What Makes You Think You're The Credit Card Exception?

[@MikeMarshall1411]

Im 33. Ive never paid 1 cent of cc interest. But the cash back - 6% on groceries, 3% on gas, and 2% on everything else (personal + work spending) - pays for all christmas gifts and a beach trip every year. One thing I'll never be on board with that Dave recommends.

[@toddrobinson8852]

Absolutely! I loose $ when I don't use a credit card. I pay for EVERYTHING with my cc and accumulate cash back...just pay the entire bill at the end of the month👍

[@ToOpen6seven]

Exactly -- everything he says is not gospel.

[@WeBeatMedicare6969]

Who do you think pays for your rewards?

[@WeBeatMedicare6969]

@@toddrobinson8852 *lose

[@sevenscreens5640]

I do the exact same. Pay for everything with CC and use whatever I get at the end of the year on Christmas Gifts. I'm 30 and neither have I ever paid any CC interest in 12 years. Just pay it off in full.

[@phillipsouthard8285]

I don't understand why people call into the Ramsey Show with a credit card question like he's going to completely flip on the stuff he's been saying for decades now. Is he right? Not all the time, but the people I know who just used credit cards for points and then pay it off before interest hits, have made mistakes. They missed a payment, they lost a job, they had a health scare, they had an unexpected car or house repair. Where did they pay for it? Credit card. Credit cards can be a great tool in wealth building, but if you're a person who already needs Dave Ramsey's plan, you aren't a credit card person.

[@calebcoleman4066]

100%

[@titan4599]

200%

[@deliz870]

300%

[@Jumperman12mac]

0%

[@GMDOCNICE]

5000% -Dalia Dippilito💀

[@blackworldtraveler3711]

I've lost count of the people I have met traveling first class to Hawaii using their credit card miles through the years. It was just a vacation and not to become a millionaire. Dave is the only person that says this.

[@todd2456]

That argument is getting so old ... the "no millionaire said they made their wealth using a credit card for points." While that's true, that doesn't mean that probably most of those millionaires didn't use a credit card during the time they were becoming wealthy.

[@slyfoxx2973]

Hardly the point as the amount gained is rather insignificant in the scope of a life. Where do you want to focus your attention? The baby steps are the foundation of the plan so most focus on only them and not the reasons they actually work. Might want to look up hyperbole while you're at it. Good day Sir.

[@adamseidel9780]

@@slyfoxx2973 do you consider $1500-2000 annually insignificant?

[@mightymouse9001]

@@adamseidel9780 exactly. My wife and I are on the FIRE path and spending only $25-30k a year. Opening 3-4 credit cards a year easily gets us $2k in value from sign up bonuses and cash back. I wouldn’t say almost 10% of yearly expenses is insignificant

[@slyfoxx2973]

@@adamseidel9780 Pretty much. Yes.

[@todd2456]

@@slyfoxx2973 Might want to look up "totally missed the assignment" while you're at it.

[@jyfsb8067]

I’ve paid my credit cards off every single month for over a decade. Never been charged a cent of interest.

[@roythousand13]

Good for you! However, there are millions of Americans who have balances on their credit cards, and they are paying interest on those balances. That's why people like Dave Ramsey are needed!

[@jyfsb8067]

@@roythousand13 no, you’re missing the point. Ramsey is saying even if you have the best credit and are financially sound to still never use credit cards. I disagree. Credit cards can be beneficial if used properly. Like I said I’ve been using them over a decade and have never paid any interest + I’ve received cash in return for using them.

[@user-yb5bg8im5g]

51% do pay off each month. dave systems, inc is a great path. we just get crancy with the condecenion @@roythousand13

[@DEBTFREEMIKE769]

Same ole cc argument. Either use it properly or just use a debit card. This argument will never end.

[@TheFlyingZulu]

I'm an exception to the credit card rule. I treat a CC like a debit card and spend my money accordingly.

[@JakeStewart1343]

I'm an exception to the Airline miles/ wealth rule. I wouldn't have made it without my Airline miles. 👍

[@Squeenix1]

I’m also very stingy with money but most people can’t help themselves

[@gauseb]

$2 back on $100 sure isn't much but 2% back on groceries and gas, and insurance every year can easily amount to $500-1000.. That's a free grocery run every year. It's not about getting wealthy, it's just a nice little bonus

[@sunsetatshabooms4558]

agreed. Dave even says, every little bit helps

[@jakejakeman4591]

You would have to spend 25,000 bucks to get 500 back and 50,000 to get 1000 back. if you’re spending 50,000 on groceries, gas, and insurances, you’re doing something wrong dude😂 if you have that much money, just save a thousand of it and then you’re at the same finish line.

[@MrJimmy3459]

LOL!!! It will take you 10-15 YEARS spending on groceries to get 500 back

[@dennis007]

For a family with no eat out, the following basics are added up to $25,000 Utilities (Electricity, Natural Gas, Water, Garbage/Waste ...) $3,500.00 Auto Gasoline $2,000.00 Auto Insurance $2,500.00 Home Insurance $1,000.00 Telephone/Cell $1,500.00 Groceries/Household $10,000.00 Property Tax $6,000.00 Internet $700.00 Clothing ? Auto repair/maintenance ? Medical Insurance ?

[@mightymouse9001]

@@MrJimmy3459 my wife and I get a new credit card with a new sign up bonus whenever we finish one. We’re always working towards some type of $200 - $400 sign up bonus. And then you double it because there’s 2 of us. You really can get back thousands yearly if you looked into what’s called “credit card churning”

[@Caiti_spud]

I listen to Dave on the regular, and I don't have any debt, have an emergency fund, invest and save, but I use credit cards -- have been able to fly first class domestically and internationally using points. But like, what answer did Kathy expect from Dave? She was just antagonizing and condescending to him and she didn't even provide a solid argument when it comes to using credit cards.

