The weirdness of middle-aged Swifties - with Rod Liddle and Zoe Strimpel

[@jfv65]

Modern pop music is no longer counter culture like Rock 'n roll, Punk and Grunge used to be. New pop music, It's all polished commercial drab. That is how IMO Taylor Swift can appeal to young as well as middle aged people.

[@pressme71nz]

@@jfv65 was it ever? Any music that hits the mainstream has already passed the acceptability-to-the-system test. Look for true counter culture amongst the deplatformed, censored, and imprisoned musicians.

[@lordtherapeutics]

It is telling that the most irritating vacuous people at work turn out to be Swifties.

[@mikeysaint4368]

I've got one. She's thirty-three and keeps trying to convince me that Taylor Swift writes profound songs with great tunes and lyrics. I've been diplomatic and said Swift's music isn't terrible, but that I find it bland and ordinary. I'm older than my workmate and I have a high standard for what constitutes actually good music. Even that is making excuses for my workmate, because it's never been easier to explore the history of popular music and find the stuff which is actually good and great.

[@dogsenseforu301]

If a person can't turn down Taylor Swift tickets.... what other 'gifts' can't they turn down? ..... Aren't holidays, cars, houses etc even harder to turn down?

[@pepegalego]

It just highlights how professional politicians are corruptable, corrupted and corrupt. Personally, I think the Labour corruption is WORSE than the Consevative in that they have been screaming from the towers that they are the honest, transparent, good guys not like the shameful lot on the other side of the aisle. Look on the bright side, at least you aren't dealing with the sheer corruption from our President Sanchez of Spain, the Paladin of the poor and defender of honesty...his.

[@gronkmusic7973]

"The tickets were hard to turn down." That's the point of a bribe.

[@ravens-crypt]

And now you have hang up the door sign Got tickets to a concert for …. Why not until they are found out 🤦

[@chriswatts1680]

100% correct

[@Caratacus1]

I'd throw in Live Aid as well as a seminal point where after the music industry became over bloated with its own self-importance. Also it was when the suits saw the huge global reach and properly moved in, killing originality and dumbing music down into middle-of-the-road tedium. Its prime purpose was just to make them some guaranteed money and it has been ever since.

[@hangingaround2954]

I’m in my late fifties, if my late parents had shown any interest in The Smiths or Bowie or The Stranglers I’d have found other people to listen to.

[@noahdanielg]

From Henry Purcell, Lord Byron and William Shakespeare to English exams in rap. Great job Britain.

[@barekicks]

Did Zoe Strimpel go to school in Britain? Or is she talking about the US?

[@robkeeleycomposer]

Isn’t Walton’s setting of Edith Sitwell in Façade the ultimate proto-rap?

[@dannyarcher6370]

And rap isn't even native to Britain.

[@craigr4763]

​@@dannyarcher6370And yet it's a fantastic artistic medium of the English language. One of the most popular and respected, at that. So, your point is what?

[@craigr4763]

Said someone who doesn't know good artists and shamefully craps on them because it's forever been fashionable to some people. Well done you.

[@top20research]

And there was me thinking Tailor Swift was the person who made all that clobber for no-cheer Keir. Still, if you elect a Student Union as your government, this is what you get.

[@_BMS_]

In my view liking TS as a middle aged parent is a pretentious form of virtue signalling, along the lines of 'look at me and what a great parent I am.' But as RL rightly implies here, part of our childhood should be defined by how we're carving our own niche, navigating our own difficulties, forming our own views to become the independent beings we need to be as an adult. And part of that growing up problem is _precisely_ contained in emphasizing your difference from your parents. I don't want to be best buddies with my children, just like I never wanted to be best buddies with my parents.

[@andrewhotston983]

Our entire civilisation has been infantilised. Adult Swifties are just another manifestation of this phenomenon.

[@JagdgeschwaderX]

Absolutely right

[@markemarkatfb]

I guarantee someone has made a similar observation every decade since the Renaissance. In fact many people probably said it about the Renaissance!

[@andrewhotston983]

@@markemarkatfb Find me an example of someone saying the Renaissance was infantile please. But I suspect it's your comment that's infantile, thereby proving my point. You're probably a Taylor Swift fan, too!

[@markemarkatfb]

@@andrewhotston983 I'm pretty sure the catholic church weren't huge fans of the Renaissance but my latin is a bit rusty. Btw I do not know a single Taylor Swift song. Or rather I'm sure I have heard several of them, but I couldn't name a single one. My eldest daughter is only 7 though so she hasn't started disappearing into her bedroom with her iPhone and AirPods (yet!) We're still bonding over a little star that twinkles.

