Jane Muncke: "Perils of Plastic Packaging” | The Great Simplification

[@TennesseeJed]

I am a collapseterian my first twenty five years we were burning lead in our cars, drinking from lead soldering pipes. Then we started microwaving our plastic cups of soup. Never had a non toxic chance.

[@antonyjh1234]

Gee mate, pull your head out, let's not be throwing stones just yet ay? How have you cut your overall consumption 80% in the last two decades and are those glasses plastic?@@SRCX.ClimateResearch

[@antonyjh1234]

Why not de growth instead? To think we, the ones who are supposed to be in control, grew up smelling and using leaded petrol, are the ones that are in charge of a better world..

[@TennesseeJed]

@@SRCX.ClimateResearch The only consistency in humans is hypocrisy. Yes, I MUST use fossil fuel I know no other way to live. If one simian doesn't dig it up, burn it and consume as much as possible another one will. The subject was on toxins, mainly plastics, in the food, no? As far as spelling fabricated words, I beg you pardon.

[@TennesseeJed]

@@antonyjh1234 I think degrowth is an excellent idea we can never do voluntarily. I believe the powerful are trapped in the paradigm of exponential growth as much or more than the working class which seems evident in the way the corporate leaders demand higher productivity and less pay to the employees.

[@antonyjh1234]

There's 636 kilowatts of energy in a tank of diesel, and 20% of our energy use is electricity, add another 5% for food production/delivery another 5 for medical/emergency services, round up another 10% and by staying home we could reduce emissions 60% overnight. Wouldn't think telling people to stay home, that food, medical care and shelter will be provided for free would be a hard sell. We need a paradigm shift of those at the bottom and because there's more of us, it should work, but we believe the system as it is instead of looking past it. We work at trying to get jobs, our values are designed around it and we can't see our way out of it because we are so entrenched, which is such a shame, people can imagine living in space but not past the system we have here.. With oil running out getting closer and closer and business as usual not caring who dies afterwards, 49 years if all reserves gone, what will it mean if in 20 years all the easy stuff is gone, we abuse ourselves because of what we think is normal and the attitude of "going along to get along" is not going to end well if we keep going the same way of supporting the current system we have, the more that do will mean the shock at the other end will be greater and if "we" are the greater users then the shock will greater with us, the 3-5 billion poor people won't suffer as much by a long way...sorry I'm rambling now. Promote change by saying it's possible is still a step forward.@@TennesseeJed

[@c.s.102]

My dad died in 1976. Before he always thought us to do dishes in the sink. He got frustrated by all this plastic handystuff. He forsaw, wow. I got rid as individual of most of plastic handystuff in my house. I did not realize that there is/was so much plastic in my household. Thank you for another excellent episode!

[@chrismullin8304]

A friend of mine cleaned and saved ALL of their family’s plastic garbage for a month. It really changed their behaviors.

[@c.s.102]

@@chrismullin8304 I keep wondering how high that plastic mountain was your friend collected? Great idea to let an outsider look into my plastic consuming! Your friend can make a career of Awareness in cleaning households from plastics. Seriously, my hobby is painting and I am looking now how much of crea stuff comes with plastic coatings, in plastic boxes and in plastic storage. I try to buy natural materials as much, less toxic and more often Not online off course, but from local stores. Thanks for the tip!

[@allonesame6467]

As a consumer my view is: packaging comes from the store and is "turned into waste" in the home. Therefore corporations are externalizing their "waste" onto the consumer and the environment with no requirements or incentives to reclaim it. Logically, since the packaging came from the store, the store should receive the packaging back from the consumer in a clean state. The store can return it to the manufacturer for re-processing, perhaps. // Freeze driers are now available for the homestead. Nate, you could grow your favorite cucumber, slice them and dry them.

[@JugglinJellyTake01]

Yes it is household waste which means supermarkets piggy back the externality cost on the consumer waste collection. By that private or local government taxes.

[@Joeyjojoshabbadoo]

Yeah, I was all proud of myself, when I was like 15, when it was so abundantly clear to me we could get rid of all packaging, in the grocery store at least, just by using those little bins, where you get the Brach's candy and stuff, and just use your own reusable containers, and the store or the corporation doesn't have anything to do with it. And no more packaging. It's still true. But, of course, nobody does anything about it. And the status quo continues unabated. Also, I'm done blaming corporations or politicians for anything. The peasants and the people are the problem in society. We are the cancer. Enough passing the buck. Just wanted to throw that in there.

[@zeekczup]

Wrote my master's thesis on plastic packaging on fruit/veg in the Netherlands. It was exciting (also, concerning..) to hear some of the results shared with Jane's own research and remarks.

[@davehendricks4824]

I’ll bet Nate throws out that black plastic spatula. I just did.

