TikTok vs YouTube with Hank Green

It isn't often that Marques speaks with someone who has been making videos on KZbin for longer than he has! In this one we bring on Hank Green to talk all about social media monetization and what it's like to be a creator on multiple platforms. Marques and Hank dive deeper into a video that Hank made discussing the TikTok creator fund and why it likely isn't a sustainable option for creators who are trying to make a living.
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
01:09 Hank Green has entered the chat
03:43 How KZbin treats creators and how Hank views KZbin
11:20 Twitter and other social media platforms
21:32 (Ad break)
21:34 Diving deep into Hank's video
38:52 (Ad break)
38:58 Being on KZbin for a long time
47:12 Race from A to Z
51:29 Outro
Links:
Hank Green video: bit.ly/3Hs3Co9
Twitters:
/ wvfrm
/ mkbhd
/ andymanganelli
/ hankgreen
/ adamlukas17
Instagram:
/ wvfrmpodcast
Shop the merch:
shop.mkbhd.com
Join the Discord:
/ discord
Music by 20syl:
bit.ly/2S53xlC
Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

[@hellomakaylahappy]

Wow proud to be one of MKBHD’s 3% female audience 🙌🏼

[@christina4941]

Same

[@tinkerer7813]

Hank is an OG for KZbin lore. Him and his brother are almost like the godfathers of what KZbin creators are today. Silent but immensely influential.

[@vyvyanne]

yeah they created VidCon for goodness sake

[@paulah.l.]

I was so excited to see this episode! I could listen to these two talk about anything for days. Also, I am shocked to be in the 3 % of women who watch MKBHD videos. Never though there were so few of us.

[@prettystreetchic]

I’m a woman and far from a nerd or techie but somehow I stumbled on this podcast and never looked back! Love!

[@Shirley36]

Woo! Part of the 3% represent!

[@boredpotato182]

Right! Why is that??

[@MasukaMutenda]

Also had no idea. I’m shocked at the ratio actually. Been subscribed since 2015.

[@jua-nia]

Sameee 🙃

[@Matkatamiba]

Hank's reaction to the male:female ratio was fucking funny

[@Kylefassbinderful]

Words cannot express how much I appreciate Hank Green and all of his KZbin content.

[@prestonbruchmiller497]

I'm so stoked P4A made over 3 million this year.

[@josipjagic]

Completely agree

[@PhoneRepairGuru]

The collab of the century

[@Josephalbuqu]

Hey!

[@XLessThanZ]

👍 Wow, Hank is a bundle of knowledge. I thought this might be a boring episode for me, since I only do YT as a hobby of my hobby, but Hank really opens your eyes to very interesting bits of info I didn't know. He's good to have on call, maybe when there's something big going on with YT or TT.

[@apocalypse487]

You should check all of his channels. SciShow is pretty big.

[@XLessThanZ]

@@apocalypse487 🤙Right on! My kinda channel. I just subscribed.

[@domdoug]

I cannot tell you how well the release time of the pod works in the UK. Friday nights now always involve cooking and listening to waveform, preferably with a beer. This podcast is great, introducing a verity of guests will only make it better!

[@MM-dw4ew]

Same!

[@caraellen936]

It's so strange to me, hearing how little of Marques' audience is female. I experience the overwhelming male majority in IT every day at university, but I don't feel like that on tech youtube as a woman, which I think is great on the basis of feeling included still, but also I think it's really sad how few women there still are in the tech communities.

[@imran5373]

Well, it all starts with the good ol' "men go hunting, and women stay at home cleaning", like many people know, men got jobs earlier than women, until women stood up for their own rights, but still, majority of IT universities will have more male students because men spend more time than girls playing videogames, programming, and being ona computer overall. Still sad to see such a small amount of girls actually taking part in IT.

