Top Gun: Maverick - Spoilers Discussion

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AngryJoe, OtherJoe & Alex discuss all the spoilers and in-depth on the plot points of Top Gun: Maverick, how did it end up being better than the original? We discuss!
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[@user-ne4pm8cg3t]

That scene where he steals an aircraft to run the course himself and show everyone it can be done was actually my favorite scene lol

[@varunaX]

That was predictable af tho no?

[@Stormbless3d]

@@varunaX I didn't predict that at all. I thought it would be a realisation from the crew that the Navy was hanging them out to dry. They would band together and refuse until Mav was back.

[@Stormbless3d]

My favorite scene as well, I could feel my childhood energy blossoming. I had to restrain myself from jumping out of my seat!

[@cantafordcollege4672]

it needed more dangerzone during that scene

[@dlaird8]

Best scene in the movie. It was so powerful showing the gforces and incredible sounds of the stress on the aircraft. It was also one of the greatest drop the mic scenes of all time. When Hangman says "damn" it was like the best drop the mic reaction ever.

[@nerad1994]

The best scene was the “You told me not to think!” And Tom just is just completely silenced unable to possibly refute that.

[@709mash]

A silent "touchè".

[@yorkshire_tea_innit8097]

Just a bit of comedy to smooth over the ridiculousness.

[@Allaiya.]

Yeah that part was hilarious

[@dwally4198]

Yeah that whole scene where he comes and shoved rooster and they’re arguing was great. My whole theater busted out laughing. It was a well placed tension breaker

[@juanmanuelpenaloza9264]

I gotta be honest, if it was just them waiting for a helicopter or something to pick them up, I would have been happy. But then they remembered "Oh right, we have a Chekov's F-14 in the hangar." And from there it was just catharsis.

[@mlstiger]

The reason they couldn't spot the 3rd 5th gen jet is because the radar system on F-14 was offline during the previous dog fight, Rooster turns the radar back on and that's when they see the 3rd jet on the radar screen.

[@Whistler112]

Cool story

[@madphantom92]

@@Whistler112 True Story

[@kaijenkins4513]

It’s also a “stealth” fighter so it has reduced RCS

[@spectrealangritch]

@@kaijenkins4513 it’s supposed to be.. but due to the engines mostly, it’s about as stealthy as a Boeing 7-47 irl. It’s pretty on par with modern F-15s.

[@kaijenkins4513]

@@spectrealangritch shh let their egos enjoy the moment lol

[@tylerwerner7847]

Highly disagree with the criticism about the film needing deaths. Gooses death was the entire driving force of the film and for someone else to die especially in training under Maverick would have have really undermined everything.

[@blankname6629]

Your wrong and for one simple reason the other part that drives maverick. Wanting to be like his dad. His dad died saving other pilots. To me this is how this movie should have ended it would have closed the loop perfectly.

[@tylerwerner7847]

@@blankname6629 Yeah I think Maverick himself dying would have been alright. None of the other pilots he was responsible for though.

[@Mr.PR2000]

@@blankname6629 Maverick dying would have pissed off die hard Top Gun fans. Good choice on having him survive.

[@shelbyvillerules9962]

Maverick butts heads with Jon Hamm about how he doesn’t view _any_ losses as acceptable for this mission… so if one of the recruits did end up dying it would basically make Maverick a failure.

[@blankname6629]

@@Mr.PR2000 I’m a die hard top gun fan. If they did it the way they set up perfectly I would have liked it because it draws right back to the first movie. Going out a hero like his dad. Going out with a hokey totally predictable plot armored ending was just a slap in the face.

[@LUISO1995]

This movie was unreal. Coolest experience in a movie theatre in years. Cruise is the last of a kind.

[@violentpursuit]

Yeah, these movies where the greats are aging out are so bittersweet, knowing that the last generation of truly great movie stars is passing into history

[@jasonskywalker2023]

Or he's the beginning of a new kind.

[@justalpha9138]

@@jasonskywalker2023 That's the way I see it. There will always be new amazing people to take the places of something

[@jessicadavis8865]

@@justalpha9138 have you SEEN the young “movie stars” these days? I appreciate your optimism, but I don’t share it. They’ve got absolutely nothing on the movie stars like Tom Cruise, Brad Pitt, Leo Decaprio, and the like. It’s just an objective truth

[@justalpha9138]

@@jessicadavis8865 You don't know that.

[@Bluebpy83]

Saw it today on IMAX. Amazing film. Last 45 mins are freaking epic

[@vespa731]

I'm glad there was a lull in the story line near the middle and not near the end. It starts picking up again near the end (it actually starts picking up after Iceman's funeral)

[@phil_5430]

yeah this was one was so epic on imax. the jet nozzle almost made me feel the insane power xD

[@smoothshot9562]

Totally man I lost count of how many times I seen the original as a kid, never thought I'd see a sequel, it's up there with T2 for me

[@HevICue]

I debated between this and Dolby. As soon as I felt the engines rumbling in the theater, no regrets on Dolby. May go back just to get the IMAX experience

[@anti-ethniccleansing465]

@@HevICue What’s the main differences between Dolby and IMAX? I’m not a movie buff. Haven’t been to the movie theater in like a decade. I heard someone describe a 4DX screening of this movie though, and that sounded like a riot lol.

[@rohailaamir9343]

That Val Kilmer scene alone is worth 5 stars 😭

[@betelguse16]

RIP Iceman 😭

[@ServantBerserkerZero]

Right? Talking about subverting expectations, I actually didn't expect to see Iceman and Maverick on the same frame again. It was beautiful. 😭

[@jacobjones1273]

Agreed 💯 had some years I was fighting back

[@MichaelFormoso]

I gotta tell ya man, this movie had me crying like a little bitch...like a god damn...little...bitch, and I loved every minute of it.

