Top 10 Units That Aged Like COCOGOAT MILK in Genshin Impact

[@JelloImpact]

Top 10 Units that aged like Osthmanthus Wine: 🍷 kzbin.info/www/bejne/apCbdamuhdRqd9ksi=a50eRTaDWv4d4ZON

[@jakelastra9488]

Ayaka is more aged like soda, like its sweet and fizzy to start but if you leave it out it just goes flat, it’s not harmful or bad like milk just tasteless

[@anime4rz]

Ayaka can clear every abyss from start till now yes you might be creative sometimes if she cant freeze mono cryo do the job and if not people dont use ayaka ult (xiangling/klee/gaming/hutao)melt ayaka dont need to do melts pyro carrys does

[@ISMythix]

​@@anime4rzI mean ive seen amber clear every abyss so far it's not like they're saying ayaka is bad

[@cloudunderweather9554]

Ya cause her kit still works fine.

[@danielg107]

That's what happens when you exclude one of the 4 "core elements" from the BEST reactions; Cryo characters are strong (except Eula, physical SUCKS), they just weren't invited to the Dendro party and people assume they are now bad 😂

[@HearMeLearn]

@@anime4rz I have a high investment ayaka and I struggle to clear abyss with her. To phrase that differently, I can't with her lol. I have her on fontaine craftable sword and premium team but no shenhe so I use diona. I think r1 and shenhe is necessary to get her abyss capable which is crazy. You would never think neuv needs his signature and furina to be good, they just make him better

[@lancevance6346]

It's crazy how badly they screwed up power balance for Inazuma DPS's. Setting aside the archon,and maybe Ayaka at the time, they were over-balanced and undertuned for literally no reason until you got their C6 which makes me think they were trying to experiment how far they can push people's wallets. Which I think didn't work out as well and we started getting C2s as good stopping points again from the next region. Like, only the supports have kept Inazuma cast relevant.

[@planetary-rendez-vous]

I'm really wondering if it's a marketing ploy which sucks or if it was simply the designer's poor decision : they didn't want to necessarily make characters in accordance with the hypercarry meta yet (Yoimiya with her useless ultimate and charged shot, suggesting more swaps for some reason) and whatever ayato is doing, Kokomi's kit was pretty experimental (negative crit), only Itto but was completely Gorou locked), and also in parallel Inazuma's story was also rushed and lacking. Definitively the dark eras of Genshin...

[@torygonzalez5401]

As a yoimiya main true

[@kashira-0]

Only the environment/music design teams were awake in Inazuma. Everyone else was on drugs

[@lancevance6346]

@@planetary-rendez-vous Idk. Hutao and national teams etc still existed and had way higher ceilings to these characters. To then go and undertune almost everything in Inazuma was so odd. Cause right when Inazuma characters were finished they suddenly dropped a character like Yelan with no care for balance. They just treated Inazuma like a test subject. On top that btw, if dendro didn't exist, and brought the hard coded buffs to reactions, even Yae,Ayato etc wouldn't have gotten the extra longevity they got and would be 5x as worse right now. They're this mid AFTER getting a lifeline.

[@planetary-rendez-vous]

@@lancevance6346 Idk either, I don't think it's JP racism either? Or perhaps people complained about powercreep which definitely was a thing since Hu Tao Ganyu Eula in succession was a lot

[@chisha8415]

What hurts me about Shenhe is that she only buffs cryo but Furina arguably buffs cryo characters better than her

[@ruthwikreddy6924]

Ugghhhh ikr, it hurt me when I realized furina charlite was better shene mona/kokomi

[@clown2005]

i don't think anyone would complain if venti's whole kit got reworked because an archon is supposed to be broken. but it's not possible.

[@ChirpyMisha]

There will be hardcore venti stans who will go feral

[@71775926]

He was, until they made it such that enemies can't be pulled. He wouldn't need a rework if Hoyo just fucking stopped making abyss enemies that can't be grouped.

[@xdragon2k]

I think the heavier mob can just be sucked in but not lifted. They can still attack and not staggered. So at least Venti will have a use in gathering into one spot for the AoE nuker to hit.

[@sense6472]

He's broken at the time of his release and for several months. Nobody back then said that he's weak.

[@Nmerejilla]

Yea. Only exception is Zhongli cause of you know... China

[@shinobu1886]

A part of me has copium Snezhnaya will save Cryo. The other part of me think it will just release new busted Cryo characters like the Archon, rather than bring up the existing ones.

[@LucidDreamr463]

Capitanooooo

[@Shane_A_M]

@@LucidDreamr463I think Capitano will save himself, not Cryo haha. Kind of like how Navia was great in spite of being Geo not because of it, then Xilonen came around and actually saved Geo. I’m just hoping Capitano is good with Shenhe.

[@JX531]

@@Shane_A_M We have Citlali coming up too so thats (potentially) nice

[@Shane_A_M]

@@JX531 With the shatter buffs, I have a theory that Citlali will be like Nahida but for the Shatter reaction, I think it would be super cool.

[@banjoowo4001]

Shatter is too situational , there are tons of enemies that don't get frozen

[@TheJH1015]

Yoimiya has 2 main issue: 1) her kit was overbalanced. She doesn't get her own 20% ATK buff from her burst effect that the rest of the team DOES get, and her arrows don't have any splash damage. Also having standard ICD fucks her over big time. 2) something that in the Pokémon community we call "4th slot syndrome", where you really need 5 move options for your pokemon but you only have room for 4. Same with Yoimiya, you want one or two buffers, one or two off field elemental dps/appliers, and a sustain. In addition to Yoimiya HERSELF. There's not enough team slots to give her what she needs and wants.

[@NonMeta_]

I run Yoimiya, Xilonen, Yelan and Furina. Most of the Genshin player base is causal and can't play without a shield so they can't play Yoimiya's best teams. The more skill you have the less you have to rely on sustains. I see a lot of people build their Yoimiya's with 70ish/250 Crit Ratios which is idiotic. She does the majority damage over 21 hits and people decide not critting 30% of the time is fine when some of the missed crits are vapes. But you can't explain math to Genshin players. She's is not a casual friendly player for Abyss, fine for Overworld though.

[@princeresuta6485]

@@NonMeta_ you need a shielder because you need to complete her 5 autos, it's not because of skill issue. Even if you can dodge any attack the damage outcome still isnt the same when you continuously hit that 5th hit

[@shinobu1886]

Yoimiya has another issue, one that Wriothesley, who also has combos, does not have. The fact that Yoimiya is shield dependent as dodging resets her combo, whereas someone like Wriothesley, can dodge and keep his combo.

[@NonMeta_]

@@princeresuta6485 As someone who mains and plays her without a shield you don't. "You lose DPS". Nonsense. You have to dash forward with Yoimiya because she gradually drifts backwards during her attacking string. Dodging or the time casting Zhongli's shield is no different. Dodging cost me 2.5 K DPS, most of you exaggerate or don't know how much DPS is loss dodging. You're just repeating what you heard when you make it sound catastrophic or that she can't clear a chamber if you dodge. There are plenty of videos on KZbin that show that isn't the case.

