Top 5 Overrated Games

The Dice Tower Crew share their top 5 Overrated Games!!
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#dicetower #thedicetower

[@thedicetower]

We know the audio isn't great. But it's the best we can do - we are so busy running these shows at conventions, we aren't set up to record them live.

[@ddolgov]

Subtitles please

[@ZachLorton]

To be fair, you guys ARE a media channel. Maybe part of your KS funding should go to hiring someone to get audio & recording set for your live panels. It's possible someone in the DT crew might know someone that wouldn't charge you an arm and a leg to get a clean recording. I do enjoy listening to some panels that are recorded like this, but just a thought for future panels.

[@Manigo1743]

If you aren't set up to record them live, then why do you do it?

[@thedicetower]

@@Manigo1743 We figure that people might want to see them, rather than nothing at all.

[@mattvucu6706]

I appreciate you sharing, thanks DT

[@Officegamecafe]

They might as well have turned Camilla’s mic off for her #1 she was booed so loudly

[@zxKAOS1]

57:42

[@chillingcapybara8528]

And I agree with her so much. She seems to have good taste it would be interesting to see what her top 10 are

[@dandurkin9735]

"We're all going to think of one word for Camilla's number 1 pick." ~ Joey 😆

[@SuncoastGuy]

Chris 5 Splendor 4 Great Western Trail 3 Quacks of Quedlinburg 2 Marvel United 1 Magic the Gathering Joey 5 Nemesis 4 Ark Nova 3 Zoo Vadis 2 Blood on the Clocktower 1 Gloomhaven Zee 5 Galaxy Truckers 4 Pulsar 2849 3 Tigris and Euphrates 2 Quacks of Quedlinburg 1 Nemesis Camilla 5 Deception Murder in Hong Kong 4 Eldritch Horror 3 Agricola 2 Wingspan 1 Just One Mike 5 Castles of Mad King Ludwig 4 Res Arcana 3 Betrayal at House on the HIll 2 Aeon's End 1 Great Western Trail Tom 5 Scrabble 4 Kingdom Builder 3 Betrayal at House on the Hill 2 The Mind 1 Mage Knight

[@gamera2351]

Mikes #3 was 7th continent

[@steelman774]

Camilla’s #3 is La Havre

[@CK-xh7gn]

Camilla being called out for calling Arkham Horror a euro game lol

[@GrandElemental]

And for a good reason. That is a factually wrong claim.

[@MillaCleg]

😂 I blame sleep depravation. They rightfully called me out - I’ll own it.

[@Walkdogger]

Eldritch Horror, but yeah, that's a weird one. It's a Eurogame because you have to control your actions and control the board? Is everything a Eurogame?

[@txsportsfreak02]

​@@MillaCleghow was the con?

[@xshadowscreamx]

It’s on a map, and it is long and fiddly. So I can see the comparisons to a heavy euro.

[@richardkeeling9213]

Thanks for posting this! Love seeing these panel discussions/top 10s even if I didn’t get to attend!

[@zackbob6]

There's so much booing during Camilla's number 1 that KZbin can't even figure out subtitles lol

[@stevenmill9887]

Why is Mike not on a throne?

[@dandurkin9735]

Joey understood the assignment - he was on fire !🔥

[@furleyx]

His Ark Nova assessment is spot on!

[@anthonykuhn3792]

His number 1 was a huge miss. His complaint is that people enjoy playing it on pc? Plenty of games have digital versions that are very fun to play. And the complaint about missing? One of the best things about GH is that you don't have to check to see if you hit, just to see how much damage you do.

[@GrandElemental]

Worst list by far.

[@ThorAxiun]

@@anthonykuhn3792nah I totally agree with Joey. The digital adaptation is so good it has me wanting to sell my physical copy. I never want to have to deal with that setup/teardown and all that overhead again. Whereas with other digital adaptations I still enjoy playing the physical. Also pulling the x0 is essentially the same as missing.

[@anthonykuhn3792]

@ThorAxiun if you're still enjoying the digital game, then the game clearly isn't overrated. It's still good, but you prefer it with less overhead. And sure, the 1 in 20 to do no damage can hurt, but it isn't the same as missing in 90% of other rpg type games. You still get all benefits of the attack including status effects and if you plan to do big attacks, you can equip your character to prepare for those moments when you absolutely need to hit. The game would be worse without the miss card.

[@jakersni9499]

Camilla's #1 nearly started a riot!

