially Stefan.

[@jbabylucus1641]

She should have went to New Orleans. You see how they let witches do just about anything in the originals. Bonnie with all her power would have been perfect. And she wouldn’t have been alone in being a witch. Join up with Vincent anything more instead of just keeping her as a walking plot device

[@mariof3780]

Bonnie was annoying as fuck lol

[@audreykoskei4072]

Offended in African. 🥺

[@savana6561]

At the very least, I can say that the reason I like Kai is because he made such a great villain. It's not that he was an amazing character or anything, but he was just so fun and charismatic while feeling like an actual menace that, as a villain, it made him extremely entertaining.

[@dianaselnekovicova948]

I hated him every time I saw him on the screen because he was killing al the time someone I was literally scare of every scene with him😂😂😂 so I wold say he was good villain because he created strong emotions for me every time I saw him.

[@malin6068]

I thought Nina Dobrev did a fantastic job as an actress portraying both Elena and Katherine and I always saw it as obvious when she was playing Katherine acting as Elena. Never heard anyone complain about her acting skills. And Katherine was a beloved character, I don't think thats a controversial opinion at all. People LOVED Katherine, I think her and Damon are fan favorites along with Caroline. However, yes, there was alot of potential and things they could have done differently storywise. And I also hated the werewolves. I HATED Tyler and never understood the love interest between him and Caroline, he literally ghosted her and left her all the time.

[@RestlessChildcz]

I agree about the acting. I often forgot it’s the same actress playing them both because she was able to make them such distinct characters. The styling helped but most of the props go to Nina for that. I always saw her acting as above average in general but i guess that’s personal preference ✨

[@Nazo422]

Yeah I could tell when she was each character but imo that just made it more interesting to be watching and realize like “ OHHH SHITT WAIT THATS FUCKIN KATHERINE RUNN” 😂 props to Nina Dobrev she really portrayed the characters distinctively

[@apollomommy7364]

I love the wolves that aren't attached directly to the main story lol, like Klaus's baby mom Haley, absolutely loved her and even more so in the originals. The ones in this were all pretty lame and weak sauce compared to everyone else

[@xapokalypse]

Yeah I've never heard someone complain about her acting, only about her character - Elena ofc - being annoying

[@joshuabrough2409]

That was included because Tyler is her main love interest in the novels.

[@giorgia.m]

What I will say about the Klaus introduction was that they couldn’t find the perfect actor to play Klaus and they were stalling by having him possess Alaric until the found the right one. I agree with what you said but I’m glad they waited for Joseph Morgan instead of going with someone else!!! That could’ve ruined the character completely. Turns out that Paul Wesley actually suggested Joseph Morgan for the role. One of the best castings of the show 🖤

[@kyafilm]

I’m so glad you touched on bonnie because everything that Kat Graham went through was absolutely INFURIATING

[@Luna-The-Drow]

Didnt realise as a teen but Damon is the incarnation of pretty privilege lmao. Anyway, Bonnie's the best, Caroline is fun and I loved to see her evolution bec I felt watching the show that she was one of the only caracater to actually learn smth and evolve somehow. Just discovered your channel, love it, I'm ready to watch the Gossip Girl one now.

[@rhuonaChanel]

The casting of Damon couldnt have been more perfect, i dont think if it wasn't for Ian, the audience wont have gotten tired of his shenanigans 😅

[@jaycievictory8461]

I feel like Elena's character does change - she stops caring when innocent people die and she stops holding any kind of a moral line. All that matters is her own selfish wants, and she'll keep ppl in her life who do appalling things. That's not the case in the early seasons. She hates Damon, for example, because of how much he kills and hurts ppl. She stabs herself to try to protect others. But what good there is in her character hugely devolves.

[@Andjelka99]

Yes I liked her first 2 maybe 3 seasons. But then they destroyed her character leter on and only reason anyone survived s4 is main character plot armour

[@gm.8805]

@@Andjelka99 that’s not true. elena was selfless even after being a vampire

[@gm.8805]

elena was still a selfless and good character as a vampire. she genuinely was always a good person and wanted the best for the people around her.

