Tundra Timing chain problems - root cause

[@josephheffernan2622]

Thank you for identifying how they are failing to operate. I agree a good cleaning/flush is worth an attempt before replacement.

[@danmccarthy206]

You know, after thinking about what I found with these tensioners, I'm wondering if just using carb cleaner or a similar product to dissolve the varnish on the outside of the plunger might resolve the issue? Instead of taking the whole engine apart, you could use a small diameter tube (like a metal brake line ) along with an inspection scope (cheapo scope that plugs into your iPhone) and work your way down to the tensioner and spray it down several times to dissolve the varnish on the plunger. If you spray it several times, I would think some of the liquid would run down the plunger into the tensioner and melt the varnish? You can easily get to the driver's side tensioner through the oil fill cap (just remove the short extension and cap from the valve cover) OR an even better way is through the two access plugs on the timing cover! There are two threaded plugs on each side/bank of the timing cover that are very close to each tensioner that you can just unscrew and use your spray/camera setup to spray down the plungers. I would definitely give this a try first before doing all that work to replace them. You will still probably need to remove some of the accessories from the front of the engine to get access to the plugs. I still believe it was just the varnish that caused my tensioners to stick. I found no evidence of any coked oil inside or physical damage to either tensioner. I would spray each tensioner several times and let it work for a minute between sprays. If you try this process, I would change the oil immediately afterward ( before starting the engine) because the carb cleaner will dilute the oil to some extent even though there are 8 quarts in the engine.

[@teamhogmeat]

Has anyone tried this yet before committing to this big job? Should I try PB Blaster, Carb Cleaner, mineral spirits? My noise is definitely driver side top tensioner, would love to not tear all this shit apart lol

[@danmccarthy206]

@@teamhogmeat I would try carb cleaner or maybe starting fluid to melt the varnish on the plunger. Spray some on, wait a few seconds, spray more, wait, spray more, etc. If you can melt that varnish, it should solve the problem. Get an inspection scope for your phone and fish it down there and watch it while you spray it to make sure it dissolves. I really think if you can dissolve that varnish, it will fix it and save you a bunch of cash and time.

[@kuzebnyi]

I tried it yesterday. Didn’t help. I used the carb cleaner. The tensioner looked pretty dirty and I did clean it but it didn’t help unfortunately

[@teamhogmeat]

@@kuzebnyiThanks for following up after trying this idea out. I bought a borescope and was hoping to do the same, but this report is discouraging. Did you spray the whole tensioner body and piston or just the piston? Do you plan on replacing the tensioner now that this did not work?

[@kuzebnyi]

@@teamhogmeat I was hoping it’s gonna help too. I sprayed only the piston and only from the top. Maybe if there’s a way to spray the bottom it would help but my engine looks pretty neglected. I bought it with this issue almost 2 years ago and put like 30k miles and it doesn’t seem to get any worse. It’s only on cold starts. But I do plan to change the tensioner. Looking for a good brand for the timing chain kit right now.

[@Is_Time_A_Number]

I have this same issue. 2015. Noise started at about 95,000 miles. Started replacing one quart of oil with Marvel Mystery oil at about 110,000 miles when I finally figured out what was making the noise. It helps tremendously. Oil quality seems to determine how long into the oil change interval the noise returns. This past oil change I had to use normal Valvoline full synthetic and at 4K into oil interval noise is back. Changing oil today with Penzoil Ultra Platinum w/ MMO added with the hope that the high quality of the oil with superior lubricity will get me to 5k with no noises.

[@Is_Time_A_Number]

Oh and current mileage is 148,000. Does anybody know or have heard of catastrophic failure repaired to this issue?

[@mjriegs2]

Did the Penzoil ultra plat with MMO Combo work?

[@mjriegs2]

Did the Penzoil ultra / MMO combo do the trick and fix noise?

[@robertespinoza2740]

Did the ultra work for you ???

[@steveschneider3872]

Question: What brand of oil and viscosity? Oil change interval? I don’t have any noise yet. My ‘08, which is identical to your’s, even color has 147,000 on the clock. I just did the starter, more of preventative maintenance than failure. It was a bit of a bear, but nothing compared to your repair. I’ve run Royal Purple 5w-20 since new and have changed it religiously at 5k or sooner.

