RWBY Villains : The Other Guys

[@ShirtFan]

"helping an ancient magical witch find special girls to open magical doors inside of schools to get special relics so she can get back at her ex-husband" LOL

[@johannesseyfried7933]

I mean, are there NON-MAGICAL Witches?

[@robertbartley2409]

@@johannesseyfried7933 Glynda she has no real magic

[@johannesseyfried7933]

@@robertbartley2409 Yes, but I mean, in general. 😁

[@robertbartley2409]

@@johannesseyfried7933 if they are not magical they r just bitches with a cool har

[@josephdavis9234]

@@johannesseyfried7933 IRL Wiccans

[@brandonontama2415]

My main problem with RWBY villains is that they don't feel like an threat. Where's the tension?

[@irrevenant3]

Depends where in the series you are. They've been pretty underwhelming for the last couple of seasons. They felt pretty darn threatening in Season 3, and even 4. In season 1 and 2 you don't want them to feel threatening because they were ramping up to it, but once they hit their stride the show really did need to keep their momentum in this regard, and they haven't really.

[@clutchpedal1145]

At Yang's arm.

[@TheShadowWolfie]

More than likely they're lowering the perceived threat level so it feels more devastating when they succeed in Atlas. The Fall of Beacon was so effective because no one was expecting it to take such a dark turn so fast. If the villains won in Mistral it would have just felt cheap and lowered the stakes because it would feel like we know exactly what's going to happen in each kingdom. They need to mix it up so we don't just always expect one or the other.

[@xendra333]

@@irrevenant3 Season 3 and 4 haven't came out tho

[@irrevenant3]

@@xendra333 What do you mean? There have been 6 seasons of RWBY.

[@TheJaranggigi]

Honestly, the no weapon thing for Hazel could have worked really well if they did his fighting style right. Think about it, in this world of Bloodborne hunters who spend so much time crafting, naming, and obsessing over their weapons a person who ditches that and trusts their own strength entirely is actually a pretty unique idea. If even prominent martial artists like Yang and Mercury ultimately incorporate firearms then how much of a beast must Hazel be to rely solely on his bare hands? It even plays into his distaste for the Ozpin and the Hunting Academies since weapons and weaponcrafting are such an integral part of the Huntsman sub-culture. It makes sense that a man who hates Oz from the bottom of his heart would reject something so intimately tied to Ozpin's influence on the world. Like everything else in this show, the issue is execution. Instead of being the Ultimate Fighter (hehe) his choice of weapon implies he fights like the Hulk, or the Juggernaut, or any of the other countless "huge, strong, dumb" characters in fiction. They could have made him a counter fighter that uses his Semblance to bait opponents and crush them when a move they thought would be a finishing blow fails. He could have been a big wrestle man and used his semblance to tank attacks and hammer his opponents with throws, slams, and submission holds. Personally I would have favored him being a super MMA fighter, i.e. using tactics specifically designed to wear his opponents down over the course of the fight like trying to break their legs with low round kicks or hammering them against the walls or the floor to exhaust them since his Semblance means that any battle of attrition will end in his favor. Sadly, Miles and Kerry aren't very creative and the result is that they fell back on old ideas that have been done to death a thousand times over. Hazel's not a powerful but just warrior who has legitimate reasons to back Salem. He's a big, dumb hypocrite and everyone who thought he could be otherwise is just a troll.

[@demetriusprime1505]

I could see him having some wrestling style moves that would devastate the shit out of everyone with small moves of Judo. I believe that's also a grappling style, correct me if I'm wrong or add on more with how they could make him the ultimate embodiment of human potential.

[@HappyPotat]

Basically "it's bad because I can imagine them doing it differently" which is...dumb. I mean by that logic, the Hulk is a terrible fighter because they could have made him learn martial arts or do more than just basic muscle things.

[@irrevenant3]

This is really a matter of personal opinion. They *could* have done Hazel that way. Instead they did him as essentially raw unpolished power and tenacity. That's actually something we didn't really have in the show yet, so it's pretty cool. . The style you describe would be interesting but possibly overlaps a little too closely with Mercury.

[@LuckiSir]

Thats exactly what I hoped he would be, despite his size he'd be an all-rounder MMA fighter. Although with no semblance (like Roman & Mercury, who have thrived despite not having awakened/had their semblances taken from them) he's able to match everyone else due to pure skill, hard work, and durability. I could imagine his main fighting style being Judo tho, being a calm person when faced with danger (unless its Ozpin). It could also give some insight about how such capable fighters can go down a dark path based on circumstances or just bad luck.

[@brandonontama2415]

@@irrevenant3 Regardless it leads to boring and uninteresting fights, RWBY main appeal was that all the characters had cool fighting styles, something that not present in the newer volumes.

[@Calruxio]

You know what blew my mind while listening to this? The fact that Oscar took a train to Haven and Ruby's crew went on foot. The hell?

[@RedEveTillDawn]

Calruxio Ruby’s crew wanted to help people on their way to haven

[@RedEveTillDawn]

CrimsonNerd they did really have a specific set goal. They just knew they needed to go to haven because of what qrow said at the end of volume 3. They didn’t know why so they figured they’d help other villages along the way

[@idk-ye7ur]

@CrimsonTheNeek Blame Qrow, not RWBY.

[@devinehinton5039]

Ok so we don’t really know what direction Oscar came from or if their was a train in the general area where Ruby came from. This argument always felt flat to me

[@santanalopez4073]

I’m just going with the most logical answer and say Team RNJR was broke

[@iamlordapollo]

i wish they would reveal that hazels sister was the maiden from season 3. thats a retcon i can get behind.

[@theclown6217]

That's honestly who I thought he was talking about, until I remembered her name was different XD Would have made so much more sense and better storytelling if it was Amber

[@iamlordapollo]

@@theclown6217 all they had to do was not reveal her name and they wouldve had a perfect opportunity

[@kingraplhmativo5178]

@@theclown6217 it's would be worst story telling, then Hazel would go after Cinder and turn against Salem.

[@davidgarrido5506]

What if amber is a alias and she is really his sister Besides I don’t know how hazels sister died or if she actually died

[@Missing-Ace]

That would have made hazel a lot better

[@thexv3show96]

I won't consider Whitley a villain. I just think he is a kid that would rather do what his father in order to be the next heir rather than have freedom like Weiss and Winter.

[@lightdragoon88]

*volume 7* : hold my beer....maybe...who knows at this point.

[@williamharmon4039]

I mostly see him as an abuse victim who has been conditioned to obey his father to avoid punishment and suffering. He didn't really do anything bad. The worst he did was emphasize to Weiss how much she screwed up by publicly going against Jacques and giving him an excuse to bring down the hammer on her as punishment.