[@Anas0_ali]

@@gm.8805 Damon killed Aaron and she slept with him right away. He killed his entire family and kept him alive so he could kill his future kids and anyone related to them. After finding that out, she slept with him.

[@petloverspy]

I’m a big fan of characters “regressing,” what I just hate about Elena is that the show tries so. Fucking. Hard. To tell you that she’s so good and pure. You should not need to tell your audience that if it’s true. It creates this air of a perfect mary sue around her - even though she is a pretty good, genuinely flawed character, most of the time the writers treat her like she is morally superior and above all else. It honestly ruined a perfectly good character for me.

[@jennymartin547]

It is stupid that Caroline 'dates' all the main men but Jeremy and Elijah. And insane that Damien hypnotising women for sex and food is not seen as a problem.

[@journey1998]

Damon is the worst character for me. I DO NOT like Ians acting. Its very forced

[@gallarinas]

@@journey1998 exactly

[@balabanasireti]

@@journey1998 I wouldn't say that it's forced, just that he really overreacts

[@camishavilme7402]

Can you actually see Caroline with Jeremy though? Also I can’t imagine her with Elijah too. I’m sorry but Elijah x Elena would have been something

[@GrainneMhaol]

I know right? I roll my eyes at the Elena/Damon shippers. Damon is a literal rapist, my dudes

[@tiffanywardrop]

thank u for briefly glossing over how weird it is that vampires centuries years old consistently fall for underage girls. i feel like it’s accepted by the fandom and masses because these vampires died at 17 and as such, are stuck in the body of 17 year olds forever. however, they’ve lived through WHOLE HISTORICAL EVENTS YOU’D READ IN TEXTBOOKS! it isn’t that deep, after all it’s just a show, but i still find it weird. their minds are heavily developed after spending centuries learning and adapting, they aren’t just stuck in that same 17 year old mindset where they can relate to and act like another 17 year old. a power and intelligence unbalance is definitely expected.

[@esraamohamed7551]

Agreed especially the whole damon and underage girls thing that was going on was just disgusting he wasnt even turned when he was a teenager, he was turned as a full grown man at the age of 24 /25 , and klaus who was 1000 years old with his mentality would fall for a teenage girl who was enjoying high school dances after seeing her just once , like he saw her once and decided I am going to fall in love with her

[@christophersmith3341]

Meh, It's a meaningless critique. For a centuries old vampire to desire ANY living person is creepy and inappropriate. I mean, by their very nature what vampires do is creepy and inappropriate, but just on the level of "problematic" age differences, anyone alive is far too young to be an appropriate mate for one who has lived through several major historical time periods. But it's just a fantasy for us mortals, anyway, so it doesn't matter, whether the object of desire be Mina Harker or Buffy Sommers (who, if you think about it, aren't that far apart in age). All that matters is the vampire is attracted to whatever age group is the book/movie/tv show's intended audience. For about 30 years, that audience has mostly been teenagers.

[@charadeslondon]

My favorite subversion of this trope is in the film What We Do In The Shadows. One of the vamps is still in love with an old flame who is now in her 80s I believe. Their age difference is still a lot since he's a vampire turned in the 19th century at some point, but it's handled much better and is very cute.

