Why does DC have so much abandoned railway electrification?

[@pastorjerrykliner3162]

You should see the situation up in Pennsylvania... The ENTIRE Pennsy network was electrified but with the demise of the Pennsy and the "Penn Central" most of those electrified lines have been "de-electrified" but leaving most of the stanchions in place to rust away.

[@Thom-TRA]

I noticed that yesterday when I took the Acela through Philly!

[@paulw.woodring7304]

Actually, the electrification never went west of Harrisburg, although there were plans at one time to extend it to Pittsburgh, which would have made sense to do over the Alleghenies and Horseshoe Curve.

[@pastorjerrykliner3162]

There is a preserved Pennsy electric freight loco up in Harrisburg, PA, at the station there... Sorry, I'm not up on my model numbers to say what exactly it is...

[@paulw.woodring7304]

@@pastorjerrykliner3162 That would be GG1 #4859.

[@mambomta]

@@pastorjerrykliner3162 It's a GG-1, which was also a passenger loco

[@andywomack3414]

I am glad you got to Pot Yard. I worked for the B&O in the early 1970's and the cars that we interchanged with the Pennsy at Bayview were marked "PBW" which I was told stood for Philadelphia, Baltimore and Washington. I don't know if that was the actual name of one of the ancestral lines that formed the PRR. One of the daily trains operating to and from Potomac Yard was called the "Pot Yard Turn." The rivalry between the B&O and PRR was evident the night the PC failed as they were no longer able to accept cars in interchange. There was a certain amount of glee mixed with sadness as we made sure to find every car rejected for interchange with the fallen giant in order for the B&O to have a record of the total per diem penalty accessed for holding those cars. At that time the B&O was in the process of being swallowed by the C&O, and the glee was in seeing the failure of the merger between the NE giants, NYC and PRR as well as the corporate memory of that rivalry. The sadness was in witnessing the decades-long decay of the railway industry in general.

[@lawrencewild2523]

You actually missed one other player in the Union Station unification. The Southern Railroad which shared traffic rights over the Pennsy's lines into Union Station from just south of Alexandria yards. DC was in fact the northern termination of the Southern Crescent out of New Orleans (and the northern passenger terminus for all Southern Railway runs). A run near and dear to my heart as I was able to ride on one of the last of their runs back in 1978 shortly before their consolidation into the Norfolk & Western and then the elimination of their passenger service and handing it over to Amtrak (and since it was in December of 1978 I do mean just before, the handover was the end of January). At that point I believe the Southern Crescent was one of the last, if not the last, of the great named passenger runs not in Amtrak service. I will never forget how wonderful the ride up from New Orleans was, the quality of the meals and the pride the entire staff expressed in providing first class service right to the end. Nor will I forget how the whole tenor and feel of the service changes when in Union station the train was handed over to Amtrak and the amenities of the Crescent were removed and the train became the Northeast regional I believe. I rode it up to Penn station in Baltimore, where my dad picked me up (it was my first leave during my time in the USAF. Fresh out of tech school I had treated myself to a train ride as a treat. I had heard they were handing it over and I wanted to be on one of those last rides on the Southern.)

[@Thom-TRA]

I split the video up into a north and south , not quite chronologically. Actually most of the railroads in the south had trackage rights over the Pennsy before Union station was opened.

[@davidpowell3347]

Didn't "The Southern" have its main office in Washington D.C. ?

[@scottdowney4865]

​@@davidpowell3347 Yes it did at 15th & K STs. When they merged they moved headquarters to Atlanta. My Dad's career was with Southern/Norfolk Southern retiring in 1987.

[@kitchin2]

@@scottdowney4865NS corp hq was in Norfolk, but moved to Atlanta recently. I guess some sub-hq or operations were in ATL? And the Crescent I believe was always a New Orleans to New York service. Many pax lines had through service to New York. How cooperative!

[@davidpowell3347]

@@scottdowney4865 The Southern seemed to be the friendly railroad. In 1973 there was an "Albemarle Hotel" in Charlottesville VA which had become rental rooms to University of Virginia students and perhaps a few other residents. Across the road from there (U.S. Route 250,"Main St." or "University Blvd.")(Ivy Road) was the end of a siding coming off of the Southern's main two track line through Charlottesville. A crew of a couple guys (Engineer and "Fireman"?) would park a locomotive there most night,would leave it running all night in freezing weather. They explained to me the undesirability of using antifreeze in it because of the "overhead" radiators and the danger of antifreeze in the coolant should some of it get through the head gaskets (I think it had a separate head gasket for each of its cylinders) An EMD hood unit,I think 4 axles,might have been an older mainline power locomotive but now mostly used in local pickup and delivery service to customers who had rail siding service - maybe an older GP model? I was once invited to come into the operator's cab and look around. The area was very near a church and more or less diagonally across the street from the Hotel. I think they could padlock the doors to the cab and there was a padlock secured derailing device isolating the end of the track where the locomotive was parked for the night - if someone unauthorized were to try to move the locomotive out of the blind track end the idea was that it would derail beside the siding and not be able to get out onto the spur or to the main tracks. The handles for some of the control (stand?) looked to me somewhat like the flush handle on a commercial toilet. Reverser? I don't think that spur or siding is there anymore. Hotel building maybe still there but not a hotel anymore ? Some of the switches controlling the main line junctions to spurs or connections to the other railroad line in town which crossed the Southern line had natural gas burners that could be turned on/lit during very cold weather to allow the switches to get "thrown" or changed during conditions such as snow or icing I think their passenger service from Charlottesville towards Alexandria was called the Piedmont. The other railroad (C & O) I think had already ended its "George Washington" and transferred its passenger service to AMTRAK. The Piedmont was sometimes just a carbody locomotive and a passenger car or two spliced into a freight train headed by a hood locomotive I think the Southern was running 6 axle hood locomotives on the mainline trains by then (SD units?)

[@SuperDave30]

This is absolutely a great story and some very serious archives.

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you!

[@Westhamsterdam]

There is only 1 problem. 25k high wire voltage cables were only invented after WW2 in the 1950´s by the French!

[@Thom-TRA]

@@Westhamsterdam funny, I just read my entire script, I can’t find anywhere where I say they added the 25KV before 1950.

[@JohnM1774]

EXCELLENT Video. It is a shame the wires were taken down. Many hours of labor went into installing electrification to a railroad. You did many hours of research !!! Keep up the GREAT work.

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you so much!! Really appreciate this

[@chicagolandrailroader]

Great documentary! Electrified railroads in North America, especially freight hauling ones, has been a hyper fixation of mine recently. Thank you!

[@Thom-TRA]

Happy to add to your fixation haha

[@IndustrialParrot2816]

Mine too

[@00Zy99]

Great movie. Well shot, well narrated, and well paced. Just a few clarifications/corrections: 1) The Pennsylvania started its AC electrification in Philadelphia in 1915, and expanded it through the greater Delaware Valley through the 1920s. It wasn't until the 1930s, however, that the mainline beyond Trenton and Wilmington got wires. New York City was connected in 1933 and the wires reached DC in January, 1935. 2) In addition to other reasons cited below, one of the reasons for Conrail cutting the wires was due to the lack of flexibility. There just wasn't enough electrified mileage to be worth it. If the wires had gone over the Alleghenies, they would probably have stayed, but as it was there was relatively little incentive to keep them up. 3) The reason that the electrified freight lines were entangled with the Northeast Corridor was because the PRR never had the chance to finish its proposed Low Grade Network. Additional lines would have run from Downingtown to Philadelphia via Newtown Square and from Morrisville, PA to Linden, NJ. Obviously, these would not have completely separated things, but in conjunction with extra tracks, and a proposed Belt Line around Baltimore there would have been far less interaction. Another line that I've heard described as being part of the Low Grade Network was the Oxford Road branch. 4) Another reason given for closing Potomac Yard was the concern about large quantities of hazardous cargo in close proximity to the nation's capitol. Of course, the Virginia Avenue Tunnel is still in use today, but at least freight keeps moving and doesn't have a chance to accumulate or become a tempting target for terrorists.