[@dehenry2]

Neoteny is the search term y'all are looking for

[@mickymack1230]

OH Rod thats so true what you said about teachers.For someone who spent twenty years in a school in a technical support role I can assure you, you are spot on.Teachers have a pathological desire to be LIKED by their pupils to the detriment of their education.One group of girls once confided in me that they knew how to manipulate certain teachers by chatting about certain subjects close to the teachers heart.This would ensure a period of unstructured mucking about.

[@jacksonmiked]

Every Taylor Swift song is about Taylor Swift

[@Cotictimmy]

The lady who is happy to have freedom of speech (& therefore thought) cancelled at British universities - loves Taylor Swift LOL. 🤣

[@patrickjoneill5836]

Same thing with Harry Potter, which as far as I'm aware was written for children, but loads of adults admit to reading those books. I haven't read any of them.

[@barekicks]

Harry Potter is more nostalgia-driven. It was the leading fantasy book series for my generation (millennials). By and large, people aren't re-reading the books now that they are hitting 40 or not far from it. But they have great fondness for the Harry Potter era of their lives, which would have lasted a good decade, from their teens to their mid-20s, and they are introducing their own kids to these books. I never read them because the genre doesn't entice me. But I have heard they are well-written and extremely imaginative.

[@TrumptonMayor]

Very self congratulatory of you. I regularly watch Bagpuss and Mary , Mungo and Midge so have some of that.

[@rudolfecker7691]

You sound like that Judge in the Beatles era who came out in Court with 'What are the Beetles?' No doubt you're a Tolkien fan then?

[@dellacrean3296]

I wonder if they would have been so keen had she been someone who would come out in support of Trump?

[@davidfoarde558]

You don’t even have to go that far to get your answer. Last week this very very popular young lgbtq type artist Chappel Roan had people (led by a huge part of her fan base) absolutely loosing their minds because she said “Donald Trump and the republicans are evil and horrible. I am voting for Harris but I don’t want to endorse her because I think the democrats are also doing horrible things that I dnt agree with.” So not even endorsing Trump and still voting for Harris but they lose their minds thag she won’t get on board with the show they are putting on

[@trevr10]

I'm older than Rod and while I don't get Taylor Swift I do remember what my parents used to say about the music I listened to in the 60's and 70's. Maybe it's not such a bad thing that middle-aged people enjoy the same music as their teenage children. None of us have a golden ear and have a right to say that an artist who is the 9th best selling in history, has no merit.

[@iconiclust]

Not when the music is blatant satanic influence that harms young girls and eventually culture.

[@Star-hg1kt]

Lol yeah ryt

[@eddenoy321]

release the sausages and give Keir his banger

[@FraserBailey-jm5yz]

No sausages without fire.

[@JagdgeschwaderX]

Rumour has it he's seen a fair few sausages recently

[@TrumptonMayor]

They must be unharmed and in date, nothing else will suffice.

[@TrumptonMayor]

​@@JagdgeschwaderXCheeky!!😂

[@AsurmenHandOfAsur]

It is like a Cult!

[@davidhigginbottom6190]

I bought a Swift CD to try to find out what was SO wonderful about her. I didn’t discover anything, it just increased my bemusement.

[@jackryan2135]

Her music is pretty inane.

[@AsurmenHandOfAsur]

Yeah it's all about bashing ex-boyfriends. Travis better watch out otherwise he is next !

[@trevorloughlin1492]

Next to Justin Bieber she is Radiohead.

[@claudiabailey5302]

Ed Sheeran is equally inane. How these people sell so many albums and have so many downloads is beyond me.

[@trevorloughlin1492]

@@claudiabailey5302 Ed Sheeran did show promise with the lyrically brilliant, brutal and poignant "The A team" but has degenerated to blandness, but Bieber is the musical antichrist. No comparison. As a boomer I was brought up on early and Reverberation era Bunnymen, The Chameleons and Joy Division and even the Nineties had some great electronic dance music, but the 21st century is a musical wasteland. My theory is that the neoliberal attack on social protections and consequent enslavement of the young for economic exploitation means only the wealthy can make new music. Some of the posh girls are very good, such as Rachel Dadd and her pals. As for Taylor Swift she actually can do passionate vocals and is beautiful of course but where she totally fails are in the lyrics which are about absolutely NOTHING.. I remember watching Bowie sing Star Man and thought "this is the glorious future" but the Rupert Murdoch media forced neoliberalism on us and we are now in a cultural and economic dystopia.

[@TrumptonMayor]

What is weird is middle aged men like Liddle getting worked up by it.

