TRAIL BIKE MULLET EXPERIMENT - Vital Gear Show

[@vitalmtb]

Have you ever tried a mixed wheel MTB setup? Should we keep the nutcracker on every show? Contents of this Vital Gear Show 00:56 - MTB Team News with riders and brands breaking up 1:54 - Vital Bike of the Day - Forbidden Druid 2:14 - Raffle and Dream Build for www.jordielunnbikeraffle.com - #ROUGHAF - Gee Milner's Dream Build video kzbin.info/www/bejne/paTQXomEYr2We7c 2:52 - PNW Rainer IR Dropper Post and Loam Lever 3:32 - e*thirteen Base pedal trail-side tech 5:23 - New Alpinestars Missle Tech full-face helmet 8:15 - We weigh 8 different pairs of flat pedals 8:55 - Mullet / 69er / Mixed Wheelsize Trail Bike Experiment 21:03 - Kyle Warner's take on the mixed wheelsize bike

[@mtbprophet3515]

Riding a Nicolai G19 from Jack Reading with the Mullet Setup 👌

[@TheJablko91]

I put 27,5 into rear on my 29er dh bike, I have flip chip wich make 1° difference, so in the high setup angles are almost the same as full 29er, bike feels more agille and its still smooth.

[@sham8723]

Wasn't this really a critique of compromised geometry due to bike modifications more than a wheelsize critique? Literally every critique and observation had to do with geometry compromises due to imperfectly modifying an existing frame to accomodate mixed wheels. So the question is... if there were a bike built around mixed wheels without compromise... or if you were able to mod a bike without compromise.... keeping a reasonable STA / HTA / BB / handlebar height / suspension travel numbers.... THEN you can answer the question of wheelsize preference. The bikes you didn't like... the reasons cited were all geo related, not wheel size.

[@gmt198]

I've been riding a mullet Geometron G16 for over a year - by far the best bike I've ever had. Granted, I'm 6'2" and so the length of the bike may be more of the improvement, but I'd say the mullet combo may lend itself to longer and slacker bikes anyway. I'd be interested to see you try this on a Geometron and compare against what you already have.

[@niklasdr]

sham8723 yes, this is obviously the big question that no manufacturer has yet dared to try launching on the market! I thought it’d happen this year but seems we’ll have to wait at least another year! Maybe manufacturers came to the conclusion that there are too many complications or that the most part will have such a hard time getting used to different sensations that it will be too much critiqued. So, maybe “the market” needs to be more ready for it, I don’t really know.

[@snowee___joey]

I have a 9.8 Remedy 27.5 that always felt a touch small making me miss my 29er. Especially the monster wheel up front. The mullet concept brewed in my head for a couple years before I tripped over geeks on the net who were doing. . I picked up a dual height lyric that i mostly keep at 130mm, but will chopper out 160 for long downhills. I'll never go back. It is so fun.

[@lynnbattista787]

Best video on mixed wheel size by far on this KZbin. Thank you sir.

[@Shepski15]

I run a 27.5 rear wheel on my SBG Transition Smuggler but only for shuttle and park riding. Lower, slacker, and extra bum clearance are real benefits when riding rowdy DH trails. I have a dedicated 27.5 wheel with cassette and rotor so the swap is effortless. I love the transformation!

[@bimfred]

If Loic Bruni calls it a Mullet...then just call it a Mullet.

[@motron1845]

Pretty sure he called it a moolay

[@jeffwertz8108]

Have been considering trying a mullet setup on my 2018 Trex Fuel EX 5 which came with 29er wheels, but is also sold with 27.5+ tires. In the 29er version, the front fork has 130 mm travel but the 27.5 version ships with 140 mm, probably to compensate for the head tube angle and BB height. first 29er bike and I'm not sure I like running 29's, esp for turning. I guess I like the rollover but it just feels more cadillac than porsche and I'll take porsche every time. I run the minolink on the high setting b/c I noticed more pedal strikes with the lower BB running the more slack HTA. I had heard about Mullet bikes and thought about switching to a 27.5+ for the rear to try it out, but this video helped me realize that's going to lower my BB and though I'll have a plus size tire on there, I'll be right back to the pedal strikes I don't like, so I'm inclined to just move from a 29x2.3 tire to a 29x2.6 on the rear for the near plus width traction and keep my BB height up. I even thought about changing the air cartridge in the fork to make it the 140 mm b/c that would give me more clearance yet on the BB. Thoughts?

[@pierrorider]

I've been riding my Mondraker Dune Carbon with a 29" front and 150mm Fox36 for 4 months now and it's so much fun!! A lot of traction in the front so you can drift the rear all over the place in a controled way.