[@jaredohlstein7355]

Agreed 100%

[@Raul_Menendez]

Top Gun: Maverick is up there with Empire Strikes Back and Terminator 2: Judgement Day. A sequel better than the original. Which is rare for a film to be.

[@Mr.PR2000]

Sam Raimi Spiderman 2 and Aliens 1986 come to mind as well.

[@mroctober3657]

Human Centipede II

[@Jvksiew]

Blade Runner 2049 is arguably a better film than the original

[@Quincy_Morris]

A surprise to be sure. But a welcome one.

[@leslauner5062]

@@Jvksiew Yeah, but you have to argue pretty hard on that one. But to be fair, I watch it every now and then and it's growing on me more and more. That film had a few pacing problems that better editing would've fixed. Original Blade Runner flowed much better IMHO.

[@NCHProductions]

the mission was like a death star trench run, but set on earth and without CGI/practical effects lol.

[@ComeOnPelican91]

And with a dogfight at the end

[@Kamiyoda]

Cape Rainy Assault

[@albertbermudez9269]

And Rooster used the force to guide the missiles to blow up the uranium depots!!!!

[@purefoldnz3070]

@@albertbermudez9269 trust your feelings Rooster. Don't think.

[@theedude2207]

I have seen this comment in literally every other review...it was ripped off from that movie plain and simple, Death Star Trench Run Followed by Darth Vader Dogfight!

[@dwaynebrietzke]

After hearing all the glowing reviews on this my expectations were high...... and were totally met. Had me on the edge of my seat the whole last act. I love how they let the hero be the hero again. I love the original Top Gun but this movie in every way blows it out of the water.

[@anti-ethniccleansing465]

Alex is such a downer. I’m a woman myself, and even I know that the first movie’s love interest (Kelly McGillis) was fulfilling every boy’s fantasy of being with the hot teacher. The first movie wasn’t apologetic about being a movie for the boys, and trying to make working in the military as sexy as possible. Recruiting skyrocketed because of that movie (which was why the government was totally on board with both movies).

[@countof3everybodyOD]

Not soundtrack

[@HevICue]

The writing for this is crazy because they tell you exactly what they're gonna do the entire time. The run it over and over. You know what's gonna happen, but the amount of tension put on it blows your mind

[@Rod.s_Channel]

Ace Combat players after watching the movie: "I've trained for that mission my whole life!"

[@rramos117]

Could’ve beat this mission in 10 mins…with an A-10

[@zandyzain6241]

There are DLC of Top Gun Maverick in Ace Combat 7

[@Shinransa]

This entire mission was very close to two missions in AC7. Magic Spear has the bombs you have to guide into IRBM silos and Faceless Soldier has the snowy canyon and altitude limitations because of enemy AA. It was perfect, they even had a "flying in enclosed or tight structures" moment with the bridge.

[@betelguse16]

Reminded me of the Stonehenge missions where you have to stay below 2000ft or die instantly and the V2 mission where you have to fly up the canyon to hit the dam (and there’s also a dogfight at the end). Also, Maverick should have been flying a FALKEN. 😉

[@RickSanchez167]

All i could think about was the Ghosts of Razgriz

[@boomkruncher325zzshred5]

The F-14 Tomcat used in the film was a museum plane that they gussied up for the film. Tom Cruise actually flew that Tomcat in the film, and he piloted the old P51D Mustang he flies in at the end of the film (it’s Tom’s personal plane). My twin brother was stunned at how ACCURATE the inside of the F-14 looked, he flies in flight simulators and is a fighter plane NUT and the film was accurate to the simulators and what he has learned about how the plane looked and handled. Tremendous props to the film production that got that miracle F-14 airborne for this film!

[@snownation]

So your brother was stunned at how the Tomcat in Maverick is accurate to a flight sim, which to supposed to be accurate to a Tomcat?

[@boomkruncher325zzshred5]

@@snownation Yep! He had also watched lots of videos and read up on documentation on all the major fighter jets over the years (he’s a nerd for this kind of stuff) and he was shocked that the F-14 cockpit was so accurate to what he had seen and studied.

[@gestaposantaclaus]

@@boomkruncher325zzshred5 well no shit, it’s an actual F-14 cockpit lmao.

[@MrTornadoman97]

The Tomcat wasn't flyable, all the parts for them were scrapped when they were decommisioned because the only other operator is Iran. They didnt want any parts getting to them.

[@alexsilva28]

I'm sure he's enjoying the MSFS Top Gun expansion

[@jonasdiaz8615]

Regarding Penny (Jennifer Connelly) as someone who watched Top Gun just before seeing the sequel, I thought it was clear Penny was “The Admiral’s Daughter” that Maverick wooed in the first film when they talked about that in the bar. Also as for reference I too consider this to be far superior to the original, despite pilot details that are likely unrealistic such as Maverick swooping in between two planes or whatnot. Still enjoyed this far more than the first!

[@davidpeterson5647]

Plus, Connelly would have been a minor if she portrayed Penny!

[@ricogomez4020]

I am glad they didn't make this a WOKE movie and have the lone woman save the day.

[@PakluPapito]

Yup. Remember her name Penny Benjamin they used it in the first movie

[@blankname6629]

It’s not better than the original it borrowed about 6 to 8 scenes from the original and just reshot it. You can’t rank it better than the original when you do something like that. It basically was kind of like force awakens and a new hope. I will say it is top 2 for me when it comes to being visually stunning. I also thought they did a little bit better job with dialogue for penny compared to Charlie in some spots of this movie. they abandoned the right ending. Maverick should have died saving rooster. Not just so that he could save goose’s kid but it also would have closed the loop for maverick going back to his dad. He would have died the same way his dad died.