[@mikeysaint4368]

Sorry, Zoe, but I've never heard any rap which convinced me I was wrong about rap artists being terrible poets who have absolutely no ability to write melodies. A barrage of uninteresting words isn't an artistic statement.

[@ZeppoM]

Dessa - Matches to Paper Dolls There is good stuff but its just hard to find when all mainstream airtime is given to Taylor Swift type rubbish.

[@billyliar1614]

At one time the masses worshipped pharaoh, then it was (fill in the religious blank), now it's Taylor Swift. I don't want to consider what might come next.

[@IANBryant-eb9bw]

If you are going to get freebies then make it something good rather than overpriced tickets for an overated popstar...

[@davidriggs1470]

Swift never heard her stuff but a mystery.I’m happy listening to Four Tops.

[@dannyarcher6370]

Almost everything since 2004 has been shit.

[@craigr4763]

Yeah, actually, you're not far off with 2004. I can think of some really good albums from that year, but less from the years thereafter. Not that there isn't still great music being made.

[@dannyarcher6370]

@gissellest333 90s was peak Western civilisation. But there was still good stuff in the early 00s.

[@pepegalego]

I have recently listening to Muse 2006-2008 --very good. If you want a date; Napstar destroyed everything.

[@clemfandango619]

I'd say 2011. That's when new music started sounding very dull to me.

[@kandilula]

My 20yo son barely listens to anything past the early 2000s except for DNB. Both kiddos wish they were born at least 20 years earlier.

[@CUMBICA1970]

I don't know a single TS song (until recently I really thought "Cowboy Casanova" was hers oh plz don't kill me Swifties) but I kinda get why she's become so galactic popular. Even in my native Brazil. It's not about her music but her image. She's shiny, she's got a superb persona, and most importantly, she's didn't wh@re down like Miley Cyrus! So fine with me she's the establishment. Besides we'll always have Paris (in my case meaning Beatles, Prince, Metallica, P!nk, Green Day and on.) PS. Seriously if she was Barbie that movie would have earned a 100 billion haha.

[@SexRealityBites]

There is nothing more going on here than a legitimately talented woman attracting a new fan base based on her music coming from a more mature place. She’s just better now. Taylor Swift is 34, but because of her gift of musical talent, writing and storytelling- and how long she has been honing her craft (she’s prolific) she makes music that appeals to people in their forties or older. Her music spans multiple decades. Little kids like her older stuff that she wrote when she was little best. Older people like her newer stuff that she’s written as a woman. If you gain new fans with every album, the more albums you have the more popular you get.

[@iconiclust]

Yeah but she uses her influence to promote satanic witchcraft and poisons young girls minds making them become miserable and broken.

[@barekicks]

She's gifted but the music is still empty. Like, don't get me wrong, I occasionally listen to it and it's super catchy but it's crass to obsess over it.

[@yvonnelas2969]

There is help available when you are ready to leave the cult.

[@SexRealityBites]

@@yvonnelas2969 It would be much appreciated if you wouldn’t misuse or overuse words like “cult” as they have a very significant and important meaning. There are some incredible documentaries out there on cults that I would highly recommend. Survivors of real cults are legitimately inspirational and important people. They don’t deserve to have their experience cheapened.

[@SexRealityBites]

@@barekicks It’s empty to you, that’s okay. It has no meaning to you. I feel that way about many musicians, filmmakers… authors. Not all storytellers resonate with every one. That’s what diversity is all about.

[@renshiwu305]

Just like contestants on Reality TV dating shows shouldn't be allowed to breed, Swifties shouldn't be allowed to vote.

[@patricka.crawley6572]

The parents are old as they are seeking no new experiences, Just a regurgitation of their earlier years. The children are old as they're in the same mindset as their old parents.

[@davidbarry6900]

I'm not a Swiftie, but from the ads that I have seen, her shows are spectactular. She is an embodiment of an aspirational hope that yes, some young people CAN do very well in life - AND look great AND be nice people - so no wonder that some people adore Swift. Honestly the initial descriptions put forward in this piece sound a lot like jealousy in action... As for anyone wondering why middle-aged people should listen to Swift, couldn't you say the same for Mozart's music, much of it written and performed when he was very young and a similar teen star in the big city at the time? We simply don't know which of today's pop music will really be appreciated and last over the next century.

[@tolhumexy6706]

Last Beyonce album was probably her worst. But it was influenced by 'old' country. Maybe that's why Ros likes it.

