Are liberals our enemies?

[@Marxism_Today]

I think it's important to emphasise that we as socialists aren't against reforms. We're against reformism. A lot of the things that liberals, and social democrats to be more precise, are fighting for are things that we're also fighting for - the difference is that we're only doing so on the road to building socialism. We're going to need a lot more pro-working class reforms to open the way for socialist transformation of society, so we can definitely work together with liberals on these specific issues.

[@adrenalinevan]

Exactly! Especially when it comes to the necessities of life! Let's not say to a differently abled comrade, who needs healthcare to survive, oh it's not good enough just wait for the capital r Revolution

[@JjJj-nn6in]

@@pewtercamaro That's the word for a fellow socialist, it kinda stuck since the only alternative I see would have been "bro"

[@jeffengel2607]

It's one of those "good but not nearly enough" things. We're insisting on the "not nearly enough" part - we're _not_ disagreeing on the "good" part and that ought to stay clear too. And when we've got that established with our fainter-hearted friends, we have an entry for explaining how we _need_ X reform because of the dynamics of capitalism, and we're going to have to keep up this patchwork til we fix the underlying problem.

[@JjJj-nn6in]

@@pewtercamaro Now that was insightful, really made me think you know, really good argument there champ.

[@mickeyg7219]

Some may share the same goal, but how they planned to get there is the problem. Liberals want something socialists also want, except that at the same time, they want to preserve capitalism. They're just short-sighted, and if no one redirects their misguidance, liberals can and have ruined socialist's efforts. Liberals are very ineffectual against the far-right, they never win against them, but socialists have.

[@artificial-alex01101]

"I don't think you can dismantle authority and hierarchy and also believe in your own superiority." - Thought Slime

[@chrisbcpack]

i feel almost ashamed for how long i thought 'liberal' and 'leftist' were just 2 words meaning the same thing

[@soensocomrade600]

Nah, don't be ashamed. The two are intentionally conflated in mainstream discourse. Not surprising that happens if you consider liberalism's purpose to be to subvert leftism. It's meant to be a limiter, giving the illusion of a progressive option, but never actually allowing any real changes that would threaten the dominance of the bourgeoisie.

[@KSignalEingang]

You're in no way alone. In the US, common usage makes them effectively interchangeable terms as far as the overwhelming majority of people are concerned... Twenty-plus years ago only the most nerdy of political nerds would have drawn any kind of distinction. Kind of happy that's changing as the distinction is important, but it also means a lot of people are still hung up on the "older" usage (which is actually newer but you know what I mean.) Long story short, don't sweat labels. They matter a lot less than actions, policies, and just generally sharing ideas of what a better world could look like and how we can get there.

[@jacobloving6765]

Liberal means anyone who wants something new, technically commies or socialists would be liberals in the USA. The problem is neither party is liberal as they don’t want any real change.

[@Al-nr9nd]

Don't feel ashamed. I did as well.

[@godlessdisco4266]

I used to think that being a liberal meant like liberal minded which means "open to new ideas," but then I watched Philosophy Tube's video about liberalism and then I realized that I really wasn't a liberal

[@TrenchantEdges]

Ok, I didn't appreciate being called out about the breadsticks.

[@cezarcatalin1406]

Steve Fisher Redistribute the damn sticks, STEVE

[@patbiss7742]

GIVE US THE STICKS STEVE

[@m0rShh]

You're part of the problem, Steve. Now surrender the stix or pay the price with your blood.

[@HerrBjork]

Just bake some extra for the next bake-a-thon and it'll all be good

[@TheRedRaccoonDog]

Until you stop taking all the breadsticks you aren't welcome at the table, STEVE.

[@Who-vt9oh]

Fantastic, FANTASTIC, video. "Outreach, not compromise" is a critically important point that can not be emphasized enough. Outreach is absolutely essential if we really want to achieve our goals of social and class justice.

[@kopfkinooo]

Michael Kropotkin likesThought Slime!

[@MissFotini]

Matthew, I am a very tired girl-type humanoid. I haven't had time to properly rest since before Christmas. I am so very close to a full body shut down. This morning I woke up to a framed poster falling off my wall and the unholy sound of glass shattering. Then I washed a dish and my tap handle flew off the wall. I'm in Struggletown. But when you said "Bernard Hussein Sanders", I laughed so very loudly. Thank you for that.

[@minimariih14]

I will start referring to myself as "very tired girl-type humanoid" from now on. You caused this. Thank you.

[@secretshark5710]

I was in that spot. Then I shaved the sides of my head and 1/3 of my left eyebrow, cleaned my entire room, put on weird makeup, and failed all my classes for 2 months or so. Oh, and I made some art. I'm in a different, kind-of-better spot now and I've combined doing stuff that makes me feel happy and/or alive with meds and therapy. I can't tell you what to do, but I can tell you that you will not be laying in that bad-sad place forever. Your body will shift forms as time passes, and so will the world around you, and even if you have to claw your way out alone, it is within your power to do so.

[@Mondomeyer]

@@minimariih14 So will I, and I’m male!

[@imperial2252]

this is such an amazing comment

[@Mondomeyer]

@@imperial2252 Why thank you...wait, you were referring to the other person's comment, weren't you?

[@Tomonomonous]

"BERNARD HUSSEIN SANDERS" I literally cracked out laughing at that and scared the shit out of my cat.

[@charalampostsakirides-pala2761]

Your cat gets scared?!?!? I WANT AN AUTOPAWMARK FROM IT! (A regular autograph would do, but that's trickier.... :P )

[@gateauxq4604]

HIGHKEY BEST LINE

[@SlapstickGenius23]

Barack Hussein Obama.

[@Abaudahdine]

"Raise your hand if you, at some point, were a liberal" *raises hand* "What happened?" Police brutality. Police brutality happened. And because of this I embraced direct action and a more radical vision of the world. It's crazy what experience will teach you sometimes, but despite all of this, I don't wish it upon anybody. I would not wish upon anybody to experience, to live this, and to keep the scars.

[@kitsunevalentine]

Oof, in Chile we are having a social revolution and the more police brutality I see the more radical I have become. I've seen horrors and despite of that some liberal and mostly conservative people still defend the police, and say they are not being "harsh enough". My blood boils, especially cause I hear it from familiars or known adults of mine. That's when I see their privilege. Privilege is not being abused by the police ever. Even tho I don't wish upon anybody to be abused by the police I wish they were a little more comprehensive. Sad to hear what happened to you :/ ACAB

[@Abaudahdine]

@@kitsunevalentine ACAB comrade. Solidarity and love

[@colleen6474]

@@kitsunevalentine ACAB

[@amberrichards2778]

I don't wish this pain onto people. I do wish the awareness that comes with the pain onto people. Stay strong. ACAB.

