The SECRET of Bulk Fermentation: Measuring Dough Temperature and % Rise - The Two-Factor Method

[@MeliXdupraeX]

Can’t thank you enough! As someone who utilizes evidence based practice in healthcare I have been SO frustrated by the magnitude of nonspecific information regarding fermentation. Every baker seems to “measure with their heart”. But there’s no way to create consistent results this way without having extensive experiential knowledge that a beginner would not have. My first loaf was beginners luck. As soon as my kitchen started warming up this spring I was making overproofed after overproofed dough. Can’t wait to try again!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@cyn4rest]

Great info. Took the temp of my dough during bulk fermentation- zero guesswork as to when it was finished. I baked two of the best loaves of whole grain sourdough bread I have ever made! Oven Spring was amazing! Been baking >65 years. Color me happy! Thank you so very much!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@emzoneill6735]

Hi please tell me how many grams of starter, water and wholegrain flour u used ?

[@cyn4rest]

@@emzoneill6735 Hi. Sorry I don’t recall. This was 3 weeks ago. But, my starter is 95-100 % hydration, and usually use about 100g. Also I use fresh milled flour. HTHs

[@maidmarymoo]

Lifechanging sourdough info. I won't bother with anyone else's sourdough instructions. This channel provides all anyone needs.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@emmabaido458]

Totally agree. These videos are the best! 🙌🏼

[@02nov56]

Worked great for me! Have only been on my ‘sourdough craze’ since the beginning of Feb 2024 when I decided to create a sourdough starter. I’m hooked! But it has been cold here and was wondering how the dough will respond when our hot summers get here. Had a blazing fire going and thought I’d experiment with bulk fermentation times while the room was at a warmer temp. Dough temperature was 76 degrees and I followed the chart for bulk fermentation. The dough ended up being a whole different consistency, frankly I was concerned as to how the bread would turn out. It ended up with a spectacular ear, and a perfect crumb! Am so pleased, thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks for the feedback!

[@davidnemecek7479]

Finally, person with a brain that shares what he learned.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. 🙏

[@DeborahSample-i1c]

You have the heart of an educator Tom! Great information, explained very well.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you, I appreciate that!

[@NikoOkamoto]

OMG, this is such a gamechanger. Your simple chart provides so much clarity. Your video and this information really removes the mystery and frustration about bulk fermentation and for the first time, I feel confident my next loaf will be perfectly proofed. At last!!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@dawnciarleglio75]

FINALLY! Someone who gets it! Thank you so much for this and all of your other informative videos from the first. You have combined the mind and talents of a science teacher with the enthusiasm and creativity of an artisan baker. You should be very proud. Yours seems to be the only no-nonsense sourdough channel out there! Keep it up and Thanks again! Your friend in sourdough from CT, Dawn Ciarleglio.

[@NikoOkamoto]

He's even got a little comedian in him, too. I love Tom and this channel!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! I appreciate the feedback.

[@dianapagnucco8161]

wow the javelin demo was incredible - thank you for your confidence, patience, and belief in all of us out here trying to understand what the heck we're doing - you're a HUGE help and a wonderful teacher!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you so much. I appreciate the feedback. It took me two years to come up with an analogy that really worked. I had a very complicated hot air balloon analogy too. Glad I didn’t need to use that one. 🥸

[@dianapagnucco8161]

haha i'm an analogy junkie too - when you come up with a good one, it's a great feeling - the santa-mobile is good and funny too :) @@thesourdoughjourney

[@evielem863]

Best video ever explaining bulk fermentation in an accurately measurable way! Thank you for this!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@TitanSuksod-fv2et]

I have seen a bunch of sourdough tutorial clip but as you said, most of them didn't mention about the dough temperature! (their clips are also great resources) until I found yours and got it!!! I tried once with checking the dough temperature and the % of rising vs the temp..and it work very well!!! I am trying again today and will see the results tomorrow. thanks so much for sharing this useful resources.. from Bangkok, Thailand 😊😊🙏

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. Good luck.

[@thanhhang1392]

You are really an excellent teacher. Even all of your videos are very long, I decided to watch all of it because they are so precious. Thanks for doing this for us. I hope you will make more videos. I’m waiting for you to come back xxxxxxx

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏

[@helentate9659]

Virtually every one of Tom’s sentences is gold dust. In all modesty I am a (very) good cook but cracking sourdough has been the toughest challenge of my culinary career. With Tom I have progressed from overly sour, dense doorstops which my family refused to eat, to open crumbed success. I think I’ve got most of the principles under my belt, but once in a while I’ll randomly watch a video from the sourdough consortium HQ and still benefit greatly. Thank you Tom you are a legend in your own kitchen.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏

[@tammyharris7216]

The absolute best explanation and instruction I have seen. Thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@espenstoro]

As a new baker, I love how I'm getting my findings verified. I made some utterly flat baguettes by following a recipe to the letter. Next time I cut the timings down to slightly more than half, and it was drastically better. It's been rather hot around here. Now my first ever sourdough bread is in the oven, and it's not flat. Not the best, but it's better than expected. Thanks for sharing your knowledge, it's really helpful.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. Good luck.