[@TheJH1015]

@@NonMeta_ I assume you want her to have at least 80-85% crit rate for her to do consistent good damage? genuine question

[@silverlugia9689]

i’ve always had the idea if they ever introduced a new ascension level that allowed characters to hit lvl100 that this could be a way to introduce buffs to old characters. like maybe only certain chars get it at a time, and once you unlock the final ascension you get a toggle for new updated abilities or just number buffs to their old abilities. i’ve heard rumors that lvl100 is happening eventually but i don’t really see a point unless it’s something like this

[@vladys001]

wouldn't it make older characters much more powerful that would remove the need for older players to pull for new units? It anyway comesdown to the business model. Also imagine introducing 100+ new kits for all the characters

[@tarubus2728]

Shenhe aged so bad that universal buffers like Furina Xilonen and Kazuha are better supports for Cryo characters. Her quills are terrible for Wrio and mid on Ganyu. She's a glorified Ayaka constellation. Her buffs for Cryo are legit worse than Faruzan and Chevreuse. Which is sad tbh.

[@HearMeLearn]

wait fr? Damn and I was thinking about pulling for her...

[@tarubus2728]

@@HearMeLearn yeah her quills have a scuffed cd that only Ayaka can use it since it has the same duration as her burst.

[@tartagliasjigglydworshipper]

i think they should've never put a limit on her quills. Yunjin literally has like 3 times her quill count. and Yunjin's work with any elements. like WTH? not that Yunjin has any meta relevance but still

[@DeyadaKris]

@@HearMeLearn I don't think this take is accurate -- Shenhe's frontload is still the highest potential buff for Cryo and scales really well in tandem with other, additional attack buffers The 7 punches Wrio gets Quill boosted on C0 Shenhe are ABSURDLY strong -- we're talking over 150,000 each NA without Melts

[@dotalbo8279]

@@HearMeLearnif u like her still definitely go for her. She’s like the LIMITED limited 5 star iykyk.

[@filipeeem21]

I don't know why people are throwing so much hate at old units these days. Genshin is not a competitive game lmao. Ayaka is a very solid character and can do any abyss. Yoimiya has always been strong against bosses, as her damage is ST, and nothing has really changed about her. Ganyu and Beidou are also good characters, just unpopular due to the competition or playstyle.

[@thejamfishh]

Venti really needs help, Jello is 100% right. All the archons should get buffed.

[@tartagliasjigglydworshipper]

imo, just move him from a CC bot into a Swirl/Elemental absorption subdps/support. CC will always be either OP or weak in an ARPG environment like Genshin. look at PGR, WuWa, HI3, Aether Gazer, etc. their form of CC comes in a form of a stun phase for bosses.

[@leahblanck5145]

@@tartagliasjigglydworshipper Hell even ZZZ has a stun phase too and they implemented a great mechanic for it, allowing characters to build a stat to capitalize off of it. Venti could be interesting by letting bosses either enter their stun phase earlier, extended the stun duration or increase the amount of damage they take during their stun phase all scaling of an existent stat (i.e. EM). Bosses already have their unique stun windows by interacting with their mechanic so Venti could integrate into this well. This allows Venti to have viability in boss and non-ccable enemy scenarios and more importantly give him a niche. Venti will finally have use case outside of ccing which can be easily shafted by Hoyo.

[@adityaprakash992]

Not all archons need buff it's just venti , Zhongli and Furina are S+ in most meta tierlists and they are also the most used characters in the meta , Raiden is not used that much nowadays but she is still a S tier dps

[@trashraccoon2635]

venti makes me sad because he's genuinely fun to play to me. and his suction actually is pretty strong that he can even slow some big enemies down if the vortex is at the right place. like i have seen some bigger enemies kinda just walk in place as if they're on a treadmill. if only it's strong enough to actually suck them in and keep them in place. (maybe not make them flail around like the smaller enemies, though i wouldn't be opposed to that either. that would be hilarious)

[@darkdude1996ify]

Try overload, Jean charge attacks or, if you have her, Klee charge attacks with Venti. It's pretty hilarious how many medium-sized enemies can be thrown into Venti's burst if you just stagger them enough

[@Desticy]

"His suction is strong" okay lil bro stop right there

[@tartagliasjigglydworshipper]

Venti should've been an Anemo absorption and Swirl character instead of CC tbh. i knew from the start that he's gonna fall off because his kit is literally like every early game farmers in other gacha games.

[@dmitri_1i]

Hope Mavuika gives off field pyro for Ganyu melt and Mualani vape. Unlike Xiao and HuTao, Ganyu didn't get any indirect buffs.

[@haroonafridi231]

+ if she gives Atk buffs too that would another Plus

[@kashira-0]

Instead of getting direct buffs like Xiao and Hutao, Ganyu got indirect nerfs. I hope Mavuika and/or Pyro traveler can do something for her and free her from Xiangling/Bennett's restrictive playstyles.

[@vherdelviperblade753]

I mean, she got Emilie and Dehya over the years, so it's not like she didn't get anything. Still, a ranged pyro off field turret would be a significant QoL.

[@Sillysillywithpearls]

I'm hoping for this as well!

[@AverageRNGHater]

if it keeps lyney relevant, sure

[@Tamytaummta]

At least most of the genshin characters aged well than most of the HSR characters

[@funkids7250]

HSR, there are even 14 good 4 star characters And just six aged badly 4 star characters Still good!

[@banjoowo4001]

No one cares about auto battle simulator here lil bro

[@francescoettwedda-1875]

@@banjoowo4001 genshin is less fun than an autobattle simulator imho

[@riteshram74]

As someone who mains beidou, what you said about her was true, but I think with arlecchino overload, she did get a good niche to slot into and for a team going back a bit, alhaitham and beidou for a spread/aggravate team is pretty good. These two teams carry my abyss.

[@jamin3131]

Never thought about arlechinno and beido. Or alhaitham. Thanks!

[@ninjagold9244]

She's great with Arlecchino. Adds more AOE, and with C2 Arlecchino, Arlecchino has 75% damage reduction with Beidou's shield, which actually makes it last pretty long against damage. Counters are easy to land because Arlecchin's infusion doesn't end if you swap off.

[@Garkain141]

Ive been using Arle-Beidou-Fischl-Chevy and it works wonders, Beidou fits the support/3rd dps role perfectly

[@NathanNGM]

I LOVE Beidou on my Arlecchino, Chevy, Fischl team. Yea you miss out on Bennett but it's more comfortable and has better AOE.