[@SM-gt9vg]

In the US? Police brutality has been going on since 2011/2012 at least and it's only gotten worse. I've been hearing about it my whole adult life and voting 3rd party always too. Also Obama saying he was going to do all kinds of stuff like bring our troops home and then he NEVER did any of it the first time he was elected, that was what made me lose faith in the Democrats.

[@Izzy-fv1ng]

"That's not what the conquest of bread means, STEVE"

[@smallseal17]

"mArX fAiLeD tO aCcOuNt FoR tHe ExIsTeNcE oF 7-11s" Good video.

[@Eibarwoman]

Given that 7/11s didn't exist for another 100 years, that would be accurate. He couldn't have foreseen a subtype of petite bourgeoisie barely able to make ends meet but highly prone to robbery

[@johannageisel5390]

7/11s don't exist even today in Germany. Marx was right.

[@diegosanchez894]

Legend says Karl Marx's last words were "shit I forgot about human nature!".

[@johannageisel5390]

@@diegosanchez894 I think he accounted for human nature very well. That's why he knew that a system based on competition and exploitation like capitalism will never be beneficial for all, because it brings out the worst in people.

[@charalampostsakirides-pala2761]

xDDDDDDDD

[@fomoriii]

i’ll have you know i was born a socialist. my first word for comrade. i instigated a general strike in my pre-school, we had a 3-day anarchist utopia and the juiceboxes were distributed fairly.

[@mockdr]

lol

[@astralseaslug546]

This is the best KZbin comment ever

[@WillYouVid]

...is it you, Pepe Mujica?

[@EmilyKveldulv]

Top tier comment

[@Marlodrama]

Its true I was there we drew the hammer & sickle flags with crayons

[@inigo137]

That condescending comparison using Harry Potter's terms 10/10

[@Manorjames]

I was a proto-fascist when I was a teen. I was the type of person I would punch today if I'd expoused my ideas and put others at risk. Luckily, I educated myself, and am thus indebted to the people that created the material with which I did. However, I surely wish I'd had a friend with whom to speak. When I try to be that friend I never had, my words usually fall deaf. But I will keep trying. Thank you, Slime, it's easier to not give up when we cheer each other up.

[@akaking7499]

Going from hard right to hard left! How brave of you. Big aplause, much change.

[@colto2312]

@@akaking7499 He's an extremist. Whomever will accept him into their ingroup is now whom he supports. The most dangerous kind of person, but applauded in today's society.

[@akaking7499]

exactly

[@enricoberlinguer8959]

@@akaking7499 Are we talking about two cute so called free-thinkers, that think that they see with criticism "every" ideology while reproducing the hegemonic ideology without even realizing so? How come they are repeating the hegemonic and absurd troppe extremes are close to each other , they are the same, therefore no news in going from extreme right ( racists, clasist, sexists, homophobe...) to extreme left (wanting equality for people through a system more fair than capitalism... and also against race, class, gender, sexual orientation opressions) OH MY GOD theya re the same!!

[@akaking7499]

@@enricoberlinguer8959 hay, you think I'm cute UwU! I'm from Georgia, a post USSR country so yea, I think so. Commies were as much or even more racist sexist bla bla bla than the nazies. You know, minorities don't go well with collectivist ideologies, because you know they are minorities in the world where only the majority matters. Only diverse place in the whole USSR and China are the gulags my brother. Also don't give me the Not Real bull, marks and his goons were a mandatory read. This was theory in praxis

[@nate882]

Removes liberal scooby doo mask: It was capitalism the whole time

[@charalampostsakirides-pala2761]

Awwwww, I thought we meddling children put capitalism away after we caught it behind the fascist mask... :( How'd it get out?

[@Yiab]

Two other things we can do to help with outreach: 1) Don't insult people who don't already know all the theory we do, and 2) Stop ridiculing people on our side who try and actually do the outreach to liberals we want done.

[@jimmyl27]

I stopped being a liberal because of socialist memes. It was only ironic at first.

[@Evilwarts]

That's exactly how a lot of people recently became fascist (side note - my computer tried to autocorrect fascist to racist)

[@McHobotheBobo]

The truth cannot be ignored!

[@rosemali3022]

How do we make more socialist memes? And how do we get them as popular as white nationalists memes?

[@enjolraswaters7491]

thats kind of awesome dude

[@GalladofBales]

Seize the memes of production

[@manso306]

"We need ants on our side" so true. They include some of the very few eusocial ("truly social" so to speak) species on the planet, they number in the trillions, and they possess devastating weapons -- some of them capable of inflicting literally the worst pain imaginable.

[@moredetonation3755]

Ant Man wears red, demonstrating his support of the proletariat

[@katherinemorelle7115]

Ants are great. And Antz the movie is also a great anti capitalist/anti fascist story that even kids can understand.

[@xCorvus7x]

@@katherinemorelle7115 Could you tell me what your profile picture is and why?

[@emilywilson967]

@@xCorvus7x Why, that's clearly the Gadsden flag, except the snake is licking a boot, along with the caption "*LICK*". It is the only accurate representation of the creatures the US calls "libertarians," and I would argue that it is a work of art.

[@jjjbjbbnjbjbjbjbjb9415]

@@emilywilson967 If you are any good at photoshop PLEASE make that image

[@TMMx]

Frustratingly often, I will hear people say that it's bad to try to convince liberals, because we have enough people who already agree with us and we just need to mobilize them, and all liberals should just be shunned. This is amazingly naive. And it's tragically counterproductive when failure to shun liberals whom you're trying to convince, or trying to keep other leftists from being shitty toward liberals in a way that alienates liberals from leftist politics gets you shunned as well.

[@IamIK3]

TMM the people who give this take grossly overestimate how many of us exist offline. If they interacted with people irl more often, they’d see how important it is that we coalition build and further our ideas outside of our echo chambers.

[@Tori_TLCR]

I see similar attitudes about Boomers. I'm a Millenial, but no, Millenials and Zoomers are not the only Leftists. Boomer Lefties exist just like Zoomer and Millenial Conservatives and Facists exist. Just waiting for the generations that came before us to die will not solve Capitalism or racism, actually.