[@ajvlogs957]

You're right, he's a abuse victim who should be seen as just that: someone who has been manipulated and broken down by a diabolical father. Will the show do that? No. Why? Because the FNDM can only see him as a villain. For people who use to say they wanted Cinder and Emerald, they seem to have forgotten that morally-grey characters can exist (i.e. Raven must be a villain despite her valid reason, Ozpin was 100% in the wrong despite being put in an impossible situation, younger Adam must have also been just as evil as he is in v3-6)

[@thexv3show96]

@@ajvlogs957 you are so FUCKING right it pisses me off. Nice analysis btw.

[@timothymclean]

​@@williamharmon4039 That would be great, if Whitley was framed like that. But the directors, animators, screenwriters, etc make him come off more as a cheap minion to dear old Dad, devoid of any internal tension that might make him interesting. If you want to see an abuse victim villain going after a sibling done _right,_ look at Azula. (Or maybe Cherish from _Worm,_ but she ends up derailing her mission with her own ambitions before her first onscreen appearance.)

[@darkarpatron]

My biggest problem is how many one-off villains there are. Roman Torchwick was _meant_ to be a one-off villain but was received so well by the fanbase that he was given a bigger role. To me, this demonstrates two main problems: First: If Roman's popularity was what saved him, (until Volume 3 at least which I still consider a waste of a fun character), then having such an interesting and unique character be intended as a one-off doesn't seem like confident writing. Second: It was mentioned in this video; if they only intended for certain lesser villains to make brief appearances, then why not just use generic bad guys in the first place instead of wasting time on the concept of a character that's not even gonna be hanging around? Would've saved time for putting more focus on the writing, if only by a little, *and* you could potentially save those cool character concepts until you were ready to actually do something with them. I understand that the writers of RWBY have a lot to deal with at once, but a lot of these problems could be solved if they just took the time to plan out and consider the writing properly. Personally, I think it is *_ridiculously_* stupid to churn something that is loved by many out just so they can get it quicker, *at the expense of its quality.* I know many would rather have the next volume come out sooner, but it confuses me when they then complain about the lack of quality in various aspects of it _because_ it was rushed. But... that's just me. ...I dunno, this is how I see it.

[@timothymclean]

I wonder if Monty Oum was just addicted to character design and designed Roman et al for the heck of it. (Though I wonder the same thing about Akira Toriyama, just because of how many Dragon Ball products he designed a couple of characters for and did nothing else with.) Dunno why the team would keep that up afterwards, though.

[@kylecyrus9457]

I actually really like professor Port's axe musket, I felt it highlights the advancements in technology since his time as a huntsman well. I do agree that Lionheart's design is boring though.

[@demetriusprime1505]

Really? I thought you were gonna say Dr. Oobleck since his thermos that he drinks from is a weapon. Isn't professor Ports just a musket with axe blades on its sides? Doesn't seem all that special. Edit: Ah right you mean compared to everyone else's weapons. Makes sense.

[@irrevenant3]

I agree with this. The Axe-musket feels pretty right for an earlier-generation Huntsman weapon.

[@timothymclean]

At first, I thought the axe-musket was kinda silly. (Couldn't the axe blades at least be on the _other side_ of the musket, so you can shoot it without cutting your arm off?) But then Volume 2 brought us a thermos-mace-flamethrower and a handbag-minigun, and don't get me started on the Vytal Tournament; my opinion of it has softened significantly.

[@agarciahunter]

The funny thing about Professor Port’s axe musket is that it was unique because of it’s stupid design. It was the only thing in the show that had such a look.

[@timothymclean]

@@agarciahunter I probably would have agreed before the Vytal Tournament...but after the hoverboard-pistols, string, and _trumpet_ (among other things), I think it's fair to say that Port's weapon is only unique in how blandly okay its stupidity is.

[@dylantennant6594]

Watts actual does have a purpose. He’s the technician and puppet master of the WTCH. He’s the one who hacked Ironwoods scroll and got access to Penny’s schematics and the atlasian Knights. Unlike Hazel and Tyrian who are Assasins and warriors, Watts is like Salem’s answer to Peter Baelish, someone to bring the information and plan out a strategy. I also think he is the one who provides Salem’s associates with money and dust (especially with Torchwick gone) his status as a scientist for atlas probably means he can hack into Atlas bank accounts and military warehouses pretty easily.

[@kellywishart8503]

How is it that he can hack into atlesion knights I feel like that would be really well encrypted

[@dylantennant6594]

Well he is an atlasian scientist, maybe he’s the one who helped design them, that would cracking the codes on them easy. Hel what if Watts is one of the people who built Penny? Thats why Cinder was given the information to her, she even states it, because he understands it. That would be a good twist, and actually show some tension, maybe have Ruby go after him, in some sort of vengeance. Honestly for as much people give Watts crap for having no motive or characters, this could be a good chance to connect the characters.

[@kellywishart8503]

@@dylantennant6594 that makes since but remember he's disgraced you think that they would change the encrypt so he doesn't sell it to atlas enemys. I liked the reveal it just confused me.

[@lilmissbacon]

​@@kellywishart8503everyone thought he was dead, they'd have no reason to change the codes in this case. And even if they didn't think he was dead, (aside from Ironwood) the rich Atlesians are definitely the type of people to take someone else's work and just pass it off as their own without any changes and with no regards for how dangerous it could be in the long run. They want to sell it off as soon as they can, they wouldn't waste money to change the codes, ESPECIALLY when it was the work of a thought-to-be dead man.

[@curtiburm5442]

I think it would be cool if Watts were the cleanup crew for WTCH, being sent places only either as an informant/messenger for Salem or to clean up after another member of the team messes up a plan. If the writers are smart enough to do this properly it could make a good explanation for his jerkish behavior toward others who work for Salem.

[@donnamitsuki281]

You mean... Let's imagine everything going wrong or the villain defeated. And then Watts appear to do whatever the other villain couldn't,clean up whatever went wrong

[@tatsumitwi348]

"Held her ground and fled" That's a contradictory statement.

[@T-Jex]

Perfect for Rwby

[@timothymclean]

I think that's supposed to be a joke?

[@entropy7705]

They need a villain that absolutely detests RWBY regardless of what they say or do, and is willing to harm them without plot armor protecting them all the time.

[@theclown6217]

I feel like that was supposed to be Cinder, but she only hates Ruby, not RWBY. The way they wrote it fell flat since Cinder never learned from her countless mistakes lol

[@theamazingmr.shovelman8328]

Like me, just give me like a hammer or something and I’ll be a better villain than any other in the show

[@idk-ye7ur]

@@theclown6217 Countless? The only mistake that she did was the big one, in V5, in V6 she does nothing, so what mistakes you say? People really love to hate Cinder...

