Transferring The Trackplan (136)

[@TheDCCGuy]

I have had questions concerning alternatives for the foam insulation material I used, especially from UK modelers. here is a note from a friend in Wales on the subject. I also will ask Charlie Bishop what he uses over in Somerset. Extruded foam sheets were very popular about ten years ago, and I used them a lot myself, but then they became much harder to obtain. My local DIY (home improvement) store used to stock them in packs of four but they seem to have dropped out of favour with the building profession so are much less readily available. But they can still be ordered: I put a thread on RMweb about exactly this subject and I got directed to some suppliers: www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/152941-pink-or-blue-extruded-foam-insulation-board/&tab=comments#comment-3899249 As far as I'm aware, the nearest UK equivalent to Homasote is a product called Sundeala which was what all the modelling magazines and books recommended in the 60s and 70s, because it takes pins easily. My dad built my first layouts using Sundeala. But it's somewhat out of favour nowadays because it's heavy and tends to sag between supports, as well as being susceptible to damp (which may be a particular issue in the UK!). It's still used, though. I've used all sorts of methods for layouts, as have my friends. My home-based N scale layout is built to battleship standards, using hardboard sheets over timber framing, all sealed against damp. Hardboard is a compressed wood fibre product, denser than Sundeala. On top of that I added 1 inch thick Woodland scenics foam boards, then cork or foam roadbed.

[@v4victory665]

Thank You Larry... I'm new to Model RR, I learn so much from all your videos...looking forward to the magnetic coupler episode 👍👍💯

[@mannyfernandez2921]

Nice Video! Very well done!

[@Celtic2Realms]

Thanks. Lovely interesting and entertaining videos on making a small layout.

[@rhondakendrick2563]

good job nice

[@flyboy2610]

Looks like it's going to be a fun layout, Larry! Liquid Nails for Projects is a great adhesive to use on foam, no doubt about it! If you're going to lay down foam on a medium to large sized layout, though, the cost can be a bit high. For my 19 x 7 foot layout, over the top of the 1/2" plywood I laid down 1" of foam and 1/2" thick sheets of Homasote, because I plan to nail (pin) down the track. I used PPG Gripper primer paint as an adhesive for the foam and Homasote. It did an excellent job on all three materials! The cost for 1 gallon was about $25 at Home Depot. I still have some left. I'm looking forward to the rest of this build! I'm going to use Peco Electrofrog's as well, but in code 100 as I have some older equipment that doesn't like code 83.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I’ll take a look at the PPG primer. I usually order the Liquid Nails by the case.

[@flyboy2610]

Just a thin coat on each surface will do the job.

[@JonBanquer]

Peco seems to be the only one offering concrete tie turnouts. I would love to use all concreate ties on my modern layout.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I am pretty sure that Walthers, Atlas, and MicroEngineering offer concrete ties too.

[@JonBanquer]

@@TheDCCGuy Any suggestions for what to do to match the concrete track ties when I have to build turnouts?

[@TheDCCGuy]

The prototypes I have seen used standard wood tie turnouts mixed with the concrete ties under the rails.

[@darylculler8233]

That was all neat and pretty. How about transferring a plan to a layout with L girder construction.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I design my layouts using Cadrail and with that you can place the benchwork against a wall and measure out from it to all points on the layout. Essentially the same approach as how I put in the mainline on the modules and then placed the other tracks at measured distances. I used Cadrail for that plan too.

[@suprsoulgrowr]

Hello DCC Guy I have been really diggin your videos! Thank you for putting all of your expertise out there for us novices it is greatly appreciated :) So my question is this....I have chosen to model a RR from one of the plans I found in past issues of Model Railroader. It's from 2012 and the RR is called Boston and Maine Bedford division. Nothing on the plans state what any of the turnout numbers are....how do I determine which is a #4 and which turnout needs a #6. I am using Peco code 83 flexible track and plan on using Peco turnouts as well. Would you be able to provide any guidance?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Check the small info box on the preceding page. It says the minimum turnout is #6.

[@suprsoulgrowr]

@@TheDCCGuy Oh my lord...been reading these for years and didn't pay attention...thank you! lol

[@illusionclassicrock6742]

Is that half-inch plywood that you used for your base?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes.

[@bevmalone1555]

How do you lay the track over the area where the tables are joined?

[@TheDCCGuy]

It depends on whether the layout is permanent or portable. For permanent I sand the two sides to make sue they are level then install cork roadbed over the gap. For portable modules. I just lay the track and adjust the height using the leveling feet I install on the bottoms of the legs-watch that video.