[@ToOpen6seven]

I am like you and I use my one credit card just because I do for somethings, I don't care about the points. I get them, but that is not my goal. Yes, I am different and I won't spend more with a credit card. I just don't. But when I had bogus charges on my debit vs my credit card, the level of protection is way better for the credit card. I don't care what Dave and his cohost is saying SOME people know how to use a credit card in a smart way. I am still going to pay my home off early, I still am out of debt except for my mortgage, I still paid off a new car in 1 year and 4 months. I don't get pleasure out of using my credit card and I use it sparingly. I had to travel for work and yes I had to use my credit card to purchase my airline ticket. Yes, I was reimbursed (thank goodness) within a few days. Dave is correct that for most people they are not smart with credit cards and what I feel the real temptation is when you have more than one (a Lowes, a Macy's, a Best Buy etc etc -- all these different credit cards is not smart).

[@nathangallagher5112]

If you are using the points to go on even more trips (in first class) than you likely would have otherwise then I doubt you are saving any money. And you are likely racking up even more junk on the card during these trips. Even one unneeded purchase of $20 will undo $1000 you've spent with the card, then you are losing money from there.

[@mastafull]

I just switched my debit card to a credit card and spend like I normally would without thinking it's anyone's money but my own. I get 2% cash back on everything I spend each month, including my autopay bills. It's not enough money to make me wealthy or anything, but it's more money than I would have otherwise. Of course you need to be disciplined to never miss a payment and keep your mindset right, which I understand most people can't do which is why CC companies exist.

[@mightymouse9001]

@@nathangallagher5112 you’re making up a scenario where one automatically takes more expensive trips just because they’re using a credit card. This sounds realistic on paper, but if you’re someone concerned about their balance, you don’t automatically buy business class because of a credit card. Also if I end up going on more trips in my lifetime, doesn’t sound like a bad balance. Getting what I paid for, for less money overall vs using cash

[@costco_pizza]

The thing is @Caiti_spud is that NO millionaire ever said they became millionaires off of airline points. Ditch your credit cards and use cash. You may think you are winning the game with credit cards but you are not.

[@stevenmitchell9182]

Dave and jade are both insightful, but I don’t agree with the CC take. It does take discipline, but totally doable. I only use CC and pay the balance of every month. You could use cards to pay your mortgage/rent and bills. That’s money you were going to spend anyways. Why not get the little incentive? I literally have 3k worth of point statements or travel. It feels good to take the family on vacation and not have to spend a dime of my money. It’s not a get rich game. Depending on your bills, you could earn thousands of dollars in redemptions. I’ll keep using my cards and maintain that 800 credit score.

[@theflightsimulationexperie6894]

Everything you said makes 💯 % sense. But this is Dave Ramsey and his approach is always one size fits all. I wouldn’t be surprised if he has changed his views on this subject but is too embarrassed to come clean as he doesn’t want to be labeled as a flip flopper.

[@DJHesterman]

totally agree. he always uses the "none of our millionaires in our study say that was the reason they got rich.". of course that's not how they got rich, but over 90% of millionaires are using credit cards. it's just one more way to get a little more out of every dollar. I've been using credit cards for 15 years and never paid a penny of interest. meanwhile I've gotten 2 percent back on basically all my spending that whole time which has amounted to thousands in extra cash.

[@DJHesterman]

Also, they always say "I'm not paying for a trip with points earned on the back of a single mother barely getting by." But credit cards can pay for the cash back from usage alone without even having to rely on interest payments.

[@XennialGuy]

​@@DJHestermanSame here. I didn't become a millionaire getting rewards points, but I also didn't become a millionaire throwing away free money. I have to spend it anyway, so why not get 2% from the bank if I'm disciplined, to the tune of an extra $1500 a year? Debit cards give you nothing and do NOT provide the same protection as a CC. I will NEVER allow a merchant direct access to my checking through a debit card.

[@rossmcgreg6r642]

Love all these reasonable comments.

[@AshSrinivas]

Why do people call in to argue with Dave? Why don't they just do whatever they want without calling in to argue? 😂

[@harrykashouli9774]

Because it's fake. It's one of his staff members.

[@kevincc3293]

​@@harrykashouli9774I thought of this...not just credit card calls,lot of other call sounds fake..

[@rockystaatz521]

Actually I use them on things that you’re going to pay anyway (utility, gas) and get cash back just to pay them what you are already having to pay to live

[@JA-re8gi]

I've used credit cards for over 15 years and have never owed on them. It just takes a little bit of self discipline.

[@silkamilkamonico]

Dave's rational for not using credit cards is because it subconsciously allows you to spend more. If that's the case then he isn't a firm believer in going off a straight budget.

[@mightymouse9001]

@@silkamilkamonicoohhhh crap never considered that. Good point. If you have a budget then you just funnel through the card and get points! I think the real reason is that the people that need help are the ones that are completely terrible with finances and are better off just going cold turkey. Dave is like the beginners guide to finance for those that dug a hole

[@jack0451]

Wait until you lose your job.

[@dedalliance1]

@@jack0451 Yeah emergency funds don't exist.

[@mightymouse9001]

@@jack0451 I only use my credit card if I have the cash to back it up. Better to have cash stay in the HYSA until the bill is actually due

[@BlackExcellenceProductions]

Ppl try so hard to defend their credit card use. Like dude if it works for you, all good. But the fact of the matter is must ppl are losing with credit cards.

[@littlebob1261]

It's too bad so many people are bad with money, I get 2% cash back every month for everything. They will literally pay you if you are capable of controlling your spending to ensure you pay your bill in full each month.

[@libertarian4323]

About half of all cc users pay their cards off in full every month.

[@Fedgery007]

Whose argument is I’m getting rich because I’m using a credit card?! Nobody says that.

