Using the LokProgrammer Software Without the LokProgrammer Interface (125)

LokSound decoders have their own peculiarities especially when it comes time to load a sound project and program them. The easiest way is to purchase the LokProgrammer interface but there are cheaper options that allow you to use DecoderPro and I'll share those with you in this video.

[@timothystadel6484]

What a great video. I only have a half dozen or so lok sound decoders and have had the sound projects pre loaded on purchase no problem but there are some aspects I would like to change. Talking with the suppliers of said decoders my only option was to buy the lok programmer. Sure glad I found this video first. Thanks a bundle Larry.

[@gmcliff555]

This was a WONDERFUL, video. Thank You, Larry

[@KingTrump2024]

This is pretty cool. Loksound Programmer software is layed out easier to use with Loksound decoders than decoder pro is. So this is a great way of getting the fine tuned settings into DecoderPro !!!

[@dennisedgar3430]

Larry, thank you for that video. I do not have a Lok Programmer, however, from time to time I am asked to load LokSound files.

[@LTSpenny]

Larry. Thank you so much for this tutorial!

[@gungadin4]

Thank you Larry! Very Useful & helpful!

[@v4victory665]

Excellent Vid Larry... THANK YOU 💪👍👍💯

[@chazco]

excellent tutorial. Thanks

[@Archerman.4514]

Hi Larry. Using only Decoder Pro/Jmri, and simply trying to change it to a LONG address on a brand new Scaletrains ET44AC Loksound 5, it changed the address BUT now the Horn will not work! So Hopefully, this video using the Loksound programming software and importing it will do the trick! Changing an address should be so simple and it wasn't. Thanks for all you do to help guys like me!

[@TheDCCGuy]

If the loco came with the decoder installed then it likely has custom program settings which might interact unexpectedly so don’t get too bold at first. Did it come with a detailed handbook or sheet on the decoder and sound package settings?

[@ricter591]

Thanks Larry!

[@SignalMan9292]

Yesssssss just what I needed

[@sidnzrael2433]

Hi Larry, you have answered a thought I've had with Lok Sound, as they are used here to great effect modelling the NZR. Another well explained video. Thank you. Having lost my job to CCPVirus, there is less to go around on 'tools-to-do-the-job'... Another way to achieve the same outcome however... Looking forward to your new 'take' on your videos, too...

[@skipduld3630]

SO, I HAVE TO MAKE SURE WHICH LOCO HAS A LOK CARD IN THE LOCO. 1- HEADER ON THE COMPUTER FOR THE FIRST DOWNLOAD. 2-I HAVE TO MAKE A HEADER FILE FOR THE .TXT FILE. CARECT ?

[@robertageorge52]

Hi, thanks for great video. I’ve just started on dcc, and want to alter some settings while hoping not to have buy a lock programmer - so how do you physically connect the decoder to a cable? I read it’s R/S 232 with a usb at the pc end, but what about the loco/decoder end? Any help most welcome, thanks.

[@TheDCCGuy]

You don’t, the decoder is installed in a loco which is placed on the programming track.

[@robertageorge52]

@@TheDCCGuy thanks for reply. Sorry perhaps I asked the wrong question. I get the decoder’s in the loco, on the track, track connected to dcc controller, but it’s from that point to the pc throws me.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Ok, then are you using a LokProgrammer software anddevice or DecoderPro? If no LokProgrammer device then you can follow the steps in this video to move the CVs from the LokProgrammer software to DecoderPro, is that clear? So if you are using DecoderPro please confirm that it is working properly with another decoder before taking the plunge with the rest of the process.

