This New Cartridge is a Marketing Scam....

[@WHOTEEWHO]

25% OFF ARKEN with code: whoteewho

[@mhughes1160]

A new more expensive cartridge , because ammo isn’t expensive enough ? LoL 😂 👍

[@RandytheRedneck]

What about the 22 creedmoor?

[@WHOTEEWHO]

22 creedmoor doesn't count. Expensive, boutique rifles that most can't afford. Also hornady doesn't list it on their website

[@tobybobo6539]

Any clues about some Black Friday deals with Arken yet plus use your code???

[@WHOTEEWHO]

Don't know yet about black friday

[@MrJdebest]

Here's the deal, the firearms industry has a problem. Their products last hundreds of years! So, to create demand, they have to introduce new calibers to boost sales.

[@ratagris21]

Like .224 Valkerie, .30 Super carry just to name a few.

[@williamcrane8236]

new .21. Gotta replace the oldest cartridge around.

[@Roadking556]

What are you talking about? 90 percent of the time I can't find or buy old cartridges! . . . Why don't they manufacture the old cartridges in demand? Sounds like they are cutting off their nose despite their face.

[@jeffshelton4741]

@@ratagris21 Don't forget the short mags and super short mags.

[@camwinston5248]

@@Roadking556 they are cutting their nose off...because to many of these companies are being ran by beancounters and owned/controlled pholding companies/,hedge funds now...and all these boards and investors are wanting to ses a immediate return on their investments.

[@curtis6554]

I am an old man who is old school. my hunting calibers are the 22 magnum, the 556, the 22-250, the 30-30, the 308, the 30-06, and the 300win mag. I have been shooting these calibers for over 50 years and they still put meat in the freezer. I know what my bullets can do and I know what my rifles can do. I don't need a lot of new fangled bullets to harvest game.

[@ZaleZeager]

I agree with all of these. I do use a .338 Win Mag for elk tho. But 30-30, 30-06 are my "reach out and touch them choices.

[@curtis6554]

@@ZaleZeager I have often considered buying a 338 it is a great cartridge. but at my age and no more than I shoot I just haven't taken the plunge

[@ZaleZeager]

@@curtis6554 it's a great rifle. But it's expensive to shoot. A little bit over kill for smaller game than a deer. But all in all It's good for the big game to fill your freezer. Sounds like Thunder too so don't miss lol

[@realblakrawb]

I agree. 22mag, 22 250 (my swift is sort of specialized) 308. And here's where i get weird. 280ai. Or 7rem mag

[@hoosierplowboy5299]

At 83, feel the same way, pard... 😊

[@rickerdman9116]

I own all calibers mentions. That being said I have a bolt and gas gun in 22 arc. The gas guns run at a lower pressure. Now compare the bolt gun data it's truly amazing. The 22-250 is good but with light bullets and not high BC bullets because of the twist rate. Get a bolt gun when get your 22 ARC. The Ruger American gen 2 in 22 and 6 ARC is slick! I've been trashing coyotes with 55 gr Varmagedon (3700 fps) and the 62gr ELD-VT bullets (3625 fps). The 22 ARC uses a lot less powder and also uses small rifle primers to do the same job but less $$.

[@JordanDavis-cb8uu]

The 88 ELDM is a hammer on coyote too, getting 2918 in a gas gun. Happy hunting

[@armalite3009]

Thanks for posting that info. I have the ruger gen 2 in 6 arc 16in barrel that I am going to play with some 58gr vmax in. I got into suppressors and with the added length they put on the gun it makes me hate long barrels. 3600 or 3700fps could sucker me into a long barrel though lol

[@RockinRack]

You'll never convince ignorant people with facts lol

[@milesrost6674]

The 6 ARC is a great round!! - Godspeed

[@fruitfarmfords8243]

Can buy a lot of powder and large rifle primers for the cost of a new rifle. Like buying a new 50k car to save fuel because my $2500 pickup is a gas hog.

[@robgoins3672]

All these new bullets and everyday my mind is still blown by what you can accomplish handloading .270 Winchester……

[@jeffwilliams3436]

Man when you hand load the new cartridges…you’ll be blown away again. Push a PRC cartridge to the max and you’ll store pee paws old walnut stock 270 in the back of the safe.

[@Manbunmen65]

It used to be "You will be blown away by the 270" Now the 270 fan boys say "You will be blown away by the hand loaded 270 with a re barrel job for heavier bullets" What a joke.

[@JohnSmith-f6o]

Yep, load the 270 with a 130 grain Ballistic Tip and you've got a 325 yard "Point-Blank-Range" load for a 7 inch circle. That is flat enough to aim dead center on a deer without worrying about trajectory out to 325 yards. None of these new "efficient" cartridges with heavy-for-caliber bullets will do that. It's the same situation as in this video, the range has to be well beyond what anybody really shoots at before you gain anything in bullet drop. And something that few ever point out, by the time you get far out enough to gain the drop advantage with the new cartridges you are measuring drop in "feet" or even "yards". No matter what cartridge you are shooting, you are going to need a range finder and will have to know your exact trajectory in detail to compensate. Does it really matter if you improve from 130 inches of down to 110 inches???

[@stevesmith2171]

Being completely familiar with the rifle and loads you are using is more important than having the supposedly latest and greatest. That complete familiarity only comes with years of use. Shooting in the field is far different than the range. ​@@jeffwilliams3436

[@pabloco091]

@@robgoins3672 fact

[@josephmallard9053]

I appreciate your insight. My best friend's father was using a .264 Win Mag back in the early 1970's and continued to use it all his life. He took about every kind of game you could out here in Eastern Idaho, Wyoming, Montana, etc. His son used a 7mm Rem. Mag and his father just smiled and outshot us all. A great caliber and hunting round. I am really getting tired of the so called latest and greatest cartridges coming out. I was fortunate to take a nice 4x4 mule deer this fall at around 165 yards. I guarantee you that the deer didn't give a crap about all the numbers and hype when my 30-06, handloaded with 165 grain AccuBond, wrecked his world with one through the boiler room. He was dead on his feet. Anyway, great video.