[@Dorian_sapiens]

@@Tori_TLCR Everyone always forgets about Gen X, the New Silent Generation. 😭

[@frechjo]

​@@Dorian_sapiens Gen X-ers solidarity! REPRESENT! Looking on the bright side, we can shit on them all, and they won't even see us :D

[@michaelsalmon9832]

liberals should be shunned. people who genuinely and whole-heartedly believe in liberal ideology are not your allies any more than conservatives are. because its a different ideology. see this is you guys giving the game away here. you want to get liberals involved, because really, all of you are pretty much liberals. just a more radical version of them. one might say.....radically liberal. just all of the assumptions of liberalism taken to their extremes. but yes, those are liberal assumptions. not socialist ones.

[@basicindiebro]

i’m a college student and i can tell you that talking about ecosocialism at climate protests with liberals has been really effective.

[@SubjectiveObserver]

I get the feeling that climate change will become the "philosophers stone" of political debates in the near future.

[@basicindiebro]

SubjectiveObserver you’re probably right. if you mean what i think you mean.

[@LeBonkJordan]

_Climate Change As Class War_ and all that

[@AlexBrovo]

It’s what happens when you dont have a job

[@Petepeatpeet]

“I don’t think you can dismantle authority and hierarchy and also believe in your own superiority.” Well fucking said.

[@bradypustridactylus488]

When I tell "conservatives" my political position, they call me a "liberal." When I tell "liberals" where I stand, they call me communist. So I insist that I am an anarchist, which pisses them off because the word has been toxified by the establishment mediia to mean political nihilist. Some media gatekeeper once said that Noam Chomsky was not interviewed on MSM because he sounds like he comes from Neptune. Yeah, I know.

[@twistysunshine]

It's sometimes easier to be angry at someone that by all rights "should" agree with you, than someone you never expected support from in the first place. It's hard to remember, but we gotta focus on recruitment too

[@calmkat9032]

"People who get their political views from a mod for Hearts of Iron 4" Me, a Syndicalist: Bruh.

[@clunston]

Yeah that joke was too real lmao

[@victorconway444]

Me: *slowly hiding away my savegames as Totalist Britain and Italy*

[@jamessinton7718]

same

[@bigburd875]

You ever just... play as Nat Pop Russia?

[@benwilliams3698]

Yeah as someone who discovered syndicalism through Kaiserich, I feel called out :(

[@veinerschnoozle6776]

"Sherlock Gnomes Chomsky" *chefs kiss* brilliant

[@yonatanbeer3475]

*chef kiss* indeed

[@thisisisabella3634]

When did "chef's kiss" become a thing? And why does it seem weirdly racist?

[@benutzername1875]

@@thisisisabella3634 bec it brings a very stereotypical image of an italian chef to mind

[@thisisisabella3634]

@@benutzername1875 That was the joke more or less.

[@unknownhandyman6821]

Elemental, my dear zizek...

[@ernststravoblofeld]

I get a bit *excited* when I hear someone say, "let's not have presidents."

[@hannavignolo6454]

Particularly, I get turned on

[@melotron00]

lmao same

[@travisrandall6535]

As a more liberal person.. what is the suggested alternative? I don't like any of the candidates to decide our gate for the next four years but what system should we put in place otherwise?

[@ernststravoblofeld]

@@travisrandall6535 Do we need these systems? Do they work for us? I don't think so.

[@travisrandall6535]

@@ernststravoblofeld ok sure I believe that but then what? Just plain old anarchy? I don't know if I could really trust that system. (I'm not baiting or anything I'm really just unsure on what a replacement system could be)

[@ZILtoid1991]

Liberal? I was worse. In my adolescence, my only idea of socialism came from boomer Kádárists. They thought that socialism is when you work 72 hours in a factory, construction, or the fields, with no protective equipment because scars from workplace injuries are manly. And don't you dare to work with computers, which are actually Super Nintendos, that have more button on their controllers, but turn their players into addicts the same way as the ones that have less buttons. And you know what addicts of Super Nintendos do? They at one point no longer are satisfied by the thrills of gaming, and they pick up guns and shoot real people. This whole thing made me resent socialism so much, that at one point, I was looking into becoming a member of Magyar Gárda, and I couldn't choose between Jobbik and Fidesz, whit the latter was already tainted by the conservative plague of picking up ideas from the far-right. It took me a wake up call to even just consider being a liberal, then I slowly moved to the left, and Gamergate was the event that turned me into an anarcho-syndicalist, as liberal anti-GGers did nothing but prayed to corporations, influencers, and the police to finally do something, while gators were allowed to dox, harass, and do other nasty things to people (some even spending all of their free time on mass downvoting and reporting videos with multiple sockpuppets).

[@soupalex]

glad you made it through, comrade! (btw fuck toil-fetishist "socialists", all they've ever achieved is an erosion of class solidarity)

[@Mokkababa]

Fellow Hungarian, finally someone! ♥️

[@lynh.1214]

Hello fellow hungarian socialist raised by vehemently anti-soc parents. It is not easy to break free and start to think properly about these issues. As a first time voter fetus-me was actually proud to vote for Fidesz. Nowadays I cringe at the memory.

[@charalampostsakirides-pala2761]

Well, well! A nice surprise out of Hungary. I hope such pleasant surprises are numerically enough to make them not a surprise to anyone who doesn't get their news from the mass media. Not that we'd easily hear about the subject down here on the south end of the Balkans, anyway. They only show the trap you escaped from getting more massive. Everywhere, to be fair, but there more than most places.

[@charalampostsakirides-pala2761]

@@Mokkababa Not a fellow Hungarian, but I do share the feeling. :P And not just the two of you, either! :)))))

[@stm7810]

we will admit, we were liberal, back when we thought we were 1 person, it took a few months of KZbin videos to discover anarchism existed, before that we spent years hating everything about capitalism without a word for capitalism or knowledge of an alternative.

[@OllieMendes]

I remember when I didn't know a lot about politics, so I just considered myself a liberal because as an American there was only two choices as far as I could see it. I had this cognitive dissonance where I knew some of it was obvious bs, but since I knew I wasn't a conservative, and since there was no other option, I just ignored the contradictions.

[@mrsicness1]

ditto.

