To All the Dank Anons . . . Shall We See You Anon? | Blog and Mablog

[@nate9388]

I swear that Doug and Joel could fix the situation up un a private conversation in under two hours.

[@YTTraveler777]

I don't think so. You haven't delved yet into the philosophies behind Webbons camp.

[@BenGallows]

Only if Joel agreed to work for Israel like Doug does.

[@nicks3933]

@@YTTraveler777I believe the issue is one group believes denying the Holocaust sends you to hell and the other group believes actual heresy sends you to hell.

[@youngsterjoey9038]

@@BenGallows 🐽

[@spartakos3178]

Only if Joel gave up his hitlerite fetish.

[@HonestlyNow4Real]

Am I being too simple? Be an anon to avoid cancellation by employers and other potential opponents of the Gospel, but operate as though your pastors, your wife, and all your adult children knew it was you.

[@jamesedwards.1069]

Don't forget God knows it's you. God is our most honest critic and our most loyal champion. If we conform ourselves to His revealed will for us, we will prosper. Psalm 1 1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful. 2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night. 3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper. 4 The ungodly are not so: but are like the chaff which the wind driveth away. 5 Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous. 6 For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.

[@RebekkaMH13]

And, because we are weak humans, some of those people should probably have access to that account for accountability. Pretending that my pastor can see it and an actual pastor that sees it are two different things. The pretend pastor might agree with you more often than the real one. 😅

[@topkapi9351]

@HonestlyNow4Real Joel, Wess, and Michael all agreed that if you have an anon account some pastoral authority in your life should know that the account is you in order to keep you accountable. Guess that didn't make the clips shown in this video though. Wonder why. 🤔

[@jillthomson3038]

@@topkapi9351You’re right, I also listened to that podcast & Joel made that clear.

[@michaellautermilch9185]

All perfectly biblical content, except continuing the internal wars isn't great. Also theres no way you could listen to the full Right Response podcast and conclude Joel was giving the unbibilcal anons a free pass. Clips out of context.

[@joeadrian2860]

Well then that blame must go to the "Unsupervised Woman Tweeting" who has been know to engage in slander in my estimation pertaining to Joel. I didn't like it and got Blocked for my, perhaps a bit to harsh tweeting against her (I probably shouldn't have used the pun 'brainless') and would apologize for the unnecessary name calling.

[@justinwiebe2459]

Pastor Wilosn, they weren't responding to you in that video. They were responding to Pastor Durbin's assumptions about anons

[@justinwiebe2459]

It sounds like you and Joel agree that anons can be great or terrible

[@carlosbrown6208]

They seem to disagree on the distribution of great and terrible anons

[@justinwiebe2459]

@@carlosbrown6208 Except didn't Pastor Wilson start out the video with "a small minority"?

[@carlosbrown6208]

​@@justinwiebe2459 I come to that conclusion because one side thinks this is a major problem and the other doesn't. Even if they agree that those categories exist, they obviously don't agree on the degree to which those categories are distributed.

[@philipmurray9796]

Im against nazi anon accounts and thinking the jews are behind every nefarious deed ... but also against putting forth a declaration with Tobias name on it after his lying and slander against Joel. Where does that put me?

[@YTTraveler777]

It puts you wrong. Tobias did not slander. Webbon has lived up to every concern we had/ have.

[@philipmurray9796]

@YTTraveler777 it is documented that Tobias has slandered. Unless he can prove his claims that there is a prevalence of Holocaust denialism in Joel's church. Where was the study and poll done of the church congregation? Let's see the proof?

[@michaellautermilch9185]

Tobias shared a private text message with the whole world, for the purpose of shaming someone into repentance without first talking about the private sin privately. He had alternatives, such as replying directly to the text in question. It seems fairly clear to me that this was not correctly handled by Tobias.

[@quinnpeterson2716]

@@michaellautermilch9185 amen. Not to mention, when you go listen to the entire zoom call, it ends with Joel and his member clearing up any misunderstandings and asking if there is anything more Tobias would like to see. He says no and they wish each other the best. That’s the last thing said before Tobias does his American debut podcast trying to ruin Joel’s career over that same call. Pretty weasel like.

[@topkapi9351]

@@philipmurray9796 depending on who you ask... hell. It puts you in front of the gates of hell with an Admission One ticket in your hand.

[@topkapi9351]

Doug, I hope you listened to the whole episode that those clips came from, and not just the clips. Those clips do not show the whole context of what Joel said or his condemnation of vile behavior by some of the anons, *which appear elsewhere in the episode.* As someone who I'm sure has been maliciously taken out of context before, I hope you are not helping to perpetuate that same offense here. That said, I have my doubts, seeing as little consideration seems to be given to the condemnation that Joel gave elsewhere in the episode. Also, probably not wise to take clips from someone with the user name/handle "Unsupervised Woman Tweeting," - with a name like that, there's surely no way they're a good faith actor in this situation. Post Script: It's also a little disappointing that you either 1) are not aware that Joel *helped* Spurgeon craft his statement or 2) chose to not acknowledge it. I hope it's only the former and not the latter, because if it's the latter, that doesn't seem very brotherly.

[@ExNihiloComesNothing]

Doug is having a moment here and your thought out response is getting in the way

[@darthbigred22]

Buddy I think this is why we are all learning why we'd never heard of Doug Wilson before we really got involved and why randos know who Joel Webbon is. One is trying to fight a war against pagans and the other wants to appear they are fighting a war.

