There’s Something Weird About Neandertal DNA And It Might Be Our Fault

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Maybe it’s a little self-centered that we can be pretty focused on the DNA that we got from Neanderthals - but we shouldn’t forget that gene flow goes both ways.
Thanks to Julio Lacerda ( / juliotheartist ) for the excellent reconstructions featured in this episode!
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Produced by Complexly for PBS Digital Studios
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References:
www.science.org/doi/10.1126/s...
www.nature.com/articles/ncomm...

[@TheMotlias]

My cousin did a DNA test the other month and was embarresed about having a much highter amount of Neandertal DNA than the average european, but I told them about all the cool things I learned about them on this channel, like they were intelligent, and looked after the sick and it made my cousin feel a lot better about it.

[@nmarbletoe8210]

the oldest known musical instrument on earth is a neanderthal flute :)

[@___________________________000]

You're the real MVP

[@CorwinFound]

Ack. A new form of racism emerges. "Your neanderthal DNA is *how* high? Wow. How unevolved of you." I'd be thrilled to learn I had a higher percentage. I grew up reading the Jean Auel books in the 80's and even convinced my friends to play Clan of the Cave Bear with me. Many of the ideas of the books haven't held up to modern research but she was one of the first to popularize the humanistic depiction of Neanderthals.

[@edwardfletcher7790]

Did you tell him that he's more likely to be stronger and have thicker bones and joint surfaces too ? That should appeal to a guy 😁

[@Lazerecho]

@@CorwinFound likely be the other way around when you account for the African sentiments.

[@Renwoxing13]

I don’t think people really realise how closely related we are to each other. The fact that we could not only mate and produce viable offspring with them, but that those kids could go on and continue the breeding speaks volumes about how closely we were related !

[@7inrain]

Be careful. The ability to produce viable offspring between two closely related species is not an on/off switch. It is gradual. Even with mules, ligers or tigons that usually are thought to be infertile you get animals that can reproduce. Very rarely but those cases exist. As long as we don't know how reproduction rates were between Homo sapiens and Homo neanderthalensis I don't think we can make any judgment just from the fact that they had viable offspring.

[@brucewelty7684]

@@7inrain You are basing your argument on "VERY RARELY". Now how often is very rarely?

[@mlt6322]

Don't forget most of the freaks in jars at a Ripley's Believe it or Not exhibit are from Texas ranchers molesting their sheep when drunk.

[@M5252email]

@@yvonneplant9434 Yes. And you are always welcome to ignore what anyone writes in the comments.

[@M5252email]

@@yvonneplant9434 You can't avoid thinking that if Hollywood wanted to do a remake of Quest for Fire, John Fetterman could go to the casting call. The guy has a massive head with brow ridges and a neck that just blends into his shoulders.

[@Dcain2]

I wish there were more visuals (movies /animation) on early human like species. Its fascinating to imagine people roaming, surviving and encountering “others”

[@yupok318]

There are no humanlike species

[@hvermout4248]

I presume you would like the visuals to show them interbreeding, right?

[@johnnyllooddte3415]

didnt happen

[@danquaylesitsspeltpotatoe8307]

@@yupok318 What do u mean?

[@danquaylesitsspeltpotatoe8307]

The problem is the person doing this video has no idea about the subject! NEANDERTHALS DID GET THEIR Ys FROM HUMANS THEY GOT ALL THEIR DNA FROM HUMANS! Humans never passed it on to them they always had it from they where humans!

[@michaelprice9053]

Coprolite might not be my favourite fossil but it's a solid number 2.

[@petuniasevan]

Clever 💩

[@frankhooper7871]

@@petuniasevan But lost on most people, who have no idea what coprolite is (there's a Coprolite Street in my town).

[@cathjj840]

@@frankhooper7871 Let me guess - it's the sh.ttiest part of town?

[@NinjaTyler]

@@cathjj840 it's marred by skid marks all up and down the lane

[@CD_Character]

I'm definitely stealing that. I may not get an opening to use it right away, but I will use it. edit: I've used it. Thanks Michael!

[@thel33tpenguinftw40]

I have a bio-anthropology exam tomorrow focusing on human evolution and I can't tell if watching this is procrastinating or not lol

[@madcow3417]

If you're looking at the latest in scientific research and news then you're going to do so bad on your exam :p Your book was probably written 10-20 years ago with only minor updates for a new publish date.

[@vestafreyja]

Some column A and some column B.

[@Styphon]

Sounds like studying to me

[@claudiostudios9002]

Tell how was the exam when you finish

[@oldenoughtobeyourmom221]

@@madcow3417 Science is ever changing I don’t understand why school don’t focus on the current discoveries as well as the past theories and studies.

[@KimberlyGreen]

So instead of a cleanly branching tree, we have branches intertwined around each other like some trees & shrubs.

[@terdragontra8900]

the branches themselves are really a bundle of threads, formed of individuals and their offspring, splitting and remerging into groups within groups as humans spread around. if we could see that whole web it would be absurdly and beautifully complex

[@nao_chan_]

everything else Ive seen though is that for the amount of neanderthal dna we have, there was very little actual intermixing. some did occur, but it seems like it affected them much more than it affected us. the vast majority of neanderthals remained a seperate species that went extinct (most likely by being outhunted or directly hunted), they did not simply merge into the homo sapiens species.

[@ingoseiler]

@@nao_chan_ h. sapiens had a much larger population, lived in larger groups and reproduced quicker, so the % of remaining Neanderthal DNA matches at least the order of magnitude of population size difference

[@sophierobinson2738]

kudzu.

