'There's just too many laws!' Claire Fox and Toby Young on trivial legislation | SpectatorTV

Columnist Toby Young and Baroness Fox share their frustrations with pointless legislation, and the habit of passing laws that are either wildly ambitious or incredibly trivial, while neglecting the real problems Britain faces, such as the housing shortage, the productivity crisis and the eye-watering dysfunction of the NHS.
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#lords #commons #legal #law #brexit

[@SpectatorTV]

If you could repeal one piece of legislation which would it be?

[@tonysherwood9619]

Our special relationship with the usa would be a start!

[@humanoverde2810]

Love listening to Claire Fox, she’s so rational and genuinely wants Britain to be a freer society 🇬🇧

[@OnlineEnglish-wl5rp]

Free for who? She strikes me as little more than a contrarian

[@ChrisNother]

You cannot legislate society out of its decline.

[@OnlineEnglish-wl5rp]

The Tories have been in power for FOURTEEN YEARS during which time they successfully passed the costs of the bankers' crash to everyone else and the "personal responsibility" "law and order" "sound money" "patriotic" types let them do it They've also grossly over-populated the country. Quite obviously the coterie of financial interests behind the Tory couldn't give damn about this society

[@mr2981]

You might be able legisliate society into it..

[@SpectatorTV]

What then are the solutions?

[@tzazosghost8256]

@@SpectatorTV simplicity of law is comprehensible law and comprehensible law is easy to obey. But comprehensible law must be justified

[@khankrum1]

Perhapsthey should enforce existing laws

[@marumaru6084]

Mass immigration, why work harder for no extra pay, why work harder for no better job why work harder for no home.

[@daisyjanepink1833]

Claire Fox and Toby Young are great

[@markhutton6055]

You cannot own a cat. A cat chooses where it wants to live and who it wants to live with

[@CountofMonteBisto]

the cat that walked by himself by rudyard kipling 🐈‍⬛

[@MrGavinBoyd]

Laws are for the little people. Partygate, Post Office scandal, Dominic Cummings and Barnard Castle. Those that rule are rarely held to account.

[@jemgeach4066]

The passage of many laws about trivia or impossibilities brings the whole law into disrepute

[@Noallegiance]

Too many laws. Too much tax. Too much regulation. Free we are not.

[@sirjohng1]

Way back in the 60's I remember reading that every time we woke in the morning we had to remember the over 8,000 Laws and regulations in place at the time because IGNORANCE OF THE LAW IS NO EXCUSE.

[@CountofMonteBisto]

. Aunty from madmax bartertown said "i know you wont break the rules because there arent any"

[@lorrimang]

"Ignorance of the law is no excuse", we need the government to fund all citizens in to taking a degree in UK law.

[@adrianlloyd6403]

Kerry Packer, the Australian media mogul, when complaining about more laws being passed by the Australian government to curb his business interets,made the very sensible suggestion that for every new law introduced, one old existing law should be repealed.It made perfect sense to me to stop the state just churning out law after useless new law.Of course his idea wasn't accepted.

[@brucegraham7652]

Claire Fox for PM !

[@annabell5646]

To many Lawyers in the HoC & lords therefore they love making new laws.

[@stablefairy9437]

thank you for finally letting me know what a stakeholder is!!

[@afifahhamilton8843]

Clair Fox continues togo up in my estimation. Toby Young also. Heres's to Common Law and here's to hatred of that which should be hated!

[@jemgeach4066]

There was a state somewhere in which the proponent of a new law had to stand on a block with their neck in a noose. If the law failed of acceptance then the block was removed

[@royboyx2]

Go, Claire go!

[@nicolabaker551]

There ARE too many laws ffs. Use the plural.

[@clvrswine]

Thank you for this comment.

[@davidbenton8775]

I have two suggestions . 1, Newtonian legislating... Newton said 'for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. So for every law that gets passed an equally large,(or small) law must be removed from the statute books . 2, Politicians should, by default, but not all the time, follow the simple premise.... "Don't just do something, sit there. This pause would allow thought, reflection and critical internal and external debate on an issue .

[@The_New_IKB]

Cats choose you, not the other way round!!!