[@titusvandussen6303]

Nobody. It's a strawman argument used by Dave. Millionaires use credit cards, regardless of how they made their money.

[@BetterNBetter]

Exactly! The wealthy use debt and credit lines to finance and leverage their assets all the time. I love Dave but he isn’t completely correct on this.

[@TheMCGamer2012]

Unfortunately, Dave can't admit that the studies and negative side effects of owning a credit card only apply to the "average person". The problem is that nobody thinks they are the average person, so he must be firm with blanket advice on credit cards, when in reality there are legitimate exceptions...

[@roythousand13]

NO EXCEPTIONS!

[@chrisforker7487]

It’s not your “Break Through “, but it probably made me 4-5k in cash back over 5+years. I’ll take it and I never run a balance, so it worked out for me personally.

[@lawrence-juniornalty]

They often build these strawman arguments where credit cards are concerned: "You spend $100 to get back $2. Whoopdeedoo" Well if you were going to spend $100 anyway, may as well get $2 back

[@robloxvids2233]

Does Dave tell nobody to drink because some percentage can't handle it and become alcoholic? This comes down to the user. I get about $1,000 cashback at the end of the year and don't spend a dime to do so. If you are reckless don't do it. If you're on Baby Step 4/5/6 and responsible, go for it. I wouldn't do it if you're on step 1, 2, or 3.

[@robertperry814]

I do the same thing on a cash back card. I've noticed that whenever this question comes up the caller is always talking about airline miles or "points", never about plain cash back.

[@MrEternalFool]

A large percentage of CC users end up spending more. A small percentage of people who drink become alcoholics.

[@robloxvids2233]

@MrEternalFool That's on them. I don't really buy that someone (on step 4/5/6) will spend more because they are swiping a credit card instead of debit. It feels the same. But let's say for those people they can at least move all their recurring auto-pay over to CC. Energy bill, cable, phone, internet, streaming, insurance premiums, water, etc.

[@MrMaramor]

I’m not against the general message. Lots of people have issues and yes no one gets rich from credit cards but them. It’s not about getting rich from them, it’s about using a tool properly. If your struggling then cut them up.

[@samueldion-dundas5219]

Ramsey is pretty hawkish when it comes to credit cards. His 'never do credit cards' solution is more for uneducated, impulsive people who spend like mad anytime they have the chance rather than for responsible people. It's the financial equivalent of someone who can't control their liquor and therefore never ever ever drinks again. You do you, but I'm enjoying my wine on a friday night, and my 801 credit score all thanks to credit cards.

[@justinbrown6922]

As long as you budget and have the money to pay it off every month why not get rewarded something rather than nothing?

[@abark]

@@sanshinobi3664 I am not an emotionally driven woman, so using a credit card or paying cash has no impact on my peace of mind.

[@NickRaeff]

This caller should listen to Caleb Hammer. If you CAN handle it, use it.

[@CrazyBomber22]

Typically employers give you a choice: get a corporate credit card (paid by employer), or use your personal credit card (paid by you). If you buy flights on corporate card, you have no risk, and you get no points. If you buy flights on your personal credit card, you get the points but you're responsible for payment - until you are reimbursed by your employer, of course. If you work for a decent company, they're pretty good at reimbursing your expenses. The risk is negligible, but it's there.

[@BaconMountainMan]

I travel a fair amount of time and I have a corporate credit card. I don't charge anything on my personal cards.

[@skynard117]

I know a handful of millionaires, I’ve never met one that didn’t use credit cards for the rewards. They all pay them off and never owe on them. I’ve had one for 15 years, never paid a penny of interest on it. It’s like coupons, nobody will get rich using them, but every little bit helps. If you are responsible enough to save money and follow Dave’s baby steps then you are responsible enough to treat your credit card like it’s a debit card and pay it off the second you use it, then get free air miles for doing so.

[@mtMage3]

Handful of millionaires vs 10,137 millionaires in the largest survey of millionaires ever conducted. Sample size is important.

[@skynard117]

@@mtMage3 did you become a millionaire because of your credit card? Guarantee none of them said yes. Versus do you have and use a credit card? I have yet to meet a millionaire in real life that thinks credit cards are evil and will bankrupt you. I would bet 90% of millionaires use them and never pay any interest.

[@rossmcgreg6r642]

@@mtMage3 Do you know how Dave calculates someone being a millionaire?

[@mtMage3]

@@rossmcgreg6r642 The way that everyone does. Net-worth.

[@abark]

@@skynard117 who would ever ask someone if they became a millionaire because of their credit card? That would immediately qualify the person asking as a blithering moron.

[@stevegolacks8731]

But Dave, I follow a lot of your advice, and I have never met a millionaire who said I AM A MILLIONAIRE because I ONLY used debit cards. Think about that. Your credit card quip is inaccurate

[@amireallythatgrumpy6508]

You've probably knowingly never met a millionaire at all

[@XennialGuy]

​@@amireallythatgrumpy6508Well, I fall into the millionaire category. I didn't become a millionaire getting rewards points, but I also didn't become a millionaire throwing away free money. I have to spend it anyway, so why not get 2% from the bank if I'm disciplined, to the tune of an extra $1500 a year. Debit cards give you nothing and do NOT provide the same protection as a CC. I will NEVER allow a merchant direct access to my checking through a debit card.

[@zackwheat5770]

No millionaires have a “breakthrough moment” spending money on a debit card either.

[@nathangallagher5112]

No, but at least debit cards haven't pulled Americans into over $1 trillion in high interest debt.

[@mightymouse9001]

@@nathangallagher5112 Americans pulled Americans into high interest debt. Let’s take some accountability here

[@tywebbgolfenthusiast8950]

@@mightymouse9001 I applaud this comment. this strikes right at the heart of everything that’s wrong with the world right now. Its as simple as this: if you always believe you are a victim, then you are admitting that you have no ability to improve your life and someone else is steering the ship that is you.