[@Dakarai_Knight]

@@imran5373 A lot of the main reason is cultural. Girls are either directly or indirectly told what careers to aim for same as men. Men who want to be nurses aren't seen as much of men and women in tech aren't seen as feminine etc. As a gay brown person in tech I see that as well it's hard to get into a field that has so few people that are like you there already. Some of our professors also see it like that. Occasionally I get a homophobic or not overtly but still somewhat racist teacher. I mean a lot of them are in their 70's the demographic has some people whom hold those beliefs. I've gotten negative grades on exams because a teacher didn't think I deserved to pass despite doing well in his court. After I complained he was put through sensitivity training again (3rd time according to another professor and student) and he still has his Job and I eventually settle to pass with a C when I had an A- before the final. There's a lot of barriers for certain groups of people and it's so unfortunate.

[@TohirT]

This is such an amazing discussion. The nuances Hank brought to every topic makes me excited about the creator economy. This is the stage where we at now - we have highly knowledgeable professionals debating commercially impactful topics.

[@youknowhu]

It's always admirable to see the amount of introspection that Hank does. Just look at Mark asking any question and it's immediately apparent that Hank has thought about the question or another related question at some point in his mindset. What a fascinating guy!

[@svenr101]

I listen to Tangents (one of hank’s podcasts) and waveform religiously, this is just the collaboration I wanted to see!

[@me_jd]

Hank the absolute 🐐as usual. Love the crossover episode.

[@lexikiq]

KZbin also is way above and beyond with accessibility compared to every other social media site i know of. it has support for rich subtitles, translations for video titles + descriptions + subtitles, and they've even finally started to roll out multi-audio tracks to allow videos to get descriptive audio (for blind/vision-impaired individuals) or natively dubbed into other languages. most of this stuff is, like, standard for TV broadcasting and has been for a long time, and yet the rest of Silicon Valley really can't be bothered. closest competitor i can think of is Twitter which supports image alt text and basic/plain subtitles in i think just one language. so, yeah, basically nothing compared to YT.

[@karatjuicepodcast]

This topic is right on time … fortunately it is relevant for me because I am primarily on KZbin and only recent started dabbling on Tik tok. Great interview and conversation fellas.

[@Kylefassbinderful]

Out of all the content I consume everyday I'd say KZbin makes up 85% of it. It's by far my favorite use of the internet. I've had Premium for about a few years at this point.

[@ZainAli-lq1bw]

I’ve never clicked on a podcast quicker. This is gonna be fantastic

[@justnate-4810]

same

[@SinthumStudios]

same

[@KeeganEvansPhoto]

This was fantastic guys! Could listen to many more just like this! 🔥

[@Dylan-zm3ht]

KZbin really needs to figure out this shorts stuff. I do not want to see shorts in my subscription feed. Until they figure that out I am ignoring youtube shorts.

[@latenightmurmur]

I kept postponing to watch this video because I knew the information intake will be large but gosh am I freaking glad that i finally have the time to watch it. This is amazing and I love how these two bring up so many things that just require attention and awareness

[@rubenmoreno407]

It's not that I'm avoiding the internet like Marques said, but I've never heard of the guy, not even once until today. I have different interests than what he does, so the only way for me to know, is for him to show up in my own interests, like on the podcast. I'm getting to know about more people just because of Marques bringing them in 😀

[@joselivingroom5951]

Hank Green is a legend. If you have struggled in understanding a academic subject, he has helped you out.

[@BruceTheLee]

Hey Marquess, I’ve been a really huge fan of your work and find your work ethic incredibly inspiring. I would like to bring to your attention to some issue you have not mentioned. Mainly the human effects of the technology you are reviewing. Chief among them is Tesla. Tesla was accused of involvement in the 2019 military coup in Bolivia, Elon admitted to it on twitter. Tesla was sued by the state of California for a culture of racist treatment of their employees. Please speak on these issues as they are very serious.

[@ggcab5]

I never thought I would see this collab. Been a fan of both of yall for a good 10 years.