[@fightingmedialounge519]

I wouldn't say love to hate.

[@oreoex-rwbyhater599]

They dont need that when salem hates the world.

[@brandonontama2415]

Why does Leo deserve to die an humiliating death but Revan gets to live even though she more of an coward and killed an Maiden, and didn't even feel remorse for it at first, at least Leo felt guilty.

[@demetriusprime1505]

Let's not forget he was actually useful had Cinder not fucked up.

[@AEsir_Goji]

You: misspell “Raven" as “Revan" Me: All hail Revan! kzbin.info/www/bejne/m3PRdJZ5lNd4ms0

[@irrevenant3]

A couple of reasons. One is that Leo is a boring character of minimal plot value while Raven is Yang's mother with all the dramatic potential that entails. (Oh yeah, and the ). Another is that the RWBY world isn't fair. Characters die who shouldn't all the time while characters who deserve punishment get off scot-free.

[@brandonontama2415]

@@irrevenant3 Raven is equally boring and badly written, and anything interesting with the relationship between Yang and Raven go scraped in volume 5. Also, the second point is very pretentious, they only live because the writers are biased and protect characters through plot armour, the world not being fair is rarely explored in the show.

[@irrevenant3]

@@brandonontama2415 Yeah, like I said elsewhere they've been really bad for that in the latest seasons. It was much better realised in the first few. . Raven is boring because she's been written badly. I'm talking her dramatic potential, not how well they executed it. The character has a lot more story potential than Leo, and could still be made interesting again if the writers pick up their game.

[@insertjokehere212]

I'd say the axemusket fits. It's totally his style, is funtional but not good like his teaching and appears ancient compared to the other weapons, giving us a feel that he truly has been a huntsman for years and never bothered to replace his equipment as technology progressed. His character is clearly an old dude who keeps a tight grip on the past and his weapon reflects that.

[@RobertPage562]

I wish Cardin's potential was used in the show. He could have been so useful in the battle of beacon and could have traveled with RNJR or even had a few episodes for him and Velvet to become friends.

[@irrevenant3]

Yeah. Whether they went the path of him being redeemed from his jerkishness, the path of it being his undoing, or something else entirely, it seems a shame to take a character they invested so much time into and just do *nothing* with him.

[@sonicfan2403]

He could've taken inspiration from Groose from Skyward Sword.

[@TheVTable]

If you want to see Cardin’s potential flourish then I recommend watching Celtic Phoenix’s Fixing RWBY series, it’s not perfect but it’s still pretty good

[@RobertPage562]

@@TheVTable thanks I'll take a look at it

[@abdelwahebregai7431]

"Raven congratulates her on finally finding her, like it's been a long game of hide and seek. You abandoned your daughter!" Critter, have you seen Hunter x Hunter?

[@lostinacatsmouth8389]

When she said that Raven wanted to be a history teacher, for a second i deadass thought 'oh wait that's kind of a cute character thing. it'd be neat if this gal who abandonded her daughter cared about children, it would make the reason she left more interesting and impactful if she liked children or was very attached to her daughter', but no. This gals throwaway joke made a better character picture than the actual writers.

[@SirEriol]

Makes a lot of sense. Odin's Crows, Huggin and Munnin, represent Thought and Memory. Odin let's them roam the Earth each day and by sunset they tell him everything new. He worries that Thought could someday leave him and never return, but the one he worries for the most is Memory. He is scared of losing his Memory. So we havr a drunk spy who's quite amazing at getting things done when he doesn't get in his way. And we could have had a history teacher who in the pursuit of knowledge found something she regrets ever getting involved with. So she abandons her family, her child, and roams aimlesly believing herself to be stronger now that she's ruled by fear. A Spring Maiden who no longer has faith in new begginings, guarding the Relic of Knowledge she wishes to forget. A fleeting memory, remembered solely by a daughter left behind.

[@itspienoon7883]

​@@SirEriol That's such a good idea that I'm pissed that the writers didn't think of it. In fact, like many have already stated throughout these last years of RWBY, the writers have a mountain store of creative ways to take their story, but because they're so inept, these fairy tale/mythology references are nothing more than wasted potential. To add onto your inclucion, we could've had Ozpin be the Odin to Qrow and Raven's Huggin and Munnin, because they're both wise old men, and during their prime, Ozpin when he was Ozma and Odin pre-Ragnarok, were held as the ruler of Gods, like c'mon, would've been so good

[@camilaalmiron5588]

​@@SirEriol your idea is great 😮

[@Yankeesfan4ever100]

Regarding Junior and the twins, I feel like, if Miles and Kerry wanted them back in the story to make them actual characters, they could make for a good refugee story. They lose their club and all their men in the fall of Beacon, are forced to move to Atlas with whatever money they have, and possibly fight Yang again only to eventually become friends...or something along those lines. Either way, I feel like there's something you can do with them. I'm always of the opinion that potential exists in everything.

[@vynonyoutube1418]

There's also Miss Malachite in Volume 6. Keyword, "Malachite". Guess what Miltia's and Melanie's surname is. There's a possibility that Miss Malachite might be related to the twins, possibly being their mother or aunt or something, of course, it's not confirmed and i doubt Miles and Kerry will bring this up again.

[@quinnhope4278]

Remember that chainsaw guy who almost killed Weiss on the Grimm train to Beacon and then they never showed how she got out of being chopped in half AND defeated this villain who she very clearly was not strong enough to face? Yeah...

[@thomasraines1396]

Plot armor.

[@sweet_t1nk389]

I like how you don't just sit here and bash the villains in the show. You put more commentary on how they could be better, lots of respect.

[@irrevenant3]

Hmm, I don't really agree about Hazel's fighting style. He's pretty much the Hulk and RWBY has noone else like that. His style isn't calculated or refined - hell, it's arguably not even a style. It's getting the job done with raw anger and force and power. And an unwillingness to ever. stay. down. The fight against Hazel worked for me. . And I liked the idea of him being a weaponless powerhouse who just maxes out by directly mainlining dust. That's pretty cool and, again, not seen anywhere else in RWBY. Honestly, he's pretty unique as the villains go. If they just fixed that issue with his backstory he's pretty epic.

[@johannesseyfried7933]

Exactly! On Paper, he is an awesome Villain. Serious and Quiet, but not interested in unnecessary bloodshed or cruel. The Fact that he doesn't seem to even really LIKE Fighting (except when his enemies are Oz and one of his many Hosts) and doesn't use Weapons makes his Fightingstyle even more interesting. Hazel is the "The Monk". The big Problem is his Backstory and the Fact that RT refuses to show that Oz is the shady Character that they said he is.