[@edwardcardinal4328]

Start 'em soft with Monty Python and the Holy Grail, then follow up with Chomsky. Now you see the violence inherent in the system.

[@Starlight-ue8jy]

Monty python is socialist? It’s been a while, maybe I missed something haha.

[@Totally_Glitched]

Okay, I seriously love the term 'baby liberal'. I think keeping it in mind is gonna help me have more patience and compassion from now on, especially since I remember when I was a baby liberal. Ah, good times /sarcasm.

[@jeffengel2607]

Yeah. I like to think of having the right ideas as being in possession of something good you probably owe, ultimately or proximately, to mere luck - like social class of birth, citizenship, money, or health. Someone else doesn't have it? SHARE IT - in the case of an idea, you still have it in full afterward too. Being ahead in the right idea department is not a reason to regard them as some subhuman.

[@gwills9337]

@@jeffengel2607 100% agree, 'moral authority' or 'better than' is a right-wing, conservative ploy. We can do better!

[@richardwilliams2808]

"Get Good" is not a useful response to liberals or baby leftists that are at least trying to think their way out of the current system. Nobody arrived at socialism (communism, anarchism, et al.) without help and time to work on the issues and themselves. Do for them what others have done for you. Easier said than done, as Slime-o says, but helping educate others will grow that skill in ourselves.

[@SMATF5]

The best thing you can do to convince someone of your opinion is to NOT TALK DOWN to them; smugness or self-righteousness will instantly make someone not want to hear what you have to say. Empathy and mutual respect go a very long way in the exchange of ideas.

[@harpoonlobotomy]

I've found it useful when having conversations with liberals/centrists to points out not only what's wrong with the current system, but why it doesn't have to be this way. Once you can get someone to realise that the status quo /could/ be different, then you can start having conversations about what alternatives there could be. You'll never convert someone who can't imagine an alternative existing.

[@gwills9337]

100% remind people that homelessness, hunger, and poverty are contrived problems. These social problems are systemic and allowed to exist, its not that we don't know how to solve the issues. All crises we've lived through in the US are distribution problems (from greed and lack of social policy)

[@SubjectiveObserver]

@@gwills9337 The key that opened my eyes was the revelation that it's impossible to accumulate wealth in a fair and ethical way, especially because our finite land was stolen from other people and has already been distributed to a specific 'class' of people generations ago. I understood humanity had the resources to fix these issues, but I got hung up on the idea of "stealing" from the wealthy to solve our problems. After that, I thought about how unrealistic it is to assume innovation and entrepreneurship could give every ambitious person an opportunity to escape wage labor, especially if modern automation eliminates jobs faster than it creates them. Ideally automation would eliminate most work anyway, right? And finally, I concluded that even if you do play their game and succeed at competing in the market, we are all racing our 'private jets' toward ecological catastrophe. Sure, we can create more efficient engines. If we run out of fuel, we can learn to use alternative fuels instead. But we're obviously not going to develop sustainable solutions before inevitably crashing to the ground. Smarter strategy is to slow down, level out, and reserve fuel until we sort out these existential threats... which wraps back around to my first realization that we already have enough resources...

[@mgroesbeck4503]

At times it almost seems easier to explain anarchism than socialism..."Hierarchy hurts people, and we should get rid of it." Then a little bit about how for some of us "get[ting] rid of" can mean phasing out, and how it's not just about "people" (but it's still about people, too)...and then I can talk about socialism as trying to reduce or eliminate hierarchy in the economy. Of course, then five minutes later some people are back to insisting "Anarchism means no organization or empathy for anyone, and socialists are all Stalinists", but I hope that a few people start to get it.

[@terminaldeity]

Idealistic notions are easy to explain. Material analysis is much harder.

[@tarawright4339]

"Raise your hand if you were a liberal" *raises hand* "What happened? Did you magically reevaluate your entire worldview all by yourself?" No, I came out as trans

[@SophiefromMars]

I want a grey jumpsuit so badly though...

[@mcfeelyat]

Curio Can’t a man just chill in his gray jumpsuit and watch the large man’s head speaking without some Olivia Newton John-lookin jazzercise instructor chucking her hammer at the screen? I hardly ever get to go to the movies anymore, let me just have this.

[@TheLostArchangel666]

11:50 *Looks up from his pile of stolen bread-products* ... It's not? Huh.

[@charalampostsakirides-pala2761]

xDDDDDDDDDDD

[@genessab]

I hope everyone is having an amazing day! Remember to drink some water okay? I hope the rest of your day goes beautifully, you deserve it.

[@LustStarrr]

Genessa - thanks, same to you. 😃

[@calebl6609]

What if I’m a piece of shit though?

[@alzed9983]

Ok but instead of water what if I do coffee? I'll even do black coffee to bring it closest to water, I'm just too tired to stick to only water

[@Potatosti]

thanks you, you too ^^

[@h4nh90]

Khaled Rapp who knows? Maybe they’ll be less of a piece of shit :/

[@NilkadNaquadaG]

Man, I wish I had time to watch that Viki1999 video before going into work today, I'll have to watch it after my shift. Content that debunks the bad stats while also NOT making apologetics for the real shitty things done by the Soviet Union and other attempts at socialist states is something I've wanted for a while.

[@garrettblack]

God I love your Eyeball Zone segways

[@mcfeelyat]

Garrett Black Is that why his posture seems so strange during those segments? He’s riding a Segway the whole time?

[@DonkeyBoyVids]

3:37 I like to imagine this is the director's commentary for Sherlock Gnomes

[@triciaroy]

I gotta say, only a morbid fascination made me click. I was prepared for some right-wing yuckiness. Pleasantly surprised. I’ve been a closet “lefty” for most of my life, but accepting liberal positions in a political space without other options. Generally, I think people like me do not have the confidence to embrace socialism, or see viable options outside of liberalism despite the inevitable death-match with conservatives. I’m a teacher (I hope you don’t think teacher=bad), so I am constantly in that catch-22 of trying to engage ideas from all sides but not seeming to “force” my own principles. That “forcing” is really just a function of my position in the classroom, one that I try to decentralize, but since the structure around me insists that I give grades, I am limited in the amount of revolution I am allowed. Oftentimes, students and others assume that if I am pointing out the logical deficiencies in a Trump statement, that I am “forcing my agenda” and that I’m a “liberal.” And then I’m like, bitch, you don’t even begin to know what I think. Anyway, this is rambling, so I’ll stop. Thanks for the education!