[@KayneWalshNZ]

yeah came to the comments to say this i think its her best team as of now and works super well on floor one chamber 2 with the geo shields

[@ulrikruby]

4:30 I personally prefer separating the element from the characters, when talking about which element is the worst. Geo is still undoubtedly the worst element, because crystallize is basically useless (yes some characters want it, but that’s just to activate their own mechanics, not because it’s actually good) whereas Cryo has the very powerful melt reaction + sometimes useful freeze, which I think makes Cryo a better element than Geo. But Geo has much better characters (Xilonen and Navia).

[@kashira-0]

Geo is the absolute worst. Above it, you got Cryo, Electro and Dendro being interchangeable depending on investment (Dendro/Electro = high floor, Cryo = high ceiling). Then Hydro, Anemo and Pyro are top 3 in that order. That's my personal view

[@meowk123]

But geo character have higher multipliers due to lack of reaction. While there are no reliable melt characters and hoyo killed the freeze. I think genshins reaction system is very flawed ​@@kashira-0

[@violetcity2658]

The thing about Cryo characters is that Shneznaya still can make them better. But unfortunataly every indirect buff to Albedo would also buff Chiori, making the buff irrlevent. They would need to make an energy hungry geo dps for shutter so Albedo would be a good battery... or maby make a DPS that really would appreciate both EM and geo? Maby his mother in 3 years or something. It really sucks that Geo and Dendro have no reaction.

[@Marc-w1f5x]

if they make albedo's flower indestructible he would be great.

[@mathpi2211]

I feel like the buffs to superconduct/shatter could help Albedo. Imagine a cryo/hydro/electro/Albedo team that sets up freeze, superconduct and shatter. Albedo gets some shatters and buffs everyone's reactions through the EM buff. The on-fielder will do physical damage on top of the reactions. We simply need the right characters to make this work. Maybe Furina could be the hydro, but one of the other characters needs to be a healer...

[@violetcity2658]

@@mathpi2211 I hope so! I was thinking about this when I read about shutter buff!

[@Shane_A_M]

@@mathpi2211Albedo’s kit is perfect for triggering off-field shatters. I think this will be Albedo’s future, not as a worse Chiori but as a dedicated reaction trigger. We just need shatter to be trigger-able on bosses and he will actually have a niche he is legitimately the best at.

[@steeltalon937]

I think they could make a decent buff to Albedo (and constructs in general) if they make very short timed buffs. New geo support, gives 500% DEF and 40% Geo DMG for 0.5 seconds upon switching. Snapshot that with a geo construct or the def part if you instant burst with Itto or Noelle. Chiori doesn't snapshot so you could try and get a 1 e slash or a burst nuke I guess. I wish Kachina snapshotted :(

[@iv6436]

I wouldn't agree that Ayaka aged terribly - Furina and Xilonen are both great teammates for her, and she still has those high raw numbers. It's Hoyo who played rat moves and blatantly turned off Freeze as a reaction, bc it had a potential to be the most OP reaction. Like, why can i freeze a 15ft tall Ruin Grader, but can't freeze a human sized local legend? What is the logic here?

[@ArcadeAce21]

Xilonen is only good with Ayaka at C2 and furina requires you to change your team by losing either a good healer like Kokomi or grouping like Kazuha because she's tied to shenhe. She just hasn't had comfortable upgrades in a while

[@iv6436]

@@ArcadeAce21 Xilonen IS good with every Cryo/Hydro/Pyro/Electro/Geo DPS simply bc of her unconditional skill and the scrolls. She's also a healer, good enough to meet Furina requirements, and Kuzuha isn't always needed. I beat half of the last combat event on steadfast diff with Ayaka/Furina/Xilonen/Shenhe and I gotta say it's much more consistent than Ayaka premium team (especially against bosses)

[@redsky397]

​@@ArcadeAce21 xilonen doest the axact same as kazuha without the grouping, but she gives healing. And since kazuha always was in ayakas best teams why would xilonen not be. She even enables furina in a ayaka freeze team

[@agadexis]

​@@redsky397 ?? you use kazuha in freeze precisely because of his grouping

[@redsky397]

@@agadexis im not saying he cant be used, i also use him for ayaka, but xilonen is also really good with freeze, just because she enables furina in those freeze teams. Without her you would either have to run jean who also doesnt have grouping, or kokomi which would result in not having a slot left for shenhe or kazuha depending on who you use. Or just not using furina to her full potential since she cant generate fanfare as fast then, but thats also not ideal anymore. Both the kazuha and xilonen version of the team are good options, the xilonen one dealing more damage overall, the kazuha version is a little easier and sometimes better against groupable enemies.

[@Sleepynorth]

Your love of Yoimya convinced me to pull for her and I regret nothing. I can't use her for anything other than OW but got dame I freaking love her.

[@squaremage]

Still use Ganyu as my top Cyro, Plan to pull 1 C every banner until she c6. So fun for me rocking Lyney's bow with her Lantern rite skin. I do acknowledge she is not at the top, and I will be the one make her become that.

[@nk30020]

The gal to bring up Nahida who's still t0 while not even remotely mentioning raiden who literally got kicked out of t0 is just so biased

[@darkdude1996ify]

Sigewinne didn't even age, she's still a baby. She was only born a few patches ago 😭 The only way I see Yoi and Yunjin regain any amount of relevance right now is if they release a Xianyun-type character but for attack speed or something. Just something that giga-buffs attack speed. Similar to how Xianyun was a pretty big buff for a number of Claymore characters but not as much for anything else, an ASPD buff would be massive for normal attack characters with no hitlag like Wanderer or Yoi, but wouldn't make that much of a difference for most other characters.

[@steeltalon937]

There is a 60% cap on ASPD buffs and c6 YunJin gives 10%. A 50% ASPD buff from some 5 star would be pretty great but since YunJin runs off of a quill limit you might end up doing too many attacks and not buffing them all. Better than not using all 30 quills which can be somewhat difficult though.

[@flamezforthegamez1056]

YunJIn would become mega relevant the moment an off-field Normal attack dps comes out. YunJIn's quota stacks are character-independent. Maybe if there was an AoE Normal attacker with some exclusive attack that you want to land on their 3rd or 4th hit, thus making even the attack speed worthwhile. So think if Zhongli was a dps, and the spin-kick was the attack you're trying to spam. For Yoimiya, we would just need an overloaded buffer, increasing the size of AoE and its knockback potential, making Yoimiya a safer bet for overload than likes of other pyro dps, including Arlecchino.

[@joshuacooper6]

Doesn't matter if Ganyu and Shenhe have unfortunately been forgotten by hoyo, I still want them!!!!

[@RareAngelz]

I still think Sigewinne is good at what she was made for. Furina + Sigewinne makes things die passively in the overworld and every fight ends with a full hp team. She is super easy to build decently and is one of the most casual friendly characters.