[@claudiar.4815]

Tartine country loaf has been the only recipe that has been so consistent and I love it. Thank you for this great video. ❤❤❤

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@soniacosgrove]

I had so many a-ha moments watching this! Even though I have heard you explain this before, there was something in the way you explained it that just made sense to me! I will be watching and studying this over and over. Thank you for your work involved in putting this together 🥰

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I appreciate the feedback and am happy to help.

[@terryhudson665]

Excellent video. Just started my journey in January of 2024. I’ve learned exactly what I was hoping to learn. Thanks Tom.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Good luck!

[@karenhelenthal3105]

Wow. This is the most informative, logical, and relatable explanation I have ever heard. Thank you for providing an invaluable guide for a reliable understanding and application of the process. Thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. 🙏

[@donnaandre7633]

This makes so much sense. I am going to binge watch all of these videos.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks.

[@KogakuKing]

All I can say is “THIS WORKS!” Just pulled my first loaf using this technique from the oven. Beautiful! As is common in sourdough baking, there are always surprises. This bake was no exception. Based on 81° target dough temp, my “Rise Time” was estimated at a little less than 5-6 hours. I was quite surprised when, at an ambient temperature of 79-80°, my dough hit the target volume in 3.5 hours! I was momentarily very skeptical about the accuracy of the bulk fermentation chart. But, as you would say, “…In the interest of science and transparency …” I decided to trust the math and see where it went. Glad I did. The loaf was beautiful; better than I imagined. Had I let the dough ferment any longer I surely would have over-proofed the dough. Happy Day 😊

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you for the feedback!

[@LizHolbrook-iq4me]

After 4 months of trying to make sourdough bread, temping the dough and following this chart finally worked for me!!! In this 4 month process, I even bought a bread proofer, which actually made my bread worse. Turned out my dough was very warm and I was overproofing my bread. Once I cut off the bulk fermentation at about 3 hrs 45 minutes, my sourdough bread is perfect…..the bread of my dreams.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks for sharing!

[@ariframlee6386]

This channel is the most scientific sourdough guidance out there. Thank you

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@shellymcfalls3147]

HO-LEE-COW. I’m using this chart for the first time today. I’ll never do it another way. EVER. This is truly amazing. Thank you for doing the work. Thank you for sharing the results. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks you.

[@Eilonwy50]

THANKS!!! After multiple fails with recipes that called for a 100% bulk fermentation rise, I finally got my loaves to rise by stopping at 75% or less. Thanks for explaining how it works.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks! Good luck.

[@annabruzzese7300]

When do you take the temperature of the dough? Is it after stretch and folds

[@RoddieH]

@@annabruzzese7300According to the chart (shown at 4:45): "Bulk fermentation begins when starter is added," so unless your dough temperature is changing wildly between the mix and your last stretch and fold, that's when to take the temperature for this guide. Also see 31:30 of the video. This is from the article on the website: Is the target bulk fermentation temperature the “ending temperature?” No. It is the average (and ending) temperature. Bulk fermenting your dough is not like cooking a steak where you are trying to raise the temperature to a desired end point. Bulk fermentation works best if you can maintain your target temperature throughout bulk fermentation. Use tools such as a desired dough temperature calculator and a proofing chamber to maintain a constant dough temperature throughout bulk fermentation. Temperature fluctuations during bulk fermentation can result in uneven dough fermentation with some parts of the dough fermenting faster or slower than others. The appropriate target percentage rise is more influenced by the ending dough temperature because that temperature influences the fermentation in the downstream steps. Bulk fermentation times generally are driven by the average dough temperature during bulk fermentation.

