The Worst Thing Warhammer Has Ever Done?

[@GlassHalfDead]

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[@johnnutter7372]

Gambling for children sucks

[@maxpanther2082]

Aren't we all children at heart? :D

[@chris4728]

Agreed, though it’s not new. Cards like Pokemon and whatever have been doing it for decades. Not like GW started something new.

[@HonestScorpion]

Yes, yes it does.

[@HonestScorpion]

​@@chris4728This, while true, does not make it good or appropriate.

[@CTimmerman]

No more betting on sports! That includes having faith in your favorite team instead of knowing they are better than another.

[@DPD1]

Clicked on the video expecting rage-bait, found a reasonable concern about poor consumer practice. Keep fighting the good fight.

[@johnbeaudoin7820]

I’m not a Stormcast fan, so this won’t personally affect me, but if this overt gambling mechanic were instituted for a Kill Team release I’d be pretty furious. This is definitely a bad direction for GW to move in.

[@hereticalchappie6729]

Kill Team Justian when it came out? Lol

[@CholulaSauce]

@@hereticalchappie6729 yes for individual boxes, however if you bought the case it wasn't a gamble as every model was guaranteed

[@Balambambuny]

I've never liked this system, it was the main reason I stopped playing MTG almost 20 years ago. I don't understand how gacha-like systems are allowed since not that long ago the EU legislated against loot boxes, which is basically the same: gambling.

[@GlassHalfDead]

Yeah, I haven't looked into it enough, but booster pack sales models legit confuse me. I don't understand their legality.

[@RetconCrisis]

I think the technical difference of it is that lootboxes are digital and have no physical resale value, while stuff like sports/MTG cards and these gacha things do? Not sure but I'm guessing that might be it. I don't like any of it either way as well

[@Balambambuny]

@@RetconCrisis Sure, I understand that, but gacha systems are also present in games. Things like Genshin Impact (or anything from that company) have been extremely successful for years now, so much so that a lot of other companies are adopting similar monetization systems for their games. I don't get why "lootbox bad, gacha fine" and it kinda pisses me off.

[@effindave6909]

I'm going to sound like the old grumpy guy cause I am... Younger folks today have been gaslight into believing these practices are consumer friendly. When the culture as a whole accepts this sort of thing it makes it infinitely harder to legislate against it. These gacha practices would have been unthinkable to my generation coming up in the 80's/90's. Now however, Just make a post complaining about microtransactions on a steam forum for any game. People will come out by the dozens defending these greedy corporations.

[@RetconCrisis]

​@@Balambambuny Yeah, I definitely agree with you there. I totally forgot about video games for some reason.

[@CrimsonTemplar2]

You are not overreacting. I hope someone reports this to the EU because poor sales won’t sway them.

[@AluinKali]

Report them for what though? Online casinos are rampant in the EU. I can pay ten thousand euros every month in a single gacha game and that’s also legal in the EU. I fear European legislators don’t care about gambling. No matter if it’s for adults or for children. The massive Star Wars Battlefront lootbox debacle changed nothing I doubt GWs little blind boxes will do. As sad as it is.

[@TehCorbzor]

The non-gacha ones only came out when they were released. Space Marines, termies and DG were all gacha outside of japan, then (SM re released as) BA and DG were rereleased as all in one box outside of japan. afaik termies were never released as non gacha outside of in a boardgame, the SM/BA were also in a board game before non-gach rerelease.

[@GlassHalfDead]

Can't be entirely correct, as I bought the DG from Japan and it was as I said. Guarenteed to get all minis in the box. (the plaguecaster came in another box, but that was known)

[@TehCorbzor]

I'm not 100% on the DG, but iirc I wasn't interested in the first announcement I saw because it was gacha, or maybe I just assumed it was since the SM and termies were only gacha still at that point (pre board game for sm and termies). I remember getting the DG box set w/o plaguecaster but I remember it being like 6+ months after I first saw the DG heroes announcement. I also much later picked up the rerelease DG set w/ plaguecaster since it was cheaper as a whole box than just that plaguecaster was a the time.

[@effindave6909]

I also bought the death guard all in one box, well 6 boxes packaged together but I couldn't find the plague caster until about a week ago.

[@TehCorbzor]

@@effindave6909 originally the plaguecaster was Japan only in the DG heroes paint set box.

