Badempanada's Embarassing Debate Against Lonerbox (Debate Review)

[@patchhappens7575]

"Who gives a shit if they're not guilty?" I look forward to Bad Empanada being cited by the supreme Court

[@herec0mestheCh33f]

OMEGALUL

[@MindForgedManacle]

💀

[@whyythestupidithurts5564]

Technically they just recently "innocence isn't enough"

[@Jaximous]

he would probably say the supreme court and courts in general are liberal or something , and that guilt isn't a meaningful category. he's not even entirely wrong; it's just all Ws for liberalism.

[@Kikasitsu]

Oh no! Not another “Moscow Trials!”😱 [*Hitler’s reaction to the Tukhaschevsky Trial memo intensifies.*]

[@slackershrub8923]

BE: You defended destiny for 2 hours LB: No I didn't also the video was 45 minutes. BE: I don't care 400 IQ response

[@Ar1AnX1x]

Checkmate

[@hadronoftheseus8829]

I'm just a few minutes in and Badempadada is just outright panicking, full stop. This is no exaggeration, it's _quite_ unmistakable in the timorous shaking of his voice. His lack of confidence i extremely well founded.

[@My_name_is-]

I mean I don't really see the issue with BE saying he defended him for 2 hours instead of 45 minutes since they are both really long times for someone to be in defense of another🤔. Accuracy in parts like this aren't really that important unless this is being documented and the sources need to be 100% accurate. I think that accuracy and being right tend to go hand in hand but don't really mean the same thing. I mean, BE wasn't accurate about the exact amount of time he defended destiny, but either way- he defended destiny and for a considerably long time. I think BE is an Essayist and he tries to argue points with debate bros that he simply can't defend in real time effectively and articulately enough to win. He makes really good points when he makes videos(points that don't include his baseless smears against others like calling LB a Necrophile- which is most likely trolling). He just seems to get too worked up with debate bro tactics that make him say things on the spot out of spite. I think he shouldn't really debate and stick to doing creating content. He just can't pick up on the tactics and speak his point well enough under pressure.

[@filipmaly6603]

Good, reality is overated after all!

[@jessedoof4054]

@@My_name_is- you right, it's obvious his point was correct and arguing over the actual time is petty

[@hi__im_zack4890]

You know there are going to be some serious memes when the person doesn't even say hello and just jumps right into it.

[@Keviamaya]

The devil shivers when a clown starts morbin

[@alrecks619]

@kevin amaya i see what you did there.

[@SillyGooseProduction]

when someone walks up to you in a dark alley and he's wearing a gi

[@energeticstunts993]

the guy who re-posts propaganda about IDF al shifa hospitals (lonerbox) seems more like the devil here

[@supermutantsam1160]

I’m surprised this wasn’t just an hour of BE attempting to blast copyrighted music over Loner’s stream. That is where his argumentative strengths lie, after all

[@Meladjusted]

Does he actually do that sort of thing?

[@billzhang8628]

@@Meladjusted yes with sdl

[@verager2493]

@@Meladjusted he's mostly famous for being on his 50th Twitter account from all the death threats and doxing

[@chickenintrousers6723]

@@verager2493 isn’t he also banned from Reddit?

[@iz2333]

@@Meladjusted yes I think even more than once

[@Colddirector]

I’ve never seen someone so arrogantly concede pretty much every argument they make.

[@JSmusiqalthinka]

Oh you have a counter point? Whatever I don't give a shit.

[@lillebror1567]

been waiting for Goodempanada for years now

[@jeremiahbarnes6313]

Noah....

[@Colddirector]

@@jeremiahbarnes6313 if you mean Noah Samson, he wasn’t really arrogant. he politely conceded every point he had then retracted it all later. He’s spineless, Badempanada is just stupid

[@jeremiahbarnes6313]

@Rohan Orton I smiled at bashful

[@Froggsroxx]

LB: "this is spliced together" BE: "no it's not it's a full clip!" LB: "so it's a 3 minute clip?" BE: "no it's a a bunch of 30s clips" LB: "so it's spliced together" BE: "noOOooOoo!"

[@Liquid_Smoke]

This little gem of an actual dialogue can be found at around 24:19. I didn't believe it until I heard it myself. Repeatedly.

[@Revan058]

And then kept screaming about how it was totally all in context. Boggles the fukk'n mind.

[@matheusvillela9150]

Defending an ethnostate is okay as long as you do it in 30s clips

[@planetChomskyNews]

@@matheusvillela9150If you go back to the original video, you will find that her views are even worse than he presented.

[@brandonrathbone3690]

@@planetChomskyNews then why did he need to post a bunch of clips, after swearing they weren't clips?

[@ASolidSnack]

I know we call a lot of people mentally ill but BE is genuinely like direly unwell

[@derpeth2101]

Let’s say he is. What arguments of his do you disagree with?

[@iceman5117]

@@derpeth2101 cope

[@derpeth2101]

@@iceman5117 Any arguments?

[@iceman5117]

@@derpeth2101 my argument is that you're weak and you're trying to cope with that fact.

[@derpeth2101]

@@iceman5117 I don’t know buddy, looks like you’re projecting hard.

[@RazorFringe2]

Bad Empanada came in as mad as I've heard someone be in a gooood while.

[@furiousapplesack]

Hysteria is his default state.

[@gudboah4688]

It’s BE, what do you expect?

[@craigstephenson7676]

He is peak mald

[@abstractalien12345]

Considering he's arguing with a full blown zion nazi, the righteous anger is kinda justified

[@Kataki1987]

Dude sounded like some angry internet nerd that had a bunch of pent up anger right at the start. Dont know anything about either of these two but god damn he sounds unhinged.

[@God_gundam36]

BE saying he has a 3 minute audio clip that's not out of context then have that clip feature about a dozen extremely noticeable jump cuts was hilarious.

[@derpeth2101]

You can watch the video on her channel in full context. How exactly is it out of context?

[@sypherthe297th2]

@@derpeth2101 The mere presence of cuts in something that has supposedly not been taken out of context should obviously be disqualifying. I'd expect no less of BadEmpanada. He is a dishonest psycho.

[@derpeth2101]

@@sypherthe297th2 So explain the context then.

[@sypherthe297th2]

@@derpeth2101 Sure. Provide the unedited file with markers where he took the cuts from. Until you can do that, you have nothing with which to rebut the dishonesty of clip-chimping.

[@PhilfreezeCH]

One does not mean the other isn‘t true. Some people just drift off topic all the time, so if you want to make an on-topic clip you need to cut. This is actually something that is pretty apparent with Hasans clips as well, the good clip channels will cut out all the random shit he constantly drifts to because of his ADHD. A totally different example is Elon Musk, he is essentially incomprehensible without editing because he constantly stumbles over his own words.

[@joeverkill9086]

I gotta appreciate Lonerbox's patience in this debate. Talking to BE seems like the most infuriating thing. BE asks a question, Lonerbox starts to respond, then BE just keeps rambling over him.

[@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan]

Lonerbox is being passive agressive to piss of BE. As BE is notorious for being short fused. Lonerbox is douchey for employing this dirty tactic

[@brandonrathbone3690]

@@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan BE is douchy for asserting pride parades are inherently sexual. think about who youre defending here.

[@jawamedia1529]

@@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan maybe BE should work on not getting upset by people arguing with him? Especially of he is going to keep arguing the same stupid points he already argues

[@Saturnia2014]

@@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan No point in having a debate if you can't control your anger

[@ThomasShatter]

@@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan BE is an imbecile and should be put down by injection in a vet office.

[@jwoodsonmusic]

Never listened to BE before, just rolled my eyes at him on Twitter. 8 minutes in and I’m so fucking surprised he’s THIS unhinged holy shit.

[@ftwallday3112]

Unhinged are not his positions were far more correct

[@furiousapplesack]

I've watched his content but don't use twitter, and this debate has confirmed my worst views about him. Makes sense why he supports Flowers. The genocidal do tend to support each other in their intentions. He's even doing the same BS she did with, "all of group x deserves the wall for simply existing, but don't you dare claim I think all of group x deserves the wall you shitlib."

[@josue.ortega]

Some of his video essays are pretty good but man is he insufferable in one to one interaction.

[@scslre]

@@ftwallday3112 the old man the boat

[@page8301]

@@ftwallday3112 Cool story bruh.