[@Nemamka]

This becomes funny when you think about Aragorn and Arwen's epic-mythical love from LotR.... Arwen was 2000ish years old, having witnessed AGES pass by the time Aragorn was 87, and they'd first met when Aragorn was only like, 10 or something, then he's said to have grown up with her around, in Rivendell. If fans from twitter were here, they could cancel me (and/or Tolkien, if it hasn't happened so far) for liking a ship that is super imbalanced and could potentially include so much grooming and other problematic things. H o w e v e r, neither of them age like normal humans, because neither of them _are_ normal humans. I think people deeming vampire behavior problematic are like, missing the whole fucking point. Neither Stefan nor Damon have been _human_ for 160ish years, vampires are _not_ human anymore, no matter how much they remember of their humanity and we try to moralize that in essence. It's like saying ghosts are flesh and blood just because they are still with us / visible, but no they are not human anymore, they can go through walls for christ's sake. Vampires are fantastical creatures with supernatural powers who walk the earth in their late human skin but they are not tied to the (western) world's moral code any longer. This show is fantasy for entertainment and to be judging non-human characters on a human moral scale is just... useless? I mean we keep saying they are cold blooded murderers but the line is always at 'Caroline was 17!!' :D I don't get it, and don't get me wrong, I'm against that too, like when will we finally let go of highschool stories with literal adults in it, but it raises the question of why do we humanize vampires so much, when they are just as much nonexistent as elves or the witcher or Scott Fucking McCall lmao, like I just believe these stories should be able to be consumed on a level that is distanced from ourselves, they are literally the manifestation of the distinction between chewing-gum and actual food. I do not, for the life of me, condone p*dophilia, and I agree that it's fucking stupid that anyone over the actual age of 17 would even care to look at a 17 year old girl, I just don't think of vampires as humans and I sort of don't understand why everyone does. Like yes they were human before and they can be cured (which is also stupid that it just happens like that and their 100-500 year old developed brain doesn't just melt from that but okay) but in that state they are physically something else that cannot and should not be reasoned with on the human moral level. By definition they will ALWAYS be creepy and inappropriate (p*dophilic) because they will always outlive everyone, so actually any consumer of a vampire themed narrative should be called out and condemned? Sorry for the rant, not directed at OP, this phenomena is just really interesting to me

[@FelisImpurrator]

@@Nemamka It's because apparently, fandom spaces have all decided to act like American religious conservatives and start moral panics over fiction, to the point that the nutjobs on Twitter will harass and abuse actual minors (and also adults) to avoid hypothetical imaginary harm that could, maybe, in some alternate universe, by chance, hurt fictional minors who don't exist. It's just QAnon for people with superficially progressive aesthetics. I mean that in a direct, non-exaggerated sense. Like QAnon, it's a moral crusade that has never been about protecting actual people in any way, or based on anything that exists; rather, it exists to give its participants a sense of smugly superior moral purity as they, the Good, Virtuous ingroup, combat the Bad, Morally Degenerate outgroup for the sin of not conforming. Or the sin of making them slightly uncomfortable. It's basically just a bunch of terminally online adults who really need to get laid but are too traumatized by their hyper-religious parents to go out and find other consenting adults, or terminally online teenagers who really need to stop reading stuff they don't like but are ALSO traumatized by their hyper-religious parents to understand the concept of leaving well enough alone (or who believe that demonstrating moral purity is their ticket into an exclusive social club that functions identically to every shitty high school clique in the history of the world).

[@firey171]

Regarding Bonnie, i think they missed out on a real opportunity to make Kat Graham happy and to make Bonnie's storyline realistic if they had let her wear her hair naturally during her time in the prison world in s6, especially when she was alone. Could have been a mini arc for her, realizing she didnt have to be one way for other people, and just be herself. But from everything ive heard, that wouldve been impossible.

[@avalangrin4904]

You think Kat Graham’s main problem at TVD is her not being allowed to wear her hair naturally? It’s not separating Kat from the rest of the cast in a storyline that basically isolates her, or Julie Plec killing off Kat’s character repeatedly. In fact Ian Sommerholder threatened to quit if Kat was killed off. Yeah Kat’s hair was the issue. 🤣🤣🤣

[@belladonnnaxox]

@@avalangrin4904I feel like the original poster was just saying one aspect of how they could’ve made Bonnie more interesting and realistic and you’re making fun of them for not mentioning other things. Not cool

[@avalangrin4904]

@@belladonnnaxox You know what’s not cool? Entirely missing the point. 🤨🤨🤨

[@BattleofDesires]

The thing with Damon looking for redemption, but then fucking it up and going 'Elena, I'm a BAAAAD guy, there's no saving me' got really boring really fast, cause it was repeated TOOO many times.