[@danmccarthy206]

I did all oil changes every 5k as indicated by the maintenance light. I used Valvoline full synthetic 0-20 in the winter and 5-20 over the summer months. I'm not sure what brand and weight oil would be best in that particular engine. I do a fair amount of idling so I'm not sure if that creates more heat or causes more varnish to form. I think adding an oil flush product a few hundred miles before each oil change might help keep varnish to a minimum BUT I don't like the whole idea of thinning the oil with something that breaks down varnish because it might also break down the lubrication the oil performs and cause additional engine wear. Most likely, in the future, I will flush the oil once in a while to help keep varnish to a minimum.

[@JoseDiaz-qk3ek]

Tremendous job and great explainations. A few years back i started using marvel mystery oil. one half quart marvel the rest 5w30 walmart elcheapo oil. 3 thousand miles or 6months. mmo has a wetting molecule(s) . change the filter at every second oil service. modern engines use oil for actuators and whatnot so id rather do more changes with cheap oil since im not driving like a nut or have turbos. btw a channel called THE CAR CARE NUT is specializing in toyota and is a must

[@vtimou5772]

its the oil pressure sipping out the tensionner,,,thats what is causing the noise,,,,pull the fuel pump relay at cold start,,do a long crank,,,then put back the fuel relay,,,no more noise..because oil pressure has build up in the tensionner

[@marcopolo8249]

Didn't work, how long should I do the long crank

[@vtimou5772]

@@marcopolo8249 its like 5 or 10sec max...if it not working is because tensioners are to far gone and needs replacing

[@diychicken7279]

Fantastic Video, GREAT JOB digging into this. Still not a clear answer, but certainly much needed info for everyone. I too have the cold start rattle (goes away when warm)... I was convinced that it was the driver's side tensioner. I ended up letting the dealer look at it and they insist that mine is NOT the tensioner. They say my problem is a sticky lifter.... about $4.5k to fix, but they recommend leaving it alone. So I am leaving it alone, though I'm not sure I believe their analysis.

[@donsscooters]

I think, and would bet, that its equal to the oil pressure. Whatever pressure the oil is, would be applied directly to the plunger. No math needed! There is also may or may not be possible leverage advantage also since the wiper is mounted below the plunger. The check ball could also be a factor? It really doesn't mater though. My 2009 has the same problem for the 7-8 years I've owned it. It bothers me slightly and I just put in a half bottle of Seafoam to see what happens. I love the truck though and I'm gonna try and drive it till 300K. Its 244K now. Thanks for your content, I enjoyed it.

[@ColoradoFishing]

I think it’s varnish as well. Other folks in other videos have said they run seafoam treatment through crankcase/fuel system and some have success with it fixing the tensioner. Seems like it’s worth it to try removing varnish before taking on the huge job or paying to have it done.

[@74nova36]

It does in fact work. About half a can of sea foam poured directly into the crankcase via the oil filler. Run that sea foam in there for about 20 miles and drain oil while hot. Repeat 3 times and use 5-30w oil for the love of god unless you live north of Colorado

[@findmeacar4286]

There’s a bulletin from Lexus eu talking about this problem It’s a design fault for the tensioners Parts have been superseded twice Toyota won’t help resolve the issue or recall

[@nrehberg]

Do you have a link to that bulletin?

[@findmeacar4286]

@@nrehberg file:///var/mobile/Library/SMS/Attachments/88/08/27F097AC-5E89-4846-9608-719A5F27F1DD/EG-0031L-0516.pdf

[@eloyrodriguez4586]

Would you happen to have a list of the parts needed to do the timing chain tensioner replacement? Example seals or sealant or any other major parts needed to be replaced once the maintenance has started. Thank you.

[@montanacontrolsllc3272]

I replaced my tensioners etc. at about 160000 miles due to chain noises growing louder over time. When i took everything apart, the components were very clean, little to no build up on any of the components. The noise went away. It started coming back faintly after about 5000 miles, now at 10000 miles its clearly back. It took my daughter and I 4 days to replace, I'm curious what else may be causing this??? could it have something to do with the VVT valves on the valve cover??? Anyhow, I may machine some pressure monitoring adapters for the valve cover to see whats going on. let me know if you have any thoughts...