[@herec0mestheCh33f]

Saying someone deserves ptsd proves you're completely detached from any concept of actual struggle, and look down upon people from your pristine ivory tower, incapable of understanding anything. Which makes sense. He's well off enough enough to go colonize Argentina, after all

[@kylegidluck3486]

I mean, if I say the Buffalo shooter should have PTSD forever, and that that is right and moral. Would you accuse me, someone who lives with severe PTSD, “detached from the struggle”? Or i have a “PTSD” pass? not defending the lunatic at all, but the folks he wished that on, I’m not against increasing their suffering several degrees!

[@herec0mestheCh33f]

@@kylegidluck3486 yes :gigachad: to the point where I would say that unironically advocating for increased suffering for suffering's sake makes me doubt you've ever meaningfully suffered.

[@charlottecomeau1266]

@@herec0mestheCh33f the people being wished struggling are literal mass murderers. they should be miserable. cope.

[@flunkiebubs2002]

I have CSA PTSD and believe that Rittenhouse deserves PTSD, he's a murderer and still doesn't regret his actions.

[@wheatleythebrick2276]

​@@herec0mestheCh33f im gonna be honest I dont really get that. Like yeah from a utilitarian perspective, no good can come from him suffering (I guess,) but I honestly could not care less if he did. Ofc this is assuming youre not just jerking yourself off here and you genuinely believe in what youre saying, but still saying someone with ptsd hasnt truly suffered is kinda absurd lol.

[@acarter9806]

Bad Empanada: publicly melting down into radioactive slag Vaush, meanwhile: "I'm twuck. I'm a fire twuck. Look I'll show you."

[@Revan058]

@Aziben M1 ...same. Zero idea, but made me laugh.

[@litkeys3497]

Good god BE has lost his entire mind. I don't think I've ever seen somebody less hinged in a debate.

[@Natro166]

Always has been...

[@fullsend8738]

Droniebox advocates for settlement expansion through his complicity. He does not want Palestinians to return home because it means settlers will lose their homes. Why is this not being spoken about? That is a pro Zionist take there is no grey area here. No let's to talk about how "unhinged" BE is. There is nothing to debate here Jesus fuck

[@MrAllofyourbase]

Haz still takes that crown, but the bar to be better than Haz is still somewhere in the Earth's mantle.

[@jodiekoree1086]

@@MrAllofyourbase haz is intelligent though

[@Revan058]

@@jodiekoree1086 ...is he? Is he _really_ , though?

[@theorangeninja6486]

its the fucking manray meme dude LB: "you said all colonizers deserve the wall, yes?" BE: "absolutely" LB: "And you've also called all israelis colonizers, is that correct?" BE: "yes, that's true, anyone who lives in israel is partaking in that colonialist project" LB: "right, so you think all israelis are colonizers, and you think colonizers deserve the wall, do i have that all right? BE: "Sounds good to me." LB: "So you think all israelis deserve the wall." BE: "I never said that, stop utilizing nazi rhetoric"

[@jack3226]

Everyone else: calls BE a lunatic and asshole for being toxic to everyone Badempanada: calls people pedos, necros, encourages their suicide and harassment, etc etc etc BE: "why are people so mean to me D: "

[@GuyShōtō]

I can't wait until some career ending dirt shows up for BE and he inevitably gets canceled.

[@danielshepard1449]

When did BE say "why are people so mean to me"? He's pretty open about how he hates most of streaming politics

[@GuyShōtō]

@@danielshepard1449 Weird because he's literally everything he cries about. Ultra toxic on social media, throwing baseless accusations and outright lying against Lonerbox, and making spurious at best and libelous at worse proclamations about people. I get he's not mentally right in the head, but BE's a joke.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

BE is the kind of guy who makes a big deal about Hitler’s concentration camps as this big moral failure of the world while making arguments defending Stalin's ethnic cleansing and red purge/ the gulags

[@mckenzie.latham91]

@@danielshepard1449 BE says multiple times in the debate--er sorry the stream that liberals like loner box alway are framing him and or his positions out of context and or framing his "facts" as something worse and or evil he does it multiple times

[@trashketchum9782]

can’t believe an Australian is spouting performative “colonists get the wall” sentiment by his logic if he doesn’t move to the UK or Roblox himself he’s a total hypocrite

[@somethingelse5599]

Even worse, he moved to Argentina. He is a double colonial settler.

[@calebharris292]

@@somethingelse5599 holy shit I thought he *was* born in Argentina

[@trashketchum9782]

@Something Else there’s a long history of antisemites moving to Argentina.. lol

[@GreekHouseEffect]

@@somethingelse5599 that's not how colonialism works

[@somethingelse5599]

@@GreekHouseEffect I know....I'm making fun of Badempanada's conflation with colonialists with white people.

[@solareclipse4241]

Loner Box: Do all Israelis deserve the wall? Bad Empanada: Well um... Bad Empanada is reaching negative IQ numbers

[@esbenm6544]

@derzzsh Who's the ethno-nationalist again?

[@esbenm6544]

@derzzsh That you consider them equal is very telling about you.

[@esbenm6544]

@derzzsh You like pancakes? So you hate waffles.

[@esbenm6544]

@derzzsh No thanks. I don't have to prop up a dictator just because he toppled the previous dictator.

[@cunning_linguist.]

@derzzsh Literally dogma

[@akaroth7542]

God, he needs meds. Does he think this method of interaction does anything to persuade people over to him? Or does he actually just want to push people away to be king of a lonely castle?

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Yeah, his rage is unaltered But don't let that distract you from his arguments on his videos. They are very well put together and verifiable on top of that

[@hodgi3]

Was hoping you'd go over this. So much meme potential

[@hadronoftheseus8829]

Good god, I'm about four minutes in, and Badempanada is _palpably terrified_ . His voice was trembling from the outset and there are moments where it sounds very much like he's close to literally bursting into tears. This is _exactly_ the kind of person for whom the epithets "keyboard warrior" and "internet tough guy" were coined. No puddle ever fit a pothole more closely than these terms fit him.

[@evieeevee]

H huh uuI my u I

[@evieeevee]

Uh

[@GuyShōtō]

@@hadronoftheseus8829 TRUUUEEE!!

[@Dylanquinn666]

Badempanada sounds like he's never interacted with another human being outside of stupid twitter arguments with strangers.

[@Rudero3]

Ok that comment is AMAZING because that's the truth. It genuinely feels like he could get into this level argument with a person at a Wendy's or whatever, like does this dude not know how to talk to people? If he uses his common phrase of "I don't care" then like, bad manners alone make people unwillingly to listen or entertain his arguments. Like his catchphrase of "settler colonialism" feels like something he brings up all the time....to anyone....

[@Misterbgone1]

I don’t think he has I think he moved to Argentina and just stays inside making videos and crying on Twitter

[@Time_Is_Left]

Characterizing a public, mainstream pride event as overtly sexual seems homophobic to me

[@chelsgo8675]

I thought the same thing. Like, was BE suggesting that kids shouldn't be at pride?

[@sypherthe297th2]

Tankies are regressive social conservative authoritarians cloaked in red. Such behavior shouldn't really be surprising at this juncture.

[@Time_Is_Left]

@@chelsgo8675 I think so. Isn’t that just the groomer argument but from the other end?

[@chelsgo8675]

@@Time_Is_Left I mean, I could maybe steel man him and assume he meant that kids shouldn't be at specific like adults-only pride events, not necessarily meaning pride as a whole. But that's not how it came across.

[@Time_Is_Left]

@@chelsgo8675 Certainly wasn’t

[@jonathanbosak8581]

The Chad Lonerbox - have is own theme song -provides context in arguments -provides evidence when is acused of fake news The virging Bad empanada - no theme song -"i don't care abaut your context" -gets dunked on his Bad arguments and keeps pushing

[@PancakemonsterFO4]

You forgot plays guitar

[@GuyShōtō]

Lonerbox also doesn't live in a white-settler colony, Badempanada a white person left one settler-colony for another, so by his own logic he's a scummy colonizer.

