Top 10 Bad Games By Great Designers

[@salmonblox]

Zee, Tom, and Eric played off each other so well during the Felinia segment. I loved them being so bewildered at the surrealism. “WHY are they CATS??” And Eric’s joke was brilliant, I love the subtlety of it

[@eddieb8054]

I just saw a reprint of Felinia tonight and I was like…. This is that game. Why are they cats!!?!?!

[@JedisTrek]

I keep coming back to this one. I've lost count of how many times I've watched. It's also the most quoted list in my house.

[@eddieb8054]

I was able to attend Dice Tower Con, and able to see this live. I had such an amazing time, my best vacation ever. First Con I ever attended. So many amazing people who are passionate about games and are so friendly. I saw folks from eight years old, to about 70; having a blast playing games. I plan on coming to these forever, at least as long as I can choose where I want my vacation to be! I loved sitting there and watching Sam vent! So relaxing to see it actually happen, like live, right in front of me!!!! And for Eric, CIITTTTTTTTTADELLLLLLLLLS!!!!!!!!!!!

[@renempineda]

Game convention: the largest collection of overweight virgin losers in the world

[@Anton_Schusler]

Sam brings such a chaotic energy to this list, and I'm all here for it.

[@hellwroughtangel]

48:20 that "yes" in the background cracks me up.

[@11Garnett11]

With the exception of the mighty scream of "CITADEEEEELS", pretty much every other game listed, were "safe" choices. Unpopular and/or forgotten for a good reason. Except... for Sam. The man presented truly popular games that he simply deslikes/hates and received all the heat. Kudos mr. Healey, my experience with roborally was dreadful too! More top 10s please!

[@arlonathan9294]

instablaster.

[@bloodrunsclear]

The fact that he sat back with this beautiful expression of transcendent rage released made it all the more fantastic

[@paulgower4594]

Thumbs up to Eric. Glad to see at least someone on Dicetower that appreciates Kingdom Builder. There's far more depth and strategy to that game than first appears.

[@HITFORDCYCLE1]

Code names is a great game. You must be playing it wrong. When the other team is selecting, we throw out red herrings. It is fun!

[@DarthSironos]

58:02 it's so awesome how it's like he is powering up dragonball style to unleash all his fury ^^ You should bring him in more top tens, he fits in well.

[@trevorallaby5780]

I was in the crowd, and I definitely had to go back at watch at 58:00. Awesome!! Thanks for that Eric.

[@HainishMentat]

Eric was great. You should have him on more video Top 10s.

[@yunsuk21]

I think I heard that he lives in Connecticut, but Tom and Eric does go through top 10s on their podcasts

[@RGcrasyRG]

I don't get Eric's lists at all, even on a podcast. :D

[@Sannop24]

Mentat1231 completely agree!!!! Switch him and Sam

[@fatcattran]

Tash Kalar, one of the best games I ever played? OMG. I played it nearly 50 times and still feel fresh! Bad critic from great reviewer, Tom :))

[@TarquinTed]

Great to hear such great luminaries of the games world airing their honest opinions. Of course there are going to be disagreements, that's the nature of gaming. I have been reviewing games for nearly 40 years and I have had my share of discussions about my opinions, but generally I agree to differ and the argument is friendly and never personal; most gamers are like that. I do like the idea of the panel doing a Great Games Why? session. I would put Settlers of Catan right at the top of that list simply because of the Robber (roll of #7). Not only does this average of 2D6 roll prevent an area you on from producing it also steals a card from you and if you are already having problems gaining cards it just kicks you while you are down and keeps kicking. I have played games where one or two players have gone 6-8 die rolls without ever receiving a card and that sucks, especially when other players are gaining cards a-plenty. Before you begin to nay-say me take a look at the majority of Catan games that have come out in recent years and apart from different themes the one thing they all have in common is that the mechanic concerning the Robber has been changed, continually trying to find a balance where it is a hazard but isn't a game changer.

[@Hilipinapixili]

I was the guy who didn't get a single turn in Citadels. Even when the others noticed I was starting to get annoyed and they decided to deliberately avoid targetting me by attacking characters they didn't think I had... they STILL managed to kill my character every single time.