[@danmccarthy206]

It's hard to say. Does the noise sound like the chains slapping around OR is it coming from higher up near the VVT sprockets? I haven't seen anyone online who had to replace the VVT's because of this problem but it's certainly possible. The VVT's are about 400 bucks( x 4 =$1600) so most folks don't replace them if they still seem to work ok. Mine were fine, That 5.7L make a significant amount of tappet noise even when it's running fine so make sure your not hearing that noise and thinking its the chains.

[@montanacontrolsllc3272]

@@danmccarthy206 I will look into it a bit further as time permits. The noise comes and goes when the engine is running. It's audible more often then not and is worse when the engine is hot. Thanks for the response.

[@danmccarthy206]

@@montanacontrolsllc3272 maybe get a stethoscope for mechanics and see if you can hunt down the source of the noise. Maybe find a great repair shop and ask them to diagnose the noise then repair it yourself?

[@plasmastorm8]

Has anyone tried machining or modifying a tensioner that will plug up the oil route or reroute the oil so that it flows out the side of the tensioner and then put a stronger spring inside the tensioner, that will keep constant pressure on the chain guide. Just a thought.

[@roberthuezo3146]

I had same issue only on hot days I replaced tensioners problem was not solved When problem started I would change oil and rattle would stop Then oil changes didn’t help after a while. Then high mileage Lucas would make it go away. Now nothing helps but it drives fine It’s been rattling of and on for 100k miles I’m at 250k

[@stevendamron1967]

I have a 07 Tundra with 147000 miles. I use sea foam or a really good engine cleaner before changing the oil. This does the trick. If it's not too far gone then it will need replaced

[@westallenshow9204]

This happen to me this was the trick. Read tile end. At first at about 80 thousand it started. I had the timing chain changed... That help for about 30 thousand miles. At $2800. What causes it is the varnish on the tensioner .....and the vvt valves. So it went on until about 230,000 miles... So under my reluctant judgement I went to O'Reilly's and bought one can of sea foam to remove varnish before oil change. I ran it on idle as I was traveling using inverter for about 60 hours then it almost went away. So I did an oil change. And that did it acts as if it is new again. I will now use Sea Foam before oil change more often. The tolerance of the parts of this motor are such as that as seen in video here the tensioner get varnish on the end of it's shaft and sticks holding it in.... The vvt silinoids also are the problem as they stick not allowing the timing to position until motor is warmed up enough to expand plastic loosening to adjust time on vvt valves. I had this problem, I paid the price no changing oil enough because I was running full synthetic. That is a no, no. Make sure to change oil 3000 to 4000 miles or it will varnish inner parts. Hope this helps, I scoured You Tube for years with the fix and never found it. This is the fix.... If you have to change the oil and use another can of seafoam until it stops and goes to normal operation. One ounce per quart of oil only.

[@74nova36]

You’re spreading the good work. Oil changes at no less than 5000 miles. Decent quality oil. Make sure 8.25-8.5qts go back in. SeaFoam 10-20 miles before changing the oil and drain it while’s it’s hot. The noise will disappear after a half a can of seafoam added to crankcase. Then drain that as you don’t want sea foam constantly in your oil supply.

[@westallenshow9204]

When I changed my timing chain the tensioner looked fine seemed to work good by hand. The varnish causing it to lock up when pushed all the way in was the problem as it would stick until motor was warm. How ever if the varnish was re moved the used tensioner work great. Sea Foam removes this varnish and restored parts original function. Just keep using until it's like new. I used Pro Long to reduce engine friction by 80% 230,000 miles and never uses oil if changed by 4000 miles.

[@nickvoelker7180]

It's a bad design, and it doesn't allow enough oil to enter the tensioner. Toyota knows this, they've redesigned the tensioner to correct the problem. However, they DID NOT issue a technical bulletin or recall notice to owners. There is a TB that just says the part has been redesigned, and the new part number is a suitable replacement. I'm currently replacing all three tensioners in a 1GR-FE (same tensioners). They all failed with low millage and proper maintenance. If you have a vehicle with that model of tensioner, you have a disaster waiting to happen under your hood. Or not, mine was running fine with no tension on any of the chains. Minor excessive valve train noise and an engine whine is what alerted me to the problem. No drop in performance, efficiency, or DTCs.

[@oversizedoverlanding2365]

For a noisy tensioner - Is it worth trying an oil system cleaner like ATS 505 CRO?