[@ghostburger2455]

I like how he goes straight from speaking positively about China to calling him queerphobic

[@danielshepard1449]

"Speaking positively about China" China did a good thing? NO NUANCE ALLOWED CHINA BAD

[@Kikasitsu]

BTDUBz: Still waiting for that Uighur “Genocide” evidence to come out. I can’t wait for me to dig deep, and see that every source you give *leads back to Adrian Zenz.*🙂👍

[@maean7410]

​@@Kikasitsutankies when they spend 2 hours without genocide denial

[@Kikasitsu]

@@maean7410 You know, it’s funny you call it “denial” when NONE OF YOU can provide evidence for the claims. Yet when I provide it, I get called such. How does that work?

[@maean7410]

@@Kikasitsu youre the one who brought the thing up man calm down

[@Time_Is_Left]

You don’t have to agree with or like KR to acknowledge that PTSD is likely present. No well adjusted, well brought up 17 year old would have been even exposed to those experiences in the first place

[@ftwallday3112]

Good I hope that little f***** has nightmares

[@januszkurahenowski2860]

Who is KR?

[@kindredspirit9703]

@@januszkurahenowski2860 Kyle Rittenhouse

[@IrideLastMtb]

@@januszkurahenowski2860 lol it took me a minute as well 😅

[@abstractalien12345]

"Dont disparage those with mental health issues just to whitewash a kkk terrorist" challenge fully failed here

[@tiekogalaxylatte8839]

"Interesting counter-argument. Unfortunately for you I don't give a shit. Next question."

[@freedomofmusic2112]

Before this, I thought Vaush might have been exaggerating or being hyperbolic about Bad Empanada cuz I never knew sh*t about the guy....but now I see Vaush was merely using accurate descriptions. The dude is clearly not well, his grasp of reality is tenuous at best.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Watch bad empanada's main channel I don't know why in the hell he is like this in debates and Twitter when he is the absolute opposite in his video essays- which are top notch

[@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan]

His regular videos are good. But on twitter and debates he's like a different guy. Lonerbox is also doing bad faith 'gotcha!' tricks and trying to get BE angry.

[@someonerandom8552]

@@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan I like Empandas videos but holy shit he was unhinged here. Lonerbox had some saintly level of patience

[@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan]

@@someonerandom8552 Don't know Lonerbox before this, but it feels like he's trying to get under BE by staying weirdly calm. And his "gotcha!" rethorical tricks are verbal knocks below the belt. And he keeps doing it because it's getting BE angry. I'll admit, BE should try and stay cooler, but that's that Greek + Australian blood he"s got. You say unhinged, I say warm-blooded and passionate

[@Elmesiasdelgol2022]

Wasn't this the guy who was being hounded by Australian justice?

[@UmQasaann]

Australia is nazi state

[@Ihatemyusernamemore]

​@@UmQasaannsays the American 😂😂😂 actually no, I take this back, your comments are so bad I reckon you must be one of those Russian kremlin trolls deliberately shit stirring to undermine society

[@magnus_cockstrong]

It's always nice when you hear about someone a lot and then when you encounter them in the wild they are exactly as stupid as you imagined. Thank you bad empanada.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

If you watch his videos on his main channel, you will rescind that statement Look at them and verify it for yourself.

[@magnus_cockstrong]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord lol

[@KatzenjammerFuu]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord For the love of god, simp for better people.

[@jdb5961]

@@KatzenjammerFuu You're a Vaush fan. 100% guarantee you wouldn't be able to articulate what exactly you object to with Badempanada other than he doesn't like KZbinrs that you like

[@Kikasitsu]

Nice Holocaust Denial agenda there, buddy.

[@Dreigonix]

“DO YOU THINK I’M SUPPOSED TO HAVE MERCY FOR THESE PEOPLE?! WHO GIVES A SHIT IF THEY’RE NOT GUILTY?!” I could literally hear this out of a Nazi on Stormfront. Jesus.

[@CrestOfArtorias]

Horseshoe yay!

[@danielshepard1449]

Nazism is when you don't have sympathy for the "all lives matter" take on Israel?

[@Dreigonix]

@@danielshepard1449 You can’t make the All Lives Matter comparison when BE literally advocated for the murder of all Israelis. Sorry buddy.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

It does come out of Nazi’s on stormfront again BE is the tankie guy who claims to be a marxist but is really a strain-totalitarian red Fascist Which was so far from actual Marxism it is in another galaxy.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Would you not do the same to a white supremacist here? The only way to stop a growing fascist movement (if ending capitalism is not possible) is by force Even governments know this.

[@OliveGodd]

As a Palestinian, the majority of Palestinians do not accept a two-state solution and reject it only about 39% Palestinians accepted 2 State solution. So I have to disagree with loanerbox on that point

[@BusCord]

-BE clearly understands the issue enough to discuss it and have nuanced opinions -He's not an effective debater, but that will come with practice -I'm disappointed in Vaush for mocking him out of ignorance

[@ineedapharmists]

Palestine either accepts a two state solution or it just won't exist. Ask any of it's neighbors, Israel is here to stay

[@ralphmarx7554]

Well shit. Enjoy the eternal civil war then

[@anti-theocrat8815]

It’s illegal to support a 2 State Solution in Gaza

[@technicallythecenteroftheu1349]

BadEmpanada has fallen all the way off man. Christ. The guy's video essays are genuinely incredible. It's like he was replaced with a CIA double.

[@oxcide5888]

he hasn't fell off, the guy always was bonkers on twitter

[@technicallythecenteroftheu1349]

@@oxcide5888 I swear it's a different person who writes the video essays. Online discourse and its consequences, I guess.

[@skullbuster1220]

I don’t know, I watched one video of his where he said the Hong Kong protests were a CIA psy op and shouldn’t be supported and I didn’t give him a second chance LOL

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@technicallythecenteroftheu1349 Yeah, he's unhinged in debating, but when he does serious work, he's unmatched (streamer and online left wise)

[@rainbowkrampus]

Ehh, he's always sprinkled tankie bullshit in amongst everything. It's like all the people who say Hakim is really smart. Wrong, he's good at presenting the ideas of others. When it comes to presenting his own ideas, it's the same tankie bullshit.

[@emeraldheart2244]

BE doing a speedrun on how to be bad faith. I think he was faster than professor flowers

[@themightymcb7310]

At least PF said hello before she did the brownie points thing!

[@hadronoftheseus8829]

He was certainly more frantic. Pretender Flowers began at least somewhat confidently and the trepidation smoldered for a while before it kindled into full blown panic. Bad Empanadas is nothing sort of outright terrified from the beginning, as can be heard unmistakably in his trembling voice. I never thought he would agree to this.

[@danielshepard1449]

You have to be bad faith sometimes with weaselly liberals who support Israeli colonization of Palestine.

[@magnus_cockstrong]

This was like watching bad empanada run his face repeatedly into a brick wall. Very enjoyable.

[@danielshepard1449]

lol LonerBox literally had to walk back everything he said from "Eristocracy is great advocate for Palestinians" to "No nuclear armed country has ever dissolved itself"

[@magnus_cockstrong]

@@danielshepard1449 you're entitled to your feelings bud.

[@danielshepard1449]

@@magnus_cockstrong Solid argument! Very nice! Facts and logic bro!

[@magnus_cockstrong]

@@danielshepard1449 my guy I get that you're a bad empanada fan, but he got his shit pushed in. Sorry buddy, but I'm not rewatching the video just to argue with the all your opinions. If you liked what you saw from your dude that's on you.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

@@danielshepard1449 *lol LonerBox literally had to walk back everything he said from "Eristocracy is great advocate for Palestinians" to "No nuclear armed country has ever dissolved itself”* He at no point ever states either of that Also he specifically calls out how South Africa was different and it doesn’t count the same as they disarmed their nukes only after the government was beginning to switch, but south Africa did not dissolve itself, it remained south Africa, the government just changed hands not the same thing and then BE actually claimed that the USSR dissolved itself, which is false, it collapsed and they themselves admitted they collapsed, they never willingly disarmed and or dissolved they no longer could hold the USSR together.

[@SA-mo3hq]

Most sane tankie and very stable good brain genius, Empanada. I look forward to the tankie caterwauling in this comment section.

[@herec0mestheCh33f]

"Um sweaty only British parliament members who support the ussr are tankies. Words don't reflect modern usage" -be stans unironically

[@Kropothead]

@@herec0mestheCh33f He’s got big “we don’t literally call ourselves national socialists so we’re not racist” energy. Exact same ideological consistency as every groyper.