[@Freenos]

Truly the Zhongli/Deyha of the Hydro cast

[@TechTalk0069]

Cocogoat milk 🌚

[@misogaming21]

😏

[@totallyregulargiorno]

Yummy 😋

[@xiaozihua]

​@@totallyregulargiorno 😂

[@Evie0133]

Yum 😋

[@ヒロトさん]

69 likes 💀

[@ReseOnReplay]

I have faith that ganyus time is coming. If the made diluc good again, trust between pyro and cryo ARCHONS, there will be a resurgence

[@DontCallMeGaga.04]

By the time cryo archon comes out everyone will have a much better dps than ganyu

[@ReseOnReplay]

@ yeah but surely there’ll still be things to try with her

[@nigithebig5315]

Of course i use Beidou, she's in my Arlecchino overload team, doesn't do as much damage as Fischl but is way comfier. Plus Arlecchino does enough damage for the whole theam anyway...

[@cshahbazi1220]

I do use Beidou... in imaginarium theater. Jokes aside, I feel like Beidou is kinda similar to Thoma, in that she's pretty good, but she's rarely best in slot in a top tier team. So yeah, a solid imaginarium theater character where you can get away with sub-optimal teams but still need good teams.

[@anime4rz]

What i found out beidou dont steal blooms so i use her with kuki in hyper bloom team kuki got all bloms and beidou do great agrivates

[@anime4rz]

If you have 2 or more oponents beidou is strong

[@seiuchicompositions]

Local Beidou main here, I like the funny parry and building her as a hypercarry its legitimately pretty good you just gotta hit those perfect parries to deal with the energy issues and now with xilonen and chev she can do some great damage, Hoyo just needs to give her someone to let her cook fr

[@miggymigz9242]

Venti is still pretty great for me and he's a permanent member of my abyss teams as long as the 1st/2nd half of each chamber in floor 9-11 have enemies that can be sucked in by his burst.

[@VetriVade]

I remember when baihzu came out everyone was saying he was mid and an easy skip. I took it personally because i saved up for him for months, my only c6 5☆

[@LuddyFish_]

It's really a shame how Shenhe, a *5 star* element specific support has fallen off, mostly due to the cryo element struggling, but she's even getting outclassed in her role by the likes of Xilonen and Furina. At least Sara and Gorou have a loose hold on their niches (being an electro and geo/defence scaling support respectively). If only they were brought out during Sumeru's era so they could be on Faruzan's level; so powerful that her buffs can turn herself into a main DPS.

[@RuneKatashima]

Beidou was the one character I regret building. She was my first 4* but I didn't use her. I ended up building her after getting Childe on his 1st rerun. There was a short and sweet time where Tazer with him, her, and fischl and sucrose was going real well and then I never touched her again. Well, a little inaccurate. I tried to make her work but she just does not. The only other time (I just remembered mb) I used her to good effect was in the Pale Flame/TotM domain. I have her block the first jump attack of the Vishaps and then burst the second and because there's two targets, her burst does optimal damage. And I would also use Eula. It went really well imo. That's just not the case anymore.

[@ratnadipukey3071]

I stopped pulling characters since fontain powercreept. Now i play to enjoy story only. It feels so bad when you pour your soul to build character you love and suddenly new character comes and blow that build into oblivion

[@steeltalon937]

I can understand that somewhat but I just play characters I like without caring for the meta. I pulled Noelle on launch day and still main her. Is there better dps's? Yeah any 5 star tbh but that ain't my problem!

[@purp1e200]

Yeah, this is why following the meta is so st*pid in this game. You can farm for months for a character just for another, more powerful character to be relased a year later and completely powercreep them with half the investment. After realising that all of your hard work got wasted, you pull for the next powerful character and the cycle continues. I personally always pull for my favourites and never bench them. I make them as powerful as possible. Beating the hard content using my favourites is a kind of achievement for me.

[@ratnadipukey3071]

@@purp1e200 I builded my ayato, he is c1 76:205 139er but still can't do Abyss with all star. I don't go for meta The only alhaitham is the character that I pulled because of the meta to do 36 abyss. Still I always ended up at 34 stars. So I stopped caring about the abyss too. Now I have almost 58 characters built

[@purp1e200]

@@ratnadipukey3071 It's probably an investment issue. You should be able to beat any hard content with any limited 5 star character with enough investment. I have video proof on my channel of Yoimiya hypercarry and Sucrose taser teams clearing the 4.8 abyss which is considered the hardest abyss cycle in the game till this day. 4 of these characters from these teams were considered "aged like milk" by Jello

[@nojmarigold4764]

I remember pulling Ayaka thinking that she was gonna last a while and then Fontaine came out and she's been benched since

[@ebullient39]

she came out like first thing inazuma, she lasted longer than most HSR characters lmao. It's not until sumeru coming out with an entire new element that shifted away from the freeze meta.

[@thisisyourorder]

Same bruh 😭

[@verzetta]

She arguably came back to the meta again with Shenhe-Kazuha-Xilonen against unfreezable opponents.

[@shironasama0445]

Xilonen brought Ayaka back

[@madzaisa]

@@verzetta But you need Shenhe who *only* really works with Ayaka and Ganyu. And since freeze is in a such bad spot you just spend primos on a very niche character. And this is sad, because Ayaka is my favorite character...

[@noonalamada1568]

I use Venti in EVERY SINGLE ABYSS for the defend the statue thing and also for 9 + 10 fast clears. He is good as he is in my opinion. He has the best cc for small adds period.

[@facundoremi]

I'm gonna pull for him just for the other half of 11-1 😂

[@TCSyndicate]

no one cares about floor 11. it's trivial.

[@Emmanuel_Rocha]

And floors 9 - 10 are not necessary anymore. You can just skip them, which makes Venti even less relevant.

[@juggernaut6666]

We get to skip floors 9+10 now, so he lost that. Floor 11 is very rarely anything more than a joke. Just a yelan and xinqiu standing by the monument mashing normal attacks can usually clear defense missions. His only use is imaginarium theater. His weapon has 10x the value he does and is the only reason his banners aren't a huge disappointment.

[@DefinitelyNotAFerret]

I use venti because I’m an archon main ❤ though I’ll admit he probably contributes less than 10% of the teams damage

[@exploreevery]

Next what ? age like Neuvillette water ? 🤔

[@MellowGirl2000]

Osmanthus Wine he already made a video

[@azuarc]

Fonta.

[@JuneTreeDraws]

Completely fine to make this list, and Ganyu was my first ever 5 *, I think she has aged awfully but I don’t regret getting her at all when I did early on in my account because she was the first real on field dps I was able to tackle the games challenges with

[@Shahido2017]

That’s how I feel about Ayato

[@alexmalkiewicz]

She was my first dps as well, I loved playing her in the overworld. In abyss (around 3.0) I couldn't use her properly. I had her melt teams, but they had huge energy issues for me at the time. I was only able to 33⭐ until I got Raiden National and hyperbloom going mid-Sumeru.