[@robertageorge52]

@@TheDCCGuy many thanks for getting back. I don’t have a locprogrammer (yet) or dcc pro /JMRI. I’m not sure if I’ll invest that much. I just liked the idea of reading the decoders contents before I try to change any cv’s, which would some how mean connecting my pc to the decoder. I have 3 new loksound decoders for UK efe tube trains, but the only thing not working is the simulated third rail flash which the enclosed function map states is on aux3 , F15. I get no response from that, or the decoders suppliers , but it’s all I really want to fix. It’s a big ask, so please don’t go to any trouble. Thanks again.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Ok, that clears things up. This process does require DecoderPro, but you should be able to program a limited number of things such as address, sounds, sound levels, speed settings using a handheld throttle. So many of the settings require using indexed CVs and unless you are a diehard it van be a daunting task. If you can find someone to work with you in this task such as at a local club it would make it go easier.

[@minibok2008]

But how do you connect the decoder to your PC?

[@SignalMan9292]

How do you put the file on the locomotive

[@donaldshroyer8633]

Nice vid. On that issue of sound slot assignment, if one has locos with Loksound installed (eg. Atlas), but not the pricey Loksound programmer, is there any way to determine what sound slots are which sounds? Decoder Pro can't read that, as far as I know.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Go to the LokSound webstie and look up the sound package for the decoder in your loco. As far as I know all Atlas sound files are posted. You can then download the sound package and view it in the LokProgrammer software and print out the bulletin as I showed. In some cases the bulletin is even available when you click in the sound package info in their website. If the sound package is not there you also maybe able to get it from Atlas tech support.

[@donaldshroyer8633]

@@TheDCCGuy Thanks for the info.

[@jeanlouislebourgeois3368]

Hi Larry Excellent video but one thing that You said that the Program (LokProgrammer) can export as TXT Files its ok but from What ?? Can You read the CV From a Loco on POM eg by a Z21 Roco central . Is My Z21 can read thge CV From Lokprogrammer 5 ? because I will soon buy a decoder Loksound V5 . I know that my Z21Station can drive it, but to read all CV from Lokprogrammer I'm not sure, because nothing in the software to connect a Z21, or others only the lokprogrammer interface ? I'm sure missing somethings sorry guy's...(Jean Louis France)

[@Cboss1021]

Hello Larry, I have several lokpilot 5 non sound decoders (59629). Do I need a lokprogrammer to program those or can you suggest another program I can use to program the CVs more easily?

[@TheDCCGuy]

You only need the LokProgrammer to upload sound files to LokSound decoders. Any programming throttle or DecoderPro (see my videos on it) can be used for LokPilots.

[@normantoogood6937]

Hi, Larry. Is there any way to update the firmware in a Loksound decoder without using the LokProgrammer? In Canada, they're $190, and I don't have many ESU decoders. Thanks

[@TheDCCGuy]

No, that’s the only way to do it that I know of. If you buy regularly from a dealer with one he might do it for a small fee.

[@kite7214]

I have subscribed now Larry. :-). You didn’t mention where the decoder is positioned..... presumably it is in the locomotive? Is it on the main track or the programming track to read the data?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, typically it would be in the locomotive and on the programming track. And remember, only the LokProgrammer can upload the sounds, DeciderPro can only modify the CV settings.

[@h2osmokey]

Do you have a video of adding a current keeper to a Loksound decoder?

[@TheDCCGuy]

If I were to do one I would use one of the Decoder Buddies with the solder tabs specifically for attaching the 3 wire stay alives to LokSound 21 pin decoders. To be honest I have never found it necessary on my layout to use a stay alive with LokSound decoders. They seem to have enough onboard capacitance to resist most of the dirty bits of track I have.

[@sugarcubeaudio152]

Hey Larry can I use the Digitrax PR3 to program the ESU decoders ?

[@TheDCCGuy]

It should work. Be aware though that LokSound decoders prefer about 13 volts on the programming track. I am planning a video on using the PR3 and PR4 and will be sure to use a LokSound decoder as a test.

[@antosavo3558]

Where is the part when you load those setting in the decoder? without using the programming device. So far just noticed how you created the setting file. Am I missing something? Thanks

[@TheDCCGuy]

There used to be an option in DecoderPro that allows you to load the CV setting in the file created by Lokprogrammer. That gives you the best way to modify and transfer those CVs.