[@milesvause2780]

Thanks for the videos and nicely done. My 2015 Tundra is making a rattling noise. It does it about 1 minute after start up and then goes away after 30 seconds or so. I think I’ll try the carb cleaner trick you mentioned before doing my next oil change.

[@74nova36]

Add seafoam directly into crankcase and run it shortly before changing your oil. It will go away. Use 5-30w

[@integrity262]

Interesting for sure.My 2014 5.7 Tundra has this noise coming from the driver side.

[@74nova36]

Yeppp same here brother. Use 5-30 and add sea foam to crankcase 10 miles before an oil change. It will go away

[@shawngertridge-eh9hp]

Its always the driver side tensioner to its the only one that uses oil to pressure it mine failed and timing guide came off and fell into the oil pan and got munched up and put aluminum filings through my crank and took out my bearings make sure you change oil at 3-5000 you should be alright dont use heavier wait oil the tolerance s in the engines are small and heavy wieght oils will do more harm than good

[@ninazeng6036]

Nice job!

[@luvingfully]

I think I would have tried using a higher viscosity oil, such as 5W-30. This would raise oil pressure a little bit and produce slightly higher tensioner force. Calculate force at engine idle when oil pressure is lower. Oil pressure at idle when engine is hot should be lower than when the engine is cold, and yet the noise happens only when cold, so that is confusing. A Google search shows many are concerned about low oil pressure at idle.

[@danmccarthy206]

I have used 10-30 in it as a test but it didn't seem to make any difference. Once the engine warms up, I seem to have the same oil pressure (according to the gauge) no matter what oil I run in it. I think the tensioner plunger sticks when the engine is cold because the diameter of the tensioner cylinder is slightly smaller than when it's hot. As long as my engine was hot, the noise went away.

[@Abdul-mh5zh]

​@@danmccarthy206 Hi Dan, I'm having the same problem when on cold starts the noise so annoying, 5 min later when warms up it goes. And sometimes I heart at drive thru really bothers me. What did you do to yours if had it? And is it harmful for the engine if you ignore for awhile?

[@danmccarthy206]

@@Abdul-mh5zh Hi Abdul, You can run it for a while like that BUT I would plan on having it repaired ASAP. You might want to try an oil flush or Marvel Mystery oil added to the engine oil. That MIGHT dissolve some of the varnishes and allow the hydraulic tensioner to work properly. Right now that tensioner is probably covered in varnish and this is what causes the plunger to stick and not fully extend once the oil pressure comes up. I would flush the oil several times (running clean oil between flushes) or try Marvel Mystery oil as an additive to help loosen the varnish. The repair job is so costly, I would try several flushes before doing the repair because it might loosen enough varnish to make it work properly. See the repair here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eXbahnZtmN16sJo It's a long and difficult job.

[@74nova36]

To make it even more complicated mine only does it at engine warm temps. Never cold. That was with 0w-20. About to sell this rattling POS 2014 with 107k when the noise started out of nowhere. Of course right after an oil change.

[@CheekyMonkey888]

Mobil1 did the same for mine, instantly

[@74nova36]

@@CheekyMonkey888now I’m at 155k and got the noise to go away with several hot oil changes while adding sea foam directly into the crankcase 20 miles before changing

[@robertosequoia]

Eso pasa cuando echas aceites malos y los cambios cuando te acuerdas

[@vinhsinhdang3510]

It’s probably a failed design the plunger may have travel to much out of the housing that make the housing worn out

[@findmeacar4286]

Here’s the admission from LEXUS but they will not help SAME ENGINE AS TUNDRA

[@suggesttwo]

3:47 there's the problem. All gummed up.

[@suggesttwo]

WYNNE'S ENGINE TUNE UP.

[@ninazeng6036]

【from HIPA】are you interested in testing my parts?Thanks.

[@jameshudson8357]

I just finished a chain job on a lx570. They all do it. Poorly designed and laid out v8 with too much emissions systems. Nissan VK56DE makes the 3UR look like a joke. The new VK56VD is garbage too now unfortunately. First gen titans for LIFE!

[@PaulDowns-z4c]

Pie are round.

[@74nova36]

Run 5-30w oil brother. It’ll go away

[@74nova36]

Run 5-30w oil brother. It’ll go away