[@Nobodyofimportance2u]

Spot on ​@@darthbigred22

[@ratchet-z3d]

Well Doug is also not a good faith actor, so it all works out for him

[@masonmcelroy8125]

I am not a Joel Webbon fan, in fact I didn't even know who he was before this controversy. However, this is NOT going to go away until you address the apparent slander and lies told by Tobias. If you do not believe he DID slander Joel, you need to come out and say it. If you DO think he slandered Joel then WHY is he one of the "collaborators" on the Antioch declaration?

[@austinrothjr]

He has explicitly come out and said he doesn’t think Tobias slandered Joel. It was post on Blog and Mablog a couple weeks ago but I don’t think it was recorded on audio/video.

[@spartakos3178]

Bearing false witness (Holocaust denial, which is an objective and obvious lie) is a damnable sin, and like any other needs to be repented of.

[@ExNihiloComesNothing]

@@spartakos3178thanks Tobias alt

[@RebekkaMH13]

Which slander and lies was he charged with?

[@MansterBear]

@@spartakos3178 Does that go for all mainstream narrative history accounts? What if you deny the moon landing? Or climate change? Or that America founded on and continues on systematic racism? If a lie = doubting or outright denying the currently accepted version of history then you’re about to create a bunch of sins. In fact, that’s pretty much what we went thru in real time about 4 years ago with a certain flu season…

[@tycer9754]

Moral of the story: spend less time on social media.

[@camthejock]

literately lol

[@Yesica1993]

Except online stuff eventually does bleed into real life.

[@forsterfarm4492]

I just want to point out, all of us deal with anons, AKA trolls. Joel deals with them. You deal with them. Anyone with a public platform deals with them. Joel doesn't have to tell "his" anons to lay off of you any more than you have to tell all of the trolls following your account to lay off any one else out there - because you CAN'T. It is impossible, the trolls will always exist. This is just internetting 101. The minute someone starts complaining about the trolls, or anons, they've lost the argument. You simply need to block them or ignore them, but they aren't Joel's fault. They're here purely to chip at your armor until your show a little tear - which has just happened with this video. I hope you all just make up and move on.

[@theMolluskMan]

Exactly. Well said.

[@nerychristian]

Exactly! The more Doug argues about this topic, the weaker it makes him seem. It makes him look sensitive and unable to forgive

[@robertlewis6915]

You realize that part of Wilson's point here is that Webbon is encouraging the anons?

[@Connnacht]

We all deal with them AND we don't need to disavow every single comment

[@AndersAylward]

I don't think either side realizes how much they are losing the respect of those who already followed them by this disputing

[@nerychristian]

True. It seems like these people are just disputing each other out of intellectual pride.

[@lewislibre]

Agreed I’m over this crap

[@justinchamberlain3443]

@@nerychristianright that’s called Calvinism (ie pseudo intellectual pride)

[@austinrothjr]

It’s not even so much a disappointment over that they are disputing but how and what. This whole anon conversation is a complete distraction from real issues. Doug has been accused of having an anon army. I never saw so many so-called Christians spew bile more than when I started following in his circles. Doug sees no need to repudiate his anon supporters, some of whom are guilty in all the way he mentions here. Likewise, I see no need for him to do so. However, he seems to think Joel must do exactly what he has not. I would love to hear a good debate on how they differ in their understanding of Israel, ethnicity, and nation. It seems all we’re going to get is complaints about anons doing what anons do.

[@AndersAylward]

@austinrothjr at this point a public debate is likely the only thing that could satisfy those with contempt for the way they've behaved. If you're going to air out your dirty laundry in public, you need to own up to it in public, and not just through videos and tweets

[@Nobodyofimportance2u]

Is Doug a pastor or a youtuber? Right now he looks like he is bad at both

[@jessetoler8171]

Yea, these disputes aren't helping anyne.

[@samgott8689]

Psst: it looks that way because it is that way

[@EarlSimmons-f2n]

Always been a bad pastor, a plagiarist, and a slavery apologist.

[@austinrothjr]

I wonder if Doug actually listened to the whole episode or if he just took the clip from the UNSUPERVISED WOMAN TWEETING account and ran with it? I find myself caught between two men I like and respect so I have to listen to everything they say about each other right now to get the full picture. Though I’m generally closer to Doug theologically it seems like Joel is actually approaching this whole thing in a more serious way. I think there are substantive differences that go beyond anons that I’d love to hear more about but all the ink in Moscow is being spilled on anons and neo-Nazis. I had no idea there was such a problem until November. Maybe it’s because I don’t have Twitter.

[@777enc]

I’m a member of Canon+. I purchased many books from Canon Press. I’m really disappointed by the way both sides are handling this. At what point are you guys going to meet each other in person and talk it out like Christian men. Both sides are acting like a couple of 14 year-old girls. This is disappointing.

[@lkae4]

Yeah, so disappointing. Maybe American Protestantism deserves to go away because I see no real leaders.

[@mrich21087]

Who started all of this? It wasn’t Joel.

[@HusGoose]

@@mrich21087 it was/is Joel. His regular posts about Israel and discourse with Isker were the signal for blue haired red eyed Anons. If you think this is about the German pastor and the meme, the issue isn’t the issue and you don’t know what is going on.

[@nerychristian]

I agree. Most of us don't care about these disputes. They seem silly to me. Why not just ignore when people say things that we don't like? It's just part of life.