[@grahamsmith5952]

For so long I've been guessing at what variables to change based on instructions from books and videos on WHAT to do but not WHY to do it. Such a relief to find someone who so clearly explains why things work the way they do. Loved the santa low-rider analogy too. Hilarious

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@trishh9219]

My DT was 77 degrees. I split the difference in time. I pre-shaped and shaped to put into the frig. I did the poke test, which I know is not completely reliable, but did it anyway. That showed the dough was under proofed. After being in the frig overnight, it was perfect! Thanks for a great tutorial.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Excellent. Great job !👏

[@giselevonkonigstein3154]

You are amazing!! For the first time I was able to make a perfect loaf!! My biggest problem was not knowing when bulk fermentation was over, cause everyone always says “when it has doubled in size” and it always ended up over fermenting to me when it doubled in size. I’m really grateful for this video!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. 🙏

[@Pa2m2ela22]

This is so helpful- game changer for sure!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks.

[@KN-ks6zf]

Thanks for the information, Tom. You're so passionate to sourdough. The most informative sourdough video I've ever watched. This is definitely will be my guide for bulk fermentation from now on. Appreciate your time and your work, professor 🙏. Magnificent work!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@GG-qg2iu]

I kept seeing this chart come up on all the Facebook groups and they didn't quite understand it. I knew absolutely nothing about sourdough or how it rose or how it was different from regular yeasted breads. Now I know! It's been a couple of months so I'm definitely going to try this! I really think lack of oven spring is related to over fermentation. Thank you so much. Funny thing is my kitchen isn't even on here.. in the winter it's about 62° on average lol

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. Good luck!

[@an4950]

3 loaves later and I cant thank you enough Tom. You are my favorite Sourdough person! ❤🎉

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@magdalenarzeplinska]

Mine too. Greetings from Warsaw, Poland. ❤️😀

[@rosyperu88]

I’m so glad I found your channel Tom. Thank you for all the information here. I’ve been making sourdough for a year and I’ve been overproofing through the winter because my kitchen is warmer. I never thought to take the dough temperature. Your scientific studies have helped me to finally understand the chemistry behind fermentation. I will print your work and keep learning from you. Thank you again

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@grahamhagerty8648]

As a beginner and a scientist, I really appreciate addressing so many of the quirks that appear in most sourdough "logic". It was driving me crazy! Thanks👍👍

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@lolajacomino6574]

I finally have a guide. So many KZbinrs need to see your videos 🙄 Thank you so much Tom ❤

[@thesourdoughjourney]

thank you.

[@27kjh]

This video was absolutely awesome! You’ve made measuring, time and temperature so much clearer. You answered all the questions I’ve had, and even some that I didn’t even know I had. You’ve help me understand the process so much better. Thank you.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks for watching!

[@alfontana6242]

Good job Tom you knocked it out of the park again. Every time I see one of your videos I learn something new even though I’ve been making sourdough bread for nearly four years.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏

[@springtime700]

Best ever information. This was a life changer for me.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@cciieerraar32]

Your videos and information has helped me a great deal over this last year! Thank you. Would love for you to do a video on bulk fermentation doing a different type of loaf. Like a sandwich bread when adding in things like butter/oil, sugar/honey, maybe an egg. And how those ingredients affect bulk fermentation time.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I will add that to my future list of topics.

[@janiggulden4193]

Another outstanding video! You've covered all the variables, and answered every question that came to mind while watching. Your analogies are excellent illustrations. I might just finally get the whole bulk fermentation thing down! Thank you for being the scientist on our behalf!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@ddr80]

the how to read crumbs photos along with this temperature dependent fermentation chart are game changer, finally figured out why my dough is sometimes way over proofed and sometimes under

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@MrJeGeir]

LOVE ❤ how precise you are! Love the use of the metric system!! This is backing on the next lvl!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks 🙏

[@alejandrodavila3411]

Hello from Mexico! I have followed your videos and this one is really awesome. I tried immediately / the day I watched. I marked a new container (with my wifes's permission of course) and started to measure. My dough grew to 75% which is what the chart showed, but I think I still need some more, since the crumb was not as open. Thank you very much !

[@thesourdoughjourney]

This guidance is generally on the low end. If it under, add 10% on the next try. You’ll dial it in after 3-5 bakes.

[@hdesutter]

This video is PRICELESS! You have a gift, Tom. Much appreciated!! 🙌🏽👏🏽 Wish I had this when I first started but, this just validates I understand the process correctly. Thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@helenbhunter]

Fabulous information. Absolute game changer! Thank you so much for the time and effort you spent researching this, and so generously sharing it.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks you.