[@karlimo4034]

@@ricogomez4020 Yeah, that was a relief.

[@telfer3388]

That Ed Harris scene was actually filmed practical with a jet flying over his head and the roof breaking from the pressure wave, and Ed Harris did not flinch and is definetly still alive :)

[@scubasteve1803]

Best part was them coming to the realization that rooster couldn’t be flying that F14 and that maverick is still alive

[@4h0w1e6]

Helicopter crew died too. Also, two great scenes/moments... the Great Balls of Fire part could have just been dumb fan service callback, but they made it melancholy with Maverick as an observer. I also really liked Rooster's line, "Talk to me dad." Which was interesting because it immediately cuts to Maverick, his sort of surrogate.

[@Noizemaze4]

Yes, many people forget to mention this :P

[@HenryWong888]

Watching this on video, which allows for multiple views, the first pilot actually survived. He ejected right before his plane was used as a shield from his wingman's missile.

[@Shinransa]

Alex, SU-57 have stealth capabilities so that last Bandit did show up out of nowhere for a good reason and the Tomcat's radar was out until that point.

[@shelbyvillerules9962]

If any of the pilots had died then Maverick would have failed, at least that’s how the character views it. They specifically have him butt head with Jon Hamm’s character over how he doesn’t view _any_ losses as being acceptable.

[@Sksniper128]

I find it funny that you guys considered Hangman as Ice 2.0, when he's more like Maverick. Consider that he's a hotshot pilot who has already gotten kills, is supremely confident in his own piloting skills, and most importantly of all...he consistently leaves his wingman hanging, hence his callsign. He's quite literally young pre-Top Gun Maverick, if Maverick was tall and blonde.

[@trequor]

Yeah he's definitely the new Maverick. That's why he sits out of the mission; they've already got a maverick on the team

[@P.W.N.ed_9000]

Modern movie directors: HOW DARE THEY RESPECT THE ORIGINAL CHARACTER AND NOT HAVE POINTLESS PLOT TWISTS!!! RRRRREEEEEEEEEE!!!

[@axelstone3131]

Alex has a strange perspective on some things. Maverick isn’t an asshole. He breaks the rules, but he doesn’t do it recklessly. He pushes the limits and that ultimately what makes him and exceptional pilot. He is a wildcard, but that’s also his greatest asset. He takes the f-18 to prove the point that the mission can be done. If he didn’t it’s quite likely the mission would have failed and everyone would have been killed. He takes Darkstar up without approval to prove the point that it can go Mach 10 and faster. Ultimately saving the program. Ensuring it’s future development saving abs the teams jobs. He saves roosters life by sacrificing himself/aircraft. I think this film shows that in life you cannot or shouldn’t always obey the rules and some rules need to be broken to either prove a point that’s something can be done or achieved or to prove a point that the rules aren’t always the right thing to follow. Maverick may seem like a danger to other but the reality is his unorthodox approach to things makes him the best. Iceman has total belief in mavericks abilities. That’s why he keeps protecting him from being reprimanded. Not sure if Hangman said “fuck it” at the end and just left to save maverick or not but if he did, again, even he broke the rule and saved maverick and roosters life which is another example of how obeying the rules can be the wrong thing to do.

[@johnleonard9102]

I agree with all of this. But with Hangman, he definitely would have needed permission to launch that jet; the deck crew that operates the catapult wouldn't disobey the admirals if they said to keep Hangman grounded. Once the ship picked up Rooster's location flying high speed, the admirals gave Hangman the go to take off and provide an escort.

[@axelstone3131]

@@johnleonard9102 thanks for your input appreciated.

[@jueshihuanggua3162]

Exactly, he just thinks outside the box and he got the skills to make risky moves work, and it produces better results. this should be encouraged in men, we don't lack men who can follow rules....

[@axelstone3131]

@@jueshihuanggua3162 exactly

[@divinedragon88]

I was hoping someone out there will write this somewhere in the comments. Thank you Axel Stone.

[@ZiggyDoom]

This movie exceeded my expectations. Sometimes people forget that you have to suspend reality in movies.

[@undisclosedsteve6361]

Yeah, I just didn't care about all the unrealistic things, like even Rooster singing the same song as his dad in the bar, it was very silly but I just didn't care😂

[@blankname6629]

@@undisclosedsteve6361 aka this movie borrowed a scene from the original and just reshot it. Did not like the line talk to me dad. It was a little too cute for it’s own good.

[@undisclosedsteve6361]

@@blankname6629 Yeah exactly, I think I would be rolling my eyes alot if I wasn't having such a good time lol

[@blankname6629]

@@undisclosedsteve6361 I am a bit disappointed with this movie because they did that too much where they almost plagiarized scenes from the original. I know it’s not plagiarism if you own both films but it’s lazy and easy to do. However the air combat in this was miles ahead of the original. That part I absolutely loved it was basically the parts when they were not flying that I had issues with. Well except for that talk to me dad line haha

[@Quincy_Morris]

@@undisclosedsteve6361 what’s unrealistic about someone singing a song that person heard their dad sing as a kid?

[@CasualMMOing]

btw the P51 is tom's own plane . that just shows how bad ass tom really is

[@Taj_Rahine]

You can tell the Ace Combat team had a lot of influence on the mission related story, which is fantastic. Ace Combat has had amazing storytelling for a long time, I’ve always wanted an Ace Combat movie.

[@betelguse16]

Yes! That mission was straight out of Ace Combat. Specifically, the Stonehenge missions from AC4 where you have to stay below 2000ft and the V2 mission from AC0 where you have to fly through the canyon to hit the dam. The movie was so good, though I would have picked the FALKEN for the mission. 😉

[@spectrealangritch]

I also noticed that.. For a second I was like “ what an absurd, sci-fi scenario.. it reminds me of Ace Combat! .. I love Ace Combat!”