[@Thom-TRA]

Interesting, did not know about the low grade network

[@tennyho3236]

Thanks for explanations. Btw is revitalizing Virginia Av Tunnel for DC Metro's new crosstown line a serious thing being considered?

[@Thom-TRA]

@@tennyho3236 no, I don’t believe it is

[@00Zy99]

@@tennyho3236 No. It would require a slightly different profile (a bit wider) if my eyes and memory aren't failing me. And that leaves aside the fact that it is quite busy with freight traffic. And that it doesn't connect to any proposed Metro alignment-the complexity of tying the Metro in on both ends would vastly outweigh the cost of just digging a new tunnel.

[@Scrublord30]

23:48 One more clarification, in 2021 the Virginia government bought 386 miles of right of way and 223 miles of track from CSX between DC and Richmond. Hopefully we will start to see some more reliable and frequent passenger rail from the corridor in the future due to the deal

[@Ulisest91]

There was an electric bypass in Wilmington Delaware that bypassed the NEC passing through the city. its now single tracked with the old Catenary towers still visible.

[@j.martin6787]

former PRR Shellpot Branch- a double track, electrified freight bypass around Wilmington. Still in use by NS but single track. For a long time wires were up in case of emergency but Conrail eventually pulled them down.

[@JohnGeorgeBauerBuis]

@@j.martin6787now I wonder what the last time a passenger train used that for a diversion. It was probably a few years before the wires were removed.

[@rwboa22]

A similar bypass existed around Downingtown, PA (Philadelphia and Thorndale Line) except that not only Conrail de-electrified the line, but also abandoned it.

[@thenoodledrop]

@@rwboa22the High Grade Line is genuinely impressive. the Downingtown Trestle Bridge and Whitford Flyover are very impressive structures. Such a shame it was abandoned.

[@ralphsanchico2452]

I’m still trying to wrap my head around the fact that certain freight routes were electrified. I’m a product of the 69’s did they have them then?

[@brycebundens6866]

Electrify the NE corridor all the way to Richmond!!!! I hope we all can make it happen soon!!!! Excellent video, it’s a documentary that was sorely needed about all of the city’s former railways. There is so much old ROW ready for new Metro lines, light rail, and streetcars!!!

[@j.martin6787]

It will happen-the momentum is there, both in VA and the nation. People want high speed trains.

[@brycebundens6866]

@@j.martin6787 heck yes!!!!

[@sammymarrco47]

Virginia electrification to Roanoke too, Manassas line FTW

[@OntarioTrafficMan]

Would pair nicely with Virginia's new passenger rail tracks

[@CaptRR]

The issue you run into is that the rails south of DC are owned by the rail companies, and they don’t want a bunch of overhead centenary messing up how high they can stack their cargo containers.

[@TheOneKEA]

This was a fantastic video! One other thing you may want to explore is the former site of Capitol Substation (Sub 25), the original southern terminus of the PRR’s 138kV transmission grid. Prior to 1995, the two 138kV lines along the Landover Sub tracks (now partially removed, as shown in your video) continued south past the site of the former 25Hz generator at the Benning Road power station and crossed the Anacostia River before transitioning from overhead lines to underground lines at a pair of aerial terminal towers just east of the Virginia Avenue tunnel. The 138kV lines, now insulated and enclosed in cable ducts, traveled through the Virginia Avenue tunnel and then terminated at the Capitol Substation, where the switchgear, transformers, catenary breakers and control equipment were located. Several 12kV circuits emanated outward from the Capitol Substation; some of them powered the catenary between Landover Substation and Potomac Yard; some of them were insulated and traveled back through the 1st Street Tunnels to connect to the switching station next to Union Station (Sub 25A); and some of them went to another switching station in Pot Yard in order to operate the catenary in the yard itself. When the insulated cables reached end-of-life in 1995, CSX decided that they didn’t want the 138kV cables in their tunnel any longer and demanded their removal, resulting in the decommissioning and removal of Capitol Substation, Pot Yard switching station (located on the site of the current 60Hz utility substation near the W&OD trail), and the removal of the feeders to Sub 25A at Union Station. (I don’t know if Pot Yard switching station was still in use past 1989 but it would have definitely been decommissioned when Capitol Substation was decommissioned). The removal of the 12kV feeder circuits that ran from Capitol Substation to Sub 25A significantly weakened the electrical capacity of Union Station and Ivy City Yard, resulting in many problems with the HHP-8 locomotives that contributed to their notorious reputation. In order to fix it, Amtrak commissioned a 2008 study into the problem, and then built two new 138kV circuits in 2010 that follow the Northeast Corridor from the split east of Cheverly and terminate at the far eastern end of Ivy City Yard, at a new substation called Ivy City Substation (also numbered Sub 25). This substation has two transformers (with room for a third) and restores the missing 12kV feeder capacity needed for Union Station and Ivy City Yard’s electric locomotive operations. Your video clearly shows the transposition in the circuits at Cheverly station as they travel along the Corridor towards the other crossing of the Anacostia River. I have some digitized documents that talk about the construction of Capitol Substation and Ivy City Substation that go into detail about the design and implementation of the electrification in the D.C. area and provide some useful context about the information you provided in your video. I also have three dead-tree books called “Under Pennsy Wires” (by Paul Carleton), “The Pennsylvania Railroad Under Wire” (by William D. Middleton, ISBN 0-89024-617-3) and “TRAINS” (edited by John Westwood, ISBN 0-7064-0939-6) that have even more details about the PRR electrification; the third book also has lots of detail about the electrified freight lines elsewhere in the U.S. that you referenced in your video. I am looking forward to the next entry in this series!

[@Thom-TRA]

Thanks for the tip!

[@TheOneKEA]

You’re welcome! The titles of the digital documents I referenced above are “The Capitol Sub-Station at South Capitol and G. Streets, Washington D.C.” and “Strengthening Amtrak’s South End - the Ivy City Substation Project”.

[@matttjaden]

Thom, good video but I’d also like to add a few things. There were two big reasons Conrail stopped using electric locomotives. By the late 70’s the GG1 were end of life. The other main electric locomotives Conrail used, E33s and E44s, had transformers that used oil that contained PCB. PCB are known to cause long term health issues and were banned by the EPA in the 1970’s. Conrail had debated rebuilding the E44s which was very costly due to having to flush the transformers and dispose of the PCB laced oil. Conrail had also looked to EMD for possible replacement locomotives and EMD build two demonstration models. However by this time Amtrak had raised the rates they were charging Conrail for use of electric power. This in connection with the end of the oil crisis caused Conrail to discontinue the use of electric locomotives. As for Potomac Yard, there were several reasons why the yard closed down in 1992. In your video you stated the yard closed in 1989, operations were consolidated into a smaller yard by that point. At Pot Yard, as us long time railfans called it, was a major interchange point between Southern Railway and Conrail. Up until the mid 80’s Conrail trains would use the NEC to get from Baltimore to Pot Yard. Amtrak had started to become more hostile to Conrail using their track at the time. The catalyst that push Amtrak to practically ban Conrail from their tracks was the tragic Chase, MD derailment. This forced Conrail to use the B&O to get from Pot Yard and Baltimore until Norfolk Southern reached a deal to interchange trains in Harrisburg, PA. Please check out the RF&P Historical Society. We are a dedicated group who are working to preserve the history of the RF&P.

[@davidpowell3347]

I understand that Potomac Yard was still economically viable and useful but that the land value had become so high that the owner (a Railroad Retirement Fund and part of the R F and P which was actually owned by other railroad companies?) came to believe that the Yard was worth more as land to be sold rather than as a working facility ? When Potomac Yard went out of commission did R F and P become part of CSX or was it already a division of CSX ?

[@matttjaden]

@@davidpowell3347 when the Virginia retirement system decided to sell their stock it basically sold off the railroad to CSX and the RF&P basically became a real estate company. What was once undesirable land became worth millions. Most of the yard was removed in 1992 but a few yard tracks remained for block swapping between road trains. CSX moved the mainline from the western part of the yard to its current alignment back in the mid 90’s. This was done to eliminate the need for grade crossings. As part of this project Driggs Construction Company was contracted to remove the top six feet of dirt from the site as it was considered contaminated. Fresh fill dirt was brought in to replace the soil that was removed. One this was completed development started by the late 90’s.