[@Coffeeeveryday89]

Amen brother

[@LRRPFco52]

The problem with 264 Win Mag and 7 mm Rem Mag is they don't burn all the powder in the chamber. Nobody will notice at 300-400yds, but they are anything but efficient at achieving a full propellant burn due to how tall the powder column is. Very wasteful, inefficient, and require actions that are longer, only to not burn that powder that requires the longer case and action.

[@rickwebster9549]

AMEN ON THAT 👍👍

[@davidlamb155]

I’ll keep my 22-250.

[@unclebob540i3]

.220 Swift is the grand daddy, .22-250 is still king.

[@timj.8056]

I'll also keep my 22-250!

[@KB-ld6ql]

Energy numbers are screwed. Higher weight booolits! Match that Hornady Kool-aid Caliber Arc with .243 in same weight. Keeping my 22 250.

[@Lethal_Intent]

Same i load my own with 73gr and 80gr boolits in my fast twist 22-250. And it does everything the 22 arc can do but better trajectory wise.

[@PineyJustice]

@@KB-ld6ql The 22-250 won't even stabilize the 90 grain 224 bullets. The heavy legacy style 224 bullets are low bc to keep overall length short for stabilization. Secondly, the chambers are not cut for them, you may have to seat the bullet so far into the case it affects performance, if you can get them to load and feed at all.

[@fracken1441]

I think your missing the point. The 22 ARC works in the AR 15. The 22-250 and 220 swift do not. The 22 ARC can shoot the longer bullets with higher BC, This alone illuminates everything but 224 Valkyrie. The 22 ARC bests the 224 Valkyrie. Try finding a factory 22-250 with a fast enough twist rate to shoot the heavy bullets. In the end the ARC cartridges were developed for the AR15 platform that's where they shine and what they were made for.

[@JamesSimpson-zk5cv]

Best comment yet!

[@bowhuntrrl]

Bear Creek Arsenal makes an AR10 upper for .22-250...

[@jeffwilliams3436]

@@bowhuntrrl22-250 does NOT feed well in a gas gun. That’s why 22ARC exists

[@johngregware9073]

Someone finally gets it, made for AR15 platform. The 22-250 cartridge is to long that's the whole point.

[@kevinkerr2847]

@@jeffwilliams3436

[@tylerepperson4381]

I'm sticking with my 22-250. I love it but the local ground hog population hate it.

[@realblakrawb]

Of 22lr 22wrm 223, 22 250, 220 swift, and a stupid expensive 22 fx airgun. My go to is the fx airgun with 23 grain slugs and the 22 250 with 52fb berger is my go to for hunting. The 22 250 hand loaded has done more than my swift for performance.

[@bestestusername]

Lots of "Gucci" rounds come out that pretend to do what 22, 22-250, 223,243,270,308, 30.06 and 300wm can do but many end up discounted rifles

[@donbenson5292]

Like that term "Gucci" rounds. Lol

[@mudshark412]

you forget the 7mm08

[@bestestusername]

@@donbenson5292 Haha its a good one, I don't own it I heard it on ozzie reveiws youtube channel. He is an Aussie guy that reviews stuff like this.

[@glennllewellyn7369]

@@mudshark412 Beautiful cartridge!

[@scottythebody0811]

Agree, but remember, long range shooters shoot a lot more ammo than hunters do.

[@DG2244]

With light bullets any of them are great. With heavy bullets the 22 ARC shines. You need a fast twist barrel for heavy bullets , 1 in 7 seems to be magic. The factory 22 ARC guns are coming with 7 twist so you don't need to have the barrel changed on your 14 or 12 twist guns. In a bolt gun like the Ruger American, handload data from Hornady uses 62,000 psi as max pressure and is getting 2950 fps with 88 grain bullets. The 62 ELD-VT bullet was designed for the 22 ARC and has very high BC and load data is pushing it at 3550 fps. If you look at the total package, the 22 ARC is a well engineered concept and a handloaders dream.

[@mrplumsak]

Weight is a factor and the heavier the bullet the more drop it’s gonna show. Have to agree with you dg2244, 22 ARC was built to send the heavy’s downward. It’s not a 22 Creed, but it’s adequate for what it does for sure.

[@drakeslocum2564]

I would have liked to see the wind drift. I bet that’s where the ARC and Valkyrie would shine. Drop is predictable, wind is not

[@kevinfidler8074]

Most of them are, meanwhile they can't keep brass in stock for existing cartridges.

[@austinfisheroutdoors]

Man, ain't that the truth! There's a constant shortage for many well-established calibers because production goes to this new stuff. Things that used to be cheap are now expensive due to scarcity. The other side of that is the new stuff gets pushed by the companies, but then it's too expensive to do anything with, and then it's basically dead in a year or so. Back to square one, rinse and repeat. We as consumers suffer because of their poor logistical choices. If they actually wanted us to convert to the newer "better" stuff, then they'd make it affordable. Instead, we just get these constant boutique rounds that only guys with sponsorships can afford to play with.

[@buckfutter99]

Reloading has been around for a long time.

[@lanejohnson7656]

@@austinfisheroutdoors Often times the components for their newly developed rounds are unavailable

[@V8RJIM]

My rule for cartridges….can i walk in to any sporting goods store or Walmart and buy ammunition for it?

[@whiskerbiscuit99]

Then what you have is what you have. I buy lots of the primary stuff, 22lr, 5.56, 9mm, 45acp, 308, and practice and replenish. Other calibers i buy less of but still have plenty ifbi suddenly cant get it for a period. And i shop where money goes the furthest, and walmart or online retailers are where thats at. Since covid a vast majority of distribution has been to online retailers, that get better pricing for volume and sell it cheaper. I buy stuff online thats nearly half or more of the price in some cases, vs whats on my local shelves. If i can get more ammo for a lot less on online, online it is. Moneys tight, and i have a hoard to keep topped off after range days.

[@landenrobbins9936]

I buy 6arc ammo and 22 arc ammo from academy

[@whiskerbiscuit99]

@@landenrobbins9936 yes they have good prices sometimes. Whoever i buy from, i try to find the lowest price with free shipping if i huy x amount, whether that 250, 500, or 1k rds. Its a big buy up front but the savings is so worth it

[@xvonfrankenstein]

Ingenious solution to a non existent problem.