[@joshjenson8111]

She's not wrong, just one is just a generic party game, there's nothing original or special about it

[@loovtrain4520]

Gotta say… that might have been the best live top 5 you’ve ever done.

[@Isrephael1]

Perhaps recording from the sound mixer next time so it's more discernible.

[@halforange1]

Good job pulling off a “family-friendly roast” vibe. Fun video. Specifically for solo, I don’t get the hype for Wingspan’s automa. It does not approximate how a human plays nor how a human would score (unless your friends regularly score 110-135 points). Maybe I keep getting unlucky, but it puts too many birds into play for the facedown bird card point value to effectively modulate the difficulty.

[@markusbiewer2756]

I don't get the hate for Quacks, especially coming from Zee: it's such a welcoming game. I had great success teaching this game to new players. Of course it's luck, that's why it's called push your luck!

[@PaulSzkibik]

For a game that lucky it just goes too long for the amount of decisions you do. I bought the expansions and they make it more strategic but also longer and at that point of complexity there are just better games. In the base game all decisions feel like a no-brainer because after you bought your first couple of ingredients you are more or less set on a path. Depending on the recipe-books there are certain combinations that you can try out, assuming that it's all balanced by the designer, and then you just kind of do it. -> the game more or less plays itself. There isn't much sense in "switching strategies" by the end somehow. If your orange and red chips are highly synnergistic, you're not suddenly going to buy a blue chip in round 5. Na, it's still going to be orange and/or red. I enjoy Tavers of Tiefental much more because despite also being really lucky you have way more room to make decisions with the dice you place. I'm not exactly hating Quacks but there's just better games around.

[@markusbiewer2756]

@@PaulSzkibik I have Taverns, but I didn't have a chance to play it yet. I hope we can play it soon!

[@PaulSzkibik]

@@markusbiewer2756 On that note, do consider to play with all modules right away, if not in the first game then definetely from the second game on. They're all very easy, don't add too much extra upkeep but do enrich the game greatly for me. (including varied starting deck per player instead of everyone starting with the same cards) While I like Tom Vasels reviews, he kind of underrated the game because he only ever played the very basic "family version" with the reason being, that he doesn't like it when the designer/publisher asks the players, what should be in the game "the modules" and so he skipped the modules on principle. I find the basic Taverns a bit bland and the modules feel like the actual game (a bit like "advanced" boards for Rajas of the Ganges, if you've ever played that one.) I think the decision for the modules was made, because it was the follow-up game to Quacks of Quedlinburg and the designer and/or publusher were afraid that lovers of Quack would bounce off Taverns because it's more complex so they made it more accessible as a "base game". It's definetely a flaw of the game, that it's not sure what kind of experience if wants to be, but I also think that Tom Vasel was too harsh on it because he didn't review the "actual game" in my mind. But in the end, it does depend on you. Taverns with all modules kind is meatier experience and maybe you're just not looking for that. In any case, do actually try out the modules. They are super easy to grasp and integrate.

[@markusbiewer2756]

@@PaulSzkibik Thanks for the advice, I will add the modules after our first few games!

[@concretetable5643]

It's too long for what it is, there's no player interaction, it's got too many fiddly in between round rules to make it an elegant family game. The production is nice and for some people having no player interaction makes it easier for them to play, but there are many better easy to play push your luck games

[@knitlobe1305]

Will watch the video later but hope someone mention Earth. Most overrated nature game with poor production. Can’t get my head around being compared with Wingspan, Terraforming Mars and Ark Nova. Those 3 games had tons of different things to do, while in Earth the green cube, growth cube, the disposed card are all samey as they all give 1 points each. Not to mentioned the card power variety is super low.

[@JimmyWorld]

Tom's reaction to Camilla's #1 is so great.

[@ThorAxiun]

57:43 The disbelief as he checks the screen then starts laughing about the chaos she just created was amazing 🤣

[@ianw0ng]

😂😂

[@Big_Dai]

Res Arcana!? I don't think the game is even well-rated to be considered overrated! It's also a really good game.

[@GrandElemental]

Underrated if anything in my opinion.

[@utahman06]

Yes, the sound is bad. However, if our options are these videos with bad sound or not getting them at all, I’ll take the video all day. Thanks for making them available.

[@mmarcatili]

Hot damn! Joey kills on this list! Even his shots between selections land hard. On fire!

[@rexology_bg]

So Tom's take on "overrated" is games that should have fewer ratings? 😅

[@danacoleman4007]

I don't get that either.