[@alexdhall]

Now that I think of it...and if I still have the magazines. They started the process in 1989. I swear they demolished the....control tower? Also I've heard the GG1's used PCBs in their transformers. Probably another nail the coffin for keeping those running.....😿

[@CodeScrubber]

Another nail in the coffin of Conrail's freight operations was the route rationalization going on at the time. In Pa., The major electrified freight route from Harrisburg to Trenton (the Atglen and Susquehanna and the Trenton cutoff) had few online customers when compared with Reading - Lehigh Valley route. It didn't make economic sense to keep both as through routes at the time. Portions of the PRR lines were connected to their former competitors to make a more compact system. To the east of Trenton, electrified freight needed to use the NEC for some distance.

[@SHKarlson]

@@davidpowell3347 I forget exactly when RF&P became part of CSX, but when it did, that made running freight trains through Washington without classifying cars a lot easier. Potomac Yard had little commercial value thereafter.

[@gezag.hanniker1940]

A couple of things to mention… not only Pot Yard was dismantled but another big yard was as well… that yard is the N & W yard in Alexandria. Also there is a very good book I would recommend for learning about railway electrification.. it’s called … “When the Steam Railways Electrified “ by William D Middleton .. 2nd edition.

[@Thom-TRA]

You’re the second one to recommend that book!!

[@Linflas]

I attended elementary school 1 block up from the Fruit Growers Express yard in Alexandria. All day we would hear them switching and moving cars around with the little switchers they used there.

[@xXBlueSheepXx]

This is one of those things I've always noticed about DC but never thought about deeply. Thanks for making this video.

[@Thom-TRA]

I like to be the giver of random information

[@DanHominem]

This was actually incredibly educational. As a rail fan new to DC myself, this was a very good resource for me.

[@Thom-TRA]

Glad it was helpful!

[@alexdhall]

Long term resident of NoVA. I remember bits and pieces about Potomac Yard (I was quite young when they started demolishing that yard). Glad you put together a detailed video on it. I vaguely remember as a kid asking my father about those same abandoned catenaries at L'Efant Plaza station...

[@WhatsInAName222]

I really enjoyed the video. I live in the DC area and my son and I are train buffs. We have seen the remnants of the old electrification and wondered whatever happened to the trains that used them. Well, now we know. Thanks a lot of the effort to research and photography all the key points in the network. I’ll be taking the metro from Reston to new Carrollton next week and I’ll keep an eye out of the freight tracks and NEC tracks during the trip. Thanks again.

[@pickled51]

Thank you Thom for an excellent video. I often wondered why electifrication stopped in DC and did not extend further south into Virginia towards Richmond. And having lived along the NE Corridor in NJ as a youngster, I remember back in the late 1950's and early 1960's freight trains running on the Pennsy hauled by electric locomotives. This was while waiting with my parents for next local self propelled electrified Pennsy train at the station in Iselin, NJ (now superseded by the Metropark station next to the Garden State Parkway).

[@Thom-TRA]

I passed through your old stomping grounds on the Acela yesterday?

[@Rovan84127]

I was just fiddling around in Google Maps a few weeks ago trying to find out where the Landover subdivision was going after it split from the NEC! Glad to see you tackle this subject in detail, Thom.

[@Thom-TRA]

Yep, it’s barely noticeable!

[@lennyhendricks4628]

Nice dreams people - don't get me wrong, but who is going to pay for this? We can't even get the money out of the feds to install constant tension catenary from DC to New Haven (where and why is there constant tension catenary? Look it up!) and you want to electrify not only to Richmond (THAT MIGHT be doable in an ideal world), But Norfolk, Roanoke, Raleigh and Charlotte. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see it, but dream on. For now, just concentrate on DC to Richmond. But first fix the tunnels and the old catenary.

[@Thom-TRA]

@@lennyhendricks4628 and what exactly are you responding to?

[@lennyhendricks4628]

@@Thom-TRA -- things like this: @brycebundens6866 21 hours ago Electrify the NE corridor all the way to Richmond!!!! I hope we all can make it happen soon!!!! Excellent video, it’s a documentary that was sorely needed about all of the city’s former railways. There is so much old ROW ready for new Metro lines, light rail, and streetcars!!! and this: @sammymarrco47 20 hours ago Virginia electrification to Roanoke too, Manassas line FTW and other similar posts. -- also to expand on my post, IIRC, the State of Virginia paid CSX for a third main DC to Richmond (a long time ago), so the State of Virginia might have an electrification clause in that agreement -- and if so, there is your logical initial electrification project south of DC. Do that & see how it works, then build consensus to carry it father, likely with the government paying for more third mains. Win-Win.

[@BJRyan-bw4ny]

Love that you're getting into more documentary-style content! This was a great, really well-researched story.

[@Thom-TRA]

Thanks, more to come!

[@dexteralexander2437]

A fascinating history lecture clearly backed by extensive research. Plus, two Lindsey cameos and a rabbit. You made my Saturday morning, Thom.

[@Thom-TRA]

That’s my mission! :)

[@NikonF5user]

There is similar infrastructure along the "Port Road" from Perryville, MD to Enola, PA...

[@lionelmpc]

Well done and well researched video! Many (but not all) of the places that the overhead catenary poles remain on freight only lines are due to them carrying some part of the former Pennsylvania Railroad power transmission and distribution network. The Pennsy used 25-cycle AC which is not directly compatible with the 60-cycle grid, so they built their own transmission network. Amtrak has never upgraded the system to 60-cycle, which I assume is due mainly to the two Amtrak scheduled 25-cycle hydro power generators located at the Safe Harbor Dam on the Susquehanna River. When the line was de-electrified south of Union Station it led to serious power instability in the overhead wires located around the station. Amtrak had to install another power feed to fix the problem. The beginning of the end of electric freight on Conrail was when the Northeast Corridor was transferred from Penn Central to Amtrak in 1976. While PC freight was on home rails Conrail found itself only a tenant. Amtrak wanted the through freights off the corridor and charged ever higher fees to use it's track. It got so expensive that Conrail decided to re-route as much freight off of the corridor as possible. Without the main "spine" of the corridor (and the Philly-Harrisburg Keystone main line also owned by Amtrak) it left a handful of disconnected electrified secondary lines that no longer made any sense. Conrail de-electrified completely by 1983, with the remaining freight trains that had to run on the corridor being diesel powered ever since.

[@Thom-TRA]

So is that when Conrail started using the old B&O more (through Bound Brook, West Trenton, and Camden)?

[@JessicaKasumi1990]

And that was in my opinion and excuse my French, a dick move by Amtrak. Amtrak should have compromised with Conrail or given Conrail ownership of the electrification.

[@lionelmpc]

@@Thom-TRA I don't know, but it sounds likely. I'm not nearly as familiar with what happened on the south end. The Keystone line is my main interest, but it's all related as it all happened at the same time for the same reason. It was around that time that Conrail re-routed most of the Philadelphia-Harrisburg traffic onto the former Reading main line, leading to abandonment of the Atglen & Susquehanna (the Enola Low Grade line) and the wires coming down on the former Columbia & Port Deposit between Perryville and Enola (across the river from Harrisburg) as well as the Columbia Secondary and the Royalton branch. One other interesting point, Conrail did a study on extending the electrification from Harrisburg to Pittsburgh in the late 70s. It can be found online with a little searching. Amtrak indirectly killed that idea before it even had a chance. One has to wonder what would've happened differently if Amtrak had stayed a tenant and the corridor had gone to Conrail, but we'll never know.

[@alexdhall]

​@@JessicaKasumi1990If that happened, then CSX would of had control of the electrification of the northeast corridor. Based on their recent track record....I think it's better that Amtrak kicked them off. Dedicated trackage to passenger trains is a good thing. Besides railroads like CSX today don't give priority to Amtrak, nor give a 💩 about maintaining their infrastructure...