[@Target135]

Already listened to the audio on a plane :) didn't realize you post the audio earlier

[@kensg]

Wow, this is a great listening experience. You guys touch on a lot of info I needed to hear. Good stuff indeed 👍🏿

[@KidMonkii]

Add in Phillip Defranco and you got my top three most viewed KZbinrs of all time... I wonder if Marques would consider him and what he does relevant enough to this podcast. If so, that'd be my next long time creator pick for a guest.

[@paulah.l.]

Marques was on his podcast a while ago, I'm sure he finds him relevant.

[@soleneptune9498]

This guy taught me sm on crash course that I would watch anything he’s apart of 😂😂

[@FightAgainstObesity]

I only just found this. Did not realise how much I needed this.

[@U2haveaniceday20]

Wow So nice to see and listen to two intellectual people who have a great attitude and discuss the issues and matters of some of the platforms and hopefully this actually makes some sit back and think.Truly enjoyed.Also makes me feel better about the content I follow.Thanks so much Deb 👍✌️

[@Xavier0458]

You need to invite John just for the typing! John could type 80 words per minute by the time he was 12 and now says he can type as fast as he can think!

[@kassyg8256]

Completely shocked that the main channel only has 3% female viewer ratio. Super proud to be part of that but omg

[@alysonmarie]

Listening to this in Jan of 2024 - the Twitter segment! It’s wild to think how significantly that platform has changed in such a short period of time.

[@shanemooon]

The issue with TikTok is the same as Vine. It’s concept and UI does not lend itself to building communities and followings. So it is very hard to get any sort of long lasting following that transcends the platform. . We saw the same thing with Vine. It’s so short form and people post so frequently that it doesn’t have a way for you to feel connected in a way that makes you want to really follow or build a relationship with the person that you’re watching. Obviously there are some standouts that have transcended the platform and did so for Vine too. But the overwhelming majority of creators do not. In TikTok world, 1 million followers means pretty much nothing. But in Instagram it’s way more meaningful and it’s a huge deal on KZbin.

[@DailyDoseOfInternet]

great stuff

[@dna8269]

Loved this pod and the one with Colin & Samir. The KZbin/social meta discussions are fascinating. Also, What microphones and arms do you guys use? Haven't seen it listed anywhere.

[@saca.technology]

One of my favorite episodes so far 🤩

[@timbrowntown]

KZbin is the best social media platform. Is it perfect, no. From my experience, TikTok is fun but there is no moderation, and it's impossible to tell what the algorithms are doing. If you're on your phone, you're just hooked into the algorithms entirely. With KZbin, you're presented with at least some choice of what you view. This gives everyone a chance to use the algorithm, but also to correct, or guide it with human intervention. For this reason, it will never be a good choice, especially for children. It's literally like allowing the algorithm full control and it's scarier than anything I've seen when it comes to this topic. This is beyond privacy concerns. This is complete elimination of choice.

[@Bork_In_Volcanic]

Right on point. Facebook 2.0

[@2350J]

yessssss so glad hank green was able to make it to this podcast

[@daniel.cuevas]

What a cool and interesting conversation, and I have no huge personal or professional stake in the creator economy. Very insightful, especially Hank's video on his channel. Now a fan of Hank Green 👍

[@alandworsky8926]

This was such a great interview

[@losisd3ad]

this episode and the one with Colin and Samir are my favorite

[@aionbrti]

How have I never heard of Hank? I literally live on KZbin

[@shannawynn7493]

Loved this episode guys!

[@AroundWayOther]

Great discussion y'all! Was interesting to hear esp about the creator space in KZbin. Something I do want to grow on my own end!

[@eggstraordinair]

something that hit me about hank while watching this is i thought about hank as just another regular person but he is incredibly influential.

[@SydPeppa]

Shout out to Hank and the vlogbrothers!

[@AyFedd]

I was honestly not ready for two of my favorite creators in one place, I’m still a bit stunned

[@alexselg]

favourite episode yet!

[@matthewshields]

Even though I’ll never understand while Hank Green left Florida for the frozen tundra, he sure does make a lot of great content.