[@lkae4]

@@nerychristian I know a guy who is so angry at all the CN Christians he thinks are tolerating racist comments without joining his activist. He accused me of being racist because I refuse to join his crusade against CN. I want to ask him if he expects the same of his mother or wife or children. Or do they get a special exemption because they won't be manipulated and will absolutely call him out for his nonsense behavior.

[@michaelclark2458]

You make valid points about anon accounts getting to vile and outrageous. And I get you sit opposite Webbon, Conn, etc. I get that you think they are soft on nazis and then think you are soft the other way. I personally advocate every believer gets off of all socialist media. However I fail to understand why you have not rebuked publicly Tobias for starting this whole controversy. And call for him and Joel to hash out their differences. Perhaps you could moderate it. It seems to me the only ones winning here are anon accounts you repudiate, and the secular world seeing much infighting inside of Christendom.

[@arcanum3882]

Doesn’t need to be even “moderated” and public, should just be mediated

[@michaellautermilch9185]

It's public at this point though

[@michaelclark2458]

@@arcanum3882 it should of been private. It should have never went public. You are right about that. Tobias made it public. And his friends DW, JD, JW have made it a very public issue now. This video is even linked to it. It would be best to publicly hash it out. No more he said, she said.

[@RebekkaMH13]

​@@michaelclark2458 Tobias mentioned that hatred of Jews for being born Jews was creeping into reformed camps. When asked, he generally named some names and broad circles where it was happening. (Which we all were able to see even before he said anything. Thanks, white boy summer video.) Joel Webbon is the one who made personal and private things public. If I'm wrong, here, I'd really appreciate a video name + time stamp where I can look it up for myself.

[@KevinVanGelder]

The thing that is disturbing is your handling of this entire situation.

[@kpope7007]

i have no interest in these videos. Please for the love of Christ and His church, take this off line. Leave your offering at the door and be reconciled to your brother. Most anon responses will stop at that point. Since you are the elder I beseech you to make the first move humbly. Many are calling, begging, praying for this. cast ego and pride aside. It’s not cute,clever, or funny. Praying for you Doug.

[@sterlinggeorge205]

so according to uncle doug, joel must personally shepherd every single anon on x that happens to agree with us on anything, but at the same time he must positively renounce them and get them cancelled. seems reasonable.

[@harrisonmoore6346]

Can yall meet and work this out already

[@Connnacht]

"DO YOU DISAVOW?" Sounds familiar...

[@Nick-ex1qn]

What happened to No Enemies On The Right?

[@MrTimoteo1981]

I've purchased over 20 books from Canon Press over the past few years, and I've learned a lot from Doug and the content Canon puts out. I've also been a Blog & Mablog subscriber for over five years. This feud has gotten so ridiculous that I've unsubscribed and I'm walking away until they can sort this out. I have little children at home who can reconcile more quickly and then just let it go. Lead us by example in this situation and work it out. Please. Many of us have looked up to your ministry and have shared your videos, books, and blog posts over the years and now you're making us feel embarrassed by all of this. Just reconcile and move on already.

[@AngryChiropractor]

Didnt all of this start because one of Webbon's church members shared a holocaust meme? And havent you already claimed in the previous video that alot of this is for show, because Hegseth is a member of your Synod? This is ridiculous and does not bring glory to Christ, or unity among bretheren. If he had shared a meme about Ghengis Khan, or even the Armenian genocide, i HIGHLY doubt there would be this much showboating and grandstanding, if any. Calling attention to something as benign as a meme (albeit, one probably in poor taste. I havent seen it.) has caused a malignant situation, and given a platform to these same anons. Its also heaping fuel on the fire, because the obvious over-reaction is making it look like they are right, at least in their own eyes. Arguing with people on the internet has almost never resulted in a change of mind of the parties engaged in argument; however, arguments between parties HAVE influenced the people who come and read the comments, and right now you are playing into your opponent's hands. We are all either gate-keepers or pipe-lines of our online shared opinions. You look like youre intentionally grand standing for click, likes, comments and those sweet dopamine hits at this point. And mayyyybe to have something to point back to when the Neo-Libs try to accuse the Reffies of being mean to jews. All of you need to meet in person, without cameras and a live stream, and find unity.

[@MySaltyFitness]

Do y'all read your comments? How is your unsubscribe rate with Canon Press? Open your eyes - these are YOUR people that you are confusing & that are leaving your platform. Not a bunch of wild-eyed extremists.

[@lkae4]

This is not reasoning. This is a personal quarrel. No matter how clear you think you're explaining it, many, as shown in the comments, will continue to see it as nothing more than a personal quarrel until the quarrel is resolved. So please stop trying to reason it.

[@nerychristian]

Exactly. At this point it just sounds like a man who is trying to sound intelligent while talking bad about the other party

[@anitasmith203]

​@@nerychristian you mean Webbon?

[@nerychristian]

@@anitasmith203 I mean anyone who feels the need to go back and forth at each other online. If Doug was a true believer he would just call him and try to settle the matter privately. And if he can't settle the matter, just let it be. I can guarantee most people don't care about this dispute

[@RebekkaMH13]

​@@nerychristian "If Doug was a true believer"?

[@nerychristian]

@@RebekkaMH13 It's an expression. Kind of like when women say "If you were a real man you'd pay for my meal". Even though we know that a man is a man whether he pays for a meal or not.

[@asherfong6906]

This is pure, unadulterated anon fuel

[@JuanInATrillion]

Moscow is losing its mood…..