[@timothymclean]

Anyone else think irrevenant's description of Hazel's fighting style sounds a lot like Yang when she gets mad, except less flexible?

[@irrevenant3]

@@timothymclean Hmm. IMO, sort of but not really. Yang is a skilled and athletic martial artist, even when all fired up. She also has (and frequently uses) ranged attacks. Hazel is pure hand-to-hand, superhumanly strong and tough, unskilled and pretty much just uses raw power to smash things.

[@timothymclean]

@@irrevenant3 Which pretty much just makes him fight like Yang, but with less range. (By which I mean variety.)

[@irrevenant3]

​@@timothymclean I don't think their styles are that similar for the reasons I gave above. And more importantly, the way they fight *looks* very different. Hazel looks like an untrained brawler, and Yang looks like a skilled martial artist.

[@irrevenant3]

Also, the entire point of the Cowardly Lion is that he *wasn't* cowardly. I know that the characters are loose analogues at best, but still...

[@snoozalssmetz3]

Honestly, I think that is pretty interesting. In the Wizard of Oz, the Lion gets over his cowardice. But in RWBY, it works in the reverse. To become a huntsman, you need to be pretty brave. So after learning , he lost his bravery and became afraid. Then a coward. Ironwood, who represents the Tinman in The Wizard of Oz. The tinman wanted a heart (which I think would represent trust/faith in RWBY as Ironwood loses faith in Ozpin?), but Ironwood loses his heart. Working in the reverse. Becoming heartless (could also mean that he becomes a shell of his former self in an attempt to protect the people). I admit to not really knowing what happens much with the Scarecrow in the Wizard of Oz (I think he wanted adventure?). But we know Qrow obviously represents him XD Assuming adventure was the main reason for the Scarecrow, when Qrow learns , he loses his drive to go on; find out more; see the world again. He becomes depressed and wants to regress into himself. But that was just a word vomit on my part XD Take it as you will! Opinions are totally allowed :D

[@irrevenant3]

@@snoozalssmetz3 Hmm. Scarecrow wanted brains. Qrow started as a clever fighter and tactician but as the show went on he started growing despondent and getting drunk more so his charges relied on his counsel less and became more independent. . So that one works too. That's a really interesting thought...

[@snoozalssmetz3]

@@irrevenant3 Right! I definitely think it is an interesting take on CRWBY's part. A nice spin to a story we may have thought would come to light :D

[@warwatcher91]

1:35 At the end of the day Cardin he got in Beacon legit, while Jaune cheated his way in. Just remember that everyone.

[@Skitzotech]

What if Ozpin was the "adult supervision" that Hazels sister's team had? Or what if "as per Ozpin's style" he was trying to give her a "gift" like Qrow/Raven's or gow he made Pyrah take on the maiden's powers... or whatever happened to Summer.

[@LuckiSir]

I feel like Hazel's backstory really let me down, and now I'm just expecting them to drop Watts' everything.

[@arnowisp6244]

True, it doesn't even make sense since his sister died from Grimm. If anything, he should have been an unallied guy who targets Ozpin and only him and he wouldn't even be a threat to our cast unless he got in their way.

[@arnowisp6244]

@@ChangedMyNameFinally69 Wait, you made a fanfic? Can you link to it?

[@sonicchaos-ir9kw]

"don't let such a small obstacle block your path" that line is so cool for leaving an impression. It tells us that he is a man of resolve who has powered through hardship which also alludes to his unfortunately boring semblance. Other dialogue we get with him shows that he isn't a murderhobo like all the other team WTCH members like him saying "no one had to die today". Then for him to contradict his motivation by beating the crap out of children when he hates oz for "getting her killed".

[@panpan1287]

Even the villains from the SLVR videos seemed more threatening And only one of them had lines

[@JanizMakudomaru]

I can make the Yang and Raven dialogue insulting: this came out a few years ago and The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air came out in the 90s. You know what scene I would refer to that's one of the best ones in the show and they failed at these two.

[@ozmasterofmasks5838]

22:45 It would have been cooler if Salem's group was actually sone kind of a cult.

[@lenni01]

Quivering little bean at the corner of the screen in the first 4 seconds. Me: you have my attention

[@ghostzombies3252]

After seeing Tyrian I will now headcanon him as a poet (or a literature buff) when he was, you know, sane or prior to meeting Salem

[@Ryoko48]

Watts: is my fave out of WTCH, because he's such a snob and snarky ass. From his interactions with Salem though, I feel like he's the only one she enjoys an intelligent conversation with. Hazel: my god, when his reason for hating Oz was revealed...dumbest reason ever. This is a world....a school....where on their first day as students they get catapulted off a cliff into a forest and get told they if they don't win against the grim, 'you will die'. Like if you sign up for that shit, there is no way you can turn around and be all DIS IS ON YOU when you encounter casualty. I just want to see Glynda again :

[@ahmadkaien]

What if watts semblance is mind reading and his weapon is a holographic staff that can create hard light holograms? We could have some interesting callbacks...js

[@johannesseyfried7933]

The Hardlight Thing would be interesting, but I am not so sure about the telepathic Semblance. It kinda seems...not fitting, which, I admit, is a strange Argument, considering the World the Show takes place in.

[@ahmadkaien]

@@johannesseyfried7933 eh I think it could for his personality but not straight up telepathy...like he can't read minds but he can find the one person you care about or afraid of. Idk I just see him as a puppet master-type fighter

[@nickmason2765]

I’m gonna assume this is not a revolutionary idea cause I just thought of it while you were talking bout Leo. If your gonna make a cowardly lion Chracter why not make him a big beefy lion fauns who has a Chracter simaler to king from one punch man. He can be considered this great all powerful warrior with a hulking physic but in truth is a giant coward who just stumbles into victories. Have Ozpin be the only one he knew about it, give him semblance that’s a loud bestial roar that can buff his allies and also call for help

[@camilaalmiron5588]

Your idea is great

[@tminusboom2140]

How to fix Hazel: Gretchen had silver eyes, she was being personally taken on the mission by Ozpin, and Ozpin deliberately made the mission go poorly to prompt her to use the silver eyes, which failed.

[@Oorillon]

For Vernal: actually, I didnt pay attention, so i didnt even realized that they tried to missdirect the audience into thinking that Vernal is the spring maiden. I was more suprised about Cinder attacking her than the actual reveal XD

[@idk-ye7ur]

What does that bring? Actually not paying attention got the majority of people surprised.