[@Matt_Dagostino]

@@nathangallagher5112 Debit cards are issued by banks. I thought the general consensus is that banks are the scum of the earth because they charge poor people exorbitant overdraft fees. It is up to you as the cardholder to use your card (credit, debit, or otherwise) responsibly. Stop making excuses and hold yourself accountable. It's no else's fault but your own. You knew the terms and conditions when you signed up. Adhere to them or pay the consequences

[@feliperiossanchez7229]

You totally missed the point 🤦‍♂️

[@Robmar40]

Its just as painful using a credit card vs a debit card. I watch what I spend for both the same.

[@adamseidel9780]

Yes, and SIGNIFICANTLY more painful using either than using cash.

[@jimroscovius]

Most people don't.

[@Robmar40]

@@jimroscovius DR assumes everybody is wired the same which is not true.

[@Treerootz1]

I always pay it off immediately. I don’t give a shit other people can’t

[@brentsmelser]

She didn’t have a question. She came in with an axe to grind and the thought she was going to get permission from Dave and live radio.

[@cantfindneutral]

I personally only have 1 credit card that I pay off in full when any purchase posts, I don’t trust using my debit card in card readers anymore.

[@BigWally975]

“I use my visa debit card rather than a visa credit card because I don’t want to support the bad company called visa….”

[@realjohnnyharrison]

Visas just the processor, they don’t issue the cards or charge interest

[@lionelhuts875]

​@@realjohnnyharrisonThe point still stands for the issuing banks.

[@superblump87]

​@@realjohnnyharrisonVisa still makes money by charging the bank transaction fees when you use your debit card. Do you think Visa does that for free?

[@tywebbgolfenthusiast8950]

@@superblump87 visa is just the clearinghouse. Banks issue the cards and the consumer debt that the customers have incurred sits on the banks balance sheet. Banks also sign up the merchants. A customer of bank A uses their card at a merchant of bank B. Bank B passes those transactions, along with any transactions from Banks C, D, or E, to visa. Visa routes those transactions back to the issuing bank. Bank B collects interchange fees from the merchant. Some of this interchange gets passed back to the issuing bank…which funds rewards programs. FYI, I am a graduate of Bankcard School and worked 35 years for a founding member of visa. And a note to @bigwally975: last I checked, my debit card is Visa branded, too.

[@yelenawhitmer1329]

I always overspend, when I use CC for points, at the end of the month I paid all balances… but still overspend! This month I decided use debit only. So surprisingly, very first time I have money left after I paid all my bills! Thanks so much for advice , Mr. Dave. P.S. This month I lost approximately $12.00 as a cash buck, this is how much I use to get from my CC … but I save approximately $250.00, because I stop overspending!

[@phatbetbruh]

Same here. This month (June), debit only and it's making me pay attention!

[@newp848]

Thank Christ Almighty someone gets it

[@rodrigofernandez9055]

A CC is a layer of protection. You will change your mind when scammers clone your debit card.

[@MrBrewman95]

Just use the same budgeting as if you use a debit card. You got 100 max to spend for groceries, you spend 100 or less on your credit card.

[@aolvaar8792]

???? start the month with $10K in checking or pay a $4K CC bill at the end of the month. either way $6K in checking left, which is refilled by SSA.

[@fornx8574]

My close friend got a job doing maintenance work at an expensive resort. He was ASKED to get HVAC certified so they can move him up with higher pay and higher job title. They said they would pay for the tuition. He agreed. He paid for the schooling every single semester and when it came time to collect the money from the company, they denied it, saying it was never communicated on paper. They agreed to pay month after month, they knew he was actively enrolled. He now works at another company, paid 5k for a certification he does not need and was totally let down. Just because the company makes a clear statement and they are financially stable does not mean they will honor their word. The guy is a single father with three kids and the children live with him full time. He doesn't even get child support. Just because they hired you does not mean they have your back.

[@wewhoareabouttodiesaluteyo9303]

He should have received it in writing. I never trust private employers.

[@fornx8574]

@@wewhoareabouttodiesaluteyo9303 That was the first thought I had when he told me the story as well. Get everything in writing. He was in his early 20s and it was his first non-restaurant job. He should have gotten it in writing but they also should not have exploited a young. eager, worker.

[@krobdawg]

"Kind of a problem isn't it?" "For him absolutely" "For you too" Lmaooooo

[@carolcole9789]

I Love Queen Jade's Laugh 😂

[@jimmymcgill6778]

Stop with these strawman arguments. So what if she have to pay for it. She is getting it back. No one is saying they are gonna became wealthy from point and cash back. You pay it off. There's no problems.

[@AbidingHopeMentalHealthCoach]

“We’ve never experienced that situation.” Yeah, so hadn’t the guy with $11,000 on his credit card before it happened. Good grief! 🤦🏻‍♀️🤷🏻‍♀️

[@briansager3744]

Okay, so the alternative is he put those expenses on his debit card instead of his credit card. The company still goes under, he still gets stuck with the bill. Is that better?

[@austinduke8876]

I don't even understand why Dave Ramsey even takes these calls anymore. He's so thoroughly stated his position and rationale for it that the only thing you can do is agree or disagree but as far as Ramsey is concerned there isn't a debate to be had.

[@stevegolacks8731]

Because someday he will change his mind on CC use. 80% of HARDCORE dave followers still use credit cards, and pay it off monthly. A study was done and proved this. He will either come around, or after he is gone, Rachel will tweak that silly rule. Debit cards are dangerous!! just like cash! no way!

[@jack8356]

Because he makes money on youtube. What else

[@jimmymcgill6778]

They seems fake at this point.

[@MrJimmy3459]

@@stevegolacks8731 80% LOL, you pull that out of you A$$

[@amireallythatgrumpy6508]

@@jack8356 The money he makes on KZbin would be about 0.1% of the money his business makes overall...