[@thomasraines1396]

It’s crazy.

[@youdontneedtoknowwhoiam6640]

Well, the audience liked it when Damon Salvatore was bad and when he was actively going through a redemption arc. The writers, too scared to try something new, just kept repeating this same arc over and over again... so Damon's character is just running in circles. It loses its appeal really quickly.

[@m.sshalom]

I’m in the middle of season 5 and literally wanting to rip out my hair because that’s all their relationship is. “Elena, we’re BAAAD for each other”. I can hear his voice in my head

[@meghan92385]

In Elena's defense, the biggest problem isn't that she constantly needs saved. It's the fact that Damon and Stefan never let that girl fucking breathe. She tried consistently to help in situations by herself and come up with solutions by herself but they were ALWAYS in her fucking ear telling her that she could never do anything without them and she could never leave their side. That's why I like Stefan a little more then damon in terms of relationships because Stefan let her make her own decisions more then damon did but they were both still the worst when it came to them constantly thinking they needed to make her decisions for her. People shit on her alot about how she always needed to be saved, but I think more shit needs to be thrown at them for how absolutely unnecessary their mental chokehold was on her.

[@thecavalieryouth]

This is what happens when 160-something year olds date a 17 year old girl... As much as I agree with Dylan about her, you do have a point about how much they infantilised her.

[@GomesLivArsManU]

she did the same thing to Jeremy tho, she'd tell Damon off about respecting her freedom of choice and then compell Jeremy to straight up move to a different town because "being around vampires is dangerous for him" yet she herself always hung around them just cuz she had a teenage crush

[@meghan92385]

@@GomesLivArsManU I don't think she hung around them just because she had a crush. Maybe at first but after season 1 she quite literally becomes the thing all of the bad guys need to complete their master plan. Sending jeremy away from mystic falls was her trying to protect him because she knew they would try to use him against her somehow. They didn't know he was a hunter at that point.

[@GomesLivArsManU]

@@meghan92385 in season 1 she still told Damon to compell him to forget about vicky, good intentions or not that goes against her entire speech of respecting of choice

[@meghan92385]

@@GomesLivArsManU yeah and Bonnie called her out on it. I don't agree with what she did but I understand

[@no-ll7pi]

I’m so glad you called out Elena’s character. What makes her so insufferable is her selfish hypocrisy yet the show pretends otherwise and she NEVER takes responsibility for her actions. She ruined the show for me. She serve no purpose to the story and was a nuisance

[@lenaolishevska4070]

What I hated the most is how everyone in the show loved her so much when audience couldn't stand her. Like it was the most unrealistic thing in the show

[@marypaul8004]

I got a little bit annoyed after some time that everyone would literally kill/sacrifice anyone else and their grandma (+themselves) to save her. At some point it just got too much & the irony of elena having a crisis over killing people when her actions and survival stood on a pile(!) of bodies already was soo obvious.

[@sophieamandaleitontoomey9343]

I didn't mind her that much when she was with Stefan. Then she gets with Damon and she stops being remotely likable.

[@ARKdeEREH]

​@@marypaul8004 Elena's standing as a moral person permanently ended for me when she and Jeremy killed Cole just so that his entire sire line of vampires (people that they didn't even know) would die in what amounted to genocide, just so that Jeremy's Hunter's Mark would grow so that Elena could selfishly get the cure to vampirism. Then, once Elena finally had the cure, she didn't even take it (which meant that she murdered all those people for nothing) and instead forced it on Katherine. As if that wasn't bad enough, once Katherine was severely weakened as a direct result of Elena's actions, was no threat at all, and was just trying to get away, Elena then went out of her way to try to get Katherine killed by offering her up to Silas and did in fact cause her to become mortally wounded. After all that, we are supposed to see Katherine as the villain because she passengered into Elena's body for a few weeks, which was only necessary in the first place because Elena caused the death of Katherine's body and to kill Katherine's consciousness, the so-called heroes did so by kidnapping and killing Katherine's daughter and using Katherine's dying daughter as leverage against her. Katherine was by no means perfect, but it's very easy for me to conclude that she was a considerably more moral character than Elena and her allies. She was certainly more likeable!