[@JonFrumTheFirst]

"I can't imagine why anyone would like music I don't like!" "I'm so superior to those foolish women!" "Why did Tom Cruise play a pilot? He's not really a pilot!" Personally, I can't imagine why anyone cares about another person's taste in entertainment. Other than to signal some sort of tired superiority.

[@tanyahotchkiss5403]

Zoe sounds a lot like she hasn't actually listened to any songs of Taylor Swift's since her early albums, that were written when she was a teenager. She is 34 now, her music covers a far more mature view of how it feels to have a long term relationship end when marriage and children were discussed. She also looks at how her relationships have changed her over time, how she wonders if she will ever find that love. Her muse is her broken heart in many ways. But she covers topics such as her mother's illness, the damage of fame, the loss of friendships, existential questions about the self. Frankly, as a 33 year old mother, I won't let my children listen to half the songs on folklore, evermore, midnights and her latest album because the topics are far too mature for them. So, it doesn't surprise me that her more mature music has brought in older fans that allow them to reflect and reminisce on their own experiences. Women and girl's stories are important and she has done a great job advocating for that through her music throughout her career. There is a lot to relate to no matter your age because she has been in the industry for 20 years and has such a huge volume of work.

[@llengsuch3426]

When I was fifteen I would have been able to tell you the current Top Ten, and could list the entire Radio 1 schedule. Now I could not tell you a single song by Taylor Swift or that other one - the ginger bloke. And that seems fine to me. I'm a grumpy old geezer now who never listens to pop radio and has no interest in it. I was amused/irritated by the furore about people scrambling to get Oasis tickets recently. You would have to pay me to go. Although I saw them twice nearly thirty years ago. Sometimes I think rock n roll is coming to the end of its run. We still have old men performing: Rolling Stones, Iron Maiden, Take That etc. But in another 10 - 20 years rock n roll will probably be a relic of the past. like music hall. An it its place there will be AI generated holograms of Elvis singing with Sinatra.

[@GrahamSouthorn]

All good points. The reason for the lack of bands, in my opinion, is economics. It's easy (if you are musical!) to create music on your own computer, and if you sing you can add all the backing. No need to hire an expensive rehearsal studio. There's less money to be made from music nowadays and a lot more competition, and income does not have to be shared out between band members. If you are already a "name" band like the ones you mention, you can make a lot of money from touring. For new bands it must be extremely hard, not least due to petrol/hotel/ costs which have shot up. And all the technicians and stage hands you have to hire don't come cheap.

[@colinmacdonald5732]

Your comment has prompted me to look at the UK top 10 the week I was born 57 years ago... I can recognize 7 of them. I doubt if I'd recognize any of last week's top 10. Go further down the charts you'll "Pleasant Valley Sunday", "Massachusetts", "Love is all you need".

[@offshoretomorrow3346]

The number of bands that get into the top 10 has crashed to almost zero over the past decade.

[@AsMr-km6ex]

I’m nearly 41 and i love taylor. She started making hits when I was 23 and I’ve loved her music since then. Her songwriting is second to none and she writes about heartbreak in a beautifully poignant way. Lots of artists write about their past relationships and draw on life experiences for their creative output. I absolutely hate her support for the transgender agenda and I like her despite her leftiness. The Taylor bashing is so foolish. People think they’re far too cool to like pop music. That’s what’s weird.

[@silviariver718]

It's perfectly understandable that a 41 years old loves a 35 years old's music. She's almost your age.

[@farty81]

​@@silviariver718newsflash: lots of 40-somethings have kids who like Taylor Swift independently of their parents, who also like Taylor Swift.

[@silviariver718]

@@farty81 Seriously that's newsflash for you?😆😆

[@farty81]

@@silviariver718 No....I'm making the obvious, but seemingly not apparent to the likes of Rod and Zoe, point that Swift appeals across lots of generations because she's great at what she does - tell stories through song.

[@greengrin9401]

denigrating popular artists to get clicks is always a good strategy

[@PhilipRobinson-l9p]

I'm 65, I've 4 daughters. None of them are interested in Taylor Swift. But I love Taylor's music. I rarely listen to anyone else nowadays.

[@huyhritter1724]

I love the grounded reality of this channel!!! Retirement took a toll on my finances, but with my involvement in the digital market, $47,000 weekly returns has been life changing. AWESOME GOD❤️

[@KuramaUchiha-id1ow]

Massive! Been trying to trade on my own for a while now, but it isn't going well. few months ago I lost about $8,500 in the trade. Can you please at least advise me on what to do?

[@huyhritter1724]

@@KuramaUchiha-id1owMaria Angelina Alexander I really appreciate her efforts and transparency.