[@keithparker1346]

Tom confusing popularity or awareness of a game with quality

[@KissellMissile]

@@keithparker1346I don't think it's confusion, he just chose a different metric.

[@LoftOfTheUniverse]

If you think something is overrated, don't you think it means it should be rated... lower?

[@hermithouse]

Ironically, I've LONG argued that despite the "awards" Kingdom Builder has gotten, I think it is way under-rated. Because the amount of hate and bad reviews and criticism the game gets is actually very high. Meanwhile, the people who take the time to understand what exactly KB has to offer seem to love it...which is a minority. So hard to say a game is over-rated when a lot of people dislike it openly, unless you are only talking about the reviews/ratings.

[@alexlord4599]

It had fun watching. It was funny and bold. Great job guys! 😊

[@VeeeeryyyFaaaastSlooooth]

I love Nemesis but I agree it's overrated and not for eveyrone, and the whole BGG TOP 100 list is just weird with very little informational value.

[@GrandElemental]

I love this game, but yeah, it is weirdly high on BGG list. It is a niche game and has clear flaws, but it does create a very unique experience that can in some cases fall flat.

[@jeremiahhammer2282]

One of these days I’m gonna make it to a Dice Tower convention. How can you not love this crew? Every time I watch them it’s like hanging out with good friends, even though I’ve never met any of them.

[@jonwitkop3723]

Dice Tower West is such a great experience. This was my third year and I don't plan on missing another year.

[@cailin5301]

Same. It looks so much fun. My travel options are limited, but I promise myself I'll make it to one someday.

[@BretMyers-fd5kt]

I didn't think these were supposed to be games that you hated, necessarily, but just games that you thought didnt live up the hype. It seemed like there was a lot of hating on these games, but that could just be exaggeration for dramatic effect. Certainly, some of the choices seemed to be extreme just to stir up the croed.

[@hermithouse]

Also, there's just something weird to me hating on a game like Blood on the Clocktower because fans want more people to try it and play it. This game has become popular literally because of word of mouth and people trying it, loving it, then trying to find a copy in print. This should be the type of game that, love it or hate it, is celebrated by gamers. But when Tom admits that (despite years of him hyping up Werewolf and how much he loves playing Werewolf) he refuses to even play Blood on the Clocktower because people keep asking him to play it? That really seems odd and spiteful to me. Perhaps all these fans really want to know Tom's opinion, especially after saying a year ago he was looking forward to playing and reviewing it but hasn't. But despite that, I actually like that this is mostly an attempt to rile up the crowd than anything. Kind of the whole point of doing this live rather than just another video. Tom was the only one who seemed to understand the assignment and you can see his list was the least entertaining for the crowd.

[@leonjoffe6380]

Some of our favourite games are on your lists: 7th Continent, Mage Knights, Nemesis, Quacks, Ark Nova.....but we STILL LOVE THEM....😂. Great to see all of you together

[@utahman06]

I’m glad I’ve played Nemesis, it’s an experience. But for a game of that length, setup, and rules complexity, the randomness is too much for me. It also drives me CRAZY that if you’re playing full co-op or solo there are cards in the very thin action card deck that are totally worthless (the interrupt action). I also think the infection system is way too punishing and resolves in a bizarre way.

[@HomeDrone]

I'm guessing you already realize this, but the interrupt action card is not totally useless in co-op. It's free to be discarded for doing an action that costs other cards, which seems perfectly adequate for the conversion to a co-op. It's fine to dislike the game though, I just wouldn't put much weight on that reason.

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

Ark Nova seems to be a love/hate relationship with most players.

[@kafka0622]

Yes, good players love it. Not so good players hate it.

[@Gokkus87]

Ark Nova is a great game IF you are into longer, involved, multiplayer solitair-ish eurogames. Some people just hate the hype or refuse to give it a real chance. The "It's too long" argument is rubbish imo too, that is a player(count) problem.

[@kafka0622]

Not to mention that the length problem really does get better the more you play it. It's always going to be on the long end but there are games that feel really long and games that ARE long but don't feel that long. AN is the latter for me.

[@Shoitaan]

Most of the games I love are long but they feel like the time pay off is worth it. That's definitely not the vibe with Ark Nova. It's too solitary to run as long as it does.

[@chrismurphy9932]

I find it too long and too random. I also don't like the mechanic it borrowed from Terraforming Mars with cards you can't use in certain parts of the game. So I get past 20 appeal points and I can't use a bunch of cards? Why? I also am not a fan of the subtracting one point value from another. Why would I want to play a game for 1-2 hours just so I can get negative points at the end? I'd rather play Underwater Cities. In fact I had Ark Nova, played it a half dozen times and sold it.