[@aegisfate117]

What in the world should he do with it? Not buy it... But it existed anyways... Because people buy it.... Because they exist.......... Because people buy it........ Because..... People....... Exist

[@davehendricks4824]

@@aegisfate117 according to the WEF’s plan, a lot of people won’t exist much longer! It’s called “depopulation”.

[@krautergarten4529]

Where can i find studies or information on health impacs of kinds of plastic (black plastic cooking utensils) to show friends and family? Tried to find it on janes homepage but was not able to find it right away. Its hard to argue without it.

[@jjuniper274]

Podcasts promoting home pressure canning may be born from this discussion.

[@keithomelvena2354]

There's a lot here on the Tube. We're busy preserving the first of the summer harvest right now. Bottling Gooseberries.

[@josephbot6]

Great video, Nate. Thanks.

[@andywilliams7989]

In 2010 I built a chalet for a family that runs a multinational (Carrefour, Decathlon etc). They had a cellar like mine, but bigger and better..full of glass jars filled with homegrown (they pay a guy) food. From tomato sauce and green beans to pork and duck and paté. Whitewashed stone walls and oak shelves.. beautiful, but expensive.. I ate with these people at lunch time, they had smoked salmon that was caught in Scotland (by one of their guys) and smoked on the riverbank with a portable smoker. They own the largest french supermarket chain, family members all over China running stuff. They definitely know that what they produce and distribute is no good..they quite openly told me so. (Damn that salmon was good)

[@bencarr8809]

love to hear more of your story.

[@dbadagna]

There are no subtitles from 44:30 through the end of this video.

[@JugglinJellyTake01]

Corporate packaging lock in for the next 20 to 30 years suggest they are not going to change any time soon. Given the decades they have been using these technologies and their green washing mass boycotts seem an urgent priority. The challenge is to scale up that awareness and translate it into boycotts.

[@cedrickervella409]

Thank you so much Nate for this, again, so interesting interview. I would love I heard it 20 years ago. Then I was a young father. I still hear my mother begging me not to use plastic baby’s bottles. I remember me answering, stupid and naiv, the authorities wouldn’t accept these products if they occur any danger… my both children have had later hormon problems. I’m still angry against me, everyday, and against these companies and authorities of course. Best regards from France

[@dbadagna]

A 2020 study from Italy found microplastic particles in fruits and vegetables ranging up to 302,250 particles per gram (per gram!) of fruit or vegetable. The most highly contaminated ones were apples and carrots, with the particles apparently entering the plants through the plants' porous roots.

[@antonyjh1234]

"The higher median (IQR) level of MPs in fruit and vegetable samples was 223,000 (52,600-307,750) and 97,800 (72,175-130,500), respectively. In particular, apples were the most contaminated fruit samples, while carrot was the most contaminated vegetable. Conversely, the lower median (IQR) level was observed in lettuce samples 52,050 (26,375-75,425). Both vegetable and fruit samples MPs levels were characterized by wide variability. The smallest size of MPs was found in the carrot samples (1.51 μm), while the biggest ones were found in the lettuce (2.52 μm)"

[@dbadagna]

@@antonyjh1234 Strangely, in the 3+ years since this study was published, this news story has gotten little public attention, and most people probably have no idea. It seems like big news to me...

[@antonyjh1234]

I had to search it out because I suppose like them, how the heck can there be 300k particles on something when I can't see any of them? @@dbadagna

[@DaveE99]

@@dbadagna it could also be the fact that what you going to do for most people, eat highly processed foods instead. They where already trying to be healthy eating fruits and vegetables. They likley are overwhelmed and not a clear solution and happy ending on how to fix.

[@snowflakeca2079]

I knew you would get around to this soon Nate! Thank you so much! Hope you are enjoying sabbatical!!!

[@integralmark]

discipline collaboration is the way forward.

[@vincentkosik403]

Microplastics are reported throughout our body now... What's next? Thank you both for this important discussion. She is very knowledgeable and remember the Graduate movie with Dustin Hoffman...he was dead on Plastics were the future to our demise

[@markarchambault4783]

Yes, I remember that scene well. Very prescient but then again all these problems probably couldn't have been foreseen in the 1950s and 60s.

[@lornareay]

Fascinating! Thank you.

[@vincentkosik403]

New research finds that nearly 90% of proteins - yes, even vegan alternatives - tested by researchers contain microplastics, which have been linked to negative health consequences. Sixteen types of protein sources - including chicken, beef, seafood, pork, tofu and three plant-based alternatives - were analyzed for microplastics in a study published Monday in the journal Environmental Pollution. The samples were purchased in April 2022 from two supermarkets and one grocer in the Portland, Oregon, area - according to the product packaging, they were produced in the US. Just posted on the web...New York Post

[@davehendricks4824]

Well, between plastics and sugar, that explains a lot about what’s happening to the American public!