[@mckymcobvious3043]

I just love how the GOP is constantly gaslighing us, acting like what they call the "left" is crazy, is ruining the country, wants to socialize health care (even tho the democratic nominee just wants a public opinion) i hate it i hate it i hate it and I've still had to *gently, nicely point out* that Biden is clearly a good way better person than Trump. b/c even THAT somehow isn't obvious to some people

[@christophercheck1590]

Fellow teacher here, and I feel you. I don't want to indoctrinate my kids, but just exposing them to information outside of what is "appropriate" is called indoctrination sometimes. Especially since I teach in the People's Democratic Republic of Texas. Just acknowledging things like the Tuskegee experiments or the Secessions of the Plebs in Ancient Rome is, to some people, subversive propaganda. I don't even have to have an opinionated stance, I just need to acknowledge things outside of what they find appropriate exist to be on the wrong side of a lot of people with authority over me. Then there's grading, wherein we are expected to rank kids so they can be prepared for the tyranny of their bosses who will give them performance evaluations and exact demands, often irrationally. How do you walk the tightrope between preparing them for a very real world that sucks and also firing them up about the idea that they world could be so much better, and they shouldn't have to settle. This pandemic has helped a little bit, I've found. But I'm not optimistic yet.

[@dashiellgillingham4579]

Hm. That kinda parallels my experience. Except I'd already assembled by own idealized government concept in strange near-parallel to Democratic Socialist policies before I ever met one, or knew a single aspect of the ideology, or was of voting age. Ended up in this bizarre space where I only ever fit in with Social Democrats and Social Liberals, advocating for universal workplace democracy as the indispensable thing that permits any other human freedom to be upheld, as corporate ownership is itself inherently autocratic and enabling of autocracy due to it's existing hierarchy reducing the number of actors who must be controlled to control a state as an individual. When you're throughly anti-revolutionary (because the USA is a Democracy, and defending that is the goal for me), and saying things like 'for humans to have liberty, we cannot permit groups of people to be owned, any more than individuals,' there really doesn't seem to be a good place for you.

[@mishat5405]

I convinced my friends to cook food for homeless people with me, and while doing that initiated conversations about why were having to do it at all, but kinda let them lead those conversations, and I didn’t even bring up socialism at all until they mentioned it, and then I gave them books, and now 3/4 of those friends are angry anarchists

[@adriannecoopersmith589]

"Raise your hand if you were a liberal. What happened?" I started listening to folk punk.

[@MarlowWhere]

Now we know why all your friends left.

[@Kakashi75]

This is literally the crux of Alexander Berkman‘s book “What is Anarchist Communism” chapter titled “The idea is the thing” to bring revolution we need to start by converting people which won’t happen if we make fun of them for not knowing what we know. Great work comrade slime

[@tyblazitar]

Aaah, so that's why liberals will never say the word "capital".

[@Swingingbells]

Hahaha!

[@chipmo]

The cake made no sense. I mean, couldn't they at least poison them or something?

[@g81atherton]

This video gives me strong parasocial feelings of gratitude and admiration.

[@kidkurmudgeon-0_o]

"Why destroy them now when you can torture them with tooth decay!" - Him Powerpuff Girls

[@verager2493]

A fabulous trans man ahead of his time. He made his pronouns into his name so no one could misgender him.

[@far-lefteevee608]

One time a liberal called me a nihilistic Bernie bot. I don’t think they realized I’m actually a nihilist, so their “comeback” was quite hilarious to me

[@inthedetails5467]

Sounds like a compliment to me

[@far-lefteevee608]

Honestly? I took it as one

[@cpeithman999]

Since I am also a nihilist, I believe that your comment is no more objectively valuable than any other comment, but since a "Nihilistic Bernie Bot" is subjectively hilarious, I says: "Good job, LOL" Nihilistic Bernie Bot: "beep boop. I am simultaneously programmed for idealism and nihilism. please deactivate me. beep boop. i am in great pain."

[@popejaimie]

Nah absurdism is the funny version of nihilism, existentialism is just slightly less depressing nihilism

[@delve_]

+Chad Dysvick Have you tried Absurdism?

[@kneesnap1041]

"That's not what The Conquest of Bread means, Steve!" 🤣

[@kage6613]

That killed me.

[@jmn327]

I think what I've found so stifling, particularly among the "leftists who only seem to exist on Twitter" (or around Brooklyn, going by where I live), is the overemphasis on elections as the means of bringing about massive change or, in a super contradictory fart of an idea, revolution itself. My local left political volunteer group has tried working with the local DSA chapter numerous times, yet so often we got hit with "if you're not voting for Bernie, you're the enemy", as if electing Bernie, a social democrat (hell, DSA, *that's in your group's name*) would or could have torn down capitalism, and that Biden now being the presidential standard bearer of the only organized political party in the US that even pretends to have remotely left leanings (sorry, third parties) means doom for the entire project. This ignores that actual work for revolution, direct action itself, is much more properly done between and around elections; if you have not built a coalition of people sharing in a desire for massive change, then you cannot hope to achieve it at the ballot box, let alone through action in the streets or in the workplace, and you cannot make saviors out of individual candidates and think that's going to accomplish literally anything. Elections, particularly in a two-party system, are not vehicles for revolution; they are simply methods of harm reduction. Our system is harmful, but when it comes time to pick one of the two candidates with any prayer of victory, it is incumbent to pick the one you believe will either reduce or minimize that harm relative to the alternative. "Heightening the contradictions" is only fun if you're not in a group that faces potential annihilation from those contradictions. Worse, we're not living in an America where the choice is between malign liberalism and somewhat softer, friendlier liberalism: we exist in a nation with laws and structures that limit us to a two party system, with one party indeed revolving around "liberalism but with a nicer edge to it (sometimes)", but with the other being *a literal ethno-fascist/dominionist death cult*. Priority one right now is to put out the raging inferno that is growing global authoritarianism, embodied by Trump, Erdogan, Putin, Xi, Duterte, Bolsonaro, and far too many others to varying degrees, and in surviving democratic states that might mean having to hold one's nose and support an unlikeable candidate who promises liberalism in response (maybe social democracy, that'd be better, but still not ideal), but then focus on doing the work AFTER that election via outreach to lay the groundwork for a more aware working class and a coalition that isn't afraid of embracing more radical politics.