[@josephbegin6074]

Needs subtitles.

[@SeerMagicX]

No, they need better audio. They all have mics, no reason a far away camera is recording the audio.

[@4amayason]

CC

[@searose6192]

It has captions…just tap CC.

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

Even the CC couldn't hear Camilla over the crowd at the end. 😂

[@keithparker1346]

​@@EfrainRiveraJuniorgreat comment

[@ekurisona663]

lot of people get tricked into buying a lot of lame games every year...

[@jvomkrieg]

If nemesis takes you 6 hours to play, its not nemesis that is the problem, lol

[@ziomalZparafii]

I've played a few times with different player count and group, it was always 6h. I stopped playing it because of that. Yes, I've heard it can be done in 2h - just never seen it.

[@dddmmm21]

Maybe I am one of the lucky ones but I never had a horrible experience with Nemesis... such a great game...

[@drewkennewell4267]

People don't love Mage Knight because it's a deck builder or you move on a map Thom. It's because the combination of the deck building + hand management + board state = interesting, puzzle type gameplay that hasn't been successfully replicated to the same degree since it came out. I get why people might not like it, but the fact it's still a game that appears at the top of people's solo lists 13 years after it came out kind of says something. Edit: To elaborate on this. It would make more sense for Thom to point out other games that do what Mage Knight does, but better, in order to prove his point that it's overrated. Because it'll be hard for you to find any.

[@timdertim]

Just got it last year, it's awesome

[@KissellMissile]

I get why people like it. For me, it just slogs too much, and I think it works best as a solo game.

[@shaneannigans]

​@@KissellMissile It's my favourite game of all time but even I will admit it's only good solo.

[@CoreyMarinoGames]

Do you know if this has similar mechanics to the original Mage Knight or Mage Knight Dungeons?

[@LoftOfTheUniverse]

The idea that something can't be overrated unless something is similar to it is a fallacy.

[@adpayne91]

No one had the courage to say Brass: Birmingham

[@Mateilenberg]

That's because it isn't overrated, but just a solid and brilliant game

[@prisonmike1576]

@@Mateilenberg 1# on bgg? No

[@evandercaldwell9993]

Exactly!! Brass is boring asf

[@PamWD]

@@MateilenbergAgree, Brass is great!

[@lastburning]

I often find myself with contrary opinions but not in this case. Brass is excellent!

[@4amayason]

Galaxy truck? Come on... The concept and dynamic.. can't beat that

[@SalterThe]

List should have been called "Zee hates czech games" :D :D :D

[@TheBrokenMeeple]

I can't tell whether to love or hate Joey. He rips on my beloved Ark Nova but then redeems himself with taking on Blood on the Overrated Clock tower and Gloom !! :D I'll let you off! 😅

[@RuNacken]

28:50 - my favorite moment, when Zee starts by telling his nr. 3 pick is from Reiner Knizia - somebody from audience: "NOT THE DOCTOR!!"

[@thecrabbydice]

Boy clearly tom is the only one at the DT who has good taste in games

[@makerofjam]

The more videos like this I see, the more convinced I am that we need a Dice Tower roast battle

[@jeffmarner3106]

Tigris is not a strategy game. It’s a tactical game. You just play the board the best you can on the current turn your given.

[@ajeckler]

Some great picks… Ark Nova and Wingspan, as examples, are fine games, but both had been hyped as among the best games ever made, showing up as many people’s “#1 of all time”. That to me is baffling, and probably made me more critical (because of the lofty expectations - bought both and was disappointed). Res Arcana (which I really like) doesn’t make sense as “overrated” because it doesn’t rate particularly high and there is only moderate hype. It’s an inexpensive, very accessible (minimal rules overhead), engine builder with an element of worker placement (magic item selection each round), that can be set up and played (with drafting) in under an hour. In addition, the box is great (no need for storage solutions, even with the expansions), and components are decent. People might not like it, but I don’t think it can technically qualify as being overrated.

[@rav3style]

Tom, brother, it's a haunted house, it doesn't follow architectural rules. that's like getting upset that the overlook hotel has elevators ful of blood

[@Ras137]

"Hmm...that's odd usually the blood gets off at the second floor"

[@Mokhnaar]

I'm sad Eric didn't get to interact with the rest

[@charlesbarthel4329]

Well that feels awkward. I watched a list and actually agreed with everything I heard. Usually I at least disagree w/ Chris and Joey.