[@ENDUROMASIVO]

I did the same combination, MONDRAKER DUNE 27.5 with a YARI 160mm 29er ... it was amazing!

[@pierrorider]

@@ENDUROMASIVO I also tested that and it was amazing for downhill but a bit too slack for technical steep climbs for me

[@ENDUROMASIVO]

@@pierrorider it right, for Technical climbs is too much ...

[@niklasdr]

ENDURO MASIVO thanks, can you guys say what goes you were getting out of your bikes with your setups?

[@joelirving9292]

I'm planning to just stick a 29 in a 27 fork, gives me about 3 mm clearance but its cheaper

[@ianrama3482]

Is it safer?

[@mattschirle]

There are actually quite a few 29ers that I think would make excellent mullet conversions. You want to look for bikes with relatively high BB and steep angles. Some of the best I've found are the Firebird 29 in the high setting, 2018 Enduro 29 in the high setting, 2017 Enduro 29, Foxy 29, or Instinct/Pipeline in the steepest geometry setting. I think these 29ers would actually work out better than a 650b bike, since as Kyle mentioned in the video, swapping a 29" fork and front wheel onto a 650b bike will raise the front end by ~40mm. Even if you reduce the front travel by 20mm, the front end is still almost 20mm higher than 650b. Running 650b on the back of a 29er only drops the rear end by 18mm, which could actually be a good thing for the 29ers I mentioned if you look at how high and steep they are to start with, and you don't have to sacrifice any travel.

[@vitalmtb]

fair points, especially w/ older bike models that could apply due to geo.

[@jacobbriggs9043]

@@vitalmtb bikes with adjustable geo that everyone sticks in the low setting anyway (banshee, evil, speccy enduro etc) work well with a smaller wheel, cos then you run it in the high setting, most have a roughly 10mm drop when you switch them to low. So when running in high with the smaller rear wheel, you only drop about 5mm rather than the normal 15ishmm, and less angle loss. I've been running 27.5 in the rear of a Transition Sentinel (bb went too low but I dealt with it), and now a Banshee Titan. It definitely suits the Titan in high setting perfectly, but both bikes worked splendidly in that configuration. Both I feel worked better with the 27.5 in the rear, rather than 29.

[@mattschirle]

@@jacobbriggs9043 Yup. You've got to be a little careful with it; on some bikes the "high" setting really isn't all that high (e.g. Evil, Santa Cruz), so you have to look at the numbers. The 650b rear swap is going to drop the BB by about 13mm and slack the head and seat angles by about 0.8 deg. But I definitely agree.

[@vitalmtb]

@@mattschirle and @Jacob Briggs have you guys thought about suspension performance in high setting vs low? this is a fairly generalized statement, but plenty of test riders we've dealt with (and even some bike designers we've talked to) seem to think the bikes and shocks are designed to work best in the low settings and that the bikes will work "well enough" in the high settings. i've heard, off the record, that certain bikes shouldn't even have the high setting available because they don't work well enough, but the consumer wants the option, so they're given it. i guess i just always lean toward "low" settings on any bike and never considered thinking of mullets in high settings since none of my bikes have flip chips

[@mattschirle]

@@vitalmtb I have not, but that is an interesting point. Most suspension designs are going to have more anti-squat in the high setting, sometimes significantly more, which could potentially be a good or bad thing depending on the bike and your preferences. It'll probably also have some effect on the leverage curve, but in general I think that effect should be pretty minimal. If you look at some of the graphs on the Linkage Design blog, you're just shifting those curves left or right by 5-10mm. That's almost always only going to change the leverage rate and progression by maybe a few percent at most. There are a few exceptions to this, but generally the manufacturer will state increased or decreased progression in the different flip chip settings (see Rocky Mountain or Santa Cruz), which is accomplished by moving the eyelet divergently from the stroke of the shock.

[@marinstaykov7689]

Hi folks, I have a Canyon Strive CF and a Canyon Torque (AL 7.0) and I'm seriously considering turning the Torque into a mullet bike by swapping the 180mm Fox 36 with the new Fox 38 (170 mm). I'm not planning on changing any other components - just the fork and the front wheel. I searched all around the internet about more people who have turned their Torque into mullet bike but found just one dude from Germany who has done it one year ago and was pretty impressed with it. Just as this guy, I am riding mostly enduro type of trails in here with a lot of chattery/rocky straights and loose turns, but I'm also planning on taking this bike to Morzine for this summer and probably for next year's trip as well. I would really like to know what is your opinion on this

[@alexcharles321]

Just picked up a nukeproof mega AM 275 Pro 2014 in an XL frame second hand. I'm a 6'5 rider, short legs (go figure 🤦🏻) but the previous owner took great care and replaced parts over the years as needed. To my surprise, he's had a 29er 150mm front fork fitted to replace the original 27.5. It'd be a crime not to try out the mullet/reverse mullet/69er, especially as I'm needing new rubber to replace the semi-worn wtb rangers currently fitted. I can stretch to the cost of a new 29 rim. Thanks for the in-depth comparison - but judging from the frame I have, I certainly wouldn't want the BB any lower for the trails / descents around here.