[@jgsprecision]

224 valkyrie is the 6.8spc /.422ish rim, all the ARC is the grendel / 7.62x39 rim. 22ARC is a 22 grendel, even shares headspace gauges. The grendel case gives a bit more powder capacity and 88gn bullets not loaded deep in the case (more capacity again).

[@chiefmachining7972]

^ Yep all his video he does. He misses details or gets them wrong

[@jgsprecision]

@@chiefmachining7972 I think he likes leaving "easter eggs" to pull us into the comments ...

[@chiefmachining7972]

@@jgsprecision Make sense to get that engagement up

[@alienstacker]

Wish you would have included the 22 creedmoor! Keep up the great videos!

[@WHOTEEWHO]

I don't consider that yet. Can only get it from small sources and very expensive boutique guns. To me it doesn't count

[@strangemayc]

@@WHOTEEWHO bro hornady has the 22 creedmoor in the same lineup of ammo as the 22 arc

[@camwinston5248]

​@@strangemaycfind an off the rack rifle for it..and then try to source ammo that doesn't cost a tank of gas.

[@cjberan]

@@camwinston5248you can get a ruger American barrel for $400 and ammo for $40 a box for 22 creedmoor shipping to your house

[@The_Judge300]

@@WHOTEEWHO It is not harder to get .22 Creedmoor ammo than it is to get .22 ARC ammo(both Hornady) and a very accurate factory rifle from Horizon costs 2.8k. And you can get a gun for cheaper than that if you buy a 2nd hand gun and put in a new barrel chambered in .22 Creedmoor. Personally I think the .22 Creedmoor will have a much better and longer future than the .22 ARC. The .22 ARC is just some overhyped nonsense from Hornady and I 100% agree with your view about it.

[@newscoulomb3705]

The biggest issue with the 22-250 is that the barrel twist rates don't allow for heavier bullets. If they did, it could outperform 22 ARC with the heavier weight bullets.

[@swamper2fly]

I put an 8 twist on mine and run 77s with great results.

[@newscoulomb3705]

@@swamper2fly Yeah. Mine is supposed to be 1:9, but I haven't had a chance to run heavier than 50 gr through it.

[@cjberan]

22-250AI is that. And it’s very similar to the 22 creedmoor.

[@KevinSchable]

There is one or two production guns with twist rates for heavier bullets. Was anyway. I haven't been in the market for a while, but a while back I saw a couple. Might have been an older CZ 550 and something else. But, lots of prefits available today.

[@newscoulomb3705]

@@KevinSchable Savage 110 came in 1:9, 1:12, and 1:14. I'm not sure how many others.

[@bigtexfirearmsllc]

Anybody remember when they repackaged the .280 and called it the 7mm Express? This is an ongoing issue with manufactures, As WTW stated, we had the .264 win mag and the .260 Rem, but along comes the 6.5 CM and PRC. They can't sell guns unless they keep you wanting something different. The latest isn't always the greatest.

[@paulbuckner9820]

Cartridges like this are what the Late Col Jeff Cooper called "an ingenious solution to a non existent problem".

[@philipMorris-e9q]

It's all about marketing, and retail sales, in reality, it's the wheel being re-invented, there is more than enough cartridges on the market

[@lonerinthesticks]

I’ve never heard someone with real world experience hunting with a preferred cartridge that’s been around for years say “I like it but it just isn’t enough”. The same companies will say .410 is in low demand and can justify low production/high price…but they produce a cartridge AND create exclusive firearms for said cartridge in a gamble that may not pay off. In short, they don’t have their priorities in check. All about making money even if it means losing it.

[@jesusisalive3227]

The 22arc is awesome. It allows you to shoot a heavy 22 bullet in an ar15. None of the others allow you to do that. Everyone who owns one loves it. The 224v was a flop. Im so sick of people asking if we need it. We dont need half of what we have. Why all of a sudden is everyone so against new products coming out? If you dont want it, dont buy it!

[@Mike-xi4zt]

@@jesusisalive3227 22 arc is a another version of 22 ppc, 22 lbc, 22 grendel, little difference in real performance between 224 V and 22 arc. 22 arc removes more metal from the AR bolt face than a 224 V.

[@Thousand_yard_King]

No way, that shoulder is way too steep and big to feed properly into an AR. I've seen cartridges with smaller shoulders that won't even do it, and end up being a flop. For a straight wall cartridge!

[@The_Judge300]

This products is NOT good, no matter what Hornady claims and you think. And it is VERY far from being awesome. But I guess it is awesome for members of the Hornady cult...

[@jgsprecision]

@Thousand_yard_King it's the grendel shoulder , 30deg... same as a wide variety of cartridges including the Creedmoors and the 277 Sig Fury. Military full auto reliable and sporting reliability are not the same.

[@RETOKSQUID]

Part of the frustration is the wasted time and resources that these companies waste producing these new "improved " rounds, when you can't even find ammo for the ones you already have, or when you do it is outrageously expensive because they have decided to make limited production runs of what was once very common ammo.

[@chrishelms1967]

22-250 is an over achiever......always has been, always will be

[@curtwuollet2912]

.250-3000 savage was an over achiever.

[@kenwienken1396]

Yeah, I think you missed the point. The 22 ARC was designed for the AR platform, so it should only be compared with other 22 calibers that fit the AR also. That leaves the 223 and the 224 Valkery. If you want a hot rod 22 in a bolt gun, then get the 22 Creed.

[@KevinSchable]

No, I would rather get a .22/243 Middlestead because I think that was what the Crudmoor came from. I like original stuff.

[@IndependentArmz]

I'm starting a 2A channel. I'm just learning the editing stuff, it's not really my wheelhouse. Any support from you guys would be appreciated. Love ya either way.

[@superdavekc5vmq]

I think I prefer my 243 over all of those

[@nathanlambshead4778]

Totally agree. Great varminter, great woods/medium range deer hunter.

[@PineyJustice]

good thing we have 6mm creedmoor. Gives up nothing while not falling flat at 200 yards.