[@teod.2779]

Thank you, Tom! Such a scientific approach to sourdough baking, taking into account so many variables, as usual! Great work!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@joanneolsen3217]

I’m so glad I’ve learned this! I have lost countless loaves to overproofing & on my own figured I need to let it rise till about 75%- but now I know the facts it won’t be a stressy guessing game anymore!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks! 🙏

[@pattyfigarola5057]

Another great video - thanks so much! I just wanted to share a little Tik Tok tip (I know how much you love those!). There’s a microbakery owner that posted a technique where she bulk ferments at 80 degrees F and will use an aliquot jar. Nothing new there, but her spin on it is that she places 40g of her dough (after all ingredients have been mixed / pre- stretch & fold) into a 2 oz condiment container like what I used to use to make Jell-O shots back in college. She’s figured out that if she lets the dough rise until it hits the lid of this container, that indicates a 30% rise. I’ve tried it and I think it works, but I prefer just placing all of my dough into a 2,000 ml measuring bowl like you have and measuring my rise from there. What I find interesting is that several others have commented and posted videos saying that this has worked for them with whatever room temperature their house is at. That part doesn’t make sense to me. I just thought it was interesting and wanted to share.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. Yes, I’ve seen that. I haven’t tried it yet, but I will.

[@MatheusCdePaula]

Hi, Tom! Fairly new to sourdough baking and summer in Brazil makes everything even harder because of high temperatures. I’ve been looking at a lot of videos on KZbin, reading blogs and Reddit threads about sourdough but honestly this video here is by far the best content I’ve found. I’m a stickler when it comes to measuring and as you said, almost no recipe gives you all the three parameters. Also, whenever I remotely tried to double my dough, it would become a liquid mess. So thank you for being a cranky old dude, I’ll try to bake again this weekend with a fresh perspective 😊

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! Here’s another method to consider if your kitchen is warm. thesourdoughjourney.com/what-is-two-stage-bulk-fermentation/

[@MatheusCdePaula]

@@thesourdoughjourney thank you! I’ll definitely try this method as well.

[@SidAuteur]

Wish I'd read this last night LOL. Just put a loaf in and might have over done the bulk last night. We'll see. As always though, great information from a baker who really puts in the work to understand and refine the processes. This gentleman taught me how to bake bread and I've been baking at least two loafs of great bread a week since I discovered him. Thanks Tom!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks! 🙏

[@ddfc8255]

Cannot thank you enough very analytical and clear rarely found

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@braunarete5044]

I've been working at a bakery making sourdough and baguettes for the past 3 months. Our AC keeps going out which has been tricky to adjust to. I was about to make a temperature/bulk fermentation spreadsheet myself and I came across your video which is amazingly presented. You might cover this in a separate video but another thing I've learned with our room temperature is the carry over in starter activity for several days if our AC goes out. It's normally 71-72 f and if the AC is out it's 78-79. I couldn't believe the huge difference that just 6-8 degrees makes and how drastic my bulk fermentation time changes the following days even if the room temperature is back to 71-72 f.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. Yes, great point. The starter health and strength is very much impacted by temperature. And it can lag for a few days.

[@braunarete5044]

@@thesourdoughjourney something wild happened with today's bake! So normally I start a autolyse for our euro and baguette dough while I do the morning bake and feed our euro starter. It's very active so it falls at least once or twice before I add it after I bake. Did everything the same today, had a very elastic and beautiful window in the dough. After I had weighed the different loaves into bus tubs I start pre forming (three hours at 78 f) and the dough was running on me. It lost 80-90 of its extensibility but it was very taught, ripped/leaked if you started manipulating it. The ph at this point is normally 4.7-4.8, if it's overproved it'll be 4.5 or below but it had less starter and less bulk fermentation than yesterday and had a pH of 5.6. even if it starts running on me the structure and feeling of the dough while very relaxed still maintains characteristics. It was as if only parts of the gluten network were being affected. My coworker did some digging and came across a apparently rare strain of bacteria that can form from the starter being warmer than 86 f or in the fridge with infrequent feeding. A different coworker had a wheat starter that they neglected and grew pink mold, so I'm wondering if those spores found their way into the euro. I roughly formed it the best I could because I'm curious if it will caramelize tomorrow. I kept a piece of dough out at room temperature because normally it would continue to over prove right? 3-4 hours later it had remained the same and even had a slight improvement to its extensibility. I've been doing the same recipe, bulk/starter/folds etc amounts for the last 4-5 weeks with great results. Have you heard of these strains and/or have you ever had something like this happen to you?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Wow. That’s very interesting. I’ve never heard of that but it sounds like something very out of the ordinary.