[@jonb3189]

Dave is just being silly. If you can handle a credit card and can pay it off every month, then use it. If you can't handle it, then just tare it up. Personally, every month I've always paid them off in full and therefore paid zero in interest. And, I've flown internationally countless times for free. Also credit cards have allowed my to get mortgages from different banks and credit unions for my houses. Without credit cards building my credit score, I'd have close to nothing. To put this another way, if you have the discipline, credit cards are wonderful.

[@Winnie-Kay]

"we haven't experienced that." Hahaha Neither had the example guy until he did.

[@thejakelegion]

I AM the credit card exception. LOL. It's physically painful to swipe a card knowing I have to pay it later. I literally buy more things with cash because it's a "buy once, cry once" feeling and passes quickly. I spend less when I know I have a CC bill coming at the end of my month. So I use a credit card, pay it off every month and don't buy crap I don't need. Saving up to buy a house. :)

[@handleyobusiness]

😂😂😂

[@MrClassicmetal]

There's always 100s of people in these comments sections who are "the exception".😆

[@thejakelegion]

Do I encourage people to get a credit card? No. Do I think it's my ticket to wealth? No. Do I chase after airline miles? No. I just use it and keep moving forward with my financial plan. 8 years with a credit card, never once not paid the balance in full. For some reason I did go to check on points the other day and found out I have $2500 in some kind of Visa that I can spend on whatever I want, so I guess that added up over time and is a handy little bit of money to have. But it hasn't changed my life one way or the other and I would not encourage the average person to get a credit card.

[@Ryan_DeWitt]

@@MrClassicmetal That is because there are many, many people that do pay off their CC's 100% every month and have been doing it for a long time. It is not a rare thing. They just aren't the ones calling the show to cry about their 20k in CC debt because they didn't buy things they couldn't afford. CC's don't put you in debt, buying things you can't afford does.

[@benjaminhough8804]

I’m right there with you. It’s painful to spend on a credit card BECAUSE I have to pay the bill again. It’s painful to see the balance, even if the spending is within budget (and it always is). Cash is gone like that because I never see it again. It’s invisible once it leaves my wallet, never seen on my statement, bills, it disappears much faster.

[@dantran5395]

If she has to pay the expenses on her personal card and they decide to not reimburse her, it doesn’t matter if she uses cash, debit card, or a credit card…and I hate when Dave says that no one became a millionaire bc of credit card miles. Obviously no one gets their wealth from that

[@patty109109]

Yes it’s a clownish straw man argument.

[@bradleymaravalli2851]

The company is supposed to pay for the expense upfront - hotel, travel, and an allowance for food.

[@davidcanning4840]

I’ve been putting all my spending, all my bills on a single credit card for the last 28 years. It works if you are not a moron. Pay off the balance every month. Harvest the perks, points, etc. The credit card company does not make money from me, they make it from the poor ass vendors who have to pay visa/Mastercard for the crap I buy. - like 3%

[@David-wo9un]

Why do people call for advice they have zero intention of following? Can’t these people just do what they want and let people who actually want advice to take up time on the DR podcast?

[@machutson5493]

They actually believe they can change Dave's mind and philosophy.

[@ForTheChristians]

I love Dave Ramsey and his team. But I’ve also had a credit card for 10 years and have *always* paid my full balance when due. We exist. The reward dollars pay for lodging and gas on our vacation every year. I totally understand Dr. Deloney’s argument about opting out of the system. However, in reality, I’m just scraping back the transaction fees back that retailers price into every item they sell whether or not people use a credit card for the purchase.

[@mightymouse9001]

I don’t care for his argument either because using his logic, I shouldn’t take out a mortgage from a bank that makes money off single moms struggling. I shouldn’t participate in free checking accounts from a bank due to it only being free from someone else’s struggle

[@ForTheChristians]

@@mightymouse9001 that’s a good point.

[@robertperry814]

Yeah, I don't buy that "struggling single mom" argument either. If I stop getting my cash back on purchases, are credit card companies going to stop charging single moms interest? I doubt it.

[@AspiringInterpreter]

This is why I'm starting to get more entertainment from Caleb Hammer and less from DR. The arrogance and lack of care is starting to bother me more and more whereas Caleb acknowledges there are credit card people and non credit card people

[@cantgetright742]

CCs are simply against Dave’s policy. Eliminate the risk. You might be doing this and that but you’re playing with snakes and it’s only a matter of time before you get bit. Stick with the shtick it’s got him this far. Seems fair to me.

[@bryceduncan2074]

Exactly! Love Caleb.

[@DamianBadalamenti]

Miles and Free hotels won't make you rich, but it does lower your vacation costs if you're responsible with your money But if you're responsible with your money you probably don't need Daves advice

[@andrewheffel3565]

That's the travel protocol for many big companies, including the one I worked for. My job required frequent travel, either I charged the ticket and rental car on my credit card or I was out of a job. I didn't like it at first, but they always reimbursed me before the card was due, and I got used to it. I don't ever use my debit card for purchases, my credit card card is safer. If there is fraud using a debit card the bank is not responsible for my loss. But if there is fraud using a credit card the bank takes care of it. I use my Costco Visa card for nearly all purchases, I cary very little cash. But my wife and I are disciplined. We buy only what we need and we always pay off the card each month. The main benefit is convenience, but the 2-4% cash rebate adds up to a $800 to $1,200 reward check at Costco each year. I don't recommend doing this if you have trouble overspending, but we have been doing it for many years. We are older and have paid off our home, our cars, our rental mortgages and all personal debts. We are debt free and have a good income, we use our credit card for convenience. Dave is used to helping people who are addicted to abusing credit cards and he correctly tells them to stay away from credit purchases, because they get themselves into more trouble.