[@jjuniper274]

Actually, seed oils and folic acid are a massive problem. As much as 44% of the population have an inability to process it to make methylfolate. This is an avenue not many explore. There are genes like MTHFR that hinder this process and cause a whole host of medical issues like high BP, obesity, and other downstream effects.

[@Lynssss24]

Excess consumption of seed oils and lack of folic acid are directly related to the issue of plastics and sugar. Plenty of ultra processed foods have low nutritional value (not a lot of folate), excessive amounts of sugar, and are packaged in plastic. If not for the sugar we would never eat this crap the first place. I don’t understand why you said “actually it’s folic acid and seed oil” as if the lack of nutritional density and unnaturally excessive plant byproduct in the form of seed oil isn’t intrinsic to the same system of mass manufacturing ultra processed foods as what causes the plastic/sugar issue, and in most cases the foods we eat have all in common; high sugar, high plant-based oil, low folate, wrapped in plastic

[@davehendricks4824]

@@jjuniper274 I’ve heard about that too. I avoid them.

[@davehendricks4824]

@@Lynssss24 And then there’s the loss of nutritional value in todays vegetables due to hybridization. I plant heirloom seeds.

[@Lynssss24]

@@davehendricks4824 so do I 🙌🏼

[@pigstonwidget]

Always so good. Loved this. Love the Jane's idea of people doing a couple of days a year work in a field to grow their own food. I do think a good future will mean local cooperation and food growing. It would be good to see you sometime in your garden Nate and with your dogs!

[@MountaineeringSense]

You have been led astray on Planet Earth by Jane!? I live in NE Wyoming and Dug round about 700 Pounds of Spuds this season with my Broad Fork, no not my Wife, with my left armies and right armies and my right footies and left footies. Easy Peasy! Not so! As I was digging my Spuds, the two dogs that Tolerate my Behavior were busy finding moles! FYI: Still living off the Mole Scared Spuds! Turns out the Thermodynamics of Living on Spuds and other goodies w/o hydrocarbons ain't so easy! A "Couple Days of Work?" in the Garden? Who's Foolin' Who? It will require a Paradigm Shift of Human Consciousness in Western Civilization! San Diego? "For I knew that topless lady. Had something up her sleeve" ~ John Prine - WS Great Works Here!!!!

[@chookbuffy]

any good recommendations for guides for growing potatoes? I grow a few beds No Dig (No Till) but am thinking of expanding my operation next year to help supply my wife's shop with organic produce. @@MountaineeringSense

[@liamtaylor4955]

@@MountaineeringSense I laughed at "couple days of work". We'll be lucky if we can technologically fall no farther back than early 18th Century New England, and that would still mean a LOT of labor required of all to provision tools, shelter, food, water, etc.

[@wvhaugen]

@@liamtaylor4955 - Both you guys are right. It takes a lot more labor to grow your food sustainably. But perhaps a shift in consciousness is in order. I grow a considerable amount of food for ourselves and to give away. But it is good work. Even with my age (73), my angina and my GERD, I manage to get it done. Once you decide that you like working the soil, it becomes more likable. Even down on my knees and puling weeds can be fun. And if you have a social conscience, growing food by manual labor even becomes a preferred activity.

[@larrytaylor693]

People talk about the labor involed that's definitely true but I live outside of Indianapolis Indiana once called the corn belt but more recently the corn fields are becoming housing editions and strip malls I moved out of the city 25 yrs ago and the landscape was corn not anymore every year they disappear. Now I've grown a garden every year for the 25 years but regardless of the fertilizer I use organic or not my yields started falling the problem is the sun has been so intense and rain comes early then durring the hotter months drought conditions persist no matter how much I water my garden the rain I captured go's quick and watering using my piped in water the plants become stressed produce vary little and sickly looking . So climate change toxic water although it's suppost to be safe to drink I try not consuming it showering in it but drinking bottled water isn't good either . So the countdown to the end is always becoming near

[@DaveE99]

How would I go about understanding endocrine disrupting chemicals and what they are connected to?

[@RosaLeeJean]

How is it possitive to use wooden plates becouse trees don't grow soo fast

[@DaveE99]

The crazy thing about the foods she says absorb plastic: the book “Salt Fat Acid Heat” is a culinary godsend. Though if you look at the FAT ACID HEAT: that’s the foods that make things taste delicious. all those elements work together in every single recipie I’ve ever read. It’s how our taste buds just naturally work.