[@justforkicks4427]

one of the best videos I've seen on youtube regarding sourdough honestly.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@MarkKrebs]

Hi folks. I'm a month in, and loving THE IIftAoSS&R of Cleveland, Ohio. The videos have all been good and I've just baked my first really good loaf. This video touches one of the main points for me which was to vigilantly watch and quickly arrest a fast warm ferment, 'cause it's got momentum! Altogether, I had 5 major technique tweaks that made my bread go from breadmaker-machine-quality to really good. IYI: 1) Bought some thermometers: like this video says, dough temp matters while fermenting. 2) Got a dutch oven and I spritz the bread when i put it in. (I'm at high altitude, btw.) 3) Measure! The crazy mistake I made was, I have some pint glasses, and I know how big a pint is, and the density of water so I scaled my recipe to match, with water and starter adding up to exactly a pint. (Don't try this at home kids: I'm a rocket scientist.) Well, pride goeth before a fall as they say... As it turns out, my scale reads 8% low! That induced a chain of disasters until I happened to notice and tracked down why my pint glass contained only 430g of water instead of 473g. The scale factor error is tolerable, but only if you weigh everything, even the water. Not so genius after all, eh smart boy? 4) My oven was 20deg cold. Score another point for thermometers. 5) I got a banneton and cloth. Thanks Tom, for this whole series. All of this has been very rewarding. photos.app.goo.gl/yZ2MdG9Vn91jK8GV8

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks! 🙏 I appreciate the feedback and your updates.

[@DoughReMeandYou]

😮💡This is so helpful! This is my first winter baking sourdough, and I’ve been confused why the same process is leading to different results. It takes way more time to bulk ferment, which made sense due to colder temps, but I never thought about the role that the temp played in relation to the percentage rise before I popped my loaves into the fridge. Excited to see how my next loaves turn out! Thank you for all the time and energy you put into making your videos!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Good luck. Let me know how it works out!

[@emmabaido458]

Something that finally makes sense! Absolutely loved this video. Thank you so much.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. 🙏

[@NikoOkamoto]

At this very minute, my FIRST by-the-book (as opposed to improvisations of) Tartine Country Loaf is bulk fermenting, using your proven methods. Completely different S&F experience, insane windowpaning, and now just waiting for the dough to reach 140% @ 77°F. This loaf is going to be epic. Thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! Good luck!

[@danielhiam5108]

Thank you so much for this info. This has zeroed in my proofing. Just took my bread out of oven and it's the best one yet. Game changer for sure.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

thank you.

[@mendingmandy869]

Excuse me. How dare you be so amazing and educated haha :p thank you SO much. Im a new sourdough baker and the bulk fermentation was scaring me. I feel so much more equipped to handle this phase accurately!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@morrellirocks]

Wow so so helpful!! I love how your delivery the information as I laughed and learned at the same time. Thank you!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. 🙏

[@lissyperez4299]

Thank you so much! This was a game changer for me since seems like I either overproofed or underproofed based on our house temperature. We keep our house very cool in the winter so it takes forever for it to ferment, I just did one at 18 hours and still had a great dough at 75% proofing after I saw your video! In the summer I tried to leave it overnight only because it's easier to make bread that way and guess what definitely overproofed it! So I guess I will do a much shorter proofing this coming summer.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Glad it was helpful!

[@libbykalinowski5799]

Today I was in the midst of trying to figure out my 80 degree bulk fermentation timing for a couple of loaves. I am new to sourdough baking and have had some success with this baking ritual. However, I have been confounded by bulk fermentation timing. One expert says smell the dough, another says feel the dough, another see the dough (but each prefaces their recommendations on some fantastical knowledge one 31:20 should obtain after months if not years of exhaustive sniffing, staring at, and fearfully touching the object of our affection - fermenting dough. I have asked myself how one ever knows how to gain the knowledge without suffering through great misery. None of these experts have stated what you as well as I believe in - scientific research. Of course, as I awaited the right moment to pre-shape, I happened upon your wonderful explanation of the coup de grace, temperature and time. I smiled and instantly thought, “Of course, science does rule the world, even the sourdough world.”

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.🙏

[@R00ster108]

I was a professional baker in my younger years. I always used cake yeast and was very aware of how a mixer raised dough temperature due to friction and that using the correct temperature of water affected bread baking. Time and temperature is important at every step from mixing, fermentation, bench rest, to proofing and baking. Sourdough bread is a different beast. When is the optimum point for using the starter? What's the correct hydration for the flour I'm using? How many stretches and folds is the correct number and when do I perform them? How long do I bulk ferment the dough? How long do I bench rest the dough? How much pressure do I apply in shaping? I've been wrestling with these issue for months. Many of them I've gotten comfortable with but this lesson regarding time and temperature and bulk fermentation volume has been a missing key in my understanding the process. Thanks for putting this together in a repeatable and verifiable method. You think like an engineer. Big thumbs up!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! I appreciate the feedback. I’ve been tackling many of these topics one at a time in my videos. I’m down to a few of the last mysteries, including: 1) Optimal hydration level for specific flours 2) impact of hand mixing methods on open crumb 3) impact of baking temperatures/methods on crumb These contribute to the last 5-10% of “perfection” in the quest for open crumb. Bulk fermentation is a huge contributor. Thats why I've done so much work there. and starter strength/health.