[@Dionizos666]

Now Ace Combat has skins from this movie :D

[@5000562]

@@Dionizos666 And the DarkStar

[@minaminotaiyo6055]

@@betelguse16 or more accurately (and recently), Cape Rainy Assault.

[@ynkybomber]

We as a people DO NOT DESERVE a movie this good in 2022.

[@alphatrion100]

"She doesnt like him and then she loves him" Thats how it goes

[@tangobang2642]

She was an older woman, not wanting to go with a younger guy and shes an instructor not wanting to go with a student but Maverick is such a stud she finally gives in. I think it totally works.

[@trequor]

Yeah i dont get their hangup. She brushed him off initially as another hotshot pilot, but changed her tune immediately when she realized that he was the one who got the inverted MiG photograh

[@turbobutton1]

Is Jennifer Connolly Penny Benjamin the admiral's daughter who was referenced in the first film?

[@Rod.s_Channel]

Yes

[@davidpeterson5647]

AND SHE WOULD HAVE BEEN A MINOR!!! IT NEVER ENDS WITH TOM!!!

[@jimboa20]

@@davidpeterson5647 dude, in the movie they make it clear that they were a thing three years before the movie takes place. Maverick knows her daughter. They weren't boning when she was a minor

[@Leonnie13]

@@davidpeterson5647 Lol. You need to know that actors aren’t really the characters. They can play other people who are different ages. For example, the original 90210 cast did not actually have high school freshmen and juniors playing the roles. Andrea’s actor was 30. So they picked a younger actress to play Penny…

[@bishopsarch]

In terms of the F14 at the end, its a reference to the Iranians still using the F14s in their airforce. The whole mission is based on an American plan to bomb an Iranian reactor iirc.) When you say they're fueling up the Tomcat, they're actually turning on the ground power and the ground air supply, which is what you actually have to do to start up the Tomcat on the ground, which I was really impressed by!

[@johnleonard9102]

I work on the EA-18G for the Navy and instantly picked up that one of those cables was ground power. Was the hose liquid nitrogen since the Tomcat doesn't have the On Board Oxygen Generating System?

[@claytonbinder9759]

Yeah, I was very impressed with that attention to detail. As being someone who plays DCS and flies the F-14 and F-18, the attention to detail at times was awesome.

[@johnleonard9102]

@erik bengt as cool as Tomcats are, they're not very good dogfighters. They were made to be interceptors, meaning if a US fleet picked up that a squadron of enemy bombers were coming to sink the ships, the Tomcats had great top speeds to get to the enemy squadron, fire their missiles, then turn around and get back to the carrier. 15s, 16s, 18s, 35s, and especially 22s have much more capable maneuverability, meaning a dogfight with Tomcats wouldn't be too hard.

[@johnleonard9102]

@erik bengt ah I gotcha now.

[@dantespimp]

Not gonna lie, I was worried at two points of the film. The first happened when Maverick sacrificed himself to save Rooster - I thought the film was gonna pull a 'Last Fucking Jedi' thing and kill off another iconic character. ;-; The second point happened when BOTH Maverick and Rooster miraculously survived and found each other. I thought the film was gonna do something stupid by having the reserve team conveniently show up to save them right there and then. Thankfully, we had ourselves a 'Behind Enemy Lines' moment - and I fucking LOVED IT! I loved watching Maverick and Rooster commandeer an old-school plane and try to blend in with the enemies before inevitably having to fight with this outdated plane lol. I also think the story of Maverick turned to full circle when Rooster encouraged Maverick to be himself - to do what he did best and DOGFIGHT his way out of this mess.

[@Allaiya.]

I’m ok with no one dying bc it’s supposed to be Mavericks redemption arc from having Goose die in the first one. Now I was maybe expecting they’d do a No Time to Die if you know what I mean.

[@MackdaddyC]

In regards to characters being expendable you have to keep in mind those pilots are the best of the best so they’re built to be able to do things others can’t

[@thedarkemissary]

Not to mention, if a pilot had died during training, the instructors probably get kicked and derails the whole movie. Not really sure what this guy is talking about.

[@johnleonard9102]

@@thedarkemissary and when it comes to Phoenix and Bob losing their jet during training, that was because of a bird strike and those are absolutely random. In the case of bird strikes, typically nobody is held responsible for that.

[@gankdalfthedank9855]

The Initial criticism here about nobody in the class dying, the navy literally won't allow military personnel to die in the film beyond certain limits if the film wants to keep their access. It's the same reason Goose died in the flat spin ejection failure in the original, the script originally had him die in a mid air collision but the navy did not allow it. Also Jennifer Connolly character was somebody maverick was seeing In the past, it's mentioned briefly in the original the pass at the admirals daughter comment

[@negative6442]

Lmao meanwhile the Marines and Army die in droves and neither of them give a shit

[@thedoncastellani]

The SU 57 showing up out of nowhere in the emd was not completely movie magic. Their stealth capabilities are apparently very good and could possibly avoid the AWACS and carrier fleets radars.

[@VkrauRJ]

The most unrealistic part is the Awacs catching the first 2 Felons and them not reacting with their RWR.

[@thedoncastellani]

@@VkrauRJ true

[@anngo4140]

@@VkrauRJ And Hangman could get that Felon without the Felon knowing. Oh well

[@troymash8109]

"Their stealth capabilities are apparently very good" Brought to you from the same sources that told you every other BS little Russian factoid. 🤣

[@pogo1140]

@@VkrauRJ Might be the E-2D with it's UHF VHF electro mechanical radar, think AESA radar, it might not even show up on their RWR. It's capable of picking up fighter sized stealth aircraft. Also assume that the "unnamed hostile country" knows there is a carrier out there conducting air operations for the past couple of days and they've grown accustomed to the E-2 scanning their area on a routine basis.