[@rodrigofernandez9055]

You are correct 💯

[@jill9606]

I just had fraud on my debit card last week and my bank immediately reimbursed me, closed my card, and issued a new one. Same protection as a credit card.

[@andrewheffel3565]

@@jill9606 That's good, glad to hear it. Maybe bank policy has changed?

[@abark]

"If there is fraud using a debit card the bank is not responsible for my loss." This is not true. Visa or MC debit cards have the same fraud protection as a credit card. HOWEVER-- If a thief compromises your debit card you can be up crap creek without any cash in your bank account for 30+ days waiting for the claim to be processed. So don't keep more money than you can afford to be without in any account tied to a debit card.

[@andrewheffel3565]

@@abark Thanks for the correction, and glad to hear it. The possibility of fraud without compensation was my main objection to debit cards. I will probably keep using my credit card, mostly because I am old and it's a habit, but also for the 2-4% cash back.

[@logicbomb8977]

Lol at everyone still trying to justify their use of credit cards. “I can pay for a vacation 1 year”🤪

[@indianatime]

Dave frequently sets up the straw man "no millionaire says credit card points is what led them to wealth." but that is the wrong question to supporting his policy of no credit cards. The proper question should be: "how many millionaires said credit cards impeded your path to wealth/financial freedom? " I'd wager a significant number, if not a majority, would answer it did not impede their path, damaging Dave's argument.

[@da11king]

Somebody should bring this point to Dave Ramsey ✨️👌🏾

[@robertperry814]

And I've never heard a millionaire say they became wealthy by buying things that were on sale or using coupons at the grocery store. So I guess sale items and coupons are bad financially.

[@JakeSpradlin2]

This is where I’m a Dave-ish…… gotta use credit cards. Can be a huge benefit for people like the caller traveling for work

[@tonythaiger93]

She thought she will outsmart Dave all smiling but she got shutdown less than 60 seconds.

[@richguest]

I pay my credit card off every month no problem - oh, and I have a net worth of a million....

[@tywebbgolfenthusiast8950]

Me too. I don’t use credit cards much, but every online purchase is on a card. No way I’m putting my own money on the line. Also, I don’t believe that 78% of points are being left on the table. Maybe when rewards cards first came out, but not now and certainly not for convenience users.

[@richguest]

@@tywebbgolfenthusiast8950 I see them as a useful tool in my arsenal!

[@dannypakaz]

You know what's the worst type of people, are the people who can't admit when they are wrong and Dave is clearly wrong

[@amireallythatgrumpy6508]

Well he's American. That makes him always wrong.

[@dannypakaz]

@@amireallythatgrumpy6508 Very true 😂

[@daniellineberry8879]

How many people have you helped get out of debt, or become a millionaire? Then shut up!!!!

[@rayh3899]

Something about "Becky down in accounting" that made me chuckle lol

[@kvgolfa]

You can also say "no millionaire has ever said they are millionaires because they only use debit cards" lol. I save 70% of my income making 270k a year. Never paid a cent of interest and don't plan to.

[@jorgetech2985]

I have a company credit card but I use mine instead to get points and cash back. Let me tell you that I have not spent 1 penny in interest but have gotten thousands back. Yes thousands. It's not for everyone though.

[@bantizzle79]

The caller sounds like a "Karen"

[@Fedgery007]

Dumbest comment I’ve read so far!

[@elizabethallen4353]

The caller's tone with them...cringe. If she already knows the answer, why call?

[@cooperwright8500]

She came on thinking she would one up Dave

[@JustinCase780]

She's calling from the studio.

[@benjaminhough8804]

Is anyone actually saying they will get rich by credit card rewards? Because I’ve never heard it, and I certainly have no expectation of wealth from rewards.

[@handleyobusiness]

Then I wonder why are these pro-credit card people are defending these small rewards so vigorously.

[@mightymouse9001]

@@handleyobusiness because used correctly can completely pay for your yearly vacation. I also wouldn’t keep a checking account if it charged me 2-5% monthly maintenance fee based on my spending. By choosing to use a debit card, it’s like I’m opting into a monthly maintenance fee by leaving money on the table.

[@zackwheat5770]

Nobody got rich by using a debit card. It’s an irrelevant argument.

[@Zorcon741]

Mathematically she's correct. Dave can't accept that

[@georgem2315]

Btw, I work for the company that gave me a corporate credit to use for such things as travel, purchases, etc., and Dave’s argument does not work, at anytime my company can decide that the purchase or that I tipped too much, etc that those are not “business” expenses and they WILL take out of my paycheck… before anyone jumps in and says anything, yes, I have signed stating that I accept that. So the point is, it’s irrelevant whether you have a company’s card or your own, you are still at the mercy of the company.

[@Zorcon741]

I've never met someone who became a millionaire cutting coupons from newspapers but that's not an argument

[@nathangallagher5112]

Dave's point is that it's just not worth it to think you can win the game. The average card holders debt is over $6000. People with this mentality of finding money shortcuts are not likely to become millionaires. People with an extreme saving mentality, like couponers, do become everyday millionaires far more often.

[@Zorcon741]

@nathangallagher5112 you word "beat the game" like it's a casino where there are physically mathematical odds against you... Imagine some guy saying "don't get married since the odds are against you," it's not the same thing.

[@nathangallagher5112]

@@Zorcon741 Not sure how the marriage reference is supposed to relate to CCs. Also, statistically the odds are in fact against you for credit cards. The average person gets a CC thinking they will get money back. But guess what, the average CC holder is 6k in debt, and the CC companies are still in business. And it's not just poor people with this debt. My mom makes six figures and decided to go on a last minute vacation last year to use her miles (like most people, she used the credit card and her built up miles to justify it.) She still has several thousand in debt racked up a year later.

[@Zorcon741]

@nathangallagher5112 my point is that people use statistics to justify making decisions, which eliminates the individual. Most people aren't financially disciplined; that doesn't mean you can't be

[@danieljohnson4418]

Dave's hostile response is indicative of his lack of a compelling answer to her question.