[@jimmore1694]

I have a problem my sound Decoder. It is not responding to its function keys., It is talking to my powercab but that is all. I can all the info like manufacturer ID. There is no sound from anything and the motor is not responding either. How can I get everything back on track without losing what is already there. I am using an ESU locsound and I do not have an ESU programmer. Your site is great and very informative. Thank you Jim More

[@TheDCCGuy]

Watch video 105 and make sure to read your LokSound instructions on resetting decoders. You will likely lose all CV changes you have made but the sound package should still be there.

[@alantrains]

Hi Larry, I always enjoy your videos and just revisited this one which is up to your usual great standard. You showed how I can download a sound project for lokprogrammer and export the CV for used in Decoder-pro. I wonder if it is possible to do the reverse and copy CVs from decoder-pro into the Lokprogrammer project? I have a few loksound select V4s that I modified CVs manually a couple of years aago and would like to check out what I did and Lokprogrammer will make it easier to figure out. Thanks in advance Alan J

[@TheDCCGuy]

Alan, I’ve never tried that before and never have heard of anyone doing it but it may be possible. I’ll try to check on that this weekend.

[@alantrains]

@@TheDCCGuy Thanks Larry, I've had a little bit of time spent checking out lokprogrammer and I don't think I can do what I planned without the hardware, which is too expensive here in Australia anyway. So there is probably no reason for you to spend any time on it. But thanks for your reply.

[@patrickwebb7388]

Is it possible to transfer decoder settings from one decoder into another identical decoder so that two locomotives have identical decoder settings?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, but you need to use DecoderPro or a similar computer program. You simply read the CV values on the first decoder, save them to the database, then program the second decoder using those saved settings.

[@philzdybel2058]

Just to clarify after loaded to decoder pro all sound file and cv settings will go across once cv are write. Also, can this be done in reverse.

[@TheDCCGuy]

You must either purchase the decoder with the desired sounds already loaded or load them yourself using the Lokprogrammer interface. This method allows you to take the default settings for that sound package and export them to a file which can be loaded into DecoderPro. This saves a lot of time trying to get DecoderPro to read all those CV settings. I have never looked into doing the reverse.

[@kite7214]

That was very informative, Larry. Thank you. Does Decoder Pro allow you to listen to the sounds through a headset? Keith

[@TheDCCGuy]

No, you only hear the sound once a speaker is installed or if you hook up the decoder to the ESU decoder tester which has a speaker built in.

[@kite7214]

@@TheDCCGuy Larry, I have the ESU tester, but not the programmer. can I put the loco on the programming track and couple the tester to the track to hear the sounds? Keith

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, that should work for you as long as you have gad you dealer upload the sound files onto the decoder. There are only two ways to do that (1) do it yourself with the LokProgrammer, or (2) have the dealer do it for you. Many will do it for free when you order the decider, but some charge an extra fee.

[@lloydscentralstation1245]

Hi Larry So over here in the uk, could I buy a lok sound chip from the Usa which is cheaper download a sound project and copy it to the lok sound chip using decoder pro, without the lok sound decoder pro Cheers Mick

[@TheDCCGuy]

Sorry but you have to have that physical/electrical connection with the LokProgrammer in order to upload the sound project. That is a proprietary process that so far only the LokProgrammer can do.

[@lloydscentralstation1245]

Thank you for the info

[@wallysmodelrailroading]

Thank you very much! You've inspired me to follow through with this procedure. All is set however when I get into decoder pro and write each page I don't hear the sounds of the file transferred onto loco. I am missing something.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Some decoders may not make any noise or jerk when a command is sent. The important thing is if you read back a CV has it changed?

[@wallysmodelrailroading]

@@TheDCCGuy I will check. Thank you

[@jdigg2007]

Great Video. But that being said, I gather if you have neither the decoderpro or the Lokprogrammer interfaces you could theoretically modify the sound file settings for your loco (if you have the file) using the Lokprogrammer software, export the CV list, and change the CV's manually with your controller on your programming track. I guess the catch would be that you would need the sound file from the manufacturer of your loco which I suspect would be difficult.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Most reputable LokSound dealers will preload the sound file for you as long a you ask when ordering the decoder.