[@CodeScrubber]

@@Thom-TRA Yep. Up until the NS-CSX split. The old B&O/Reading/CNJ "Royal Route" does not go thru Camden, but thru Northeast Philly eventually crossing the Delaware at Yardley, Pa. At the split, CSX got the West Trenton line. NS routes all Philly area - North Jersey freight thru Reading and Allentown. Conrail (Shared Assets) begins at Manville/Bound Brook.

[@YuukariShishome]

as a fellow DC area resident and train enthusiast, i love hearing about all the stuff around here. i hope your just as excited about the purple line as i am!

[@davinp]

In the future, VRE plans to build a new L'Enfant Plaza station with 2 platforms. This will be needed when MARC trains go to Alexandria, VA

[@edwardloomis887]

@davinp , which MARC lines would go to Alexandria? Penn, Camden, Brunswick, or all of the above? That would be a great option for MDers or VAers who have to take a new job across the river, don't want to drive and live close to MARC and VRE.

[@davinp]

@@edwardloomis887 I don't know. No specifics as that is way in the future. However, you can use your MARC ticket on VRE and vise versa as MARC has reinstated their cross honor agreement with VRE

[@chief1b]

@@edwardloomis887 For me I would like to see a big commuter network where MARC would go to Delaware on SEPTA tracks and VRE on MARC tracks. Let's go big and think BIG

[@intrepidfox37]

@@chief1b Exactly. Its so obvious to connect the systems, just like NJT and SEPTA connect in Trenton. Or Metro North and CT Rail in New Haven. Connect it all!

[@arthure.petersenjr.8089]

@@chief1b MARC's Penn Line runs on Amtrak's Northeast Corridor (NEC) as does SEPTA' s service to Delaware. Neither own those tracks. Out of Union Station, VRE uses CSX tracks to Alexandria where the Manasass line splits off to run on Norfolk Southern.

[@billlauretti7963]

Great video, Thom! I used to live in the DC area and would love to see a future video about the interurban line that connected Washington, Annapolis and Baltimore.

[@johnchambers8528]

Thanks for this interesting video. It gave me some history about the Pennsylvania Railroad and why it terminated in Alexander’s, VA. I remember how big that yard was while riding trains to Florida. The modern mergers basically made the yard at Alexandra obsolete as the trains could be made up elsewhere and run through to the northeast or other points. Conrail caused most of that freight electric trackage to be abandoned due to the preference of not having to change to electric engines just to serve the old PRR freight lines. Also a lot of the old engines were needing replacement and it reduced costs to maintain the limited electric freight lines.

[@RABSTRAINS]

OUTSTANDING! You are very good at creating educational railroad history videos! GREAT JOB!

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you!!

[@bryceknowles1380]

CTA’s Yellow Line still has the electric overhead towers for the electric wires. Today, it no longer has overhead electric power and instead runs on a third rail. As a CTA fan that wasn’t born back in the old days, it sucks that I didn’t get to experience the system in its prime. The Yellow Line, formerly The North Shore Line, initially ran to Milwaukee Wisconsin and Lake Bluff Chicago. Today the only line that runs to Wisconsin is Metra’s UP North Line and Amtrack’s Hiawatha Service. Now, if the NSL were still in service today, of course, given the lack of overhead wires it would have to rely on a third-rail. Back in the day the line terminated at Roosevelt Road, but should it be revived today I’d make Howard the terminal station, and have it run express to downtown. From Howard it would follow it former route along the Yellow Line(new tracks would need to be built) and new cars would be built to. Given that most of these areas would be off the beaten path for Metra, I’d think having the line would allow for faster to downtown. The fact that the only interurban network in Chicago that’s still around is the South Shore Line sucks.

[@Thom-TRA]

What I would give to see the north shore line still in service…

[@bryceknowles1380]

@@Thom-TRA That and the Chicago Aurora Elgin railway as well

[@doomsdayrabbit4398]

​@@bryceknowles1380RIP CA&E.

[@jaymorgenthal9479]

@@bryceknowles1380 The CTA yellow line ( Skokie Swift) was a project funded by the US Government in 1964 .

[@SHKarlson]

Oh, you missed the most spectacular part of the North Shore Line, which was the Electroliner crews putting the trolley poles on the wire near Crawford Ave. at speed. They even did that on rainy and snowy nights. Motorman shuts off, collector raises rear pole and buzzes the motorman, conductor raises the front pole and buzzes the motorman, motorman takes power. Oh, the motorman also has to be sounding the horn for the level crossings!

[@LMHPhilly]

Terrific and thoughtful video. Great presentation.

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you kindly!

[@lizzy7393]

23:28 While Conrail did deelectrify their lines around that time, it wasn't until CSX was looking to run double stack container freight that most of the wires and whatnot were actually removed. Conrail and later CSX just ran their freight under the abandoned catenary for decades, never seeing the need to waste labor and interrupt service to remove the disused infrastructure until it was actually in the way. You'll also notice that some of the poles have visible evidence of their cross members having been removed, which also came down at that late date. The catenary infrastructure on the Long Bridge, other than the wires themselves, were removed years later. You can still see the stumps of the poles on the bridge supports if you look from the adjacent Metro yellow line bridge, as well as a few surviving poles with other cables still attached just into Virginia. There also remains some other poles in Arlington.

[@mmi16]

I am not sure, but I believe various utilities - electric, telephone, cable TV etc. have wire line agreements with CSX and are using the former catenary towers for their own business purposes.

[@lizzy7393]

​@@mmi16 That, too. But the actual running wires were more or less intact well into the early 2000s. Growing up in the area, I used to ride the Metro up and down just to examine what was still there as a teenager, as well as explore on the ground.

[@Hurricane-Holla]

When I first spotted your railroad video, I was intrigued by the possible answers as to why there is such a mismatch in our country's approach to powering our railroads. I was captivated by how much background information and location filming you compiled for this video. Not only are your videos are professionally well done, but you are also an informed host making your videos are a capsule to history. I can't wait to watch more.

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you so much!

[@tootired76]

Well done. I appreciate the work you put into this!

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you!

[@pettahify]

Awesome video!!! Yes, we in the rest of the world do wonder why the us has such a small amount of electrified railways. Sure electrification does introduce more failure points, but if everything is maintained properly its fine. That's the only drawback electrification has . But it does have insane benefits. Just caugh up the money to introduce it, you will make up for it in the long term.

[@jimfarmer7811]

The electrical supply system is very expensive to maintain. If it was cost effective to electrify the railroads don't you think the railroads would have done it already?

[@SHKarlson]

@@jimfarmer7811 Yes, in fact several of the Western carriers have looked at the possibility. There was a reason The Milwaukee Road came up with a way to control diesels from the Little Joe electrics. Multiple three Joes and the substations tripped out.

[@RichardWilliams-o2u]

Great job on this video Thom. As a long time railfan who grew up along the Northeast Corridor (will always be the Pennsy to me) I knew most of what you discovered, but was very interesting to see it all put together in a cohesive unit.

[@j2themac778]

I grew up just a few blocks away from Potomac Yard, in the 70's and 80's those towers still had catenary and signs posted indicating where the electric power ended to alert the engineers.

[@MrCateagle]

For a fair bit of history on this, see William D. Middleton's "When the Steam Railroads Electrified". It is a fascinating book and I recommend it. Bad blood between the B&O and the PRR was definitely evident at the 1894 Columbian Exposition in Chicago.

[@Thom-TRA]

I’ll have to see if my local library has it!

[@SHKarlson]

@@Thom-TRA If it doesn't, maybe interlibrary loan will help you, or Indiana University Press has the revised edition in print, or perhaps the used book store at a preservation railway had one come in!

[@robtman9199]

Having lived around here all my life, I knew quite a bit of the history, but you cleared up so many small and larger details. What an awesome video and wish you the best and many more.

[@Thom-TRA]

This is high praise! The B&O logo is your profile picture!

[@johncamp2567]

The de-electrification was sped up by a Fourth of July fatality in the late ‘80’s, when someone, seeking a better view of Washington’s fireworks, climbed atop a boxcar and made deadly contact with the wire.