[@PineyJustice]

@@megastick9324 in another 5-10 years 243 ammo won't be on store shelves anymore, replaced by 6mm creedmoor.

[@HoffnerPrecision]

.243 is one of those timeless chamberings that will be around for a very long time.

[@nathanlambshead4778]

​@@PineyJustice Falling flat at 200 yards? While the .243 is no elk or moose gun (unless that is all you have and you are very close range) it has great ballistics and very flat shooting. With it's heaviest (100 grain) loading and a 1.5 inch high zero at 100 it will be dead on at 200 with an average 1,340 ft/lbs energy. How is that 'falling flat'? That same bullet will only be dropping 45 inches at 500, still traveling 1,800 plus or minus

[@williamgunn1076]

You missed the point or modern precision cartridges by not comparing wind drift. 22 ARC is the bomb. More energy down range and less wind drift. It's easy to compensate for drop.

[@jeffwilliams3436]

He’s also forgetting that factory ammo has been optimized for the AR-15 platform. You can push it hotter when hand loaded for a bolt gun.

[@timeverett7828]

Adam your videos have gotten so much better within the last year! I'll stick with the 22-250 Remington with 58gr vmax! Awesome 👌

[@WHOTEEWHO]

I appreciate you watching

[@theguyinmaine]

In 1912 the Savage 22 high power with 77 grain was going 2790. In 1915 the 250-3000 Savage with 87 grain is faster than all of them at 3000 feet per second. Nothing new under the sun but salesmen.

[@PineyJustice]

high bc bullets are the new bit. Those old cartridges might have impressive numbers on the box, but compare them 200-500 yards downrange and they fall flat fast.

[@theguyinmaine]

@@PineyJustice 250-3000 with 100 grain Sierra GK Bal tip, muzzle, 3000 fps, 2000 lbs. energy. sighted at 180 yds, @ 100 yds +2 @ 300 yds -4.4 2253 fps and 1127 energy not bad for 110 year old design, and they are still available through Hornady That's 100 grains, much heavier than any listed. Compare the numbers.

[@PineyJustice]

@@theguyinmaine A niche cartridge from 100 years ago, while it performs decently it was not and never will be designed to shoot modern high bc bullets. I don't think any 30-06 wildcats are going to be performing poorly within 200 yards, but what does it do at 1000 yards? 25 creedmoor would probably be significantly better performing at 200 yards and everything beyond that.

[@surfr716]

Wind drift is where the arc really starts to eat the 22-250s lunch. It also recoils less and maintains more energy. Also the velocities you're using are for gas guns. Reload them using the hornady bolt gun data and the velocity jumps over 100 fps. They really shine in the micro actions like the howa 1500 mini

[@waltermckinney606]

it allows you to do more with the AR platform. one really good lower and many upper allow very options for shooting in small platform 223/556, 300 blk, 6.5 grendel , 6mm ARC and the 22 ARC. In the Flat lands shots can exceed 300y and out to 500 easy. 22 val not available in stores here.

[@justinjones9042]

Good stuff , awesome you took all time to put up all the data , appreciated . Myself 204 Ruger , 223 Rem 22-250rem , 6.5x55 Swedish, 264 win mag. Why because they're all proven , tons of reloading data , and most of all they're damn fun to shoot .220 swift is a solid classic also .

[@mikewebb8456]

👍WTW. I will stick with the old faithful cartridges.

[@chadbarth-hj4kb]

These modern cartilages are more accurate, hands down. Wind drift is significantly improved with the high bc projectiles. That’s a win win, because most people don’t have the skills to estimate wind, or even care, there’s no phone app for that. It’s easy to drop a bullet in the kill zone at 2-300 yards, but pulling the trigger in 30 mph nor’easter might just mean your in for some tracking on a gut shot animal. The bonus is you get a heavy for caliber bullet weight which creates more energy, and less recoil. Yes, ultimately the biggest improvement is the longer ranges, but they also improve performance at every distance.

[@Accidic]

Improving twists installed on older rifles would allow the use and same benefits. Two rifles come immediately to mind... 22-250 in Browning(?) with a faster twist (1:8.5?) I see at the range does well with 80gr Bergers and was bought new with that twist. Another in .270 with a fast twist barrel replacement also does very well with long Monos. But then... Hornady doesn't make rifles so what would their motivation be? I'd say Winchester would be a better example but even they gave us the 6.8 Western instead of an updated .270. 😢

[@Hornet135]

@@Accidic But you can’t put very long, high BC bullets in .22-250 without running into max OAL issues. So you’d probably need a custom chamber in addition to the fast twist, and even then they would most likely be single load.

[@benjaminbradley3009]

Just be a Better HUNTER. it's called Hunting for a reason.

[@Hornet135]

@@benjaminbradley3009 go back to your spear

[@benjaminbradley3009]

@Hornet135 aaaww did I step on your toes? Poor baby

[@eugenejensen2279]

I was told the 22 ARC was using the 6.5 Grendel brass only necked down.

[@blakebrown8393]

Couple things… 22ARC and 6arc parent case is the Grendel case and the 224VAL parent case is 6.8spc. Got that backwards. I put a 22ARC together for my 6yo son to shoot. Super low recoil, fits in AR platform so he can use a collapsible stock and fit him. In the AR platform, it’s a neat fun to have. He shots deer the other day, it did a good job. He’s shooting milk jugs at 200 yds with it. I will say, I have mine zeroed at 200 and 1” high at 100 and couple inches low at 300. Milk jugs at 400-500 aren’t a difficult task. I agree, 22-250 and others are better for most applications, but it’s the higher grain bullets that make it shine in a compact AR platform. I wouldn’t say it’s a marketing ploy, I’m picky on calibers and new things and I’m enjoying this round. Waiting for colder weather here in East Texas to turn it loose on some coyotes. Keep up the videos, always enjoy it when a Whoteewho video alert goes off.

[@williampurvis8098]

The Arc cartridge takes smaller powder charge to accomplish what it does with a heavier projectile than the 22-250 or 220 Swift. That would be an advantage with todays prices for powder

[@Mike-xi4zt]

@@williampurvis8098 $75 per lb for 4350... I had a old can from late 70's that had $1.99 on it. Name one thing that has gone up more than powder and primers.