[@chanceenglish7769]

"She stood her ground and fled" how oxymoronic😂

[@TheLeky98]

I wrote this in the one after this, but it fits more perfectly here after watching. Hazel is Discount Bane: Change My Mind

[@redcarp9867]

I was pleasantly surprised to learn that Watts is ready, willing, capable of throwing hands in Volume 7.

[@imfunatparties2821]

No villain could become a big threat since most characters doesnt feel important

[@burgermeister8261]

I feel like post volume 8, the section about Watts would be much different, since in 7 and 8 pretty much everything mentioned got amended lol

[@Kylesico912x]

Hoenstly, I feel terrible for Hazel. His entire character was ruined by the revelation of his motive. If I were writing him, I would make him a martial artist and not an unorganized brawler. Furthermore, I would make his motivation an younger brother or sister figure that reminds him of his dead sibling. Said sibling figure came down with a deadly disease that only Salem (with her magic) or Watts can treat. In exchange, he has to pledge his services to Salem. Maybe he still partially blames the death of his sister on Ozpin but otherwise long forgave him and moved on. He doesn't want to work with Salem but has to. This would explain why Hazel seems to be an otherwise good person despite working for the bad guys.

[@handhelder823]

Easy, have Ozpin knowing he can't win to the entire council of evil and have Hazel only Go specificly against Ozpin (For sending countless children to their deaths) while he only knocks out the children if they interfere and makes sure not to kill them, as they are innocent in that case. Showing it through a fight of the past, where he got attacked as a lieutenant and he kicked the hunters asses, but doesn't kill a single one, lamenting that they attacked first

[@nothingiseverperfect]

Yessss I’m happy someone is making RWBY videos right after I finished RWBY finally hehehehehehe

[@irrevenant3]

23:05 Personally I still have my doubts that Oz was being completely honest with Oscar about what happened to Oscar's sister. But they've been pretty bad the last few seasons about letting the heroes genuinely screw up and face the consequences, so possibly not... :/ (EDIT: Ohey, great minds. :)

[@LuckiSir]

Tbh I could've imagined something like Hazel's sister awakening an overpowered semblance to which Ozpin manipulates her into joining Beacon (With clear dismay from Hazel).

[@rashan141]

@@LuckiSir I think a good way to tie it in would be that she 'died' and 'Amber' isn't who we think she is.

[@TheRockhound119]

One thing about Watts - his crowning achievement so far was being the mastermind behind the virus that allowed Cinder to actually do something to Vale, it isn't blatantly obvious however.

[@jacksonbrubaker1399]

Junior, the Twins, Cardin, Jacques, Whitley, Yuma, Trifa, Sienna, Tock, Vernal, Leo, and Watts are pretty good takes here I have nothing to add. I do have some small notes on three of the others and an essay for one of them though Cordo I'm surprised at your opinion, most are turned off with her over top personality. Tyrian's vocabulary I disagree with you and think it adds to the scenes he's in, he's one of my favorites to listen to. And finally Hazel you are right about him for the most part but I'm holding onto hope that with a more specific story he'll make more sense. Now here's a question for you Critter, multiple times you've said even if they do more with a character in the future you won't care because you say you are more or less done with them. Now I'm not saying that future development makes up for poor writing in the past and able to make that past writing good, but say Cinder or Hazel gets a backstory on the level of The Lost Fable (Or whatever backstory you just loved when you heard it). Can you say that you'd let past writing get in the way of enjoying a currently interesting story? Personally I highly dislike team CFVY but even in the short preview we got of After The Fall I was able to enjoy them there, not letting myself automatically close myself to the idea of the book. Now here's that essay I was talking about. Raven, perhaps the most controversial character that I've gotten into really good debates about. In this video you have two main points or scenes about her so let's get into it The first is when Raven and Qrow are at the bar. Personally I can see a little bit of that boredom in her talk with Qrow at the bar but I found it enjoyable the twins trying to talk around each other, what they say, what you can pick apart from it and looking back on it now the context we now know it is still interesting. Yang and Raven's interaction at the camp is your second point. It was confusing and you have a good point in some of it, like how Yang's past motivations seem to be gone or completely overridden by finding Ruby which is an admittedly weak reason But there were a few things that you missed and the delivery of them being so aggressive makes you sound like you are throwing a tantrum because you don't understand something that is in front of you. For instance are you really going to complain about Yang using Raven to find Ruby? Yang explains well enough that she doesn't know where Ruby is but does know that Qrow is with her and Raven can use her semblance to get to him. Combine that with Qrow letting Yang know where the Branwen tribe is it's much easier to find (maybe not negotiate a ride) Raven and use her semblance. That was explained to you in the show I shouldn't have to do it But there was one sentence in there I have major issues with "Raven's motivations for abandoning everyone was just 'I was curious if my daughter really could find me, no reason as to why'." And this is the worst part of the video. Not only did you leave out a large chunk of Raven's person like you did Mercury in your last video you again have something in front of you that you ignore then call the writing bad because of it. Never *once* did you touch on Raven and her relation to Ozpin, nor anything after Yang leaves her camp, or her role in the Battle of Haven, *or* how Yang verbally destroys her. If you had you can see that Raven is motivated by fear, doing what she thinks will give her the best chance to live, something that again Yang spelled out for your. This huge oversight in a video talking about RWBY's villains and their merits or lack of I can not believe has been made. You spent the time to talk about Yuma, Trifa, and Junior, how do you simply ignore such a vital piece of information about one of the four main girls' personal antagonists?

[@thejudgmentalcritter6584]