[@Senor_Elegante]

I bought the strike force Justinian box and it was guaranteed you’d be getting all the models plus one repeat.

[@chetmanley1885]

They're not even good models. They're ok, no better than the regular units. I'm also with you on the gambling / loot box thing, it's rubbish. I would buy Heroes if I knew what I was getting (like series 1 & 2), sure it's a premium premium product, but if I want the extra nice things I'll stump up some extra money. I'm very much not into this model of selling them.

[@Axiom125]

But they make more money when they have you gamble! But seriously, This is crap. Gacha is crap. As I grew older and saw how bad the gambling stuff is with games like MTG and Heroclix, and how it was hooking me I stay away like the plague now. If I can't tell exactly what I buying when I buy it - NO THANK YOU!

[@oldworldvulture3260]

I like the percentages graphic. Where did you get it from?

[@christianjohansen1493]

I agree, Andy … about the odds: nr. 7 is the most Common(two in every box), it’s the Girl with the ponytail on the right, next most common: the one top right pointing the sword, the three dark guys and the archer are one of each in every box AND lastly the silhouetted guy, one in every third box.

[@kollegex6946]

I mean. GW trying hard to protect my wallet by making me shift to 3D print and other companies, i guess.

[@TabletopImpulse]

Thanks for the shoutout. I for one look forward to the burning of Kill Team Warhammer Heroes in 2025 and the inevitable storm that will cause online. Unless that is GW listens to us and abandons this model, which feels very unlikely. Keep up the good work.

[@theanimaster]

GW looks forward to that too - afterall, they would have already made a sale off the people burning their own stuff; so GW couldn’t care less. In fact it would only help GW - negative publicity is still free marketing.

[@Lil-ig7br]

I think to help this game feel even more like a card game, they should retire storm cast every 2 years and do a new large release

[@Bysentenial]

They've done this twice before already. The chaplain and terminator chaplain from the first 2 series were 1 in 36 or something

[@TheycallmeWade]

Morals are a poor man’s quality apparently. Shame on you James Workshop

[@darthhall6187]

The Justian team didn't sell well here in Japan. It's still easy to find, and often at full set is 50% off in second hand stores. Warhammer in general just isn't a thing here, the scene is very small by comparison. AoS is less popular than the 40K. So this makes no sense in trying to boost sales. My take is its not about how popular AoS is, or trying to boost its awareness in Japan. I think its just t about making money from those who are addicted to buying the blind boxes. Same as how Panchinko is not classed as gambling in Japan (as its based on random chance, not skill) yet millions of Japanese are addicted to that. Pretty despicable by GW in my opinion. But as you say, corporations don't have morals, only profit margines. As for this AoS set, I'll just wait in about 6 months until it shows up in second hand stores, and buy a complete set at a reasonable price. FOMO has no hold over me thankfully

[@JimHurst-UK]

I’m with you, targeting this kind of gambling at younger people is at the very least morally dodgy, but companies don’t have morals, management and share holders do. If you want to effect GW, buy shares in them, go to the shareholder meetings and ask difficult questions of the board.

[@OffMetaMusings]

Thanks for using a screenshot of my video as reference but not actually saying where it came from :/

[@Rawilow]

This exactly. Why not credit OffMeta?

[@GlassHalfDead]

Ahh, well thank you for that, and apologies for not shouting you out! I only saw the screenshot posted in my Discord with no attirbution to anyone else. Have edited in a link pointing to your vid in the pinned comment and channel in the description.

[@OffMetaMusings]

good stuff

[@angryviking6928]

Unironically requesting a lore video about the horse

[@jkalysta8955]

I agree with the previous ones where you could gamble by getting one or buy the set and guarantee each model. When they take out the guarantee, then I don't agree

[@daili4917]

In my misspent youth, at the tender age of 19 I was given my first hit of Yu-Gi-Oh by a "friend". As far as I can tell it's the social aspect, a group of friends or "enablers" quickly forms around a lead personality or "pusher" - a dude who has a lot of disposable income and big folders full of rare and/or banned cards. I was dragged off to a couple of tournaments, the people were lovely, even when crushing you with their world champion level deck, fortunately for me I'm too asocial and simply didn't care enough to go back. There's definitely that gambling appeal, that you could pick up a fairly cheap booster pack or two and you might find a rare card that suddenly transforms your deck (or is worth a small fortune on ebay), but the mindset and the friend groups would be what really drags people into the collectible trading card game. GW getting into that sphere would be like mixing plastic crack with scarcity cocaine, imagine a future of kill team where every box is a single miniature and the best operatives are rare - or even there's a 1/1000 chance for a super-ultra-rare operative that if you get will make your team near unstoppable. That'd be pretty wild, although if it ever came to that tournaments would have to offer large cash prizes or it's dead in the water!