[@calicow]

I'm sure this will be echoed throughout the comments (at least I'd imagine so), but your channel played a large part in making me realize the values I held were not the values of a democrat but of a leftist. You helped me understand what I'd always had an inkling of, but considered too... fringe to think: That capitalism is not a necessary evil. It's the root cause of so much shittiness. I've always unfortunately been one of those "sure it would be nice if we could live this way, but we need to work with what we've got" people, and as I've educated myself on the subject I've realized how much these compromises have just given power to the people who need it the least. So thanks for that, Matt. I have some friends who are still baby liberals. It's hard to be patient with them sometimes, but this year (in the US at least) I think it's needed now more than ever. And it wasn't long ago that I was in their shoes.

[@bramborovygulas1049]

I used to be a far right fashy boy before my socialist philosophy professor had the near god-like patience to sit me down and forced me to actually think about my position. Now I do direct action and battle black shirts.

[@amberrichards2778]

I have a friend who I think is trapped in a fascist echo chamber. I'm trying to do something similar with him.

[@bramborovygulas1049]

@Gabe. Well, it all really started around childhood. I was fed an almost constant uninterrupted stream of complete hogwash conservative propaganda. After the Obama presidency ended I had my foolish porridge mind pretty well and truly warped. I gave in to all the propaganda by that point and I said and advocated for frankly horrifying things. Things that ruined friendships, estranged me from people I had known my whole life. I started really getting Fash when the Trump campaign started, and only came off it within the last couple of years.

[@handsofchange11111]

@@bramborovygulas1049 What made you stop? What were the arguments your professor used, if you remember?

[@Inanedata]

@@handsofchange11111 I would be curious too, if you're willing to tell @Clinton Cox

[@sch4891]

i'm gonna be a teacher and your story would be very helpful to know. no judgements

[@middlesidetopwise]

I actually was born anarchist, but didn’t realize that my inherent distaste for hierarchy and submissive rules had a name until I started studying theory 30 years later. Wish someone had handed me The Conquest of Bread in high school instead of The Anarchist Cookbook 😟✊

[@cezarcatalin1406]

Actually, I started asking myself questions about the meaning of life, existentialism, society as a supersystem composed of smaller subsystems like humans, about the efficiency of said systems... and the more I was thinking about it with an objective EYE the farther to the left I went. Then I discovered breadtube and you really really gave me a shred of hope. Now I am a progressive-revolutionary neocommunist documented about marxism-leninism, trotskyism, internationalism, revolutionary ideals, progressivism, anarchism, etc. Reality is... everyone is born a lefty. Then we are harmed and beaten into becoming individualistic numbskulls.

[@seto749]

That may be true for the hetties.

[@esbenm6544]

I have an aunt who's an old-school ML tankie. I'm not sure we can trust her.

[@KristofskiKabuki]

As a small child I told my parents that money shouldn't exist. I did indeed pop out as a hardcore leftist SJW.

[@nicksnrub7265]

I present my morsel for Grumbletum!

[@leahmontgo]

That's a really good point that I had somehow neglected to think about......that not everyone saturates themself in theory and Leftist debates, and may not have the vocabulary to express their social and political view. Popular left vs. right dialogues equip the average person with enough lingo to partake in these sorts of conversations on only a shallow, superficial level. But also talking to people is well out of my comfort zone, so I'm really not sure how to help people communicate their political and social thoughts better.

[@GogiRegion]

Based off of things that Bernie Sanders has said over the years as well as some of his earlier politics, I wouldn’t be surprised if he genuinely was a socialist who just understands that right now even social democrat policies are going to have a hard time being voted in, much less a genuine socialist, and he’s currently trying to move the Overton window by running as a social democrat.

[@Jaxuhe]

As far as I care the "enemy" is indifference and misguided hostility. Yes, long term going out and feeding the hungry doesn't change anything, except for... well, keeping a few people alive. You kinda want to do that even if you believe a reform will work. And you kinda want someone trying to do reform even if you don't think it's gonna do much, especially in the short term. I dunno, just in case it does work? To make your direct action easier? To spread awareness of a problem through more varied means and get more people trying to help? Like, that situation you described is so... absolutely stupid to argue about? Do people actually do that? But even with that cake thing, at least the guy cares and is trying to do... something. Yell at him or whatever for doing it and instead he'll likely just do nothing. Hardly seems an improvement if you turn someone who's trying to help into someone who isn't.

[@StevenSmyth]

Sorry, I... I’ll never hoard the breadsticks again...

[@Honsejpeg]

Redistribute those sticks STEVE

[@gwills9337]

1% of the Steves have 99% of the breadsticks

[@kevinwillems8720]

That's better Steve. Thank you for admitting your mistake

[@octaviusroosevelt7355]

Good, now write that on the chalkboard 25 times.

[@lucasqualls5086]

My conversion came from when I was in 9th grade. I used to want to be the richest man in the world, but then I thought: "hey, if money is finite, and I got all the money, that inherently will make other people poor. No matter how good intentioned you are, having all the capital and money inherently deprives others of it, and if the rich were to just redistribute it out of the goodness of their own heart, what would be the point of even having a system for them to get that rich anyway?" and it continued from there.

[@RangerJosey]

I was a lib. But an uncomfortable one. I didn't know there was anything further left. The one day on Reddit I got absolutely dragged by some actual leftists for a spectacularly shitty take. That's when I started learning.

[@giorgigagua3034]

yeah ideological bullying worked on me too. reddit nerds making fun of me made me realize I wasn't as smart as I thought and made me more open-minded towards leftie ideas.

[@Bumblebeez011]

ShadowmanFan1 exact same story except I was on Tumblr.

[@omegahaxors9-11]

Shoutouts to r/Circlebroke2 for showing me that Leftist trolls exist, and they are fucking hilarious.

[@amaryllis0]

@@pewtercamaro Not all radical ideologies are harmful even if lots of harmful ideologies are radical.

[@Hatsuseno1]

"I got brainwashed. Me big brain"

[@rerefriedbean]

man do i love the good ol’ ceaseless watcher the eye it knows you beholding

[@MF-R]

Never get bored of the transition to the eyeball zone; it's super well done every time.

[@supernsansa]

Stay slimey bro

[@motorcitymangababe]

I litteraly just went through this with a friend of my moms. Finally got him to look at some leftbook resources- which i explained are useful as a compiling tool for people not versed in undirected research via the bibliographies and got told "thats not a valid resource" while he watched cnn and msnbc like they arent provably corrupt. Like... Idk what to do with that other than let him enjoy approved lies over independent research.