[@life42theuniverse]

Organic chemistry: The chemistry of living systems. Organic food: Food grown without the use of ‘Artificial organic chemistry’

[@robinschaufler444]

What a bonanza of information! Thank you, Nate and Jane. The other big source of plastic packaging in my household is medical, which is harder to work around. I have to use a salene sinus rinse with medication added. The rinse bottle is plastic, the medication comes in little non-recyclable plastic vials. I take prescription meds and non-prescription but doctor recommended meds that come in pill bottles. I have various home medical tests all of which involve plastic. All invasive tests and procedures involve plastic entering my body. I wonder if some of my medical conditions that have to be treated and monitored were in part or in whole caused by plastics, What's a person to do?

[@tomsitzman3952]

Good chat. My wife and I store our grains in glass jars or silicone after taking them out of the plastic bag they came in. I have always avoided Styrofoam for the mess they create for the environment but had never realized the toxic hot coffee concern. It is becoming almost impossible to avoid plastic in packaging. It is sad that some of the plastic package is to make it more difficult to steal.

[@ThisIsToolman]

I wonder if silicon rubber is one of these carcinogenic plastics?

[@braeburn2333]

Great interview! Did she talk about teflon pans? PTFE is a polymer with a lot of Flourine in it. Many people cook their food in these pans. I used to, then switched to cast iron which works much better and is even more non stick, just don't use soap when you wash them. Did you know, that if you heat a teflon pan without any water or oil in it, it will degrade into toxic chemical gasses which will kill all the birds in your house? It can't be good to use this crap.

[@dbadagna]

Not just cookware, but the supposedly "green"/"compostable" molded fiber bowls at Chipotle and other similar restaurants are also coated with "forever" chemicals--that's what makes them impervious to breaking down in contact with liquids.

[@drillerdev4624]

What do you use to clean it? (Asking seriously) I've considered switching to cast iron, but if you can't clean it properly I find it a hindrance

[@dbadagna]

@@drillerdev4624 If a properly seasoned cast iron skillet gets encrusted with cooking debris all one needs to do is fill it with cold water, let it soak for an hour or so, then scrub with a scrub brush. No soap is needed, and the water does all the work.

[@allynnamccleod8862]

@@dbadagna maybe mine just got seasoned particularly well, but I find most of the time I can just rinse them out with warm water and then wipe them out either with a paper towel or lightly with a stainless steel scrubbing pad. The less time they spend with water in them the better. And cooking anything with tomato in it is often problematic.

[@UsterKoolageArt]

@@allynnamccleod8862why is tomato a problem in cast iron? I have made chili with tomato and other dishes. Is it harmful?

[@jonathanrider4417]

Great subject Nate ans Jane! Glass is wonderful but has high embodied energy - in fact the more it is recycled the higher the embodied energy.

[@Praylak]

I'll never look at a plastic cup the same way again.

[@c.s.102]

So just a question: A toxic plastic boycot would imply that all and employees working in using endocrine disrupting plastic companies and the citizens/consumers go on strike? Not everyone can afford that?

[@Seawithinyou]

A Big wake up call thank you so much and now to replace my plastics 😇🕊🌏

[@keithomelvena2354]

One of the best interviews you have done. Very engaging speaker. Possibly a little outside the expertise, but I'd have liked to know the life cycle of these exudates once they enter the wider environment. Do they break down into harmless substances? Plastic and its exhudates are impossible to avoid. I installed concrete tanks for water storage to reduce the problem, but there's still a km of alkathene pipe between the tanks and house and I imagine the reticulation scheme uses plastic infrastructure. Another point of interest is what happens to plastic when it breaks down? My understanding is plastic never goes away, it just forms smaller and smaller molecules and that "biodegradable" is greenwash?

[@dbadagna]

A 2020 study from Italy found microplastic particles in fruits and vegetables ranging up to 302,250 particles per gram (per gram!) of fruit or vegetable. The most highly contaminated ones were apples and carrots, with the particles apparently entering the plants through the plants' porous roots.

[@dbadagna]

Yes, the plastic breaks down into smaller and smaller particles, and these particles are known to absorb even worse chemical and biological contaminants

[@Donovon-ti2zu]

Actually the albatross birds are using the plastic in gallbladder like they use stones.. I'm not implying that makes it ok.. it's another example how plastic is Getting everywhere, probably doesn't allow them to digest food well..etc.. Micro plastic in oceans is very concerning, and the endocrine disruptors is extremely unsafe for living things. Thank you for good presentation

[@neilsonlee7610]

Avoid coffemakers they're plastic. I use a stainless steel pot and heat it on the stove. Takes longer but you avoid one less toxic source.

[@mrdeanvincent]

Most modern clothing is just plastic packaging for our bodies. Nylon, polyester, etc. We cover our bodies with it, putting it directly against our skin, with body heat and sweat.