[@jdigg2007]

@@TheDCCGuy So it turns out this process may not work with proprietary sound equipped locomotives. The lokprogrammer software ignored the sound settings for the CV List export. Tried it with the Rapido FP9A.

[@peterjhillier7659]

I think this your First Video under your new Title, great Video, however, could you confirm that the programming work with a Mac or only using a PC. Thanks Larry.

[@TheDCCGuy]

As I said it is a Windows program. I do not know whether of not it will work on a Mac using a Windows emulator but it costs nothing to try.

[@peterjhillier7659]

Model Railroading With The DCC Guy Thanks Larry.

[@eXtremeFX2010]

Fantastic Tutorial! I was wondering about a work-around. And your tutorial is the solution QUESTION: Does it usually take a long time writing changes? I mean like 30mins etc? On the CVs I clicked "Write Full Sheet" My other Decoders from SoundTraxx do not take this long using Direct Byte... No errors so far. I have followed your directions and clicked "Write Full Sheet" Not All Sheets. If there is Aditional tutorial I need to watch...please let me know. Thanks so much for your great tutorials

[@TheDCCGuy]

LokSound decoders can take a while. You can just click Write Changes and that will be quicker but it assumes that the decoder has all the CVs correct to start with. Recently I have been throwing caution to the wind and doing it that way when making changes. But when taking the CVs from the LokSound sound package using the Lokprogrammer software as I described it usually is safer to do it the long way to get a cleaner start. I usually do it while working on something else and just let it do its thing.

[@eXtremeFX2010]

@@TheDCCGuy Thank You So Much for the Tip!😁👍

[@johnc3327]

I had a Loksound 5 with the Alco profile. I downloaded an Atlas EMD GP7 profile and used this process to update it from Alco to EMD. Took about 90 minutes to write the changes.

[@SignalMan9292]

Ok is it possible to use the method in this video and then (since I have a DCS52) use the USBC connector that comes with the controller and plug the USB side into the computer then put the locomotive with a DCC Lokpilot 5 micro decoder on the program track to upload the file into it. Does that work?

[@TheDCCGuy]

IN ORDER TO UPLOAD A SOUND PROJECT TO A LOKSOUND DECODER YOU MUST HAVE A LOKPROGRAMMER DEVICE. I have spelled out in this video or one on using LokSound decoders if you do not have a LokProgrammer device then you must ask your dealer to install the correct sound project when you purchase the decoder. Most will do this for free if you ask up front. Once the sound project has been uploaded then you can use DecoderPro to program the individual CVs to adjust things like the address and volume etc. The method outlined in this video is necessary to make programming changes using the free LokProgrammer software and then move those changes to your DecoderPro file for that locomotive and make further changes later.

[@SignalMan9292]

No I have a non sound ESU decoder. Which is why I was wondering about my possible method

[@TheDCCGuy]

If you are using a non-ESU decoder which file are you trying to load onto it? The only decoders I am aware of that allow you to load files onto them are Digitrax, LokSound, and Zimo. Otherwise you are simply changing individual CV settings that are part of the decoder software installed at the factory.

[@SignalMan9292]

No I mean I have a drop in ESU lokpilot 5 micro which is a non sound decoder. Im trying to upload the flashing ditch light file from scale trains so the ditch lights work correctly

[@TheDCCGuy]

You mean they provided a file that must be uploaded? I have never heard of that but then I have never used a LokPilot decoder. Did they not include any instructions with the file? I think you need ti ask the tech support folks at the company who sold the decoder and or file about this. Typically all that is required to use ditch lights is program a few CV settings.

[@jameschute3754]

Larry. Great video. Unless I missed it somewhere, but the decoder has to have the proper sound files loaded. If you have a blank Loksound decoder, this process will not work.

[@TheDCCGuy]

The decoders are not shipped blank, they have a funky european diesel switcher of some kind that is used for testing I have been told. And of course unless you have the desired sound project loaded the CV values will be useless for the one you want.