[@mothman-jz8ug]

Yes, that savings in powder will offset the price of a new rifle, right? And, of course, you'll need a scope and mounts for it. Then there are the loading dies to purchase, along with brass, etc. Let us know when that saving kicks on due to less powder.

[@williamcrane8236]

@@mothman-jz8ug You'll know cuzz, they'll come out with another new round that you'll need to rinse and repeat. I'm sure it makes sense to someone though.

[@williampurvis8098]

@@mothman-jz8ug Not everyone owns a rifle in one of these calibers. I don’t. I’m just saying if you were interested in one and are planning on making the investment in all the gear it would be something to consider.

[@nmelkhunter1]

@@mothman-jz8ugThis.

[@paulmoss7940]

I smile when they give cute names to new unproven cartridges, like "Legend", "ARC" and "Valkyrie".

[@toddk1377]

Well, the "legend" like the 350 has been very popular and based on the sales in states with restrictions, I'd say it's here to stay. Tons of people have reported success as well...now the 400...that remains to be seen.

[@gregjennings9442]

It’s because they don’t want to call it a fast twist 22 PPC.

[@adamdrouin2295]

Because they sound cool and that's what really sells new rifle calibers. Most people can't or won't maximize the slight improved differences in performance compared to existing rounds

[@ramdom_assortment]

Man in the past 15 years there's been like 20 new AR calibers and none of them justifies the obscurity or added cost compared to .308, that includes the .277 Fury that the US military is supposed to switch to. The only exception to that is something like the 50 Beowulf, or 458 Socom because of ballistics out of a short barrel with a lot of power and heavy bullet to sort of fill the role that would be used for a shotgun.

[@CodyCarlson-d5t]

We built a couple of sixteen in bolt guns in 277 fury. 143 grn bullet at 3000, no pressure signs. Just the new flavor of the month. Like the 7prc

[@msb2948]

WTW, do a fast twist 22-250 comparison and put this to rest forever.

[@chriscirillo352]

I think what's being overlooked is the 22 ARC for medium game. You can shoot the heavies and have more energy at realistic ranges than the others. It's not hamstrung by slow twists and limited to lighter bullets. With the 70gr CX and 80gr ELD-X now, you can get a lightweight bolt action that can drop whitetail easily with everything off the shelf.

[@danielgwinn6461]

I like how everybody complains about new cartridges.Can nobody see past the nose stuck up in the air that anything added to our shooting sports is a good thing. Yes these companies are in it to make money that is the point of any business. My view on this is i dont care what cartridge you use. I just want to see the industry get bigger and better. With all these new options, we have more to choose from and more to pass on to the future generations.

[@JamesPuckett-k5c]

I'm still a fan of the 22-250, does everything I need it to do. Comfortable and confident using it out to 500 yards or so. It simply works. AS for Hornady ammo, I love it. Good quality, excellent performance, and at least for me, 100% reliability. I just haven't jumped on the band-wagon for the latest greatest caliber-of-the-month club yet. And I'm not likely to...

[@HighRoad317]

We don’t need it, but they need to sell and people need to buy! I’m not a slave to earning or spending.

[@jeremystyron9721]

I wanted to let you know its not expensive to have your 220swift and 22-250 Ackley improved. The benefits are incredible especially for reloading and it will still shoot factory ammo the same. It will automatically fire form every round witch is great. The majority of my guns are Ackley improved for that veryreason . You also gain quite a bit more velocity as well . The case life more than dubbles . I get 30 or more firings per brass with them all . For example my 22-250 AI I get an average of 45 firings thats huge with little to no trimming. Talk about saving money. Just some food for thought its worth it without a doubt. Awesome vedio very Informational and educational . God bless you and your family God-bless America 🇺🇸 🇨🇱

[@KB-ld6ql]

The varmints absolutely hate my Mod 16 Savage in 22 250. 55gr and IMR 4895 = 👹 out to 450 yds. The $50.00 Weaver scope that it came with has won a few 5 shot group challenges. Mostly from my buddies who for no reason hate Savage. Wish I saved the money though.....

[@jeffreywilson690]

No really a apple to apple comparison Do it with the same weight bullet Have been working on a 22/250AI 88 grain eldm @3200 fps

[@CARLPHILLY]

As a hunter and a reloader, I’m not a big Hornady fan though I do shoot some of their bullets. The main reason for that is, they’re all about accuracy and a lot of the things they’re coming out with are very accurate, but the killing ability is not there. like the old Nosler, Winchester and Speer bullets. About the only bullet that they have that is really geared toward hunting is the Hornady interlock. The 6.5 Creedmoor, the 7 mm PRC the 6.5 PRC and the 300 PRC are mainly rounds, that are geared toward accuracy first. Will they kill an animal? Yes but they’re not as good at it as some of the old hunting bullets are like Nosler petition and many others.

[@HoffnerPrecision]

As a hunter, hunting guide, and reloader, I’m a huge fan of Hornady. The innovation is there, the accuracy is there, the ability to kill effectively is absolutely there. I see dozens of elk killed very efficiently every year, most with Hornady ELDM bullets. I realize it’s pretty uncool to go against the KZbin warriors and say Hornady is good, but for those of us who work in the industry and see more elk go down in a season than most KZbin viewers see in a lifetime, we know what works. True, you don’t take a short range shoulder shot with bullets designed for longer shots, but good hunters don’t take shoulder shots anyway. Too much meat ruined. That used to matter to hunters.

[@russramirez5672]

I'm a target shooter. Modern cartridges from Hornady are providing opportunities to use high BC bullets from anyone, e.g. Nosler, Berger or Hornady. As for .224 Valkyrie, I covered it in both bolt and AR15 because Federal is local for me. 22 ARC outshoots Valkyrie for target shooting from 100 yds out. BTW, 6.8 SPC is one of my favorite rounds, so I wanted 224 Valkyrie to be better than it is.