[@brianphillips4554]

I have thought for years that there is too much law making. We should get MP’s out of Westminster and meeting their constituents rather than grandstanding in the Chamber

[@clovermark39]

Can we get a bill to find stolen bikes.

[@Brookspirit]

Lawmakers make new laws or they will be out of a job, the same goes for the EU, if they don't keep making laws they won't have anything to do and their job would be as redundant as them.

[@phwbooth]

Lady Fox (as I think of her).

[@istftlats]

Law making as governmental Virtue signalling. So true.

[@joedge6142]

It's not trivial if you get your dog stolen, it's devastating.

[@scottythedog8829]

And there is already a law that covers that. There is no need for a new one.

[@joedge6142]

@@scottythedog8829 Yeah and they just give you a crime number to use for the insurance.

[@scottythedog8829]

@@joedge6142 and why would a new law make any difference?

[@CountofMonteBisto]

talking of dags "use it or lose it" is what your taught onsite...go spend a few months with the gypsies

[@tonysherwood9619]

Why always adopt the 'american systems' - they're retro-gressive and crap as it turns out!

[@user-3282]

Agree. The UK needs to stop following the USA. They are not more intelligent or a better system than we can develop ourselves.

[@aleph8888]

A lot of US laws are based on English common law

[@tonysherwood9619]

@@aleph8888 we moved on but now shackled a neo-puritan ideal to honour american pride!

[@istftlats]

Brilliant insights exposing the “consultation process”

[@lmg7503]

They can be so mindless

[@sirjohng1]

In the Sixties I remember reading that upon awakening in the morning I had to remember the 8000+ Laws and Regulations commonly in use at that time as ignorance of the Law is no excuse! Trouble is, Laws are so rarely erased even when no longer relevant.

[@doone8849]

There are*

[@clvrswine]

Yes, thanks for this comment.

[@kathrynbarbara967]

Yes, “stake holders” are activists, so minority views are magnified and mainlined into parliamentary action. Perhaps there should be a mainstream views “stakeholders” that are factored in via consultations. Minority rule is very problematic.

[@boydonewrongagain]

There is some interesting discussion here. However, Toby Young is totally wrong about 15-minute cities. All it means is having services within a 15-minute walk. It doesn't mean you can ONLY travel 15-minutes from your home.

[@dod4004]

The only area of law I know well concerns child employment. And it's such a patchwork mess that most people think it's been banned outright. A 14 year old can get a job in an office*, but they'll need permission from the local authority, but they can't work in a factory, except when organised by a school, but they can work in a pub, unless a local byelaw prohibits it, but they may still be able to sell alcohol in a sealed container, but if there isn't a byelaw then they can serve alcohol, but only if each sale is authorised by the bar manager, unless it's for a table meal, in which case they can sell alcohol, but only in the restaurant area, unless the restaurant area has a bar. So I can only imagine what a tangled web it is in other areas. * But not for more than an hour before school, unless a byelaw allows it, but for a maximum of 2 hours a day, except during the holidays when they can do 5 hours, unless they're 15 when they can do 8 hours, but only for a total of 12 hours a week, except during school holidays when they can do 25 hours a week, unless they're 15 when they can do 35 hours, but not after 7pm or before 7am.

[@dod4004]

Apologies, I missed a caveat. Except on Sundays which is 2 hours. Unless there's a byelaw which may add further restrictions on working hours, conditions of work and the type of employment. See your local authority's Education Welfare OfficerS for more! And if you navigate this labyrinth of legislation starting in the 19th century, you-a 14 year old-might just be able to sell a copy of the Spectator in your local shop.

[@dod4004]

Don't forget to remind your employer to review their risk assessment to take into account your inexperience, immaturity and lack of awareness of risks. And their Employer's Liability Insurance will need to cover children (unless it's work experience in which case it's automatic.* Unless your insurer says it isn't). * But only for school work experience, not any old work experience. And for not more than 2 weeks.

[@rorysmith2415]

It is so sad and depressing that someone like Claire Fox is rewarded with a position in the House of Lords. She has views on bullying and abuse issues that I strongly disagree with. It shows what sort of views get you rewarded in society Oh by the way to all the right wing, remember Fox was in the Communist Party.