Alrighty! :D So lots of ties when I say I don't care about a character anymore it mostly means I'm not really looking forward to seeing them again, because I have very low expectations of what the scene's outcome will be. For the most part I haven't really given up on any of the characters, I'm still holding onto hope that some (or most in a perfect world) could get some really good character moments that help drive them forward. It's not necessarily just backstory hat would help me feel this way, I just want to see the characters BE characters rather than just tools to exposit lore or push the paper thin plot forward. The only characters I've really given up hope on are Adam and Cinder. It's too late for Adam but it would have to take a lot of really good character building for me to care about Cinder in the future. Maybe have her express some emotions other than "cocky" would be a good starting point. My biggest problems with raven and Qrow talking in the bar is in hindsight they could have really done a better job with it. Qrow is just asking her if she knows about the spring maidens' whereabouts, then in volume 5 when he talks with Leo he sounds like he's convinced Raven 100% knows that information. Maybe if Raven accidentally let slip Vernal's name or referenced her in some way to help push that scene forward. It feels like they didn't actually know what would happen in future volumes yet when they wrote the scene and kind of wrote themselves into a corner trying to hint at things that they themselves weren't sure about. I know Yang says she wanted to use Raven's teleportal to get her Qrow, it just really seems like the harder route for her to take. Taking a chance trying to hunt down Raven seems unnecessary when Ruby made it clear her destination was always to go to Haven. I feel like they could've kept it as Yang using her portals to get to Qrow if Yang's goals were more than just "get to Ruby". If Yang's idea was "I want to finally find my mom and confront her, while I'm there she can easily get me to my sister" then i think it would've been a great idea. but the fact Yang ignores addressing Raven about anything personal between them, she only cares about the portal feels like Raven was never really Yang's goal in the long run. also maybe if Yang didn't find Raven so quickly in the volume? Make it a struggle not just to get to Raven to show how committed Yang is on confronting her. it's not the easy path but she's going to meet her mom and get some answers no matter what. And your right! I didn't touch on Raven's mindset of Ozpin, mostly because I don't actually consider Oz as a villain? I feel like it's also unconnected to her abandonment of Yang. leaving Tai and Qrow behind? Sure, especially if Tai also knows about all that maidens and relics stuff. But I would actually think she would take Yang away with her to try to keep her safe from those kind of dangerous people. If Raven doesn't trust Ozpin and Qrow so much, why leave her daughter there in an environment where she's most likely to spend a lot of time with them and end up learning about maidens too? thanks for watching and commenting by the way! :D

[@demetriusprime1505]

@@thejudgmentalcritter6584 Maybe the worst case scenario with Adam is that they pull another Cinder and comes back "Crazier" than ever. Turning him into another Tyrian but with inconsistent build up at the very least. What are you talking about? Cinder had other emotions... When she didn't talk then went right back to being full of cock... I mean cocky. Full on cocky. Your last part about Raven again her mindset is that she's a coward willing to abandon her own child and husband to save herself that doesn't make much sense either considering if she just decided to quit being a Huntswoman to be a stay at home mom for the most part she could have avoided Salem WAY easier. But instead decides it's a good idea to roam around with bandits that are more than likely to be eaten by Grimm and get her into fights with other Huntsman. Yes she can fight them but you're still giving yourself away even worse by killing a Maiden and taking her powers then has the best idea ever of getting a Relic after being found out by Salem so she could use it to fight against Salem if she has to but leaves it to her daughter to be hunted instead. You can argue at first she joined the bandits to use as meat shields rather than her family because she loves them more but like I said she gave the Relic to her daughter in order to run away even using her husband as a quick portal to further her escape. Her mindset is all over the place in my eyes.

[@TheCosmicTiger]

I love Raven tbh. She's one of my favorite characters actually 😅

[@gipgap4]

Me too. She’s the most mysterious of the bunch and I think we’d like to know why she left her daughter and husband. It’s rarely black and white, usually shades of grey.

[@TheVTable]

I just wish she was better written

[@kaiyamazaki1684]

Hazel's motivation is especially stupid in retrospect when you get context from Volume 8 where it's highly suggested Grimm killed his sister lol

[@zendakon8299]

Glad someone else feels this way about Hazel.

[@josepharchuleta9809]

as for Hazel it makes a little more sense then Anakin terning to the darkside in Revenge of the Sith

[@tribacioustee2846]

Tyrian was the only villain I came here to defend. But I'm glad you see the value in him! Fingers crossed the rest of the inner circle step up to his level

[@vynonyoutube1418]

Agreed. All we need for Tyrian is for CRWBY not to fuck him up in the future, and maybe some info on how he got to side with Salem, and why he's so peculiar.

[@sohei7798]

Raven vs Qrow (I know it already happened but just go with) Raven-i need more power Vergil-wait that's my line...

[@MarshmallowHope536]

14:28 the virgin lionheart vs the chad Ironwood.

[@brianbrush5107]

17:34 I think what the show wants to set up is that he's the type of opponent who's more brain then brawn. In volume 3 the chip Roman used to take Contorl of ironwoods army had a W on it implying he created that

[@CodeTetsu]

You know Watts orchestrated the entire pieces for the Fall of Beacon right? He was arguably the most important on Salem's team until maybe Cinder now.

[@samanthapribble3306]

Is that confirmed? How did he orchestrate it, he just came up with the idea?

[@CodeTetsu]

@@samanthapribble3306 The Black Queen Virus was created by Watts which what was used to take over the Atlas tech. If you look when Cinder has her tablet in vol 3 there is the W which is Watt's symbol. This is the tablet Cinder used to mess with the tournament match ups and is why Penny was put up against Pyrrha. Also the Black Queen virus was on the scroll Neo put into the airship which took over all the robots. Do you honestly think Cinder was smart enough to do all this herself. She just used the tools Salem and Watts gave her to carry out the job. Watts looks too old to be able to get into Haven academy and so others had to do the job.

[@samanthapribble3306]

Magma Spacer oh yeah! I totally forgot about the black queen virus!

[@DarkSlasher36]

raven and vernal in volume 5 were basically a plot device, yang needs to get to mistral so finds raven for her semblance which'll get her there faster, raven is then spent spending an entire episode expositing, vernal is there to reveal the true maiden, raven is used to open the vault and basically gave it away without a fight to the heroes, well unless youre like miles and think bickering is a "word fight"

[@spencerbergstrom9848]

I would like to point out that Leo's shield is meant to look like a paint palette, making him also a reference to Leonardo D'Vinci

[@zendakon8299]

Truth is I love the two white fang members. It shows that now no side character has been overlooked.

[@metadaneholtzman7816]

Here's a question: What actually kept Weiss from leaving her home? I mean, I doubt any of the SDC staff have any Huntsmen Training or Combat Training, aside from security guards but other than that all she'd have to do is walk out of the front door and away. What's her dad going to do? Slap her? She can doge bullets and Slice through Metal, I doubt he could do anything Physical to her. Her Brother? Same thing. Mother? Would more likely help her. Ironwood? All she'd have to say is she'll be more than happy to testify against her Father for illegal and unsafe work environments and Abuse.

[@rashan141]

Cordo, Whitley, Junor's Gang, and Jacques are Antagonists... save for Whitley. Focusing on Weiss here, nothing Weiss does make me think she's worth the Heiress title. Whitley is the last line of Schnee that can inherit the title and has done nothing to Weiss, not even INDIRECTLY think of that, to take it from her. Whitley deserves the title of Heir more than Weiss ever will, whether that was good for him is debatable. You know, because of all that TLC Schnee tutoring the Schnee siblings have gone through? /s Seriously, what did Weiss expect to happen after everything she'd done, leading up to this?

[@handhelder823]

Why does he deserve it more?