[@isaks3243]

i bought a 27.5 + bike and i have been thinking about buying a 29er fork and convert my bike to a 69er. only problem is that i don't have the money to do so right now.

[@ianfurqueron5850]

A couple of friends are running 27.5" Nomads with 170mm 29er forks and front wheels. They like them although one of them is 3" taller than me and his large Nomad felt a lot smaller than my large Megatower. So far, I have been happy with the playfulness of my Megatower, so I will stick with 29 F&R.

[@richrider5884]

I'm currently getting used to riding hardtail Specialized Rockhopper with a 29 f/27.5 r setup. So far so good. Had to bring the hbar in a little bit and lower it. Seems to be working well. Looking at a seat dropper next. Right along with a slightly shorter crank arms.

[@esdubya]

I’ve been running a 150mm 29er fork on my 19 stumpy comp carbon in the high setting resulting in the same head and seat angles as in the low setting with the 27.5 on the front this setup raises the already to low bb to 345mm high from 336mm is which is perfect outcome. Could be the best mullet 69er setup out there!

[@joelirving9292]

I had a 29wr one for a weekend and just swapped to 27 rear and made the geo much faster and more fun, having said that the 140 would bottom our when smashing corners

[@rytisstanevicius4592]

@Esdubya i have the same bike and thats what im thinking to try ! what offset did you choose? and what tyre width did you go for ? thank you .

[@esdubya]

Rytis Stanevicius hi mate it was a 44mm offset fork with a 2.4 Maxxis dhr2 30mm internal width! I wouldn’t be to concerned with offset anyway. Try to get a fork with the same to similar crown to axle length! Mine differed by 6mm (longer) but I also converted my original 27.5 fork to 160mm as I personally felt that in the low setting the bb was to low so I added the 10mm to the head tube. Regardless in the mullet set up I checked all angles with a angle finder to be sure I didn’t go to far! Cheers mate I’d be interested how you go drop a line if you decide to pull it off!

[@rytisstanevicius4592]

Esdubya 0 i done the same , i add 10mm to the fork travel but still find bb to low , ill try in high setting to see what’s happening and also my friend is willing to borrow he’s 29er fork to try. At the moment I’m running MRP ribbon coil fork and I’m not really happy with how heavy the front end feels so i was thinking to upgrade thats why I consider a set up like this :))

[@RaptorV1USA]

I just built my 1st MTB in 10 years... had a lot to learn! Ended up building a Devinci Troy carbon and ended up with a 27.5+/29 boost Pike...so I had to try it,...found a sweet deal on a cf 29 front and bam... Mullet 279... All setup plug and play.. I'm still getting used to the dramatic difference in a bike tech and geo. from the last 2/3 years vs my sweet old '98 FSR... So not a ton of detailed feedback but I do like it, the 29 def rolls a bit easier and feels fine if freekin huge (2me) out front....I'm still getting used to the bigger wheels and longer bikes etc its a lot, but I see the advantages... Fwiw, when I pulled the old FSR MAXBb frame Out of the rafters to restore it last year, I restomodded it W/upgraded susp. and went Mullet,.. it has a 27.5 ft. w/a 26in. RR. Rides beautifully...

[@nathangaffran]

The team rumours form is what I live for.

[@mtb_alan]

I think Bruni settled what to call a mixed-wheel-size bike. 🤔

[@ENDUROMASIVO]

I did the same experiment with my MONDRAKER DUNE and a new RS Yari 160mm 29er and this was amazing, feel pretty well on the bike, now i did the same with a CANNONDALE JEKYLL 2019 ... the feeling is great, better grip, more confident, more fun!

[@dhnoob]

Nice! I've built the same bike with a Fox 36 160mm. The BB is pretty high! I've to test it in spring on the trails!

[@laurentp89]

Has anyone tried putting a 29er in front for the latest YT Capra 27?

[@bryancampbell2577]

Mr Nutcracker seems to have the same voice as Mr Hanky. Whether it's nuts or poo, it's the voice of the Christmas Spirit!

[@RobBradshawG]

Were you able to try change flip chip from low to high on a 29er with 275 rear wheel? Interested if that would help with the dropped BB

[@VdubSPAZ]

Curious what would you call a 26 with a 27 fork on the front with a 27 roll on the front.... I love the nimbleness of a 26 without the fear of talking wheels at my 230 lb bag of potatoes riding like its freestyle

[@samslichter3566]

Am I the only one that wants someone to try a 69er with a 26” and 29” on some modern bikes?