[@aurasphere87]

Well aren't you the pot calling the kettle black.. Dave's response was accurate.

[@rossmcgreg6r642]

Well said.

[@rossmcgreg6r642]

To be clear, well said 4418

[@johnk6749]

I worked for several companies where I had to figure out how to pay for travel expenses, then submit an expense report and hope they will allow everything. I worked for a company where I had to buy cleaning supplies, then submit my expense receipts for reimbursement. They didn't think keeping computer equipment or desk areas clean was important.

[@rodrigofernandez9055]

I travel twice a year on airline miles. Airline credit cards are for travelers. There are other benefits such as foreign transaction fees waived, car rental insurance, global entry reimbursement, no luggage fee, you always board with group 2 among other benefits. Credit cards are not for people that can't control their impulsive purchases.

[@mattbenesh9784]

Credit card is paid in full every month, I use all the airline points I’ve earned through the card every year, have trained myself to feel “the pain” he refers to when using the card because I understand my budget for essentials and non-essentials, and my goal isn’t to become a millionaire from the points. The goal is two things…one, the points earned save me about three months of time that I would otherwise have to use to earn enough points for my flight companion pass each year from non-credit card activities. And two, it allows me to travel as frequently as I want without paying for flights and making financial trade offs elsewhere. It’s not for everyone and I wouldn’t recommend it to anyone, but if you have self-control, have a realistic goal for why you are using the card, and are completely committed to using everything you earn, it’s definitely worth it.

[@Fedgery007]

Dave’s example is such a low probability. He is correct. But the risk is pretty low I would think.

[@newp848]

It happened to me recently. My hotel cost did not get reimbursed.

[@binfordtoolman5674]

I follow most of Dave's advice, but I will never be on board with his anti-cc position. I've never heard a caller claim that airline miles or points is what got them to be a millionaire. But I've never heard Dave give a convincing argument that one shouldn't use a cc to pay for things they need as long as the balance is paid in full each month. He keeps falling back to dc's. That's his prerogative, just as it's mine to use cc's responsibly. Oh, BTW, I'm a Baby Steps MM.

[@dr.bradshaw]

Cathy’s name should be Karen

[@9liveslisa]

I wouldn't work for a company that didn't give me a corporate credit card to pay for business travel. Hands down.

[@todd2456]

What if they paid you over $1M per year. ??

[@theflightsimulationexperie6894]

Exactly

[@stevenporter863]

That is some blanket statement. Like saying you won't accept a stack of money unless there is a red rubber band holding it all together.

[@user-yb5bg8im5g]

''i do not want to be involved in a company based on failure.'' no. the majority of money comes from merchant fees, not ''failure'' to pay.

[@nerdobject5351]

This is dumb. If you trust your employer to pay you every month they will pay your expenses after the travel. The reason it’s done this way it’s less of a paper trail and much easier for both parties and it’s unknown what your expenses for travel will be. Your responsible for checking what is reimbursement and what is not.

[@eatpigsnot]

do people really think credit card companies give cash back, rewards, etc... because they are generous, caring, companies?

[@FrankS111]

In my late 30s…been using credit cards since graduating college in early 20s. Never paid a penny in interest over 15+ years. Have had monthly CC bills ranging from $500 when I was single to $3000 now married with 3 kids. So let’s say an average of $1750 during my life. Cash back has ranged from 1.5% to 2% so let’s say 1.75%. That’s $5,513 in cash back I would have missed out on thanks to this flippant mode of thinking. I’ve been able to utilize that either paying bills or investing. Never ONCE have I said (nor any rational person) that using credit cards will make me a millionaire.

[@Billman8686]

It's funny everyone always say this🤔 but yet over half of people are carrying a balance.

[@Treerootz1]

Right? I don’t care if poor people can’t handle paying it off immediately. I’m just benefiting based on other morons who can’t control themselves.

[@jimmymcgill6778]

@@Billman8686 SO what. We are not talking about the people that don't pay it.

[@XXnickles]

This is partially true. There is a "hidden psychological trick" in the equation: some of those purchases might not have been necessities, but impulse driven purchases because of the cash back. Also, the fact is credit cards not only make money on interest, but also in transaction fees. It turns out that they have embedded these fees in most of our day-to-day purchases, which means we are paying MORE for products we purchase, and they make more money if you do multiple and/or big pruchases with your CC. On the other hand, becouse most of everyday purchases already have added those processing fees, it is also true that we are "losing" money paying with debit/cash. If we see it as it is, credit card is just a gamification of the system, and we always pay for it more than we get from it

[@handleyobusiness]

@@jimmymcgill6778Even people with good credit is gonna pay interest in one way or another. These banks are not stupid.

[@lepoj]

3:38 Classic Dave strawman argument and he calls it "the most compelling argument" 😂

[@tugboat2030]

That's not a strawman. A strawman is mischaracterizing an argument for credit card debt. He's arguing that credit card points won't cause wealth, which is Dave's objective for his audience.

[@lepoj]

@@tugboat2030 A strawman argument is the logical fallacy of distorting an opposing position into an extreme version of itself and then arguing against that extreme version. What Dave said is the epitome of strawman🤷

[@ASimoneau]

@@lepoj False. @tugboat2030 is correct. Dave's show is about building wealth. One of your financial goals is to build wealth. Yet, the moment Dave tells you that one of the things you do with your money isn't causing you to build wealth, you suddenly act like that's a non sequitur ("Who said anything about building wealth?")