[@debbybrady1246]

I just bought a thermometer for my kitchen and one for the dough. Thanks for your videos.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. 🙏

[@barneybilello7606]

Tom, your videos and website are by far the best out there for sourdough bakers. After a few months of watching your work I finally have consistency in my loaves that I did not have before. This video completely answers my confusion on when to end bulk fermentation. Thank you! I have one question that you did address a bit earlier in response to another viewer’s comment. I typically only make 1-2 loaves at time. Can we use your methodology that you discussed in this video if we scale up to a larger amount of dough?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes. Sometimes I’ll mix a large batch and pull out one batch worth and out it in a separately for monitoring the rise. Then I assume both batches are rising equivalently but it is easier to see in a single batch. You want to ensure the dough temp remains the same between both.

[@barneybilello7606]

@@thesourdoughjourney Thank you!

[@abbykennedy9275]

I recently found your channel and I love your scientific approach to sourdough baking! It's so frustrating when people say things like "with experience, you'll learn to naturally read the dough." No thanks, I like charts and graphs to really understand the science. Please keep making these videos of your sourdough journey :-)

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! “Just read the dough” is the laziest instruction I’ve ever heard in my life. “Just swing the bat.. “Just throw the ball…” “Just swing the club…” “just read the dough…”

[@abbykennedy9275]

I posted my last comment before I finished the entire video and now I can say that in my opinion this is hands down the BEST video I've seen on bulk fermentation. Thank you! I can't wait to try it when I bake tomorrow :-) Do you think that additions to the dough (such as raisins, cheese, etc.) will impact the formula?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

As long as you follow a consistent method it should still work. Adding inclusions will raise the starting volume in milliliters. But the target percentage rise should remain the same.

[@Lilmayabee]

Oh boy, I watched this video right after I put my dough in the fridge without waiting for the dough to rise 😢 I guess I can already tell the outcome 😢… another great video by Tom though!! So much great information! Thanks again!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks.

[@patriciazander2072]

I came back to your channel per Nim's (nimcm on KZbin) recommendation...I have been jumping around to many different sourdough experts on KZbin...and I think I am finally discovery a substantive site with you....thank you for all you do...PS the gentleman who authors the Perfect Loaf channel does say that temperature is one of the ingedients of sourdough and should be seriously addressed in the same manner as all the other ingredients...but your scientific explanation (your graph on your website is excellent) supports such a statement...and the car braking analogy is excellent as well....

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@supernoobsmith5718]

This is a revelation....even for yeasted breads. Great work my friend.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@supernoobsmith5718]

Been baking regular bread for about 1 year. And just recently began relying on dough temp to rise in a timely fashion in my coldish kitchen 68F or less. But now I can tell I've been bulk rising too long when I began manipulating the dough temp. I created a sourdough starter recently that is just now beginning to come to maturity, and I will use your valuable information here, and know I will have success sooner than later. @@thesourdoughjourney

[@dashermike3207]

Well I’m unable to get as involved or as accurate as you seem to get but I do want to say thanks for this very extensive explanation because for the first time in my three years of trying to produce good sourdough bread I have started paying much more attention to dough temperature and I have stopped rushing the necessary rise time. Now my crum is much lighter and my crust is a lot crisper, thinner, and easier to eat. I appreciate the info very much!

[@dashermike3207]

In other words for years I have been under proofing the dough. Since watching this video I now just get out of the way and allow the dough to proof closer to what is ideal. Still imperfect but a 100% better.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Glad it helped!

[@hobbyless4089]

This video reminded me of my chemistry class back in college. Rate of kinetics to be exact, the rate at which certain reactions occur plays an important role. Good information, I like the science based method you present.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@aracelibutler8411]

I know you probably didn't mean to be funny, but it really was, in the best way. This video is the most helpful one i have seen. I dont do well with the willy nilly follow your heart kind of instructions so this video is a godsend!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@dandooon99]

Tom, this is an amazing job really useful for all ppl around the world

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@damullins]

Thank you so much! You are the best. You should write a book on sourdough. It would be a best seller among sourdough bakers. I appreciate all you do. The information I have gained from you has changed everything about my bread for the better.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

thank you so much. My website is my “working draft.”