[@Jamangel]

She wasn't that bad too me till s4 and later on I thought people were being dramatic but lord....she's so annoying and mean at times and it feels like she doesn't even care for her friends (mostly Bonnie) they even talk abt but she never changes LMAO

[@guyr3618]

For someone who doesn't like soapy romance, it's actually impressive that you managed to enjoy this show as much as you did. Like, the heart of the show didn't even interest you, and you STILL found plenty to love in the early seasons. Wild.

[@lizzycorvus5109]

Damon is a fun character, but it would've been better for him to have one long-term face turn that sticks, because having him flip-flop makes the other characters forgiving him harder and harder to buy

[@lizzycorvus5109]

also fandom people desperately need to learn that you can find a character sexy and entertaining without defending their actions, it's fine to be horny for villains

[@LS13.]

That’s literally what makes him Him though…. As he was written both books and show. He was never meant to be a total villain, no one on this show is completely a protagonist either

[@Marcustheseer]

damon was a cool grey villain but i would never trust him i would actualy kind of dislike him for the dick moves he does,i dont get why the woman in thr show think he is alright or why female fans like him,why do these woman think asholes are hot? even friendly space ninja likes psychopaths like stefan with his humanity of or klaus,shure klaus redeems himself at the end of the originals but in the vampire diaries he is a fucked up psychopath. i gues its the darkness in humanity that some people like these charcs.

[@DemetriusTheFanatic]

@@LS13. STEFAN>

[@LS13.]

@@DemetriusTheFanatic “okay?” >

[@ndeat.5833]

I truly never hear enough people talk about how Damon is a raging predator 😭 compelling Caroline to sleep with him? R*pe. Also the way they treat Caroline??? Terrible. Clearly just because she’s “girly”, during that 2000s “not like other girls” era 😭 And the show speaks for itself when it comes to the treatment, the literal EXISTence of Black characters 😐

[@carleeelizabeth]

finally, someone acknowledging how fucking mean everyone is to caroline in season one for no reason.

[@ndeat.5833]

@@carleeelizabeth exactly!!

[@samsampleman2439]

@@carleeelizabeth Oh they have their reasons, people just seem to love to pretend they weren't valid enough to not want to deal with her 24/7.

[@FirstnameLastname-zq8oy]

@@samsampleman2439 not wanting to deal with her 24/7 and occasionally finding her annoying is VERY different to the other characters constantly belittling her, making fun of her and sometimes just being straight up mean to her face and behind her back. It is very obvious that a huge reason the other characters were written to treat her that way (especially in season 1) was because Caroline was a stereotypical girly girl, who are often portrayed as stupid, mean and annoying, ESPECIALLY in the early 2010’s era where the “not like other girls” ideology was very popular in mainstream media. Fortunately they did give her a redemption arc where she was finally treated as a valued member of the group (which is more than Bonnie ever got), however they failed to address all the horrible things the other characters did to her especially in season 1 with Damon straight up r*ping her which was completely ignored.