[@Thom-TRA]

Ouch that’s tragic

[@evanstauffer4470]

By that time, CR had turned off the power in their catenary. I'm not familiar with that incident, but if the catenary was "hot", it must have belonged to Amtrak or one of the commuter railroads [SEPTA, etc.] In some cases, Amtrak continued to use the high-voltage transmission lines [higher up on the support poles] of CR to transmit power between their various lines. However, there is no way someone could have reached those lines from the top of a rail car.

[@timothynoel786]

Loved your comment about the food trucks!! Great job, as always and informative!!

[@cliffmclane6271]

That was very interesting. I know, that Pennsylvania Railroad had a powerful elctric engine in that time. Now i know, why.

[@Thom-TRA]

I’d love to see a comeback

[@helgakrobo]

"why does DC have so much abandoned electrification?" because they're switching to AC!

[@Thom-TRA]

Ha ha

[@CoffeeAndPaul]

Quick note about DC squirrels: DC has black squirrels in addition to the typical American grey squirrel. The Canadians were sad that squirrels around the Nation's Capital had been hunted or otherwise killed to local extinction so they grabbed some squirrels from parks in Ontario, took them to DC, & released them around the Capitol Mall area & the National Zoo. Like trains, the Potomac was like a barrier for the black squirrel but somehow they've made the leap across the River & are in Northern Virginia 🐿️🐿️!

[@Thom-TRA]

Okay, there’s a black squirrel in a tree near my apartment, but I had no idea he was CANADIAN?? 🇨🇦🇨🇦

[@GENIUSA1A]

I’ve also seen Albano squirrels in DC

[@Linflas]

I used to see some of those black squirrels when I worked in DC and walked from 18th and F over to the slug line on 14th street. I didn't know they had made it in to Virginia.

[@FrankHghTwr]

@@Thom-TRA don't be silly, he's a 122nd-generation immigrant!

[@cfjohnson7369]

Canadian spy squirrels?

[@WA1LBK]

Good historical research, with a minor omission; when the PRR electrified the freight trackage, all non-electrified trains were steam- hauled. New York City banned the operation of steam locomotives into the city after a train wreck on the New Haven RR (2 passenger trains collided, the engineer of the 2nd train couldn’t see a red signal protecting the rear end of the first due to smoke & steam buildup in the Park Avenue tunnel, & hit it, with many fatalities). I believe the ban was effective in 1907, if I remember correctly. This forced the steam railroads to electrify any trackage entering New York City, & pushed electrification technology. PRR initially used 600 volt DC with third rail on a relatively short stretch between Penn Station, through the Hudson River Tunnels, & ending at a station in New Jersey appropriately named “Manhattan Transfer”, where the DC electrics handed off their trains to steam locomotives, & vice-versa. The New Haven pioneered high-voltage AC electrification (11,000 volts, 25 Hz. AC) between Stamford, CT & New York City; PRR eventually adopted the New Haven standard when they electrified their NYC - Washington DC line & their line to Harrisburg, PA as well. Smoke abatement in urban Washington was probably a consideration as well, using electric switch locomotives instead of steam switchers. By the way, the proper term for what you’re referring to as “portals” is “catenary towers”. 😊 Still very good video with great research!

[@Thom-TRA]

They can also be called portals and I prefer using terms that a broader audience will understand.

[@RealConstructor]

As far as I know they’re called portals if they exist of two poles with a beam between them over the tracks. With one pillar it is called a catenary pole or catenary mast on either side of the track. At least that’s what they were called when I worked at a rail construction company in my country.

[@TheLewistownTrainspotter8102]

For thos who are interested, Manhattan Transfer was not around Secaucus Junction, but in fact was just east of Harrison station, near where the PATH tracks diverge from the Northeast Corridor to travel east towards Journal Square.

[@annenelson5656]

Way back in the 1970s there was a train yard in New Haven, Connecticut where they switched diesel to electric and vice versa. It was a great train yard filled with GG-1s and older EMD E and F locomotives that were still in service. Amtrak was running EMD F-40PH’s then as well. I was in my early 20s and kind of broke so I don’t have many photos of the train yard and equipment but it was happy times that I got to spend there. I don’t imagine it’s still there.

[@dock_yard1149]

Passenger loco changes were done AT New Haven station up until about 20 years ago when the electrification was extended up to Boston. The yard you’re thinking of was 3-4 miles outside of NH, it was Cedar Hill Yard and it was indeed huge. But it was all freight, no passenger trains cut through Cedar Hill, and technically no loco changes were done there since al freight trains terminated there. A small portion of CHY still exists in North Haven, serving CSX, P&W, CSO railroads.

[@SHKarlson]

There still is an intensive coach yard by the New Haven rail station where the Metro North cars lay over, but the pocket tracks required to swap out the motors have mostly gone away. North of the station, between the Springfield line and the Providence line is what remains of the Cedar Hill freight yards, also the dead line for superfluous motive power, but with the gross regional product of New England shipping out in lobster barrels and jump drives these days, there aren't the potato and paper cars from the Aroostook or the textiles from the Boston area to sort out for forwarding to Maybrook or the car floats any more. Moreover, once New Haven became part of Penn Central, the Cedar Hill freight got sent to Selkirk on the old Boston and Albany ...

[@jackrussell3753]

As a DC native and avid rail fan, I never knew this. Thanks for sharing the history!

[@Thom-TRA]

You’re welcome!

[@sammymarrco47]

Such a great video, I learned alot about my own backyard!

[@johntitterton4840]

Often overlooked is the economics of running a railroad, often looking at the effect and not the cause. Electrification is incredibly capital intensive, only makes sense in very high density corridors and requires an entirely new union craft to maintain the overhead wires. PC and later Conrail struggled to earn their cost of capital to invest and rehabilitate their infrastructure, had 1930's era electric locomotives dripping PCB's and needed replacement, had declining traffic density and needed to shed labor cost to achieve profitability.

[@luddite4change449]

I always come back to this when I am asked by European colleagues about the used of rail in each region. In Europe people move by rail and cargo on roads, in the US it is the reverse. Running electric trains from Pittsburg to San Francisco is just not economically practical.

[@barvdw]

Sure, not every railway line needs to be electrified, but the tipping point on when it is useful is probably closer than you think. Quite a few lines in Virginia already see quite high frequencies of very long and heavy trains, making a pretty good business case. Maybe not until NOLA or MIA, but RVM seems perfectly doable and worth the investment.

[@ethanlamoureux5306]

@@luddite4change449 It’s much more economical to run freight by rail, and people like the freedom of individual transportation by private automobile. However, when the roads get choked with too many vehicles, especially large trucks, cars become inconvenient and more people begin to prefer trains. Most likely the highways in Europe are very congested if all the freight is shipped that way, so people like to take the train. Freight and passenger rail don’t coexist very well, which is why there needs to be more tracks to allow dedicated service for each. This is what Florida East Coast and Brightline have done, they double tracked the FEC rails and run Brightline trains on one track and FEC freight on the other. I remember seeing videos about a new rail line built on old abandoned rail bed in Scotland. The line was originally double tracked, but the new one was built single to save money. There is not enough capacity to handle both passenger and freight trains, so it only gets used for passenger trains and the freight continues on trucks. This brings up the issue of government subsidies on trucking which gives trucking an artificial advantage over rail freight. Freight railroads have to build and maintain their own tracks, while trucking companies get the roads built and maintained for them almost for free. Yet if there were no trucks, the cost of maintaining a road network would be much less because trucks cause more than 90% of the damage to roads and bridges, yet only pay a tiny percentage of the cost. What would happen if we transferred 90% of the cost of road maintenance to the trucking companies? I dare say the railroads would experience a renaissance.

[@luddite4change449]

@@ethanlamoureux5306 There is definately a place for both. I and others still have to get to a boarding point for the train. It then becomes a question of marginal cost in terms of time and money, especially if you are charging me a large fee to park my car at the train/metro terminal.