[@scottpduncan]

I am sorry I missed this session...it was a riot!

[@juanpablozabala4975]

It was a great oportunity to demand a Blue Moon City reprint! After reprinting Knizia´s best know games, through Euro Games line, FFG - Windrider Games really should consider bringing back this awesome game!

[@Skorrigan]

38:30 onwards OMG I laughed so hard Zee :D

[@ricke1732]

Felinia has a weird theme, but it's actually a good game. The auction mechanism is similar to Spiecherstadt (Jorvik) and came out the same year. It also has a fun area control-ish aspect.

[@ricke1732]

Jesse Whitehead I agree 100%. I almost didn't buy the game because of that strange decision. I'm glad I did, though, because I enjoy the gameplay quite a bit.

[@2teachers2kids38]

So refreshing to hear what the DiceTower doesn't like.

[@rivalskygames8314]

I would love you guys to do a 'Top 10 games that tell a story'

[@6rimR3ap3r]

Wow, at least the slightly mentioned Kingdom Builder is a game our group enjoys a lot. Kind of a gateway game more than to be really competitive.

[@Hieronymus-Pseudonymous]

"Zombiaki II: Attack on Moscow" is still available on the BGG store.

[@MrTerrakb117]

Why the hate for RoboRally? If the game was to program move a robot from one spot to another with out anyone effecting each other how boring would that be. The whole point with effecting each others movement is to add that extra dimension of conflicting with other players and adding that thinking to your programming on top of getting to your objective. I mean if being knocked of your path by other people is the main complaint then play then game solo. The game isnt cooperative after all, so knocking out people IS part of the game. The hate for it is IMO Lame. Do people hate conflict type games because they effect your plans in other games?

[@LoftOfTheUniverse]

Nah, it's just a sucky way to deal with conflict. It isn't the conflict, it is the means of how it is done.

[@jonathanmcanulty5142]

Reiner Knizia: Cthulhu Rising - Never have I ever been so dissapointed.

[@RonnieLunn84]

Be interesting to see a Top 10 Games We Got Bored Of list, different from a game being replaced by another. Just something you used to love that you eventually grew bored of. My number 1 would be Carcassonne, I still play if people want to, but I will never ask to play this anymore. Great game, just grew bored of it.

[@sybmike]

Mr. Jack??? How dare you? That is one of the best games on the market

[@halinar1]

It was interesting watching all those copies of Seafall sit around on sale... not moving at the con.

[@Gutock]

The brutality of these critiques made me never, ever want to develop a game. Thanks DiceTower! But for real, very very entertaining list!

[@hairbrainedgames3127]

Well, developing a good game is hard. None of these guys ever successfully pulled it off.

[@terrencesoltz8943]

I had the exact same experience with Temporum. It was so bad, we had trouble wrapping our heads around it. I’m not sure I’d put Vaccarino on the list of great designers, though. 504 might be biggest disappointment, just because it sounded like a cool idea. I like Tash Kalar.

[@edmundengland]

I was hoping that you would mention Hengist and Tom did! It became my daughters first game, she trashed it but had great fun with it.

[@Jnarcane]

This would've been way better if the camera had kept all four in frame. We missed out on so many great-sounding reactions!

[@ramonosuke]

This was a great and funny top 10, but it's hard to top "Top 10 games these JOKERS don't appreciate" from last year. Eric was a great addition and should be on more lists for sure I own Bloodborne, but I agree to Zee to some extent. I just hate how Tom and Sam are so apprehensive towards his reasoning. We get it you guys are Lang fans but jeez let the man speak his mind

[@darrenq1067]

"I'll do it!" - from Sam made me laugh out loud. The New Jersey coming out :P

[@PodMan26]

Zee. Zombiacki is how you say Zombies in Polish. Definitely sounds like a weird title in English, but makes perfect sense in Polish. Haha. Still, not very original to just call your game Zombies. :P

[@Michael_Sean_OConnor]

Difficult to imagine Tash Kalaar on this list...such a great and innovative system.