[@jma64930]

Trek used to sell a 69er back in the day. I have built 2 restomod 67ers(26 x 27.5) its not new

[@Kev.in-Bike]

Thanks for this Nice vidéo.

[@MatiStein]

Well, if I get a Fuse frame that built both for 27.5 and 29 and go 69er. Did I shrink the rear? Did I put bigger in front? Does it matter?

[@janbraza7385]

Hi, what type of rear shock is on the Fluid 29? Is it Super Deluxe, 190x45? I have this bike too and I'm looking for a better rear shock...

[@wadesafool]

I wanna hear about those vector tech knee pads yohan was riding in

[@vitalmtb]

Stay tuned, that review will drop in an upcoming show!

[@enol8603]

27.5" / 26".

[@Jabbatan]

Yo whear did you get that not an ebike sticker?

[@mikerotchburns1622]

go moto and run 29x2.5 and 27.5x3.0

[@shadow7423]

Hi, thanks for the video. I am in a pickle on what to do. I am doing a custom build of a 2021 Clash. Been contemplating on doing a mullet setup. 29 front and 27.5 rear. But if I get the 29 fork with 170mm of travel (instead 180mm) is that close enough not to mess up the geometry?

[@gwsmtbdepok750]

Nice bro

[@zeeynlally6215]

Yay I’m the first person, great video guys

[@germi1]

Just buy a Liteville if you want a 29/27.5 or a 69er, ha ha

[@elliotwilliams7421]

Ed masters off to GT?????

[@vitalmtb]

if you read eddie's latest insta post, he never says he's off pivot. he just thanks them. if he's trolling, he's awesome at it LOL

[@elliotwilliams7421]

@@vitalmtb damned lawyer talk

[@octodadmtbmartyrichards2862]

Elliot Williams Brothers from New Zealand stick together!

[@elliotwilliams7421]

@@octodadmtbmartyrichards2862 @vitalmtb are on it. Ed is trolling.

[@vitalmtb]

@@elliotwilliams7421 seriously. my heart sank too until someone pointed he probably trolling. hilarious!

[@alfiusgaming9874]

I got a stump evo 69er most mint bike ever

[@rytisstanevicius4592]

what travel did you go for ? and do you run in high setting ? thanks

[@alfiusgaming9874]

Rytis Stanevicius 150 front run high setting in winter when need to get over the front more, but ran low setting in summer as was riding faster tracks bigger jumps etc and wanted to be more central on the bike

[@rytisstanevicius4592]

Alfius Gaming what fork did you go for ? What offset did you choose?

[@alfiusgaming9874]

Rytis Stanevicius it’s a fox 34 bcos was on my old bike and can’t afford a new fork and 51mm offset. I wouldn’t recommend a bike this slack with that much offset way too big trail handling felt floppy at low speed at first, but used to it now so it’s fine.

[@michaelhorner4011]

I always run a 28.25 front / rear setup ...works like ahh champ :)

[@spiral99able]

Wanna get rowdy.. 27.5 front 29 rear😂😂😂😂

[@stephenkohler3472]

I think the name is pretty well agreed upon and 69er aint it.

[@Krikstar123]

Fun to see pros, journalists and magazines FINALLY getting in to experimenting with different sized wheels some 50 years after motorcycles found out it was a good idea... LOL! Really shows how slow and backward thinking the bike industry really is. I've been experimenting and riding with both 26/27,5 and 27,5/29 setups for around 5 years now. So far I have only found advantages and no disadvantages if setup right :-) IMO the best way to test this out is if you have a 29'er with an already high BB and steep HA - most older 29'ers will have that and the 27,5 rear solves both issues. It's a really good, cheap and fun way to experiment with the mullet/mixed wheels setup, learn about bike geometry and to breathe new life into an old outdated bike ;-)

[@niklasdr]

Krikstar123 well, it may solve the issues you talk about but, I’d also just point out that old 29ers (to my knowledge) have long chain stays. For me, this is bad as I imagine I want the shorter more playful rear triangle of a 27er. But longer chain stays are getting more buzz these days, for example 452(?) on the Pole Stamina 140, which I guess gives really good cornering traction. Then again, I would guess most older bikes have too long seat tubes for my liking.

[@Krikstar123]

@@niklasdr Yes, it's hugely dependable of the bike. Luckily it doesn't cost much if you already have a 27,5 rear wheel lying around - and if not you can probably borrow one from a friend to test it out ;-)

[@stoenchu122]

69 *NICE*

[@philmay7834]

First time at this channel. Sorry guys, that creepy talking stick is just plain weird. Bye!

[@jloucks7]

Clip less pedals please