[@SHKarlson]

In addition, the demand on power stations from U.S. style freight railroads is serious. The Milwaukee Road came up with those diesels controlled from the Little Joes because you couldn't multiple more than two of them without overloading the substations, particularly if there was a set of the older boxcabs pushing in the middle.

[@rikkichunn8856]

If anyone really wants to see lots of abandoned catenary, visit Cleveland! The tracks to Cleveland's Union Terminal came in underground, so they had to be electrified. Trains dropped their steam engines just outside of the tunnel system and hooked on electric locomotives to pull into the terminal. Then after stopping there, they had to turn the entire train around to pull out of the terminal to continue on their way. When they got to the end of the tunnel system on the other side of the city, the electric locomotive was unhooked and a new steam engine took over for the rest of the trip. The terminal was also designed to handle electric interurbans too, but by the time it opened, the only remaining interurban was the Shaker Heights Rapid Transit (today's RTA green and blue lines). Today, the Rapid (green, blue, and red lines) are the only trains serving the old station. Amtrak has its own station over by the lake front, a facility that wouldn't even do a suburb proud! Visitors to the old terminal are amazed how much unused space there is in it.

[@Thom-TRA]

I hope to visit Cleveland sometime soon!

[@buildintotrains]

Looking forward to a video about the W&OD! During filming, make sure to stop at the Vienna railway station that is now home to the Northern Virginia Model Railroaders 😃

[@Thom-TRA]

Absolutely! I’ve biked parts of the trail, love it.

[@buildintotrains]

@@Thom-TRA If you ever visit the NVMR, the station's open from 5 PM til around 9 PM every Tuesday. We'd love to see you come by!

[@tommy2845]

Down with ARSLink, bring back Amtrak

[@AmericanTrainRailfan]

@tommy2845 Ur really still mad about that?

[@29downtheline]

Y’all have an amazing layout in Vienna!

[@plequere]

Fantastic work, Thom. I love the direction the channel is taking. Well researched and well narrated. Thank you!!

[@Thom-TRA]

Thanks! What aspects of the direction specifically do you appreciate?

[@plequere]

@@Thom-TRA I love the increased focus on railroad history, the technical details, and overall more in-depth research that went into your recent videos. Reviews (seat comfort and whatnot) are always fun to watch, but it's your more in-depth content that makes you truly shine :)

[@nathreed]

More DC rail history please! This was great!

[@Thom-TRA]

Already working on a big project about the streetcars!

[@Bratsbergbanen1]

Thom, you always make incredibly well-researched videos, but you really outdid yourself this time! It's always a pleasure to watch your channel!

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you so much! I’m glad people seem to be enjoying this!

[@SubaruAmbassadorRobert]

Just so you know, over 70% of the US rail network (compared to our heyday in rail) is dismantled or abandoned, and much of what's left abandoned has fallen into severe disrepair, and/or been encroached upon by others who've taken it over after it was abandoned.

[@Thom-TRA]

Yep it’s sad

[@SubaruAmbassadorRobert]

@@Thom-TRA love your channel, btw.

[@Thom-TRA]

@@SubaruAmbassadorRobert thanks!

[@alexdhall]

Yep. Part of the W&O trackage became a very popular bike trail decades later: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_and_Old_Dominion_Railroad_Regional_Park?wprov=sfla1

[@lemapp]

In the 1970's, to save on taxes, 1 of the two sets of tracks from Richmond to Newport News were removed. This means that only one train can travel through that long corridor at any given time. The VP who made that decision was fired. They still haven't restored the missing set of tracks. Like Norfolk, Newport News is a major East Coast seaport. Lots of cargo like coal travels on this segment of track. I think that CSX is hoping Virginia or the Federal Government will rebuild the missing tracks.

[@tomquinn1192]

Fascinating history. Thanks for all the research and hard work!

[@Thom-TRA]

My pleasure!

[@josephpadula2283]

Annapolis MD was the only state Capitol in the U.S. without train service ! It was served by two interurbans , one from Baltimore , the other from DC . The Dc line ended near the Annapolis mall . You should do a video on those lines !

[@Thom-TRA]

I’m always looking for an excuse to go to Annapolis!

[@josephpadula2283]

@@Thom-TRA There is a silent movie about the naval academy. I saw once that shows the Midshipman on the inter urban . It was kind of like a gallery car split level .

[@josephpadula2283]

@@Thom-TRA Car 50 in the link trolleytime.blogspot.com/2020/08/washington-baltimore-and-annapolis.html?m=1

[@randomsource]

nice historic video, it was quite a thrill to see the hump yard in Potomac as well as the the mainline parallel and adjacent to US Route 1. When the Potomac Yard was dismantled the mainline was relocated closer to the GW Parkway to make room for the massive development that you see now. Across the Anacostia, it would be great to see the PRR's juicejacks namely the GG1's and the EPA Rectifiers which were laid up there in preparation for their next run. The juicejacks brought the freights into Potomac Yard where cars were reassigned for routes South.

[@Thom-TRA]

So much interesting history!

[@danielwaitzman2118]

The word you want is “gantries”, not “portals”, for the support of the electric catenary. Thank you for your informative presentation.

[@Thom-TRA]

Portals are a type of gantry, it’s a perfectly acceptable term.

[@danielwaitzman2118]

@@Thom-TRA Well then, I stand corrected. But I could not find such a definition of “portal” in the dictionary.

[@Thom-TRA]

@@danielwaitzman2118 I believe it’s a term more commonly used in British English

[@douglasengle2704]

Thank you for describing the railroad history of the Washington DC Potomac history! I grew up in Vienna VA with my dad being a bit of a passenger train railroad fan. I was fascinated by the catenary wire coming down into Alexandria. I may have seen a GG1 pulling freight. I'd thought that would have been at the Alexandria passenger station, but an X railroad employee informed me "the wire" didn't go that far south. The NEC handled freight traffic in the 1970s which Amtrak has greatly discouraged. Fast accelerating and fast running freight made possible with GG1 electric locomotives cleared the tracks quickly. It maybe they were not suppose to run freight at 100 mph, but it appears that was common. A GG1 is rated at 100 mph, but that is likely when pulling freight. I had a GG1 freshly restored by a railroad club, which it may have had a lot of upgrades, in June 1981 on the Broadway Limited going south. South of Wilmington DE I timed a mile at 22-1/2 seconds that is 160 mph! My ears would pop going under bridges. I think it was a special run because we were given priority over all other passenger trains passing Metroliner service with nearly a 50 mph higher speed. Billboards were a blur. Amtrak's long term goals, possibly very long term goals, for the NEC is for it to be 220 mph high speed rail and double stack freight. A lot of deep bore tunnels could accomplish that likely with four track mainline. The "Broadway" of four tracks is what the Pennsylvania railroad was famous for. I'm of the opinion that by the mid 2040s double width 8 meter wide tri-level 1,000 kph (621 mph) maglev trains will be a strong possibility able to carry large assemblies across land easily with average travel speeds being about 400 mph allowing such a train to cross the US 3200 miles in about 8 hours. No vacuum tunnels. People would have vista dome cars enabling watching the scenery. There is little benefit at traveling at super sonic speeds when stopping about every 100 miles. At 1,000 kph (621 mph) running speeds with slowing down and speeding up those stops are only a bit over 10 minutes apart. The first level would likely be good for roll-on roll-off cargo simultaneously from the sides which could include motor vehicles in a 1 minute stop. The Chinese are prototyping a nearly 4 meter wide loading gauge maglev at 600 kph with goals of 800 kph. This is a self levitating train needing no landing gear. It's hard to believe the US freight rail was not harmed by removal the Potomac railroad yard. It was big. It really needed a railroad viewing park because there was no easy way to view its activities. Much of it was behind sight obstructions. Crossing over it on a highway bridge was one of the few ways to get a glimpse of it. The Four Mile Run bike path crossed under the Potomac railroad yard and it was a long under bridge distance! There was no place to go topside to see the railroad activity. It connected with the Mount Vernon bike path on the Potomac River side of the railroad yard. The area I think has improved. Back in the 1980s I would of been uncomfortable walking that distance from a personal security standpoint and was very glad to pass through it quickly on a bicycle. The B&O railroad built the Metropolitan Southern from the B&O Metropolitan Branch at Silver Spring starting in 1892 to cross the Potomac about 1/2 mile west of Chain Bridge on a high bridge. This is more commonly known as the Georgetown Branch now the Capital Crescent Trail. It had two other incorporate railroads making it up as it went further to run on the streets in Georgetown. I came up with the term Rail-Trail to promote preserving the mainline rail alignment as a paved bicycle path for this rail-to-trail conversion. I designed and put up all the mile makers that are within a foot of the actual railroad milages. Mile maker 8.5 is about 2-1/2 feet off. This railroad is discussed in the "Impossible Challenge". In the winter time with the foliage down some work on the Potomac River bridge abutments maybe seen. Instead of veering towards Georgetown on the 10° curve continue straight and look a bit to the West. This is off the Georgetown Branch corridor lands. Going down the slope fairly quickly the land is National Park Service part of the Parkway corridor. Up higher it is Dalecarlia water works land and those people falsely represented themselves as owing the railroad real estate in order to get control of the land and built the flyover bridge the trail was forced on to. As part of the deal the plans were for a 14-foot wide concrete decking of the railroad bridge over the Cabin John Trolley line now filled in. Dalecarlia pulled out funding after getting their grade separated crossing and started promoting "they'd given us a bridge". There is nothing honorable about these people and they operate largely outside the law.