[@mightymouse9001]

@@ASimoneau it’s a strawman that people who use credit cards say it makes them wealthy. Everyone knows it won’t make you wealthy. It will however pay for your yearly vacation and is the more optimal way of spending. If I follow a budget to a T like Ramsey suggests, where is the risk of overspending? Using a debit card instead of my credit card that gives 5.25% back is like choosing to have a checking account that charges a 5.25% monthly maintenance fee Would you choose a checking account that charges a 5.25% monthly fee based on your spending? No? Looks like credit cards are for you

[@lepoj]

@@ASimoneau It literally does not matter who Dave's audience is. A strawman is a strawman. No point in arguing with you if you can't understand the basic definition.

[@justinitsthatguyme010]

Because I am disciplined and I’ve had fraud before. Credit cards are safe for me

[@nicodimus2222]

There ARE exceptions to every rule. The problem is when 90% percent of the people think that they are the 10% exception, when their track record indicates otherwise. I've been a millionaire for a while, but I would never claim that I got here by getting credit card rewards. However, I do get the cash back, and I only use the card for gasoline and pay it off within a week. The decision-making for me doesn't change. When it's time to fill up the car, it's time to fill up the car. I don't also buy a squeegee and a can of motor oil. Just the gas. If you limit it to that, and you have strong self-discipline, you can 'beat the house' as the saying goes. The problem is that most people lack strong self-discipline.

[@noblekishor]

Dave couldnt trust a multimillion dollar company reimburse its employee the business flight fair but he can trust on the investment market that if you invest 10k will give you 8k in 2 years lol

[@amireallythatgrumpy6508]

No, he does NOT trust the market that way. He always says if you're going to need the money within 5 years save not invest...

[@josephpotter7776]

Im college my soccer coach used his CC for all our away trips. Woth the points he built up he took his family on a really nice vacation during the summer. Like the entire hotel bill for 22 people like 11 times a year plus all the food we ate. Legit took his family tp Disney for free

[@Jackaroo.]

If you can't control your spending, credit cards aren't for you. If you are in control of yourself, credit cards are fantastic.

[@cameronmcfarrin4587]

I disagree with Ramsey to a degree when it comes to CCs. They can be harmful if you are not keeping the balances low towards what you can afford and the interest gets tacked on . If you pay the balance every month, then its ok. If i get cashback and i was going to buy gas for my normal commute to work, i was going to buy gas anyways, why not get something back?

[@JimmyMook]

Psychology. They have talked about this a lot on the program. Your brain changes when you have a CC.

[@ryand7713]

I am the exception but why call Dave? You aren't going to win him over.

[@lkj0822g]

A credit card is just a financial tool - nothing more, nothing less. There are distinct advantages of using a CC over a debit card or even cash. There are also financial risks of using a CC. Most adults in the room recognize this, but Dave thinks everyone (but him) is an imbecile and cannot think for themselves. Ideally, if you travel or otherwise incur expenses while conducting company business, the company has provided you with a corporate credit card to use. A lot of companies, especially smaller companies, do not provide corporate credit cards to their employees and still utilize the expense statement method to reimburse their employees who incur business expenses. Some do what Ramsey Inc does and provides cash advances, but that practice is not common nowadays as most employees do not want to be walking around with thousands of dollars in their pocket.

[@bradleymaravalli2851]

Corporate America should pay for these expenses upfront - hotel, travel, and an allowance for food.

[@shepdog069]

Debit cards suffer the same charges as credit cards, so if you use a debit card, you are STILL supporting Visa, Mastercard, or whomever. The only way to avoid that is checks, money orders, or cash. What we need is a national law preventing credit card companies from forbidding vendors from passing all fees onto the buyer. That way, cash becomes cheaper to spend than digital currency

[@mattfrank6804]

It’s not about making millions on points. It’s about getting free money. We use every airline mile we get and fly for free every summer while paying 0 interest.

[@tombellamy7167]

Federal employee here, if we have to travel for work on an annual basis, we get a "GTC" government travel card to pay for expenses. There's no way I'd pay for airfare, hotel, meals, etc, on my own dime regardless of whether or not I would get reimbursed.

[@CCF_Christopher]

People have to realize that they can become ill or get into a bad car accident or lose their job. It’s always good to be debt free. With an emergency fund.

[@scratch57]

she didn't claim that she'd become a millionaire by using card points. Dave states this constantly but not a single caller has ever argued that.

[@MoeHhggg]

That’s how most companies work these days.

[@tashinaking3198]

In reality, regardless of what they use, they would still be on the hook for the money. If it's on a credit card, they just have to pay it back over time. They wouldn't have that option with their debit card. 🤷🏾‍♀️

[@MrFijiBoySako]

Actually not true, there is a company provided CC, and you can get your personal CC if you choose not to.

[@DefinitelyNotRin]

I went from swiping my debit card on everything to swiping my credit card on everything. It just depends on the person. Dave knows it's fine but he will never say it is because that's his thing

[@ds5651]

I am the exception. Mastered the credit card to take my summer vacation flight and hotels free every year. I do everything right budget, invest in index funds since I was 18, have 6 rentals, live below my means and invest 40 percent of my income

[@Matt_Dagostino]

Who the hell is getting $11,000 in unreimbursed expenses? One time I paid a $2k hotel bill and was reimbursed the following Friday. It sounds like more of an employee problem if you allow the company to get the tab up to $11k.

[@littlelolex11]

Dave likes to strawman these arguments and use the most extreme examples. If my $20 lunch isn't expensed at work in 2 weeks I'll bring it up and my work is good about it. The minute my work doesn't pay me back in a timely manner, the minute I won't use my personal card for expenses and start looking for a new job. But his advice is definitely for those people dumb enough to be cheated out of 11k.

[@markJones38133]

You know, I bought my grand kids some toys and junk food yesterday and paid with my credit card. I let them buy whatever because my card had a zero balance and I wanted to put something on it. It cost me $300 total, I would have never allowed that much if I was paying with cash.

[@scratch57]

I do not spend $100 in order to get $2 back. I let a $100 transaction for a necessity get a $2 discount.