[@agekee]

If you haven't figured it out hoyo doesn't care about you if your outside china and south Korea they won't change a thing IMO just play char you like and don't pay attention to meta or what's good or bad. so what if you cant get max rewards from abyss or theater its virtual stuff doesn't affect real life and no one cares if you 36 star abyss if they do best not get to close to them My fav character is diluc I don't use him but he's batman

[@C00lRanch]

Venti be like " hold my beer.. i mean.. cocogoat milk!"

[@BerryKing-p5q]

It's really telling when a chill, well-meaning creator is lowkey scared of the fandom's reaction to a harmless video.

[@polskigeorge]

we genuinely need to do research on how we can indirectly buff yoimiya because its crazy out here

[@masonnelson7267]

I love this list, thank you for making it!!! My partner runs Wriothesley with Shenhe and she still buffs him REALLY well, but of course Wrio is C1R1 and my partner and I are both holding fast that Shenhe and Cryo will make a comeback (Perhaps with Citlali if she's a support/buffer?). And I actually really love Ayato and Yunjin together, I built her specifically for him in mind (I'm an Ayato main and always looking for more fun teams for him) and running them with Thoma and then a flex member like Baizhu (burgeon team) or even Furina for quick clears if you're not worried about taking too much damage with two shielders, can be pretty fun! Perhaps not the top meta damage, but gets the job done :D I look forward to your next video!

[@KahlevN]

The main problem with the character that aged terribly is Hoyo's terribly lazy implementation of how they nerfed crowd control abilities. There was no reason to just make everything immune to freeze/pull mechanics to nerf cryo and Venti. They should have done what literally every other game with CC does, where you either have to build up the CC like Anomaly in ZZZ, or make it so once applied there is a temporary immunity window where it can't be applied again, that grows in time if it's CC'd again right away once the first time fades, like WoW. The fact that they just slammed these characters with the nerf hammer and completely obliterated their ability to CC the vast majority of Abyss mobs is honestly something I'm shocked Chinese players haven't rioted over like Nuev's "bug fix" nerf. Until they fundamentally changed how they balance crowd control, these characters will stay bad.

[@MandaiPL]

Cryo has always been my favourite element, but you're right saying it's likely the worst element rn. Hoping for a cryo rework. Hoyo make Cryo great again!

[@yaoipurpleheart]

Same! Freeze is my personal favorite reaction and I joined the game when it’s not even meta anymore 😭

[@stephenlittle332]

heres my respectful and civil comment: *flips table*

[@OsaZen992]

As much as I hate to say it, because they are my two favorite Genshin characters, Ganyu and Yoimiya have not aged well. I still use at least one of them to clear most abyss cycles, sometimes both, but comparing them to my teams using newer dpses like Alhaitham or Neuvillette its just so much weaker. But because they are my favorites, I will keep using them.

[@herbertcoxe3601]

Only use what you find fun and makes you happy to play the game… you don’t have to play a character in abyss just to prove to yourself that you still like them lol Raiden and Eula are both my favorites but I wouldn’t be trying too use Eula in abyss Eula could never out play Navia so wouldn’t even try, and After getting Arlecchino.. Raiden is no longer my carry for hard content but I still use Raiden on a dual dps team with Arlecchino. Once I get Arlecchino C2 she’s mommy But Eula is fun in open world and events and farming.

[@OsaZen992]

@@herbertcoxe3601 I use them because I have the most fun using them, part of that probably comes from me liking their designs and personalities, but I do like their playstyles too.

[@flamezforthegamez1056]

Pfft, Ganyu did age pretty well. Reason I say that is because Emilie came out, making burnmelt more consistent rather than a tight timed window for it with Nahida. And there is still not any new pyro applicators for her, so Mavuika could in fact, shake things up a bit for Ganyu. Emilie-Ganyu burnmelt is of the better burnmelt teams. THe moment she can be free from Bennett, Ganyu would also become far more mobile. Off-field pyro dps and supports are what Ganyu needs so far.

[@foxwaffles]

I know someone who has Ganyu and Yoimiya extremely well built and still loves playing them too. If you enjoy, then that's what matters. I have played on their account before when I was a new player and wanted to practice and experiment on their account because they had more units and honestly Yoimiya was fun, because I found her fun I plan to build my Sethos

[@herbertcoxe3601]

​@@OsaZen992 Yeah I figured that’s what you meant 🥂 it’s just that a lot of players put themselves in jail sometimes because they feel like if they don’t play their favorite characters that they put all this time and effort into they failed, they will try to force themselves to play it even though it’s not fun to them, players also refuse to change who their favorite characters are because it feels weird and wrong to them even if they don’t play the characters that much or like other characters way more in every way lol I fully built Ganyu and Yoimiya on my sisters account and they are fun just not that powerful compared to the meta but I feel you

[@evilsatorii]

it is sad to see Venti end up like this, he is still achon so they should buff/ upgrade his E, his constellations and even with c0 make him more or at least not less valuable in teams then Sucrose and Kazuha

[@haydenz0]

Venti really should be given a much larger AoE on his burst and be able to drag all enemies towards his burst (even if they don't go in the air). His skill should be larger, go higher, and probably provide more particles. And I don't remember his talents but make him buff something.

[@leahblanck5145]

@@haydenz0 I still feel disappointment whenever I see his a1... something that should have been part of his base kit.

[@gogiantrobot]

Ganyu was my first love in Genshin. I really want to see cryo buffed. I have a decent melt Ganyu and I'm still going to work on making her better because she's one of my favorites. Looking forward to your follow up video!

[@sr.lontra]

"Furina is better" I can't even vape consistently if she's my only hgdro character. Whereas Xingqiu basically makes the enemies perma wet

[@pdballou]

Cool, a video with all the characters I pulled early on!

[@chomusuke1593]

Let's say tho, ganyu can be tops if you put 200 iq in the rotations

[@redlok3455]

What we need are cryo units that can apply cryo reliably just like Yelan, XQ, Furina and Kokomi do with hydro, and you will see a rise in melt or even superconduct teams. Melt is on par with vaporize in terms of multipliers but has much less accessibility as of now. Afaik, Layla and Charlotte are pionieers for this job but it's not enough, so let's hope cryo has not fallen off for good but only hibernating right now till Snezhnaya arrives. Speaking of which, if they added sth like "hyperfreeze" (hydro+cryo+cryo) and it does dps over time like being in dragonspine, that would be a buff much needed to make freeze great again.

[@Dovahkiin3759]

I like my Cocogoat milk moldy bruh 😋

[@TechTalk0069]

Mr beast scandal

[@Sheerwinter]

Cryo ll be amazing in snezhnaya.

[@Daivd1111]

I watched the recent event steadfast 10s clear runs, and the team used is Sigewinne Mualani Xilonen Xiangling, and the comment is like 'didn't except the one getting replaced is Furina' It was hilarious!!!