[@jameschute3754]

Thanks for the response.

[@NitroStarGT]

Can I turn down the loksound volume with my NCE power cab?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, you can use ops mode programming to change the master volume, check your decoder manual for the correct CV number.

[@NitroStarGT]

@TheDCCGuy Thanks bud. I downloaded manual and I was able to turn CV 63 down but I couldn't figure out a way to turn the horn back up. It's already at max. I didn't see a setting for the prime mover volume only

[@skipduld3630]

HOW DO I FIND WHICH LOCO HAVE A LOK CARD IN IT ?

[@SignalMan9292]

If your wondering which unit has it look in the manual or look at a review of a run of the locomotive you have and they will say.

[@swhfire31]

How about the Digitrak Decoders,can you do the same with them using there software and DecoderPro ?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Are you talking about loading sound packages on their sound decoders or just programming Digitrax decoder CVs?

[@swhfire31]

I was asking about loading sound files

[@TheDCCGuy]

Digitrax sound files are like LokSound ones in that they do require you use the free Soundloader program and a Digitrax compatible interface to load them into the decoder.

[@swhfire31]

@@TheDCCGuy So basically its the same as LokSound you have to have their sound decoder with say GP7 sound file in it to change it . Thank you for doing all this I am new to all this DCC stuff and have learned alot from you .

[@TheDCCGuy]

Their sound decoders come with a combination of about 6 steam and diesel sound projects on them and then there are a bunch of others you can download and then write to the decoder. The interface would be either a PR3 or PR4 or one of their new command stations with a built in USB port. WOWSound decoders come with a lot of steam or diesel sound files on them and cannot be added to without a return to the factory. SoundTraxx decoders come with a smaller selection of sound files for several diesels or steam that cannot be added to.

[@spacecalander]

It is easier to use one brand of decoder, it makes consisting much much easier. Also remember to remove headlight function in consist, otherwise all headlights come on in consist which is wrong. You just want lead unit lights on

[@TheDCCGuy]

I agree, especially since the various brands often use different approaches for things like braking and other features which are not directly compatible. I always try to think ahead and install the same decoders in locos I plan to consist.

[@donsmith4584]

Can I copy from a similar locomotive..

[@TheDCCGuy]

Copy what? If you mean sound then no, they must be uploaded to each decoder. The CVs may or may not be transferrable, it all depends on the decoder and firmware version. I think that the CVs are pretty much the same among sound projects but cannot say that for sure. I have only transferred CVs from the LokProgrammer to JMRI for the same decoder, never another one and definitely not another version.

[@phil36310]

What confuses me in your explanation is: Do you write this into a blanc ESU decoder ? Or is the sound file already there so you just 'overwrite' with new CV's imported from the Lokprogrammer file ?? In that case the ESU sound file info sheet is all one need no ?? Sorry...

[@TheDCCGuy]

The idea is that the LokSound decoders already have the sounds and associated CV settings loaded into them either at a factory or by a dealer you purchase it from. However because ESU does not provide a file with the CV settings for every possible sound file available DecoderPro has no quick and easy way to read the CV settings on the decoder so you are basically flying blind if you want to change some settings. What I suggest doing is use LokProgrammer software to provide a text file containing those CV settings and read it into DecoderPro. That way you know what you already have in the decoder plus if you screw up you can reprogram the decoder using the original settings. Although DecoderPro can do a full read of the decoder it would take hours because of all the CVs and they would likely be full of errors. I know that this is complex but that is one issue I have with LokSound decoders, they are very complex.

[@phil36310]

@@TheDCCGuy Many thanks for your reply Larry ! Most appreciated.

[@bmbm2901]

Your programming decoders is only on the level of cv's, not possible for wave-file transmitting. Every producer had his own protected sound file transfer protocols

[@rambaral340]

When all this craziness is over will you be going to train shows?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Maybe. My wife tells me I already have enough stuff to open a hobby shop so maybe I need to set up a table and sell a bunch of stuff.