[@alexdhall]

Wait...what happened to that restored GG1? They were able to clean out the PCBs they had...or not?

[@johnp1937]

Through the 1980s Potomac Yard was critical to the supply of frozen concentrated orange juice, then an important food staple in America. The Tropicana juice trains from Florida used insulated boxcars to keep the juice fresh. At Potomac Yard, the Penn Central took over and the juice made its way to New Jersey for distribution. Through the 90s, you could see Tropicana boxcars parked in Potomac Yard. The whole area was a sea of electric wires until the 90s when the area was finally redeveloped into a Cinema with stadium seating and a Barnes and Noble along with other stores.

[@barryrobinson1041]

Myself a Pennsy rail fan and knew the story of Pot Yard. Been to that Barnes and Noble and shops there about a year and a half ago. You wouldn't know there was a massive freight yard there unless you knew what to look for. Great video!

[@Thom-TRA]

I still catch a few juice train cars coming through the city

[@alexdhall]

I'm pretty sure as a kid in the 90s there were still trains with plenty of Tropicana trains. Since CSX had control of that trackage, there wasn't much of a need for a yard (just as described in the video)...

[@alexdhall]

​@@barryrobinson1041It took them a while to build that into what it is now. Learned later it was declared a Superfund site. Explains why it took decades to build up.

[@kitchin2]

The juice trains are still seen in the Ashland railcam on KZbin. Just ask people there when’s a good time to watch for them.

[@ck4426]

This historical masterpiece of train and railroad history was awesome!!! If you aren’t already a history professor, you should consider that profession. Your attention to detail and explanations and illustrations were truly awesome!!!

[@Thom-TRA]

Haha, if my current career path doesn’t work out, I know what to fall back on!

[@stanhry]

Had a feeling ConRail was a fault for removing the wires.

[@Thom-TRA]

That sinking feeling

[@SHKarlson]

Yes, in part that was a consequence of Conrail moving the freight traffic east of Harrisburg off the former Pennsylvania Railroad to the Reading tracks, which were never wired for freight. Therefore. there's a lot of the bare poles where the wires used to be along former Pennsylvania Railroad freight bypasses in New Jersey and Pennsylvania. Some of those can be gotten to on the SEPTA dinkies or the Harrisburg trains on Amtrak.

[@29downtheline]

Amazing video! All that research certainly paid off! When you talked about electrification on the Virginia side of the Potomac, I thought of the W&OD, which was, for a time, electrified! I really wish this line still existed, since it would be such a useful transportation link for Loudoun and Fairfax Counties today (and yes, the W&OD Trail is nice, but the trail could have simply been built next to the rail line)!

[@Thom-TRA]

I read an interesting Greater Greater Washington article about restoring commuter rail on that line

[@29downtheline]

@@Thom-TRA West of I-66, the right of way is mostly intact! It gets a little dicey in and around Paeonian Springs, west of Leesburg, but I doubt they’d run this theoretical line beyond Leesburg. I actually wouldn’t have minded if the Silver Line went up the W&OD from Reston, through Herndon, Sterling, Ashburn, and Leesburg (it would sadly miss IAD, so I understand why they built it further south). It’s too bad WMATA never bought the right of way, because the W&OD is still more central to where people live in that part of Northern Virginia!

[@Northern_Idaho]

As a train and history nerd, this majorly fueled my autism

[@Thom-TRA]

Haha fuel on the fire I guess

[@ViewpointUnique]

This is very well done and informative! I knew the answer already but still learned a lot of new info due to your diligent research. Great job!

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you!

[@davinp]

Yes, Virginia & Maryland are not considered the northeast. They are considered the Mid-Atlantic states. Virginia could be considered a south state

[@josephpadula2283]

Robert e Lee might have agreed it was a Southern State at least ….

[@samlogan8096]

Excellent work. Technically, there were two lines of the PRR which were located south of Potomac Yards, one to Popes Creek, MD, the other to Cape Charles, VA (across the Chesapeake Bay from Hampton Roads/Norfolk). However, they would carry much less traffic than Potomac Yards.

[@Thom-TRA]

Well, yes. I meant of the main trunk section of course.

[@paulw.woodring7304]

Nice job, Thom. I was watching this thinking at first, "well you could have just asked me", about the history of this, but you did find a couple of things I wasn't totally clear on. I was in DC on a school trip in the mid-1970s and saw a set of PRR (PC) E44 electrics crossing the Long Bridge from a tour bus Somewhere I have a really bad photo of them (hard to believe GG1s went that far). Into the early 2000s you could still see the polls for the electrification into Pot Yard at the south end of Crystal City, which was built while Pot Yard existed. In 1976 a few local fans arranged for a photo shoot in Pot Yard when SP 4449 in American Freedom Train livery was in town, alongside a GG1, and another rare locomotive I can't remember right now (maybe one of the Southern Crescent E units but they usually turned at Washington Terminal). I think it's out there somewhere on someone's Flicker page. The metal sign warning of the end of the overhead was still on one of the cross members right at Crystal City: "AC Motor Stop". I'm willing to bet it ended up in the collection of some fan. Interestingly, the passenger main by-pass around the yard ran alongside U. S. 1 past the yard, before they moved the remaining tracks over towards the river after they tore up the yard. The infrastructure for the electrification was torn up when the yard was sold for development, but took well over a decade, because over 50 years of motors operating into there with their PCB filled transformers, not to mention the lube oils, coal ash and Diesel fuel residue, had left the area one big Superfund cleanup site.

[@Thom-TRA]

I still make it a habit to not eat big scoop fulls of dirt when I walk around in Potomac yard

[@kjrehberg]

Potomac Yards is a major brownfield. Most of the development is retail instead of residential. I find it fascinating that they are building on top of the original bridges over the Potomac and Four Mile Run.

[@AutumnBosco]

This video was insane! I saw it a few days ago but I waited to watch it until I could sit down and pay full attention to the entire thing. This helped answer so many of my vague questions about the DC area’s rail network. Thank you!

[@Thom-TRA]

So happy to hear this!

[@paulcastillo1310]

Great video

[@Thom-TRA]

Thanks!

[@paulcastillo1310]

@@Thom-TRA your welcome

[@stevek9670]

Thank you. As a 35 year railroad employee in the NE, we do have a piece in the Northeast corridor.

[@ICEHAWKSBOII_5]

I love tra vids

[@gregng25]

This video was so well edited, researched and produced!! Love your vids

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you so much!! This made my day

[@kpdvw]

Of all the western developed Nations the US has a Rail road/Passenger Train system that is the equivalent of a typical 3rd world Country....!

[@MervynPartin]

Excellent production. I had noticed the abandoned electrification from my hotel in Arlington during my last visit. I did like the DC Union Station- magnificent.