[@rashan141]

​@@handhelder823 Because, unlike Weiss, his attention isn't split. He's not trying to learn to be a businessman by day and a fighter by night. He's learning to be a PURE businessman, like Jacques. Jacques is likely keeper a closer hold on Whitley due to Weiss leaving for Beacon. Whitley's the only heir he has left who listens to him and I doubt he's going to miss his THIRD TRY at this, even though he's a crap parent. Back onto Whitley, Weiss, since we've first seen her, doesn't possess the true qualities to be a businesswoman. She's easily riled up, petty, emotional, and has a sort of entitlement to her that wouildn't run well in the type of business wars that Jacques faces on a daily basis. Weiss tries to be a fighter and pencil pusher, two horribly diametrically different things and it's been shown that she is more of a Huntress than a woman who does business. That's why I believe Whitley deserves the title more. Besides the fact that Weiss and Winter took said title for granted and either left or discarded it, it's all Whitley has left. It's _rightfully_ his. When both former heiresses treat the title and the very power said title has with little respect or intelligence, they don't deserve it. Especially by the point where we are in the show.

[@handhelder823]

@@rashan141 ok. You make sense

[@OneManCast]

Hold up. "Jacques is not a true antagonist" "Jacques is everything Weiss does not want to be". Holy heck, way to bury the idea into the ground, since that would qualify as antagonism.

[@kori4264]

Going back to rewatch that scene with raven it was brought up why she went to raven instead of ruby. She had no way of confirming if ruby ever got to haven and she knew that qrow was with her so it was easier in her mind to take Ty’s tip as to where raven was than go straight to mistral and wait for ruby to get there. In her mind thanks to Ty’s tip of where raven was it was likely just a lot faster and guaranteed she’d get to ruby by going to raven then try and find ruby in mistral or across anima(it is still a bit of a cop out)

[@brandonontama2415]

Honestly, what has Ozpin done wrong? I failed to understand the fanbase hatred of him, all he did was inform Phyrra that he thought she would be the best candidate for the in fact while fighting Cinder he tells Phyrra to go and get help she was the one who decided to go on an suicide mission.

[@lightdragoon88]

Because he put her in a spot where she didnt have a choice. Opzin had her be the only one to ask if she 'wants' the maiden power and to tell no one about it. Instead of having 2 or 3 people to ask (in theory if pyrrha said no he would have to ask someone else) and have those 2-3 girls talk to each other, he left Pyrrha alone with herself knowing that she would say yes because as Jaune said, that is who she is.

[@brandonontama2415]

@@lightdragoon88 How is getting maiden powers to protect humanity any different from being an huntress and fighting an never ending wave of grimm until you die? And she did have an choice and she said yes, Ozpin knowing she would say yes isn't manipulation, he told her the situation asked for her help and she said yes. Him asking alone honestly would make him more suspicious since he asking an teenage girl to take this great power without anyone company. If I sell an product to someone and I know he will say yes I'm I forcing the guy to buy the product simply because I know he will say yes? Of course not that's faulty logic. Phyrra is someone that wants to help people so of course she would want to do so, it would be no different if it was any other character.

[@lightdragoon88]

@@brandonontama2415 again he should of ask more than just pyrrha. Instead he pretty much said "either take this power that could erase your entire personally or let the bad guys get it."

[@samanthapribble3306]

Lightdragoon88 Phyrra did have a choice, but her obsession with destiny just made her think there was no other option. And since she said yes right away there was no red for Oz to ask any other girls. He wanted to keep maidens as much of a secret to the general populous As he could.

[@lightdragoon88]

@@samanthapribble3306 again: she had no choice because 1) Opzin knew she would say yes and 2) once Cinder attacked and she was the only person in beacon who knew about the maiden. She had the illusion of choice, but it was an ultimatum.

[@electricblaster7798]

Even though Hazel was disappointing, he did make a good quote in Volume 4. "Don't let such a small obstacle block your path."

[@manumainio]

Hazel was the most interesting of the villains before the custerfuck that was season 5. He still has potential and hope, it they shed more light on his backstory and give him a proper fight.

[@OneManCast]

I have high hopes for Jacques, because I feel like he's the one villain that not even Miles and Kerry can fuck up. A 5 year old could write an effective Jacques.

[@jell00motto]

Looks at KZbin recommendations: Ooooh this looks interesting! Watches video: Damn, this person is so judgmental. Looks at username: oh.

[@rayseaman6204]

Vernal was a perfect soldier. She was completely loyal to Raven and Her Tribe, following Her orders to the end. Admirable.

[@joaovictordioud7242]

I was like "i heard this voice before, who is it ?". It took me 1 year to figure out that i watch your sisters channel

[@Hiya8partyz]

I want to say something: RWBY’s writing gets a lot more shot after Monty passed. Rest In Peace Monty

[@irrevenant3]

The weird thing was Cardin bullying Velvet. When you saw later in the season that Velvet was a senior student and what she could do when she cut loose? He's just super lucky she was so passive about the whole thing...

[@samanthapribble3306]

More importantly, what’s a senior student doing in a freshman history class?

[@irrevenant3]

@@samanthapribble3306 Were they in class together? The bullying I recall took place in the common eating area.

[@samanthapribble3306]

irrevenant3 later they had a history class with Oobkeck, and the students were RWBY, JNPR, Cardin, and velvet was there to answer Oobleck when he asked if anyone had seen or suffered from Faunus discrimination

[@irrevenant3]

@@samanthapribble3306 Huh, I'd forgotten that bit. Really good point.

[@RedEveTillDawn]

Also the fact that the rest of team CFVY didn’t beat cardins ass for bullying velvet

[@augustbeller]

16:01 Watz (mighta spelt it wrong) created the black queen virus which caused cinder to give her speech when Pyrrha killed Penny, Gave cinder the info on Penny, aloud cinder to choose who fights who, in the tournament, and caused the Atlesian knights to go all evil mode so I’d say he’s done a lot and since team Rwby is in Atlas now we’re definitely gonna see more of him

[@immortalgamer3960]

I don't remember what video I heard this from, but it was about the RWBY crew talking about things that were left unfinished when Monty passed. There was apparently a scene that had been written where Raven ambushed team JNPR in a cafe but there was no context given behind why so it was never developed further. It makes me not only wonder not only what her original motivations were supposed to be, but also about the REALLY slow burn about what it is that makes John so special. (Finger's crossed that doesn't turn out to be something boring, like he's Ozpin's descendant from a previous life or something.)