[@LuisAldamiz]

@@nao_chan_ - Not so little: 2.4% (typical, it may be higher in some populations, even slightlyy above 3%) means the equivalent to a great-great-great-grandparent. It was selected against in some aspects (reproductive ones especially) but for in some others, notably a variant for keratin, which is probably behind straight hair, as the ancestral type in H. sapiens is clearly the African and other tropical "woolly hair" or thinly curled hair. That means that, if you have straight hair (and surely also wavy and even widely curly hair like mine), you owe that to that "great-great-great-grandpa" (or "grandma") Neanderthal. There's even one X-chromosome haplotype, the B006, which is probably of Neanderthal legacy.

[@m.m.i.9586]

I wonder if way back, some very small bands of early humans, exploring Eurasia, fell on hard times in the unfamiliar territory, and got “adopted” into the local groups of Neanderthals for survival, eventually taking brides and husbands, and changing the Neanderthal genome forever. 🤔

[@Zaxares]

It's certainly possible. There are many stories of lost or struggling colonists in the Americas or Australia getting adopted into local tribes/clans and eventually becoming part of the society. The indigenous Ainu people of northern Japan are similar, having a DNA mix-up consisting of genes from Eastern Asians, Pacific Islanders, and even from later Dutch colonists.

[@EnigmaticLucas]

@@Zaxares Isn’t that the prevailing hypothesis about Roanoke now?

[@melodi996]

@@Zaxares but neanderthals were much harsher on each other than we are, their family groups weren't friendly to each other, killing and eating together when meat was scarce, so it must be something truly unique to have groups collade and not end up in massacre, I'd say a regular female stealing would make some sense.

[@Zaxares]

​@@melodi996 Not necessarily. Eons recently did a video about this showing that there was evidence Neanderthals did actually have fairly complex social lives and structures and they did care for sick or handicapped individuals. I'm not sure if there's solid proof showing that they were far less friendly to rival families or clans (although it's certainly likely. Homo Sapiens certainly have a long and infamous history of doing some very nasty things to rivals), but my guess is that Neanderthals were very similar to us in terms of temperament. Some tribes were friendly and welcoming, others were harsh and cruel. It would be unfair to label all of them as being barbaric or savage any more than it would be to label all modern humans as being greedy and warmongering. ​ @GPlumbob It is, yes. I don't know if we've yet found conclusive proof of it, but that is the prevailing theory.

[@MannIchFindKeinName]

@@melodi996 That notion of brutal neanderthals comes from the way higher testosterone. Like, its not totally off the roof, but it was enough to make basically any neanderthal bulkier than any "normal" homo sapiens, and jeah, well, we do have our conceptions of the testosterone riddled part of "man"kind :P If you ever grew up or were part of a highly toxic, male centric group, you know its not impossible to be "adopted", its "just" rough af. But jeah, just some more stuff added to what @Zaxares said :D

[@Andy_Babb]

It’s wild how modern humans are kind of a genetic mosaic of all of our ancient ancestors… like we didn’t so much as “beat out” other populations of humans as absorb them, so to speak.

[@kittyelgato4246]

Just like Svante Pääbo said

[@Andy_Babb]

@@kittyelgato4246 lol who?

[@caldoreo]

@@kittyelgato4246 he won the nobel prize this year

[@newq]

Honestly, if you put any evolutionary transition under the microscope as much as we've done to our own recent evolutionary history, you'll probably see similar patterns as the boundaries between populations blur over time. It's just that we're paying a lot of attention to our own history, but also all this happened so recently that it's still very well preserved in the fossil record. At the end of the day, though, it's probably just what it looks like when two species split. There's some interbreeding during the split before the two populations fully diverge. It's to be expected.

[@Gabryal77]

@@Andy_Babb I like how you asked instead of I dunno, doing a google search

[@AlexandruBurda]

Neandertals were humans too. So to say "humans and neandertals" is kind of misleading. It should be "sapiens and neandertals" to be precise and fair. The same goes with the denisovans.

[@charlesspeaksthetruth4334]

They weren't modern humans though like homo sapiens. There is a difference.

[@Ekaustonian]

They are both "homonids". Neanderthals may have had "Human - as in Homo sapien" characteristics, but are not themselves Humans; they are Homo neanderthalensis.

[@AlexandruBurda]

@@Ekaustonian they are hominids indeed. Scientifically speaking. And while they were Homo Neandertalensis, our direct ancestors were Homo Sapiens (we ourselfs are Homo Sapiens Sapiens). So if we use the colloquial term "humans", it should apply to both our ancestors and neandertals. If we use Neandertals for them, then we should use Sapiens for our direct ancestors. Let's not confuse everyday talking with scientific terms. 🙂

[@AlexandruBurda]

@@charlesspeaksthetruth4334 Homo Sapiens were not themselves modern humans. We are and our scientific denomination is Homo Sapiens Sapiens. And the differences between neandertals and sapiens weren't such as to justify calling us "humans" and them not. They were humans. Wether we like it or not.

[@AlexandruBurda]

PS: it is funny that our ancestors the Sapiens had no problem in seeing the neandertals as humans and interbreeding with them, while us the Sapiens Sapiens, try to find all kind of semantics to distance them from us. Although the neandertals are our ancestors too. Rejecting our own "parents" because they did not look exactly like us... 🤔

[@Darkmattermonkey77]

What we don’t know about the history of humans could fill several hundred large books. So much is lost and unknown, undiscovered, and/or forgotten. To say we know the history of humans is akin to saying, “we know all there is to know about what conditions are beyond the edge of the universe”.

[@robotboy719]

That cover picture is too funny. 'It was a forbidden love, a love between two species. In the forest their eyes met and a fire blazed. They both knew it was wrong but nothing could keep them apart. 'No. Stop. I have to go back to the cave and gnaw on hides.' 'I jus' can't quit you, cave-cave-girl.' Their doomed romance would change the course of evolution.'