[@KeithHeilner]

Larry - Please confirm or correct my understanding....you lay out the parallel track lines first. After which you manually place your turnouts on the lines in their approximate locations. Finally with the turnouts down on the previously drawn parallel lines you draw the centerlines between the turnouts? Is that the process? I'm concerned about my turnouts not lining up precisely introducing a kink in the connecting track between two turnouts. Is my understanding correct? Thank you for a great series!

[@TheDCCGuy]

That’s my method. The turnouts dictate placement of the other tracks, especially since when used to create a crossover they create 2” parallel tracks which is pretty standard for HO/OO.

[@philipwells9498]

Larry, I am interested in understanding the layout of a railyard in addition to a depot as you are describing. It looks from the packages that you are using #6 Peco turnouts? If I were constructing a railyard what would you suggest using...possibly #4's or stay with the #6's. All of your videos are so thorough, it gives so much helpful and useful information .Thank you. PS would you consider doing a video in the future on loops and wyes and how to go about wiring them? Again, thanks.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, when I get to the point where I am installing my reverse loops on the Piedmont Southern I will definitely do that. As for the yard layout hes I am using Peco #6 turnouts. You could use #4 or #5 turnouts for this and get a more compact design. MicroEngineering has a nw tyoe of turnout specifically for yards that allow the more compact design without adversely affecting operations or long wheelbase equipment. If you visit their website you can download a good pdf on how to use these. If they had been available when I started the PS I would have jumped on them instead of using Walthers #5 in my yards. Here is a link to the pdf microengineering.com/Micro_Engineering_Ladder_Track_System_v1.pdf

[@donaldshroyer8633]

Did you change the left side crossover turnouts? They seem to be positioned opposite of what they were on the track plans.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, a couple viewers commented that having the main route set as through on both crossovers was more common so I flipped it.

[@PaulSmith-pl7fo]

Hi Larry. Did you use a special type of foam? The conventional objection to foam is that it denatures over a (relatively short) period of time and just crumbles away. I'm not sure that in the UK we have signal boxes quite like the one you're proposing to use (but hey, Rule 1 applies, right?).

[@TheDCCGuy]

Paul, it is a foam designed for long term installation in homes as insulation and should be stable over long periods. I have been using the same foam on the Piedmont Southern for 7 years with no issues. As for the “signal box” it usually sits at the intersection of the Southern and C&O mainlines in Charlottesville on the Piedmont Southern and I just grabbed to use as a stand in. One of the Peco GWR versions will be permanently installed on this layout.

[@illusionclassicrock6742]

Is there any reason you chose 1 inch foam instead of 2 inch? I’m about to do the same myself and was thinking a 2 inch would give me more options for carving my scenery below track level.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I used 2” foam on a previous layout and find it makes it harder to install Tortoise switch machines. The combination of 1/2” playwood and foam gives a total of 1” and you can easily mount Tortoises or anything else with screws. When it comes to scenery I just pile up slabs of foam and carve to shape. If I want a deep ravine or river I drop that section of the layout. I showed how to do that in an article in Model Railroader October 2014.

[@Dave_at_Its_My_Model_Railway]

Hi Larry, great video, do you have a name for the green foam, as over here in the UK I am struggling to find anything similar ? Most bulders yards have a insulation foam board called Celotex or Ecotec, but they have tin foil glued to both sides and is therefore quite expensive. Some hobby stores do a blue foam in small sheets for modeling, but that is even more expensive. Regards, Dave.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Dave, sorry to be late answering but your comment got stuck in KZbin limbo for some reason. I think I saw that Everard Junction uses something like this so let me go back and see what he said. OK, it appears he uses cork sheets laid on top of the plywood. I will also contact a coulpe guys in Somerset and Wales and see what they have found and get back to you. I am sure this is a question that will come up regularly. Also do you have a cess to a compressed paper board called Homasote? It is popular here instead of foam sheets and comes in various thicknesses including 1/2”.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I added a pinned comment to this video with some feedback from a friend in Wales that has some suggestions.

[@stewarttrains98]

You forgot to mention a very critical point, some of the foam board comes with a clear plastic protective sheeting that must be removed. Often times the pink has it on both sides, if not minimum of one side. I learned this the hard way and had to sand the glue and clear sheet off.

[@TheDCCGuy]

The green foam used to come with it but I haven’t seen it used in about 5 years so I assumed they have dispensed with it.