[@joelmichalski7429]

Does anybody know if silicone cooking & storage utensils have the same toxicity problems as plastic utensils & containers?

[@jeffreyburdges1293]

At least the "novel entities" planetary boundary covers both plastics together with forever chemicals, aka halogens bound to organic compounds, which could impact "novel entities" being rated higher than climate change.

[@wvhaugen]

"I just want to say one word to you... just one word... are you listening? Plastics." - The Graduate (1967) Ben and Elaine had it right. Run, run, run away from the madness. I liked that they got on a bus. So did I. "The bus came by and I got on. That's when it all began" - That's It for the Other One, Anthem of the Sun, Grateful Dead (1968)

[@JugglinJellyTake01]

Hormones can be thought of as the master controls for bodily functions. Small doses of pollutants have a huge effect.

[@jennysteves]

Great episode! ‘Manufacturing of Doubt’ - oh yes. Does anyone know if there’s been an updated publication along the lines of Naomi Oreskes’ excellent ‘Merchants of Doubt’?

[@bumblebee9337]

I'm surprised there remains a fresh food section in the supermarket. This must be what customers want, even though the produce can be infested with fruit flies, and unsold produce has to be thrown out, cutting into profits.

[@freeforester1717]

It’s an intelligence test..

[@cdineaglecollapsecenter4672]

If you want cucumbers in winter, buy pickles!

[@AnniesEggs]

This was informative and also heart-warming. What a good interviewee Jane is.

[@Joeyjojoshabbadoo]

I don't know about that. IMO this was about as uninspiring and uninformative as you could get. The word 'banal' also quickly comes to mind. I guess this lady knows her plastics, but it's already pretty much common knowledge that plastics are really bad, and we probably should do something about it. So I already knew that. Her advice to start a garden, and get your own ice cream maker was especially not pertinent to anything. As well that we all ought to consider making minor adjustments to our personal consumption habits, and I think she said spend time with good people? Seriously? So I sincerely hope that there are other people in her position of relative influence with a considerably greater sense of urgency.

[@paulheydarian1281]

​​@@Joeyjojoshabbadoo Do you have a personal grudge against her? It sounds personal. Has this lady done something to you? 🤔

[@Joeyjojoshabbadoo]

@@paulheydarian1281 I've never heard of this lady before in my life. It was just a particularly vapid interview. Nothing more than that. So it was a little annoying. And while we're on the subject, are you not a little put off, or bemused, or some kind of reaction to the endless row after row of alarmingly praiseful and fulsome comments from the hoi palloi in the comments section? You've even gone so far yourself as to confront me as to why I'm not similarly abject as everyone else. I'm not sure a 3rd-world dictator would be treated with this kind of deference and adulation. It really is striking. I didn't realize KZbin comments were quite like this, I thought people gave their honest opinions and such, and it was more of a robust affair. Apparently not. So no I don't have a personal grudge against her. Was none too impressed is all.

[@integralmark]

what about engineered replacements that don't poison people or the biosphere? Is that being researched?

[@integralmark]

discussion after minute 15--that the largest food companies are locked into their food packaging methods due to the cost of the automated (often customized) packaging equipment --the cost is amortized over time and it takes a long time to amortize the cost.

[@gautingmusik9561]

20:30 The plastic raw material contains 80% monomers. The remaining 20% are not identified chemicals. These chemicals are in the polymer, and migrate into the food and are accumulated by humans.

[@timothyhume3741]

I raise organic animals but now even the hay comes wrapped in plastic so I am wondering about the migration of toxic chemicals into the hay. Holy or unholy cow, sure makes one think. Thank you for your work, Nate and Jane. Cheers and blessings.

[@pookah9938]

Eek. Plastic wrapped organic hay sounds like a reach.

[@pinkgarage]

with advent of railway, refrigeration came on the scene - refrigerated rail cars. And just to be clear, industrial revolution was not so much about consumer goods, but predominantly about producer goods- portable steam plants, combines, later tractors, etc, the needs for mechanized "scientific" farming...

[@JugglinJellyTake01]

Re cooking in plastics and microwaves, my kitchen is limited to kettle, toaster, fridge freezer, cooker and washing machine. My tools are all hand tools , no power tools. The explosion in electronic gadgets in the shed, kitchen and house in general is staggering. The majority are not needed. If any gadgets are needed from time Tool Libraries or Share and Repair projects are places to go. For most gadgets they tend to be used once or once a year, we likely have enough gadgets in the kitchen and shed to last us 50 years or more. Community ownership is a far better model.