[@Woolfy]

That P51 is one of Tom Cruises personal aircraft, so yes, he does fly it. Its badass.

[@AidilAfham]

That’s actually Tom Cruise’s P-51 Mustang, he owns it

[@zandyzain6241]

Knew It.

[@JohnStonebraker]

How does Tom get off the ground with his massive balls?

[@fernandopajares8998]

Regarding deaths. One of the main plot points of the movie, and conflict between Maverik and the superior officer, is how hellbent Maverik is in keeping the kids alive, on performing the mission in a way to make sure they survive. To kill one of the recruits would have undermined those stakes, the whole "everyone goes home" goal of Maverik.

[@aseebknx]

It really makes you “FEEL” like Tom Cruise

[@LinktheSamoyed]

My only knitpick, how does a pilot not know what variable wings are, or let alone what an F-14 is... especially that it is the plane your dad flew.

[@CallsignYukiMizuki]

Because Rooster wasnt trained to fly the F-14, let alone be its RIO?

[@sunny-sq6ci]

by the time of this movie, the f14 has been out of the us military inventory for a full generation so it makes sense that very very few would remember it.

[@LinktheSamoyed]

@@CallsignYukiMizukitrue but it is such an iconic plane, any kid growing up to be a pilot you would think would be obsessed with everything planes, especially those that were active while growing up.

[@Sigma-0007_Septem]

Rooster was not surprised that the F-14 has variable wings I t was more the neighbourhood of why Maverick would open them(which was to get more lift so they can use the shorter runway)

[@LinktheSamoyed]

@@Sigma-0007_Septem ahh ok, cos I thought they were always out for take off/landing and under a certain speed, and retract for over a certain speed and storage.

[@MichaelFormoso]

What can I say about Top Gun: Maverick... one of the greatest movies ever made. The movie was thoughtful, memorable, exciting, edge-of-your seat thrilling, breathe taking in the literal sense, emotionally nostalgic that makes your love for the first film feel appreciated, and a movie that has somehow imprinted itself on my heart as a fan of movies. If you haven't seen this film, what are you doing with your life? Go see this movie...right...NOW!

[@dorianr4770]

yes! this movie got to me. on a deep level.

[@wayneelliott5392]

the "rogue" nation would be iran if the used a real country. Iran is the only nation that currently operates f-14s. The terrain and the shots where they are sweating on the ship probably because they are in the pursian gulf or of the southern coast near the equator. Awesome movie and having had a little flight experience (just cessna level) i am overjoyed with the potrayed physics of flight that most movies screw up. Kept the immersion

[@inorite4553]

But only Russia operates SU-57 (5th generation fighters)

[@wayneelliott5392]

@@inorite4553 yeah true that. I think they had to use the creative license there. Quite a bit less tension if they where up against anything else

[@nicholasespinoza9610]

@@inorite4553 Russia has sent their Su-57 to syria in the past to help out their ally, not a stretch to sent them to Iran so help out another ally. I also their civilian reactor is of Russian design.

[@jensonkiin3678]

@@inorite4553 It's not beyond the realm of possibility that Iran might buy SU-57 in the future.

[@Noizemaze4]

I want to say it's china just because it's something the ccp would do for their pilots to practice dogfights with old American models in order to "take down" America :P flew in a cesna a few times too and once with my old man, was a great experience c:

[@92EEM]

Did the scene where Rooster asks his dad for help remind anyone of Luke Skywalker hearing Obi-Wan's voice during the Death Star trench run scene. Actually that whole mission reminded of the Death Star scene. Down to the air vent mirroring the thermal exhaust port.

[@Dipsxi]

Im shocked with how little this is mentioned. They seem to have taken a lot of inspiration from the star wars trench scene.

[@92EEM]

@@Dipsxi I know, right!? Also, how the laser guidance system wasn't working just like Luke's targeting computer wasn't working. At one point I couldve sworn I heard one of the characters scream "Jedi jedi jedi" during the mission, but im.sure it was just my ears playing tricks on me

[@Thebellybouncer]

@@92EEM that was when bob couldn’t get the laser he was saying deadeye deadeye deadeye

[@gamerkev30]

I never realized it, but damn, you have a really point

[@adarkwind4712]

The F35s targeting system would have the same issue the sukhois did when getting close to ground. They said, can’t remember if it was natural or not, but there was magnetic interference messing with that specific type of targeting system so they had to use a laser guided missile or dumb fire them which is a 1 in a billion shot.

[@kevinconrad2250]

I’m pretty sure the enemy fighter would have just switched to a heatseeking IR missile instead of a radar guided missile. I think the r-73 archer is standard load out on all air intercepted. Hollywood imaginations at its finest.

[@heroscapewarrior4217]

That's the best kind of shot, launching ordinance into the exhaust port is a classic move lol

[@Kenny-nz7hp]

I think they said in the film that the base had GPS scramblers installed that messed up the F-22 / 35 navs and targeting

[@fossil6845]

@@Kenny-nz7hp F-22's were never mentioned, but yes they did mention something about the GPS not being able to be used which you have to suspend your disbelief for it to make sense. but they had no other choice considering the USN would never let them film the inside of an F35 not to mention no two-seater F35 exist, meaning they would not be able to do any practical stunts it would all be CGI which in my opinion would ruin the movie.