[@samsampleman2439]

@@FirstnameLastname-zq8oy Caroline was also belittling/making fun of people she deemed less than her, not to mention how hurtful she could be while disguising it as a 'sassy one liner'. On top of that she was incredibly nosy (which is terrible if we keep in mind how she was always revealing other people's secrets), controlling, slutshaming other girls out of jealousy, hypocritical and taking out her insecurities on Elena instead of doing literally anything else about it. And her being a stereotypical 'girly girl' was surely not the main reason she was hated, but how she acted in S1 (and later on too but it happened less frequent or the other characters were written to react to it differently than before) As for her 'redemption arc', that one was a real slap in the face for me. See, I was also insecure like Caroline and therefore related to her a great deal. But instead of having her see the error of her ways, as in acknowledge how terrible she was to Elena (and sometimes Bonnie) and talk it out, get over it and mature, the writers made her go through changes of supernatural proportions and the powers she gained made her more confident (instead of having her realize her own self-worth and apologizing to the people she's hurt bc of it) and gave her a person she can dote on to show the audience that they were wrong about her not being all that empathetic. They basically did to Caroline what they did to almost every villain on the show: give them one (or sometimes more) person to be nice to (either to gain their friendship or love and have viewers believe that 'see, they can be nice, must mean they're not so bad after all' while neglecting the character actually acknowledge their wrongdoings and show remorse for them. As for the rape in S1, how the writers dealt with it is terrible. And there are so many instances where characters are guilty of sa in this show it's wild how the Care/Damon situation seems to be the only one people focus on...but I suppose the other situations were less obvious which is why it's hard to spot (well, aside from Katherine raping Stefan, that one was exactly like Caroline/Damon, yet people still love to argue Katherine's better than Damon) Sry this got so long, had a lot of thoughts on the matter 😅

[@heavenlyfavor6723]

The doppelgänger paradox can be explained in 1 of two ways. Silas and Amara were not only children, or nature started a doppelgänger bloodline sepeately from Silas and Amara. Also for the big gap between Katarina and Elena, it can be attributed to vampirism and the spell that makes vampires partially immortal.

[@cristina5534]

If I had a dollar for the amount of times I’ve watched 2.5 hour long videos about the vampire diaries, I’d have 2 dollars, which isn’t a lot, but it’s weird it happened twice 💀

[@anjaraj]

Thats 5 hours, I think you deserve more than 2 dollars.. also if you watched the show as a teenager, I feel like we should all be refunded somehow, I can't believe I watched all of this🤣

[@annika94323]

same and now I feel like an expert on TVD when I haven't even seen a single episode of this godforsaken show

[@coldcovoi5408]

I’d have 6 dollars 😭

[@FuzaketeSatsugai]

Yesss I love the reference

[@Totoro793]

Same and I haven’t even watch more then the 3 first episodes

[@samfanhellyeah]

The way Bonnie/Kat was treated is desgusting. Ian had to threatened that he would leave if they killed Bonnie off which they still clearly kept trying to do. I only found out Bonnie and Damon get together in the books. If the show runners weren't racist assholes. I would have loved for Damon and Bonnie to get together. While Elena stays with Stafen.

[@softjytsu]

so true, I genuinely love the chemistry they had together anyways

[@Megrezz]

Fun fact, Delena was going to be book cannon, but the publisher didn't like that so they actually fired the orignal author and creator of the books and hired a ghost writer instead. Which is how we got Stelena and Bamon as book cannon. I stopped reading after the first Ghost writen book - It felt off and I couldn't tell what happened so I did some digging and discovered that the publisher had near abusive rights over LJ Smiths work, story, and characters.

[@athenajaxon2397]

@@Megrezz I actually heard the opposite, the publishers wanted the books to go more in the way of the show when L.J Smith refused that's when they fired her

[@IHARumor]

This is a direct quote from L.J. Smith: “I always fight editing. In Midnight, I had to fight to keep many Bonnie scenes in the book. I’m not at all sure they liked the things I was doing with Bonnie and Damon-they kept trying to cut such scenes. […] They want strictly Stelena books.”