[@treefrog3349]

Isn't it a mind-boggling irony that the term "plastic" connotes a strong degree of man-made artificiality? Plastic, in all of its manifestations is intrinsically "unnatural", and profoundly foreign and detrimental to the biological world, yet it is one of our proudest and ubiquitous creations. The metaphorical significance of the term "plastic", coupled with its factual malignancy is a phenomena that has much deeper significance than most of care to admit. Plastic politicians and plastic drinking straws and plastic priests and plastic drinking cups and...

[@davehendricks4824]

Plastic planet.

[@bumblebee9337]

Yet the backbone for plastic are organic molecules.

[@treefrog3349]

That's my point exactly! Humanity has succeeded in taking naturally-occurring aspects of the physical world and turned them toxic! @@bumblebee9337

[@robertdavies82]

There is a plastic Jesus sitting on the dashboard of my car. 😂

[@bumblebee9337]

@@treefrog3349 Revenge of the Plant Kingdom

[@DaveE99]

I’m wondering how trauma and endocrine disrupting chemicals interact as if you look at research and ace study there is large increases in various endocrine disorders and heal issues and polyvagally your endocrine health matters because that’s your sense of felt saftey in your body

[@j.s.c.4355]

TG Starbucks doesn’t use styrofoam. Prior to the Pandemic, they used to encourage people to bring in their own refillable mugs, but they stopped that during the Pandemic. One of the ways the Pandemic interfered with sustainability.

[@danielfaben5838]

A story of modern life must include the three c's: containers, conveyance and convenience. The convenience of cheap lightweight plastic cannot be bettered as a short term support of expanding commerce. That its use shames, sickens, kills and generally degrades the world is a testament to humanities greed and willingness to exploit everyone and everything without regards to the future. May money and amoral behavior disappear before we do. If not, think Wall-e.

[@olivergilpin]

Why does Nate’s team keep forgetting timestamps???

[@pkopalek]

This reminds me that I always was hoping for an interview with Frank Arthur von Hippel, The University of Arizona | UA · Community, Environment and Policy Ph.D - he was saying how you can't go to the most remote place of the Arctic, where no humans have been, and find a single centimeter of earth that doesn't have pesticides in it. It was a sobering listen on JRE #1540 Ph.D.

[@bencarr8809]

bring your own tupperware in every level of food distribution, reusing containers. it works.

[@AntonOfTheWoods]

There are a lot of really great people out there. But there are 8 billion of us on this earth, and I'm afraid there just aren't enough good people to guide the others, particularly when there are also lots of pretty nasty people who are also trying to guide others. That's the real root of the meta crisis.

[@wvhaugen]

There are enough good people to guide everyone but you have to listen to them. If YOU would have listened to US fifty-five years ago WE wouldn't be in trouble NOW. I started saying this in 1978 with "ten years." Now the coming decades will feature accelerating dieoff. The more you listen to us alternative types, the greater your chances of survival.

[@bencarr8809]

it starts locally, so locally, with the people around

[@NancyBruning]

I hope refrigeration also gets mentioned, and the role of fissile fuels in that.

[@jordanrohlfing7924]

Imagine the baleen whales filter feeding the micro-plastics from our Polar fleeces and polyester t shirts. Waste water treatment plants do not filter the particles. Also if so much dryer lint is created in the front of your dryer how much microscopic plastic lint are we putting out or dryer returns. Don’t get me started on tire wear and bubble gum.

[@integralmark]

local (hyper local?)food supply chains is so interesting to me...

[@larrytaylor693]

I had to give up a high paying job in the arrowspace industry because seeing the impact and the massive amounts of drones being produced more then civil aviation engines for private jets I went into deep depression when I started connecting the dots so now I go around collecting scrap picking up broken appliances I fix and separate the different metals to sell also donate lots of stuff that's been fixed or just good stuff and that was another wake up call seeing brand new merchandise just tossed in the dumper or put out for Trash it is unbelievable once I had people giving me tips on so and so has some stuff you can recycle Burger is another one easy fix if anything wrong with it and keeps it out of land fills restoring a washer if it's an older one is way better then some new ones just are made to only last a short time . And are mostly plastic anyway but I stay plenty busy can't even go out that much these days because I get more then I can fix or tear down and recycle. Pay my bills that isnt much now because I don't buy anything new hardly thrift store has brand new or like new clothing I buy socks and underwater not much else will not eat at a fast food restaurant the food wasn't that good 20 years ago and now it's awful cost way to much and all the waste and damage to the eco system has my stomach upset just seeing the lines rapping around the McDonald's is mind blowing I grow some food but that's getting harder to do my water bill was insane last two summers we get flooding rains early that makes my plants get to much water then drought conditions and city water is terrible to the plants . That's supposed to be ok for human consumption. I will keep doing my best keep helping those that can't afford new things out. Keep selling scrap I get a lot of calls this past year with word of mouth I fix people's mowers vars applications just in my local area I ride my bike to the thrift store or grocery and always thinking of other ways to conserve and watch as the bottom falling out . Still stay depressed a lot but keeping busy thinking if anything I'm erasing my carbon foot print not that it's going to change anything but it helps my conscious from knowing the damage I'm causing is little or even better . But proprogsnda keeps the greedy running full steam ahead . Sorry about my Grammer and bouncing around I have Adhd that's out of hand these days because anxiety and depression makes it difficult to stay on subject

[@teiuq]

It becomes more readable if you use paragraphs to structure and split the wall of text.