[@huyhritter1724]

Giving her my initial savings of $12,000 to invest in a brokerage account was a turning point in my life. It's been an incredibly rewarding experience and the best decision I ever made!

[@amalmberg13]

This is a definition of God's unending provisions for his people. God remains faithful to his words. I receive this for my household.🙏

[@OliveBond]

YES!!! That's exactly her name (Maria Angelina Alexander) so many people have recommended highly about her and am just starting with her from Brisbane Australia.

[@tigersforever4577]

It is so true: this obsession with being friends with children, and it serves neither child bor adult well.

[@jae2686]

Swift is a nice person, and she’s obviously very savvy in promoting herself, she’s a billionaire! However, it can’t be too satisfying for her to be middle aged whose only appeal is to teeny boppers and parents who are wanna be teeny boppers. She’s 34-years old after all.

[@Bostronix]

Why can’t we analyze political policies rather than what concert a politician goes to?

[@evelyneverettgreen]

Women old enough to be her mother going to see Taylor Swift, who herself is a woman in early middle-age who writes songs that you might guess were written by, and share the preoccupations of, a teenage girl. Our society seems to celebrate immaturity, and people simply refuse to grow up.

[@craigr4763]

Disrespect towards "rappers" is so old fashioned and out of touch. It's a clear display of ignorance and there's nothing charming about it unless your thing is being part of the 1% of grumpy old people that hold on to things like this. You can easily cherry pick some terrible artists that are rappers and claim it's all crap, but why this ignorance/discrimination is more forgivable than any other is beyond me. Rap's been around for decades now and there is an abundance of globally-respected artists. I do like Rod Little, but he's not even a better writer than an artist like Mach-Hommy ("rapper"), for example, and he should humble himself.

[@waterboys3001]

I am 67. People are trying to stay younger for longer and they often appear ridiculous. I collected Marvel and DC comics from 9-11 and then moved into novels. My daughter and her husband both have degrees but have not yet outgrown comic book culture. I find that odd. My parents hated the music I listened to in the 1970s. I still listen to Tales from Topographic Oceans by Yes, it is a brilliant piece of music. I also like Jazz and 20th-century classical music. In writing Tales, Jon Anderson was influenced by the Autobiography of a Yogi by Paramahansa Yogananda. Steve Jobs re-read the book every year and attendees at his memorial service were given a copy of the book. Rod is a snob but knows bugger all about music and Eastern philosophy. I saw Yes headline at the Reading Festival in 1975. Nobody was older than 23 and it was school and college kids. These days, fat, balding blokes dressed like teenagers attend festivals. Music has been dumbed down since the 1970s.

[@stevehill4629]

@waterboys3001 As a 68 year old l remember the music of Yes and other progrock bands. In all honesty, l didn't get it then, and l still don't. A lot of my mates loved them, l tried to get into the music, but it just didn't move me. Having said that'll the music of that era was phenomenally good and widely varied. There was something for everyone, and l didn't feel we were being manipulated by record companies. Rod Liddle, a snob? Stop it!

[@RidleyHolmes-sr2tw]

It's like when a 60-year old man writes you an email and writes OMG. Cringe.

[@markemarkatfb]

It's always good to hear people who describe themselves as libertarian telling me what I should or shouldn't enjoy. I only hope that I'll grow up to be as happy, healthy and fulfilled as Mr Liddle clearly is (he's less than 10 years older than me but in his mind he seems to be everybody's cranky old uncle.)

[@joanr3189]

There is a lot of speculation here about “why?” moms join their teens celebrating as Swifties. Did anyone ask the moms why they joined the groupies in this phenomenon? When Elvis hit the screen, my teen friends gave in to hysteria; I didn’t then,, and didn’t later. I am still not sure why I resisted the pop craze.

[@samnicolson1197]

How do kids stuck living with their parents into their 30s rebel against their parents? It's better to enjoy the same music or spend endless hours wearing headphones

[@alisonstuart2784]

Adult swifties are bad enough. Even worse are grown ass people going to Harry Potter World and having Harry Potter weddings.

[@Nameless-lk8ld]

Taylor is actually very talented. And I am way too old to be a swifty. What? Katy Perry deserves an Oscar? Miley is a poet? Ridiculous.

[@aloisraich9326]

Its just pop culture, there is no depths in this, No authenticity, little meaning, no edges, exactly that's why she is so attractive. Parents going with their kids to a concert, is cute.