[@cubeofcheese5574]

Super wild that they've never actually talked before

[@novectus9933]

Not letting viewers see the number of dislikes does nothing to stop "brigading", it only stops the viewers on the platform from discerning any kind of information AT ALL from the likes and dislikes. The like value has become a meaningless number that only reflects what percentage of people bothered to click the button, with no opposing data points present.

[@oybekochilov8217]

On the topic of monetization, do you guys monetize these video? I don't recall seeing ads and I've watched a fair share of them already

[@JDOPost]

Tiktoks creator fund is an absolute disgrace. I’m glad larger creators like this are standing up, more people need to know about this. 👍🏻

[@slaterbreaker]

Because standing up to the CCP always works

[@eseukey2057]

To summarise it, he is a lecturer on social media... You're welcome.

[@vitoryarebelo3810]

I’m from Brazil and my biggest concern is that we can’t coherce fake news, and conspiracy theories. And YT itself does nothing about it. Like flat eathers

[@NeatPens]

One of the first things I noticed that views on tiktok didn’t convert the same in terms of monetization and community as on other platforms

[@yonbonny]

So excited to listen to this! :D

[@Trevenclaw]

I am too old to have seen Hank's science videos, I only know him from TikTok, so this is literally my first time ever hearing him speak for more than three minutes at a time.

[@vincentmiller420]

Honestly great points.

[@abbydeguzman]

“Do you not have KZbin Premium?” Thanks, Hank, for asking

[@Fourtyano_]

Why doesn’t anybody talk about a paid subscription that can give you KZbin premium (no ads) , pay the creator and the platform, the creator can also do in video sponsored ads , everybody wins .. you should make a video on this topic.

[@travis_approved]

What an unexpected surprise!!!

[@tron2724]

Hey marques can you please make a video on how youtube search is totally fcked up currently and shows totally irrelevant videos as to what is searched. There's a post on r/youtube called "The KZbin Search Absolutely S*cks.", it explains everything very nicely. Even though that posst is a year old, but a lot of the comments on that posst are very recent and made in just past 1 month, which shows that a lot of people have started facing this problem on a big scale very recently and are facing it currently.

[@Dave-cg9li]

Just finished watching random vlogbrothers videos and see this? Prefect!

[@one-man-band]

YUUUUS, I love Hank!

[@Charmane73]

I’m a proud member of the 3%!

[@chirag1764]

OMG HANK i clicked as soon as i saw lmao Dftba!!

[@elijahclark1700]

@MKBHD was that a Pixel 5??? 32:24

[@edhardyguy715]

Would love to see one of these as a twitch vs youtube with ludwig

[@AlexMacGregor]

Great video guys

[@Kylefassbinderful]

I love Twitter because it's incredibly simple. You can tweet stuff, public or private. You can follow your favorite KZbin content creators and certain former presidents. Simple and sometimes fun.

[@theglowcloud2215]

Removing the dislike stats was and is indefensible. KZbin's judgment is poor overall, but the dislike thing really broke it. Claiming that dislikes were *overwhelmingly* being used as a brigading cudgel is a flat lie. Sure, sometimes dislikes were used as a weapon, but usually not. Now, how does the average person know if a video is fucking garbage?

[@KitBetts-Masters]

85:15! MKBHD calls me world class!

[@onlyvontrez7961]

This is so legendary I can’t wait to meet you

[@unstablefusion3]

I didn’t know who Hank Green was until I saw the Crash Course page pop up.

[@justincosta89]

WVFRM should have a wall of various keyboards. Mechanical, a cheap keyboard, or the Apple keyboard. Have more than just three, but it would be a cool feature to the typing test.

[@sportsvideos5034]

Where is timestamp man ???? 👀 is it fully about KZbin vs TikTok ?

[@KrazyKobold]

I really want a follow up to this video interview now

[@jasminzhong4718]

The collab we didn’t know we needed 35:28 didn’t know I was part of only 3% 😭😭

[@jjunture]

Hank Green?!?!??!? Yes, Please!

[@43lk]

There are tools like 'bring back Dislike' awesome addon to browser.