[@Daivd1111]

The reason is Furina's burst is too long and Sigewinne C2 shred 35% hydro res.

[@funkids7250]

​@@Daivd1111 intereting tell me more why C2 Sige > Furina

[@Daivd1111]

@@funkids7250 Basically if Mualani can kill the enemy in 3 bites with Sigewinne, and Furina's extra damage is not enough to help Mualani kill it in 2 bites, Sigewinne is better, because she only use skill, and Furina use burst, costing extra 1-2 seconds

[@Agent_Raiken]

10:19 my idea for Venti rework / buff • Aimed shots create a small vortex at the point of impact for X seconds. (3- 5 seconds probably?) • Vortex sticks to enemies and geometry even if they move. • Vortex is more "magnetic" and not a violent collapse like Faruzan. (It gently pulls enemies towards it but can be fairly easily escaped by most enemies) • The 2 extra shots from C1 home in on vortex. (Think Tignari charge shots) •Using Burst while the vortex is active causes the vortex to become the center of Venti's burst. (Small magnet becomes literal black hole) • Tap E-Skill creates the wind tunnel the hold version makes. • Hold E-skill creates an Anemo aura around the active character for 25 seconds. Aura increases movement, attack speed, and Glide speed by 30%, allows you to glide from a jump, and you can glide along the ground. • Gliding would, in fact, be faster. • Finally, give him a passive like the other Archons. Im thinking something like Energy Recharge increases the party's Stamina Recovery speed. Something nice but a direct "stats to Damage" conversion like the others. All of this makes him a sort of "jack of all trades" by having similar "tech" as the other anemo characters plus makes him generally useful to all team members and useful vs all enemy types. Also make VV set work off field :)

[@RuneKatashima]

Ganyu and Eula can be saved without direct buffs, if Mihoyo cared enough. There is still no dedicated charge attack buffer. Like Yun Jin. You could take everything Yun Jin does and apply it to charge attacks, maybe make them Anemo or Pyro, and change the C6 to Charged attack charge speed and then you have something. Mavuika could consolidate the role of application and buffing. Bennett is great for buffing Ganyu's damage in charged shots for Melt but he can't do any application after the beginning. This is where Burn Melt came in. As for Eula. All they'd need to do is release a dedicated physical electro support. They just keep... not doing that. Although they could also make Shatter an Amplifying reaction as well. But that's even less likely even if it makes more sense. Shatter would still have the problem of no freeze aura on bosses. Which they should fix. They could just put the aura on without actually freezing the bosses. Allowing for Blizzard Strayer and similar effects to occur and Shatter to occur. Buffing it from 1.5 to 3 won't help it. Shenhe could probably just get by with an artifact set dedicated to her. One that just gives massive atk boost when off-field and maybe gives other characters some dmg%. Something like that if not actually that. Noblesse isn't good enough and someone else on her teams can usually equip it. So it's not helping her. Maybe they could give a copy for free too. It would build good will and she's not as good at c0 as Gorou or Faruzan are at c6.

[@noon_1361]

Ayaka and shenhe are still top tier considering they both got buffed by furina and xilonen, they are still oblitarating every abyss as other top tier teams

[@Lol-Lol0]

Truly hope they rework freeze&some old characters as well. Like -freeze can freeze bosses as well -enhance venti ulti suction so that his ulti can suck all enemies including bosses. -yoimiya NA can deal AOE. Like everytime yoimiya NA atk hit it would be like how her ulti hit like triggering small AOE dmg. Also change how her ulti work as well -klee ulti can stay even when switched out And many more

[@Surprised_Synth]

If they cant' be"physically" frozen. Just let the frozen aura exist on them that would be huge enough of a change allowing cryo resonance and brizzard strayer to work

[@mazethemercenary]

IMO They all were designed that way to urge people to vertically invest. Back before better trends and consumer understanding was obtained.

[@mikestrong325]

But most of these were released a year into the game. They are just poorly designed kits. If they were released today they would be better. Like Yoimiya would have the it where her NAs didn’t reset during moving. Or Yunjin wouldn’t feel like a support who needs a support to work.

[@lucasfmhomem]

Ganyu was designed to work with Venti in freeze and Zhongli in Melt, and they haven't released units that complement her kit as perfectly (like shield for melt and super grouping for freeze). However, many of the top supports released since then work with Ganyu as well, like Xilonen, Furina or Kazuha. In these teams Ganyu is very strong like other dpses, but skill intensive and powercrept by constellations.

[@Ottobon]

Good take on Eula, she at the time really wasn't *that* bad even if clearly far off stuff like national, which most of us were just figuring out, but they've done absolutely nothing with her. Beidou i don't know if i agree with basically because she isn't bad, she didn't get worse, the fact you need to play her more like a Parry DPS that needs a on field when she isn't parrying became more apparent, she has a really specific playstyle which tbh myself included goes above most Genshin players heads, but is really rewarding for any RPG players who are used to parry mechanic, i just can't get used to the wind-up time myself. She is a bit too situational to hit her peak though, although i believe these days in Chevreuse teams she has stood out at times among F2P ("4 cost"?) speedrunners from time to time so i wouldn't say she is that bad. Shes more just a good character that nobody uses because her competitors are so dang good and usually much simpler. I don't think Sara needs any sort of buff but Raiden Beidou would be cool these days.

[@krabling]

To my fellow long-suffering cryo mains out there - we share the pain together.

[@amouramarie]

KAEYA WILL RISE

[@Benro1001]

As someone who has played with beidou sense day 1 of her release I understand where Jello is coming from. But in my opinion her teams have decreased yes but their power level and niches have increased. She's a great alternative to alhaitham on hyperbloom teams because she can trigger aggravate and not hyperblooom while kuki or raiden battery. She also is really good on chevruse, fiscl, arlechino because she gives more sub dps dmg than bennett gives buffing in aoe/multiwave which is where she's used anyway. These are just a few examples. But to give Jello credit her og teams just aren't great as they used to be. Raiden has sort of stolen the electrocharged crown with fruina, yelan, insert buffer/healer. And hyperbloom steals the focus of the meta for a lot of characters including beidou.

[@cbrudder84]

Venti and Zhongli are my favorite characters in the game. I wish I could use Venti more but it just isn't realistic. I really wish he would get a buff

[@HotPepperLala]

In what team would you play kokomi over Furina, Neuvillite, Yelan or Xingqiu?

[@Sillysillywithpearls]

I've been playing for 6 months and since I wasn't around for a lot of the "old" characters, videos like this are so helpful. Thanks, Jello!

[@cesarignjas]

10:30 it is of course possible to buff old units, I played one game called " Nier Reincarnation " on there after 2 years of game they released the lv up for characters from lv 90 to 100, introducing a new ascension path, using new exotic materials and introducing a new pack of passives that were "gatcha picked" so you rolled spending materials to get the passive, and doing so you could upgrade your characters and even customize them for different effects... Genshin can of course do this, it will not change the current kit but build up upon it, so not against the Chinese law of consumer protection and they can manipulate the new passive or ascension buff to get old characters up-to-date. very easy to do!