[@EldritchBones]

when Eric screamed Citadels all I could hear is "Khaaaaaaaaaaan!!!"

[@TiliaCordata]

That was a memorable "Citadels" 😁

[@darthvenge465]

Zee so wrong on Oasis. Sam so wrong on Code Names.

[@philippenachtergal6077]

Citadels is fine but indeed can be very frustrating when the Assassin is used. I almost always replace it with the sorceress from the expansion

[@time-zero]

More Eric next time, it was so fun !

[@TheMacius99]

This video rocks! I would like to hear Eric's point of view more often in the future, maybe on other top tens?

[@TheWarmupLap]

Maciuś Krok then listen to the audio podcast. He does a top 10 with Tom about every two weeks.

[@danddjacko]

Mine vote was Letter of Marque by Bruno Faidutti

[@nathanaelrobinson4831]

"He left you for Dan King:" those words should be immortal.

[@ObsessioknightAnimations]

36:48, Eric's volcanic eruption

[@dorpth]

1:04:32 Tom describes Cosmic Encounter!

[@GirlyGamer-BoardGameGran]

Was waiting for Seafall the whole time, thought it might be number one. Most of Zee's choices.. games you've never heard of.. played it safe, but still a great MC.

[@justingibbons8010]

And +100 to Sam for RoboRally. So horrible. Miserable game.

[@johnrogers8876]

Have Duck Dealer on the shelf but I have yet to play it. Splotter is the best design house though, and it's not even remotely close. From the dice tower gang I think the only Splotter guys are Eric and Jason.

[@johnrogers8876]

Jesse Whitehead Hopefully I'll find it to be both interesting and fun.

[@HainishMentat]

Sam as a Sith Lord, coaching Eric into the dark side, is classic stuff. LOL

[@natew.7951]

Games mentioned that I've played: Oasis - yep, I agree, bad game Blue Moon - yep, don't care for it Codenames - giving clues is fun, but I wish it weren't a team game. Guessing is boring Pecking Order - wonderful game, Tom is clueless Citadels - hasn't aged well. It was good when it came out, but it doesn't hold up well compared to modern games Fabled Fruit - meh, it was ok. I had no desire to play again Lost Cities - yes, horrible game. Not for the reasons Sam said, but because there's really no meaningful choices Trajan (mentioned tangentially) - what? 2nd best Feld game, first mancala mechanism in a Euro, good game Taj Mahal - disagree, great game, a rare Euro to reward memory

[@violentfrog_]

Played Hengest at a convention at random "Oh I like the 2 player Rosenburgs!"......sooooooooooooo baaaaaaaaaaaaaaad

[@aaronconnell3271]

Shocked to see no galaxy trucker from sam, I thought that was his most hated Vlaada game.

[@MassEffectFan113]

hyena laugh is back in the audience from that one 2013 dice tower live. sheesh.

[@sirjoshwood]

I find that I disagree with Sam the most on top ten lists... This time he got started early, Zee is clearly the best looking DT member.

[@Noonycurt]

Why do people consider Codenames a party game? I love it, but it's not a party game.

[@ricksleurink5064]

Yes and no. depends on how casual you play the game. I've played brain crunching sessions of it and loved that, but also played with laughter fillled games with 8+ groups at a party setting and loved that too. Just go with the flow and addapt to your crowd.

[@RGcrasyRG]

Well, is dixit a party game?

[@Noonycurt]

Mostly yes. There is no point in overthinking Dixit.

[@ricksleurink5064]

If Apples to Apples is... than Dixit and Codenames are too...

[@RickKoeppen]

I guess I'm not sure why someone wouldn't classify Codenames as a party game. Is it that it is more complex than you think a party game should be? Because Captain Sonar just won the Dice Tower's party game of the year, and that is ten times more complex than Codenames. Codenames is a game I pull out at parties, but won't bring out during game nights because it just has that party game feel.

[@KabukiKid]

I'd say that the "10 Days In ...." series is more accurately called glorified Racko, rather than Lost Cities. heh Mind you, I like the 10 Days In games. :-)

[@kdhlkjhdlk]

Seafall is an amazing game! It has stickers and you get to rip up things and write on them! AMAZING.