[@margaesperanza]

When two species fight for the genus Homo, two lost souls learn to love and eventually spook unsuspecting future Homo Sapiens who bought a DNA kit

[@raeelsley2984]

Robot boy..I’m just wondering if you read a lot of romance novels……

[@galenbjorn443]

We get the Neanderthal DNA from the men, not the woman. So it is much more likely that the neandertal men took or ''won'' over the Homosapien woman. As we know, Neandertals were much more adapted to the European climate and were much bigger in body, stronger, and probably smarter. The oldest tools, instruments, paintings, and much more were made by Neandertals. So I would be more like, 'come into my cave, djungel girl'

[@douglasdavis8395]

@@raeelsley2984 - I was waiting for a torn-shirt Fabio to look off into the distance while the wind fluffs his hair.

[@jamesprather2946]

Caucasians all have neanderthal genes. Explains why most of them have a subconscious fear of melaninated people

[@TheMongolianMage]

I think of Out of Africa not so much as a few waves but more like a river that opened/closed every few seasons

[@reuireuiop0]

Yeah, like, every generation had it's Mozes, treading in to the Red Sea and stretch out his hand to split the waters - though not mentioning the Egyptians, as the pyramids were still another 100k yrs away. Seriously, much depended on how friendly the environment close by and on the Arab land bridge was to migrating early humans. Without suitable prey or food plants, or vegetation unsuitable for hunting & collecting, they wouldn't go. Plus circumstances for home land source populations had to be pretty favourable so that a certain level of overpopulation could grow to fuel a migration flow.

[@jacobrogers2906]

I was thinking the same thing watching this.

[@matthewtanner7511]

Sounds like we both came from the same ancient species and each went their own way for thousands of years only to meet up later after each had started to evolve differently

[@georgesheffield1580]

Exactly

[@ThinkingDoesMakeMeImportant]

Yawn......

[@robertgotschall1246]

Yeah, that was what Darwin was saying in the Origin of Species. All humans, archaic humans, and all apes evolved from the same ancient individual.

[@matthewtanner7511]

@@robertgotschall1246 is that book still worth a read even with how much more we know compared to then? Another words does it feel dated

[@wildfire9280]

@Andrew If he doesn’t want it, I’ll take it.

[@earthknight60]

Just a point on terminology; Neanderthals, Denisovans, and a lot of other species are 'human', so it's not that 'human' chromosomes and DNA were shared with Neanderthals, it's that *H. sapiens* chromosomes and DNA was shared with other human species, in this case that other human species being Neanderthals.

[@Ekaustonian]

They are both "homonids". Neanderthals may have had "Human - as in Homo sapien" characteristics, but are not themselves Humans; they are Homo neanderthalensis.

[@earthknight60]

@@Ekaustonian Within anthropology, it's generally considered that everything from *Homo erectus* to us is "human". Indeed, *H. erectus* is commonly referred to as, "The first human." What defines a 'human' is a set of physical and behavioral traits, not what specific species it is. It used to be though that *H. sapiens* were the only species to have these traits, so we defined 'human' by them, but we now know that Neanderthals, *H. erectus*, and others exhibit these traits. This led to two options, one was to redefine what being 'human' meant, but that would go against the long history of using these traits and measures, so the second was adopted, including all of the *Homo* genus species that demonstrate these traits under the 'human' umbrella.

[@nealjroberts4050]

@@Ekaustonian Based on how Homo was originally set up, "hominin" should be used synonymously with "human". Edit: replaced hominid with hominin as the former is used for family Hominidae not genus Homo!

[@patrickhackett7881]

@@Ekaustonian Neanderthals are considered to be human. Some consider the early **Homo** species like **H. habils** to be the first humans. Most consider **H. erectus** to be human.

[@markward3981]

Agreed 💯 they are interpreting this in a way to support their theory . This actually supports the fact that we are all humans with some separations and misunderstood genetic patterns .

[@crisrose521]

If I learnt anything from this , it’s that they really loved that sketch of the male and female youngens looking at each other

[@TheMagicalFrogYT]

It's a great sketch

[@bvtnFutureCorpse]

Anyone else ever get a little bit sad when, at the end of the list of pateons, we don't hear, "and Steve!"

[@ninomcterenceyaco7344]

*sad Steve noises*

[@CL-go2ji]

Yeah ...

[@alioramus1637]

Interaction between closely related human species is so interesting. There is even a ghost lineage that started the hypothesis that an archaic human lineage interbreed with the ancestors of west africans. I am from Somalia, a country in the horn of africa so i often wonder if this is the case for myself.

[@kevinsuggs1]

My wife is from a N African country. Her whole family thinks they are Arab. She took a DNA test and is 98% N African..... People kill each other over racial violence over there but everyone looks the same.... Makes me wonder how many people are actually Arab and N African.

[@gaetanramos7903]

@@kevinsuggs1 Maghreb as a whole is about 80% North African, so there is probably very few people who are actually Arab.

[@jonahlefholtz8219]

@@kevinsuggs1 my wife is Libyan and her father's DNA is similar to your wife's - and he still lives in Libya and doesn't tell anyone about those results because he is very proud of his Arab heritage and really bigoted.

[@petersmythe6462]

My understanding is that the most non-Sapiens descended population can be found in some villages in the west and that is highly local. But then again there could be data missing in some countries. Morocco is like 6% ghost lineage and some villages are more like 20% IIRC.

[@antiisocial]

Very cool. Ty

[@cayhill1311]

It's understandable why palaeoanthropologists compare pre-Holocene human existence to Star Trek instead of something more familiar like Middle-Earth. Humans kept boinking the unfamiliar people right off the bat. LOL

[@akechijubeimitsuhide]

Ancient homo sapiens meeting other humans: "We'll bang, okay?"