[@djarnar]

Tom should really play blood on the clocktower though he would love running it

[@GrandElemental]

It's a pretty fun game, but I don't understand why it costs 150€. It's just sheets and tokens.

[@TorIverWilhelmsen]

@@GrandElemental Lots of components, small-ish print runs.

[@keithparker1346]

​@@GrandElementaldare I say it, the makers know how to fleece nerds

[@CMinusMelendez]

​@@GrandElementalseems very easy to bootleg over a nice arts n craft-ernoon.

[@hermithouse]

Yeah, i've already said this elsewhere in this thread but its odd to me Tom has spent years talking about his love of werewolf and hyping up werewolf and yet is spitefully refusing to play BotC because other people keep asking him to play it? Very odd attitude from one of the biggest and best know game reviewers out there. Especially one who has openly expressed their love for this very type of game.

[@IndianaGeologist]

I think part of the problem is it seems they have a mic pointed at the audience.

[@EgeTunca]

Can't believe no one touched Catan O.o

[@zxKAOS1]

Maybe people have long "forgotten" about it? May be a good thing if ya ask me.

[@andrester88]

I don't think it's over hyped though. It's properly hyped as a gateway game. I never really heard anyone raving about Catan personally.

[@mikehoekstra7271]

That was a lot of fun! Needed those laughs. Joey was on fire!

[@FabianSandovalElbianfas]

that is exactly what i do not want to get Marvel united , not only I'm tired of north american super heroes , this game looks like it was made by EA with all the "micro expansions" and stuff

[@cbazler]

Tom Vasel, Miami Dice, Episode 42, Mage Knight: "Six thumbs up... Easily one of the best games I've played this last year" Sam: "Is it a 10?" Tom: "No, but it's awfully close." kzbin.info/www/bejne/mpbLZ2ewncmVbKM

[@scottv1600]

You are aware of this thing called time, right? And what the word "Overrated" means. If you look at other videos they've done, 2012 was the first year they did a "top 100" video after he played it (his 2011 version was made before he was able to play Mage Knight for the first time) - and on that list it snuck into the list at #94 - with TEN other 2011 games ahead of it. For context, only 1 of those 10 games was still on the list in 2020/21. On top of that, of the 93 games ahead of it at that point, only 21 stuck around by 2020 (with 5 falling off the list in 2021 and another 2 in 2022 - so only 14 games of the 93 that would still be considered good enough to be top 100 material). By the next year, it had fallen out of the top 100 (along with about 10 better games) - and never got close again. in 2016 on the podcast they did a top 10 from 2011, and it was not on the list for either of them; he then did another one in Sept with a couple of differences - again, no mention (although he did at least say he knew other people really liked it). Then in 2021 they did another version, this time with Mandi - no mention again. So thats across the 3 lists, 16 games from a middling year (1 of his top 100 of all time in 2021 was from 2011; thats now 0) that he thought were better from 2011 with more time to think - a good game, sure, but not a great game Then you look at the bgg ratings - dropped to #34 now but was as high as #7 - doesn't really tally with someone who never thought it was anything other than a good, but not great, game from a middling year; definitely the word "overrated" seems to be more than justified

[@vexienroe]

Great mischief guys. Love this really fun personalities jabbing and joking. One of the great panels to have in front of an audience.

[@jacobstein5678]

Joey's list was straight legendary. 🎉🎉🎉

[@joeferreti9442]

except Nemesis

[@trueslna]

Gloomhaven's gameplay is still far and away the best among all dungeon crawlers. Then saying "do as good as you can you're still gonna miss" shows ignorance about the game. Another pick just for controversy and with low knowledge of the game.

[@joker718]

Wow, I hoped to see Mage Knight mentioned somewhere on The Dice Tower but not like this 😁 I still love this game, an amazing solo experience, though I admit I'm much more likely to play something like Marvel Champions or in general less involving games now that I got older. I wouldn't call it overrated though if we were to specifically talk about the solo mode.

[@brandonmarkwell6613]

MTG as a game is amazing and not overrated. However, whether playing tournament or for fun, it is certainly pay to win.

[@n.b.8572]

How do you reconcile that opinion with the draft format? Or using pre-made decks like Jumpstart? Buying pre-made commander decks with your friends?

[@1AngelAlita]

MTG is a legend, the best proof that the game is good is that it's going strong as ever into 2024 after almost 30 years...