[@frankneher9192]

@@TheDCCGuy You can never have enough train stuff.

[@jeanlouislebourgeois3368]

Ho Wow ...Sorry it's ok I Got It !....goto ESU Download sound file and modify as need, and export TXT, then open with Fabulous DecoderPro (JMRI) this one know my Z21 Station. Ok anyway thanks a lot for this great Job . God bless You..Just for Info ESU Sale the Decoder with sound as You need, Example for me CC72000 Electro Diesel SNCF sounds are very good the reality is incredible...!

[@TheDCCGuy]

Have fun

[@DCoombs928]

This is a great video. But i for one do not use loksound decoders. The detailed sound is nice but i prefer to avoid buying the programmer and just changing cvs on all soundtraxx built decoders.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I know your situation, but it is getting harder and harder to avoid the, given all the manufacturers using them now. I avoided them for a while but once I figured out how to move the CV settings to DecoderPro I went over to the dark side so to speak. And once you know all the little peculiarities like slot assignments programming isn’t all that different. I do have my favorites though and for Alcos the WOWSound decoders are tops.

[@dwpedalplayer]

Larry I didn’t see in the video how you get the information loaded to the decoder without using a lokprogrammer. How do you connect a locos decoder to the software without the lokprogrammer? Sorry if I missed it. Everything else was super helpful

[@TheDCCGuy]

There is an option in the Lokprogram to save the CV settings to a text file. There is another option in DecoderPro to read in those CV settings. That way you simply transfer them from one to another and have customized settings for your decoder in DecoderPro.

[@dwpedalplayer]

@@TheDCCGuy I guess my issue is I don't have the Lokprogrammer, nor a sprig or any type of USB interface from my computer. So in your video how would you load the finished files from decoder pro? Or are you just using it as an interface and then manually typing into the DCC base station?

[@TheDCCGuy]

This assumes you do have a usb interface for using DecoderPro to program decoders. Of course you could enter thise CV settings by hand using a programming throttle, but with LokSound decoders that can get very tedious as there are LOTS of them in many cases. If you purchase a loco with a LokSound decoder the CV settings will most likely be optimized for that model and there will only be minor changes required such as volumes. However if you install one in a loco then it will likely need a lot of changes which are very complex and the LokProgrammer software is ideal for that.

[@dwpedalplayer]

@@TheDCCGuy ahh okay that is me. I have a lens system and am doing it all manually. But into a Lokpilot XL4 (no sound). So I may have to purchase more things to set it up. As I only have the handheld programmer which yes is very tedious. I’m adding several smoke units and they are proving to be more complex than I planned as the ESU units both have their own mini decoder I can’t change really without the lokprogrammer.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, that is a prime example. So what I recommend for folks is if you mainly use ESU decoders then dropping that $150 for a LokProgrammer device may be cost effective. However if you have a wide variety of decoder types then the JMRI/DecoderPro option may be more advantageous. And since the LokProgrammer software is free then you can do as I described and use it to creat the CV settings you need and transfer them to DecoderPro.. Hopefully ESU won’t catch on and start charging for their software and hardware!

[@williamwehmeier443]

This so complicated. All I want to do is keep the front headlight on constantly in either direction and the rear light on only in reverse

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, ESU decoders are by far the most complicated to program and what I covered is the easy stuff!

[@JohnSTL68]

I bought a Kato F7 with a factory ESU decoder. I tried to assign a road number with JMRI and somehow lost all sound. I followed this video step by step without success. Your videos are excellent, but I’m thinking not smart enough to be in this hobby.🫤

[@TheDCCGuy]

You may have assigned it an address other than what you intended and therefor cannot access it. Out it in the service mode track and reprogram the address then try again. As a last resort do a factory reset as described on video no. 291.

[@JohnSTL68]

@@TheDCCGuy Thank you for your prompt reply. I'm back up and running again. I really appreciate your help and videos as I would be lost without them. My skill set is stronger with scenery and weaker with the electronic /electric aspect of the hobby. Thanks again!