[@happyllama4255]

I'm just enjoying this person yelling about Raven's dialogue scenes

[@unclekarma1855]

I wish Hazel had a kind of domination semblance making him seem even more threataning like your trying to fight him but also keeping yourself from cowering in fear. Also I wish Leo had Hazel's semblance and it would unleash a new split personality of a brave and viscious side of him(taking inspiration of story). Well what can ya do whats done is done

[@shadowrosegaming3566]

When it comes to Hazel's blaming of ozpin it could be ozpin was the teacher his sister was with on her mission that would make the most sense on why he blames oz

[@irrevenant3]

13:24 Oh holy crap how did I not see that. >_< I had Oz, Glenda and Leo picked. Aaaargh...

[@matthewflynn5458]

Just thought of something. Imagine if Hazel's father was Ozpin. Like. When Ozpin reincarnated into his headmaster body the person who occupied the body before that was Hazel's father. Imagine if Hazel felt that Ozpin forced his father into becoming a part of him and resented that he lost his dad to this spirit that basically possessed him. This would also make it more interesting when he confronted Oscar. He'd be furious that Ozpin was going to destroy this child's life like he destroyed Hazel's father's life. Great video.

[@ninjamonkey508]

thinking about it, wouldnt it be interesting if during one of the later volumes we get a flashback for ruby to when she first made crescent rose and come to find out that she actually got the idea of how it functions by looking at conveniently placed blue prints for it from Watts?

[@handhelder823]

Like a newly developed farming tool, developed by Dr. Arthur Watts, in coorperation with the Atlus agrarcultural ministary

[@nonbeenary]

They could have made Hazel's motivation interesting if it was something like Oz saw potential in Hazel's sister so he sent her on a secret mission (like he did with Qrow and Raven) and she died as a result

[@darthsauron255]

Great video, like always!

[@qaterdargon4041]

raven is still my favourite villain, her introduction and scenes could have been changed to make her 100x better. Yang meeting Raven could’ve opened up with some dialogue, then a quick fight scene between the 2 so Raven can test Yangs strength and Yang can let out all the negative feelings towards Raven, that would be a fun introduction to Ravens character. I hope we see Raven again, she has has had the best fight scene in season 5

[@kaialexander6806]

I would love for Hazel's sister to have been a maiden who died. Like maybe she was the Fall Maiden before Amber and that's why Amber is so considered inexperienced because she didn't get proper training beforehand.

[@jorgeperez2872]

Legit they could've Hazel related to one of Ozpin's past lives or be one of them, he resisted his influence somehow, Salem get him and extended life time and ultimately just wanted Ozpin to not jump into other people.

[@JeanneMyBeloved]

I love Melanie and so sad they underused her so much , I literally want her model ported to SFM just to create animations like fighting animations involving her and her style since I love her concept so much

[@zendakon8299]

I agree. Lionheart had SO MUCH MEANING AND IMPORTANT, and he's completely a coward now! Like WTF?!

[@Lewj-c4s]

You know honestly with how much foresight we thought oswin had vs how much he really had it would surprise me if both the teachers accompanying students and the risk levels were new editions so Hazel’s blame of Ozwin would make more sense because it was his lack of foresight that got his sister killed

[@infiniteoctopaw]

My problem with the villain is they don’t seem to want anything. They have plans that they plot but they have no reason.

[@wagkayongano5264]

Leo's weapon is basically Yu Gi Oh and Bayblade combined

[@AwSamWeston]

This series was really cool, but better audio equipment would have done wonders for the videos' quality.

[@locosword3985]

"Now we just have to sit here and wait for volume 7 and hope he gets some much needed screen time." Got some news for you.

[@gommodore6441]

15:50 He seems to be the main villain for Volume 7

[@aidankeogh9994]

One potentially enthralling character I see amongst this bunch is Whitley. Winter was to be the original heiress to the Schnee Dust Company, but Jacque gave her too much freedom and he now has no control over her. Weiss was to be the next heiress candidate and is somewhat susceptible to Jacque's influence, but has both the will and strength to break away from it for the people she truly cares about. But with Whitley, Jacque has learned from his mistakes, and finally learned exactly how to mold his son into what he wants him to be. After Jacque informs Weiss that she is no longer the heiress and storms out of her room, we see but the briefest blink-and-you'll-miss-it moment of expression from Whitley outside the door. Anxiety, concern and doubt. Before, as soon as his father comes into view, he's once more the stoic and unsympathetic son Jacque raised him to be. I hold out hope for Whitley as he's clearly been most thoroughly poisoned by the influence of his father, to such an extent that neither Winter nor Weiss seem to care for him. Considering they were all each other had to lean on, and Whitley has nothing... he's perhaps the most tragic of all the Schnees.

[@The_Prizessin_der_Verurteilung]

Cardin was the antagonist of... [Jaune]'s [arc] Lol. This amuses me

[@franciscoadasilvajr4514]

Okay, but I would LOVE with the reason Raven say so much exposition was that she REALLY wanna to be a history teacher

[@solsun7350]

Rwby Villains are in two categories. Saturday cartoon villains that aren't important and don't matter. The important Villains that matter. The problem with Rwby is that nearly all of the Villains are Saturday cartoon Villains. Change my mind

[@andrewlance3898]

That's an insult to Saturday cartoon villains. That category would include villains like Slade (Teen Titans) and Nox (Wakfu), who are each more complex and compelling than all of Team WTCH put together

[@fightingmedialounge519]

Slade is complex? I don't know about that.

[@Shadowchellen]

yeah, I agree; I think Hazel's motive falls flat and the fact it would be better if Ozpin forced the whole Maiden crap on his sister which leads to her death. (Aka a similar situation with Pyrrha) and maybe another motive he could have is that Saleem tells him that she can bring his sister back to life if he works for her by using the relics (whenever if it's a lie or not) Although I do like his character.

[@sunkenobi1501]

I'm thinking there's more to this story than meets the eye.

[@sambutler953]

I would’ve much preferred Hazel just be a stoic force of nature. Oz would only be scared of him because of the chaos he brings as Salem’s muscle. Maybe Hazel was one of the first to join Salem, and he personally killed Oz at one point. Something better than “My sister died at YOUR school so it’s YOUR fault!” That’s like saying I spilled coffee on *your* rug, so it’s *your* mess to clean. No, it’s my coffee, and I’m the one who should be worrying about cleaning it. Same thing with Hazel; if his sister died, then he shouldn’t have let her become a Huntress.

[@LoraCoggins]

There are just way too many characters overall in this show.

[@Halfassedtea]

s o m e o n e s a i d i t

[@pinkgoth6]

it breaks my heart every second that red themed blind character isnt established

[@zubetube7111]

I think in volume 3 qrow tells yang how to track Raven down, when he tells her that he’s still in touch with her