[@Headbangerr-en2cc]

My number 1 would be... Dune Imperium. I love worker placement. I love deck building. Love Ruins of Arnak, Caverna, Architects of the West Kingdom, and many more. But i hate that game. It's just something in graphic desing that's awful to me. The board is just boring with all these simple shapes. And the gameplay itself feels very mechanic, but at the same time soulless.

[@SanswayNuna]

Boom Joey dropping the truth bombs on Ark Nova!! I played it for the first time at DTW 2024 and it was such a let down!

[@KurtDepner]

Not a good way to introduce you to that game.

[@dahger7]

Not their best sound moment.

[@krayez]

.....Looking at my brand new, unopened Res Arcana....

[@cursivecurses]

I haven't watched it yet, but Res is one of the best games I've ever played. Haters going to hate

[@ramonosuke]

Don’t worry, if you like Race/Roll or San Juan, you’ll like Res Arcana.

[@dereklinnabary5132]

I love it. Don’t let others spoil your fun without trying it yourself.

[@realjon4220]

Furnace kinda does it better

[@cursivecurses]

@@realjon4220 apples and oranges, but both are amazing

[@GrandMasterYoW]

Joey came to start a riot 😮

[@quashmonkey]

Nemesis for 6 hours means you're playing with the wrong people

[@Yematul]

lol seriously. It’s 3 hours at most with 4 people. Fun freaking game. Every game is what you make it though.

[@Altodromo]

People use hyperbole to express emphatically.

[@Yematul]

@@Altodromo what if I told you that you can hate a game and not be disingenuous about how long it takes to play it. One of the biggest complaints I hear about Nemesis is that it takes sooo long. That’s likely because of all the hyperbolic statements like the 6 hour one that have mislead people into thinking it’s a really long game. People need to seriously cut back on hyperbole in general these days.

[@ziomalZparafii]

I've played a few times with different player count and group, it was always 6h. I stopped playing it because of that. Yes, I've heard it can be done in 2h - just never seen it.

[@Yematul]

@@ziomalZparafii Lol that's insane! 3 hours tops for us. Does your group drink alcohol and bs a lot? I could see closer to 4-5 MAYBE? Even that's pushing it.

[@timreuter2164]

I was waiting for really boring, long and ugly but never leaving hotness/top10 games like Cascadia, Star Wars Rebellion, Scythe or Underwater Cities …. But hey, at least Gloomhaven was mentioned!

[@ramonosuke]

Viticulture. Decent at best, but highly over rated, as are most Stonemaier Games TBH. Agreed with almost all of Joey’s list, especially Blood on the Clock tower. Also hear-hear Camilla, I too can’t stand Deception: “Shouting Match” in Hong Kong.

[@utahman06]

I really struggled with Viticulture. Cards are way too random, it was hard to build up a coherent strategy. The Grande worker was once a novel concept but not so much any more, and wasn’t by the time I first tried the game. It was so underwhelming to me.

[@TheOldMan-75]

I'm not the biggest fan of the games published by Stonemaier but they cater to a specific market and they do it well. Their games have good replay value while still being pretty simple and that's not always easy to achieve. They make good games for the upper end of casual gamers or for those evenings with rather mixed groups.

[@marcelbirkenkamp1386]

this really fullfilled on the promise of being the most fun list ever. That was really funny.

[@KidJV]

geezus.. tom picked scrabble what a boring pick

[@enr1l]

Joey made me cry of laughs at every game

[@asmallcat]

Tom had some truly milquetoast picks here.

[@JJ_TheGreat]

48:10 Thank you, Tom! The Mind isn't really even a game!

[@TheManaLeek]

I love(d?) Magic, ran(run?) a Magic KZbin channel for coming up on ten years, did preview cards for WotC, all that jazz. I think if Magic was released today as a brand new game it'd get absolutely panned in reviews. A big part of its current success is mostly just that it's been successful and so stays successful; momentum basically. So much of it is dated and just bad game design, and that's not even touching on its cost, secondary market, and all the various other issues circling around it. Just from a game design perspective it's dated and just kinda meh, but 30 years ago it was all we had and it was innovative then.

[@1AngelAlita]

And that's why it's still going strong after 30 years, because it's a bad game design.. ;)

[@TheManaLeek]

@@1AngelAlita Or it's going heavily based on its own momentum. Monopoly is going strong after nearly 100 years; I wouldn't call it good game design.

[@robinvandepoele2117]

To counteract all the haters on the sound: with headphones it’s perfectly fine

[@TheOldMan-75]

Nothing to do with being "haters". This isn't their first event like this and it takes 15 minutes to set up a better audio solution. Even less if you know what you're doing.