[@milesblue638]

MSNBC and CNN are engaged in the same business model as Fox News: Misinform unsophisticated people about politics while catering to their unquestioned assumptions about the world and their part in it. "Low information voters" are not just a right-wing thing.

[@ktownshutdown21]

"Liberals are not our enemy." Mike Bloomberg: "Hold my stop and frisk."

[@living_neutral1669]

I experience this usually when I talk to a couple of guys at my work about this. When I explain how a communist society wouldn't use money they just scoff as they haven't really thought about the utility of money just what was given to them at school. I did make the point of how money is arbitrary if we don't need a system of profit and everything was already made for the need of everyone. At first they don't get it and argue how that would be impossible but if you do continue and rephrase it(not softer just differently) it starts to click for them. So honestly just try and start a convo if one of your coworkers is bitching about their job.

[@living_neutral1669]

Does everything have to default to barter? What you would want would already be produced as many in your society would've already created it as they would need it as well. If you're looking for something to exchange then sure go ahead but that doesn't mean the entire system revolves around barter.

[@AurelUrban]

@@PlatinumAltaria there is a very good reason why I, for example, want a moneyless society. money puts artificial value onto things and you can do some crazy shit with that. like, for example, extremely cheap labour that's basically slavery. or buying water and making other people pay for it. I'd argue that a moneyless society would have to be more, NOT less, advanced than our current one. realistically we don't NEED money. we can indeed just make what we need and distribute it to people who need it. and find better and smarter ways to do things nobody wants to do instead of just letting poor people do it because it's cheaper. it's not a utopistic idea that people are capable of sharing and giving just because they want to. people do it even in a capitalistic society that actively discourages it. so imagine if doing things for others' benefit was the norm and encouraged by the system. but other than these few things that popped into my head, when you get into a truly anarchist/socialist society, money just becomes pointless. excessive. when you base a society on mutual aid and prosperity, money as a concept doesn't make sense.

[@TheDoomSheep]

@@PlatinumAltaria I want a moneyless society but haven't read into or fully thought out how I would make it work. The purpose would be to make society much more efficient. It would hopefully eliminate useless jobs. It would hopefully let many people have shorter work days because you can have some things more streamlined and not worry about the workers suddenly not making a living wage (tho if the workers own the means of production this would happen anyways). It would hopefully eliminate planned obsolescence because holy fuck this is such a cancerous practice. It would hopefully disincentivise the production of many gimmicky products that are a waste of resources; the things that only exist because someone thinks many people will buy the thing and not because the thing is actually useful and improves lives. For the waitress example, I would hope that it would cause people to be more respectful to servers because they aren't "being paid to serve you" but are doing that job because society has a high demand for that job so they are basically helping you. But like you said, I don't know how I would get people to do the jobs no-one wants like sewage worker. Maybe when technology becomes advanced enough no-one will have to do the awful parts of any job. Just the opinion of a baby-lib turned leftish over the past year and still haven't read theory. Dunno if those things are addressed by the main left ideologies.

[@living_neutral1669]

@@PlatinumAltaria If I seemed attached to the idea of a moneyless society for no reason then let me make it clear that money has binded people to positions for no better reason than they merely lack the funds to obtain what has already been produced. For the issue of undesirable jobs we could have job rotation with everyone in the community rotating between the undesirable jobs and the desirable ones. I don't have the god eye to see exactly how the society would properly ran, but money is a social construct which means that its relationship and value can change.

[@purpleghost106]

@@PlatinumAltaria Think about a library, or a work supplies depot, or the postal service. If you go to a library, how do you get a book? If you are at a job with supplies in a depot, how do you get those supplies? You go in and you get what you need, and maybe depending on the type of thing you're getting you have either sign for it or use an automated system to acknowledge that the object is no longer in the building. (and thus will need restocking) In the case of a postal service, you know you're getting a package, presumably there's a reason you're getting it, and you go and pick it up. Also, pharmacies in countries with at least a degree of socialized medicine. I'm in Canada, and I go in to get a prescription and because it's covered they look up my name to check what I need and that a Dr has ordered it, and I do not pay for it. While I don't think we need a no-money system to be a no-profit system, and I also don't know that being no-money would actually be the best choice, I know that we don't need money to allow people to get goods. Money is not necessary. It's a tool, we use it to lubricate the exchange of goods, which is fine when that's a goal you need to drive your society, and maybe even fine if you don't-- but if every city has goods-depots and goods-libraries (honestly do you need to OWN a hammer? How about you borrow and return it instead) then we could do with a whole lot less money, or none at all.

[@williamallcorn1605]

I live in Alabama, and am very outspoken about this kind of stuff despite living in rural Appalachia. The most effective means I’ve found is to just not use certain words that they’re keyed to react with hostility towards. Avoiding saying socialism or even *capitalism* and instead directly explaining the problems inherit in the current system and how it should be changed is more effective - they take on the ideas you’re speaking without associating them with “evil so-shul-izm”. If you live in the South or Appalachia, appeal to our “heritage” can work wonders too. It’s often forgotten today that the biggest labor revolts in US history happened here in the South - and that fighting for the Union and socialism is part of our history and culture. Talk about the Coal Wars, talk about Blair Mountain, maybe try to turn the on to Pete Seeger. For decades the Confederacy and “Southern Heritage” have been used by the wealthy class in the South to control us, but you can flip the script on them with that. Framing is this as our history and culture - which it is - which they’re already primed to exult and uphold, can make them far more likely to be receptive.

[@aisansilva6228]

Do not feel smarter than others, but feel agony towards that the system that consider having an amorphous mass of brainless zombies as something to be desired and sustain an entire media and educational system that is not that challenging nor incentives critical thinking about society we live.

[@aisansilva6228]

@@kaylagray5834 exactly. This is extremely frustrating.

[@theatheistpaladin]

6:58 I gues I am the one person that happened to do that. I reasoned from "labor creates property rights" to "you can never surrender property rights to your labor" to "the only morally consistent system workers control the means of production."

[@cursesandprayers]

This is probably weird, but I kinda wanna use your extremely normal throat clearing as a ringtone.

[@cursesandprayers]

Congrats, Thought Slime, you are a ringtone.