[@smokinJoe682]

Tom, because of the difficulty of measuring rise % in an irregular shaped vessel, I put a dough sample in a 1/2"-3/4' diameter prescription bottle, mark and place next to the mother load. I can then easily see the exact % of rise. I add it back when it has completed its job.. BTW, I love the scientific dimension you add to the video's. Your thoughts?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

That works, but only if you can keep the temperature the same between the sample and the main dough. That is the only problem with that method.

[@robertosarnataro]

Precious classroom! and last but not least the “chemical process” in the 27°C/80,6°F bulk fermentation are a bit different in the 18°C/64,4°F bulk fermentation

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes. Thank you.

[@rixtusdonau9098]

This is so good! My other hobby requires me to plot trajectories very accurately and The Javelin Example made so much sense. Thank you Tom. Flour Power!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I tried for years to come up with an analogy that worked. I had a very complicated hot air balloon analogy. Glad I found the javelin one. 😀

[@theartisanbakeryschool1846]

🤩Brilliant lesson, thank you. Have you got anything on proofing temperature and volumes by any chance?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

What exactly are you looking for?

[@theartisanbakeryschool1846]

@@thesourdoughjourney Thank you for coming back to me. I just wondered lwhat volume increase should I expect in the final fridge proof before bake - 30% ; 50%; 75% or 100%

[@dantortorici5623]

Thanks, Tom. You have been explicit in that this will work repeatedly for the same dough formula. How do you think volume of bread made impacts this? Certainly, more mass will take longer to cool in the refrigerator, other thoughts?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

If you out 10 or more loaves in the fridge, for example, it will raise the temp in the fridge and take longer for all the loaves to get down to fridge temp. Some people also see seasonal differences in their fridge temp. Everyone needs to make small adjustments to dial it in for your circumstances, but it will then be very repeatable.

[@DANVIIL]

Well done! The final key to getting great sourdough loaves. Thanks!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I always appreciate your feedback.

[@Usernamebutwhy]

The best video. Awesomely detailed. Thankyou sir!!!!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏

[@ThisHereIsMyUserName6]

How does this work if I only want to refrigerate my dough for 3 hours before baking instead of 8 hours? Would that mean I need to go a little higher than a 75% target rise during the initial counter-top bulk fermentation? Thank you so much for posting this video and responding to questions. What a great resource for newbies who are trying to wrap their heads around all the variables that exist in sourdough bread baking! 🤯 😵‍💫🥴

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes. You’re still getting a fair amount of fermentation in the fridge in the first 3 hours while the dough is still somewhat warm in the fridge, but yes, you would need to push the percentage rise higher in bulk to account for that shorter final proof.

[@cheshpacynko7038]

Great videos and science behind it all to back up and explain it all. Living in the uk we are a lot cooler so more like 21 C so starter activity test ( circa 4 hrs at 27 c I think it was) is more difficult to judge. Very less rise in this test at 21c.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. At 21C (or lower) there is little risk of overproofing. You can easily push it from 75-100% rise. I love that dough temperature. Very forgiving and makes great bread.

[@christine77771]

Wow seriously thank you so much! I’m going to put this into practice on my next few loaves.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@yarnexpress]

I think you've solved a 2 week mystery for me. I was nearing the end of bulk fermentation. My dough temp was 80F & the dough was starting to rise. I was thinking another 30 minutes & I could move on. At that point, due to circumstances beyond my control, I had to abandon my bread making. Put the dough, as it was, into the refrigerator. It was a lot of dough--1 K of flour. 16 hrs later I returned to the dough. I was dismayed that the dough had doubled in volume & had only reached 49F. Brought the dough out & let it sit at room temp for an hour the proceeded to pre-shape & shape. Over the next 3 days, I baked the loaves. The mystery was that those loaves finished nearly perfectly fermented--maybe a tad over proofed but had good structure when removed from their bannetons. Thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

That is a great method. You can do it intentionally. Check out my video "Two-Stage Bulk Fermentation." It describes how to use that method. I love it in the summer when my kitchen is warm, then it goes on auto-pilot in the fridge.

[@yarnexpress]

Of course! I've watched that video. Somewhere in my aging brain I had that info which is why I kept going. Sourdough is amazing it seems no matter what one can produce good(maybe not perfect) bread.

[@markacyr]

@@yarnexpressAfter a few months experimenting, this has become my method of choice. I think about 3 hours of handling is the ideal compromise between quality of final product, schedule flexibility, and time commitment. And you don’t have to measure or gauge anything. As Tom says, it’s bulk fermentation on auto pilot.