[@thedicetower]

@TheOldMan-75 Live audio really isn't our forte, and several better options involve carrying equipment we'd rather not move/buy extras of. We also have a whole other convention we're running and focusing on.

[@vorondesan]

Jumping on one foot is a perfectly fine way to traverse but somehow people prefer bipedal movement. Clearly they are jump-haters.

[@stevecox4033]

@@thedicetowerJust a tip from a sound engineer’s perspective. All you really need to do is run an aux out from the board to the camera audio input. If you need stereo they could use 2 auxes. In that case you’d just need the right cable and to setup the camera somewhere in proximity to the soundboard. It wouldn’t be complex or expensive, and would probably just take a quick conversation with the sound person. Maybe it’s just a matter of these conference rooms not having regular sound guys to confer with?

[@thedicetower]

@stevecox4033 You're correct, there is no regular sound person at the Rio conference rooms. We used a phone for the recording this year so we wouldn't have to carry any of our cameras around as they're getting older and we want to make them last. I'm not sure how it will be at the new location at the Westgate, but I'll ask around to see if there's an easier way to investigate. Thanks. ~Chris

[@matthewsimpson9124]

Great video. Camilla was straight trolling. Good for her!! My Mage Knight fan boy defense - It is really a solo game. Any other way is not nearly as fun. ;-)

[@sobreeltablero]

Mage Knight is still the best game ever, no matter what Tom says. His opinion does not really matter, he does not understand his own opinions and criteria and he always contradicts himself.

[@gianfranco4789]

Hearing Zee talk about Quacks gave me hope in humanity

[@4757joshua2]

Can't hear you over the crowd.

[@PaulSzkibik]

That's either a bit dramatic or a very personal impediment. Audio isn't great but you could absolutely hear them.

[@michaelzuchold9703]

Joey, bravo 👏 for the comment on Blood On The Clocktower... what an overrated (overly pricy) box filled with hours of no fun, particularly for those who play first time (or first few times). And finally someone said it live 😊!

[@defaultlmk9290]

Well thos is unbearable. I can clearly hear the guy siiting on the 3rd row from front, 2 paces left. I can hear how he is enjoying it. :-D. Thats it, everything else is craptastisch :-) hah,ha,hhh...

[@dashalpha]

Pokemon Splendor! I knew of Eevee Point Salad (which I bought), didn't know of Pokemon Splendor until now. You know a game has made it when South Korea makes a pokemon version of it.

[@pernellvaughan8535]

This video has been absolutely entertaining! There's a great synergy amongst you all and it shines on stage

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

I've not played Wingspan yet. I keep hearing that it _is_ overrated, though.

[@muhdudebrigins7725]

Get the app! The app is really fun and pretty quick. I can’t stand playing in person.

[@keithparker1346]

Seriously just buy a photography or art book about birds

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

@@keithparker1346 - 🤣

[@zhetarho]

I think it's a solid game, like there are many solid games, and I enjoy playing it. To me though, calling it overrated just seems like it doesn't say much given the circumstances The thing is, BGG rating aside, it is generally considered the most popular game of all, so you can't really rate it much higher. So if there's even one game better than Wingspan it is technically overrated.

[@keithparker1346]

@@zhetarho ?

[@wfp9378]

Worst audio ever. So easy to fix by plugging an independent recorder into the sound mixing console and you get beautiful clear sound. Everyone who covers weddings concerts and events have done this for decades. I am old, need hearing aids and this is simply very poor production.

[@brandobond]

Feeling called out! Lots of games I like (and even love) on these lists! Luckily I went in knowing I have vastly different tastes in games than a lot of the DT staff.

[@BoardGameHype]

JUST ONE IS THE #1 PARTY GAME EVER 🎉🎉🎉🎉

[@guillermoyaroslavlverduzco1551]

My top 5 before watching: Gloomhaven of course, Ark Nova, Terrifying Moms, Scythe and Nemesis. And like 95 honorable mentions.

[@sajuro81419]

wow most of my fav games are overrrated lol 1.) aeons end 2.) wingspan 3.) quacks 4.) gloomhaven

[@1AngelAlita]

Aeon's End was a total blunder by Mike. Caling it "genering fantasy"... common.. I'm not sure what he played but it most probably wasn't Aeon's End.. ;) All good games you mentioned.