[@SuperEagle112]

I believe the boxes come with helmets so the fact that all of the diverse heads are present is a non issue. The fact that you aren’t guaranteed the full set when you buy a case is really crappy.

[@BDA1137]

Even buying 3 display cases could statically not give you a full set..

[@Kasandra_]

It's only the beginning. May take a couple of decades but this 100% ends in gambling in mainline products.

[@auradmg]

Totally agree, too many people are willing to let the bullshit slide because of brand loyalty.

[@BB-pn2qv]

Thank you for covering this. This is GROSS. Another channel covered this and it is inexcusable.

[@flamingoflame]

Would make more sense to do HQ models for different factions. Then some kid who fancies grabbing something to paint might actually start an army off the back of that purchase. I can't see anyone looking to build a warband for Warcry from buying singles in stores (how they're really supposed to be sold)

[@NoRedFear]

I like seeing you and other content creators take a stand against those practices, let's hope when/if you take action, GW does not punish you

[@timothylyons5686]

As a casual gamer it would affect GW but these days it's tournaments that makes money.

[@SheldonSteere]

The whole point of heroes was to be a blind box product to try and entice the Japanese market and then they just made it so you could buy a display and be guaranteed to get them all which does nothing to entice the typical blind box customer.

[@rickyburtrand7818]

This feels like an anti consumer business practice. I wasn't planning to get these boxes, if they continue this practice into the coming years for boxes that I do want, then I won't be buying any. I was an AoS/Warcry collector until recently when they killed some models off, some of which were only 2 years old. I stopped collecting new stuff after that. I'm still planning to get the MESBG new edition box from GW but most of my focus has been elsewhere.

[@CholulaSauce]

what's crazy is that the models aren't really distinguishable from the current releases. what's the motivation?

[@deebernaers137]

I would be ok with it if in a full box you would get 8 guaranteed different models (full set), with every separate box having the same 1/8 chance and then the one chase figurine - with lower odds of being in the box, replacing 1 of those 8. I collect SCE and none of these models interest me, such an odd choice to go with a Knight Arcanum as the chase as well - that's what, the 5th or 6th model for that unit now (counting the UW set). At least the Plaguecaster was something most DG players who wanted to run multiples would wan

[@Senor_Elegante]

Nah man well said, gambling is a predatory practice that disproportionately targets people at risk, and in baffled at how socially accepted it is in the UK, with bookies in every high street and ads at hours children would be watching. This is horrible business practice from GW.

[@Griffonbait]

Give it a year or so and the models will come in a box, all in one - just like we see with the current KT Starter set you identified at the start of the video.

[@MaiHand]

I was already not interested since I thought the newer heroes set have been rather uninspired since the death guard one, but this is actually extra gross practice!

[@joeswift403]

The worse thing GW has ever done? Surely that was when they were putting puppies in a sack in the canal?

[@vargaslc2]

I wanted this cause the models look cool. But buying a box and not getting a full set kills it for me.

[@earnestwanderer2471]

The thing that bugs me personally about this is... One of the arguments I use in defending GW is that you know the price, and you know what you’re getting. It’s either worth it in your mind or not. If not, then don’t buy the product. Easy. Now they’ve taken that argument away, as an absolute statement. However, I will say this in a sort of backhand defense of the practice... I would bet (oh no! Gambling!) that the Japanese market complained that there was not enough risk involved. That it was too easy to guarantee that you’d get that chase model. The thrill of gambling is bucking the odds. Guaranteed results? No fun.

[@axanax2534]

There would have to be a minimum of 20 different sculpts for me to find this idea acceptable.

[@johnteixeira1791]

This idea is never acceptable.

[@matthangzhou-nq4ew]

Completely agree. Awful business practice here - hope the sales are garbage. Although the models are bang average too so that will help!

[@majortom7186]

Glass Half Does it Blend? This is the shits, and I'm with you on the gambling thing. I've always considered the lottery to be the second most insidious form of taxation ever devised as it's playing on people's hope.