[@garymitchell5899]

Why no acknowledgement that this was prompted by a very similar article in The Critic last week? BTW it's almost certainly the case that Toby did NOT knock on doors and leave his phone number in the cat episode.

[@fluxington]

It's almost certainly the case that you know none of the facts surrounding the issue of Toby's cat. Have you heard him discuss it before this, and did he say something different? Has it been reported in the media? Pure supposition.

[@garymitchell5899]

@@fluxington You got me! Obviously just my opinion of the likelihood, it's not a big deal either way.

[@liaminwales]

There are laws that cover this, pet's are property. To take a cat is theft.

[@garymitchell5899]

Inducing isn't taking.

[@vatsmith8759]

If cats are property are cat owners responsible for the actions of their property?

[@joedge6142]

The police don't investigate theft anymore.

[@scottythedog8829]

Inducing is taking. And yes, cat owners are responsible for their pets actions, but it's probably not a criminal matter but a civil one.

[@garymitchell5899]

@@scottythedog8829 Inducing is not taking. There is an element of volition in inducing i.e. it is going willingly to some extent. Otherwise why criminalise it separately.

[@gca259]

My attention span is too short for any more Toby Young waffle. Bailed out at 2' 27".

[@stevenaustin8274]

there an episode of "On the buses ' on drama at ten if that's more your cup of tea ?

[@bertharius9518]

The Beano. What's in store this week, I wonder?

[@moriartyco]

What sort of monster doesn't recognize their own cat!

[@stevenaustin8274]

Monster ?? lol are you for real ?

[@garymitchell5899]

It's perfectly possible not to recognise it, but either way they're not a 'monster'. Come on.

[@moriartyco]

sense of humour anyone?

[@stevenaustin8274]

@@moriartycowell I have been known to laugh at things which are actually funny

[@vatsmith8759]

Toby, I'm surprised to hear you speak with forked tongue. The '15-minute city' idea is nothing whatsoever to do with restricting peoples' movements but restricting the unnecessary use of private cars. People would still be completely free to move around the city using other means of transport. You should know better.

[@scottythedog8829]

Toby is correct. 15 minute cities are for controlling the population. And that's before the "mission creep". Naivity to think otherwise.

[@stevenaustin8274]

Of course that is what you’ve told yourself and exactly what Khan will be saying “We’re restricting your freedoms for your own good “Trust the Government both local and national it knows what’s best for you !

[@stevenaustin8274]

Oh and incidentally has nothing to do with revenue raising whatsoever

[@garymitchell5899]

Like it or not most people use their cars, and some people either have little or restricted access to public transport. It is absolutely about restricting people's movement.

[@vatsmith8759]

@@garymitchell5899 Yes, most people, including myself, use their cars, often unnecessarily, for some journeys which would better be done by other means of transport. For those people who need to use cars their car use isn't unnecessary and so the restrictions wouldn't (shouldn't) apply. It's absolutely nothing about restricting peoples' movements (what on earth would be the point of that?).

[@gavinsmith9564]

Laws on MPs lying would be very useful, like about the benefits of Brexit...

[@terryfarren667]

Still whining after eight years?

[@katielain6519]

Make MPs and civil servants accountable for the damage they are doing to our society.

[@OnlineEnglish-wl5rp]

The Tories have been in power for FOURTEEN YEARS and they've only just discovered they've passed all these laws "The Tories are theoretically in favour of a smaller state" - actually no, they're in favour of private power and the public realm having as little as possible ability to restrict the activities of banks, corporations and the people who own them. The Tories over the last 45 years have actually created the most privatised state in the Western world and that is where your taxes are going: to subsidise privatised utilities, outsourced services and then things like tax credits and housing benefit which prop up low wage employers and private landlords. To those on the Right complaining about "small boats" i.e illegal immigration, who has the contracts for the accommodation for all these people? It's likes of Serco and Capita. Who's the former CEO of Serco? Rupert Soames, brother of Tory big wig Nicholas Soames

[@mr2981]

Definitely, and fewer muppets and Islamists, by about 100%.

[@duncefunce1513]

You're not suggesting that we deport the muppets? How heartless can you be?

[@JonathanRossRogers]

Monty Python reference #2: Fish licence! kzbin.info/www/bejne/pp_UammNbs-nq9ksi=YtfwH-lmRl0iUYY8