[@NotMe-ej9yz]

@@akechijubeimitsuhide from my understanding of animals and ancient humans, that "Okay?" part probably wasn't necessary....

[@LuisAldamiz]

Tolkien was raised in Apartheid South Africa. He had some biases...

[@badfairy9554]

You nailed it my friend. some talk a bout war and football. War is new and foot ball very new. High five my friend.

[@Anuchan]

If that's true, then why don't we see all these William Shatner offspring throughout the universe? Or do we need to wait a few more millennia until our timeline catches up to his?

[@bell4902]

Please, please, please release more episodes of the podcast. I would listen to these on my daily walks and I’m missing them.

[@JacquesMare]

Yes..... I thought I was the only one. Please your podcasts make working a godawful job bearable..... no... actually enjoyable.

[@erickatsikaris314]

I absolutely love the human evolutionary "tree" sciences. Certainly hope to see more!

[@evanstential]

why "tree"? What you implying?

[@wiseguy240Winston]

0:55 Gigachad is that you!? 😭

[@bruhman5385]

Yesss Gigachadis Antecessor Do not mistake with Gigachadis Moderni, the one we know today

[@danielbickford3458]

If I recall correctly, I seem to remember that there are some parts of the world that can have as much as 5% of their genome being made of Neanderthal or denisovan. My question is is how much of the Neanderthal or denisovan genome exists within the human genome? Like for example if you took a gene sample of every single human on the planet and picked out the Neanderthal and or denisovan bits could you in theory reconstruct an entire genome?

[@nmarbletoe8210]

i have heard 30% and 60% recently

[@danielbickford3458]

@@nmarbletoe8210 nifty

[@bemusedbandersnatch2069]

There's no point Jurassic Park-ing it up like that when we already have some complete genomes from fossils (since hominids lived so much more recently than dinosaurs). Look up "the Neanderthal Genome Project."

[@rateeightx]

My question is with all the Neanderthal DNA we can get, Both from fossils and preserved in modern human DNA, Could we make a whole Neanderthal? Even if we don't have a complete genome, Surely we could substitute missing parts with Homo Sapiens DNA, Considering we're similar enough to interbreed with them, Or atleast were some thousands of years ago.

[@petris90]

@@nmarbletoe8210 that sounds absurdly high, could you tell me the source?

[@bbirda1287]

I always wonder how much of this is sampling bias, that we just got a local group that happen to have more human Y chromosomes. It could also be that as the Neanderthal died out the surviving remnants were surrounded by more H Sapiens and therefore had more contact.

[@abydosianchulac2]

They don't explain how many of the Neanderthal remains we've recovered have been sequenced, but at 5:57 he says that this doesn't appear to be limited to just a few lineages in a few places. So we must have sequenced samples from distant-enough locations to make sampling bias unlikely.

[@charlesspeaksthetruth4334]

@@abydosianchulac2 Facts.

[@kattkatt744]

Most samples of sequensed genome for Neanthertals are from indiviulals that would not have been living at the same time. The samples are also from locations as fare apart as what is today Spain and Russia. This means that when we find something that is consistant in all the samples it means it was widely distributed over time in the populations.

[@ricardobrands9736]

Yeah you are kinda right. I would love to know what the locations of the used skeletons where at where they where found.

[@FerrariKing]

I always wondered how well our ancestors and other humans got along

[@richie_0740]

well apparently well enough that they start shagging each other

[@Thleta]

There was probably a lot of friction lol but obviously they worked through it.

[@vladimirlagos2688]

Human evolution is such a messy affair. I increasingly believe we may never fully sort it out.

[@huwhitecavebeast1972]

DNA will sort it out. But people need to stop spreading debunked discredited theories like out of Africa.

[@TheCoon1975]

It's all just academic constructs anyway, all the labels we apply to hominids are just sloppy ways to try to label people that are all closely related and all of it is still rooted in really nasty eugenic theories of the 19th century.

[@kyrab7914]

That is the wonderful thing about science- there's always more questions

[@eljanrimsa5843]

We have just developed the tools necessary to research ancient gene flows. We already know that repeated waves of migration seems to be our thing, leading to complicated genetic mosaics instead of orderly clearly delineated gene pools. Give us a couple of decades to figure out the details.

[@vladimirlagos2688]

@@eljanrimsa5843 Yeah, the problem is that genetic markers can get us just so far. Most hominid fossils have no reliable DNA traces of the living creature, and using genetic regression can only give us clues about our direct ancestors and not about any parallel branches that might have existed out there.

[@alicecain4851]

The information from Eons just keeps getting more interesting. Thank you and keep it coming!

[@LimeyLassen]

This absolute Gigachad had a one night stand and replaced the Y chromosomes of an entire species

[@RodrigoOswego]

all of his sons were gigachads as well

[@xa-xii7981]

Better conqueror than even Genghis Khan.

[@purpleemerald5299]

@@xa-xii7981 *Neandhis Khan.*

[@andreanarine8179]

Sounds quite ridiculous. The more reasonable explanation is that homo-sapiens adapted in temporary isolation and they aren't different species.

[@ooi97]

@@andreanarine8179 it does sound strange, doesn't it? If the two populations had the same Y chromosome and mitochondrial DNA, why do we consider them separate species in the first place?

[@altontacoma]

It's amazing what we keep learning, thank you for sharing this with us, great video!

[@adambruha4258]

0:32 "because the best preserved remains just happen to be female" hit me as something that's maybe worth looking into. Like if there is some relation between specimens dying in places with better odds of fossilising well and their sex. May be a fun study

[@cryptvortex2882]

Humans might have just killed the Neandertal-men which may explains few fossil remains. Where as Neandertal-women mated with Humans and were buried more carefully. An even more plain explanation could be different burial ceremonies of Neandertals by sex. But very difficult to find evidence here to get beyond fantastic Archeology.