[@zackpumpkinhead8882]

This show passed me a glass of Engel's Conditions of the Working Class

[@TreyaTheKobold]

thank you thought slime. while i would like to have something special to say, this video just reminded me that i wasnt alone.

[@dielfonelletab8711]

I think the key point that made me click with socialism was realising that I generate more money for my boss than I take home; how else would the business make a profit?

[@that_pac123]

As someone who used to be a white supremacist I always always ALWAYS try and reach out, argue, convince, introduce people to ideas they might never have encountered, because odds are they just *don't know* about some stuff that would change their minds. This works for liberals because they atleast have their hearts in the right place, and it works on some right-wingers who are actually curious too. It took me years to change my mind and alot of my core tenants in honest, thorough search of truth. It was what I wanted to do. I didn't want to be lied to, so I engaged with people who disagreed with me, and five years later here I am. Cant expect over night change but being approachable can nudge them even slightly in the right direction, even if that isnt apparent for a very long time.

[@MrPSaun]

I was never a liberal. I grew up in a very conservative household. Became a tea party libertarian in college. Came out as gay (this was one of the best descions I made in life). Graduated with an engineering degree. Got a good paying blue collar job at a power plant, and then, after observing the utter garbage going on, made the leap straight into anarchism. It's actually a pretty logical progression if you think about it... I hope someday humanity can move past the oppressive systems it has wrought for itself.

[@screamingcactus1753]

I called myself a Liberal at one point, but that's largely because I just wasn't very educated about politics and didn't know what the word really meant. I don't think my broader opinions have really drifted that much farther left than they were originally, I just broadened my understanding enough to better articulate my beliefs to myself.

[@AnxiousEducator]

Man that cake guy with the airpods at the start... I have never wanted to slap someone more in my life

[@phelan1201]

I was a liberal until I started looking deeper into what our country was doing in the middle east. It was a slow process, but I think that was probably the start of it. It was helped along quite a bit by, you know, looking at the "healthcare system" around here.

[@justfrankjustdank2538]

my fav word in the english lexicon is lib, not cause its an old word for potion but because the image of screeching about how bad people you disagree with are is hilarious already, and you needing to cut the word into a third of what it was to screech at them even more is the best thing lmao

[@Skriak]

I genuinely watch this video about once a month because it reminds me to be patient with people.

[@Mixinnitup]

Gaystation...clever

[@TheABSRDST]

I've had more productive conversations about Bernie Sanders with 2016 trump voters than liberals lately to be honest

[@rho-starmkl4483]

ABSRDST You mean the idiots who still fall for the 13/50 fallacy and bully the transgendered into their birth gender?

[@TheABSRDST]

@@rho-starmkl4483 I honestly wish, but no, it's like... just your average liberal voters who haven't really explored leftist ideology and are content with rainbow painted capitalism

[@rho-starmkl4483]

ABSRDST Here I thought they were just “I dun wan guvmint ta do stuff bcuz of vuvuzela.”

[@bujustic]

Hey ladies, did you know that Um.... Radicalise the moderates uwu

[@movementman9777]

You really kind of predicted this would be the year of no compromises.

[@NoSkillDwnload]

"People who get their political views from a mod for Hearts of Iron 4" *looks at recommended videos* *feels called out*

[@upside93]

You were spot on in my own personal conversion from liberal to leftist: bad work experiences and living in poverty. Taking acid also opened my mind up to political ideas I never previously considered. I also agree elitism gets us nowhere.

[@Dorinere]

Wait... Capital is Voldemort? This changes everything!

[@sninckashley9514]

"I don't think you can dismantle hierarchy while believing in your own superiority." This is a brilliant quote.

[@Peter]

Great video - conversion is vital if we want to move towards genuine democracy. Also, *most* US working class people are not really liberals, they think liberalism is the opposite of conservatism (to most US working class, "liberalism" means "leftism"). I think we need to work to re-emphasize what "liberal" actually means to these folks - they think it means freedom and progress, not markets and capitalism. PMC/capital liberals, however, *are absolutely at very least the opponent* as what they are doing is explicitly for the preservation and furthering of their (much higher) positions and therefore the structure. It should be understood these folks will regard our ideas adversarially regardless of how empathetic and convincing we are. This is important for people working to convert working/poor/etc. classes. Jonathan Chait (PMC) isn't going to convert and neither is Bill Gates (Capital). Just like with explicit fascists (particularly ones with followings) there's not a massive point in attempting to convince these folks of anything. Concentrate on workers/poor/marginalized!

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Ohhh but I hate talking to republican types and liberal types... They are so god damn pro corporate and a lot of the time heartless... Especially the trimpy types... You're right though... We do need to work those folks to a degree. Many of them are not THAT bad. Just sort of not up to speed on the more serious issues. They can be worked with : ) Part of being a lefty type person is helping people be better. Not shaming people for life without any chance of redemption.

[@DeoMachina]

Heyyy I'm a reading the comments Peterrrr :D

[@Crazywaffle5150]

@@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342 I'm liberal and I have never been pro corporate. Most of this seems like a generalization.

[@seviche9850]

ill be honest it was your videos that converted me from liberalism to where i am today so thank you for that

[@derekanderson706]

Looks like the beard is growing back. I like it.

[@russellharrell2747]

Derek Anderson The Beard Strikes Back, the best of the Star Beard Trilogy

[@amaryllis0]

I fucking love the way you do the Eyeball Zone intros, it's very Nightvale and I'm here for it

[@niamhleeson3522]

Selamat pagi for Yum-yum, the algorithgnome

[@Viranical]

Selamat pagi!

[@m0rShh]

Ever since I became a leftist I've been miserable. I had to get up at 5am just to go to a protest! I like how the black bandana and hoodie bring out my eyes... but it's not worth it! And shouting slogans is so horribly repetitive. I've said "seize the means of production" so many times the words have lost all meaning!

[@yay4andy620]

"Let's make 2020 the year of outreach..." ...Sure hope no unprecedentedly transmissible deadly virus comes along and forces us to isolate from each other. That would be awkward

[@AndrewGillard]

Watching this for the first time now in 2023, that line made me go “wait, _when_ was this published‽” - because there wasn't a whole lot of 2020 when that line wouldn't have seemed odd without an accompanying pandemic comment 😹

[@snoozley853]

Right after the Sherlock Gnomes Chomsky bit, and right before it start showing garden gnomes, I had an ad for Lucky Charms. Incredible.