[@tomjarvis5918]

50 yr old straight white male gen xer.. i listen to classic rock. I never listened to Taylor Swift, and i generally have your opinion on the content of her songs. My introduction to Taylor Swift was the Eras tour movie. I actually thought it was a good show - my mother loved song and dance. So, as a cultural thing, Taylor Swift-like performers have always existed... the difference today is the viral nature of modern media and the royalty-like reverence given to pop culture icons

[@tolhumexy6706]

I've no time for Harry Potter but millions of adults do. So what? They can enjoy whatever music they like and she is a cultural phenomenon. Would Rod rather see the Cabinet at a Slipknot gig?

[@incurableromantic4006]

There's nothing wrong with older people wanting to feel young again for a bit - but it's a problem when they start basing their political judgements around the same kind of youthful naiveite.

[@AncientYouth64]

Parasocial relationships are a sign of low intelligence and a weak mind

[@paulwary]

I’m old, and really don’t get TS, but I do like Billie Eilish

[@egertonmark]

😂

[@FraserBailey-jm5yz]

Actually, some British rock/pop/new wave music has been genuinely serious. I would give you the band Magazine, for instance. And I have no problem with Dylan having been awarded the Nobel Prize. There is more to his lyrics than there is to the books of most novelists.

[@1800astra]

"Backstreet Kids" Lol!

[@almcdonald8676]

Swift makes catchy tunes with fatuous lyrics and most of all claims that trump and conservatives in general give her the ick which I suspect is like catnip for a certain subset of our citizenry

[@freebornjohn2687]

You have to be pretty out of it for Trump not to give you the ick - the most disgusting loathsome corrupt creep that ever walked the earth.

[@justmemimi7338]

After the Labor government in Victoria (Australia) cancelled hosting the commonwealth Games, then-Premier Dan Andrew’s announced that Taylor Swift was going to perform in Victoria. Was that supposed to be a consolation prize? Frankly, neither interests me. But what astonished me, was seeing middle-aged politicians singing along to her songs at the concert! What is it with leftist politicians and the pretty but painfully shallow Taylor Swift? I despair at the dumbing-down of western culture.

[@clemfandango619]

Starmer is way past middle age - he's only a few years off the pension!

[@N_Loco_Parenthesis]

When Neil Young sang 'I am a child...' I don't think he anticipated what was coming. [13:14]

[@robkeeleycomposer]

It saddens me that such brilliant, clever people like Zoe and Rod waste time with relatively trivial, ephemeral stuff instead of engaging more with classical music that has lasted for centuries. Glad that Zoe mentions Schubert. Of course, a love of classical music is no guarantee of good morals.

[@williamvorkosigan5151]

Hearing Paul Wood siding with terrorists on the most recent Spectator Out Loud was repugnant. How was he allowed to do this? The "Targeted attack" on Hezbollah pagers was more targeted and with less collateral damage than any entirely lawful attack carried out by the UK or the US. Yet he bemoans that some "innocent bystanders" were injured. He declares that Hezbollah complying with a UN resolution that they withdraw from the Israeli border would be entirely unreasonable. He talks of Israel opening a second front as though Hezbollah had not opened that second front with its continued raining down rockets on Israel. A complete disgrace Spectator. Are you becoming the Guardian?

[@ChrisVaughan-gj7ve]

It exposes the childish, empty, thick, dumb, silly nature of our times. Also in the next king’s Speech can we make it a criminal offence for anyone over the age of 13 to play video games. Ideally life or worse.

[@willdon.1279]

The civilized world if falling about our ears, with us fighting each other supporting death (and other looney) cults, orchestrated by a Voldemort cyberwar maestro - and we're in a lather about trivialities... 😞While preferring Opera and classical music - there is much to enjoy in wider range - and Ms Swift seems a needed spreader of joy, fun, (+ plain decency) in a world driven by cynical, sneering, hate. And instant condemnation of many trying to grapple with my first concerns.

[@markhutton6055]

No one who listens to Taylor Swift is fit to tell anyone what to do.

[@dannyarcher6370]

Sausage Lives Matter!

[@williamvorkosigan5151]

We are clearly in late civilisation. The sad thing is that those with power seem entirely oblivious to this fact. They do nothing to turn back the tide. They embrace the decline, enthusiastically powering it on with no idea that on the other side, life will be increasingly grim for them. They can not forever avoid the consequences of what they do. While the working class might suffer first and most, it will come to them. For them the decline will come gradually, then suddenly. They may get a brief moment to regret their contribution to the fall of western liberal democracy, but perhaps for less time than the working class do. Once in control, the barbarians always come for the rich and formerly powerful first.

[@GrahamSouthorn]

Live and let live, you know? I find it strange why people love watching Formula 1. But I don't bother about it - just let them get on with it. If the issue is politicians getting free tickets then, no, they shouldn't accept them.