[@virgil.alonso]

Holy shit WVFRM got the founder of Vidcon.

[@svibhavm]

97:3 !!!! WOWWW. didnt expect that

[@tetogt]

I dont remember from who I heard/read this about it because I don’t think I’m smart enough to come up with it on my own. But from a business perspective it makes total sense to remove the dislike button. In the end youtube wants you to spend as much time as possible on youtube. So when you remove the dislike button and are looking for videos (my case right now I’m getting a puppy so puppy training videos) without the dislike button I dont know which videos are good and not so I have to sit through a good portion of each video before making my mind and say “yup this sucks” or “yup this is what I need”. All while I’m spending more time on youtube and making them happy. So they can justify it however they want but for me it’s just a business calculated decision.

[@EdwardsNH]

Can we point out how Hank put himself in MKBHD colors, right down to his glasses frame?

[@dertythegrower]

Tiktok relies on youtube and half my mobile ads here are for tiktok and fecebook apps.. says it all!

[@dertythegrower]

and i never used either spy app on my phone, ever

[@LolaLand]

Every big KZbinr brings massive views to TikTok but almost no TikToker can bring views to KZbin…says a lot too.

[@ruffsnap]

50:37 - Quinn and Marques getting sub 5 for that alphabet test is really impressive! Fastest I could get was just over 5!

[@rampadmanabhan4258]

Got 3.3 once today, but that was once in about 10 tries...

[@ajakethompson]

I only associate an add with a video if it's part of the video, like a sponsor, etc.

[@bipedalfrog7979]

great podcast

[@IanZainea1990]

47:07 I agree. I think KZbin is the most "platform" of any social media. They really do feel more like direct TV, or whatever, than like a New York times. If that makes sense

[@alexisyohanblack3154]

me enjoying this video without ads for free

[@hamza-chaudhry]

13:53 Well recently, I've been seeing ads in the replies section of a tweet

[@FutureAbe]

Hank is a CREATOR hahah A CREATOR! Like a god or summat

[@ejsese]

i think repeat guests should just update their times, like if they do better they move higher on the board

[@devilfriend]

The dislikes things was kinda "solved" by reddit by hiding the dislikes but showing an asterisk for "controversial" threads, or videos in the case of KZbin. That could work.

[@laexploradoraaaXD]

Wow. I've been watching John and Hank for 15 years and I'm in the 3% of tech female viewers

[@Daiooo9899]

Min 14:50 I honestly don’t know them. I don’t use tik tok, I think 99% of the video you found in that platform are cringy af. And also I hate those people in public places acting like dumb people.

[@sophistic9907]

Is the sibilance bad for everyone on this video or is it just my headphones?

[@Mezelenja]

I’m with Hank. I still haven’t seen a single good point for the dislike button. Like what are we losing out on? We can still comment, Which is wayyyy more useful than a like:dislike system. KZbin was the only platform that still had a dislike button in the first place, taking away the dislike button saved a creator a bit of mental anguish, and dislike bombing has been removed entirely from the platform, so both big and small creators win. Those three points for me completely deflate any argument for the dislike button.

[@mussymuss1]

Personally, there are some clickbait videos that if you see the like to dislike ratio, you can quickly click off to a better video. This is especially the case for some "how to" videos. The comment second can also be moderated by the person who posted the video.

[@UpHigherMusicOfficial]

I disagree. The like:dislike system is easy to use to just gauge whether a video is good or not rather than poring through the comments. The creator is still able to see the ratio, so I'm not sure what mental anguish you're talking about. They should have addressed dislike bombing specifically rather than just getting rid of the dislike button altogether, taking everything else with it. Maybe better algorithms detecting whether a video is getting a large amount of dislikes in a short amount of time? There are people with better ideas.

[@UpHigherMusicOfficial]

And as some other people have been saying, dislike bombing is not widespread, so why get rid of the button for such a rare issue?

[@JonathanEBoyd]

interesting perspectives solid collab