[@arekkrolak6320]

I actually checked this Zombiaki (Polish informal for zombies) game from Ignacy Trzewiczek and it exists. :) EDIT (after two years) I even played it

[@joshuareubens362]

Lord of the Rings Dice Game was a bad rule book... but... Myth will always be worse... than everything. Ever.

[@wroot_lt]

CITADEEELS!! :D Although i wouldn't cry like that, but i fully understand Eric. It's not fun at all. I have only played it 2-3 times and won't play it again..

[@Steve-L]

I don't like it either, but would try it again, but would never request it.

[@brianb5145]

Really enjoy Blue Moon City.

[@cursivecurses]

Eric clearly has not played Gauntlet of Fools by DXV.

[@hairbrainedgames3127]

Yeah, that one is way worse than any of the other DXV games. Perhaps they never played it...

[@cursivecurses]

Hair Brained Games and Nefarious has been a huge hit for our group, I like Temporum too

[@hairbrainedgames3127]

I've definitely heard mixed feedback on Nefarious (one of the rare ones I don't have). But it's definitely not hated the way this group does. I'll have to pick that one up and try it someday. It seems like it has kind of a "Despicable Me" sort of vibe, which would definitely be of interest in my gaming circle. Temporum is a decent game, I agree.

[@cursivecurses]

Eric's gripe was lack of "mad scientist" feeling. He seems to forget which designer he's talking about here, since Dominion and KB are practically abstracts. Nefarious is deifnitely more fast and loose than the rest and a lot of attacking and just general zaniness. It's fun but not as strategic as the others. To me it feels like Bruno Faidutti trying to design 7 Wonders, if that makes any sense.

[@hairbrainedgames3127]

The way you describe Nefarious, it sounds even more like something I'd enjoy. :)

[@Specialist0815]

Funny Friends is a great party game. Just do not take it seriously :) But maybe, as a German I can relate better to his humor. this is the game I lost several times when splitting up with my girlfriend and bought later again.. I think I bought it 4 times or so..

[@theicalvinist]

This must have been better watching it live. The "anger" felt awkward.

[@EverythingSpazzy]

I love Tash Kalar....

[@claudiaandalex477]

WHY ARE THEY CATS!?

[@ReadyAimFire_]

Codenames, Lost cities, Tash-Kalar or Citadels on this list? This is just trolling. These are (very) good and popular games. I dont like Scythe or Dominion (for example), but i would never call them bad. Its huge difference between not liking a game (because of theme/mechanics/whatever), and this game actually being bad.

[@spiderfingers86]

love Tash-Kalar, but to each their own

[@olafbuddenberg4787]

Sam really loves to hate on games most people like.

[@falconashek8913]

I use some of the Lord of the Rings dice with Quarriors. Corrupting your friends dice is not cooperative. I also use my Dice masters characters as well. Dragon Dice by TSR is not a great game either. I do see a lot of people still play it.

[@Steve-L]

I just played Bora Bora and thought it was fine. It is currently my 79th favorite game. It is definitely a point salad game. But I agree with Citadels being a bad game, didn't like it at all.

[@StyxTBuferd]

You can swap out characters in the new version if you don't like, for example, the Assassin. There's 3 characters per slot to choose from. Citadels is great, people just hate particular characters.

[@kriskenmonroe1]

LOL I knew as soon as he started ragging on A Study In Emerald he was going to get a hard time! That game is beloved... by the small group of people who play it :)

[@Aba19xx]

Sam I will buy your copy of Codenames (with shipping costs to Poland) with your autograph !!! Priv me please :).

[@clairvoyantmole8668]

I'm totally with Sam when it comes to Codenames. btw: Quo Vadis never was a Spiel des Jahres recommendation. Back in 1992, they didn't publish any recommendation lists, neither were there any nominees published.