[@AB-zv6dz]

Shes good at what she does, but lets not pretend like she hasnt been pushed and publicised aggressively by every media outlet for years. Up to the point now where shes even getting publicity from Keir Starmer himself with this issue over tickets. Shes good at what she does, but why she was chosen to as the golden child I have no idea. Probably because she is extremely corporate and commercially minded and does exactly what her handlers tell her, there are few other performers who agree to fly around the world all years doing hundreds of almost back to back performances. Not to take away her ability to do that which is impressive. But I think shes so popular for that reason - she has an unrivalled ability to lay golden eggs for her handlers and they reward with everything they can. She literally could not be more corporate and mainstream and thats why she has so many advantages.

[@dannyarcher6370]

There is one Taylor Swift song that should be required listening to all young guys: Blank Space. Borderline Personality Disorder. Stay AWAY.

[@WarmProp]

Music for people that aren't into music but want to be part of a crowd.

[@edbop]

These guys are clearly Coldplay fans and similarly still wet the bed. Pop music is for kids and teens, always has been, still occasionally a good tune comes out of the genre.

[@nigelpotter7195]

My god, my memory of concerts of smoke-filled theatres and the joints being passed from hand to hand or a quick smoke in the toilet.

[@tolhumexy6706]

BTW My Chemical Romance were emo bandwagon jumpers.

[@markharris1223]

I am well beyond the first flush of youth, so I have no idea who or what Taylor Swift is. My age, however, permits me not to care tuppence.

[@winstonschwarz1636]

If you read Rod's music reviews his personal musical taste is a great example of stunted growth. He's an old man listening to the sounds of his youth. This Swifty bollocks is all just a PsyOp.

[@Anne_Onymous]

I just can't bring myself to criticize someone for the type of music they like. The NPCs find her tunes "catchy" and like to be part of the "in group" so are very drawn to her 🤷‍♀️

[@martynsimpson510]

Sorry but whilst I don't fawn over Swift I do recognise that she is talented and her work is often excellent. There is a deep point about parenting in this discussion but Taylor Swift bashing isn't needed ..unless it is to criticise her politics ..then it's fine.

[@aaronsmyth7943]

Or is that you're just bitter because you wouldn't fit in? Seems that way. Imagine Liddle and Strimpel at "Glasto", with their box of wine and sour bakes?

[@Bobmudu35UK]

I'd disown my kids if they were into Taylor Swift. My eldest is in to anything from Ed Sheeran and the rapper Dave to Led Zeppelin and Louis Armstrong,my youngests (22) taste is so eclectic its hard to work out. I heard him listening to a band called The Decemberists about a whale and revenge or something,then Oliver Anthony a country music musician. I think they'd disown me if I wanted to go to a concert with them! 😊

[@kandilula]

TBF we've taken our kids to concerts but they were metal, rock or DNB. I did succumb to taking my daughter to Billie who actually has some talent, but I draw the line at the utter inanity of TS.

[@greengrin9401]

theyre trying so hard to have a unique analysis that they miss the straightforward explanation. taylor is a transcendent unicorn artist who appeals to both kids and adults. if you disagree and think another can be produced anytime feel free to launch a new singer and see it she resonates the same way.

[@TrumptonMayor]

Liddle is just a boring old fart who smokes, that is literally who he is . The poor man's Clarkson.

[@farty81]

Correct.

[@brekerr]

rod liddle doesn't seem to know what modern education is like. difficult to take him seriously when he gives forth on a topic and get it completely wrong. the emotion support schools give is nearly always on serious issues like death, sickness and mental health. to trivialise looking after this part of a childs life undermines what ever point he thinks he is making.

[@dandilion62]

I've never been so glad to be old!!!! (68)

[@johnwebster6360]

40 Greatest Hits... Rod it's 12 Gold Bars 😂

[@stevehowell231]

A bit like Harold Wilson sneaking in to see Alma Cogan.

[@farty81]

Genuinely surprised at Liddle's ignorance around Swift. She's a musical titan whose writing captures the imagination of millions. She's the exact opposite of vacuous. If there's going to be an artist that follows Dylan to a Nobel prize, it'll be Taylor Swift. And I say this as someone who agrees with Liddle that Neil Young's Tonight's the Night is one of the greatest rock albums ever made.

[@yvonnelas2969]

The Taylor Swift thing reminds me of the Wiggles - not particularly good but because every single normie in the world must have it these performers become insanely rich. People really are dumbed down masses of sheep.