[@jamestang1227]

Its certainly possible but I would caution that, like many cases with the fossil record, sample sizes are so small that random chance is a likely factor.

[@burger-jd8cx]

childbirth probably

[@Tjalve70]

I'm guessing this can be because men die while hunting, and their corpses may not be recovered. While women die in childbirth, and are probably buried in the caves where they lived.

[@screwyourhandle]

@@Tjalve70 Hunting and also fighting as well. They were probably way more likely to be out in the open, doing stuff that could get their bones broken or eaten by wild animals. Whereas women, even if they survived childbirth, would have spent a lot of time taking care of the kids, and may have been more likely to die of disease than injury.

[@Andrea-rw9tf]

Wow, this explains the “muddle in the middle”!

[@PlainsPup]

All this hybridization between humans and Neanderthals back then reminds me of hybridization between wolves and coyotes today: closely related species, whose hybrid offspring are nevertheless fertile, and go back to leave gene introgression in their parent populations. You see the same thing with bison and cattle, too. Might even be adaptive. So interesting!

[@minutemansam1214]

@Cancer McAids We don't know how easy sapiens and neanderthals reproduced. We just know that it was possible, but many offspring might have been infertile, or had other health issues.

[@laprankster3264]

@@minutemansam1214 it’s possible that Neanderthals and H Sapiens would’ve been right on the borderline between whether they were different species or not. Maybe some Neanderthals had just enough genetic similarity to create fertile offspring with Sapiens, but others were too genetically different to do so.

[@dougsmith3499]

@@cancermcaids7688 depends on the species concept that you're using... the common one we learn at school is this, but there is also the the genetic species concept which can still potentially interbreed, and a morphological species concept, which again can potentially interbreed

[@fionagibson7529]

I was taught in biological anthropology class that both Homo sapiens sapiens and the Neanderthals (Homo sapiens neanderthalensis) are subspecies of archaic Homo sapiens, so perhaps the amount of interbreeding that happened isn’t as much as people think.

[@AO-qy8fp]

The Mitochondria is the power house of the cell.

[@fieldandstream9362]

ATP

[@mretlan8528]

True

[@therecombinant6215]

It’s also the genetic ghost of maternal bloodlines.

[@bbirda1287]

It is a separate life form that drives multicellular animals around like a mech suit.

[@fieldandstream9362]

@@bbirda1287 cell phones... cellular organisms

[@arthursamuel301]

I'm still heartbroken over not hearing "Steve" at the end of the list of patrons.

[@julesgosnell9791]

Fascinating - Now I shall have to put down the the thing I was all fired up about and think about this for the next half hour ! Grrrr...

[@KSL042]

Interesting I love this channel !!!!! Knowledge is infinite

[@hkumar7340]

Astounding information... The plot thickens with each new discovery! The Nobel prize for medicine this year -- which went to the great Svänte Pääbo -- was awarded none to soon!!

[@fadillangston9797]

*too soon

[@0HARE]

Super interesting content. It’s a mind stretch to think about those very long spans of time, and the small changes that brought about significant changes in the human population.

[@flightographist]

Top shelf presentation of the current state of rapidly evolving context!

[@thomasraywood679]

Rapidly evolving context. I like that.

[@Daisy-vg4fu]

Loved this episode! I'm often wondering about the interactions between human populations before the Neanderthal/ Denisovan extinction. How did Neanderthal groups differ from Homo sapiens? How different were their languages/ dialects? How did two or more groups overcome the barriers of culture/language that had been established? So many things yet to discover :)

[@silverbackag9790]

Easy enough: “Ayla” *Neanderthal Standard Sign Language for f$cking*

[@krishadyn5211]

Clan of the Cave Bear is a torrid romance novel series, but its well researched and offers a reasonable picture.

[@anguselliott8986]

A sample size of 3 is a pretty weak basis for "all Neanderthals"

[@Articulate99]

Always interesting, thank you.

[@Macaronyman17]

Amazing how such a "tiny" discovery might possibly change our whole evolutionary timeline. Great work on this video, as always!

[@theghosthero6173]

Im glad you showed the homo sapiens with dark skin. So often we see fair skin in illustrations showing ancient homo sapiens, when If I remember correctly it only became a dominant trait in Eurasia between 12 and 8 thousands years BC.

[@charlesspeaksthetruth4334]

You said it before I did Lol. According to physical remains, according to genetic DNA. The first modern human beings aka Homo Sapiens came from Africa and they would have had dark skin. So Yes! I would appreciate it more if they were represented more in that way. Absolutely.

[@hellomyfriends9740]

Seen thumnal had to click. Hue man.

[@fightfannerd2078]

@@charlesspeaksthetruth4334 they were not modern

[@brian0902]

I have lit never seen 1 example of early humans with light skin idk where you be looking at though

[@MisterDutch93]

@@fightfannerd2078 modern humans aka Homo Sapiens.

[@pumpkinheadzj-o437]

Everything we know is “way earlier than we thought”….

[@jaydonbooth4042]

That's the perfect stereotypical paleontology professor blazer, I love it lol.

[@edwardfletcher7790]

Needs patched elbows 👍🏻🤣

[@Dystisis]

We "met" Neanderthals? We ARE them. Many of us, at least.

[@claireemilycook]

just wrote my dissertation on neanderthal/amh interactions in mid-upper paleolithic europe 😊 love to see more discussion on the topic!

[@kivunature]

Why do Neanderthals show no sapien DNA but sapiens have neanderthal DNA?

[@palindrome.]