[@flyboy2610]

I use the pink stuff and have not encountered the plastic film.

[@stewarttrains98]

@@flyboy2610 it could be just only the thinner pieces. I know it was on the stuff I bought several years ago

[@KeithHeilner]

Hi Larry - Can I just take my full size paper templates and glue that to the foam board? I'm building a yard so its all getting installed on the flat foam board. I would lay the track directly on the paper template. Do you see any issues with that? Thanks. Really enjoy your channel.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I wouldn’t lay track on the paper. Instead use an an old sewing trick. Lay out your paper then go over it using a pounce wheel. These are devices with a small wheel in them that has gear like projections around it. When you press down and roll over the plan it will perforate the paper and transfer the design to the foam board. Wood carvers use these to transfer designs to wood and then go at it. After you transfer the plan then go over it with a Sharpie. I have also seen folks who work chalk dust through the holes in the paper created by the pounce wheel to transfer the pattern. You can also place carbon paper under the track plan to make the transfer. Google pounce wheels for more info on this method.

[@KeithHeilner]

@@TheDCCGuy Thanks Larry. Someday maybe I'll be good enough to give back. In the mean time, I'll do my part by purchasing products. :) Your a really good teacher.

[@JonBanquer]

@@TheDCCGuy Using a ponce wheel is a great idea!

[@abdullahabu1252]

Hi, DCC GUY I've to know from where I can find the right motor to the HO SCALE locomotive GP. Thank you

[@TheDCCGuy]

First check the manufacturer website to see if the sell extras. If that is not an option then it can be difficult anymore. Some Chinese motors off of eBay may work and some sellers offer them on eNay as well. I recently found a Bachmann motor that is no longer available that way. You also may be able to find a damaged model that is begin sold for parts.

[@michaelsmodelrailroading7665]

One important detail that you've omitted is the exact model of PECO turnouts that you're going to be using for this layout. PECO offers a number of HO/OO turnouts, including small, medium and large radii. There also appears to be a difference in length between the UK and the USA versions that you hold up in the video. All of this comes into play when laying out the track plan. I tried to do so using XTrakCad, but without knowing which model turnouts you were using, it was difficult to replicate your design. One important consideration was the arrangement of crossovers, butting one diverging track against another, without having a short intermediate straight section. Another consideration was keeping turnouts from bridging the module joints. Both of which can lead to eventual headache.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes the UK versions are a bit longer. I remember mentioning that I am using Peco electrofrog large radius turnouts but maybe that detail got edited out. I’ll mention it again in Friday’s video.

[@jimhallett1673]

Hi Larry, great videos thank you for doing these. I have noticed recently online (and you also mentioned it) the metric reference to inches, i.e 2.9". Not sure metric to inches translates that well and struggling to work that out? Cheers Jim UK

[@jimhallett1673]

Worked it out 2 3/4"

[@TheDCCGuy]

Jim, sorry I assumed that English units were still commonly used in England. As a research scientist I used metric units all the time but in retirement I have slipped back into my childhood teachings. In the future I’ll try to toss in some metrics as well. In case I don’t 1 inch is 25.4mm.

[@jimhallett1673]

Hi Larry, no worries, no please don't change things for me. My generation 60+ sort of understand and work with both, personally I'm pretty much in metric now. It was just that I'm not sure an imperial only person would understand 2.9" which appears to be a bit of both measuremenr systems. It's a bit like the scale in UK for OO gauge is 4mm to the foot! All the best, Jim UK

[@krystynamcilroy3501]

With the difference in the U.S & UK Tie spacing it would make it easier to visually show the main & secondary rail lines for U.S. modelers.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I’m not sure what you’re asking for. Other than the visible differences in tie spacing and width the two track and turnouts systems are essentially identical. The UK “OO” scale actually uses HO track gauge, so US models can operate on their tracks and vice versa. For all intents and purposes there will be no real visible differences between building the US or UK versions until we get to adding buildings and other UK specific trackside accessories. Had I not told you which I am building you wouldn’t know for weeks or months.

[@farmerdave7965]

UK has farther tie spacing because it is 1/76 scale rather than 1/87 scale.

[@farmerdave7965]

To plug up the hole in the end of my adhesive tube I just use a 16 penny nail.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I used to do that as well as dict tape wrappings, but after a few months it would dry up in the tip and ruin the tube.Since I found these caps I have not lost a tube.

[@farmerdave7965]

@@TheDCCGuy I've also used wire nuts.

[@CarlosAlberto-ii1li]

I expect you are related to Gary too.