[@thricemindblown7883]

Bad Empanada first comes across as a gatekeeper, then he steadily reveals himself as just dishonest and destructive. As an Aussie, I'm ashamed of his behaviour.

[@fullsend8738]

Imagine being sincere with someone who's more concerned with the oppressors than the oppressed. Are you a leftist? Do you identify as a leftist? Being a leftist has lost its meaning.

[@Tacklepig]

...he's an aussie? I genuinely assumed he was from some south american country, the way he talks about their history and their politics.

[@comradeametrine3778]

@@Tacklepig He's an Australian living in Argentina that sometimes likes to larp that he's South American

[@tarqinquentinsson-obviousl957]

@@comradeametrine3778 I thought it was the other way around?

[@thricemindblown7883]

@@Tacklepig Well there's something going on with the South American pastry reference in the name. Not sure what.

[@dogearflopper7011]

BM's stance is literally an alt-right rhetorical style. 'I'm joking all the time unless I'm not. If you believe me, that's your fault.'

[@matheusvillela9150]

Right. Because defending the palestinian genocide is totally the left wing position, amaright

[@Zarastro54]

@@matheusvillela9150 Would you like to try that rebuttal again?

[@raz1572]

@@matheusvillela9150 you understand the way you wrote this implies BE is defending palenstinian genocide right...

[@matheusvillela9150]

@@raz1572 For anyone too dumb to underdtand irony or interpret text, sure. Which, as it turns out, involves a lot of Vaush fans.

[@raz1572]

@@matheusvillela9150 irony? What do you think that word means?

[@patricksikhrangkur8814]

This debate was my first introduction to Bad Empanada. I am a worse person for having experienced him.

[@jamesreynold6711]

His main channel has some genuinely good content on Latin America and it’s history with imperialism, however the man badempanada itself is quite often an unhinged baseless lunatic who looks to pick fights with almost everyone on the left. His unscripted content is usually trash, but his edited main channel videos carry some genuine weight imo

[@Vic92084]

@@jamesreynold6711 As a Latin American from historically marginalized/imperialized communities, no, his content on LatAm is in significant part horseshit, precisely *because* BE is in reality an unhinged baseless lunatic. He's just better at modulating it in long-form scripted content.

[@saliv88]

@@Vic92084 As someone who’s genuinely curious to learn more about South/Latin America’s history from both a revolutionary and anti-imperialist POV, is there anyone online who does a solid job? I’ve checked out some of his content on Cuba and Argentina, but I really don’t want to stick around if it all comes back to supporting tankie stances.

[@Carkcast]

@@saliv88 a good channel is Cafe Kyoto even if it is in spanish. if you are interested in a book Born in Blood and Fire by John Chasteen is a good introduction. Read it for a latam politics class and comming from one of those countries the descriptions and analysis are really accurate.

[@spellman007]

@@Vic92084 lol you like in the USA shut up.

[@The_Chosen_Heretic]

Also, another fucked up thing is that the dude he said deserved the wall wasn’t even pro Israel; he was just a Jew who happened to live there.

[@manjackson2772]

Barely over five minutes and he's saying pride is an "explicitly sexual" event

[@samlawrence2239]

Starting out a debate with accusations that you can't substantiation because "you don't need to watch a video before you comment" or "don't give a shit about you or what you did" is a pretty awful precedent to set haha

[@JustLilGecko]

Letting BE talk is the best debate strategy, one of those people who's brain is such inconsistent mush that just letting them splurt it out debunks them very efficiently

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Why he generally does video essays lol And they're actually good

[@canadagoose8543]

I cracked up when Empanada sent that 3 minute audio clip containing 300 sentences sliced together like a DeepFake voice generator.

[@canadagoose8543]

​@@BadEmpanada I checked the first quote... it's cut in half. The first half of that statement starts off with her pointing out how one of the consequences of Zionism is that many Jews got kicked out of regions like Morocco and Egypt, and therefore the "right to return" to Israel isn't universally applicable to all Palestinians from a geopolitical standpoint, and thus the right to return would create a population density issue. Perhaps you can argue that her statement is a Nirvana Fallacy; that is to say... the solution's impracticality doesn't mean it's not the best solution, but I wouldn't call it "indefensible". I think it's reasonable to infer that a Right To Return would create a population density issue, the key question is... whether that population density issue is significant enough to warrant consideration or not. I would argue that it's a separate issue with separate policy solutions. Anyways... I can't dig through your whole comment, it's too long. Gute Nacht.

[@bewing77]

@@BadEmpanada Seriously, even if one accepts thos clips as fully in character of what she was saying, even thos aren’t very shocking - the first three basically says that bringing millions of people into a small country where living space is already a scarce resource would cause enormous problems, especially when there’s a lot of contention between the two ethnic groups it entails. This is just indisputable facts. In the second and third clip she explains why it would be difficult to get the Israelis to accept such a solution - nowhere does she say she says it’s wrong for the Israelis to become a minority, she only, again factually observes that this is an extremely hard sell to the Israelis. In the fourth clip she expresses concern that this might drive Israel into becoming a true apartheid state, since if the jews are no longer a majority, that would be the only way for them to avoid the country to become like any other middle eastern country, where the jewish minority exists under quite oppressive conditions. Again, nowhere does she say anything about she wanting this to happen, only expressing concern that it’s a risk and if it would happen, that would be worse than what exists today. In the fifth clip she provides context for those unfamiliar with the material conditions of Israel, explaining again how living space is at a premium and that for anyone not extremely wealthy, the only way to get a living space anywhere near similar to what we in the west consider acceptable is in the settlements. Once again, nothing about her opinion of anything, just a description of facts. This is the problem that Lonerbox states over and over - you really seem incapable of assessing what she, he or for that matter anyone else actually believe based on theor statements. If the clips you provided are examples of what you consider “indefensible positions” then you really need to work on your analytical skills, since not only do they not contain any indefensible positions, they don’t contain any positions of opinion at all! When you passionately try to make the case they do, you come across as totally unhinged. It’s good to have debates about people’s opinions, but this is something else - this is you getting upset over, and trying to debate against an opinion not expressed by your target at all.

[@sebastianlavallee706]

@@BadEmpanada So that's the extent of your research into her points? An you call it bad? Seriously, I had no idea who you were before this, but you've just proved to be as unhinged as the "debate" showed you to be...

[@danielshepard1449]

@@bewing77 Ok so you're a zionist and you agree with her. That isn't out of context. At least you admit it though

[@pikapowns]

@@bewing77 Thanks for spending the time, well done

[@WarrenVGod]

It's such a shame he went down this route. He had a video back in the day explaining everything wrong with unions here in Australia that is top tier and a good recourse but I can't recommend him anymore

[@jascu4251]

What do you think happened to him?

[@arabiannights5301]

@@jascu4251 VDS

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@arabiannights5301 well justifiably so

[@furiousapplesack]

That and the Columbus video were top notch. Unfortunately, he's decided he'll operate by Highlander rules and, as the One True Leftist, will behead all other leftists who disagree with him on anything.

[@OryxAU]

@Mythic If you can't trust him as a person why would you trust his content? They're the same thing.

[@withinthrall1445]

The last notes he hit are called harmonics. Every guitar has them, some parts of the guitar make them ring out more. The Yes song roundabout (because it’s been around long before Jojo’s) starts out with it, but you’ll also hear them in songs like Nothing Else Matters by Metallica as well.

[@ShabazzTBL]

It’s impossible to talk about solutions with people like this because doing that requires nuance and talking about how things are materially rather than ideally but when you do that they get upset and moralize so much and accuse you of being on the side of oppressors. Can you imagine people like that running society? They can’t make hard ethic decisions it would require them compromising on their ideals and they would rather everything be destroyed than that. Imagine Hitler was captured rather than killing himself for some reason so aliens showed up and said “If you don’t pardon Hitler, we’re going to kill everyone.” Someone like him would have us all killed. Because to them it doesn’t matter if they’re decision leads to more harm, it only matters that they didn’t do something bad. The bad of pardoning Hitler is far outweighed by the bad of all of us dying but they’re not the ones killing us so it’s fine. I’m serious I just had an argument with a guy arguing against arming Ukraine because the Nazis would get some of them. I assumed it’s because he thought they would use they to do harm but he said he didn’t think they would have some rebellion or even be able to keep the weapons once they left military service. So this guy was literally saying that even though not arming Ukraine would have lead to mass death and subjugation of Ukrainians and even though he agreed that the Nazis would only have the guns temporarily, he was adamant that it was morally wrong and we shouldn’t do it. Folks, their brains don’t work correctly.