[@redrockcrf4663]

Nate - At around 55min about breakfast. US hotels used to be much better in terms of choice. You look a similar-ish age to me so I'm surprised you haven't experienced it.

[@Seawithinyou]

Yes even Recycling plastics is a Health Hazard 🧐🕊🌏

[@JugglinJellyTake01]

Canning and jaring were common packaging in mid 19th century.

[@alexisdespland4939]

i love the idea of musillli but here in canada i haven't be able to find a brand i like to eat.

[@bethforencich623]

Try making it yourself. I looked up recipes online after this video. I still prefer granola and make it myself. Then you can control the ingredients.

[@chrismullin8304]

Shake out your comforter/blanket when the sun shines through the window. Then breath in all those sparkly little particles!

[@halphantom2274]

51:18 wow. Reminder for Europeans to vote these corporate lobbyists out and more scientists in from 6th-9th of June.

[@EddieGNAR]

Title correction: Perils of Fossil Plastic Packaging

[@Donovon-ti2zu]

The navies of the world began using oil in early 1900.. around WW1. And using byproducts was I'm sure was well on its way by WW2 into 50s

[@alexisdespland4939]

what do you think we should replace tupperware with it needs to be both equally unbrakable and heat up fast without burning you when you take it out of the of the microwave at work where many workers only have 12 ohour to eat so i you need to be reheatable in less the five minutes otherwize the third person in line has alreadt wasted 1/2 their lunch brake in heating up there lunch and probably m can only eat not bathroom brake avalible.

[@bencarr8809]

glass

[@alexisdespland4939]

it breakes and uses much more time to heat up. if you could buil tuperware from bacteria made ingredients would you still sau no plastic. @@bencarr8809

[@treefrog3349]

At the age of 75 I have been utterly blown-away by the human capacity to do benign and wondrous things in every field of endeavor. And that is why I am utterly dumbfounded by the simultaneous, universally-destructive activities that now seem to prevail. By all moral and empirical measures, homo sapiens are collectively acting agains their own self interest! Are we simply just a form of lemmings with slightly bigger brains?

[@drillerdev4624]

Because we're acting against the species, on behalf of the benefit of (some) individuals. Individualism is what allows it to happen, and it's been favoured as a mentality for quite some time. And we just aspire to rise another step up the ladder without looking back, while our very actions cause it to rot from the base.

[@c.oreilly1387]

No, it's just that humans are not as clever as we think we are, and we are, for good biological reasons, focused on short-term gain. Therefore we rarely think through, or care about, the long-term effects of our actions. And eventually we we end up trapped in a web of unintended and deadly consequences, given enough time and enough inputs. That's where human "civilization" now finds itself.

[@iutubiutampoc]

She says we should eat local, organic and seasonable food, from an ethical point of view and also for a healthy life. But she doesn't bother eating cheese and dry meat.

[@KatharsisderWelt]

Great! The majority of olive oils, and linseed oil, and vetgetable oils come in plastic, so most of these are contaminated by plastic....?

[@eastvantony]

ban solo cups! Great interview thanks!

[@dbadagna]

I also recommend this recent interview with microplastics researcher Dr. Thava Palanisami: v=wuSATHbzzeg

[@ShaneNull]

As this to the movie Idiocracy 2🎉

[@j.s.c.4355]

AAaaahhhh! The organic produce is individually wrapped in plastic?!?!?

[@lorilafferty4099]

"We have a brain for a reason" Dont be afraid to use it!

[@fufurabumbacka]

Guys, plastic is fantastic!

[@bumblebee9337]

Apple sauce can be bought in plastic containers that are reminiscent of preserve jars. Are they meant to be re-used for actual preserves?

[@larrytaylor693]

Nate i hope your retreat helps with the mental toll learning the truths about the capitalistic country we live in is depressing at the least. Ive been struggling with the climate emergency and pollution riddled world we live in . Finding ressons to carry on or get up out of bed is difficult to say the least. Now seeing the death of thousands of peoples from Israels genocide with this countries support and help makes me so sick and thinking about all the lies and proproganda being spread by the media is pounding in my head daily let your supporters and audiences know if the reset your seeking helps because ive all but given up on humanity

[@bencarr8809]

what can you do for the people around you

[@1patula]

Thank you, always pleasure to listen. It’s also nice to listen to wise, intelligent Americans, not so obvious and frequent in Trump era..