[@chromarush1749]

It's only being sold this way because gacha sells well in Japan.

[@chromarush1749]

For people who want to model and paint vut not necessarily play the game.

[@GuttedAU]

Yes. But some things are more important than sales.

[@billybirdy9507]

I don’t see the problem. It’s no different to buying packs for TCGs. I would like buying boxes to find some exclusive or unique minis for 40K.

[@marcog7442]

I play SCE but I don't care I can't have this complete set... but I do care that few month ago with AOS 3, GW discontinued 90% of stormcasts from first and second editions, also removed warcry bands from AoS that were few months old. That's by far the worst they made for the customers imho. They start making collectable products? Just leave them on the shelves.

[@aardvarkpepper7660]

Different places have different ideas of what is right and wrong. Personally I'm far more concerned that GW is pushing subscription models for everything. Three year cycles, your codex may get released near the end, there's a rush to collect and paint units before they're obsolete, the quality of tabletop miniatures suffers. Gambling is a short-term issue addressed by existence of secondary markets. Far from ideal, but deliberate fairly quick cycling of huge chunks of army lists, I think is more detrimental.

[@ethantowne8284]

Warmachine is on the rise. Spend that money on a new warjack.

[@cillamccarthy6987]

All reasonable comments, as aa person with addictive tendency these types of products are directly market to take advantage of people. It starts with a box etc and ends or should i say can end in serious trouble for the individual concern. The fact that these products are marketed towards a younger person is borderline criminal or at least immoral. Ive been a gw fan on and off for a while ive played many other games , the phrase pay to win is something that had always been banded about when it comes to GW games and now it actually is becoming a reality.

[@DaraM73]

Right on, bro. Gambling. Lootboxes.

[@smackiesmackinger30]

These are so bland you could always just kitbash this from any two Sigmarine boxes.

[@perfidy1103]

Yeah, this one bothered me a lot. I hope this product ends up doing badly, and GW will give up on the idea, but I'm not optimistic. Like you, I'm not going to give up consuming GW stuff. I'd like to pretend I am better than that, but I'm not. That said, if this becomes common that might change.

[@marinapfanzelt468]

I would probably buy some of these models if I got a pack where I know exactly what is in it. Like this no thank you. I can get other cool stormcasts where I know what I am spending my money on.

[@genghisgahan9623]

This is such a shady practice- but people keep rewarding these practices. Whats worse is that every one of these miniatures is a stormcast eternal.

[@CTimmerman]

Imagine complaining about rolling dice for your overpriced luxury goods.

[@Rawilow]

I agree about the problems that this direction from GW poses. But I also recognise the background image from OffMetaMusing recent video, and find it disconcerting that you did not at least credit him for the image, scince I don't think you asked him if you could use it in the first place. 😕 *Edit* Thanks for adding the credit to the video!

[@BjornKuma]

The worst thing they've done yet...

[@jamparke]

Good for you finding your compass.

[@ShadowCoH316]

I mean, this sucks, but I wouldn't call this the worst they've done. Underpaying employees, not crediting artists, multiple price hikes in one year, repackaged kill teams for more money, random layoffs, intentional underproduction, playing into scalpers' hands. C'mon.

[@gravitee0]

There is this game smart people play and you should try it, it’s called Thinking Before Speaking. See if you thought before speaking you would know that the title is most likely Hyperbole. Exaggerated. Unfortunately for you, looks like you lost the game.

[@robparker79]

I was excited until I saw that you are not guaranteed any of the pulls. I love stormcast and hate they did this for what could have been such a sick product.

[@goreshadetube]

Those Pygmy models were pretty bad.

[@Jerichoplissken]

Make a donation to GamblingwithLives, or Samaritans or something instead/as well. Maybe not the full 50, but something. This evolution/normalisation of this stuff destroys lives.

[@krzysztofdrzewiecki5618]

It is terrible - I never got into card games because practices like this.

[@EvilBearSkirmish]

it is gambling as it shows the odds, i wonder ig gw has the licence ? i was 100% for these but not after it became an accsess to gambling for young players.

[@wormss]

no, sky sloops was the worst.