[@danielshepard1449]

It doesn't "require nuance" to acknowledge that any solution in Palestine involves returning stolen land back to the people it's still being stolen from. You are on the side of the oppressors if you are concern trolling over right to return instead of advocating for Palestine. Just like you are on the side of oppressors if you are concern trolling about "white rights" in South Africa or post Slavery America. I'm against arming Ukraine because I don't believe in funding proxy wars to weaken geopolitical enemies all over the world, that's called imperialism and it's already been tried and failed. Also, those weapons have destabilized Ukraine and been used in war crimes against civilian's, just like everywhere else the US arms far right groups to fight Russia. Arming Ukraine did lead to mass death, a large part of why Russia invaded Ukraine was because of US weapons and military support there. The same reason the US was going to invade Cuba during the Cuban missile crisis. Your brain doesn't work correctly, the US arming far right groups to fight Russia has been a disaster for all of American history but you think it's different this time somehow.

[@ShabazzTBL]

@@danielshepard1449 A proxy war is not when we help a country that was invaded. You’re pro-imperialism. It just matters who’s doing the imperialism. Russia agreed to respect Ukraines borders and sovereignty and they haven’t lived up to that by any stretch of the imagination. That reason is also a lie. Putin has said multiple times that he believes Ukraine should be part of Russia. All the other excuses are just that. Excuses.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

*Can you imagine people like that running society?* If you want to see a world where people like BE are in charge, don’t worry we already have had it. it was stalinist Russia. People like BE are red fascists, the totalitarian version of the Nazis, two sides of the same coin, BE is the exact the end of guy who will attack Hitler’s concentration camps as a moral failure of western society all the while excusing, justifying, supporting, and or defending Stalin's ethnic cleansing, the red purge and the Siberian gulags which were essentially work/death camps

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@ShabazzTBL in terms of power it is a war between the U.S. ogliarchy and the Russian one. No matter who wins, the people of Russia and Ukraine lose- which benefits the ogliarchs because people are easier to exploit when they are poorer and more desperate. No capitalist nation is a democracy because power is not centered towards the citizenry and working class. They are mere tools for the elites at the top.

[@danielshepard1449]

@@ShabazzTBL America isn't "helping a country that was invaded" America backed a coup to overthrow the pro Russian government in Ukraine and install a pro western government, then they turned that government into US proxies, trained armed and supported by the US, to weaken Russia and fight pro Russian forces. Wake up, America doesn't care about Ukraine, other than to use them as a militarized satellite state against Russia. That's literally the definition of a proxy war. No advocating against US involvement in wars is not what imperialism means buddy. Nice try, but try learning word definitions before you use them. You can't call other people imperialists as you advocate for more involvement in a war. Also, wtf does anything you said about Russia and Ukraine have to do with anything I said?

[@jadetaylor6093]

Heres the real takeaway: badempanada is constantly vindictive. He says he doesnt give a fuck if someone becomes worse off as a result of his ideal policy taking hold. He also says that war and cultural eviction is necessary to be taken upon ancestors of colonizers because they've taken something from someone else. This is conservativism. If you follow badempanadas ideas down a mere generation, or even two, all he's done has flipped a hierarchical structure. Property still is a law of society, and hierarchy still exists in some capacity. Instead of focusing on what can be done now, to fix the material ossue, he's instead obsessed with a 1:1 replacement (an arbitrary one, given land has been repeatedly conquered in multiple of the scenarios in this discussion) not because its the best scenario for the colonized('s ancestors) but because its the worst for the colonizer('s ancestors).

[@Iloveguitar07]

I think you meant to say descendants of colonizers, not ancestors

[@CrestOfArtorias]

I mean thats a very common position in left wing groups, especially considering where he is from.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Watch his damn videos on his main channel smh And in an objective position, yes. The west is most at fault for just about all of the world's problems. Why should we live in gold palaces while the majority of the planet rots?

[@CrestOfArtorias]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord Sure lets argue about that. Why should we care? What compels us to do that? Or we can also argue it this way - If the west is so terrible why is it that we live in a time where it is much more likely for people to die due to obesity than to starve? Why is it that starvation is less common than it was at any point in history? How come the overall standard of living, worldwide has improved and is now better than in any point in time. Seems to me no matter where you look the west did quite some impressive shit. You can argue there could have been a better system or that the current system has flaws, sure but to argue that the world is worse off due to the west is laughable.

[@nektariosorfanoudakis2270]

You almost sound like a colonist with a vested interest in not allowing decolonisation.

[@LizStaples]

This generational rights thing ignores any growth in population on either side of the conflict. No one chooses where they are born and thinking that some deserves to be without a home because it was stolen from great grandma is bad enough but now your gonna have to fight with all the cousins to decide who actually gets the house.

[@danielshepard1449]

What a horrible, awful, argument. "Sorry Palestinians, you just have to allow Israel to steal all of your land and all of your homes, because they had kids there now" you are doing an "all lives matter"

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Wealth can be redistributed though

[@andrewgreenwood9068]

Yeah. I know some of my ancestors were convicts who were deported to Australia, so how do we judge them. Any argument for punishment based on ancestry is bigoted.

[@AkiraIsMissing]

I can't believe nobody has picked up on the fact that BE called pride "overtly sexual", which is a right wing talking point used to crucify the LGBTQ movement

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

And loner box literally defend israeli fascists

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

That talking point has always spoke volumes of the sexual immaturity of the right wing. My own older brother will flat out call ANY nudity, “pornography.”

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Akira, yk Vaush used that argument for kink lmao

[@AkiraIsMissing]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord really? I remember watching his videos on pride and he infact argued in the opposite?

[@roryokane5907]

Lonerbox has a style very similar to Vaush’s when it comes to debate or arguing with his chat. It’s not without flaws, but the Bad Empanada debate was just cringe, 99% of which was Bad Empanada’s doing to himself!

[@foramoreperfectamerica8490]

Considering I had to ban Bad Empanada from Hunter's chat, this is gonna be good. Go Loner Box.

[@Tom-co8uz]

Mods will burn in hell

[@foramoreperfectamerica8490]

@@Tom-co8uz Okay Tom, lay off the roids.

[@Tom-co8uz]

@@BadEmpanadaLive touch grass

[@cornvuscornax4719]

@@BadEmpanadaLive L + You’re Bald

[@foramoreperfectamerica8490]

@@BadEmpanadaLive Hunter knows the history of the CIA and told you in his debate with you that they are not perfect. I know because I was there. Do they need Progressive Reform like the police? Yes. Good God man, the song Bonzo Goes To Bitburg by The Ramones was about Regan, but I gotta ask, my dude is your brain hanging upsidedown, or do you just really not understand what a Soc Dem is and what we believe? I mean it could be both, but if I had to pick one, I think your brain is hanging upside down.

[@faithlessfurry7816]

This is my first exposure to BadEmpanada, although I've heard Vaush mention him a time or two. I can't wait to see if the legends were true.

[@alejandrorivas4585]

Were they?

[@faithlessfurry7816]

@@alejandrorivas4585 They were beyond my wildest imagination, this man is truly legendary in his ability to frustrate even the audience

[@lukiepuki8861]

I really dislike how we keep calling everything a debate now stuff like this is just a angry man vs lonerbox

[@xBINARYGODx]

"I mean... YOU call it a camp" That right there, that is THE moment of this conversation.

[@junipre985]

I've heard ppl say that bad empanada is insane but i had never heard him talk until this and holy shit this guy is unhinged

[@buolindo8795]

Not even a hello, straight into accusations

[@UmQasaann]

Lonerbox is a necrofile lol

[@ShabazzTBL]

I just remembered BE challenged me to come on stream once. I didn’t know who he was but based on the interaction we had I knew he was to type of person that don’t engage with half of what you say and never answers questions so I said no. I dodged quite the bullet

[@helios566]

I love this type of convo. Where the crazy person just says the other believes things only to be proven wrong 5 seconds later.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

then says “i don’t give a shit” too dodge and or rebuke the points.