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you! Glad I could answer a few questions!

[@jonathanbott87]

So... who was shocked by these amazing facts? Another great video!

[@Thom-TRA]

Aww thanks!

[@TheLewistownTrainspotter8102]

Abandoned catenary supports are actually a thing on the New Haven Line. If you ride that, you'll notice that while trains make the switch from overhead wire to third rail between Pelham and Mount Vernon East, the catenary poles continue until the junction with the Harlem Line (where the changeover originally took place when the New Haven Line was first electrified in 1907).

[@rickrandall3174]

Thom, I just discovered this video, and your channel, by accident this morning. You did an amazing job with this video! Deeply researched background, excellent use of maps and live video content, and excellent narration style. I was impressed! i also read through the comments on this video and noticed that several railfans that know the history of mid-Atlantic rail companies [PC, Conrail, CSX, etc.] had positive comments about your content. I subscribed, something I rarely do these days. 😄Well done, Sir.

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you!!

[@badabing7235]

Well done report. I used to know the block operators at the Virginia Ave rail interlocking tower (still there). Last of its heyday was in the 1870s to about 1986....the tower has since closed because of automation. I would see GG1 electric locomotives heading freight trains through the 14th st tunnel. Also the line was electrified going into union station via the 1st street tunnel which peels off east after the interlocking tower. I also would hitch onto a switcher engine that they let me operate (I was 14 years old at the time.... Fun times, but saw the catenary in action. In the interlock tower there was a small sign for the electrification board "danger 750 volts"...... Best of all, I was there to witness all that😊😊

[@Thom-TRA]

Sounds like great memories!

[@TheOneKEA]

Minor correction: the 1st Street Tunnels have never been electrified for their entire length. There is a small section of the tunnel south of Union Station that is electrified, but only far enough to allow electric locomotives to uncouple from their trains, pull forward to the limit of movement past ‘A’ Interlocking, and then travel back through the interlocking and into Union Station to either go to Ivy City Yard or to one of the sidings in the station, ready to be coupled to the other end of another train. These time-consuming movements will disappear when the Airo trains with their ALC-42E locomotives and APVs go into service for the Regionals and LD trains that don’t terminate at Union Station.

[@richardneidich]

Thank you Thom. Having lived in the area, it was great to now know why its the way it is with respect to trains. Please continue to tell the history of our train system, its a great lesson on what needs to be done better, especially with respect to long distance train travel.

[@Thom-TRA]

We have so much more history here than I ever realized

[@TheGAMWolferz]

Great Work Thom! Fantastic Video about the DC’s Rail history. Can’t wait to see more long-form videos about DC’s Rail and Transit past.

[@worldwide.p]

Fantastic video. Really enjoyed it. Both the history and the video itself, the editing and the narration are awesome! Congrats!

[@Thom-TRA]

Thank you so much!

[@thenoodledrop]

Oh, up in PA, we have so many formerly electrified lines. It’s a real shame, but since a lot of those old catenaries also acted as high tension wires from before a time where there was an established power grid, they’re still in use!

[@Eurobazz]

You are so thorough in your investigations Thom and this video is no exception. You would be a prime candidate working for the US Department of Transportation. You could teach them a thing or two from your European knowledge of trains and railways.

[@chriscubingclips]

Another great video Thom! Thanks for all your hard work putting it together.

[@Thom-TRA]

My pleasure! Comments like this make it worth it

[@woodalexander]

Great video! I was aware of Potomac Yard, but I did not know the earlier history of DC's railroads. It is fascinating to step throiugh it one step at a time.

[@twcfanc24]

Excellent in-depth video full of great footage, nice work

[@montemiller3447]

Please keep doing what you are doing. I'm hoping our outdated railway system can grow and improve. The needs of the East and the West may best be served by systems catered the their needs specifically.

[@stephencryan291]

I know little of US rail so found this report very interesting. It will make me delve more into the subject. Thanks a lot.

[@davidrohlader3498]

DC also had a very useful streetcar system when I was younger. For a dime you could ride from NE DC "Brookland" to the amusement park on the river upstream from Georgetown called "Glen Echo". This was diametrically opposite to Brookland, SW DC

[@jeffh5903]

What a great history of the electrification of the NE rail lines. I've never noticed the remnants of the catenary, but will look for sure now. Next time you're in Potomac Yard walk down along Four Mile Run. You can look up and see the massive steel structures that used to carry trains in and out of the yard. One of the bridges (just to the north of Total Wine) was turned into a park, but you can still see the underside. It's wild to see that many steel beams and they're crazy thick! It seems the eastern edge of what was Potomac Yard remains to this day in the form of the CSX tracks that parallel the Metro's tracks. Thanks!

[@Thom-TRA]

I love biking the four mile run! Will probably do something similar

[@dennisud]

Well said and well done. Nice to see all the background information given to us so well.

[@michaelchristie6830]

Absolutely fantastic video! I was just in DC two weeks ago on vacation, and this sure was fascinating!

[@Thom-TRA]

Hope you had a great time in DC!

[@mr2646]

Thank you for your hard work. Very comprehensive and interesting vid. Watching from France 🇫🇷. Maurice

[@Thom-TRA]

Thanks for watching!

[@sergeykuzmichev8064]

Ur channel is great but this video was exceptional, great job. Thanks for taking time to draw charts as well

[@Thom-TRA]

Wow, such high praise 😊

[@lemapp]

As part of the long range plan to bring Acela to Atlanta, there is a project to electrify the track from Union Station in to Alexandria. This would allow Marc trains to travel south into Virginia. Also part of this project is to lay new track so that passenger trains will no long share tracks with freight. The next phase would extend to Richmond. Note: Ashland, Virginia has the railroad traveling through town, so they require all train traffic to slow down. It's clear that this restriction will need to be addressed at some point. If Ashland continues to fight, they might be bypassed.

[@kitchin2]

Long range ideas. Unfortunately the current plans and projects are more limited. These ideas probably were in some plans, before there was funding. Then the plans got set. Big question, what about after 2034?

[@davidpowell3347]

Alexandria Virginia's railroad history goes back before "Potomac Yards" there used to be a rail bridge "viaduct"? over top of the Potomac Yard tracks for the system once known as "Washington and Old Dominion" to connect the western routes that went via Leesburg VA to near the Blue Ridge and the eastern parts that served parts of Alexandria and I believe used to connect to what used to be the "Orange and Alexandria" The "W and O. D." officially died in late 1968 but pieces remained (operated by Norfolk Southern?) east of Potomac Yard and later connected to the surviving twin track railway after the demise of Potomac Yard? Pieces closing little by little until the last parts might still be in use for the removal of demolished PEPCO coal fired electric power generation on the Potomac at Alexandria? (Power station went through some ownership and/or name changes in its last years of operation "Dynergy" ?) Used to have a coal yard with a small switcher locomotive stationed there visible to part of the Mt. Vernon Bike Trail

[@Zebrails]

Good job, kid. Mature and precise content. I "LIKE" this video and subscribed a few months ago. Keep up the good work. John

[@Thom-TRA]

Thanks! Though I’m not a kid. I’m a bit older than you probably think.

[@datalasse]

Great video and research! Thanks for sharing.

[@Thom-TRA]

Thanks for watching!

[@JerrellWoolford]

This was a very informative video. For years, I would see the old gantries for tracks around the DC area and wonder why the electric lines were removed.

[@IndigenousAmericanTrucker]

Thanks for telling me what those things are. I live in Washington.D.C. and I chill on a part of M S.E. a lot, which is right in between the freight train tracks and the Anacostia river right under the Pennsylvania Ave Bridge. It's basically right after the Anacostia River Bridge that you mentioned. Nonetheless, I've always wondered what those steel overhead things were that cross over the tracks every so many feet. I knew something was there, I just didn't know what. You also answered another question that I had about why there were two separate routes of tracks. One thru the middle of the city thru northeast, etc, and one southward thru Southeast, etc. I initially thought CSX used both routes.

[@moth.monster]

as a baltimore resident i'm just happy you said we're a major city