[@mrich21087]

Gaining Prissy Boomer Status or PMS

[@darthbigred22]

He lost me when he said he envied jews. My God maybe it's I don't respect any rich man who didn't get there by some great invention or war winning. Just making smut or usury is hardly something to brag about.

[@nando7522]

Of all the anons, the kind Pastor Doug and the rest wants people to disavow (what a gay word that has become) none of them have ever been as bad for my soul (not at all actually) as DW, JW and Apologia with the way they have handled this. What a shame. We're not supposed to take the bait Pastor Wilson and you're not supposed to be the one rigging the hook.

[@heresyhunters]

Eventually Doug will realize this drama is getting him nowhere. By then it will be too late.

[@Pastor_Grant]

I dont understand, AD is on the network still So have you broke fellowship? Doesn't sound like a debate among brothers at this point

[@HonestlyNow4Real]

@@Pastor_Grant I agree. Anons are just a side issue when there's this elephant in the room knocking things around and stinking up the joint. Get everyone in the Crosspolitic room and talk it out!

[@Pastor_Grant]

@@HonestlyNow4Real the videos back and forth are not helping, Doug should have never shared the Tobias thing, he should just admit he was wrong or at least reach out, Doug has invited enemies out to wine and them, to chat why not invite brothers Joel and AD out to talk it out?

[@stryker5573]

@@Pastor_Grant I like Doug but please try to find a Boomer that ever walked something back in repentance.

[@danielnoel3540]

The comments about Webbon are really disappointing and not made in good faith. You hold him responsible for the behavior of foolish anons despite his condemnation of them while simultaneously assuming that you can be absolved of any responsibility you may have for foolish anons supporting you. This approach is not helpful. Sit down and have a man to man chat with Webbon. Arguing through blog posts and KZbin videos does far more harm than good.

[@Rollravens]

I can think of fews things as disheartening as what all the men involved in this dispute have put on display over the past few months. We have read your books. In fact you inspired us to write our own. Only to discover it appears your content was not about building up writers and creators for future generations, it was aimed at your personal success and influence. We've traveled to your conferences where you exhorted us to put aside pride to be quick to repentance. Only to discover you refuse to follow your own exhortations, and its shameful. Building Christian burrows is useless if we position them as watch towers against other burrows. Humble yourselves lest you be humbled

[@YayGrr1]

Amen, brother.

[@EthanSnyder-zk5ov]

So what exactly is Doug hoping to accomplish? The Anons don't care that you keep making videos like this saying "hey you shouldn't be saying this stuff." They don't care Doug. Just block the accounts that bother you and move on. It's the Internet, you're not going to convince trolls to play nice.

[@peterholland5517]

Someone needs to teach Doug about Dead Internet...some anons are good, some are bad, most are bots

[@EthanSnyder-zk5ov]

@peterholland5517 Doug also seems to operate on the assumption these anon accounts are all young reformed men in the church. In reality the vast majority are random trolls who could care less about the church much less are part of it.

[@luftstanza]

I can’t finish this. So much bloviating and gaseous noise coming from this spat.

[@f4g1980]

They didn’t start the fight. Doug should have told Tobias to stop gossiping. Now he just sounds pissy.

[@f4g1980]

@03:30 the titles and podcasts should be titled ‘malevolent anons’ and not blanket statements.

[@takebackthechurch]

What's this have to do with Tobias at all? Is actually commenting on the content of the video too hard?

[@f4g1980]

@@takebackthechurch that is the inception

[@nerychristian]

Doug should just be a man and get over it. You can't please everyone. No matter how careful you are in what you say, there will always be someone who gets offended or distorts your argument. Just get over it and move on. At this point it just sounds like intellectual pride.

[@HartyBiker]

The way I see it, Joel outed himself and then complained at White and Wilson, spreading lies about him. White and Wilson essentially said that Pastors who won't discipline Nazis need to step down, and Joel said, "hey that's me! Stop lying about me, I am disciplining this Nazi!" Nobody mentioned Webbon's name until Joel himself told everyone that he was being unfairly treated. Something about throwing a stone into a pack of dogs and the one that yelps is the one you hit...

[@ThereforeGo]

I’m anonymous on x because I have been fired from a job before for being outspoken against abortion. However, I don’t use it ever to just troll my brothers in Christ.

[@ratchet-z3d]

Well in deranged Boomerville ALL Anons are nazi incels in their mother's basement, so too bad for you. Doug is incapable of seeing how he is no better than the left and is employing all their tactics.

[@brohooseurdaddy9522]

Big things are happening in our culture at the moment and yet we are talking about anon accounts. Respectable people are losing the plot IMO.

[@heisaltogetherlovely7235]

Why are you worried about the dank anons ?

[@banemaler]

"Please disavow the peanut gallery." Where have I seen this play before?

[@earth9531]

@3:53 Sure. We’re all individuals and groups don’t exist and don’t exhibit group behavior and make heavy use of in-group preference. Every. Single. Time.

[@gokupepper]

Keep this reformed telenovela going, but Wilson will be the big loser, and perhaps become one of its villains.

[@ratchet-z3d]

He already is the villain. People fleeing from him in droves. As it should be. Christ is purifying His church.

[@gokupepper]

@@ratchet-z3d interesting. Do you have any evidence, even if it's anecdotal?

[@pborkstrom]

I missed this whole controversy and it looks like things are going sideways.

[@levi-316]

I wish there was a quick sum up on this whole thing. I've listened to all the people involved periodically but I still have no idea what this is all about.