[@TheNrat]

Yea they can do this but genshin prides it self on being super casual friendly . And really try not overload people in comparison to other games

[@kktnovice69]

I use Beidou novadays in overload teams if application is more importent then dmg (Arle, Fisch, her and Chevi).

[@azuarc]

I use Beidou with Clorinde on overload. I'm not sure why this use case gets completely overlooked.

[@Shane_A_M]

A teamwide Bennet would help Shenhe a lot. You could run a cryo hypercarry team with the teamwide Bennet buffing the carry as well as improving Shenhe’s buffing by buffing her attack.

[@chuck037]

Sigewinne is awesome when paired with Furina. Got my first 36 star with Sigewinne giving the killing blow. Sigewinne, Furina, Nahida + DPS kills most everything in barely 1 rotation.

[@vladys001]

the point is that any healer can work well with Furina

[@chuck037]

@@vladys001 But Sigewinne is substantially better as she buffs Furina and cancels out her HP drain with how powerful her healing is.

[@vladys001]

@@chuck037 "buffs Furina" do you mean hydro resonance? She is powerful healer, but this is still not enough to earn place among the ranks of best supports like Xilonen, who shreds 36% of resistances, which is much bigger upgrade for Furina. Sigewine is a comfort pick, like Baizhu

[@baguette_connoisseur]

@@vladys001Sigewinne gives Elemental Skill dmg bonus and it's pretty good actually. Worse than Xilonen of course, but you get better comfort factor.

[@vladys001]

@@baguette_connoisseur isn't it something very small like 8%?

[@prace2k]

i agree with the list but i dont really agree with the statement that ganyu melt is a reset team like mualani. if you play her with nahida or another buffer to get more damage then she definitely is and she does a lot more damage that way too but her classic zhongli, xiangling, bennett team is pretty comfortable to play and still has decent dps, you just need to match the insanely high energy costs tho. I dont get why people keep saying ganyu is best in freeze all the time like yea that was true when venti was still insane but dps wise melt has always been better than freeze.

[@neo.3]

yoi didn't fall off if she was never good to begin with

[@Almond_baby]

She already wasn’t the top, and the top characters kept getting powercrept, so she did go down the list even more pretty much (saying this as a yoimiya main who plays neuvi now)

[@neo.3]

@@Almond_baby i also main my babygirl (i got pulse and and will get her c6 someday), but even in single target she gets walked like a dog by my other two ST dps's (navia and mualani, both of whom are c0r0) it breaks my heart as much as i love all three

[@flamezforthegamez1056]

She was average to begin with. She was a very good matchup against Thundering Manifestation and even somewhat on Golden Wolflord. But her ST ranged advantage kinda died out with dendro and Arlecchino.

[@danielcarrilho5217]

@@flamezforthegamez1056 she still has the range advantage over hyperbloom and arlecchino tho both her and wanderer are the best at hitting flying bosses small niche but hey its something

[@Supreme_Bargainer]

​@@neo.3tldr: yoimiya is not a top dps like navia,mualani or hutao... but if you have godly supports like furina and zhongli.... then you can clear the spiral abyys I am begging to hoyo god for buffing yoimiya by Mauvika....😢

[@Benji_S_E]

Top 10 future proof characters when? Love fhe outro music 🎉🎉🎉

[@vladys001]

for a looong time Xilonen, Kazuha, Furina others will be easily powercrept with more niche characters. You can check his previous tier lists, he always talks about future proof characters

[@aurel-san8403]

love your content man you're just so chill to listen

[@VisperaInfernal]

Thundering Pulse reveals that Yoimiya's kit its contradictory, you need to burst to get one of the weapons buff, but the BiS artifact wants to consume energy, so you end up with a built with no ER to only get 15 energy for the artifact and forsake the burst (and a chunk of her kit) or praying to Shogun to burst, get the 15 energy from suports and be able to burst again at the end to renew the rotation.

[@owlofficial765]

the thing is Yoimiya is like super busted with attack speed however the only thing we can access attack speed is very rare. Fighting events rarely offer this buff, and units with atk speed buff are unsynergestic with her tho Yunjin could. Her atk speed buff is low and constellation locked We need an attack speed dedicated support, attack speed bow, and attack speed artifact set (no not that wanderer arti)

[@antonioa6089]

What about a prediction video trying to understand the direction thoward which is going the game as right now?

[@theo-ez3yp]

I actually do use beidou on an account I’m “co-parenting” with my (lazy) friend, who finds all teenagey characters (like fischl) annoying and where I want to try out different playstyles - so I’m using her with alhaitham and she’s been clearing abyss 11 with him for months, but that’s mostly due to alhaitham I think

[@HearMeLearn]

baizhu is a special character for me because I accidentally got him (in 20 pulls no pity!) while trying to snipe a 4 star, and he was definitely more useful than people gave him credit for pre furina, he's a fantastic healer, but post furina suddenly everyone came out of the wood work as a baizhu lover lmao. I agree that with xilonen that's probably going to calm down outside of maybe teams that would rather have dendro resonance than her buff (just hyperbloom I guess?) but he's always going to be a useful furina healer and a good dendro option for aggravate teams so he's definitely still in the fine wine category imo

[@antrondon3654]

My c1r1 chiori, xilonen, furina, c1r1 sigewinne feels pretty good. with 60k hp Sige's burst clears.

[@funkids7250]

Top 10 good, should have changed Ayato in place of Gorou, he is decent!

[@MoakS11]

I think Garou decaded more because it had a use. He was the only character that made Geo work even remotely. If you wanted to use Itto, you NEEDED C6 Garou. Now, well... C0 skater is better in any possible way.

[@berndkruit7170]

I am not mad at all. It is just sad to see your favourite characters fall off so hard 😢

[@erwinmendoza7714]

i feel like the reason why so many cryo characters or even as an element got worse is the lack of reaction with dendro. it's really weird that electricity and plants has synergy but the cold and plant does not. i think if we can get more reaction like hyperbloom but cryo, the situation would be much better and we can see more cryo characters in the meta.

[@Leon-yg5gm]

the list is basically all the characters i struggled and pulled for, and i feel personally attacked LOL.

[@tarubus2728]

Ayaka has reached her peak and i dont see any future character that can save her, unless they make Tsaritsa a cryo teamwide healer with Furina level buffs and buff cryo specifically. Ganyu however i can see getting buffed by Mavuika.

[@nohackershere6592]

I use Beiduo. However, only on my Arlecchino overload team. I run her as an electro shielder with Arlecchino, which makes the team substantially more comfortable to play (I have a c2 Beidou). C6 Chvreuse and c6 Fischl with Arlecchino already puts out enough damage in practically every instance I would run this team so I can run a dedicated shield to not have to worry about dodging. She was amazing to have in the recent event against that lvl 105 electro turtle. I could face tank nearly everything but the full duration of the spin.