[@davidfoarde558]

The funniest thing I heard (and I’m sure lots have made this joke by now) was when she made this big statement after the US presidential debates saying she was endorsing Kamala Harris in her race against Donald Trump. It was clearly planned to come out right at that time and she had a picture of her with her cat (which has a whole subtext) and telling everyone to go vote for Kamala. So some people were making the quite astute observation that why would you take advice from a woman who has built her entire career off of writing songs about how she always chooses the wrong man Now whatever your politics that is just a hilarious observation. We know your track record taylor

[@farty81]

The cat picture was from her Time shoot. It wasn't planned for the Harris announcement.

[@davidfoarde558]

@@farty81the timing of the post was planned to come out right after the debates..and she obviously didn’t write that post off the cuff. Adding the picture of her with her cat was a clear reference to Vance saying something on a podcast (from like 3 years ago) about how having children and a family changes you in a way where you care about the future differently and make different choices and he said something like the reason we have a lot of the problems we do is because you have all these childless cat ladies who are disproportionately activists and they don’t have the same type of investment on the future….Thats from memory so probably got some stuff wrong but that was the gist and the left used this as the #1 thing to attack him about when he was first picked. I’m not trying to comment on the politics of any of this just giving the story….but the photo was à alluding to that attack, it doesn’t matter when she took it. Lastly I feel weirdly compelled to say I’m actually pretty positive on Taylor swift and I do line a lot of her music and I think there is stuff to analyze there but won’t go into all that. But she’s been so so public this last year and she already was very prevalent…people are getting tired of her, people who normally would not have any opinion

[@farty81]

@@davidfoarde558 I know the Vance reference, don't worry. Of course, he was making a far more nuanced point about the state not supporting those starting families, but that got lost in the noise. I don't think it was particularly contrived. She watched the debate and then decided to post. It was hardly a great surprise, given that she posted the Biden/Harris cookies she cooked 4 years ago. You should view Swift positively - she's amazing, whatever her politics :-)

[@davidfoarde558]

@@farty81​​ I thought they were cupcakes for Biden 😂 and yea I was just trying to give context I don’t know where you or other commenters are from and since this is a British podcast I didn’t want to assume everyone knows all the details of our election drama….although it’s probably a safe bet they do. I think we are in almost total agreement only I am more cynical, I would say the nuance and context of Vance’s overall point was intentionally buried in the noise. I also think the timing and language of Taylor’s post was very fully thought out and involved planning as to when and how to get maximum mileage out of it. You are probably right ‘contrived’ is maybe not fair but thought through and fully planned probably coordinated with staff from Kamala campaign. Not. Surprised And I do think she is really good. I actually wish I could go into that, it’s the fun part but I feel bad I’m already sending this novel length comment 😂 I will give one swift appreciation of mine…an olive branch... Her line in the 1 “I thought I saw you at the bus stop I didn’t though” is one of my favorite lines ever written. Its such a throwaway line at first you Are like “why even mention that” and then if you think about it more the whole story of the song is summed up right there almost like she let it slip just three lines into the song. So I love the “whatever” hiding the psychology. Brilliant songwriting and storytelling.

[@farty81]

@@davidfoarde558 she conjures up such an insane amount of imagery and thought with one-liners, it's just amazing. There's no one close to her in modern pop - she's on another level.

[@dehenry2]

Taylor Swift is the embodiment of neoteny as a brand. Bring back the wild

[@grahamjohnson9430]

Prog rock was more to do with the musicianship rather than the lyrical content !

[@JillOsgerby]

Yes, it is a crisis of parenthood …

[@woodwyrm]

Ace of Base!! 😆😆 Are we going to hear about Gothenburg death metal scene next?!? lmao

[@erker6423]

This guy-ess is a billionaire.....just by fanaticizing her female kid-fans.....

[@johntease6782]

The prime seat at end of catwalk T S Miami show, 56,000 $.

[@stevo728822]

King Charles enjoyed Status Quo.

[@markbateman9222]

I agree that middle aged/old folk going to see Ms Swift is nothing more than an tragic attempt to appear relevant or "of the moment". But musically, each to his/her own. The danger comes when young people are influenced politically by their idol. Some serious commentators have cited Ms Swift as a major player in the US election because she has come out against Trump. Plenty of reasons for not voting Republican - but because a singer says not to? I think that bteween, say, 1971 and 1978 Rod Stewart aws the greatest exponent of his art that the world has ver seen or will ever see (like George Best 1965-1968). But would I take political advice from eithe rof these worthies? Absolutely not; genius in one field does not qualify anyone to pontificate in a totally unrelated field. But that is forgotten in today's celebrity driven world.

[@vh1775]

He sounds like Mark Carrigan from Peep Show.