[@black_dragon-carpentry]

Its a good thing she is an expert on plastic cuz she isnt even close on " food packaging " ... Or even really sure about plastic composition.

[@graemetunbridge1738]

Hotel breakfast - bring your own muesli.

[@cthereisnospoon]

Grrr. Ive been using a black plastic spatula since this episode started.

[@icqme8586]

43:00 fossil food restaurants. nice.

[@northpole9311]

Everything is plastic we’ve wrapped the planet in it.can’t say we don’t go big when we get an idea like plastics...oh man were really really something EH!

[@jjuniper274]

Pharmaceutical grade and 10/2011 compliant are two very different raws. There are also differences in grades for direct and indirect food contact. Plasticisizers are not common in food grade. Mostly, there are the resins, mold releases as a processing aid (lube usually palm or tallow), pigments and stabilizers. DINP, PBB, PBDE, DEHP, BBP, DBP, DIBP, DnOP, DIDP are restricted under reguations like RoHS, 2005/83/EC, 2015/863/EU and REACH-SVHC. No one buys these raws anymore and all manufacturers have phased them out.

[@derekmiller8564]

Soò Fish aren't animals?

[@ThisIsToolman]

Mo Monet, mo money, mo money...that gets you breakfast.

[@vthilton]

Save Our Planet Now

[@stringlarson1247]

I'm in love

[@markarchambault4783]

She is very beautiful.

[@RickLarsonPermacultureDesigner]

Oh that's bad news I wear synthetic clothes.. Expensive and would be hard to throw out. So now my dilemma is I'm too far gone being this old so what would I save anyway?

[@RickLarsonPermacultureDesigner]

Yes. I used to be too sick to contribute. At worst it was like my thoughts were skipping. Largely gone now that I am eating more food I grew/hunted/fished/foraged and purchased from organic sources. My goal now is I want to be natural but fat chance o' that.

[@RickLarsonPermacultureDesigner]

I eat the first meal at 11 am, being semi retired and all that I can do it. The first thing is to crack 4-5 black walnuts I cleaned and cured (they are everywhere because no one I know of around here wants to bother). I then knab a small amount of berries, maybe a half dozen different varieties, and a few acorns already fermented and boiled from the freezer. I harvested all of these. Cooked together in butter. In the mean time I crush garlic, waiting at least five minutes before eating, then in winter I eat them more times with cod liver. In summer its olives. Draining the first mixture into a bowl I then use the came pot to cook eggs with any assortment of fermented foods I have first allowed to work at room temp but then after the bacteria slows down gets stored in the fridge, some now being 1.5 years old now. Sometimes with meat sometimes not. On point this process takes more than an hour to complete. Now, its nice for me to participate on this informative podcast.

[@c.s.102]

You can start in a different way. Replace piece by piece for natural materials. A slow boycot in a way as I do.

[@RickLarsonPermacultureDesigner]

@@c.s.102 Yes, I think to consider such would help. Thanks.

[@c.s.102]

@@RickLarsonPermacultureDesigner All the best ! You may feel old but I sense your off good will. And certainly not powerless to be able to make subtle changes. For me I feel the difference on my skin and the radiance from natural materials in my interior. I keep going, little steps.

[@HailCaesar-lm4bq]

My town banned plastic straws and shopping bags 🛍️ they could wrap meat in old newspaper but they are banning meat soon 🔜 too

[@bumblebee9337]

Nate's going to gain 20 lbs because of this episode.

[@AlanDavidDoane]

WASF.

[@diva555sg]

Its just too much info. Need to go through your list area & category & types + migrate to safer option when more aware then share knowledge. Thanks Jane.

[@billhammett174]

We'll send garbage into space in 10 years...

[@barrycarter8276]

Are you sure you’ve clicked onto right podcast or were you just surfing, as the theme of this podcast is “The Great Simplification”, and on that theme think they’ll be constraints on non productive use of energy. But as regards to garbage in space you might like to check this out “Distribution of space debris in orbit around Earth” - KZbin🤔

[@bumblebee9337]

I get my food from a can. Metal is my poison of choice.

[@jjuniper274]

Cans are lined with plastic.

[@dbadagna]

@@jjuniper274 Not just cans, but also the undersides of the metal lids of glass containers.

[@bumblebee9337]

@@jjuniper274 So why do they call those coatings enamel or lacquer? Not that enamels and lacquers are good for your health.