[@DarthSironos]

Love this vid and their passion. A few mentions though: Codenames? Man, get a grip. Putting Codenames on a list of bad games is just wrong. If it is his opinion, his opinion is wrong ;) If you think people are taking too long deciding, just play with a timer. Citadels? You calling Citadels a bad game? The salt is real. Tom Vasel: "It's not a bad game, it's just boring".......wtf? If a boardgame is boring you, how can you consider it not bad? Weird.

[@EuropeanQoheleth]

I thought he'd say a bowl of different kinds of fruit.

[@Hieronymus-Pseudonymous]

This video will probably sell a few copies of Felinia.

[@edmundbloxam2714]

'Best Selling Games...Why?' sounds hilarious. Do it. We'll all be offended and bitter and it'll be hilarious.

[@endgame]

Seafall was terrible.. still in the middle of a campaign.

[@HaviccB]

endgame just cut ties

[@Slaneshhhh]

Zee is savage. Loved it.

[@zaratihoviolato]

Finally. Citadels is not my cup of tea at all

[@nallosword]

Funniest TOP 10 ever :D . . spoiler . . . . . Eric's Roar was amazing :D Zee Blood..... :D:D:D:D Sam codenames hate :D my favourite 3 monents

[@Hieronymus-Pseudonymous]

I raise you "Top 10 Games at Which We Rock!" and "Top 10 Games These Two Jokers Don't Appreciate."

[@RPG_Bliss]

loved the video!

[@DieNische]

Sam is soooo wrong. Alien Uprising is amazing. So tough, so intense. So wrong, Sam. :)

[@OmegaII2003]

Sam is wrong most of the time. He's consistent ... :p

[@grumble7425]

Alien Uprising is good times.

[@dago6410]

I aould advise anyone who does not like Citadels for the same reason this guy does.... to play it 1v1. Its much much more forgiving then xd

[@Justinlandonline]

This is one of their best

Thank you Zee! Aquasphere - devil's work. Worst game of all time in my opinion :D -Ilja

[@shagua2]

Eric's #2... so true

[@JB-ym4up]

504 is false advertising and bad math, there are 84 combinations, not 504.

[@texascpa]

Surprised Tom's No. 1 wasn't Hawaii

[@Steve-L]

he only designed 1 game, how can he be a great designer?

[@texascpa]

good point

[@hairbrainedgames3127]

Probably why Tom didn't make it onto the list, either. ;)

[@linforcer]

I love me some tash kalar

[@bushibayushi]

Eric is Matt Damon of board gamers :D

[@henrikwakman7776]

Blue Moon is indeed blah

[@silviobogsan]

Tigris & Euphrates

[@EldritchBones]

can't believe Tom said Blue Moon

[@Steve-L]

I can, I heard him say it before.

[@justingibbons8010]

I disagree with Zee on Bloodborne. I had a lot of fun playing it at Origins! It's amazing how well it captures the video game in a card game.

[@mauriceoksman8594]

I actually have never played the video game, but i own and like the board game. I actually had a bad time playing it though with a couple other hardcore gamers who didn’t seem to like it much, which made me kind of sad. I felt like they started knocking it and comparing it off-the-bat. Personally i think it’s a nice ‘light’ game, but that it suffers from being a bit abstract-since I don’t know the video game or methos, i ended up watching a youtube video about the Bloodborne world and things like ‘the hunter’s dream’ made more sense. I actually think this game suffered from being attached to Bloodborne.

[@troyeisenberger957]

Alexander Pfister....Great Western Trail, Mombassa, Broom Sevice. Excellent run of games...except Oh my Goods.

[@EclecticCamel]

No way.

[@TorIverWilhelmsen]

I guess you haven't played with the fixed rules used in the new edition/reprint? Where you finish off by running your whole engine? That makes it better.

[@KissellMissile]

Better, yes, but not great.

[@kane2239]

RoboRally is awesome :)

[@shawncameron9514]

I agree with Sam, Codenames is awful. I disagree with Sam, Robo Rally is the ONLY game by Richard Garfield I would play.

[@steelbeard151]

Really? You won't play King of Tokyo? Garfield designed that and it's a lot of fun.

[@dago6410]

Citadels and codebames are probably both among 10 best games ever made and now im not sure if there is any reason to trust anything either of these two gentlemen ever said....