[@beepboop756]

I've always thought their deep friendship was more sincere than if they would've gotten together romantically. I think it shows how much they care for each other without it being attributed infatuation. They truly love each other and their friendship is a lot sweeter than whatever else the writers would've done with a romantic relationship between them

[@Kiki-]

Honestly I would have loved a whole season where we see Elena start acting strange and pulling away from everyone for a period of time and the audience is following her notebook inner monologue but when the season ends we realise that it was katherine all along

[@magical571]

she would have to be lying in her own mind in that case for the audience not to know lol, it wouldn't be a twist, and it would beg the question, why even pretend to start as a friend and then oull away instead of the opposite, to i don't know, get closer to f them up?

[@Kiki-]

@@magical571 whenever Katherine was pretending to be elena it seemed to be for information purposes and to gain access to people she otherwise wouldn't have access to

[@fatimaolumee4517]

I agree that Elena’s character is boring and a damsel in distress but I think her character did change over the course of the show. She didn’t grow but she did regress. When she fell for Damon she started to make excuses for his crimes and it began to change her sense of morality. But what never changes is her seeing herself as the center of the entire world and her self-absorbed nature.

[@rumbabygal-5758]

"Elena is the biggest damsel in distress" You really summarized her character perfectly. Even when I loved this show in my early teen years, I found Elena sooooo INSUFRABLE. Like its always "Elena Elena Elena" its like everyone's motivations revolved around Elena and they had no individuality. That's why I was so happy when she left and I think is why I liked season 6 a lot. Because when she left, characters finally found some sense of individuality and personality.

[@samsampleman2439]

While she's one of the least powerful characters, she is still resourceful. She is clever and quick to realize relationship dynamics between people. She is a fairly good strategist, knows when to make deals and when to forgo negotiations and appeals to people when she needs to. She had several moments on the show when her simply talking to people saved not only her but her friends' respective behinds. How people fail to acknowledge that is beyond me.

[@gm6393]

Yeah and the show would always acknowledge it through the dialogue of other characters, but never remedy it. So frustrating

[@Dude-dx5ns]

You said it all. That's why Season 6 is my favourite season. I hated season 4 in particular cause of Elena

[@AngeliqueElijah]

Honestly, if they had decided to change Damon from dark to gray instead of trying to constantly make him the "good guy" it would have been better, because then they could have written him as a person who will do whatever he thinks is necessary for the people he cares about and still have him being the "bad guy" that the fans liked without constantly writing him in circles. Also, they did not only Bonnie the character but Kat the person completely wrong and it is totally unforgivable an inexcusable.

[@Fiammaaa]

The "oh hey, another black character" joke is gold 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

[@k.tempany]

I liked the magic rings aspect, it definitely brings in the witches importance but also the vulnerability of the witches

[@jedors5575]

I never knew that infamous tweet was from Julie Plec. It really goes to show why she always made Bonnie save everyone else without any concern for her own wellbeing, even on the possibility of her dying. That is simply how she sees black women, as martyrs.

[@jedors5575]

I hope Kat Graham gets a good role in show/movie. Not something corny like Honey 2 but something that really shows off her natural talent and respects her as a black character. Also I'm surprised you didn't mention that Tyler's family lives on a plantation and how they address it. I was actually baffled when I saw that scene 💀

[@daonlyboriqua11]

@@jedors5575 She does! She does some fun movies with Netflix almost every other year. I believe she has a Rom Com coming out around September on Netflix. 🥳

[@blutygar]

I really hope Kat does get better roles than this, and I hope to god that whole thing dealing with Plec didn't blacklist her in

[@Anakin737]

Julie Plec also made a tweet about the parkland shootings and it was so inappropriate. Her tweet was; “To my beloved Legacies - after the Parkland shootings, I decided I wanted to tell a story about the young heroes who would save us from ourselves. Good kids living on the fringe who ultimately were the heroes of the whole story.” She received a lot of backlash for this mainly because Legacies is a campy vampire show about magic creatures and she compared THAT to an actual mass shooting.

[@swsgrl]

@@Anakin737 what is wrong with her? lmao that's so insensitive. she's really out of touch