[@GeoNeilUK]

I think the one thing we can ascertain about Bad Empanada's views in this debate is that he doesn't care.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Having dylan burns, eristocracy and vaush shows me you don't really care either... Also wait for empanada's video essay. Those are the complete opposite of him in debates. I have no idea why he is so different in both settings.

[@GeoNeilUK]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord "Having dylan burns, eristocracy and vaush shows me you don't really care either..." And that comment shows me that all you care about is BadEmpanada. "Also wait for empanada's video essay." No. "Those are the complete opposite of him in debates." Yet they're made by him in debates. If he's so wrong in debates, how can I trust his video essays? "I have no idea why he is so different in both settings." Because in a video essay he can work alone and say whatever he likes with no immediate callbacks. In any setting that requires him to interact with other people, he shows his true character. If you want to change the world, you have to be able to work with other people, BadEmpanada can't and neither can you.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@GeoNeilUK More rhetorical nonsense. Don't play games. Do you have an actual working brain and process information? Even kids can do a better job. All you care is about defending your imperialist views instilled into you from childhood. I despise patriots because they cannot understand the world fully until they question everything that has been instilled into them by their own society. Working with someone also implies you accept and understand you are outclassed and listen to others so you can think about new information and ideas. "That comment shows.." No. I care about the positions. It's just that those people I mentioned lie by omission or just straight out lie about things. "No." You're no different than an evangelical clinging to creationism. Reasses your thought process. "Yet they're made by him..." Empanada is unhinged in debates, but the information and points he presents out of that setting is actually educational AND well sourced- something his debate self completely lacks. You can go verify all his sources yourself. That's the best part. If there's something he missed, the comments section has enough competent people to note it. When I mean that they are good quality most of the time, THEY ARE. Make's vaush's streams look how you look at bad empanada in this this debate. It's the best I can find without boring people with books, reports and research papers- because the average person sadly doesn't read it.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@GeoNeilUK character again- you sound like a conservative pulled from the daily wire. Maybe you should join them. You have enough holes in your brain. Could make you a pretty penny too. We're talking about his information, not the presentation. My argument is you should give jack shit about the presentation in his debate setting because his video setting is much different. "Working together" If you want to change the world, you have to be willing to do what is necessary at any cost once you discover how the world works. You are an obstacle to doing good in the world for as long as you are uneducated about how it functions and where it's headed. If you're trying to build a city, you do not put a 12 year old to build you a bridge. You put them in training to learn from others. You need such training because you have a very very limited scope about what you're talking about, and you let dumb things about how a person makes you feel influence you over the imperical value they hold. As for bad empanada, yes he would be unable to work with others because of his explosiveness, but my point still stands in that he provides generally very accurate information and a useful analysis unmatched in the online left.

[@danielshepard1449]

@@GeoNeilUK Vaush fans malding because the empanada was mean to their favorite streamer Also hilarious how you say "If you want to change the world, you have to be able to work with other people, BadEmpanada can't and neither can you" It's hilarious how you think twitch political commentators are "changing the world" and also because you just proved you are incapable of working with people as well lmfao

[@ZephyrDoesMedia]

I made it about 7 minutes before I was certain, this man is hearing someone else in the room.

[@bestaqua23]

I'm from Israel and I find it a bit odd that the three major group populations that are against settlements with the Palestinians were not mentioned . There is a million people who are not born in Israel and are expected to go back to f****** Russia.... Currently that's about 1/4 of the majority Jewish population and there is a bit of a difference between not wanting to immigrate and not wanting to be forced to go back to Russia ( the other two groups are mizraki Jews who were expelled from Arab countries and are actually citizens originally of other Arab countries and haredi Jews who despite being Jewish are also generally anti Zionist .) Edit: dos somone know if I can talk to vush about this ? I don't think I'm going to change his mind or something but it is a big missing part of the pazzel

[@Iloveguitar07]

Email him

[@Meladjusted]

Is BE on this video challenging people criticizing him to debates too? Amazing, man. On LB's video of this, he replied to my comment about him and challenged me to a debate. Said he hoped I wouldn't "chicken out." Absolute funniest shite to happen to me all year.

[@ThereIsABombInYourHouse]

BE is finally turning into a debate bro

[@woobiefuntime]

@@ThereIsABombInYourHouse He singled me out

[@85percentnation]

BadEmpanada certainly is a character, eh? Changed his arguments about a million times, & when cornered simply exclaimed that he "[didn't] care"!

[@GerardoHernandez-xt9hs]

isnt bad empanada australian so his "colonizer gets the wall " line is kind of backfire

[@herec0mestheCh33f]

Rules for thee not for me

[@PiecefulKaos]

He specifically called himself an Australian colonizer in this video. His point was that the designation of "colonizer" is a material description, not a moral one, and he only supports "getting the wall" for colonizers who he believes are actively supporting the settler colonial state (e.g. supporting the IDF), which was the case with the person he said this to on Twitter. I do not agree with him, by the way, but his position was pretty clear.

[@billzhang8628]

@@PiecefulKaos i mean he says this but he considers all Israelis as supporting settler colonialism. He was asked on twitter what he thinks of israelis that dont leave Israel and his answer was wall.

[@verager2493]

@@billzhang8628 I guess he thinks material conditions don't exist in the middle east

[@kaue2382]

That "clip" of Eristocracy BE played is the clip chimp equivalent of that scene in The Truman Show where Truman puts 50 different pieces of random magazine cutouts to create the face he wanted to see.

[@Sound_Judgement]

The situation Vaush describes at 1:20:00 is even more complicated too than he got into here because of tribal dynamics. Some tribes didn't settle specific lands but were more nomadic. Some formed confederacies of massive numbers of interlocking tribes who shared land or lived separately that have now been broken up for hundreds of years. Some tribes were forcibly relocated from others areas of the country, but now live in different places which might have different tribes that hold a "pre-America" claim to the land (my own tribe, the Cherokee, would fit in this, and its hard to think of how that would be managed when we are so ingratiated or have ownership/connections to the area in the state of Oklahoma at this point and not the Carolinas and Georgia area which is where most of us would be moved to). This isn't a criticism, by the way, just thought I would add more details if anyone thought it was interesting or illuminating in some way.

[@jacobray8189]

Thanks for the added context

[@pennyforyourthots]

Do you think there's a possibility that some sort of pan-indigenous movement would form, like a tribal EU? Just because of the comparatively low population numbers across tribes and the difficulty of claiming land through various historical conflicts? Rather than each tribe having complete control over an area, that control is split between everybody with a provable historic land claim? I'm really just spitballing here because it's definitely a complex situation.

[@Sound_Judgement]

@@pennyforyourthots That’s definitely a possibility; I would guess that tribes would attempt to keep some sort of structure similar to the U.S. Federal Government, as quite a few have taken on that structure in their own tribal governments and it would be a relatively easy system to just fall back to. Whether this would mean the entire continental US, Canada, Alaska, Hawaii, etc. all remain with territorial boundaries and relations as they are now is hard to predict. The eradication of indigenous ways of live has resulted in a lot of individual tribal identity being lost, the only positive of which in this situation would be a lack of historical grudges to exact revenge for. But that’s no guarantee either, as some tribes have been more or less prosperous in the US, meaning that not every tribe is going to start from the same point of educational and economic development, which could be bad for attempting any “all of us are in this together” type of movement, unless all of us are in it together as one group instead of as a bunch of separate groups collaborating but not having a shared destiny. Consequently, I’d say confederations or a Union with different states (resembling we have now in the U.S.) are more likely and more likely to actually work than separate nations collaborating like the EU.

[@MK_ULTRA420]

​@@pennyforyourthots "Do you think there's a possibility that some sort of pan-indigenous movement would form, like a tribal EU?" Only if they needed protected borders and a free-flow of labor within their borders like the Mongol Empire, otherwise there's no reason for a tribe to share grass with their rivals.

[@arcanemedia8166]

I think the reason Badempanada tried to frame it as an interview so he could use it to avoid answering questions

[@zagreus5773]

Unhinged is an understatement for BE. He is batshit insane, holy shit. Eris deserves the wall or at least be detained in a "reeducation camp"?

[@Revan058]

Fucking *Eris* of all people. Woman couldn't hurt a fly if she tried.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Yes, same as with any American evangelical, Tucker Carlson, etc. They are equivalent in threats to humanoty. Do you not see what insane rhetoric they spout?

[@Revan058]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord No one cares about your word vomit, tankie.