Random question spurred by some of the graphics used in the video - is there any evidence to suggest that neanderthals, or any other hominids beside anatomically modern humans, wore clothes? I read that humans first started consistently wearing clothes about 40,000-170,000 years ago, which we (think we) know because that's roughly when headlice and pubic lice diverged into two species.* Given that Neanderthals existed for much or most of that time, I would love to know whether they adopted clothing before us, at the same time as us, or after us - perhaps even because of us. *Some people think that humans wearing most or all of the time might coincide with a major global cooling caused by the eruption of a supervolcano ~70,000 years ago, but obviously a lot more evidence is needed to establish that claim. If true, then it would certainly make it a lot more likely that other hominids, like denisovans and neanderthals, would've had to adapt similar practices.

[@jonni2317]

Ive heard people say that even with their adaptations they would not have survived the cold without clothing, also I belive they have also found secondary evidence for clothing like leather scrapers but i'm really reaching far back into my memory and could be misremembering sorry this probably didnt help you at all lol

[@Dunkle0steus]

The denisova cave contained the oldest known sewing needle, and its associated with the Denisovan population. It was dated to 50 kya, so that's recent enough that they could've picked up the skill from ancient human populations, but if I recall, there was no noticeable homo sapiens DNA found in the remains there. That's obviously not conclusive, but it does seem more likely that there would be cultural flow between the populations much more readily if the groups were inter-marrying than the idea that ancient humans would take the time to teach clothing-making to our other ancient relatives but take no action towards coupling with them.

[@TragoudistrosMPH]

No evidence, really... it all decays... I wonder if humans and clothes are an instinct for decorating the body as a primary drive. Nest building is an ape instinct (beds/nests), so could clothes be a decoration instinct? Clothes can be tools or decorations. Weather changes, and humans in hot environments (tropical or dry) often might wear clothes, but all humans have some for of body decoration. (Fun hypothesis I've played with but not tested)

[@jesseyules]

Yes, Neanderthals had a similar dress / culture to other hunter gatherer humans. They made art and tools. They dressed in skins ect.

[@martinhughes2549]

@@jonni2317 Well there is some indirect evidence from study of parasitic insects/ eg Fleas, Lice( which live in clothes) headlice and pubic lice. Its a different angle, a bit gross though. According to a study in Nature, head lice diverged from body lice 170,000 years ago. Thus you can infer clothing began to be worn at that time, possibly.

[@jenniferlevine5406]

Fascinating! Thanks for this.

[@NGAFBlackJesus]

I be waiting for yall to post a new video Like I be waiting for my pay check every 2 weeks

[@JamesCrosby-tx8bh]

Just asking, but could it be that Denisovans were the original Neanderthals and what we have been calling Neanderthals all this time have been an ongoing hybrid species of Denisovans and Homo Sapiens?

[@ucrjedi]

Those were my exacts thoughts! I’m surprised that this theory was not addressed in the video. Seems kind of obvious.

[@nealjroberts4050]

I suspect there could be differences between Denisovans and Neanderthals that aren't due to Sapiens interbreeding.

[@ucrjedi]

@@nealjroberts4050 It would be wonderful if the video addressed any of this. I've been curious about this theory for years now.

[@iamcleaver6854]

I doubt it, because if that were the case it would be pretty obvious from DNA. I assume the reason they say "denisovan-LIKE Y-chromosome" is because it is not the denisovan Y chromosomes, but instead a version that is as similar and different to the denisovan chromosome as you would expect.

[@beefarren]

My understanding is that we have enough DNA for fairly solid estimates of the time frame for the splits between Homo sapiens/Neanderthals/Denisovans, and H. sapiens diverges hundreds of thousands of years before the other two diverged from each other. I don't think there's any evidence for the kind of ongoing, consistent gene transfer that would be needed to classify Neanderthals as a hybrid species rather than their own distinct group. They would have been interbreeding amongst themselves most of the time, with only very occasional contributions from related human species. With that said, recently some evidence has been found of yet another human group that's genetically partway between Neanderthals and Denisovans. We have no identified fossils, but we have some genetic evidence in certain human populations. The current (very tentative) theory is that this group lived in and around the Indian subcontinent, and H. sapiens picked up some DNA from them during their migrations around the coast of the Indian Ocean. KZbinr Stefan Milo just did a video on this called "The crossroads of human evolution" if you're interested.

[@SweetGoddess420]

When you're here because 23&me said you had Neanderthal DNA

[@down-to-earth-mystery-school]

Same - 5%

[@SweetGoddess420]

@@down-to-earth-mystery-school im 2%

[@bokimalou]

I'm really vibing to the music used in this video.

[@TheArtisticBiker]

Why wouldn't a simpler answer be that all Neanderthals were the result of crossbreeding the Denisovans with Sapiens?

[@ruyfernandez]

How to be sure that the whole Y-chromosome pool was replaced in Neanderthals? According to the paper (at least the abstract, I don't have access to the whole paper) only 3 Neanderthal samples were studied. Maybe, this replacement cannot be considered to be significant at the species level. In fact, considering that only 2 Denisovan samples were sequenced, I am not even convinced that such a replacement did not happen in Denivovans as well.

[@gyozakeynsianism]

Another excellent episode!

[@DipityS]

Fascinating video - thank you.

[@YoungLakesMischa]

I love this point of view!

[@johankarlsson6]

And what happened to Homo heidelbergensis? Like neanderthals they were adapted to the cold climate in Eurasia. And possibly they lived in Africa too. So the oddities found in neanderthals could be explained by their predecessors.

[@grovermartin6874]

I was surprised to find this PBS segment unsatisfactory, for several reasons. One has been mentioned, that we were all the same species, which is why we could interbreed. It isn't that hard to say "modern human" in recognition of that. Also, our Neanderthal cousins were around for WAY LONGER than we modern humans thus far. They must have had some significant evolutionary advantages to survive ice ages and climate change. To assume that their smaller populations (as far as we know so far) resulted in their disappearance is one possibility. Adverse geological or climatological changes or a killer virus or bacterium are possibilities that were not considered. This just felt neither very deeply researched nor assembled. Disappointing.