[@HusGoose]

No it’s exposing those who are unqualified. Webbon is one. I am in his generation and the arrogance he and others displays is on blast as they try to jockey for their various brands of Christian nationalism. And It’s because of how they lead and what they believe we will never get it. It’s simply a graceless gospel free-sacralism.

[@ahabion]

Ditto

[@nerychristian]

It's basically men getting their feelings hurt, and trying to sound intelligent while they talk bad about the other side

[@darthbigred22]

To sum up quickly: Some weirdo German pastor no one heard of before claims that he heard Joel Webbon didn't excommunicate a member from his church over a joke meme. The meme was a little girl asking her mom what the Holocaust was, the mother says "it was the one time the jews had to work and claimed it killed them". Silly 4chan joke, basically Family guy level harmless as the joke is mostly poking fun at jews for not being known for working manual labor jobs. Anyways German pastor calls Joel, freaks out on him with some other randos about the meme, because Joel didn't boot the guy who passed the meme around out of his church. Doug Wilson and James white get involved, side with the german pastor, and now here we are. They make some website called "the Antioch Declaration" which wants you to accept the post war WW2 consensus on the Holocaust, or that Judaism isn't uniquely dangerous to Christians, etc. It's strange like Doug doesn't seem to get why people walked away from being pre Mil is because of the noticing or bench sitting of the boomers over that end of the world event they're all sure is tomorrow. Anyways this is the end of Joel and Doug.

[@shannontederoff246]

Grateful for all the mentioned podcasts. I do see this as the free market being the free market. There is only so much time and so many podcasts. Competition is playing a role in these disputes. I think the majority of commenters here would like reconciliation. So many good men that need to respect each other for the Kingdom.

[@treybarnes5549]

I’m a teacher and once you lose respect you lost your ability to teach. Pastors have completely lost their ability to pastor

[@puttervids472]

How bad is it that I’m an anonymous account- and I’ve stumbled into this video and have zero idea what the controversy is about. Am I doing the anonymous thing wrong 😂. No memo sent to me.

[@Yeshuawins]

Yup i recently learned I'm probably going to hell for my cowardliness of being anonymous. Been a wild ride

[@puttervids472]

@ I think it’s a matter of peace. I’ve had. Cell phone number attached to my business that public since 1998. Same number. So I know how calls are all hours of the day. If my home address was posted , I’d have to cap a few in the front yard I’m sure. This is me seeking peace while discussing real topics. If someone can’t comment on my opinion , it has nothing to do with my lack of posted address. And let’s face it. That’s what the name no name argument is about. Doxing capabilities. And it’s not fear driven there. It’s just I want to know that the idiot who shows up is a nut , because he had to dig hard. So dealing with the threat will be righteous and easier. Takes plausible deniability away from them. Idea exchange matters not who it’s from.

[@raymond_sycamore]

I show my face on everything I do, and good lord dude the HATE is heinous. It's easy to get down about it, especially because ALL the haters go after my appearance first, rather than really anything substantive. But in hindsight I will say it makes for an easy filter. "bald" or "incel" comments go right in the "this is not a serious person" category.

[@michaellautermilch9185]

Sounds like you might have the wrong target audience

[@HoboFreightHamRadio]

I enjoy your content @raymond_sycamore

[@paulkurtz8136]

It seems to me that both sides are bringing reproach on the name of Christ by carrying on this fight so publicly. What really hurts is that the side I would have expected to be more mature appears to be the side that is most in the wrong. Please, get together and work this out. If that can't be done, then please seek a neutral thrid party to adjudicate the issue.

[@JeromePissard]

Middle schoolers playing the reputation game... and thus, the war went on. Can both camp drop this controversy now,l and move on other useful topics, or is it a marketing campaign for all the participants of this feud?

[@stevenboyd593]

"if you really want to foul things up get a computer involved"

[@Fillahsofee101]

So what you're saying is that you can dish it, but not take it?

[@leegaesswitz181]

I hate to see Doug become this person so many of us originally looked up to. He has spiraled downward and won’t live up to the standards he claims to. It’s a shame.

[@petermenkveld4162]

what part of the vid do u disagree with?

[@joshuakarr-BibleMan]

6:24 I noticed in the clip, his presupposition is the irredeemability of those who oppose his position. I'm guessing his position isnon the right, since he wants to push the others to the bluesky cesspit. It's hard to wash my hands of unbelievers. Sometimes I have to kick their dust off my feet, but even then I have to pray for them later.

[@ElizabethPD24]