[@jeremiahbarnes6313]

BE disagreeing with Loner on the subject of Palestinians isn't surprising given BE has been sus for a while when it comes to Js. Plus he is pretty fvcking insane and watching him backpedal while getting drilled by LonerBased brings a smile to my face. Sub to LonerBased

[@woobiefuntime]

he is going after lonerbox and eristoracy like crazy and he shadow banned my comments

[@derpeth2101]

@@woobiefuntime Eristocracy is literally an ethnonationalist.

[@jeremiahbarnes6313]

@@derpeth2101 Clip chimps said person out of context to make a point but then gets drilled on said point and backpedals like a pus'c. 22:36

[@woobiefuntime]

@@derpeth2101 she isn't that at all .she expressed compassion for the Palestinian people.

[@elim9583]

So bad empanada is the one going crazy while aristocracy fake the screenshot of him supposedly doxxing her and giving her information to a Palestinian nationalist group despite the fact that no such group exists and is he was referring to a video game

[@EliaFlowers]

Honestly I expected BE to start reading every address in Scotland for 90 mins just to dox loner box

[@gibdopaminepls]

lonerdox

[@henryburby6077]

Lonerbox: "..." BadEmpanada: "I DON'T GIVE A SHIT!!"

[@krrr.4902]

I believe *every single person* who regularly engages in online discussions of any sort is at least a little bit crazy. Bad empanada creeps me out, I feel like he is legit "real life" unstable crazy even if he is kinda playing an online persona, like there is real mental illness behind the BE character. I guess he's just really good at portraying the Bad Empanada character.. I can't enjoy watching him :/

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Doesn't matter though. I could give a damn about the wrapper they come in. So many people do online discussion for camps as and drama. What matters is that they are right. Bad empanada's information is much closer to the truth than most of vaush's and lonerbox's easily.

[@krrr.4902]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord yes, that's the thing for me. BE himself has talked about how he just wants to start a shitshow, he is precisely the drama seeker you point out. I don't believe all of his aggression is only a "wrap", it's part of his core intent and online presence and I really do lament he chooses to be a troll with all his capabilities.

[@hadronoftheseus8829]

I guarantee you he has a cluster B personality disorder. Oh, and there's that utter lunatic Haz. I'm not joking in the slightest when I say I'd be shocked if that guy has never illegally disposed of a dead body. That is someone to _never_ go near in real life under any circumstances.

[@MethSloth]

Badempanada makes my skin crawl.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

His videos won't. Give them a watch. Better sourced, thought out and closer to the truth than Vaush's.

[@jayphangx8742]

LB: “Why do you think I said it was a bad idea at the time-“ BE: “I don’t fucking know or care.”

[@UmQasaann]

Lonerbox is a necrofile

[@benh2339]

Holy shit. Is bad empanada actually schizophrenic?

[@CrestOfArtorias]

Just your regular lefty.

[@caspianseal]

That and a complete moron.

[@Harsh-mg2em]

Arguing with a tankie is legit like arguing with a Trumpist, they bombard you with what you they believe you believe based of a bad faith interpretation of a bad faith interpretation. When you finally manage to explain it they just shift the goal post, can't be giving you points, you're a baddie after all.

[@nektariosorfanoudakis2270]

So Fascists that believe in Myth and Socialists who believe in Fact are one and the same. Sure bud. Did your momma dropped you on your head when you were little?

[@thevenbede767]

The Germans who settled in Poland had been there for centuries

[@matheusvillela9150]

He's obviously talking about the nazis.

[@thevenbede767]

@@matheusvillela9150 and he's wrong about 600,000 then. Only 350,000 were and those were Germans from the Baltic States whod been propogandized into fleeing their homes before the Soviet Union took over the Baltic States

[@pogo8050]

@@matheusvillela9150 so if he knew what he was talking about, he would have taken that into account and said nazis. Not germans. Stop carrying water for this dirty soyfaced hobo

[@Manta665]

@@matheusvillela9150 yet he is throwing everything together to pretend it is really easy, when in actually the historical context of centuries or plural-ethnic countries tend to be really difficult.

[@tylerhackner9731]

Based Lonerbox

[@blitzthebird]

Lonerbased

[@d3l3tes00n]

I really enjoy his videos & overall vibe

[@Kropothead]

Lonerbox has good takes.

[@bigDean636]

"Setting right the crimes of history is not only possible, but easy and simple" -BE

[@NoReplyAsset]

huh.... so he's insufferable and annoying with nothing to say, both on Twitter and IRL. consistency.

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

Anyone else baffled at how there are a handful of debate people on youtube who consistently get shredded in debates yet they NEVER improve or adjust their points? I mean BE seems to REALLY care about a point until it is transparently lost, then he suddenly doesnt care about it. 🤷🏽‍♂️

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

Well i didnt realize BE was an Essayist. damn

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@ahh_yes_mr_bax yeah, debates are not his thing at all His video essays are unmatched by any streamer though.

[@The867530910]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord you know badempenada is not gonna pay you for defending him in every comment thread on this video

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@The867530910 I'm don't mind? He is correct overall Literally just watch the video he put

[@The867530910]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord riiiight

[@omarwajeeh3665]

The one state vs two state solution debate is a total distraction. As a Palestinian American with family still in Palestine, our priority is that Palestinians everywhere are treated with dignity, respect, and that our brothers and sisters can feel safe in their own homes without fear of persecution, death, or genocide. Before any of this bullshit, people like my cousins overseas need to be treated like human beings by the global community. Inshallah

[@verager2493]

Seriously. Saying "Palestinians are human" is to the left of the Israeli Overton window. Severely disappointed that any Jewish people could so closely emulate those who have most grievously wronged them.

[@MensHominis]

1:13:30 - The situation in Eastern Europe was way more complicated. Some cities in Silesia and Königsberg (among other regions) had been majority-German or part-German to a significant extent even before WW2; I’m reading 17 million in total, before the war. Most of those later fled or were driven out (and I surely won’t blame the Soviets for that, I just needed to clarify the fact).

[@aspacelex]

If Ukraine ends up liberating Crimea, all Russians (150k I believe) who've moved to Crimea since 2014 should be given the choice to remain there, but people who could afford to move there this quickly can afford to go back to Russia if they don't wanna be citizens of Ukraine.

[@Revan058]

That's more then fair.

[@richardarriaga6271]

It's been less than 10 years. Russia can afford to bring them back. Russia should be made to pay them to relocate.

[@aspacelex]

@@richardarriaga6271 Or that yeah. Either way, I've no sympathy for any literal settler-colonists.

[@andrewgreenwood9068]

​@@richardarriaga6271can it though? Russias economy id doing pretty badly right now

[@Kaizenkmkz]

With a brain that smooth, physicists will be wanting to use it as a real frictionless surface.

[@Revan058]

My god, BE can finally make some contribution to society...

[@kyoungt14]

0:28 “Why did that sound so familiar??” Me: “Literally cause Yes.”

[@gerunkwon2598]

Bad Empanada the type of guy who wakes up mad.

[@JustAnotherNamelessGuy]

YOU THINK I GIVE A SHIT IF MY ALARM GOES OFF OR NOT?!

[@angelantayhua3096]

I like how BE always wants be be given the benefit of the doubt when he uses words that mean definitively different things interchangeably but gets furious when some else uses rhetoric he doesn’t agree with and strawmans...

[@Tacklepig]

I actually really like the point from Vaush here, it's a main reason why I disagree with landback and/or general "anti-colonial" rhetoric. Getting rid of an oppressive state is one thing, but people who live in a place live there now, and should have a right to stay there if they want. And if they're living in an actual stolen house, they should at least be given the opportunity to buy a new one in the area or something like that. Settlers aren't the actual colonizers. That's fucking ethnostate logic, that's great replacement logic. The logic doesn't get better because you're applying it in favor of an oppressed minority.

[@Dreigonix]

The Land Back movement is not about ethnostates or kicking people out, fortunately.

[@schnoz2372]

Well can you elaborate on the last paragraph?

[@schnoz2372]

I think what you’re getting at is that being anti white isn’t being anti racist, it isn’t anti colonialism. Colonization like most crimes I believe can mostly be attributed to material conditions and socioeconomics.