[@scarletpsychowolf3578]

20 years later - TOP GUN: BOB

[@Hammerhead547]

The term they used for how dangerous the end of the mission actually was is: "coffin corner". In the aviation world that term basically means: the point at which you're on the very edge of the plane's performance abilities and you're going to die if anything goes even slightly wrong. There's actually been a few civilian plane crashes that were caused by pilots exceeding the "coffin corner" limitations of their plane's with the most infamous one being the crash of West Carribean Airways Flight 708 back in the late 90's which was caused by the pilots flying their aircraft (DC9) near its maximum ceiling through a storm while they were in transit over the darian gap while also running their de-icing system which sapped so much power from the plane (they were flying almost 5000 feet higher than they should have been) that it went into an irrecoverable stall and plunged into the ground from 35.000 feet in less than 90 seconds. Also: the attack heli seen at the end of the movie is a KH50: Aligator, so called because it's armor is like that of the skin of an alligator and its armorments are the most powerful ever designed for an attack helicopter of its time (late 80's) as it was originally designed to be used by the russians in afghanistan.

[@shames6796]

For anyone wondering and a major nerd for aviator stuff. The cockpit sounds are spot on, i think some sounds where changed. some things are changed to fit the story like the hud and stuff Also some features that the F-18/14 had they didnt use. Unfortunatly in all honesty they all should have died with the sams. Two more things it usualy takes about 5 mins for a tomcat to align all of its flight navigation and all that shit and the "get low to confuse its systems" yeah that aint true at all lmao you dead af. Dont get me wrong with the "oh it isnt accurate" i fucking love the fuck out of this movie and i dont care if they didnt get some things right it fits very well with the story im just a major fucking nerd who lives for this shit.

[@Executor009]

Remember what the F16 pilot did in the first gulf war, he evaded 6 SAMs, another point is that maybe they are too close for the SAMs to arm.

[@krypticgaming2629]

Yeah because it’s recorded while they are flying the jets lol it’s not practical effects

[@neutchain7838]

@@Executor009 That F-16 was was 25k feet high in the air and those were old SA-2 and SA-3 missiles. Dont get me wrong still scary as fuck but nowhere near have the capabilities of modern SAMs. Evading SAMs on the deck without terrain masking is just not an option, especially not in a Hornet. The F18 considered a somewhat "slow" jet compared to other fighters out there, ( like an F15 or F16 ). It's strength comes from its nose authority at slow speeds. That scene with the SAMs is pure science fiction.

[@Executor009]

@@neutchain7838 we know its a movie i just wanted to point out that something similar was actually done, you want to be too precise, the movie is good and that scene is as intense as the F16 recording.

[@nicholasespinoza9610]

it is pretty common knowledge among pilots to evade radar you fly low and ground clutter serious degrades radar. They only reason it is mentioned in the movie since they should all know is to explain it to a movie audience who thinks radar is perfect and can't be evaded.

[@tallwon33dude88]

Alex has class. I hope I meet him someday ..I usually always agree with his opinions /shrug.

[@alexanderm3504]

Ha gayyyy Jk yeah Alex is a legit cool dude he just needs a old school handle bar stach monocle and tophat

[@zoso1up]

He's a good addition for reviews somone that grades things hard and points out the flaws even too loved franchises really helps trust the reviews

[@Boxingdiehard]

The main reason I watch these reviews is for Alex’s takes. I feel he’s the most unafraid to give his honest opinion. I generally agree with his takes

[@anti-ethniccleansing465]

@@Boxingdiehard Alex is such a downer here. That’s all he did this entire time. For example- I’m a woman myself, and even I know that the first movie’s love interest (Kelly McGillis) was fulfilling every boy’s fantasy of being with the hot teacher. The first movie wasn’t apologetic about being a movie for the boys, and trying to make working in the military as sexy as possible. Recruiting skyrocketed because of that movie (which was why the government was totally on board with both movies - hell, they might have even been the entity that pushed for them to be made!).

[@axelstone3131]

The end dog fighting was amazing. The whole film was amazing.

[@BogeyTheBear]

They never crashed into the canyon during training-- but they _would have_ if it were the real thing. They had a virtual canyon programmed into their flight computers to simulate the target's terrain-- those pilots went out-of-bounds and 'crashed' into the simulation's canyon wall, not the actual one. That's why they were in the debrief room immediately after.

[@TacTixHD]

Miles Teller was born in 87 one year after Top Gun came out so it works lol

[@vespa731]

And Jennifer Connelly was only 16 when Top Gun 1 was out (while Tom was 24). Yikes!

[@Hollyweeds]

But goose's son was already 5 in '86.

[@WH250398]

Uuuuuhm.... Multiverse?

[@Mr.PR2000]

@@Hollyweeds so?

[@shelbyvillerules9962]

@@Hollyweeds I can buy Miles Teller as a 40yo it’s not that big of a deal

[@sp3ed279]

The only fun detail you guys missed was the unintentional flyby of the tower when maverick came by the carrier the first time with the busted up f-14. It was perfect. It even made a small booming sound

[@scuds03]

“Unintentional”

[@Benjiman20]

they didnt miss it joe even asked what its called when a pilot does that

[@B1ackchi]

Just saw the movie and it blew my mind. I caught myself leaning right or left when the plane turned from the cockpit view lol. Definitely deserves all the praise it’s getting.

[@241clearance5]

Knowing a lot about Tom Cruise, all personal aside he's a good man doing this film.

[@kato1kalin]

I couldn't believe they cribbed the Luke/death star scene so hard. The laser even malfunctions and he has to do it off feel. "Help me Obi...oops I mean Goose" lol

[@raijinzzgamingyoutube]

Any Ace Combat fans like me would recognise a "Trench Run" mission from a mile away!

[@betelguse16]

Me, it’s me! I was thinking, ok, when is Stonehenge going to start firing? 😁

[@turnpiketyrone3465]

My thoughts exactly! That was my first thought when they came up with the plan. Most stressful missions in those game by far!

[@DerekEvans1013]

And technically Goose wasn't his wingman, Goose was his RIO. Radar Intercept Officer.

[@Matt20911985]

Penny Benjamin was actually referenced in the first top gun, so they’ve had on again off again relationship for years. She was the admirals daughter Maverick did a flyover on, mentioned during the laundry list of flyovers by the admiral in his office in the first 10 minutes of the movie.

[@Taj_Rahine]

I feel like Iceman was always willing to help Maverick because Ice knew it was really his fault that Goose died.

[@vijanrama]

I feel it’s Mav’s fault coz he was rushing Ice just to get the kill for the points or for his ego - if he was patient and was not behind Ice’s rear too close - he would not have caught himself in the jet wash.

[@JonJonJonJonJonJonJonJon]

Maverick got goose killed.

[@arcticridge]

I agree that it would have been more tension filled if someone died during the training mission, but the fact that Maverick was able to bring everyone home.. *Fucking Epic.*

[@ba2839]

Jennifer connelys character is Penny. The Admirals daughter that maverick had a fling with back in the 80s. Shes mentioned twice in the 86 movie. I thought that was one of the coolest tie ins.

[@Benandanti]

Also Bowie playing when she’s introduced for you Labyrinth Fans!

[@WH250398]

I was so, so scared they would do that cheap No Time To Die ending and have Maverick die... Thank god they didn't do that. So much more satisfying!

[@shindalah1794]

Top Gun 3: Rooster flies the Coop.

[@DougieDollasX]

Did anyone else notice Death Star trench run homages?

[@dennisfxd]

The most encouraging speech of the year 2022: “Talk to me, Goose!”

[@Gammons211]

The su57 showing up outta no where is actually pretty damn accurate they are stealth

[@inorite4553]

Yes.....except when you remember that stealth aircraft have missiles and those missiles can reach out and touch you long before you can see the plane that fired it.

[@Gammons211]

@@inorite4553 well ya no duh but then you wouldnt have a movie come on now

[@shaunramsey605]

Fun Fact (Not sure if someone has mentioned it yet): The P-51 Mustang in the film, Tom Cruise owns and flies it regularly.

[@jackhall290]

Captain Pete "Maverick" Mitchell. The only pilot to fly himself out of being blown out of the sky into a mountain. Also, imagine the shock of the first SU he nailed.

[@heroscapewarrior4217]

Saw it in imax, 10 outa 10, amazing. Final act is pure fighter jet madness, LOVED IT

[@johnleonard9102]

So I work on the EA-18G Growler for the Navy, which is essentially the same jet as a Super Hornet but made for jamming electrical systems. One thing in this movie that was absolutely impossible happened when Phoenix and Bob got caught in the bird strike. Phoenix punches her fire extinguisher to her left engine, but then she punches it to her right engine shortly after. This is impossible because the Super Hornet platform carries only enough fire extinguisher to hit one engine, so pushing the button for the second one is pointless. The second point I want to bring up is why didn't they have a Growler as part of the operation? One growler carrying three jammers would have made the enemy SAM sites blind, and the enemy Felons would have been stuck using only their cannons against the Hornets. To be fair though, I am very happy with how riveting that mission was so I will overlook the lack of Growler in the operation.

[@mikes4086]

Absolutely loved this film. Want to see it again. Did anybody else get A New Hope feeling with the bombing run replacing the Death Star trench and the target replacing the exhaust port?

[@PixCinPT]

Milles teller is actually 35 years old, believe ir not, so it checks out

[@BKBEDSTUY]

Penny was either an admiral or generals daughter. Mac got in trouble messing with her in the original. Very good touch!

[@TheSpacecraftX]

The coffin corner thing is an aviation term for flying an aircraft close to the edge of the controllable envelope. It was referring to the way they had to fly to get out of the valley without hitting the the mountain.

[@Raul_Menendez]

The F-14A still being inservice is still true. The JSDF only JUST retired it's F4 Phantom II in 2021 an aircraft that was inservice since the 60s...

[@HULKHOGAN1]

In the era of movies infested with ‘the message’, Maverick restores the bar to a respectable level and will be used when judging the worth of movies in the future

[@dlaird8]

Tom Cruise and Christopher Nolan are truly the best at capturing that amazing movie feeling we all love. Just a fun, in your face experience. Im so glad Cruise said he has to film the actors actually in the backseats of these planes to show the gforces and strain on the body. It also captures the incredible sounds in the cockpit. CGI and visual fx wouldnt even come close. Tom Cruise is the last great movie producer and actor. He wants everything as real as possible.

[@FoxtrotMikeLimaXD]

Two reasons they couldn’t use the F-35. 1. The F-35 doesn’t have a two seater variant… so… yeah. Not possible to shoot in. 2. Even if there was a 2 seater variant, everything is still pretty classified. In the original Top Gun, the F-14’s counter measures were classified… hence all the rolling against missiles instead of flares/chaff. As a side note: There wouldn’t have been much of a movie if they used F-35’s. Radar Size: F-16 is a beach ball. F-117 is a golf ball. F-22 is a pea. F-35 is a pebble. Per Robert Wallace, senior manager for F-35 ops. So yeah… Also, the Tomahawks could have hit the SAMs or they could have brought in a F/A-18 Growler to jam the SAMs. It would be an easy in and out - but that doesn’t make for a compelling movie. I still fucking loved it.

[@fossil6845]

my brother is a weapons tech for the EA-18G here in AUS, says they are fucking amazing.

[@m0nk3yl0v3r]

this HAS to be watched in a cinema... holy shit you feel the after burners and G forces kick in

[@zyexio]

I loved Hangman coming to the rescue. He had to be sidelined but at least he got a lick in

[@RolfSAMA]

Interesting how less realistic it was than the original (basically a copy of Ace Combat canyon mission), yet how good it managed to remain. SU-57 used as enemy planes are actually not even used by Russia due to constant development issues, but it was cool to see them in combat (their CGI skins were amazing). PS 3rd SU-57 not appearing on radar, because this plane is rumored to have some stealth capabilities in real life.