With all due respect, I don’t think Pastor Doug Wilson is NOT necessarily wrong. Nor is Pastor Webbon ,I do think people who are being just hateful and saying things that are completely not Christian or wicked are not good. But the truth is there some serious discussions that real Christians are having about Zionism and the manipulation that this movement has done on the church and the name of them being chosen, and we can’t say anything against them. There’s also some serious discussion on what Judaism teaches now and it is not really about the historical law Moses and what ancient Israelites were practicing when they were following God. I think that this needs to be discussed in a very serious way that has nothing to do with ethnicity. This has to do with a Zionist movement that has nothing to do with people who are born Jewish or Ashkenazi or whatever. And a real discussion about how the majority of people who are behind, very perverted and very immoral things happen to be wealthy Zionist billionaires who are either atheist or practicing Judaism. The discussion about there being an underlining hatred of Christ and Christians in modern day Judaism needs to be discussed and a lot of people in the faith don’t understand this and are blindsided by it. This has nothing to do with Nazis and hatred and ethnicity baiting and etc.. I know plenty of Christians, whose ethnic heritage is Jewish whether that was because their ancestors converted to Judaism or because they are ethnically Jewish (southern kingdom) or Israeli (northern kingdom). The whole ethnicity thing needs to be taken off the table and we need to discuss how the nation of Israel (modern Israel) manipulates the military industrial complex for its benefit in our country and the Talmud (which Jesus called the traditions of the elders )underhandedly does not like Christians just like Muslims are hostile to Christians. Modern Judaism is the only religion that says something completely hostile and hateful about Jesus and Mary. Islam and other religions are not for Christ and do not see him as the savior of the world and do persecute Christians and are hostile in many nations, but their religious text is not explicitly say evil things about Jesus or blasphemous things. I think the church needs to wake up that modern Israel is not the same as the ancient southern kingdom of Judah and the northern kingdom of Israel. ( well maybe morally similar but so is America so that would be the pot calling the kettle black) I say all of this as someone who is friends with and knows people who are Jewish ethnically and I have nothing to do with any of this. I also think Hitler was an evil occultist and any comments or people promoting ethnic hatred are not demonstrating godly character, or Christian morals.

[@nothin2pruv]

Christ prayed that His Church be one. This video isn't exactly in keeping with that. Do you really think that because Joel openly disagrees with your positions in nuanced ways that such an adversarial posturing and putting upon him of the consequences of all anons that associate themselves with him as someone who has publicly open arms to them is appropriate? You've had similar positions for child rapists. Which seems a particularly useful example for asking is this not favoritism? It just feels like this line is beneath you, and his snide loose association with the filthy right is certainly no worse than yours with neoconservative theology.

[@Yesica1993]

"Christ prayed that His Church be one. This video isn't exactly in keeping with that. " I do not wish to "be one" with people making or defending / excusing racial hatred, Jew hatred, and making open death threats. This is not complicated. Stop pretending that it is.

[@Postmill90]

@@Yesica1993What are you talking about? Joel doesn’t hate Jews. Put down the left behind series and read your Bible again.

[@nothin2pruv]

​@@Yesica1993 That's not even what I said. Death threats? Where was that even mentioned in the greater discussion let alone this video? As for the other two, also not even the topic, but I do think I understand why you responded now. Just as a matter of emotional priority and how you read into my response. In any case you don't get to decide who the Church is, and the next time you consider that you're a sinner saved by grace ask yourself if the sins you hate most for personal reasons are the unpardonable sins or if maybe you should repent of your hypocrisy.

[@mileshall9235]

Did you intend this as copypasta 😅😅😅

[@Yesica1993]

​@@nothin2pruv It's right at 8:04. You'd know that if you'd bothered to watch the video. You're the one that needs to repent. Do not speak to me again.

[@grant7586]

Both sides need to get off the Internet and act like men .... 1 Timothy 5:13-16 Those widows who go around from house to house as busybodies are only learning to be lazy, making their situation even worse by talking too much, gossiping, and speaking things they shouldn't. They become far too obsessed with empty things that will not bear good fruit.

[@buckaroobonsaitree7488]

Most underrated comment on the comment section❤

[@buckaroobonsaitree7488]

Commenting again just to push it higher in the algo

[@theproclaimer588]

Yes it’s troubling, but why are you guys continuing to go to war on social media? I see this your way (mostly) but why keep responding? It’s getting demoralizing for many good brothers. That goes for Webbon and Wolfe and White too. This is starting to sully your reputation.

[@God1stFoundation]

Leave it reformed Christians to battle each other. Semantics, Theological pissing contests. Just stop. You weary the lay.

[@ryanmckenzie3627]

I love Doug, but I wish you would calmly work this out. I don't think I can add anything that hasn't been said, except maybe that there are plenty the godless who are happy right now.

[@micachi1693]

This is how you get more of what you're complaining about. Boomers gonna boom.

[@mileshall9235]

Joel is as cringe as they come. Every bit of his persona screams "curation of image....PLEASE repec'me!" 😅 And yeah, unless your life, physical safety, or ability to provide are at stake, anon posting is garbage.

[@tategarrett3042]

>what intelligent critique of the Doug do we have here? >"boomer, dumb" >nice

[@ctvtmo]

And children are going to act like children. Sometimes the adults have to speak up.

[@Yesica1993]

Bigots gonna bigot.

[@nerychristian]

All of this could have been avoided if Doug just ignored the people who talked bad about him. He seems overly sensitive about these things

[@JosephMorrison-q3u]

Wow. This kind of suck because these are the only 2 Christian channels I watch. I hope they work it out

[@bruisedbanana1787]

You are acting like a liberal. Trying to force Joel Webbon in line by having him name 5 unbiblical anons. Lose the pride.

[@joyfulhelpmeet]

Excellently done!!

[@PhuManchew]

I am out of the loop on this. What is going on?

[@KildaltonTheologicalStudies]

Doesn’t all of this seem a bit childish? Can’t we just grow up and redeem the time rather than wasting it with this nonsense? (Ephesians 5: 16)

[@chrisgood2go]

Isn't this whole video necessarily doing that very thing.

[@KildaltonTheologicalStudies]

@@chrisgood2goyep. Most of these pastors would do themselves and the church a favor if they got off social media.