[@garymacmillan]

Denisovans : 5 very small bone fragments found in a Siberian cave have morphed to a claimed broadly ranged human cousin. This illustrates just how hugely assumptive the art of anthropology is.

[@rainerderreimer4369]

Can you guys make a video about Endler Guppys or Livbearers in Generell?

[@davemaximo9952]

Annunaki modify those genes

[@evanwetzel8641]

This is mind blowing 🤯

[@nyang.00000]

Wow, that's so cool! We've all really all just been walking around a ton

[@charlesspeaksthetruth4334]

Walking around a ton and doing a whole lot of mixing lol.

[@cathjj840]

Got to every corner of Earth except Antarctica well before even agriculture. Mostly on foot, sometimes on rafts or tiny boats.

[@LolUGotBusted]

We need an episode on the Cerutti Mastodon Site!

[@skepticalbadger]

Title should say *Modern* Humans. Neanderthals were also humans.

[@Kleineganz]

Modern humans are homo sapiens sapiens, and Neanderthals are homo neanderthalensis. We currently classify them as different species.

[@sayittomyfaceidareyou8629]

Ah but they're not

[@kauswekazilimani3736]

@@sayittomyfaceidareyou8629 They were human. Not Homo Sapien, but human. Wolf's and coyotes are both canines for example.

[@Nathan-jt8zt]

@@sayittomyfaceidareyou8629 ah but they are; *Homo* Neanderthalensis.

[@Kleineganz]

@@kauswekazilimani3736 But humans are homo sapiens. What you're referring to are hominids.

[@ignaz3254]

I always wondered if the extinction of the neanderthals is not really just a matter of admixture and genetic loss due to smaller and more fragmented populations. When populations are separated, they start to diverge. Wenn they are getting into contact again (connected by the more mobile and numerous h. sapiens groups), the accumulated genetic specifities are likely to be sorted out again.

[@davidparker2173]

A little hard to follow, but wow, digging up the past can blow your mind. It would be intriguing to live outside of time, and to overcome what may be it's merely superficial sequence.

[@MaryAnnNytowl]

This seems like a very interesting study, thanks! (Fixed error)

[@ColocasiaCorm]

imagine meeting a similar hominid species and thinking... "I'd tap that."

[@smurfyday]

They were much more alike back then, and yeah, many people are happy to tap, tap, tap...

[@TragoudistrosMPH]

@@smurfyday they would be less alike, if they hadn't interbred, yet. Humans are curious, and something new vs more of the same? :P

[@kellysouter4381]

How did aids enter the human world?

[@Bialy_1]

@Beef Supreme Unrealisticaly small estimaion... people were traveling all the time back then...

[@therat1117]

@@kellysouter4381 Blood to blood contact with SIDS-infected apes during hunting. Your insinuation is insipid.

[@Tyler_Lalonde-]

Let's get it on Ah, baby, let's get it on Let's love, baby Let's get it on, sugar Let's get it on, woo hoo

[@bonniehoke-scedrov4906]

Great video! Thanks!

[@Vlog-hu8gb]

Gives a totally different meaning to "fk arround and find out"

[@naomilu9910]

I did a DNA analysis a few years ago, and one of the sites I uploaded my data to showed that not only did I have an extraordinarily large percentage of Neanderthal DNA, but also Denisovan DNA. This piqued my interest in this whole study of ancient humanity. Otherwise, I am 100 percent Northern Hunter/Gatherer. My blood matches up with most archaeological digs in Europe, and for some reason, one of the archaeological sites in Argentina has DNA that matches up with mine. I guess my people tended to get around!

[@tohaason]

I wouldn't trust the commercial for-fun (because that's what they really are) sites as authoritative. If you find something interesting there and you really want to know you should get a real lab to do a test, which of course will be very expensive - because it *is* expensive to do the job right.

[@naomilu9910]

@@tohaason Any particular reason you feel this way?

[@kincaidwolf5184]

I wouldn't believe commercial tests lol. If you went back 30 generations (1000 years) you would have 1 billion ancestors. And double that each generation.

[@Titancameraman64]

​@@kincaidwolf5184ok what does that have to do with anything?

[@krishadyn5211]

Denisovans mostly show up in East Asian descended groups. There was an additional cross in southeast Asia that many Pacific groups are descended from. These are also the ancestors of many native American groups. This is why there is a theory that South American natives came from Pacific ocean crossings, rather than the Bering strait.

[@dragonfox2.058]

That's crazy....so they really WERE humans if the offspring were fertile they were human

[@IllegalC4]

They didnt wanna pay taxes

[@gailaltschwager7377]

Thank you!

[@hdpmrr]

So, in other words, what some people thought was a "separate species," Neanderthal, was really already a mixed breed of modern human and archaic human ; and Denisovans are just archaic humans who interbred less with modern humans, but still also interbred with us. But, since all non-Africans have Neanderthal and Denisovan ancestry, they aren't just species that we co-existed with. They are part of our genetic heritage. They are OUR ANCESTORS too. And so what is a species, if you can interbreed with them and have physiologically fully functional children with them?

[@eljanrimsa5843]

Biologists ask this question since they understood that the old definition works only for horses and donkeys. Afaik, Ernst Mayr has given the best answer so far to this question.

[@TheParadoxGamer1]

I wonder what Neanderthal culture was like, Gods what id do to study that.

