Thunder in the East: What kind of game is this anyway?

[@vgovger4373]

When you have an attack, place a combat marker in the hex that is being challenged. Then remove all forces involved in the attack, and defender, to a side box with a number corresponding to the combat marker. And leave them there until the combat is resolved. The Victor can then re enter the game from the hex containing the combat marker hex.

[@nickfirer9915]

It's a wonder to me why designers of logistic and unit effectiveness heavy games don't factor a unit's base effectiveness off of an 'out of supply" or ineffective status. Especially when much of the units in the game will be oos or "limited" supply for much of the game. Then, when the time comes to finally be IN supply you just double the numbers. That way you don't have to do so much math. TLDR from a design point a counter's stat should reflect what that counter value is most like to be throughout the game and not the optimal performance of the unit.

[@carrickrichards2457]

Thank you for the first proper review I've seen of this HUGE game. The supply speed is a challenge - the other stack issues have easy fixes. This looks better than Fire in the east (GDW) or War in the East (SPI) - Both of which I enjoyed but neither are as practacal, playable or beautiful. I have to try Proud Monster so as to get a comarison with that!

[@edmundcowan9131]

Good comment played both older games. Personally like FIE. Better but it only run until 43! Brits made a new one with hood maps for 600 dollars but that is a socialist price I can’t afford at 70 years old. Too bad as fixes FIE issues.

[@man_vs_life]

I wan't expecting to watch the whole review, but that was quite riveting! Interesting game dynamics.

[@chrisyates3598]

really don't need to stack the aircraft on top of the attacked hex. Put them off to one side a bit. It's clear which hex they are supporting. I like the off-map handling of the air. Many games have you building airfields and having the counters add to the on-map clutter. The off-map abstraction works well for me.

[@jeffcapuano3380]

Agreed, but the RAW give that instruction so a new player is likely to follow it. There are a number of alternatives to the RAW mechanics that facilitate game play. For instance, I tend to lay out the combat odds markers during the Special Movement step for battles that I'm "considering" and then remove the ones I don't want to pursue during the Battle Declaration Step; those remaining at the end are the ones I'm committed to resolving. Not exactly pro forma, but saves the bother of keeping track in my head or off map on a piece of paper...

[@christophersmith5691]

A beautifully made game, worth it almost just for the fun of setting it up. But it's scale needs reduction and simplification. There's no real significance in 1941 to Soviet units smaller than rifle armies and mechanised corps, as well as German army corps, trust me!

[@johnbrown7858]

This game looks interesting, but it also looks super long! Thanks for posting!

[@palibrae]

I think you hit on it: When the entire ETO is played, even with multiple teams, it's going to take a long time. Probably only usable on VASSAL given the size of the physical maps and the unwieldy stacks, etc. Better for each side to have a player handling only air, naval, ground, plus an overall commander. It could end up taking as long as...World War II.

[@terry7907]

A great review. I think you hit it on the head when you addressed the one week turn time scale as being problematic. That translates to taking three weeks to a month to shift a HQ or supply center one time and get it fully operational, when, historically, it only took three months for the Germans to go from the Polish border to the outskirts of Moscow.

[@joeperez3520]

Seeing the high Boardgame Geek rating, and watching a few KZbin videos, I just decided to pull the trigger on purchasing the game. Looking at those "unstable stacks," it appears to be a game that may require the use of a tweezers. Those stacks remind me of the (very) old Milton Bradley game, "Tip-It." 😂

[@joearnold6881]

I feel like the pre-rounded counters are kind of missing the point. (Oh. Pun not intended!) I mean, sure, clipping corners is a pain, but they’ve just moved the cardboard nubs from the corner to the middle (where they’re nearly impossible to get off perfectly). Take the new collector’s edition of World In Flames, Deluxe. It’s got nice, thick counters. They’re square, but they’re all attached at the middle. In my opinion they’re so thick that they’re sturdy enough to leave with sharp corners (and the clean right angles with no nibs look nice). I don’t need touch them there. However, they have those middle nibs that take forever to file off and rarely come out perfectly. With thousands of counters, I’d have preferred they just be attached at the corners in the usual way and left me to round them. I wouldn’t be still messing with them a month later! I seem to have strayed a bit, there. Guess I’m still irritated, haha. I just hate middle-connected counters and think pre-rounding them would be awesome if it didn’t mean that.

[@Jezza_One]

Still waiting for the second game in the series.

[@johnbrown7858]

Wow! Thanks for an explanation of this game. The rules are way to complicated. I would think that two players would have all kinds of arguments about unit straight, and attacks. Kind of a mess. I'll stick with Stalingrad, and The Russian Campaign.

[@edmundcowan9131]

Thanks but you miss the point. If you want an operational east front board game it must be week turns and detail air. Like any effort more in more out. There are good strategic east front games out there. You want a great operational east front game you can play without expending frustration try Gary Grigsby (?) war in the east 2. You get the monster without the hassle and it safe from the cat and wife.

[@jeffcapuano3380]

Uh, sure. But I couldn't very well know any of that without examining the game in detail. That is the point: experiencing the game in detail! And, I spent many months experiencing the game, which is truly the point: playing the game.

[@Seven8001]

Maybe toss out some rules or modify them to make the game go a little faster. Nice vid though.

[@doncossack1016]

24:14 Overcooked air systems have ruined more than one game!

[@johnbrown7858]

Great thumbnail review of a "big" game. I think the air power is super important to this entire campaign. While this game is impressive, it looks a little bit clunky to me. I think I'll pass on this one. Thanks for your review.