[@KildaltonTheologicalStudies]

@@chrisgood2go Well... it may also just fuel the fire as there is a certain voyeur aspect to the watching online videos of pastors making fools of themselves, "Ooooh, what did he say NOW?" Then they say, "I wonder how so-in-so is going to respond..." and the drama just goes on and on and on. Meanwhile, the videos get views and clicks and their channels gain subscribers which only encourages this sort of behavior. I've unsubscribed from all of these people. HaVe a MeRry ChRiStMaS! 🎄

[@Utjb27]

Most (not all) anons in these examples are hilarious 🤣

[@daveonezero6258]

This has been my experience

[@burrowagency]

Public mudslinging on social media isn’t a good look, gentlemen. Instead of airing grievances online, handle your quarrel in private (Matthew 18) with your brother in Christ. This behavior (on both sides) is a distraction from the real enemies of the Kingdom. Grow up gentleman.

[@Donotreplytothis]

Doug is fantastic, a huge part of bringing our family to Christ. This is a great vlog. However, it is just more mud on the carpet. Can these Christian men just talk to each other...

[@YTTraveler777]

Have you listened to Joel Webbon or Eric Conn or Andrew Isker for that matter? These men are unreasonable. They bought into some Bronze Age Masculinity propaganda and their entire world view is now marked by it. Part of the Bronze Age strategy is to simply mock those who disagree with you. They are getting this from an author. Look it up.

[@darthbigred22]

I think deep down the real issue is he knows he's not leading the charge and can't so all he can do is sling mud because he's envious.

[@Donotreplytothis]

@darthbigred22 that is a concern, I hope it isnt the case.

[@brentheltonj6308]

Oh man I don’t have enough time time to make anon accounts

[@jeffkerr6098]

Boomers can't handle anon comments on the internet.

[@HonestlyNow4Real]

Some anons are boomers... 😂

[@theMolluskMan]

"Muh first amendment!" *someone exercises free speech to criticize Israel and question the holocoaster* "Noooo, not like that!!!"

[@JoesWebPresence]

Most of us get the whole 'us and them' thing from an early age. When we develop moral preferances in defining good and bad, we make progress. The average twelve year old couldn't explain game theory, but most of us are already observing its principles by that stage in our lives. When we incorporate empathy, putting ourselves in others' shoes and trying to understand how they came to believe what they do, we make another leap forward. Accepting that people on the other side can be well meaning and sincere is a real watershed moment. So too is realising that people who are on our side can be bloody-minded assenine pot stirrers, especially when they are right! Anons get to be vile anons because they are anons, and there can't be many anons who aren't prepared to be vile when the only reason for being an anon is to have the capacity to be vile. They are all equipped for vile anonimity. Accountability keeps things civil, and I console myself with the knowledge that God knows who spouted that vitreol and what were the motives of their hearts. I've never read anything profound and moving from an anon either. They usually have a point, but often it's a miserly, judgemental or pedantic point which they might feel ashamed to publicly admit to. Matthew 7:2 tells us that by what measure we judge, we shall also be judged, and anons would do well to meditate on this, before they find themselves before the throne of judgement on the last day, being ruthlessly demolished in their own dry, witty style, and when they ask who it is that judges them, all they'll see is a username . . . JC_anon777 followed by a row of LOL smileys and a devil emoji.

[@buckaroobonsaitree7488]

​@@JoesWebPresenceCool story bro, so what's your full name?

[@lj5116]

They never could

[@Aletheia828]

Didn’t have to repeat a cuss word to get your point across.

[@redbearwarrior4859]

I'm a Messianic Jew who affirms the five Solas and TULIP. Thank you Pastor Doug. I wonder how many of these anons can say with Shaul "In regard to the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but in regard to election they are dearly loved for the sake of the fathers."Rom11:28? 🤔 The Jews are according to election much loved!

[@ejmproductions8198]

This guy does not value clear language, does he? Being creative and artsy with the English language makes 50 % of the message go missing

[@givenjoy512]

Vast majority of these remarks is negative toward perpetuating the postmil family feud.

[@NKBC1689]

JERRY JERRY JERRY. I jest but i hope all this gets cleared up soon

[@charlesco7413]

I think that "mockery" sounds like it jests through the air faster than the speed of sound thinking, thus breaking a few moral barriers as it putters-out and losses interest.

[@joshualister8362]

Lets see what's going on with Moscow...Oh they are still shooting at the other Reformed guys I like. Can you guys just debate the issue in person and then be friends? I saw White and Wilson do this on an occasion or two.

[@samknobeloch503]

Doug, I appreciate you actually naming who you are talking about this time. Please continue to do this, for the sake of your audience. We need the clarity of knowing who you are talking about when you are saying what, so we can observe an judge for ourselves if your criticism is just.

[@slimpickens0000]

“Unsupervised woman tweeting.” Sounds like a winner..probably Blake Callens anon acct.

[@karlmadsen3179]

I want to like this guy, but he tries so hard to be so cute and witty in his criticisms of, well, everyone, it just gets boring. Maybe annoying, too.

[@pmbcdirector1489]

Could just be how he thinks and his personality, over and above trying.

[@jessetoler8171]

Wait, so anonymity is ok as long as Doug Wilson agrees with it?

[@SimplyReformed]

Well said. Thank you. Mature, clear, theological, pastoral.

[@darthbigred22]

Clear and Doug Wilson are never to be in the same sentence when any other man can make the same comment in 3 mins.

[@marybrewer2203]

Thanks for the pleasantly nutritious after-work snack. It actually made me consider the content of my posts and comments.

[@Rhinopkc]

Can someone please point to the mockery in the Bible that was utilized by an anonymous person? There may be biblical examples of mockery, but none of them are done by someone who is not putting their life on the line.