[@LuisAldamiz]

Prehistory. Most of what you want to know is the Mousterian culture, which is basically the same for a very long time. It's all stone tools, local variants but very similar. However there're some more interesting details. For example in Italy it has been documented that they removed the nicest feathers from some birds (eagles and crows I believe) surely to use as decoration. Odd that we don't see many depictions of Neanderthals wearing feathers because they did. Also they seem to have used magnesium based body paint (grey color). Most intriguing is when they were influenced by Sapiens-made Upper Paleolithic tech and some of them shifted to it but in their own unique style: the Chatelperronian.

[@nmarbletoe8210]

The earliest known musical instrument, a flute, was made by neanderthals

[@galenbjorn443]

we know there worshipped the cave bear, so the oldest religion in the world is from the Neanderthal.

[@ZOGGYDOGGY]

The earliest fossil evidence for homo sapiens in Africa that I know of dated to 315,000 years ago. Those remains were found in what is now, Morocco. This find would seem to indicate that homo sapiens go back further than 300,000 years. Is this a correct assumption?

[@mahfugga]

It will always be case, the more we learn the les we will know.

[@belomolnar2128]

Approx. In year 70.000 before Our Chronicle we met. Interesting. But Where ? In Europe in Tyrol ? Or and …..❤❤❤❤

[@bjboss1119]

Now I just need X and Z and I can locate the stronghold

[@UdderlyEvelyn]

Kinda wondering if the other species died out or if they all just kinda became indistinguishable and those of us with more Neanderthal or Denisovan DNA are what is left, not just Sapiens gene pool "contamination" (I do not mean that in a negative way). Probably reasons that is wrong but I wish I knew them if so.

[@thewho5786]

Other human specie died out maybe because of breeding with us, maybe our gene is much stronger. If you notice when they examine our DNA there is stil traces of other human species in our gene today.

[@chubbrock659]

I’m puzzled about why you don’t release more podcasts

[@labadal]

One thing I wonder is, did those ancient neanderthals, denisovans and sapiens realize that they were different kind of human? Like, was their behavioral and outer appearance different enough for them to assume that they were not the same?

[@xminus5561]

I mean for some time we humans couldn't do it to ourselves

[@traildoggy]

We're barely able to overcome perceived 'racial' differences well enough to not kill each other, but these guys could look at a hottie from another entire species, put on a Marvin Gaye CD, and say "Baby, let's get it on." 🥰

[@winterroadspokenword4681]

Mate, if you’ve lived all your life In a greater tribal population of 150 people...Any new incomer is gonna look like gold dust to you no matter their not before seen darker skin colour, especially with their trendy short skirts and narrow waists they brought from warmer climes. Not to mention their exotic language sounds!

[@melchiorvonsternberg844]

@@winterroadspokenword4681 Of course! Just as we Europeans were impressed by the first Arab conquerors when they put the first boot on European soil more than 1300 years ago. And we've been dealing with them ever since. It took us 700 years to reconquer Spain. It may be that simple biology plays a role, but whether the culture of the locals also allows it is a completely different question. With a lead of 200,000 years, it is very likely that the Neanderthals probably developed music and other cultural things such as jewelry and the like earlier than we did. And that's why a much more developed social order could prevent something like that. And something else is added. Children of mixed breeds would be very easy to spot and could very quickly be eliminated from the reproductive process.

[@kudjoeadkins-battle2502]

Racism is fairly new. Less than 600 years old.

[@kudjoeadkins-battle2502]

@@zxcbxfjyj423 I teach history. Tell me where I’m wrong?

[@MrChickennugget360]

@@kudjoeadkins-battle2502 No its not. We literally have historic sources as old as detailed writing that are racist. Clearly you are a poorly educated teacher. Its sad that people like you are teaching young people that racism is "600 years old" Clearly you never read Herodotus.

[@lisyekseremssko5578]

English gives a bad sentiment to " neanderthals met humans " In broad number of languages neanderthals met sapiens, but they were both humans already. With label " human " being applied to all species in homo genus. It is more in line with other naming schematics we use in biology and highlight how closely related we were. Way closer than some " breeds" of animals we currently study. Humans met humans, even before there was only one human species

[@CPlusPlusOpenGLMan]

Yes, I fully agree.

[@jemrosekoontz189]

Thank you for this great podcast

[@jan_phd]

Where did they park their starships?

[@katm9877]

I always believed that the reason why so few hybrids were found (and that we eventually replaced the Neanderthals) was a mule kind of a situation, that female Neanderthal x homo sapiens male gave offspring that was more or less predisposed to live than male Neanderthal x sapiens female. But with BOTH mitochondrial DNA and Y chromosome DNA coming from modern humans, that little theory of mine goes out of the window....

[@makeitpay8241]

you may be onto something

[@grimnir8872]

Yeah the discovery of more than Mitochonrdrial DNA shows the interbreeding was very much two way.

[@DragonFae16]

I'd been wondering why no European men alive today had inherited the Neandertal Y chromosomes. I never considered this could be the answer.

[@connieduras2386]

Thanks!

[@cimachu]

When are we gonna see another episode of the deep time podcast?

[@kellybronner4031]

Shouldn't we be referring to the modern humans as specifically "modern humans" or "sapiens" so that we don't imply that Neandertals weren't human?

[@Ekaustonian]

They weren't Humans. They are both "homonids". Neanderthals may have had "Human - as in Homo sapien" characteristics, but are not themselves Humans; they are Homo neanderthalensis.

[@martijn9568]

@@Ekaustonian I believe the discussion is more about if we should call Neanderthals humans because we wouldn't see them as different from humans if we saw a Neanderthal in real life.

[@kippesnikkel5217]

I think you meant Midichlorians. Sincerly, Qui-Gon Jinn

[@pierrepierre2356]

You guys talk a lot about the past on this channel, and that’s super interesting. But can you make a video of future evolution of our ecosystems ? Or something related to the future. Using the knowledge of the past, we can predict what will happen in the future.

[@nexuswave1984]

Mind-blowing!