[@224valk4]

I have 3 valkyries, I've been shooting it since the jump. Never had ANY issues with function, accuracy, or loading! Many chamberings vs valkyries burn considerably more powder! I'm not saying valk is a world beater, but I'm saying it's the most efficient 22 center fire out there! I push 50gr for pdogs at almost 3500. I push 85 nosler rdf's at 2875. To me valk isn't a solid 1000 yard round. It shines at 700 & closer. 26-27 grains of powder vs whatever anything else burns

[@NC-xk1eg]

Total agreement - what you said. Me? I think that we're seeing 2 new calibers as solution's to problems that don't exist. JMO

[@WHOTEEWHO]

👍👍

[@josephtindle4319]

Reminds me of an old Dilbert skit. "That's a boss, his job is to find systems that are inefficient and make them our new standards!"

[@chuckydubree1925]

Absolutely right ✅️

[@The_Judge300]

The .22 Creedmoor is a great cartridge that makes sense while the .22 ARC makes ZERO sense in my opinion. Is the .22 Creedmoor doing something amazing that no other cartridge is doing already? No, not at all, but if I was to buy a new .22 gun, I would get one in .22 Creedmoor.

[@rogerslone6742]

On guns with similar or close ballistics I try and look at ammo availability and price sometimes that's a good consideration,my aging eyes really help on these decisions as well, shot placement is what we're all after in the end, what ammo agrees with your age and need

[@gunman-6646]

I'll stay with my .22-250. I do love your 220 swift also.

[@marjoryray2564]

Both are great. + if you are shooting that far, put a tighter twist tube on it and go to the higher BC slugs. Same reloading equipment.

[@natew1731]

270 win and 6.5 prc is the exact same story as this. Great video btw.

[@WHOTEEWHO]

Thanks for watching

[@briansouth9325]

I love both of my 22arc rifles

[@SmarterGaming]

hand loading 22-250, you can get velocities in the 4,000 to 4,400 fps range with lighter bullets and still get 3,000 to 3,300 Fps with heavier bullets in the 70 to 85 grain weights... would love to see that compared to an arc, since the 22 arc muzzle speed is 200 to 300 fps less than the 22-250...

[@SilenceDoGood4th]

I'm skeptical of anything Hornady puts out these days. They're trying to make money, not be honest.

[@leedoyle76dl]

The 224 Valkyire is based on a 6.8 SPC case

[@Don8456]

Aren't the 6.8 SPC and 6.5 Gendel based on the .30 AR Remington?

[@sweetteaoutdoors]

@@Don8456the 6.8spc is but the Grendel is based on the 220 Russian I believe.

[@unclebob540i3]

@@sweetteaoutdoors that is correct

[@NelsonZAPTM]

The one "modern" cartridge I would choose would be 300PRC over 300 Winmag. Primarily because you get more reloads out of a case. Maybe tighter tolerances in the chamber, but a custom barrel could do that for a winmag.

[@Ifitfitz22]

The only consideration to a bolt vs auto may be max pressure operating limits. I know I read where the 6 arc had a significant drop in pressure recommended for an AR vs a bolt. In a bolt gun it could be loaded to basically match a .243 out to 300 yards, but in an AR it was handicapped quite a bit. I will say if I was going to get into anything new, and especially in .22 it would probably be the 22 CM

[@nobodyhere4961]

Like John Wick once said ...... I need guns..... lots of guns!!!!!! Buy them all while you can!!!!!!!!!!!

[@reconrc1787]

Im one of them who loves ALL the new calibers available to us (shooters). Its never a problem by having too many tools in your tools box, guys. If you don't like it, don't buy it but it's great for the public to have more options.

[@IndependentArmz]

I kinda think most new calibers are a scam...but, maybe I just don't wanna buy more ammo..Who can say for sure?

[@1nfamyX]

Good video WTW ♥ this is why its not enough to just read stats, we have to interpret & apply them coherently. No ones coyote hunting at 1000, and even if they were i think the slight advantage 22ARC has over 204R is negligible at best, & still far outweighed by availability, cost, etc. at worst.

[@jesusisalive3227]

The 22arc vs 204 at 1000 yards isn't even close. With the heavy 22 bullets, the 22arc outshines the 204 at that distance.

[@1nfamyX]

​@@jesusisalive3227 ​you didnt specify a metric. In drop, 204 is better than 22ARC with heavy bullets as shown in the video. None of this matters bc neither have use from 1 km away.

[@jacktrout5807]

You got the parent cases of the arc and valk switched

[@coldandaloof7166]

Great video, hit the nail on the head in my point of view as well. I'm so sick of all the new cartridges when they can't even keep the old ones in stock. I have not bought a new rifle in 7 years due to the high prices. It's not because I don't want any. I have been stalking up on ammo for the ones I have and upgrading the ones I have to be the best versions possible instead.

[@LeoBaker-ir3vo]

Dartman and the neighbor take coyotes at 1000.

[@davidcampbell2661]

Amazing, how do you spot them? No cover for the coyotes?

[@davidtolbert6204]

What are they using?

[@Mike-xi4zt]

Dartman and neighbor shoot 243 win. Unless they have changed.

[@LeotheBarbarian]

sometimes with .338 Lapua

[@Fudmottin]

What about the 22 PPC? I have loading data for that from the 13th Edition of the Speer Reloading Manual. The 22 Arc sure looks a lot like a 22 PPC. It would be interesting to compare the dimensions.

[@mattmckenzie1653]

To actually compare the cartridges they all should have the same bullet grain weight. Hand load a 50 grain in a 22 arc and its a 22-250 that fits in a ar15 that might cycle correctly. Just think 60 years ago when 22-250 came out the 220 swift guys were probably calling a 250 a Gucci round. Hornady does a great job marketing and developing new cartridges. Better than most companies. If Hornady would have released the 22 valkyrie, it wouldn't have been such a train wreck! More options is never a bad thing.

[@wowguy3562]

My thought is on barrel life, granted I would probably never burn out my barrel unless I start reloading, but shooting 2800 fps in my mind would last the barrel far longer than the 4000 fps rounds. My longest shots so far have been at 600 yards with 22lr and 6.5 cm. The 22 is so fun when conditions are good. Thanks for the charts and comparison, its good information

[@kkeen2010]

I would’ve like to see the 22 CM on that list

[@WHOTEEWHO]

22 creedmoor doesn't count. Expensive, boutique rifles that most can't afford. Also hornady doesn't list it on their website

[@woody2494]

Was the 22 ARC created for the military as a replacement for the 5.56?