[@LucaEickhoff]

I appreciate this comment, and it’s a shame it has to be said or that it’s even up for debate.

[@tategarrett3042]

An excellent and clear case - I appreciate especially that it is specific. It isn't a general condemnation of things which just happen to be relevant to certain (unnamed) individuals (and may the audience infer the rest). Because it is specific, it cannot be twisted as easily or hit the wrong target.

[@googIesux]

Yeah he's pretty good at this. We all ought to become so

[@jaholland42]

Why have i been censured!

[@Mic1904]

Probably because you don't know how to post...

[@jaholland42]

@Mic1904 disagree. It was not contentious topic. And mostly in the camp of agreement. But you seem to know the answer. Teach me your ways!

[@christopherlincoln7819]

Doug you've started a fire that you can't stop. You where wrong and now you've got guys that are wrong attacking. Just admit you where wrong, show them how

[@LampWaters]

I just hope the whole foolishness cause ppl to discern

[@JustinHonaker]

Thank you, Doug.

[@thomasmilavec3754]

I give it one year before Webbon’s troll army turns on him.

[@HartyBiker]

It's already starting. Since he signed the natural affections statement I've seen Webbon's trolls call him a traitor.

[@austinrothjr]

@@HartyBiker Then was it really his army in the first place?

[@brentheltonj6308]

Yeah as soon as they realize he’s not a Nazi sympathizer

[@yohanmcglashan7592]

“If the anonymity is protection against righteous consequences, then the anonymity is sinful; if it is protection against unrighteous consequences, then it is not.” Nailed it! 🎯💯

[@ChristForgeChurch]

Again, Doug brings clarity and the light of God's Word into a very needed topic. Thank you! A point that I think many are missing about the "Anon accounts" is that many of them are supposed to be Christian. As Christians, the power of our Testimony in Christ is our professing and the context of our conversion to the Faith, and the fruit of our lives is the proof of that Faith lived forward. We must use discernment when taking in content online, particularly when it is combative and related to the Faith. We must judge their expertise, credibility, character, and motivation. That can only be done by looking at the fruit of someone's life and by the power of their Testimony in Jesus Christ. This is absolutely mandatory when engaging with someone speaking about Christianity. The anons surrender the power of their Testimony in Christ and the good fruit of their lives, particularly when attacking fellow Christians. I wonder why...

[@ayo-samurai]

If you would give proper treatment to biblical polygyny then these guys would have better things to do.

[@InquisitorJack]

Doug did recently cover the story of David and Abigail. Honestly, as a bachelor, at this point I’d rather force the guys that have multiple women giving them kids have to take responsibility than taxing me.

[@ayo-samurai]

@InquisitorJack could be an improvement

[@InquisitorJack]

@@ayo-samurai Would hopefully pre-empt any "conservative" commentators from yet another session of "blame single men for women's choices"

[@ayo-samurai]

@@InquisitorJack right, blame men for the options that birth control gave women.

[@ayo-samurai]

@@InquisitorJack yes let's blame men for the options that birth control gave to women.

[@CorlosMazda]

This is deeply concerning

[@HOKSevin]

This is as embarrassing and cringe as two drunk brothers fighting at a family reunion. I'm fully expecting a sloppy makeup hug at some point.🤦🤦🤦 Can't take these guys seriously anymore smh

[@ikantspell]

Christendom 2.0 off to a riveting start lol 😂. Gotta build the plane before you guys can get it in the air, and you can’t even agree on what color you want your plane to be. lol 😂

[@Yesica1993]

7:53 People saying such vile things cannot be regenerate. (Especially anyone making an open, personal death threat. I hope that was reported to police. Not that they'd care much. But at least there would be some formal record of it.) I want NOTHING to do with anyone remotely excusing/defending such filth. 10:00 Again, anyone posting filth like that and claiming to be a follower of Christ is either unregenerate, or somehow so screwed up that they need to be taken before the elders for church discipline. This is not complicated. Why are supposed Christians pretending it is?! Thank you, Pastor Doug. Good wisdom here, as always.

[@Sanctifires]

💯

[@Sanctifires]

I see this all the time from PUBLIC NON-ANON Facebook accounts lol. Absolutely unregenerate.

[@PerrinAybara1619]

When I read these comments I know I'm in the right place watching both Doug and Joel because I can see a community of peacemakers. Hope y'all can resolve this issue because it really is ridiculous. I love what both of you do and you should appreciate the other's unique talents and differences as well.

[@johnl.2895]

"... and James White" 😂😂😂

[@joelarmstrong8142]

This beef is more annoying than Eustace Scrubb. Don’t be like Trudeau, learn to read the room. Give it a break.

[@FozzyBBear]

Hey! I resemble that remark. In all seriousness I abide by the old-fashioned rules of civil discourse in that I never discuss sex, religion, or politics at (my lucrative remote) work. In my personal life in my home town I let my freak-flag fly and give my honest opinion to everyone. I salted then deleted all so-called social media accounts a decade ago and constantly sit behind 7 proxies, since the moment I heard people were being fired for expressing any opinion to the right of Mao Tse Tung or Pol Pot. I only ever use the one anon name, so everywhere you see me I am still Fozzy Bear, or Fozzy B Bear. If a comment of mine is edited I always state plainly at the end what the edit was and it's usually an apology. I occasionally walk on the dank side, but I promise I don't live there, and if I get too close I can be talked back from the ledge. EDIT: Matt 10:16 "Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves."