I disagree with GCN on these wheels! - Elitewheels Velo Six Disc review

A few weeks ago, GCN reviewed these Velo Six Disc wheels. I’ve been riding the same wheels for 4 months, and disagree with what they said about stiffness…
I’ve been riding carbon road bike wheels from the Chinese company EliteWheels for many years at this point, and in April this year, Elitewheels sent me their new Velo Six Disc wheelset.
When first riding them, I initially thought they were very stiff. They felt fast, and the ride was certainly quite unforgiving, so they must be incredibly stiff. But the more I used them, the more I found this wasn't really the case.
The lateral stiffness was very low, probably the lowest of any wheelset I own actually, and this contradicts what Elitewheels say in their marketing. On the product page for these wheels, Elitewheels included the line, ‘far more laterally stiff than traditional spoked wheelsets’.
(Interestingly they have now updated the product description - more details in the bonus clip at the end)
In addition GCN, who are officially sponsored by Elitewheels, seemed to parrot this statement in their review.
So in this episode, I’ll cover these wheels, give them a good shakedown, explain the issues with stiffness, but despite this show they are still an incredible wheelset, just designed for a more specific purpose than the marketing may lead you to believe.
Wheelset link:
15% off all Elitewheels wheelsets with code ‘TRACE15’
www.elite-wheels.com/product/...
GCN review video:
• The UCI DON'T Want You...
Peak Torque Channel:
/ @peaktorque
Timestamps:
00:00 - Start
00:40 - Intro
01:25 - Wheels stats/info
02:16 - Fast and silent
03:37 - Wheel stiffness
05:01 - Wheel stiffness demo
06:56 - Lateral stiffness explanation
07:52 - Ride feel
08:49 - Conclusion
10:42 - Bonus clip time
Intro roll:
Created by Dev Joshi - www.go2dev.co.uk
Instagram:
/ tracevelo
Email:
[e-mail]
Please note:
I am not a professionally trained bike mechanic. There can be risks associated with using products that are unbranded, untested, or come from sources where the provenance is unknown. Please talk to a qualified bike mechanic if you are in any doubt.
In essence, be careful, do your research, and cycle safe!!!

[@Dreamweaver94]

Sometimes GCN can be fun to watch, especially when they get all Top Gear-y, but it's hard to trust what they say imo and many of their videos are straight up full ads.

[@Ob1sdarkside]

Yeah, if they plug it, I'll be checking for other reviews. They do have some funny, entertaining stuff, they should do more of it

[@JonnyPsyclo]

I stopped watching them years ago because literally every video was a plug for a brand rather than an actual review or group test.

[@Ob1sdarkside]

@@JonnyPsyclo when pirelli were sponsors, they were constantly plugged as great tyres.

[@calada1212]

@@JonnyPsyclosame..watched the era of the famous trio: the boss, the wig, the cyborg

[@gamecat1923]

It was flat out embarrassing when they hyped up the, appallingly inaccurate, Shimano power meter as the best thing ever.

[@nioknight2700]

Today Trace Velo takes on BIG BIKE

[@williamko4751]

He buys cheap Chinese components and builds bikes. He takes on big brands from day one.

[@renzclauderagay5773]

Yeah that's what he does

[@JohnnyMotel99]

Hambini would be proud of Mr Velo.

[@williamko4751]

@@JohnnyMotel99 and Joe Whittingham of China Cycling

[@wtfiswiththosehandles]

Yeah, GCN are sponsored by Elite wheels, so I'd expect them to just regurgitate the marketing material on those.

[@cauldron101]

CGN became more of a shopping channel than anything else.

[@jamesmckenzie3532]

No, they became ads-r-us. Rather than take on the thing they eventually are doing: Become a subscription service. Sure it's great to push the product that is sponsoring you, but they aren't a professional racing team. Saying the sponsor of the month's product is better than Cheez-Whiz (a canned cheese product) is one thing, but saying it's better than a known way better (and less expensive) is another.

[@soundninja99]

They can be entertaining and educational, but it's time to close your ears whenever they talk about specific products. I still think there's a lot of knowledge to be gained about cycling and even product categories, but you need to be aware that their marketers first and foremost.

[@Hambini]

your fluff doesn't annoy me as much as tortional stiffness!

[@doublejumpvideogames....]

There's a hairdresser joke here somewhere....

[@Hambini]

​@@doublejumpvideogames.... Fluffer is the tea boy in a prawn film

[@Technotranceism]

​@@Hambini lmao

[@time603]

The bike in the click-pick is a "Chinarello - Fluffer 9.0"

[@keislayzell9255]

@@HambiniThe Pen is definitely working. 😂😂😂

[@outdoor75]

Good on elite for editing their description of the wheels. Must have been your influence Luke! Keep it up

[@not-a-raccoon]

GCN isn't where I go for honest, unbiased reviews. They're given a list of talking points from sponsors.

[@CreativeFishDesignsCharlotte]

GCN flat out lies for marketing , they did they same thing on the mtb channel with a fork a few weeks ago

[@baconbreadwithbacon]

I would say out of fifteen things they rated poorly that I tried, only one thing was bad. After that, I was like nope. I can't trust them.

[@veganpotterthevegan]

​@baconbreadwithbacon expensive stuff only gets so bad. There are exceptions but the reviews that are really important are for mid range and low end gear.

[@nugginusslover476]

which fork or video do you mean?

[@MarvinWestmaas]

@@nugginusslover476 Doesn't matter, all GMBN does is bash on the budget options and tell us how we're not really biking unless we have the latest geometry, the newest 4 pot brakes ( even on our xc bikes ) and don't forget the 170mm+ suspension you REALLY NEED ( on our XC bikes ).... The only video's I really watch are when Blake is riding on something he built himself

[@aitorbleda8267]

Precisely why I unsubscribed. They are funny etc, but not worth it. And it all comes down to sponsors

[@sanderwolters5852]

Love how you have no background in engineering (assuming?) and no professional tools but still manage to very visually demonstrate wwhy and how exactly you go about your findings. Amazing!

[@iamjamestheiv]

GCN is in the pocket of big bike companies so I don't really take them too seriously on product recommendations because they are definitely biased.

[@wuzihuzi]

Except for Silca, they're the bomb. I trust everything Oli says about them because I'm a Silca Stan 😅.

[@jamesmckenzie3532]

Including waxing chains. It's possibly illegal in some areas and it's way more difficult than getting a bottle of the latest Whizz-Bang oil based lube. The claims for life extension are also dubious. I know folks that order chain by the roll and replace every 100 km of riding. They lube the chain once and that's it. And yes, every 60 miles.

[@lunatiy]

@@jamesmckenzie3532 How is waxing illegal, also who are you riddng with that they throw away a chain after one ride also where can you buy a roll of bike chain, so many questions...

[@jamesmckenzie3532]

@@lunatiy It's not the wax, it's the solutions used to prep the chain. It's illegal in most places just to dump mineral spirits anywhere. They have to be taken to a hazardous materials disposal place. I don't know about the Silca all in one wax package either. It's just a lot of work. As to the person who can toss chains after one use, look at the professional teams. They buy unlubricated chain by the spool. It's not that expensive when you look at it. It's wasteful though but when you want the best performance...

[@judeackland-patel6646]

This was the perfect bike tech video imo : It was so objective, your explanation was really well done and you gave the perfect amount of detail. No fluff, just really articulate and satisfying journalism. Thanks :) 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@Rieger81]

Well there was one big bit of fluff...

[@a1white]

Well GCN, technically, were correct. Torsional and radial stiffness is very high but Lateral stiffness is so important, as you showed. That test you did to demonstrate is excellent. I would not use those wheels.

[@cristofferlagergren]

Sadly GCN is not what it used to be. Keep Trace Velo great 🥖

[@HoshinoMirai]

Now you point the thingy out on your face i can't unsee it anymore

[@throwawaypt2throwawaypt2-xp8nx]

the second he was done mentioning it, I immediately forgot for the rest of the vid

[@leebaxter8654]

Changing the industry, one paragraph at a time 🥖. Great episode 😍

[@leonhardbokowski81]

I really, really appreciate how you always seem to go the extra mile to either prove or disprove manufacturer claims. I really trust your opinion. Don't let that change, thanks for all the effort!! It does not go unnoticed! 🥖🥖🥖

[@the6ig6adwolf]

GCN Is the real fluff.

[@captainvikingnumber1]

Good on you mate. Demonstrated why they were wrong!!!!!! GCN is just garbage and gave up on them years ago,. At least you actually use the gear and live with it!!! All power to you

[@bengarside79]

Totally agree, I remember waiting for every GCN video, but unsubscribed 3 years ago. They are the gravy train now..

[@chris9650]

Use them for training videos on the trainer now but that's about it. Sad cause they were great back in the day but too much money in the game.for them now.

[@WillPower46]

Thank you for your honesty and truthful review. GCN just can not be trusted they have proven that over and over again.

[@ryanS593]

Agreed. Years ago I watched them. Now I rarely ever do. They honestly lost me.

[@red00tl]

I liked how you remained fair and impartial as much as you can throughout this video. You thought the wheel had rubbishly low rim and spoke stiffness, yet you still tried to evaluate it fairly based on your actual riding impression. Your conclusion also was commendable in that you recognized both the strength and the weakness of this particular wheel design and recommended it for correct use while cautioning of its disadvantages. This might just be the most balanced and considerate review I've seen on KZbin for a while. :) Just a note: the rim deflection test with your fingers might give the wrong impression of safety. When a load is exerted on the wheel while riding, it is always on the surface side (where tire and road surface meet) and the deflection, if any, occurs on the other side (seat stay side). I should think that the deflection on the other side of the wheel should be minimal due to the low rim stiffness and strong torsional stiffness, i.e., this wheel probably won't kill anyone by suddenly locking up. ;)

[@Aero-Guero]

My concern about lateral stiffness of these wheels was my EXACT concern. Thanks for articulating so well!

[@samthackston9316]

Thanks for the honest video! 🥖🥖🥐🥐 Any word on the new Wheeltop EDS GX? The gravel Groupset?

[@frostytf2]

Mr Luke I love seeing every time that upload comes through, keep up the good work :) 🥖

[@DWMtukwila]

Have you ever seen GCN (I love the channel) like anything from Aliexpress?

[@McHayes76]

Happy Elitewheels customer. Got two sets that have been flawless so far (3 years- 15-20.000 km and 1 year- 3.000 km of use). But Luke, how can you stand the constant flapping of the backpack straps. That would drive me insaaaaane!! ;-) Keep up the good work.

[@Iamwel]

That lateral stiffness is the weakness of most 1pc Carbon rims. (i.e. Spinergy, which explodes on its peak)

[@ti0chema]

GCN has changed over the years, time to find a new source of honest information. BTW I subscribed to this channel quite some time ago, always good info about affordable products to build a competitive bike. Keep it up Luke!

[@suhdud4646]

Ive got a set of the Helix 68Ds and Elite have been amazing when listening to feedback, follow ups and always seem very appreciative of said feedback. Their customer service in my experience has been top class.

[@einarhays]

Great episode Luke, waiting for the review of the wheeltop EDS groupset 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@DWMtukwila]

Also, shallow wheels of the same type will corner better as the rim itself is not flexing

[@diran971]

Got a pair of their ENT mtb wheels for my XC bike and i love them. They're also my first carbon wheelset. If they last I'll definitely buy again 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖.

[@chriseldridge6721]

Got the ENT for road and they're so good!

[@BikePappy]

Keep an eye on your spoke nipples. In 3 years or so you may see a spoke break free at the nipple. When this happens you should immediately stop using the wheels and have all your nipples replaced. Otherwise they’ll start letting loose like popcorn. The carbon/steel/aluminum mixture corrodes the nipples internally right at the neck of the nipple. It’s not visually apparent but trust me, it’s there. I recommend brass nipples for replacement. They weigh a bit more but the safety factor is worth it to me.

[@JetsetJive7]

Great video, good to know that the manufacturer actually responded and took out claims that were incorrect. Now everyone will be pulling their wheels to see if it touches the fork ! 😁 I certainly did

[@Mapdec]

This is a very easy test we can do in shops. It is shocking how bad some wheels are at destroying rider confidence in pursuit of aero or weight gains.

[@petef15]

GCN shills saying what they're told to say for the ad.

[@oldguyandabike]

Well done. I was thinking as I was watching “ pull the rim towards the frame”. Yep. That would be terrifying to ride at speed in a fast and rough corner.

[@JeremyDawesJezweb]

Makes sense when you point it out. Bridges have triangles to make them strong. Wheels with spokes is like lots of triangles from hub to rim 😱 🥖🥖🥖🥖 great work Luke love the simplicity of the demo

[@iamtoobi]

another banger video 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖 GCN is great for entertainment but please don't get detailed product info from them folks. Elitewheels is a GCN sponsor after all.

[@tomichaubg]

Well done on calling out GCN and marketing BS. You're the only source I trust. 🥖

[@luukrutten1295]

This is the case for almost all carbon three/four/five spoke designs of other manufacturers. Still good for timetrials.

[@TomboLP]

Great stuff! 🥖🥖🥖🥖 Like a lot of people, I find that GCN can be really entertaining, but it's obvious that they also have to promote specific products. Their being more positive about the Chinese brands that smaller channels you look at might possibly lose them major advertising revenue.

[@MarkoMarjanovicKackavaljer]

🥖🥖🥖 "Mr Industry Changer" :D Nice one, hope to see some drama and a reply from GCN :D 🥖🥖🥖 Any more "cheap accessories" videos soon?

[@n22pdf]

I guess this is the power of sponsorship.. and GCN now need to money and support.. glad you’ve highlighted this dude.. great honest vid as always 😊 Pete 🚴🏻👍🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@rodcosta2345]

No drama at all - you showed evidence of the lack of lateral stiffness and pointed out an obvious issue. 🥖🥖🥖

[@charliecook6909]

Nice shots of the windmill wheels in front of Brill windmill 👌 they do look amazing , gives an 80s bmx feel , all ways wanted some mag wheels 😂🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@thiosemicarbizidebenzoylal2921]

Depends on the spoke carbon used. Most if not all carbon WHEELS are T800 carbon fiber and its more flexible than T900 or T1100 series. Past T800, things tends to CRACK laterally with any impacts. T1000 and T1100 are also not available to China due to the previous American administration citing it has vast military implications. China has since produced its own T900 equivalent. The point being is lateral flex is the nature of T800 .

[@chaddalrymple]

Great video. These wheels remind me of my 1st pair of Spinergy wheels. Those were very laterally weak as well.🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@petark1933]

Awesome video as always!

[@gregdash-fo5os]

i love riding spoked wheel because its ease of cleaning. few wipes got the wheel cleaned.

[@user-ho6zk5ew1z]

Straight honest reviews, well done. We all need them including manufacturers, makes us all better 🤷‍♂️💪 cyclists. Do you get to keep the wheels after 😅

[@ThievingMagpiee]

I discovered that Elite Wheels 50D are also sort of trash laterally, at least on the back wheel. The finger pull test you did I never did once in my life until i got the 50ds because of how noticeably they were laterally loose. No where near as bad as these wheels though...

[@outdoorvertical]

SKYWAY Mag wheels on my late 80s Raleigh Burner didnt have this problem... rim brake too. Once buckled, they were hopeless though. Does the freezer trick work? IYKYK

[@rockkin09]

How does the lateral stiffness compare to the 6 spoke drive gravel version you review a year ago? I recall you liked how those felt.

[@thomasparkins6749]

Anybody know what those chainrings are? I'm looking to replace my cannondale spiderings and love the design but don't love the price!

[@NoahStone-gu4hx]

I would love to see you built up a tt frame as a road bike with these wheels to see if that's faster than the system six

[@nickhalluk]

Almost like GCN is selling out... Very disappointing GCN. At least we can guarantee an honest opinion here. Keep up the great work 🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@cornishcat11]

sold out a long time ago

[@williamko4751]

Selling out...when did you start watching them?

[@nickhalluk]

I've watched them since the VERY early days, but over the last year or so I've really drifted away from them

[@All4Grogg]

GCN Plus was absolutely amazing while it lasted, easiest and by FAR cheapest way to view pro racing west of the Atlantic via a bit of virtual tourism. Big name manufactures have dug themselves into a massive financial hole over the past few years and considering how much of GCN was funded by them, they are in trouble. When they occasionally make commuting content, I approve. Race content was fantastic. The paid ads and shilling, hard pass. They will need to either shill harder or seriously shrink to keep the lights on and I am really hoping them chose to shrink and maintain some shred of credibility. 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@george.carlin]

Good for you Elitewheels. Right move to correct the description!

[@herrkmidt]

Hey guys, do you have any recommendations for battery-powered pressure washers for cleaning bikes? I'm looking for a handy device for a city apartment without a garden

[@ross__mcl]

Hey Luke, any word on the updated ltwoo electronic groupset? Wondering if I should wait for it, or go for the current version. Cheers 🥖🥖🥖

[@Tamanisawesome]

Can you see if you can borrow a set of the Bike Ahead Composites aero to do a comparison??

[@noamharari2409]

Another extraordinary episode. Thank you for your content . Cheers 🎉🍻

[@Coleen-it1cn]

Hey luke can you try the sensah quantum shifters paired with shimano tiagra rd? The quantum was made for tiagra

[@furiousframe]

Nice video trace. That is crazy flex!!

[@EMTBAFV]

I was in the LBS the other day and seen front derailleur clamp hangers for bikes put me in mind of you with the Trifox issue! Maybe get a the clamp for the derailleur to mount to hardly anything to it weight and build ways!

[@stujohn37]

As always Luke, a very informative video. I myself have a set of elite wheels and I love them. 🥖🥖🥖

[@KarloBituin]

Probably the only channel I can trust and resonate with. Here you go good sir 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@kevinfrost1579]

It might be a bit of fluff but definitely no flies on you Luke ……… great job ….reviews based in reality and miles …………. Multiple baguettes for you sir ! 🥖🥖🥖

[@victorlorenzo3959]

Nice video, Does the wheel touch the frame during sprinting?

[@oldmandice2731]

For TT or Triathlon what do you think about using a disc for the rear and one of these for the front?

[@galenkehler]

I have a trispoke of the same basic construction, and i found it basically as you describe, laterally not as stiff, and with a surprising amount of radial compliance. I use a disc in the back so really can't comment on torsional stiffness, but feels similar to any other wheel. And as you point out this is about what we expect from the geometry, there jist isnt the triangulation to make it laterally stiff. But im not sure thats a problem, theyre stiff enough to ride well, and as a track rider who pedals pretty straight it doesnt really show up out on the road.

[@lpoolck17]

Another great in depth look at a cycling product to give consumers some great knowledge.

[@sepg5084]

I never trusted GCN, and even Elitewheel's site lied about their own product's lateral stiffness 🤦 Lateral stiffness is more important than radial stiffness, in my opinion.

[@robertwhyte3435]

How do they feel in the corners? Does the bike wallow around or do they hold the line and inspire confidence on a technical descent?

[@ryanmichael11]

Great review 👏 this is type of details you don't get regular advert type reviews 👍 ❤ 🥖🥖

[@bjorne46]

Good to see you debunk some GCN Productplacement. Could you test the Marvel G35 gravel wheels? And.... the 15% discount doesn't apply to the Marvel G35. Thanks for the effort! 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@nebulous962]

Ztto alloy road wheelset test when?

[@themediocretriathlete]

I agree with Luke, Elite wheels really are a great deal and have a set of 80mm wheels on my tri bike for training. Just been bullet proof for me.

[@chrisscott8362]

Wow that is super flexy!!! Would not have guessed that.

[@manoftheroad55]

Very informative ..exact conclusion ..cycling has different disciplines needing different bike designs and components.. perhaps only full carbon rear wheel test .. front spoked each wheel serves a different purpose .. NOW that would be a first

[@michaelbradbrook9575]

Love it! 🥖🥖 Some Trace Velo vs GCN vs Peak Torque cage fighting 🥖🥖

[@PatrickLino]

I found my pair to be comfortable, especially once you get to the desired speed. No harshness. Something I did not expect.

[@aim-at-me]

Hey Patrick! Collab with Trace when?

[@RylHango]

That lateral flex goes out of play once you get into a smooth cadence and sit into the saddle

[@2deaf4sound]

🥖🥖🥖 Great stuff! Keep on going Luke! I´m also a fan of Elite Wheels and already were happy with the cheap rim break version. I would love to have a set of 1300g Drive wheels. Just have to convice my wife that I do desprately need them :D

[@mangethegamer]

Dear Mr Trace. What are the best wheels you can get on a budget that's both durable but also quite cool and fancy?

They simply haven't take enough time for this review.

[@haemmertime]

It's GCN they don't have time for that. German GMBN was shut down and the presenters of german GCN left the channel. They told some stories why it ended/ they left. GCN/GMBN prioritize quantity over quality, they kept repeating content and creating content without meaning only to advertise a product even pushing it so far that the presenters had to find ways to integrate products in videos where they didn't even fit.

[@smithandshortdogs]

Lateral stiffness is easy to measure. Mount the wheel horizontally, then hang a weight off of it and measure the deflection. If you don't have a jig just lay the bike on its side on a table.

[@derekhobbs1102]

PT will be all over it for his own videos.

[@FeintMotion]

Always wait for the Hambone or Peeg Torg judgement

[@roguecode2354]

Your amount of spokes dictates your lacing, and you can have the same amount of spokes in the front too, it is just done to save weight and look cool if you do radial lace. Ideally 32 or 36 holes for strength then after that it is up to you on how you want them to look and feel. I like the star 24 holes makes.

[@XJ1345]

Only thing I am having problems with is bearings of my Elite Wheel G45. After 2.000KM the front one wore out and made heavy noises despite never seeing rain. Now after 2.8000 the rear one is toast. Not sure if their ceramic bearings are that good..

[@pierrex3226]

That fork flex by hand is actually pretty scary. Climbing out of the saddle must be like riding a noodle. Well, I guess there's a reason why wheels have spokes :) elite is yet to reinvent the wheel!

[@FSR2007]

Love to see this, the wheels look cool which is honestly their main selling point, but quite crap from gcn to just repeat the marketing blurb! 🥖

[@keralka]

Hello what is the difference between drive and elite wheels?

[@stephensaines7100]

I'm @6:40...and perhaps you address this later in this vid, but getting back to rim brakes, and the deference of carbon wheels to rim brakes....add another reason. In all fairness, regular carbon spoked wheels wouldn't display this lateral plasticity, but hey....I guess I'm in the wrong section. I ride in the sensible section. And I don't have to wear silly cycling outfits to be there.

[@martinmorsch7507]

Wow traces first attempt of being a skillful influencer and react/disagree with another creator! Great work mate, thats how its done ;)

[@davidbidwell250]

Nice review and explanation of wheel stiffness. Cool wheels, but I'm not sure I would like them for any kind of climbing. 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖

[@paolot8999]

I think the lack of lateral stiffness is caused by the carbon layout more than the geometry of the wheel. It is difficult to judge from pictures but I think the fibres are layed up in a radial pattern, from the hub to the rim, this will produce a very stiff wheel radially and vertically but a very weak wheel laterally.

[@Perry_On]

The cross section in the lateral direction is way smaller but you need it because of the moment of inertia in that direction. A rectangular shape for example with double the height got an aight times greater moment of inertia in that direction. The traditional spokes have a much bigger cross section (not one spoke but the complete wheel itself), so its very hard to compansate this with better matirial. Beacuse aight time stiffer materal is not easy to get. In that case its not an rectangal right, i only want to demonstrate the issure with a smaller crosds section

[@glennoc8585]

Reminds me of my tuff bmx wheels on my bmx as a kid. They look cool but I think they're too stiff and you want some lateral movement when you corner but that is frankly bizarre. Nice for TT. I think it was Alex Dowsett that trialled the 5 spoked wheelset and he found the ride not to his liking

[@xtacbrb9286]

How do you mount wahoo speed sensors on these wheel?

[@mauriceramey7819]

Yay new video

[@haemmertime]

They choppy sound doesn't appear because of the angle of the spokes. The sound would be more prominent when the spokes were straight, by one would pass through the fork with all its surface area at once. By angeling them only a small section of one spoke passes through the fork reducing the sound. Maybe the sound could be reduced even more by an increased angle of the sokes, this however would also lead to lower lateral stiffness as well.🥖🥖🥖

[@ZenEndurance]

Wider forks would make less sound, too.

[@MrAG1986]

Quality and on point review, thanks