[@mikelsworld74]

Good luck finding 22 ARC in country bumpkin stores.

[@brianmccormack84]

You are correct The ark and the valkyrie are for AR platforms not necessary in a bolt gun. The advantage being it is very easy to customize your AR. Less expensive and faster turnaround.

[@bradlehman1537]

I don't shoot much past 350 yards anyway.

[@lrac7751]

In states where it’s legal, I could see guys using it as a deer round because of the slight increase in energy, but ain’t no varmint gonna care about that slight difference

[@EternalClimb]

Is this 22arc vs 224 Valkyrie? Hornady is just a scam these days. About time for a boycott. Bring back 6.8 Western, 22-250ai, 7mmWSM.

[@SouthernOutfitter]

Love my 7mm WSM

[@glennllewellyn7369]

Amen brother! G'day from Australia.

[@phild9813]

224 Valkyrie failure was an unfortunate byproduct of its introduction and rifle builds, not its design. Hopefully the 22 ARC doesn’t fail like it did. We need a moderately hot 22 that will shoot heavy bullets in factory configurations.

[@thelowlyengineer3325]

22 Arc is a necked down 6mm Arc which is a necked down 6.5 Grendel, which is a blown out 220 Russian, that is a necked down 7.62x39. The ARC is a factory backed and slightly tweaked version of the 22. PPC. The 22 PPC is formed from the 220 Russian and has been around since 1974.

[@DouglasPrice-p9q]

... I'm shying away from Hornady mfg stuff ... a lot of their bullets and loaded rounds are substandard

[@Manco65]

Great ill take all the extra 230gr xtp for.45ACP and 68gr BTHP Match for 5.56NATO 😛

[@maxpinson5002]

They keep discontinuing and suspending production of long time favorite dependable bullets and ammo to put out new and different things on the market. Many long time customers are left holding an empty bag

[@camwinston5248]

Yep..sad and true . They do not have but one round and caliber I do or would use anymore..and they have about one more S.A. customer service comment left and I'm done with them for good. After the way they treated there employees during the plandemic I'm about done anyway. I'm just really sick of good American companies falling by the wayside though.

[@gordonutz538]

A couple of points: 1. Not everyone is shooting coyotes. Some cartridges are created for the sole purpose of hitting targets at distance (1,000+ yards). 2. Drop isn't necessarily the most important thing to consider when shooting at a long distance. If your drop is consistent, it is easy to predict and hold over for, windage is where it gets hard. Many people shoot competitions at 1,000+ yards, the 22-250 is next to useless at that distance due to wind drift. Competitive shooters also look at barrel wear when comparing which cartridge to use. 22-250 is a known "barrel burner".

[@cheryltysver4819]

You put in a lot of work on this Adam! I don't know how you manage it all. I've got the Valkyrie in a single shot and haven't been impressed with the groups so far. I've played with pretty much all the .22's... over the years, from a sleeved .22/.308 loaded in what amounts to the .375 Chey-Tac necked down to .30 caliber with a 36" barrel that almost exited out of the back of a 2.75" block of cold rolled steel with .224 Tungsten cored NWM projectiles (I still have the sectioned steel slab that is a museum quality piece... to prove it). Down to a super-charged .22/284 in a 32" rail gun... which was a genuine PITA. Having done all of that...I kinda settled on the .22/243M as the upper useful limit with regard to case capacity and barely tolerable barrel life! It's pushing 62 grain FMJ's to over 4,000 fps with multiple different propellants in a 25.5" barrel, with no problems. Keep up your amazing work... and keep your powder dry!

[@markt5450]

22 arc

[@erniemancuso4589]

Wish you would have also compared the 243 Winchester, an incredible round

[@pabloco091]

Hey, they made the 338 arc, looking forward to seeing what you do with that...boy they poppin'm out like they're babies momm

[@MyHuntingJournal]

8.6 blk is better

[@mlkman5541]

​@MyHuntingJournal Not when your shooting subs. 338 arc is superior with subs. Costs less to build or buy and fits in an AR15 length action. It's more accurate as well due to the fact that the powder isn't floating around in a giant empty case

[@cz75tactical9]

No its not 😂​@MyHuntingJournal

[@MyHuntingJournal]

@@mlkman5541 giant empty case 😂 you could get 95% case fill and still be sub if you use the 8.6 as intended with a short barrel. It's literally made for being subsonic. You're getting a better feeding cartridge with more reliable removal performance due to the fast twist rate, and the potential to load supers to significantly more potential. Boys telling me it's not better with subs 😂😂😂

[@mlkman5541]

@MyHuntingJournal how is it better with subs? They go the same speed lol 8.6 doesn't get anywhere near 95% case fill with subsonic loads. If it did, then how would you get it much faster for supersonic loads at 100% case fill? Watch the Q LLC video on their subsonic zebra hunt. They use custom-made casings that have way less case capacity so the rounds can shoot consistently. Regular 8.6 casings won't shoot consistently because of the amount of left over case capacity. If 8.6 was subsonic at 95% case fill how in the hell is honardy getting 338 arc going the same speed with a much smaller case? Use your head "boy". Super sonic 8.6 is an okay shorter range super sonic bullet. If you own any magnum round, you'd be better off with that. .375 rapter is a much better round for the ar10 role than 8.6 All the Q fan girls are just following the hate on hornady for making better bullets lok

[@richardrussell8723]

I took a nap during during all the short mags really short run. 6.5 x 284 came and went, the 6.5 track more is getting a beating from the prec and on and on. I'm sticking with 223, 22 - 250, .308, 30 - 06, 8 x 57, 7mm Rem mag, and 300 win mag. All, time tested and mother approved. The only. "New" cartridge I jumped on has been the 350 legend and I am having a ton of fun with it in a CVA Scout pistol as well as an AR. I wish they would stop reinventing the wheel and take care of the existing cartridges like 35 Remington, 35 Whelen, 264 win mag, 338 win mag.