[@AshMo23]

I love this!. Santas drive was so great. We can’t have Christmas be canceled!😂 Thank you for explaining that In such a visual way. I get it now!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏

[@kmaeskel]

Laughed a little bit when Finland was mentioned, it's around 23-24 °C in my room right now. If it was 10 °C, I'd have to wear a winter coat and sleep with a hat on! Nevertheless, I appreciate the scientific approach with tons of graphs, thank you for sharing your knowledge!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. That was a bit of exaggeration, but some members of the sourdough groups I’m in are struggling with heating costs and are literally wearing coats and hats in their kitchens.

[@thetwopointslow]

Yo Tom! Another great video, you’re second-to-none in illustrating these concepts with entertaining examples. Would love to see you bake some loaves with additions, like nuts and/or fruit. It’d be interesting to learn the best times at which to add those extra solid ingredients to the dough, as well as how fermentation time is affected. Forgive me if this is something you’ve tackled already but it’d be neat to hear your take.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Great suggestion. I haven’t made a video, but here’s a technique I use for even distribution. thesourdoughjourney.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/How-to-Evenly-Laminate-Add-ins-in-Sourdough.pdf

[@courtneyvanpatten6345]

I was wondering why when in the winter my dough sat on the counter overnight fermenting and was great, but then the summer came and it became a sticky mess! Thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@sylviah1234]

Ok..I have been hating my stainless steel bowl and I have two of those dough buckets in my bread collection. I will definitely go back to using them.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Good luck.

[@Tinadinnah]

You are THE sourdough professor! Now a days people (including myself) have no patience and just watch TikTok videos. However, idk how I found myself here with long videos that I adore! Your videos are like high quality sourdough college classes and I appreciate the incredible amount of effort! I hope you are doing well and thank you for your contribution towards the sourdough community!🫶🫶🫶

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏. I appreciate the feedback. Also check out my website for more content.

[@gn4054]

Many thanks, Tom, for the detailed and clear info! That really helps!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you

[@cherylhaynes3214]

Thank you so much. With every video I learn a little bit more.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@DatTran]

Finally some science on the Internet! For example, the target rise is 50%, but during the stretch and fold, the dough has been degassed but it keeps fermenting. After stretch and fold, I put it in the container. Should I keep the target rise 50% or it should be lower (because some of the rise was lost during folding)? Thanks.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. The target should stay the same. Stretch and folds do degas the dough, but they also “artificially” build height from the stacking of the gluten matrix, not due to fermentation. So it is kind of a wash. The guidance is not absolute, it is a starting point that can be adjusted for each bakers methods. For example, when I use a very high protein flour, I add about 10% to the guidance because the flour “shows the rise” more than others. If I do a lot of coil folding, I add 10% also. But I do this every time for that recipe and method. Once you have it dialed in for a specific temperature, recipe and process, it literally never changes.

[@DatTran]

​@@thesourdoughjourney That's a great point. Thanks a lot.

[@markstewart3967]

Thank you for your expert info but, I have moved to use Einkorn flour and it is a completely different. Do you have any experience with this dough?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

I do not use Einkorn. It is a little tricky to work with. But the principles still apply. If you keep records of your temperature and percentage rise, you should be able to dial in the proofing in 3-5 bakes. Once you get it dialed in, it should be repeatable.

[@magelinekelley7536]

It’s definitely sourdough journey life changing! Thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@ChristinePajonas]

Me again….just got to the point that my question was answered in the video! Great instructions! 🤞🏻🤞🏻

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks

[@lynelabrecque100]

Very interesting!! Is it possible to weight the dough instead of measuring the height?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

No. The weight doesn’t change as it rises.

[@lynelabrecque100]

@@thesourdoughjourney thanks a lot!!

[@patrickhochstein9359]

KZbin algorithms should make your content the first thing anyone seeking to make sourdough sees. So many years of improper rises and mediocre bread that I just stopped altogether. Starting again with renewed enthusiasm.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you .🙏

[@WhatWeDoChannel]

Thanks for this! My next loaf is going to get proofed in a 2L Pyrex dish and I will aim for the correct % rise based on dough/room temperature. Would an actively fermenting dough get to a higher temperature than the ambient temperature of the room because of the metabolic processes of the yeast? I am a long time winemaker, I know that the yeast can make the cap of skins on a red wine ferment really warm to the touch!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. Yes, the fermentation process is exothermic, but you might only see a one degree change in the temp in the center of the dough. I often check the temp, and do see the dough temp above room temp very often.