[@pennyforyourthots]

That's not what the land back movement is about, that's more the media perception of it. From what I recall, it's basically just saying that indigenous people should be stewards of public land (like national parks) not only to turn them to their ancestral homelands, but to also strengthen the power of indigenous self-governance. It's not a movement trying to remove people from the places that are already settled, but rather a request to take up a roll in sustainability and maintaining the few places that are still preserved from before colonial times.

[@BlueTyphoon2017]

@@Dreigonix yeah I feel like this person misunderstands what landback is.

[@midnightmadness6344]

How can you ever take BadEmpanada at their word for anything? They pretty open with I don’t need to watch videos to criticize them, so why at any point should anyone take BadEmpanada at their word when they say they “watched a video”.

[@UmQasaann]

Badempanada is more honest compared to these social fascists Vaush and BonerBox.

[@fukauzumaki3282]

​@@UmQasaannif Vaush gives you dishonest vibes you're already in a cave with no daylight or hope

[@TWIlktitbliktvim-ty7td]

"if Vaush gives you dishonest vibes you're already in a cave with no daylight or hope"@@fukauzumaki3282 didn't he was your prophet

[@Betelgeuse2142]

​@@UmQasaannBad empanada is a bootlicker that wants bloodshed and nothing else

[@lorenzobarducci8353]

@@Betelgeuse2142 Could be true, never seen a video of him. He's still more honest than anyone else in this video

[@hamizanyunos1502]

I am for a binational one state solution but kicking Jews out of their houses from land that Israel took in 1948 and giving them all back to Palestinians seem not only completely unworkable but also just morally wrong . Like practically speaking how do you house those displaced Jews that need to relinquish their land and houses to Palestinians? Honestly I am amazed to how LonerBox is doing well in this debate with how BadEmpanada acting

[@Terzy]

Good thing literally no one argued that

[@hamizanyunos1502]

@@Terzy Wasn't BadEmpanada arguing that land and housing must be transferred from Israelis to the Palestinians? I mean there is a difference between dismantling the state of Israel and arguing that there needs to evictions of Israelis from their homes for Palestinians?

[@Terzy]

@@hamizanyunos1502 That land and housing was stolen by the Israeli state, there's nothing wrong with giving it back to Palestinians. He was consistently arguing that yes, houses that were directly and verifiably stolen from Palestinians should result in Palestinians having the choice to be able to move back in, but if not, then there is plenty of space to build new houses for the Palestinians who wish to return. This is not something that would just happen over night, but would take decades long process.

[@hamizanyunos1502]

@@Terzy Under a binational state wouldn't the land be jointly administered by both Israeli Jews and Palestinian Arabs under a single state? Why not just build new houses for the Palestinians that want to return to a new binational state? Why doesn't he argue that as an option and instead insists for land and housing transfers from Israelis to Palestinians first in this debate? I mean recently stolen houses like in Sheikh Jarrah I can understand returning those houses would be justified but what about houses that were were created after 1948? However in this decade long process of returning land to the Palestinians how do you convince Israelis about this?

[@ObiJohnKenobi67]

Yeah, I think it would be easier to just subsidize new housing for returning Palestinian refugees

[@jdsmedley]

It's weird, I have watched a couple of Badempanada's videos and thought they were fairly well made with good points, but every interaction I've seen from him outside of his videos has been super toxic.

[@Tacklepig]

He tends to make interesting and well-researched videos about history I think, but whenever he talks about current shit and/or online drama, he sounds utterly unhinged.

[@alrecks619]

that's essayists for you, they made the illusion until you see what is beneath the underbelly when you tear the shroud.

[@BlueTyphoon2017]

@@alrecks619 well tbf most essayists are pretty good, as well as good people as well it seems.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

@@Tacklepig If you're actually education the subjects he discusses you will find that BE does a lot of edited propaganda and bulshit for exmaple when he does videos sucking off cuba he will intentionally omit the fact that the dictaor government literally jails and or tortures artsits for making unsanctioned art that is not pre approved by the Government... he also will ignore or commit the fact that the reason the cuban health care system is so moderately good is because the government mandates and or forces people to become and join the healthcare system, it pushes government enforced conscripts of people into service, and will often sacrifice other areas of need and production to manufacture materials for the healthcare system at great expense to other facets of the society and they ignore the fact that production issues, mismanagement and etc causes issues all the time cause they want to push this idea that Cuba is some commie utopia. Now you could argue or have a discussion about the ethics and overall effectiveness of such a thing but to omit and or ignore even mentioning it for propaganda and political purposes yeah that’s not a sign of a well done researcher but a shill.

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@Tacklepig yep

[@paintman5620]

the "material conditions" thing makes me think of when I was in the military and planners would just... not plan. When the medical officer comes into the combined arms rehearsal and says tactical medical support would be "situationally dependent" instead of having a detailed plan predicting and factoring for contingencies, it typically meant they were just shit at their job 😂

[@danielshepard1449]

"People getting their stolen land back is just like when I joined the military bro"

[@paintman5620]

@@danielshepard1449 lmao salt 🧂😂

[@danielshepard1449]

@@paintman5620 salty is how your girl tasted to other dudes while you were off in the military

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

@@paintman5620 it's true though Why did you join one of the most evil and barbaric insitutions on the planet?

[@paintman5620]

@@GalacticNovaOverlord had to pay for college because my parents had a lot of kids and it's one of the few ways to guarantee yourself funding for higher education.

[@Cullinyan]

Vaush breaking out his culture and media expertise by identifying the natural harmonics from Yes's 'Roundabout' as... the anime note from JoJo. Also, on behalf of Australia, I apologise for BadEmpanada's existence.

[@MrBromansa]

Honestly not your fault, I'm surprised a country made of prison colonials and their descendants has a functioning government. Your brother in Christ, a South African (AKA 🇿🇦Another Colonial 🇻🇬)

[@Cullinyan]

@@MrBromansa on the plus side, we just had an election without any pesky insurrections

[@MrBromansa]

@@Cullinyan Hey, nice one - now that's what I call progress 2022!

[@bumblebeeatbreadloaf1286]

RIP Alan White (the drummer of Yes who passed away two days ago)

[@Revan058]

@@bumblebeeatbreadloaf1286 Aww, fucking seriously? RIP.

[@billzhang8628]

Why is an Australian who moved to Argentina talking about killing settlers??

[@derpeth2101]

He acknowledges that he’s a settler.

[@billzhang8628]

@@derpeth2101 Yes but not that he should be killed.

[@verager2493]

@@derpeth2101 and is mysteriously alive...

[@danielshepard1449]

@@verager2493 So what exactly is the own here? BadEmpanada advocates against colonization and is also a product of colonialism? So what is the problem? This is an argument a right winger would make "Hmm you support equal rights for black people yet you are white? Hmm curious"

[@verager2493]

@@danielshepard1449 no, most people who support equal rights don't call for the killing of... anyone. Much less while being the thing they think it's ok to kill people for being. I think being the product of colonialism is an unfortunate reality, but you need compassion for people in that position who want to do better. He advocates for killing people who are in that position. ... while being in that position.

[@BagelBoy97]

But the Arabs literally did try to form an ethno state. Hence the Farhoud and the expulsions of the Jews by Algiers, Jordan, Syria, Saudi-Arabia etc… Bad Empenada literally is going on a scizo tirade because people dont like his own version of an ethno state

[@WillieWonka928D]

And what gets me is BE is not a dumb guy, at all. If you watch any of his *(main channel)* videos hes clearly a knowledgeable person. But he chooses to act this way and get in these dumb fights where he dies on this pointless if not totally wrong hills. He could be much more well respected but he opts to ruin his reputation for nothing.

[@danielshepard1449]

He doesn't care about his reputation, he just likes getting overly mad at weaselly libs who act like socialists, he seems to have one of those "leftier than thou" complexes, but he makes good points in a lot of his criticisms

[@GalacticNovaOverlord]

Yep, can agree

[@reverseaimbot2509]

“What’s your point?” “My point is-“ (proceeds to interrupt him)

[@abyssGazerTV]

BadEmpanada has all the suspicious violent tendencies of Lily Orchard except he also decided to make a personality out of being actively obnoxious and it's so fucking bad.

[@grahamelliott9506]

lol the convo opens up like the matrix, and lonerbox is neo deflecting a barrage of pointed and bad intentioned questions.... its not lost on me that 'everyone knows what photo' seems to be followed by the person who said that failing to know what photo