[@darrenthedude7283]

I still love nemesis! Lol don’t care what anyone says, the production is top notch , the thematics are top tier and I think it’s fun win or lose🤷🏻‍♂️

[@knittch]

Chris Yi calling out CMON on Marvel United is just the best.

[@robo3007]

If Chris doesn't want to play with toys, he's in the wrong hobby!

[@gergenheimer]

Just played Great Western Trail with my buddies on BGA - we bailed half way through. Don't understand the appeal of a game that intentionally embodies complexity for complexity's sake and I personally don't love games where the theme is utterly irrelevant to how the game plays. They could reskin this game as "Nerf Herders of Tattooine" and it would feel exactly the same to play. If you like this game, you do you, but this felt like tedious homework to me.

[@therealBocaStudios]

I suck at deck builders, with that said, try to see a game for what it is, I’m convinced Andrew set out to design a better monopoly. Have you played maricarbo? Maricarbo is really well done, I recommend it on the tablet. GWT has this element of time to it, as a way of counting down the turns, it showed up on the scene and took the most hated mechanic, the rondel and blew our minds with it. It’s a beautiful game to look at. Clank in Space is a great deck builder.

[@wow1371]

Ok, so... whenever you guys talk about MTG I go frowny face and salty. MTG IS NOT EVEN A BOARD GAME TYPE DECK BUILDER. It is a card trading game and is rather boring like the rest of them built around these specific combos that break the game fast and you sit there not being able to do anything because your opponent suddenly got a HP of over 300

[@thedicetower]

OK, I guess? But I can pull out a couple of decks and play with a friend. That's the definition of a board game to me.

[@wow1371]

@@thedicetower I mean sure. Idk, it is really hard to explain. Although I have to say, recently I was at a friend's house and he had these game boxes called game night that are sets of 5 premade decks, and that kind of works out the way you say, like being a board game type of game. But when I started it was all about hitting the game shops and finding them rare cards or buying boosters and building decks etc. And I would argue that that aspect of MTG just doesn't fit what I consider a board game experience. Although that is just my opinion.

[@mikeforner7797]

Mage Knight?....really?

[@Ghostgamer84]

Boy it sure would be nice to be able to hear what the panel was saying without having to strain my ears

[@FleshToDust]

I watched this to hear about magic the gathering and all the guy says is "I don't know the game well enough but it is expensive." Really? that's it? I was expecting real criticisms like the game is too stalematey or you draw too many or too few lands and that the game is a mess and far to luck involved. That the game is only played because it was the first of its kind. All you have is... it's expensive? Just like that marvel game? Come on, you're a professional company. Surely you can come up with real reasons why a game is overated. You're getting paid for this.

[@thedicetower]

I have far more thoughts on the game, but it was a live show and it was more about having fun. The audience got a good laugh, there were a few funny interruptions from the other panelists, and there were a lot of other picks to go through. So, for time I let it end early. The points you make are absolutely true, and also I would have brought up that magic players basically had to create ways to make the game fun on their own: draft, cube, commander, pauper, etc. It continues to be the most popular game simply by fact that it's the most popular game, not because it is an incredibly well-made one. I didn't want the show to drag on, so I left some points unsaid. But it wasn't just that it was expensive, but that it's expensive and ridiculously luck dependent. -Chris

[@FleshToDust]

@@thedicetower ok that makes sense. I can agree with that and yes it is far too luck dependent.

[@felicianfarkas]

Mage Knight, really? I was hoping for better explanation putting it to the 1rst place.

[@vistathon]

Fun video and I struggled to think of something that I could add but it just came to me.... Turing Machine - Not a game!!! 😡🤣👍. Not a fan.

[@gianfranco4789]

The theme is the best you got against Splendor. Boo. Then, all abstract games are overrated.

[@joshhutchins6747]

Never understood the Kingdom Builder hate, great game and highly replayable

[@amunt3r]

It's an okay game, not a great game. And it's U G L Y.

[@th3cha1rmak3r]

I'm mostly heavy games player and Kingdom Builder is top 10 all time game for me. It's basically as close as you can get to Go, but with less depth and quicker. If you want to hook people into playing Go, I would give them KB every time. So much game with such a simple premise. A masterpiece.

[@gianfranco4789]

Wait. GWT too! I'm officially anti Chris lol

[@jameskonefal3453]

King of Tokyo is incredibly overrated. In my opinion, it's a boring, childish game.

[@jeremiahhammer2282]

After watching this my respect for both Joey and Chris doubled at the very least :)

[@HorseIRL]

Nemesis is a 6 hour game?!! This game is 2 hours, 3 if there are new players.