[@jeffowsley2545]

Just another gimmick round.

[@TexasThiele]

“I’m just a regular man.” Love it

[@DakotaDoc]

Generally, if you want to use a cartridge for larger game, deer, for example, you need above 1000 ft-lbs of energy. 22 ARC is way above all these. Consider that public load data exist for 22 ARC in a bolt gun. This is even more. Use it to take a deer. You will be impressed by this little cartridge. Also as I am out in the Midwest, wind drift is an inconsistent variable. Drop is consistent. I would also love to see you compare wind drift on your charts. That is where the 22 ARC or 6 ARC will shine. Just nudging out 224 Valkyrie. It is the Little Cartridge That Could. And it can.

[@zacharybaldrige3047]

Reloading perspective arc is conservative on powder. If it performs similar provides enegery down range and is efficient on consumables. Thas a win.

[@tripleceas]

There is one thing new cartridges do that I like and that’s bring new people into the sport/hobby. One of the ranges I’m a member of I am by far the youngest buck at over 40 years old. We need young men to become interested. Thank you for the unbiased info!

[@xxshiftlockxx]

I would say your points though valid, don't matter to handloaders. This would be more of an issue/concern for people who shoot factory ammo. Load a 50/55gr up in the 22arc then rerun the drop chart and energy chart... Also, 6.5 Grendel, 22 ARC, AND 224 Valkyrie are all based off of the 6.8 SPC case. They all have the same case head diameter.

[@artfranz2273]

Good data - well documented. I’m a 204 fan, mostly cuz it shoots so flat. Personally, I don’t very often shoot beyond 300yds. And where we live😢, in Canada, we aren’t allowed to shoot deer with anything smaller than .243 diameter. And since I’m also a trapper, I’ve found that even the 204 is destructive at distances less than 200 yds, unless you hit them between the ribs, and then the bullet often exits the other side causing big damage. So for my use 204 is very adequate. I have a 223 as well as a 22-250 but seldom use either.

[@nimrodmar10]

Even if you have a 22-250 with a fast enough twist to shoot the heavy- for-caliber bullets in the 75-88 grain range, the case, chamber and freebore design will limit the cartridge lenght that will fit in the magazine. By having to seat the long bullets deeper into the case to fit the magazine, you take up powder space in the case, lowering potential velocity. The higher BC of the long bullet helps them to retain velocity farther, plus the higher BC cuts down on the winds' effect on the bullet's flight.

[@Hornet135]

You took the words right out of my mouth. People are quick to put down things before they even truly understand the differences.

[@travisalder9360]

My cousin uses that new 22 arc to manage the feral cats in his trailer park. Loves it

[@jonathanmitchell3733]

Comparing rounds are tough, cause they are all coming out in wildly different bullet weights for factory loads, and you really want to compare them with the same bullet weights

[@freddaniali]

WTW, I like the 22-250. I have always wanted to get one. Thanks for this video!

[@WHOTEEWHO]

Love 22-250. Thanks for watching

[@countryboysteve]

The firearms industry is going through a similar revolution as it did in the early 1900s when we went to smokless powder and jacketed bullets. Increasing speed and accuracy into lighter and higher pressure capable rounds. Todays cartridges are taking advantage of modern propellants, long high b.c. bullets and better matched barrel twist rates. When you combine that with a modern sporting rifle its really a no brainer. As for the argument of 22 arc vs 224 valk. History has proven poor marketing can make or break a round and if you are cornering the market on the ammo at least for a while it can be worth a ton. Another thing i remember about the 224 is that it was a bit more of a wildcat with several chamber spec and was a bit touchy loading correct. Where as the 22 arc was developed and marketed as a spec round from go ish. Ive found the 6 arc and 22arc very very picky when handloading

[@brettconey5616]

Maybe, I am wrong, but I believe that you have the .224 Valkyrie and the .22 ARC parent cases switched. I believe that the .22 ARC is from the Grendel family and the .224 is from the 6.8 SPC family... But either way it doesn't change the data. Great comparison I really appreciate you doing this particular comparison as I have been considering doing either a 6mm ARC or a .22 ARC build and I think I am going to stick with the 6mm ARC. 👍👍

[@TheSuburban15]

Essentially the same as .22 PPC, a benchrest cartridge that's been around for about 50 years, which is only a little different than .220 Russian, which is about 60 years old. .224 Valkyrie is a round that a few have gotten to shoot well, but many gave up on years ago in frustration.

[@clintonlayne9253]

I'm glad to see someone else mention the 22 PPC.

[@vikingsoftpaw]

My lastest edition of Cartridges of the World has an ever expanding section of obsolete/proprietary rounds. Some i recognize from 15 years ago, like the RUM & WSSM series... I personally think the only cartridges that have the best chances of taking off are the Creedmore derivatives: .22 CM, .25 CM, 6mm CM & 6.5 CM. Added: the .22 ARC looks like a real barrel eroder.

[@rogerw71]

Hornady cartridges get buy in from manufacturers. 22 ARC is an improvement over 223 because of bullet options in an AR. 22 Creedmoor is an improvement over 22-250 for the same reasons. Nothing magical, but if you want to buy factory rifles and factory ammo they offer small improvements and will likely get enough support that you don’t end up with unsupported cartridges. It also helps that whenever Hornady releases a cartridge, Ruger releases inexpensive, accurate rifle options. Look at 6.8 Western. Great cartridge with limited support. 6.5 PRC and 7 PRC both had quality brass options before 6.8 Western, and multiple rifles options on the shelves before the 6.8 Western. What makes the Hornady cartridges special is how well they market them. If you want to shoot modern, high bc bullets without building a custom rifle, they are just easy.

[@jasonseiverling5354]

Thanks a bunch man. I’m a 22-250 fan. I love my Bergara B14 HMR in 22-250. Had been looking at 204 Ruger for awhile but decided to wait and learn about the 22 ARC. I’m definitely going back to looking at 204 Ruger. There is also a decent 224 Val AR at my LGS I might ponder as well.

[@eddawg79]

From my understanding the 22 ARC was designed to use the heavier bullets that don't work well with other cartridges. Mainly it's supposed to defeat wind drift not drop.