[@zoso1up]

Don't be hating on ace combat lol

[@RolfSAMA]

@@zoso1up don't get me wrong dude, I'm probably the biggest AC fan in this comments section :)

[@zoso1up]

@@RolfSAMA lol it's all good did you check out the new dlc for AC 7 looks good

[@RolfSAMA]

@@zoso1up got a platinum trophy & finished the game several times long time ago (along with the DLC's), so I doubt I come back to it just for a new skin for F-18. Great game tho, 2nd best in the franchise imho.

[@zoso1up]

@@RolfSAMA you should check out the trailer I'm thinking about coming back even if it's a few hours but I totally understand what you mean

[@MichaelFormoso]

Maverick not dying was kind of expected, since Admiral Cain already put it in our head, that despite Maverick's best efforts, he refused to die. So already, somehow Maverick won't die while he's piloting a jet of any kind, and something I wouldn't want to see without resolving anything with Rooster.

[@MichaelJohnsonAzgard]

Iran still use the Tomcats.

[@davidwilliams4837]

Maverick took on unacceptable risks PERSONALLY. His weakness was ALWAYS his love for his brother aviators. Rooster forcing Maverick to face down the danger WITH him there is GENIUS screenwriting. This resolves the Goose dilemma the 1st film introduced. In truth, everyone was wrong. Maverick didn't fly the way he did because of ego; he flew that way to protect those he loved. But this very attribute was what prevented his understanding of LEADERSHIP.

[@chrskelsey74]

"I'm pretty sure Tom Cruise flew that one too..." That is Tom Cruise's P-51.

[@dorianr4770]

you could suppose Top Gun Maverick actually takes place in 2012. that solves the aging issue. and they say at the start of the movie that this new drone program is happening in the future....

[@This_Is_Actual]

A lot of countries do operate relatively dated aircraft, hell the F15s and F16s the US is still flying were introduced in the 70s. The statement of countries having most older aircraft in museums is inaccurate.

[@LinktheSamoyed]

I think Iran still has f-14s, unless they have ditched them now.

[@CallsignYukiMizuki]

Its not like the USAF are still using the exact same F-15As and F-16As from the 70s in combat missions today. The base design may be old, but they are being upgraded and more modern variants are being produced

[@abigfish1620]

I mean, if they had just said the country was Iran it all would have worked. Just say Russia gave Iran some SU 57s, Iran already has Tomcats. Hell, we even fought short conflict with them like 20 years ago or something. It all works. Now, the dogfight between an old Tomcat vs 2 Su57s is kinda ridiculous, but its an awesome scene so its forgivable.

[@MrTornadoman97]

Very true. Its funny because when they first mentioned the F-14s next to the 57s I was like huh? I didn't even make the connection they were gonna fly it till they were rolling up to the base.

[@DaveSandine]

Pretty sure Tom owns a p-51 and has flown it to sets before

[@BigBear--]

This was one of the best movies to come out of Hollywood in a looooong time. Loved every second of it. Hopefully studios take a lesson from this, though I doubt they will. It was beautiful, no woke BS, didn't crap on the hero, or the military, didn't incorporate "The Message"...it was great. Such a breath of fresh air for once.

[@anti-ethniccleansing465]

It absolutely did have “woke BS” in it. But you’ve been the frog in the boiling water for so long that apparently you aren’t able to see how blatant it is. Amazing.

[@GM-xk1nw]

*Iran still use the F-14 Tomcat*

[@lemmingt6207]

Iran still uses tomcats and the us navy would be using tomcats now if it werent for beuracracy. They were used until 2006.

[@D1n0nlyD1v94]

The movie is so good if you happen to know a minuscule amount of how jets and the naval air force works. Then you can see how much the movie gets right and how the suspension of disbelief comes in on specific scenes and the disbelief is mostly arbitrary. That's to say, its mostly social constructs

[@c0de0gre]

One of the most unrealistic aspects is that Maverick, having not achieved admiral's rank, would be allowed to serve more than 30 years.

[@Goodfellas900]

I stayed till the end credits, somehow I thought it was a Marvel movie and expected to see a final scene

[@Call-3E]

this is almost 30 mins of AJ talking. i need to hear more from alex and OJ. this is ridiculous

[@gruvee9334]

I have to agree. Would be really nice to hear more Alex and OJ!

[@michaeld1170]

The F/A-18E and F are considered 4.5 Gen aircraft.

[@5000562]

All I could say to my buddies when we went and they talked about the UAVs, was that was not how it works for us as UAS operators lol. He mentioned the no eating, sleeping, or pissing part and we all just looked at each other since all 3 of us are UAV operators and that, at least at the moment, is not the case. Still loved the film. Also, 5th generation fighters would outclass the F-18. The Su-57 used as the aggressor in the film is Russia's response to the American F-22. That's why in the film, they kept reiterating that their F-18's stood no chance against 5th-Gen fighters.

[@cornpop1589]

I enjoyed the movie I saw it with my father Today and your review is spot on well done.

[@tangobang2642]

It's not really a review, it's basically a recap.

[@cornpop1589]

@@tangobang2642 right, my mistake.

[@shadowxps]

One of the driving themes of the film is bringing everyone back no matter what so I felt like the fact no one died made sense with that theme in mind. Cyclone kept treating everyone like they were expendable as long as the mission was accomplished and Maverick had to counter that by stressing that everyone has to come home.

[@CallsignYukiMizuki]

Top Gun 3 with F-35Cs would be badass

[@Raul_Menendez]

5th Gen vs 5th Gen would be AWESOME! Imagine Top Gun have to do a mission with the USAAF using F-22!