[@ruludos1977]

i'm quitting mtg because shit like this sucks, i know gw is pretty bad about stuff in general but i was hoping i didn't have to worry about gacha

[@ingounterwasser4286]

I agree with your stance on the product to a 100 %! But I strongly disagree with burning/destroying a copy you get sent. Raffle it and donate to charity or something. That would be a better use in my opinion!

[@GlassHalfDead]

That makes more sense, fair point. I mean, I won't be sent them! But IF I do... charity sale or something, yeah.

[@faiir]

Usually when you get free review stuff you're not allowed to sell/gift them.

[@GlassHalfDead]

@@faiir pretty sure we're allowed to as long as we've made content with it first. I know that, for example, Darcy Bono sells her models after painting them (or at least used to). I haven't looked into it, but I can't see doing a giveaway being against the rules

[@TB1439]

AoS is the worst GW has made so i will really pass on this.

[@samredus3563]

Credit the sources of your slides

[@Ir3zumi]

wasn't this the same case with the Death Guard Set, with the extremely rare Magus? Also the first Batch of Strike Force Justian hasn't all Models guaranteed in a whole box?! They claimed it was an "production error", and all recasts came in the "all 7 +1 Dupe" shape... i loved the Heroes before because they are unique and has a Story. This set is boring af... but will be for the next Spearhead Starter Set in 3 Years anyways...

[@thepartworkscomicsreader9488]

First UK release of the Death Guard was I believe a box of 6 with no Plaguecaster, 1 of each of the other sculpts. Second release was a box of 8 with 1 of each and an extra bolter guy.

[@theanimaster]

It is the case with all Western releases - only the Japanese releases guaranteed that you’d get everything in one box set.

[@CurlyHairedSlacker]

I think the big issue is it’s gambling with toys and at least partially marketed at children. Gambling marketing at young people in any context is extremely immoral

[@TimcPlays]

pokemon cards....sticker books....these are not new

[@CurlyHairedSlacker]

@@TimcPlays Still doesn’t make it right and is disappointing to see gw continuing it

[@slackeratlarge575]

This is a horrid business model. There needs to be a way to get them all without buying mutiple boxes for 1 elusive model.

[@theanimaster]

Yup, it’s called eBay. GW made this a scalper’s wet dream.

[@DavidVanCleef]

Living in Japan I'm used to this. Totally *shrug*. The severe reaction is pretty much just western ethnocentrism. I'm pretty convinced that the original Space Marine Heroes were set to be released as full-on gacha distribution model with no special collation attempt and the home office changed their minds at the last minute, concerned with legal issues in Germany. Just to note, GW customer support doesn't provide any attempt at remediation at all if you bought a miscollated Space Marine Heroes or Warhammer Heroes box.

[@Gerhard_S]

If there would at least be the guaranty to get all of the 4 regular and the 2 super common models in one display, we could still talk about just buing one display and forgetting about the knight arcanum. But this way: no thanks.

[@nixxinn]

so is this going to be illegal in Belgium ? like loot boxes in video-games ???

[@GlassHalfDead]

Are pokemon cards illegal in Belgium? I assume not

[@nixxinn]

@@GlassHalfDead good point..

[@gregoryjordan1740]

I feel this is an overreaction but a justified one. I dont have any moral problem with this, im sure people get joy and entertainment out of these kinds of things, they're just not for me. However, i dont want them in the hobby and if we all reject these minis outright they'll probably re box them in a way that actually makes sense for warcry. This is one of those vote with your wallet situations.

[@jonthanechols6410]

Playing devil's advocate here, almost every blind box has a specific number that tells you which mini you're getting. Of course you kind or have to look it up on the internet, but as long as you know which number contains which figure you should be alright.

[@CTimmerman]

"Oh no, they made their blind bags more random!" Just wait for a normal box or buy them unwrapped then, clickbaiter.

[@davidshaw123451001]

Yes, I hope no one buys them because of this. If they had done this with Death Guard I would not have bought them.

[@johnteixeira1791]

I will never spend a single cent or second of my time on Age of Sigmar because it killed Warhammer Fantasy and Fantasy is an infinitely better setting than AoS.

[@stevebarnett-f5o]

Absolutely 100% right, disgusting behaviour from GW .

[@zarwius7141]

This goes beyond moral. If this comes to kill team, you will need luck to build your roster which is insane.

[@johnmilik9909]

I dont care about the Japanese market but I'm not sure if they can even do this in the UK/EU due to our gambling laws. Have they said its going to be released like this over here?