[@chawa559]

i think the xingqiu yelan debate really depends on when you started playing. if you're an older player and got to get a lot of the 1.x 4 stars to c6 before the current issues with getting them started (so you have c6 xq) and havent pulled yelan it probably isnt worth it. if you're on a newer account and cant get c6 xingqiu reliably then pulling yelan is ideal. either way, why have one when you can have both

[@GoblinTinkerer]

Yoimiya hurts the most. i tried to make her work forever but now my slightly worse invested Yanfei outperforms her in endgame.

[@funkids7250]

I am so hurt, so disappointed at you Hoyo!

[@redlok3455]

I don't know what I'm doing wrong, but Yoi still helps me clear bosses in Abyss with Furina, Layla + Barabara

[@funkids7250]

@@redlok3455 you're god

[@redlok3455]

@@funkids7250 nah... there is still room for improvement

[@Almond_baby]

As a yoimiya main who got c3, I completely agree w you, she was never meta and I can’t main her anymore because Neuvi simply feels better to play and it was bound to happen….

[@MrJayslayerjay]

Videos like this are the reason why I recommend iwtl to my friend for genshin content. Just watched his video on the top 10 clears for that biggest hp enemy and ayaka was in 3 of the top 10 teams lol!

[@kristinajonsson7497]

I really think they should rework Venti because he's an archon and likewise rework Vortex Vanquisher because it's a signature weapon that sucks for the signature character.

[@GrubKiller436]

The fact that Mihoyo can change things to make the game better, yet they just don't care.

[@jenniferleeesmith]

As a new player (

[@vladys001]

I pulled Ayaka and Ayato on ther last reruns ~a year ago almost immediately after I started playing Genshin. They easily powercrept my available 4* characters, but they are also were easily powercrept by newer characters shortly after, in similar fashion as 4* before.

[@SebastianThebrave]

With world 9 Yoimiya definitely fell off. That being said having an 80/240 build with vertical investment supports does great. I cleared most of the current combat event on the hardest difficulty with Yoimiya FASTER than Arlecchino vape and overload variants WITHOUT Xilonen.

[@beancake]

I would put Yoimiya in the #1 slot for aged poorly. I just don't see how they can save her. At least for Venti he can hold VV which is at least useful in a ton of teams.

[@TamotoLover]

I had my pitch fork out when I saw Chiori on the list. Glad that I can put it away.

[@funkids7250]

Same, but for Klee (Astonished she is not reminded, she is bad as I see)

[@Kanna-Kan]

Honestly though, they could just make it so Venti's ult follows the enemies like Ayaka's ult, and it would already be a good enough touch from my perspective at the very least. Also, it would sorta solve the problem of needing to position yourself each time you want to use him, if they aren't planning to change his auto target mechanic. His ult would actually be hitting enemies. Maybe not the most of them, but at the very least it will hit. Just this one simple change would be enough for Venti to be up to his role, a sub-dps. And when people ask: What's the point of Venti if you have Kazuha or Sucrose even? Damage is going to be the answer.

[@nara-yana]

Some hot takes, but pretty reasonable stuff overall! I, for one, have C2 Eula and Ayaka both... and agree that they are currently _crap_ power-wise. XD [10:15] *Venti,* at least for me, is the definition of _"got worse but it's ok":_ When he works he _works_ - so it's not so bad having him on the account, as he _still_ trivializes any challenge that has lots of humanoid enemies... be it the non-fat Fatui, the people from the desert, treasure hoarders or even the new Natlan guys, he can make 'em all fly around hopelessly. It's just a shame that his constellations are for PHYSICAL and Anemo, and no one got to benefit from that so far (plus there's no way that HoYo would change his constellations so far after release, even if it is kinda needed. The _Hopium_ is with the Tsaritza and overall Snezhnaya stuff, which _will_ improve Cryo and _hopefully_ Phys too); [11:03] Nope, *Nahida* didn't get worse: she just didn't get "as better" as _everything else_ after her release did. I kinda understand what Jello is coming from, but I agree to disagree as I advocate for "no powercreep", thus I don't want *Hyperbloom* to have it's ceiling raised into Neuvillette territory or anything like that (Mualani can have a crazy high ceiling for all I care, as she needs way too much vertical investiment, low ping, resets and the alignment of the planets to work properly); [13:50] Nope: I don't use *Beidou* as she needs either way too much ER _or_ wastes team field time to catch particles; [14:36] *Yoimiya* can drive for the likes of Xingqiu and Beidou... but then you sacrifice personal damage for Favonius procs that aren't even guaranteed unless you grab the enemy at melee range, as her auto-aiming is gosh darn awful... at which point you should be using Hutao, Bennett or Arlecchino already. It's kinda maddening when even Aloy has better tracking on her normals (plus generates a ton of particles)... it's painful to see such a good character lore and personality-wise be wasted due to in-game mechanics. + [15:09] *Yunjin* really suffers from how much ER she needs, yes - then she isn't that much better than going for an off-field DPS instead... and when you already have Furina on the team, putting also *Yelan* makes for so much synergy (due to Hydro Resonance and particle generation) that it's not even funny anymore: Xilonen isn't even needed but, then again, you could go for another _better_ driver other than Yoimiya, and it's crazy that even *Yanfei* can fit the bill; [17:11] *Albedo* is similar to Venti, for me, in that he is another early 1.x character with constellations that do _nothing_ to improve themselves _and_ that don't have proper synergies with anyone in particular (EM buff on Burst? Small Plunge bonus?! Split scaling??)... HoYo would have to change his constellations (and give him synergistic teammates) to make him any good, as they already "gave him" two F2P weapons and two artifact sets and it wasn't enough... and I don't see that happening; [18:51] Well... *Gorou* still has the DPS Noelle teams, as he consolidates her kit quite well (more shield, healing and damage)... Furina + Gorou + Xinyan + Noelle is quite good even without the 3rd Geo, and then you can go with Kachina, Albedo, Chiori or even Xilonen instead of Xinyan if you don't want to plunge. [21:04] ...Yup: *Sigewinne* only works as "a unit" after you go for her constellations. Totally whale bait.

[@nobrainnogame4320]

> Nope, Nahida didn't get worse: she just didn't get "as better" as everything else after her release did You know, in the absolute, not a single character "got worst" strictly speaking. It is always about their relative placement. Nahida is the top of top back at her release, with how dendro based reactions dominated the meta. With Furina's release, the meta shifted back towards personal damage. Hence Nihida "got worst" relatively speaking. I'm all with you on the "no powercreep" advocacy, but I think the deal was sealed since the Zhongli drama back in v1.1: The community want powercreep and I think HSR (who share a significant part of its playerbase with Genshin), further prove it.